Short scale guitars for aging hands?
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- čas přidán 21. 08. 2024
- What is a “short scale” guitar, and could short scale guitars benefit the aging guitarist? A brief review of one “gray” picker’s experience looking for an answer…
Links for more information on short scale guitars …
The Acoustic Guitarist
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Guitar Player
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I'm 42 in 2023 arthritis is and age catching up with me. This video is awesome for all of us aging bluesheads.
Thanks for watching.
Have a Martin D-Jr with 24" scale and 1 3/4" nut. Very comfortable and easy to play.
Have heard these are great short scale guitars for the money. Thanks for watching
As an old armchair picker with small (i.e., weak) hands, I play ONLY short-scale "travel"-size instruments. They sound great, are very handy and easy on the fingers.
at age 57 after 43 years of playing I finally made the switch to short scale and love it. My hands are medium small and I play several church services every weekend. Noticed I'd wake up during the night to stiff and painful fingers that I had to stretch and loosen up. Ended up buying an Epiphone J-45, a Recording King RO-328, and an Eastman E1SS limited and have not looked back. Finger pain is gone which is a relief. Sold all my others except my D-35 which I tuned down a half step to ease the string tension. I can play for hours on the short scales and have zero finger pain now.
Bill, great story. BTW, my oldest/longest -played guitar is a D35S. (you can see my video about it here... czcams.com/channels/9wf92mCvwdzkjfyygaYwDg.htmlvideos).
Nothing else is quite like a D35 to my ears. Happy picking, and thanks for your comments.
@@anothergraypicker yes I saw that, lovely guitar. I am on the lookout for the D-18S short scale. One pops up on reverb once in a while.
I think a lot of us, regardless of age, would prefer way shorter scale lengths than we have available to us. I am a baritone player, ig fan of long long scale lengths in many ways, but when I want things to just be easy and effortless, short scale lengths are like a vacation. Not only is it comfortable, but you can do crazier things with it because of the added reach.
" like a vacation"... Yes, exactly, great comment, thanks for watching.
And they have advantages in sound with bends etc. Imo. My short scale has a reverb quality on bends that are ridiculous
Terrifically helpful thanks 🙏
So glad to hear that. Hope the playing gets sweeter and sweeter. Thanks for watching.
My go to guitar that's always by my side is a 71 fg75 it's a folk guitar and it sounds plays and sounds amazing not sure of the scale length but it's definitely shorter than my fg140 of the same year
Yeah, my 74 years old hands and fingers don't want to cooperate with my brain. Muscle memory is out the window. They\ve slowed down a whole lot and aren't as accurate as they used d to be when changing chords. I'm having trouble holding on to a pick, so I don't use one much anymore. I think 12 fret guitars are the way to go. Parlor, 00 snd 000 sized. Lots of good ones out there.
Even with the challenges it's still a great way to keep in the "game." Thanks for the comment and thanks for watching.
My drednaught has been put away for years now. I love my custom built Proulx OM/D. 12 fret. And I’ve been having fun with the new recording king parlour my wife has.
Love 12 fretters myself.... And have wanted to get my hands on the RK parlor too.
It depends on what the use is. My P bass is retired. Using a 32" J bass copy now. Night and day difference. LittleMartin works great for first position chords. Neck thickness and string spacing also matter.
I have found the same to be true! Shorter scale is far easier to play.
I also have bought an Alvarez Parlor as well as their mini jumbo LJ2.
Really great under appreciated guitars!
Thanks for the comments. I took a good look at the LJ2s when I was looking for a short scale. Thought they would be a nice option too. What's your experience been like compared to your parlor? Thanks for watching.
@@anothergraypicker Love the mahogany parlor 12 fret in the artist series so much I took it back to GC and ordered the solid hog top back and sides in the maser series. Really great! Both parlors really great tone and volume. The artist series parlor has laminate back and sides. It is a wonderful little guitar. Sweet! Wife loves the sound of the 12 fret hog parlors. So easy to play and love. I play my LJ2 a lot. Probably more than my Collings or Gibson. It is just a handy little guitar.
Yes, but most parlors have relatively wide, flat (unradiused) fingerboards. Plus, most have just 12 frets to the body, with results in wider fret spacing.
AP66SHB vs LJ2. What is the best choice?
It was not until I became a senior that I finally found a guitar neck / scale length that I am happy with. It is a short scale 24.9. The nut width is 1 3/4. I would prefer 1 13/16 but the 1 3/4 is working with the shorter scale.
The problem I had with short scale Gibsons was the skinny neck. I wanted 1 3/4 or 1 13/16.
I have medium hand width but slightly shorter fingers. The test for me was to make a full bar chord F at the 1st fret. I could never get it clean until I switched to short scale.
Great comments... I'm sure most folks would have a hard time believing that the "dreaded" F full bar chord is easier on a wider neck for some of us. But that's been my experince too. Though I still play this Alvarez parlor, the narrower neck can be a bit frustrating some times. Glad you found the "right fit." Thanks for watching and for commenting too.
@@anothergraypicker Thanks, I do mostly chord / melody finger style and I am much cleaner on a wider neck.
This is very helpful I recently learned the difference in scales never gave it any thought I could never wrap my head around it and understand it Now I do I am 62 and preparing myself with the right acoustic guitars for my retirement and I have been favoring the shorter scale necks I got a 1920 Lyon Healy parlor guitar last year and fell in love right away with the 24 inch neck I am on a waiting list for a Hauver Stella build The Long scale is long 26.5 and short 25.5 I am going for shorter I do the capo thing tune down on a 14 fret guitar. These days I prefer 12 fret pre war style guitars with 1 and 3/ 14 at the nut like you THANK YOU FOR ALL THE INFO on scale length GREAT vidio STAY HAPPY and find reasons to smile everyday!
Glad this helped. Great comments like this one are another great reason to keep smilin'
I recently bought an eastman 12 fret slotted parlor for same reasons. Best thing I ever did.
Trev, I've always been drawn to Eastman guitars (both acoustic and electric, mandolins too). I "lusted' mightily after an Eastman parlor myself when looking for one, just couldn't swing the $$$ at the time. Congratulations on finding a great guitar. Thanks for watching...
As an older guitarist, I know exactly what you are talking about. On top of that, a couple of years ago I underwent major shoulder reconstruction surgery. They also reattached by bicep muscle. After I recovered I started to play and my left hand articulation was very difficult. I started looking for shorter scale guitars. They really helped. I’m still dealing with getting older issues with playing and I totally understand where you’re coming from. Great channel. Subbed also.
Thanks for these comments. I think it’s a bit ironic that as we learn more about playing, we begin to loose the ability to “execute” to that new level of understanding. Still ain’t it great to have the joy to play what we can. In the words of the old Fleetwood Mac… “then play on.”
@@anothergraypicker I agree. That’s very astute and ironic. I’m going to play on untilI just can’t anymore. Hopefully that day will never come!
Thanks again for another great video for us older guitar players. I bought a parlor guitar a few months ago and really enjoy the sound and size, but the steel strings really do a number on my fingers. I'm considering changing the strings to nylon or something like Teflon. I will probably loose some sound quality, but hopefully it will decrease the finger tip pain.
Thanks for watching. (Also, you may want to check out my response to your comment on my "Steel Strings to Nylon..." video.)
You won't lose sound quality; it's a different sound, one that you might like more or less than a steel string sound and one that is more suitable to some types of music.
Very Interesting I am looking at getting a short scale guitar
Thanks for watching Bruce. Let us know what you decide on.
When I was young, I laughed at Mando players whose original instrument was guitar - seen mostly in country and bluegrass bands. Now that I'm nearing 70, I understand completely. Man do I understand. Next to my EZ chair hangs a Cordoba Mini II in all mahogany with nylon strings. Lets me plink away in comfort - write songs - work out voicings - though even that's not so important anymore. Guitar was only ever a vehicle for me to self accompany on original tunes - the fancy stuff was left to my band mates who were always better'n me even in my best playing days.
Ha! I knew there was something about you! A Larrivee LV-05E fan! When I lived in Princeton, IL, I saw an ad for one of those for sale from a guy up in Chicago, so hopped the Amtrak train up there to try/buy it. He'd misspoke; it was a DV-05E. I bought it anyway brought it home and introduced it to the stable; an L-09 40th Sam Ash version and an 00-50MT. I have 12 or 14 guitars and beginning to off load them - but the 3 Larrivees will be with me until I check out. Never heard guitars so sweet to my ears.
"I have 12 or 14 guitars and beginning to off load them - but the 3 Larrivees will be with me until I check out. Never heard guitars so sweet to my ears."....
Oh boy does this ring true. Know just where you're coming from on this. Thanks for your comments, and thanks for watching.
Thanks Gray picker. I’m Glenn. I am spoiled. I play mostly Martin guitars but would like to find something with good tone and not spend a lot. I have 2 Martin 12 fret slothead that I love. I’m interested in the 66 Alvarez because of its mahogany top. I don’t expect the Martin sound quality but your guitar has a good sound. I may try one. Thanks again.
My uncle, who's 72~73 now, kinda "leans his playing over" taller frets and smaller radius fretboard for his electrics (mostly Partscasters), so he can still play for hours on a gig, or rehearsing, or teaching. I'm only 32, and I don't have arthritis or anything like that, but I also got used and really like the same kinds of instruments, and when I play a very flat fretboard now, I feel some pain in my arm, very similar to carpal tunnel syndrome.
Great comment. I think fret board radius often goes unconsidered by lots of players. As I am right at your uncle's age it has become more important to me too. Makes so much difference on a 6 string bar. Thanks for your comments and thanks for watching.
Had a replacement on my left shoulder was finding it difficult on 14 frets 12 frets means I can now use open chords again great info you are giving here.
Glad to hear you're still playing, and thanks for your comments.
Thank you..
With age I have developed osteoarthritis of the finger joints and It was making it difficult for me to play my guitars. I bought a Martin Dreadnaught Junior, which has a smaller scale length and I play light gauge strings, both of which have made it easier for me to both practice and play guitar. I also like a 1.75 inch nut width which this guitar comes with.
Kenneth, those specs make a difference for me too. I've also found using round core strings is another good move to make fretting a bit more comfortable. Either way, sounds like you made a great choice. Thanks for watching.
I have one of these and my dad has a nearly 100 year old Martin parlor. We both prefer the sound of the Alvarez XD.
Julian, "a nearly 100 year old Martin parlor" must be a thing of beauty. Thanks for your comment and thanks for watching.
I found that my best guitar (Martin HJ28),became more difficult to play as I got older and the 1 11/16" nut width was the cause.I transitioned to 1 3/4" guitars the first was a Breedlove 000R Revival and also an Alvares 00.Then I px'd my Larivee OM for a Martin CEO7,then became afflicted with essential tremor so playing them is at a standstill,surgery to regulate it is due soon.
I px'd the Alvarez for a Martin DRE because I couldn't tol;erate the rapid decline of the bass E string,the tone would become muffled withind a week............................................
Thanks for the comments Russell. Sorry to hear about your situation and hope the surgery gets you back to enjoying playing again. Regarding the E string issues, did you try different brands of strings? (Just curious...). The Alvarez AP66 in this video has an unusually rich low end, so much so that I was pleasantly surprised when I began playing it.
Thanks for watching and sharing your thoughts.
Thanks for your story. Hope the surgery goes (or went) well and gives you some relief. And hope it gets you back to enjoying/playing your guitars.
Shorter scales and the type of neck are important to me. At age 72, my J45 is much easier to play than my D18.
Besides being a shorter scale, J45 neck feels better on my smaller hands.
Two fine guitars... Good to have an alternate to turn to that's as sweet as a J45.
And for just beginning guitarist, say 75 & up, that short scale sounds nice, but could I get that in an ~2” nut. Old, fat, Arthritic hands need every advantage they can get! Just want to have a little fun, before MY metronome/❤stops!
"Just want to have a little fun, before MY metronome/stops!" ...you and me both. And yeah a 2" nut on a short scale acoustic can be pretty hard to find, Thanks for te comment and thanks for watching.
Julian, "a nearly 100 year old Martin parlor" must be a thing of beauty. Thanks for your comment and thanks for watching.
Thank you very much! I am a new player (started March 2020 during the pandemic). I have love playing and want to get better. I am 64 years old and love fingerstyle. I have struggled a bit with barre chords due to strength issues. I recently discovered short scale and parlor guitars. I feel that any help I can get would be a plus. I have watched several videos on this topic and wondered whether you think short scale guitars are easier to play for someone committed to learning? Also, I currently have a beautiful Martin custom-made guitar -- does Martin make a good parlor guitar? Thanks for your help.
Yes, if your hands can manage the "tighter" fret spacing, short scale guitars can be significantly easier to play, for beginners it’s a nice path to learning.
Martin makes some exceptional "parlor" guitars, though they don't use the term parlor, but rather size designations such as "O", "00" or "000.". In fact some folks contend that they were the premier maker of small bodied guitars in the late 19th and early 20th centuries.
There are many great CZcams videos on small bodied Martins, here’s one link that may help...
czcams.com/video/o6xQ8iWTygU/video.html
@@anothergraypicker thank you very very much for your reply.
I am 72 years old and I have osteoarthritis of the fingers and I bought the Martin Dreadnaught Junior with a smaller scale length, light gauge strings and a 1.75 inch nut for this very reason. I do find it easier to play.
I want an affordable acoustic nylon or steel string guitar like the SQUIRE BULLET Mustang electric guitar.
My 67 year old hands prefer regular scale 4 string instruments. Much easier to do barre chords and all the chords take less strength in my fingers.
May i know the guitar you have in this video? I'm 63, want to learn guitar-playing more, especially fingerstyle.
Sure, it’s an Alvarez AP66ESHB.
Here’s a link to my video review of the AP66…
czcams.com/video/yZwRmuwEMmk/video.html
Here’s a link to Alvarez Guitars web page for the AP66ESHB
alvarezguitars.com/guitar/ap66eshb/
Thanks for watching, and I hope you find a guitar that suits your style...
Thank you so much 😊
I tuned my D35 HD a half step down wich is great to play some Blues and set the capo on the first fret to play in standard tuning. But I still prefer my Ceo7 , my 00028 EC sounds muddy, even dull when air humidity is higher than 45%.
Great comment. I've "detuned" a half step from time to time too, and found that some guitars seem to take to it better than others. And humidity certainly does impact tone on solid wood instruments. I live where it's often a real fight to manage high humidity, and when you keep it well under control the rewards are worth the effort in both stability and tone. BTW, nice collection of Martins ...
Thanks for watching.
yep I could never give up my D-35 and keeping it tuned down a half step really helps my hands.
Your 000 sounds muddy with anything over 45? I'm surprised by that honestly. I can understand if it was high 50s. Also, your d35 is also rosewood. So technically it should also be muddy
I have a Martin 000 28 : it sounded bad when humidity until it gets 8 year old, and it sounded dull until I tune it a half step up with lighter strings. And now I love her.
Great Video. I am also looking for a smaller scale mainly because I have a small body myself and find it hard to reach and first fret (eg F chord) and to have my right shoulder so high around the bigger bodies. Anyway, my question is your thoughts on small scale vs parlor. I understand the difference is where the body intersects the neck? 12th fret for parlor and 15th fret for small scale)
Hi Ann. Have you tried moving the guitar further over on your right leg so you strumming arm fits through the curve of the guitar and your strumming hand strums over the fretboard. Should make it easy to get to the 1st fret. Plus you will look unique and cool :) Its actually one reason why some electric guitars have a horn and the strap attaches to it. It has the effect of moving the guitar to the right.
Ann, thanks for watching. Regarding “ small scale vs parlor”, it’s a bit more complicated. Short scale guitars can be found in almost any body style. And parlor guitars can have necks that join the body at either the 12th or 14th frets. (If memory serves there are even some 13th fret models to be found.) The trick then is to find the guitar that most closely matches your own needs.
From your comments you may want to consider both parlor and “00” size bodies that have scale lengths from 24” to 24.75”. I tend to like 12 fret necks because they “push” the bridge a bit deeper into the top (i.e., closer to the bottom end of the guitar). Most folks agree that this gives the tone a bit sweeter or mellower “flavor,” though in my experience it’s surely a subtle difference.
One guitar that I considered long and hard is the Yamaha CSF series (including all solid wood models and laminate models) with 14 fret necks and 23 5/8” scale. usa.yamaha.com/products/musical_instruments/guitars_basses/ac_guitars/csf/index.html For me the Alvarez parlor in the this video won out because of the 12 fret neck. There are many candidates to choose from these days including excellent models from Eastman and Larrivee if your budget is a bit less restrictive. Let me know if I can answer other questions. Happy hunting and thanks for watching.
@@anothergraypicker Hey, great response. Thank you. I did not know there were so many different options. I used to have a Larrivee and loved it. I didnt know they had a parlor size. I will look further. Thank you
How do you like the Alvarez at this point in time? I have been looking for something smaller for a few months now. I have premature macula degeneration and no longer drive. This has hindered my search. I am interested in the Blueridge 341 and the Washburn parlor guitar. I think both have a 1 7/8 nut, which I had on an Ovation 12 fret "folklore" I bought in the mid 70s. It still plays great but I want a smaller body. My dreadnoughts are a stretch for everyday use.
John, I’m still well pleased after playing the AP66 for a few months now. Still trying to decide on the best strings for my purposes. I too looked at the Blueridge and Washburn parlors and I believe either would be an excellent choice. I have two thoughts that may help. First, pay careful attention to the specs with regard to nut width and scale length. Even if the body feels right, it doesn’t matter much if your left hand isn’t comfortable. Secondly, with a bit of “due diligence” (i.e. research), you should be able to find good reputable online sellers and not need to do any driving. I have had good luck with Reverb and I know of several folks who’ve been very happy with Sweetwater too. Happy hunting and don’t hesitate to reach out if you have more questions. Thanks for watching...
I donr think you need aging hands for short scale. Short scale can sound better. I try ans explain that to people. I hate when things are put into boxes. This is only for this, this is only for that. I'm not saying you're doing that, but alot of people do. Alot of people are convinced an OM is always better than an 000 which si ridiculous
Great comment, and I agree that we put things is "boxes" all too often. Because my channel is geared primarily to aging guitarists I focused on that concern. But as you point out a beautiful instrument is definitely not limited to certain body shapes or neck designs. The "voice" is the important consideration and there are many lovely voices to be explored. Thanks for watching and commenting.
@@anothergraypickerAgreed. And I didn't mean you when I said "people". No offense meant. Appreciate the video.
You express yourself well, no offense taken, not even close.
None taken. You expressed yourself well. Thanks for your comments and for watching.
In my opinion, 24.75" scale is standard scale length. Anything above that is a "long scale" and anything 24" and below is "short scale"!
Thanks for your comment and thanks for watching
Check out DGW for a nice short scale ❤
DGW thanks for watching. Great concept specializing in short scale guitars. Hope your business prospers. BTW I’m a former resident of Durango here, 1985-1989. What a beautiful town and great folks...
@@anothergraypicker Thanks a Bunch. Just moved south out of the snow ❄️
Thanks for an interesting posting. I'd like to add my experience, which is a bit different from most of the reader's comments I've looked at.
For me, my playing style affected my decision regarding how to resolve my fretting hand finger problems. I'm a 74 year old bluegrass-influenced picker. For those of you not familiar with the style I'm describing, listen to for example Russ Barenberg's guitar solo here at 1:07
czcams.com/video/Gyj7m0QdFkM/video.html
For tunes like this, I need a fairly low action and a quick response to the plectrum ('flatpick' if you're American). My solution has been to use extra-light gauge strings on my Martin D-28 'dreadnought' (after using light guage for many years). I've never had strong hands, and I've always had to look after them. Medium gauge strings have never been an option.
Interestingly, scale length has never been an issue for me - I've played guitars with longer and shorter scale lengths, and felt comfortable with them all.
Thanks for these great comments, and thanks for watching
I try soprano ukulele I'm noodling about is much easier and cheaper than guitars and been trying to learn the fipple flute it's cheaper. I'm only on disability pension it's all I can afford now
Ukulele and a flute... bet that there are some really sweet sounds coming from that combo.
guitars for arthritis hands...