When Should You Optimally Refresh Lumber Camps?
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- čas přidán 2. 07. 2024
- We get into the forest of Age of Empires 4 economy - this time with the age old question of when is the optimal time for you to refresh your lumber camps for the most optimal wood collection! Be sure to use the collection rates and payback times here in your gameplay!
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#AgeofEmpires4 #Economy #LumberCamp
0:00 - Intro
0:15 - Testing Methodology
1:57 - 1 Villager Test
2:53 - 2 Villagers Test
3:18 - 3 Villagers Test
3:30 - 5 Villagers Test
3:49 - 10 Villagers Test
4:38 - Testing with Feudal Upgrades
5:13 - Findings & Rule of Thumb
6:01 - Conclusion - Hry
Who doesn't like to optimize their economy? I'll be covering quite a few economy mechanics on the channel as well, so if you have a burning question regarding anything economy related in Age of Empires IV, do let me know in the comments below - I'll add those to the long list of videos to be published in 2022! As always, thanks for dropping by and watching everyone!
Sounds like a video targeted at Conan....
@@encoreperformance1081 If he shifted to AoE4 as well, of course! :D
@@AgeofNoob 11!!! love the content my turkish friend :)
@@AgeofNoob exercise is good for villagers. Also can your next video be on Justice for Encore? A certain streamer has banned him over a quick walling misunderstanding. 11
@@canadianconan4582 nonsense nonsense, only banned for commie games tis all.
Pretty good tips ! I would have loved to see the same test with wheelbarrows, as it mitigates the effect of walking a longer distance probably meaning that you probably don’t have to place as many new lumber camp after having it researched
I was really confused why he didn’t test with wheelbarrow
Wheelbarrow is not something we pick up early so I skipped it for the video - but I suppose adding a few more tests would've been useful for sure. :)
@@AgeofNoob you talked about the feudal age so I figured that a late feudal wheelbarrow would be relevant. Also, at the point in the game that you have 10+ villager on a single wood line, you definitely have picked wheelbarrow by then. But I’m not a good player so I’m surely wrong, would still be interesting though ! :)
@@AgeofNoob Wheelbarrow is upgraded by some or most pros as the first eco upgrade outside of pro scout because it also serves as a textile defence replacement.
But I think it is still insightful to have a rule of thumb conclusion with this video
@@ReuterL "Wheelbarrow is upgraded by some or most pros as the first eco upgrade [...]" while true afaIk, I've seen it as late as castle to even be picked at all. With how aggressive and unite oriented the meta has been for the last months spending even that little bit of resources on better eco seems to be seen by many as to much of an investment when it could take 3+ minutes just to pay back the initial cost, and you could be dead by that point (pro scouts being the exception to that statement). 'Specially Viper seems to have a general aversion to any and all eco upgrades and he is doing just fine.
I'd say that the best way to make this analysis isn't by payback time, but by average gather rate of each option.
Like playing the game for a certain amount of time with while applying each of them and measuring witch one gets you more wood.
That's fair enough - but you could simply multiply the restored wood per minute by a few minutes to get an idea of how much more wood you'd collect within x minutes of refreshing your lumber camp.
i.e. if 5 villagers collect roughly 120 wood per minute due to inefficiency by the third row, refresh your lumber camp, and you get back up to 158. So your decision's payback time is 1.4 minutes, and you've increased your wood per minute by 38. You can lower that number a tad because it won't stay at 38 for too long, and multiply that by a few mins to get your answer. :)
But I agree, I could've done the additional work to showcase this in the video for sure!
This is the most practical and useful application. Wish age of noob did this.
@@AgeofNoob
No because you'd only get the info about the difference of building the new spot or not, you wouldn't get the renewed 1st row benefits. And you could think of a contraption to think about what's it worth, but in reality you'd also need to now how much time it takes for these villagers to go from 1st row to 2nd row, etc.
But...
This guy asking for too specific information with specific map value only I believe. I think he wanted you to make a new lumber camp as soon as 2nd row or 3rd row is reached, therefore depending on how much time it took you to get there.
Great content man! Loving your informative and well produced content.
Glad you liked it Ralph - more of these on the way for 2022!
Great video buddy!
Another thing that might be interesting to look at is if it makes sense on big gold mines with more than 10 villagers does it make sense to put mines on more than one side if villagers are taking up 2 sides of the gold mine
Well.. if you want gold faster - then yes
Thx! Would be good to consider French separately as the lumber camp is 25 wood vs avg 50. Changing these dynamics.
With French it's a no brainer. Take the recommendation in this video and cut it down by a third at the very least.
I wish they kept the ability of gatherers to be their own supply station that they finally put into Age of Empires 3.
Not very efficient, and a very VERY niche idea to use, but if the game is lax enough to let you, could you micro your wood choppers to cut a line down the middle of a large cluster of trees, place a tower a little in so units have to go in and out the tower to get past and into the forest, cut a clearing inside, and hide a landmark inside there (perhaps with towers either side)... IF the forest is large enough to allow it.
I'm all for different ways of hiding things, like buildings inside Stealth Forests, docks on your opponent's shoreline on the other side of their docks from you (looking at you TheViper in that match Aussie_Drongo casted and posted 11 hours ago), and other sneaky plays like mass-Wololo-ing your opponent's woodchoppers via Warrior Monk with relic, and getting them to make a palisade wall and tower INSIDE their main woodline, etc etc....
Did your tests involve deleted trees? When you refresh lumber camp in a real game, 1 tree or 2 always get deleted. And that adds some initial chopping time.
Thank you very much for your work, labor
Welcome!
Cool!
What about the effect of wheelbarrow?
You are the new spirit of the law for aoe 4!, haha. Always great content, thanks! .
Glad you enjoyed it Victor - thanks for stopping by! :)
Nice video! My question would be: When playing as the Rus, how does the wooden fortress change how often you should refresh the camp? Also how much benefit do you get out of having a Wooden fortress?
Huh, this brings up a question.
For the French, who get half-off lumber camps, doesn't that mean they should spam lumber camps at the 2nd Row already?
I think it's better to go for another angle instead for even better efficiency, so a few tiles to the left or right of the first lumber camp. But yeah, you could go for the 3 min timers in this video as they'll be roughly 1.5 for the French (and perhaps even better due to the different angled lumber camps).
Edit: You still have to remember that you'll have to wait 1-2 minutes every time you build the lumber camp for it to pay back. So spamming isn't a good idea if you have a lot of woodlines!
Recently been playing using the Abbasid, so I just spam wood camps to help get the number of building required for the golden age mechanic
@@nguyenphuvinh7064 I spam all the buildings that I can/need to build to get the golden age perk, usually It's a combo of wood camps, houses and mining camps in the earlier ages, and then the military building once I reach castle
Tbh I wouldn't try to find out what the actual time is until the 50w investment is recuperated, I would simply compare the vill seconds spent on building a new lumber camp with the vill seconds lost from walking.
But anyways, it seems: rather refresh it more often than not often enough.
Hey what's that song you play as the video ends? Sounds nice
No Time to Die by Billie Eilish
You completly missed the wehlbarrow Upgrade. It ist a Upgrade that everyone gets an IT reduces tha Walking time.
I like your Videos
Can do a vid an analysis imperial official? It it worth as a gold source?
Hi, love your content :) Have been binging on them lately. Can I make a request for you to test the effectiveness of horse archers? I always find myself under-estimating them in my game.. I fight them head on, then they just melt my knights etc. within seconds.. So wondering what's the critical mass of horse archers when we should avoid fighting them heads on etc.? How effective on an equal resource match with them against knights/Man-at-arms/Chinese fully upgraded Palace Guards with 252 HP?
Horse Archers are definitely on the list of units I'll be testing out soon - stay tuned!
How about an analysis on the different ship types with different stats between civs (Like Chinese and Mongol war junks vs Delhi and Abbasid baglahs or HRE, French, or English galleys vs Rus lodyas)?
WaddlingDuck already did a video on this iirc.
@@ArawnOfAnnwn His video was made when directional ship armor was still a thing, and plus, he did not cover the galleass.
we've found why the earth become much hotter than before.
Rus have more payback time if place Wooden Fortress (175wood) for 20% Bouns ?
I'll have to test out those cases to give a definitive answer :)
Just a question: Do I still refresh my lumber camp with 3-4 villagers on the 3rd row when using Gers?
Or already on the 2nd one?
Why not pack up the Ger and just move it closer?
@@Kellexar It s what I meant by "refreshing"
@@xXDrunkendriverXx Well the only investment for Gers is your attention time. Hence, move your Gers as close as possible whenever you can for sure, never wait for the 3rd row. :)
@@AgeofNoob Yeah, thought so too ! Thanks for the reply and keep on making these vids they are awesome!
@@xXDrunkendriverXx No problem my friend, thanks for stopping by. :)
What about wheelbarrow?
Wheelbarrow is not something you'd pick up early, so I didn't end up testing for that. As you saw in the test with upgrades, it only changes the numbers by a villager max. Hence, look for ~2 mins in this video, and go for those if you have wheelbarrow picked up as well. :)
Spirit of the Law did a decent video around Wheelbarrow for AoE4. For most civs it's good, but for Chinese it has a bit of give and take due to multiple factors.
Check his vid "The Chinese Wheelbarrow Paradox (AoE4)" for an explanation... czcams.com/video/E9BR-54FHPk/video.html
Hey age of noob, take care with copy right strikes or did you license Billy Eillish if your small enough it shouldnt be that of a problem but it may backfires
It's actually a piano cover of the song that's under Creative Commons. :) Don't worry, every video gets a pre-check for Copyrights before it's published; CZcams got pretty good at this to protect creators before the video gets published.
@@AgeofNoob good i was worried for you, have a nice day
@@thefench1 No worries mate - you too! :)
What about Mongol gur replacement?
You can move it.
Wheelbarrow?
you forgot wheelbarrow
PS if you are France just spam them!
#AgeofNoobGiveaway
all you need is fire lancers to win the game
++
Is it me , or the vils wood chocking into a forest is worng , the wils would rather do deeper into woods to chop than going to the closest tree. Also no more than 3 vils will chop a tree. Vils pathing is strange
Villagers wood love to be treeted with efficient walk paths rather than lumber around needlessly.
bro, billie eilish is forbidden in my country and I could get imprisoned just because of watching your videos. Please, consider not using her content, thanks in advance.😘
Genuinely not sure if you're being sarcastic.. :D
@@AgeofNoob he's trolling lol, billie eilish toured russia.