These are the crimpers we use when we repin the connectors to fix these Bally games! amzn.to/3aLST7Y Atari ANYTHING! you buy on Amazon after clicking that link doesn't raise your prices but gives us a referral tip, thank you!
It's very good for a widebody, a lot of people don't like widebodies because they're slower, but this one plays fast, for a widebody, it's very well designed and laid out!
Oh, the woman in blue on the backglass looks like a young version of the actress Wendie Malick with braids. That was worst backbox mess I've seen in any of your videos. That spark/fire was a trip too. But man, you've been doing this for so long and know how to be safe. I can imagine you've possibly seen crazier things in a backbox or cabinet. After all that work you're darn right it's worth saving.
It does look like her, I looked her up, your'e right! Here's a backbox that was even worse, check this out if you get time : czcams.com/video/OUEB7E6aW-A/video.html
Hell yes it's worth saving! It's a fantastic table. All the old tables are worth saving, in my opinion, where possible within reason. They're going to become fewer and fewer as the years go by anyway, so it's great that to see every one that gets resurrected
I agree 100%, I'll save about anything :) We have a good little system going where we can make a little bit of money (not much!) saving even the weirdest ones :)
I love the "da da duummm" type of music, it's like a pre-spoiler alert for things that are going to come. I usually pause the video and go get my popcorn. LOL
For a 1st time pin owner and little electrical knowledge, very helpful, thank you, very informative! Liked the historical bit of Stern and Bally, didn't know that. Looking forward to next video, keep it up!
This rectifier board was used in games with an auxiliary lamp board. The extra lamp load was too much for the standard bridge and transformer to handle so instead of the square bridge we used 1/2 bridge rectification configured to handle the increased load.
@@LyonsArcade l did. I was the Bally R&D lab supervisor back in the early years of solid state pinball design. Love your videos. Happy to fill in the gaps.
On aluminum and copper, I think Barkeeper's Friend (acid-based scouring powder) can clean up metal. In worst cases, hydrochloric acid might be needed. It reminds me of toilets. Generally, you want to use bases (bleach, lye) to clean those so you don't damage the enamel, but in worst cases, you'd use an acid-based cleanser (like sulfuric acid).
Hey RonJoe interesting story. I'm a material handling equipment tech and learned on stuff almost identical to EM pins. Old pins would be perfect training platform. Wish I could sell the idea to management. Train students in relay logic, save $ on building trainers, and have sweet pins to use/sell. Sadly, they're not visionaries like us...
Sometimes they have them in the game, but most of them are online, people have done a good job of scanning them in over the years. Thank you for the kind words!
I'm working on a Spy Hunter pin right now - my first ever. I struggled all day yesterday to try and drill out the back box lock (previous owner lost the key). I need to get inside so I can inspect, diagnose and repair. Have to admit, I'm already having a lot fun tinkering around with this thing. Can't wait until I manage to get it running! Thanks a lot for the videos - they're really helpful. 🤙 How do you swap out play field bulbs without unsoldering connections? Haven't sought out that info yet. New bulbs coming in the mail.
Usually you can bend the socket out of the way and pull the bulb out, if it's the bulbs under the plastics you take the plastic off and can pull them out through the top of the playfield by pushing them in and turning them. On a Spy Hunter I believe they're all 555 bulbs, which means you just pull them straight out of the socket.
Watching this made go buy circuit breakers for fixing my pinballs. 3amp to 20amp. Do you use them for testing or do you have another trick for troubleshooting (instead of fuses).
To stiffen up the bulb holders you could cut a piece of a fabric washer out so its almost a C shape, just slide in place, then a bit of glue to keep it there maybe.
I'm an em guy but wanting to expand my horizons. Can you do a quick video on what I'm looking at when you open these backboxes? How to tell what board is which
As a Bench Tech we would get these Epson boards back from the field and then be burned up all way is 1 of 2 areas the boards where the cheap press cardboard boards 1 side. there where 2 ic used to drive the pin on the print head (9 pin Dot Matrix printhead) I have to cut out the burnt area fill it with epoxy and put a 14 pin ic holder and rebuild the runs - using 22 AWG solid core wire (Bell telephone hookup wire) - took 2 days to fix them because i had to let the epoxy dry overnight.. it got so i could do 20 to 25 in 2 days - cuting out the burned area took the most time along with the epoxy.
That's wild, I've messed with those print heads before , wow that would be the biggest pain. 20 in two days, did they keep you working on them constantly? I wonder if word got back to Epson so they could fix that on the next model!
@@LyonsArcade I work for Jolynn Service Corp. They had the 8A (Minorary Bussiness) contract with World Bank in DC to repair all the computer equipment at the bank except for the mainframes. Terminals, PC, PC Printers, this was back in the days of the IBM XT and AT. Also had a contract with DC Public Schools who was using DEC PDP 11/23+. The people in the field return bad parts back to the office and me and one other would repair them for the field tech to use in the repair of equipment. As for EPSON all they want to do was sell you the mainboard. They know it was cheap material in making the mail board and made that if it got damaged you would have to replace the board. I got so that when we ordered new boards from EPSON we unsolder the 2 ic put 2 14 pin ic socket's in and put the ic's back in the socket. This saved us a lot of problems in that when the ic burn up it did not damage the board, only the IC and Socket that we could then unsolder and replace. They had like 10 - 12 people who just work at World Bank shagging calls swapping boards and sending them back to the office.
@@LyonsArcade Each month I spent apx 6 days repairing EPSON boards. 3 days repairing P&E Video Terminal boards (Ones with the Flyback on them) 2 days on P&E Power supply, 3 or 4 days on the IBM PC and XT Power supply. and as a former DEC Field Engineer I sometimes go on calls for the DEC 11/23+
JOE's CLASSIC, I'm confused what the "heatsink Bar" that is underneath the rectifier board is used for, why was it shorting out the circuit board when you first powered on the rectifier power supply board? Another question I have is that when techs have added that "Jumper wire" to the +5vdc wire because the voltage had some type of "time delay" because the +5 volts has to loop around to other circuits. This "time delay" is some type of +5vdc problem on the pinballs regulator/driver boards?
It was supposed to be mounted just behind the bridge rectifiers, and it spaced them out so that through that heatsink bar the bridge rectifiers were connected to the metal panel behind it, so it could use it to dissipate heat. With it in place, the rest of the board is held off the plate so that nothing shorts out. Unfortunately I didn't mount all the screws back in it, so it had slid down into the wrong place and was touching a pin on the back of the power supply, making it short out and catch fire! The jumper on the solenoid board was to kind of correct a design flaw on the original design, basically the voltage is sent out of the board to another board, but only on 1 pin... so if that 1 pin gets any resistance on it (like it gets corroded, or dirty at all) then you lose a little voltage as the power goes out that pin, then back in on another pin. It's not really a time thing, it's more of a voltage drop. By tying the two test points together on the solenoid board, you're making a stronger connection so that when the power comes back on the board its' still at the same voltage it left the board at instead of a little bit lower.
@@LyonsArcade ok thanks I didn't see that part in the video of the heatsink bar not screw in all the way so I missed what was happening. Ok thanks i will look for a voltage drop on Pin#1 for a common failure.
Yes, you just plug the LED bulbs in where the regular bulbs are, easy peasy. I don't like to do it to these older ones though because it's more expensive and looks like crap. It's like putting chrome hubcaps on a 69 Camaro, looks cheap.
General questions. and something extremely interesting for anyone that would like pinball and Lego. First are those look like meter seals are those just use for a serial number the boards. Second of all on that main board there are components that look like a smaller maybe quarter watt resistor? But have I think an orange stripe and look very different than the color coding of a resistor. My guess is those are through hole fuses. I've seen them before and Equipment something some more than me not quite the same long time ago . They may be half an amp or 1 amp? I've seen them used in logic circuits and controls of various types. Once I saw them on the board that had solid state relays. And input output modules. I used it for project it was something I got used from someone else that didn't need it. And a bunch of extra goodies. Including a pinball power supply. . Kind of looked like something in that was in that machine? Also how many volts amps all that type of specs on the average pinball power supply for the older ones. It's been many years since I had gotten hold of one. Might be a good option for some projects. I'm a Electronics enthusiast and a maker. Also has anyone out there ever played a Lego pinball machine. I've seen a few and actually have played a few. I even played one that was a full-size machine. And 99% Lego. The only thing that wasn't was the controller but it was driving like a hardware to operate it. Most of the room inside was the actual Hardware. It was being run by some sort of computer type controller. Which I believe was customized. This was before raspberry pies. I do know the controller was running Linux though. There were quite a few of the old interface A's and also interface b's What I was saying about quite a while ago is that the hardware was not up to date. It also some Mindstorms Hardware. And a few of the old 12 volt Lego train Transformers. And even 9 volt speed regulators. I mean this thing was a full-on pinball machine. Scoring was mechanical. Used change and had number plates that would go past the Windows. But I did have her score and the displays would reset after each game automatically. And some of the logic was actually mechanical and electrical operated by Motors. and some of what we've been originally relays were using Motors And Lego switches of various types. This was some why I knew that had built this. Also by the way it was not on legs as usual cabinet would be. For good reason. almost all the inner workings controls mall or in the bottom of the cabinet. Heck even the cooling fan for the whole thing was Lego. Probably will the most awesome technical uses of Lego I've ever seen. in the only other non Lego thing I remember on it in the only other non Lego thing I remember on it was the ball. What I don't remember what they used. I don't I think it was metal as far as I can remember. Wood or solid plastic Maybe? Very dense rubber?
Shame about the corrosion from the battery. This machine has so much crammed into it. Looks like it would be a lot of fun to play. The power supply probably has the extra power transistors just because there is so much going on.
Joe I have a couple of questions for you. Given the nature of this particular machine where it might have had some overheating issues, did you worry about the wiring integrity? The heat would cause the wire sheething to become brittle thus exposing the copper (or aluminum). Like myself I love everything original to a machine, but given the power consumption generated by traditional incandescent bulbs, have you considered replacing them with LEDs (the type that replicate a fading/dimmable effects like incandescent do)?
I don't like the look of the LED's on these older ones (or the cost) but I do put in different incandescents that use about half the power as the originals. The wiring typically isn't a problem long term except in the areas that it has burnt, then you have to replace at least as much as was charred up!
The insulation ratings of the wire Bally used for solid state cables far exceeded possible faults. Wish that were true for Molex KK connectors. Typically when you encounter a game of this vintage the cable harness itself is in nominal shape but the power supply connectors are burned and in need of replacement.
I've been subscribed some time to your channel,but the last couple of weeks i've been more into your videos than before and i really enjoy them! this pinball raised my curiosity cuz i own a bally mystic the same period that future spa is. the problem is that after some years i got it,one day it just stopped playing! i mean you flip the switch and it just light up like a christmas tree.no coils banging,no self check,nothing. just lights up. the battery was removed and there was no corrosion there whatsoever. what you think could have caused that out of the blue? will it be so hard to fix it?
That's good there's no corrosion.... you've got some sort of power problem likely, take the backglass off and look at the mpu where the battery was, there's a LED that flashes when the game tries to boot up. If it's not flashing at all you're not getting power to the MPU, if it flashes a certain number of times you can tell by the number of flashes what's not working. There are several fuses on the power transformer rectifier board too, if one or two of those is blown it won't boot either. If you go to www.PinRepair.com and read the article about reparing bally pinball machines it tells you step by step how you can follow the power through and figure out what's going on, you'll need a multimeter and if the board needs work might need a soldering iron.
In regards to testing and results of tests of diodes also applies to bridge rectifier of course. A lot of the time but not always to most of the time of course it depends on conditions and what causes failure. I've heard this from others as well as from my own experience diodes have a tendency to fail Short Circuit we're very close to it. I've seen this a lot in reverse polarity protection circuits weather protection circuit soldiers on the output of the power supply such as a bench power supply. Some people even say that the diodes have jumper Envy. And that when they go bad they become a jumper instead of a diode. AKA fell short circuit or very close very very little resistance write down to zero ohms. Danielle it's like he says a lot of components don't just feel over time little by little but it's all or nothing is the way I phrase this. Yeah sometimes you'll have some weird where it degrades and just seems to lose some characteristics or just gets worse over time and then finally gives up the ghost but that's not as often with solid state not passive components Such as where a resistor is starting to give up the ghost because of either being just plain bad or just overloaded or abused in circuit because of other failures I've seen resistors change value but was there a loss as to why. And then again those can go all or nothing too Doesn't take too much of a overcurrent or otherwise bad conditions to cause an open circuit and usually you pretty much know it when seeing the resistor or even smelling it. By the way worst smell ever I've run across in in my life with an electronic device had got to be a failed selenium rectifier! If people remember those and what happened when they went out when it happened. And that in burning bake a light as well. Have had weird smells in a room and we're not recognize what was it smelled like I'm like okay time to check all my fixtures and lamps and I couldn't track it down. Essentially one sentence have you checked any light sockets. Was asked why and I said trust me. Sure enough one of the plastic Elite sockets that look like kind of Bakelite stuff but may not have been may have been one of the other things that similar. There was your mysterious odor cooked bulb socket. When the more annoying things is having something let out the blue smoke AKA Magic Smoke oftentimes for some reason it's something that cannot be readily fixed or parts not readily available it always has to be that part that's going to be the hardest to get ahold of or otherwise to fix seems like Murphy's Law also applies to electronics! I've got a weird fuse that was clearly blown but acted weird afterwards ever since it would test fine but would not pass current I've got that in something since it's one of those Weird Mysteries and no one's been able to figure it out. I heard about someone else having the same problem once years ago before the internet both me and the other person Also something interesting sometimes every once while you'd hear of a device picking up radio signals even in areas where there is not a tower in the vicinity close enough that things that are not properly shielded or poorly designed pick up the radio signal. Owen how do I know about this. About things that are not designed to pick up radios signals picking up and amplifying a signal. Used to live in an area that was essentially right next to a fairly higher power radio station approximately very much less than a quarter mile away. You'd hear the radio station on the most anything with a speaker depending on how bad the design was. Even the kids toys with an amplifier you'd hear the radio station in the background! And oftentimes even pick up the landline phone you'd hear the radio in the background but not always. A lot of people would have the toy record players in the older ones all these would usually have the same problems. By the way I remember years ago at the church family member worked out and I used to go to when I was much younger. Essentially anytime an emergency vehicle pass by you'd actually hear the vehicle radio if there were transmitting is there the PA system. It was said it was actually for some reason regarding the output wiring but I doubt this but if anyone could chime in on this please do so. I'd love to put this one to bed. But I do know that things were not shielded well on this system as it was. I do not know the power rating of this transmitter but I believe it was one of the higher power transmitters regarding when living in that area where you could hear the radio on almost anything. And I do know that sometimes it seemed to swap out other stations but it depended on the radio itself as to this effect. And also I've always heard about people saying that oh it must be music on home sometimes or thought even when we are calling from that place that there was music on hold and we had hold at home. Which we did not in our phones that we had didn't even have the hold function. Just at radio station playing on there due to the aforementioned effects. By the way there was a place that visited sometimes at hand an old fence that had once been electrified but no longer had been since no longer an active area of a farm war was no longer used as a farm itself forget unfortunately so many years ago. However I use the electric fence as a large antenna worked fairly well essentially in the middle of whole length of the fence was where I was able to connect for antenna. Do they have had then fence grounded for safety apparently they said they had add lightning jump from the fence to other things prior and this was done to help protect other equipment and people. I think I was even using the original fence grounding rod for my radio ground even if I remember correctly the fence Energizer was in a little shed just off the house by the way they had cut out switches around the farm for the electric fence. Complete with a pilot light in each one some of these were in a little quote unquote weather resistant overhang. Even some outdoor telephones and even in the barn had a phone. Sometimes if you're trying to Jerry bring an antenna if there's old unused electrical you know is open both ends are all low voltage wiring or even on the TV antenna any of this is worth trying to get some reception especially if it remote areas. Even when I was younger living on a hobby Farm my room actually had access to the old TV antennas and more Adventure got permission to put up a radio antenna. And of course always have yoused some type of protection against lightning. And other electrical faults but this is not for the faint of heart or those that were not be qualified to do something like this not recommended unless you know what you're doing!
You can see if a diode is shorted by seeing if the diode gives you a reading both ways it should only get a reading one way on diodes. You can also blow up a diode by putting it in wrong. Heck just a simple diode put in wrong could fowl up the whole game have heard that happen to some repairmen and the diode was in wrong from the factory. So what you doin factory worker putting into one diode wrong and making us pull out our hair over one little component? xD
It happens :) I've found stuff completely broken from the factory and it's been like that for 40 years, it never worked (but it was something minor nobody noticed or tried to ever fix)....
Future Spa is an awesome game. Love it. You can get a 'hardtop(reproduction playfield)' Here. www.outsideedgeproducts.com/store/p75/Pinball_Playfield_Hardtop.html
To be fair, it was on the tip of my tongue but I couldn't quite remember it. I asked my lovely and talented wife for "a $10 word for educational," and she answered without missing a beat
That board is trash. Its not the damaged components that make is unrepairable. The entire edge ground strip is corroded. No one will save that board. Its only value is any hard-to-find parts.
These are the crimpers we use when we repin the connectors to fix these Bally games! amzn.to/3aLST7Y
Atari ANYTHING! you buy on Amazon after clicking that link doesn't raise your prices but gives us a referral tip, thank you!
Kudos to your one-handed camera and repair skills to show us all of these step by step repairs!
Thanks Phillip, see you on the next video!
There is something about 'Future Spa' that is quite hilarious. OOOh, the spa of the future! I've dreamed of that!
Then if you think about it... Bally opened up real spas a couple years later lol somebody there was really into it...
Joe's Classic Video Games wow, that’s got to be right. Mind boggles ;-)
Thanks for posting videos.. I nice to see you not give up on anything.
Keep up the good work 👍
Thanks Bryan, we appreciate you checking it out, even though it was over an hour long!
I like the way you break down the repair process. I'm a rookie and appreciate the attention to detail and explanation. Thanks for making these videos.
It's how I think about it when I do them, I work all the way through them slowly that way I know it's all good.
Unusual wide pin, will be a good addition for someone's collection. Thanks for working on it and showing the process.
It's very good for a widebody, a lot of people don't like widebodies because they're slower, but this one plays fast, for a widebody, it's very well designed and laid out!
Oh, the woman in blue on the backglass looks like a young version of the actress Wendie Malick with braids. That was worst backbox mess I've seen in any of your videos. That spark/fire was a trip too. But man, you've been doing this for so long and know how to be safe. I can imagine you've possibly seen crazier things in a backbox or cabinet. After all that work you're darn right it's worth saving.
It does look like her, I looked her up, your'e right! Here's a backbox that was even worse, check this out if you get time : czcams.com/video/OUEB7E6aW-A/video.html
I laughed out loud t the fire extinguisher gag :) Good stuff, looking forward for the next part.
LOL Glad somebody enjoyed it...
God Dam Batteries and Capacitors, The nemeses of vintage electronics.
Pretty much! Even the cigarettes didn't kill 'em!
It looks like someone was violently ill on that board!
Watching you struggle with your multimeter reminds me that they DO make camera tripods you know? Lol! Love the videos brother👍🏻
I've seen those, maybe I should get one then use it everytime I do a gameplay video for the last 6 years :) Thank you for watching smashgordon!
Hell yes it's worth saving! It's a fantastic table. All the old tables are worth saving, in my opinion, where possible within reason. They're going to become fewer and fewer as the years go by anyway, so it's great that to see every one that gets resurrected
I agree 100%, I'll save about anything :) We have a good little system going where we can make a little bit of money (not much!) saving even the weirdest ones :)
The alien mystery music cracks me up everytime XD
I picked up a Future Spa and it’s a really fun pin.
It really is a cool game!
I love the "da da duummm" type of music, it's like a pre-spoiler alert for things that are going to come. I usually pause the video and go get my popcorn. LOL
I'm trying to spice up my production a little bit :)
@@LyonsArcade it's working and I laughed at the john cena reference for a bit too
Great video again. Your videos get an unfair share of what little spare time I have. Thanks!!
Eventually you'll watch them all and get your time back :)
+1 Love your systematic approach and attention to detail. Can't wait for the next part.
You can't wait??? You can't wait!!! I'll bet you can, the new video is out in 30 minutes :) Thanks for watching Mark, we appreciate it!
I love that you're saving this machine. It's such an odd one!
The best ones to save :)
For a 1st time pin owner and little electrical knowledge, very helpful, thank you, very informative! Liked the historical bit of Stern and Bally, didn't know that. Looking forward to next video, keep it up!
Thanks for watching Troy, see you on the next video!
Awesome teacher...thanks
Thank you Michel I'm glad you enjoyed the video!
Nice job !… waiting patiently for the next part =) Great vid , as usual !
It will be coming soon, we're going to upload more videos since it's Christmas time.
I've always said oxidization, not oxidation - so you're right either way you say it. Screw what other people say!
Tell 'em, Hunter's Moon!
3 in 1 oil trick worked wonders on a pesky flickering socket on my Hot Shot - thx!
Somebody brought it up here on youtube in the comments section once, so I figured I'd give it a try :)
Nice its a half way alive 😎👍
Yes, it's getting there!
This rectifier board was used in games with an auxiliary lamp board. The extra lamp load was too much for the standard bridge and transformer to handle so instead of the square bridge we used 1/2 bridge rectification configured to handle the increased load.
Thank you for the info that makes sense! Did you work with Bally back in the day?
@@LyonsArcade l did. I was the Bally R&D lab supervisor back in the early years of solid state pinball design. Love your videos. Happy to fill in the gaps.
@@artransitmemories9640 Thanks for your insight with a bit of history.
Love your work good job
Thanks Delta Bravo!
Great video!
Thanks Jeff, we appreciate you watching!
The solenoid board mods look like good stuff. Noticed your link to crimp tool. Which contacts do I need for a 1979 Bally for MPU connectors?
On aluminum and copper, I think Barkeeper's Friend (acid-based scouring powder) can clean up metal. In worst cases, hydrochloric acid might be needed. It reminds me of toilets. Generally, you want to use bases (bleach, lye) to clean those so you don't damage the enamel, but in worst cases, you'd use an acid-based cleanser (like sulfuric acid).
Hey RonJoe interesting story. I'm a material handling equipment tech and learned on stuff almost identical to EM pins. Old pins would be perfect training platform. Wish I could sell the idea to management. Train students in relay logic, save $ on building trainers, and have sweet pins to use/sell. Sadly, they're not visionaries like us...
Most nostalgic channel ...where in the world do you get all these repair manuals for each machine.
Sometimes they have them in the game, but most of them are online, people have done a good job of scanning them in over the years. Thank you for the kind words!
IPDB has a ton of them for free. Its a great source. Unless its a Gotliebb.
I'm working on a Spy Hunter pin right now - my first ever. I struggled all day yesterday to try and drill out the back box lock (previous owner lost the key). I need to get inside so I can inspect, diagnose and repair. Have to admit, I'm already having a lot fun tinkering around with this thing. Can't wait until I manage to get it running! Thanks a lot for the videos - they're really helpful. 🤙
How do you swap out play field bulbs without unsoldering connections? Haven't sought out that info yet. New bulbs coming in the mail.
Usually you can bend the socket out of the way and pull the bulb out, if it's the bulbs under the plastics you take the plastic off and can pull them out through the top of the playfield by pushing them in and turning them. On a Spy Hunter I believe they're all 555 bulbs, which means you just pull them straight out of the socket.
@@LyonsArcade Thanks! I'll see how it goes. 🤙
[spoiler alert] I lol'ed at the sparks flying.
LOL That was hilarious, I was glad I got it on tape!
Good call in checking the fire extinguisher expiration date.
Just in case :)
Watching this made go buy circuit breakers for fixing my pinballs. 3amp to 20amp. Do you use them for testing or do you have another trick for troubleshooting (instead of fuses).
I've never used them but they're a good idea!
To stiffen up the bulb holders you could cut a piece of a fabric washer out so its almost a C shape, just slide in place, then a bit of glue to keep it there maybe.
That would work, anything to press it back together!
I'm an em guy but wanting to expand my horizons. Can you do a quick video on what I'm looking at when you open these backboxes? How to tell what board is which
Sure thing, check this out : czcams.com/video/_o84Aq-Ybao/video.html
As a Bench Tech we would get these Epson boards back from the field and then be burned up all way is 1 of 2 areas the boards where the cheap press cardboard boards 1 side. there where 2 ic used to drive the pin on the print head (9 pin Dot Matrix printhead) I have to cut out the burnt area fill it with epoxy and put a 14 pin ic holder and rebuild the runs - using 22 AWG solid core wire (Bell telephone hookup wire) - took 2 days to fix them because i had to let the epoxy dry overnight.. it got so i could do 20 to 25 in 2 days - cuting out the burned area took the most time along with the epoxy.
That's wild, I've messed with those print heads before , wow that would be the biggest pain. 20 in two days, did they keep you working on them constantly? I wonder if word got back to Epson so they could fix that on the next model!
@@LyonsArcade I work for Jolynn Service Corp. They had the 8A (Minorary Bussiness) contract with World Bank in DC to repair all the computer equipment at the bank except for the mainframes. Terminals, PC, PC Printers, this was back in the days of the IBM XT and AT. Also had a contract with DC Public Schools who was using DEC PDP 11/23+. The people in the field return bad parts back to the office and me and one other would repair them for the field tech to use in the repair of equipment. As for EPSON all they want to do was sell you the mainboard. They know it was cheap material in making the mail board and made that if it got damaged you would have to replace the board. I got so that when we ordered new boards from EPSON we unsolder the 2 ic put 2 14 pin ic socket's in and put the ic's back in the socket. This saved us a lot of problems in that when the ic burn up it did not damage the board, only the IC and Socket that we could then unsolder and replace. They had like 10 - 12 people who just work at World Bank shagging calls swapping boards and sending them back to the office.
@@LyonsArcade Each month I spent apx 6 days repairing EPSON boards. 3 days repairing P&E Video Terminal boards (Ones with the Flyback on them) 2 days on P&E Power supply, 3 or 4 days on the IBM PC and XT Power supply. and as a former DEC Field Engineer I sometimes go on calls for the DEC 11/23+
JOE's CLASSIC, I'm confused what the "heatsink Bar" that is underneath the rectifier board is used for, why was it shorting out the circuit board when you first powered on the rectifier power supply board? Another question I have is that when techs have added that "Jumper wire" to the +5vdc wire because the voltage had some type of "time delay" because the +5 volts has to loop around to other circuits. This "time delay" is some type of +5vdc problem on the pinballs regulator/driver boards?
It was supposed to be mounted just behind the bridge rectifiers, and it spaced them out so that through that heatsink bar the bridge rectifiers were connected to the metal panel behind it, so it could use it to dissipate heat. With it in place, the rest of the board is held off the plate so that nothing shorts out. Unfortunately I didn't mount all the screws back in it, so it had slid down into the wrong place and was touching a pin on the back of the power supply, making it short out and catch fire!
The jumper on the solenoid board was to kind of correct a design flaw on the original design, basically the voltage is sent out of the board to another board, but only on 1 pin... so if that 1 pin gets any resistance on it (like it gets corroded, or dirty at all) then you lose a little voltage as the power goes out that pin, then back in on another pin. It's not really a time thing, it's more of a voltage drop. By tying the two test points together on the solenoid board, you're making a stronger connection so that when the power comes back on the board its' still at the same voltage it left the board at instead of a little bit lower.
@@LyonsArcade ok thanks I didn't see that part in the video of the heatsink bar not screw in all the way so I missed what was happening. Ok thanks i will look for a voltage drop on Pin#1 for a common failure.
@Joe's Classic Video Games Is There a Way to Upgrade Machines like this From Bulbs to LED ?,,,,, Make a Video please
Yes, you just plug the LED bulbs in where the regular bulbs are, easy peasy. I don't like to do it to these older ones though because it's more expensive and looks like crap. It's like putting chrome hubcaps on a 69 Camaro, looks cheap.
I'm following
Thanks Victory Metal Detecting!
General questions.
and something extremely interesting for anyone that would like pinball and Lego.
First are those look like meter seals are those just use for a serial number the boards.
Second of all on that main board there are components that look like a smaller maybe quarter watt resistor?
But have I think an orange stripe and look very different than the color coding of a resistor.
My guess is those are through hole fuses.
I've seen them before and Equipment something some more than me not quite the same long time ago .
They may be half an amp or 1 amp?
I've seen them used in logic circuits and controls of various types.
Once I saw them on the board that had solid state relays.
And input output modules.
I used it for project it was something I got used from someone else that didn't need it.
And a bunch of extra goodies.
Including a pinball power supply.
. Kind of looked like something in that was in that machine?
Also how many volts amps all that type of specs on the average pinball power supply for the older ones.
It's been many years since I had gotten hold of one.
Might be a good option for some projects.
I'm a Electronics enthusiast and a maker.
Also has anyone out there ever played a Lego pinball machine.
I've seen a few and actually have played a few.
I even played one that was a full-size machine.
And 99% Lego.
The only thing that wasn't was the controller but it was driving like a hardware to operate it.
Most of the room inside was the actual Hardware.
It was being run by some sort of computer type controller.
Which I believe was customized.
This was before raspberry pies.
I do know the controller was running Linux though.
There were quite a few of the old interface A's and also interface b's
What I was saying about quite a while ago is that the hardware was not up to date.
It also some Mindstorms Hardware.
And a few of the old 12 volt Lego train Transformers.
And even 9 volt speed regulators.
I mean this thing was a full-on pinball machine.
Scoring was mechanical.
Used change and had number plates that would go past the Windows.
But I did have her score and the displays would reset after each game automatically.
And some of the logic was actually mechanical and electrical operated by Motors.
and some of what we've been originally relays were using Motors And Lego switches of various types.
This was some why I knew that had built this.
Also by the way it was not on legs as usual cabinet would be.
For good reason.
almost all the inner workings controls mall or in the bottom of the cabinet.
Heck even the cooling fan for the whole thing was Lego.
Probably will the most awesome technical uses of Lego I've ever seen.
in the only other non Lego thing I remember on it in the only other non Lego thing I remember on it was the ball.
What I don't remember what they used.
I don't I think it was metal as far as I can remember.
Wood or solid plastic Maybe?
Very dense rubber?
About that transistor: Unlike other parts like resistors and capacitors those are sold by manufacturer's part number and not specs.
That sounds right :)
Shame about the corrosion from the battery. This machine has so much crammed into it. Looks like it would be a lot of fun to play.
The power supply probably has the extra power transistors just because there is so much going on.
Brendan these Ballys almost every one of them the battery kills them. It's about 80% of the ones we get that haven't been fixed up yet....
Working on a FS and just found this! Do you work on the left outlane diverter at all? Mine's acting up
Usually they stick a little bit and need a little bit of oil to get them moving easily...
@@LyonsArcade Cool. Also tried your 3in1 oil trick on some of my dud sockets. Worked just great!
I am horribly immature but it really says "transformer ass" on the board :)
Yes, yes it does. And somebody did that, and someone else approved it, LOL
Joe I have a couple of questions for you. Given the nature of this particular machine where it might have had some overheating issues, did you worry about the wiring integrity? The heat would cause the wire sheething to become brittle thus exposing the copper (or aluminum).
Like myself I love everything original to a machine, but given the power consumption generated by traditional incandescent bulbs, have you considered replacing them with LEDs (the type that replicate a fading/dimmable effects like incandescent do)?
I don't like the look of the LED's on these older ones (or the cost) but I do put in different incandescents that use about half the power as the originals. The wiring typically isn't a problem long term except in the areas that it has burnt, then you have to replace at least as much as was charred up!
The insulation ratings of the wire Bally used for solid state cables far exceeded possible faults. Wish that were true for Molex KK connectors. Typically when you encounter a game of this vintage the cable harness itself is in nominal shape but the power supply connectors are burned and in need of replacement.
I've been subscribed some time to your channel,but the last couple of weeks i've been more into your videos than before and i really enjoy them! this pinball raised my curiosity cuz i own a bally mystic the same period that future spa is. the problem is that after some years i got it,one day it just stopped playing! i mean you flip the switch and it just light up like a christmas tree.no coils banging,no self check,nothing. just lights up. the battery was removed and there was no corrosion there whatsoever. what you think could have caused that out of the blue? will it be so hard to fix it?
That's good there's no corrosion.... you've got some sort of power problem likely, take the backglass off and look at the mpu where the battery was, there's a LED that flashes when the game tries to boot up. If it's not flashing at all you're not getting power to the MPU, if it flashes a certain number of times you can tell by the number of flashes what's not working. There are several fuses on the power transformer rectifier board too, if one or two of those is blown it won't boot either. If you go to www.PinRepair.com and read the article about reparing bally pinball machines it tells you step by step how you can follow the power through and figure out what's going on, you'll need a multimeter and if the board needs work might need a soldering iron.
@@LyonsArcade The led flashes once and then stops..i will have to figure out what this means,but i will check pinrepair for sure. thanks Joe!! \m/
In regards to testing and results of tests of diodes also applies to bridge rectifier of course.
A lot of the time but not always to most of the time of course it depends on conditions and what causes failure.
I've heard this from others as well as from my own experience diodes have a tendency to fail Short Circuit we're very close to it.
I've seen this a lot in reverse polarity protection circuits weather protection circuit soldiers on the output of the power supply such as a bench power supply.
Some people even say that the diodes have jumper Envy.
And that when they go bad they become a jumper instead of a diode.
AKA fell short circuit or very close very very little resistance write down to zero ohms.
Danielle it's like he says a lot of components don't just feel over time little by little but it's all or nothing is the way I phrase this.
Yeah sometimes you'll have some weird where it degrades and just seems to lose some characteristics or just gets worse over time and then finally gives up the ghost but that's not as often with solid state not passive components
Such as where a resistor is starting to give up the ghost because of either being just plain bad or just overloaded or abused in circuit because of other failures I've seen resistors change value but was there a loss as to why.
And then again those can go all or nothing too
Doesn't take too much of a overcurrent or otherwise bad conditions to cause an open circuit and usually you pretty much know it when seeing the resistor or even smelling it.
By the way worst smell ever I've run across in in my life with an electronic device had got to be a failed selenium rectifier!
If people remember those and what happened when they went out when it happened.
And that in burning bake a light as well.
Have had weird smells in a room and we're not recognize what was it smelled like I'm like okay time to check all my fixtures and lamps and I couldn't track it down.
Essentially one sentence have you checked any light sockets.
Was asked why and I said trust me.
Sure enough one of the plastic Elite sockets that look like kind of Bakelite stuff but may not have been may have been one of the other things that similar.
There was your mysterious odor cooked bulb socket.
When the more annoying things is having something let out the blue smoke AKA Magic Smoke oftentimes for some reason it's something that cannot be readily fixed or parts not readily available it always has to be that part that's going to be the hardest to get ahold of or otherwise to fix seems like Murphy's Law also applies to electronics!
I've got a weird fuse that was clearly blown but acted weird afterwards ever since it would test fine but would not pass current I've got that in something since it's one of those Weird Mysteries and no one's been able to figure it out.
I heard about someone else having the same problem once years ago before the internet both me and the other person
Also something interesting sometimes every once while you'd hear of a device picking up radio signals even in areas where there is not a tower in the vicinity close enough that things that are not properly shielded or poorly designed pick up the radio signal.
Owen how do I know about this.
About things that are not designed to pick up radios signals picking up and amplifying a signal.
Used to live in an area that was essentially right next to a fairly higher power radio station approximately very much less than a quarter mile away.
You'd hear the radio station on the most anything with a speaker depending on how bad the design was.
Even the kids toys with an amplifier you'd hear the radio station in the background!
And oftentimes even pick up the landline phone you'd hear the radio in the background but not always.
A lot of people would have the toy record players in the older ones all these would usually have the same problems.
By the way I remember years ago at the church family member worked out and I used to go to when I was much younger.
Essentially anytime an emergency vehicle pass by you'd actually hear the vehicle radio if there were transmitting is there the PA system.
It was said it was actually for some reason regarding the output wiring but I doubt this but if anyone could chime in on this please do so.
I'd love to put this one to bed.
But I do know that things were not shielded well on this system as it was.
I do not know the power rating of this transmitter but I believe it was one of the higher power transmitters regarding when living in that area where you could hear the radio on almost anything.
And I do know that sometimes it seemed to swap out other stations but it depended on the radio itself as to this effect.
And also I've always heard about people saying that oh it must be music on home sometimes or thought even when we are calling from that place that there was music on hold and we had hold at home.
Which we did not in our phones that we had didn't even have the hold function.
Just at radio station playing on there due to the aforementioned effects.
By the way there was a place that visited sometimes at hand an old fence that had once been electrified but no longer had been since no longer an active area of a farm war was no longer used as a farm itself forget unfortunately so many years ago.
However I use the electric fence as a large antenna worked fairly well essentially in the middle of whole length of the fence was where I was able to connect for antenna.
Do they have had then fence grounded for safety apparently they said they had add lightning jump from the fence to other things prior and this was done to help protect other equipment and people.
I think I was even using the original fence grounding rod for my radio ground even if I remember correctly the fence Energizer was in a little shed just off the house by the way they had cut out switches around the farm for the electric fence.
Complete with a pilot light in each one some of these were in a little quote unquote weather resistant overhang.
Even some outdoor telephones and even in the barn had a phone.
Sometimes if you're trying to Jerry bring an antenna if there's old unused electrical you know is open both ends are all low voltage wiring or even on the TV antenna any of this is worth trying to get some reception especially if it remote areas.
Even when I was younger living on a hobby Farm my room actually had access to the old TV antennas and more Adventure got permission to put up a radio antenna.
And of course always have yoused some type of protection against lightning.
And other electrical faults but this is not for the faint of heart or those that were not be qualified to do something like this not recommended unless you know what you're doing!
Oxidation causes oxidisation.
That's a good way of putting it, thank you Tyrone!
The solenoids are cheap but there are lots of them. Otherwise you'd just slap a more expensive modern one into it.
Electro-mechanical pinball machines; mostly just lights and servos
Yup, and if you get a problem if you think about what's going on you can eliminate it down to a few areas....
Do they even make left handed chopsticks???
Yes, Ned Flanders keeps them in stock!
You can see if a diode is shorted by seeing if the diode gives you a reading both ways it should only get a reading one way on diodes.
You can also blow up a diode by putting it in wrong.
Heck just a simple diode put in wrong could fowl up the whole game have heard that happen to some repairmen and the diode was in wrong from the factory.
So what you doin factory worker putting into one diode wrong and making us pull out our hair over one little component? xD
It happens :) I've found stuff completely broken from the factory and it's been like that for 40 years, it never worked (but it was something minor nobody noticed or tried to ever fix)....
Future Spa is an awesome game. Love it. You can get a 'hardtop(reproduction playfield)' Here. www.outsideedgeproducts.com/store/p75/Pinball_Playfield_Hardtop.html
I'm going to try one of those one day....
That lady in the middle of the playfield keeps on distracting me... wonder why...
"pedantic" but also "pedagogical"
I had to google it to make sure you weren't cussing at me :)
To be fair, it was on the tip of my tongue but I couldn't quite remember it. I asked my lovely and talented wife for "a $10 word for educational," and she answered without missing a beat
I honestly have never heard it. She's purty Smart. You might say.... she's Pedagogical.
That board is trash. Its not the damaged components that make is unrepairable. The entire edge ground strip is corroded. No one will save that board. Its only value is any hard-to-find parts.
You must be new to my channel