Reform at Dwr and DNR following FabRats legal issues. The Utah Legislature Changed the Law!!
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- čas přidán 31. 03. 2024
- The Utah Legislature stepped in to make changes recommended 40 years ago that would have prevented the poor prosecution of FabRats for transporting quagga muscles in Utah. This is a big move that would not have happened without YOU!
- Sport
should have fired that dwr officer not promote him. he was trying to make a name for himself and abuse his authority
he did a good job of doing both. he was put in a position way beyond his abilities when he was hired.
It's all to justify their jobs that shouldn't exist.
well, either way the officer made a name for himself and promoted too.
Ah! The “Peter principle” at work …. bureaucrats with badges will be over wrought and overbearing no mater what!
Ahh, the ol' "Fuck up and Move up" situation!!
It was B/S from the start UTAH dwr and DNR should be ashamed of themselves For this.
This is a prime example of government getting too big and fat. Creating more "rules", then harass and fine people for frivolous crap.
no punishment for that abusive officer again. WHAT A JOKE!!!!
Unsurprisingly, the offending Gov't officials will face zero punishment and accountability.
Thanks for sharing.
promoted still higher above their abilities.
You can’t vote out a tyrannical government. The time to bear arms has come
You exposed an extortion racket. Thank you for what you do.
Here from Fab Rats, Merlin's Old School Garage, and Jet Ski Jim who all had a part in the Yellow Submarine. ❤❤❤❤
Hunter had a huge part as well.. with the mice in the bow 'cabin' 😎
🐀😬🐀✌️
I had my own run in with Utah Law Enforcement last year, mine was with the Utah State Police. I was a tourist driving my Jeep with a 3 inch lift and wide tires around the Bryce Canyon area after coming from the Sand Hollow/St. George area. I was pulled over because my tires stuck out 1/2 an inch from my fenders, I had no mudflaps (try to offroad with mudflaps), my taillights were too dark, my stock soft top tint from directly from Jeep was too dark, and I had aftermarket Halo lights and also my chassis height was too far above the ground (?) Its nothing crazy, just a Jeep with a 3 inch lift, it will run 100 MPH down the interstate just fine if I wanted it to, that's how street oriented it is.
I got a fix it ticket from the policeman, with a fine attached if i could not correct the faults, which how could I correct the faults, I am a tourist far from home. No one has ever said anything in all the other states I have been in, and it gets flat towed behind an RV, so it goes to many many states. I ended up bringing my Jeep up the local Sheriffs office, who signed off on the fix it ticket, and stated that he was tired of the state police harassing people, namely tourists and that there was plenty of actual "crime" to occupy their time.
I rode with my buddy to Moab one year in a lifted 70 Bronco on 36" tires, body lift. After the Jeep Safari, we were heading back to So.Ca, and got pulled over late at night. After running the plates, the UHP just gave him a warning about the Utah laws. Said it did no good to charge a "tourist" for it. (Yet, he felt it was warranted to pull us over for an inspection!) My buddy said he'd never go back to Utah after that.
I was down in Utah from Canada last summer in my overlanding Rubicon. 35s And roughly 3” lift. I was one of least lifted and tires were smaller than many. The tire poke was borderline at just over 2 inches. Now I have 37s but less offset.
Should o get removable mud flaps? Headed back in June.
Several years ago in Florida I got hot by a car in a parking lot. I was on his right. That driver took off on foot. the sheriffs got him,
The highway patrol did the accident. everything was okay until the cop saw my DL and saw Saskatchewan Canada. It happened at 4:30pm, he made my wife ( who is severely handicapped) sit on a curb until 7:30 while he was in his car with the heater running. we had no jackets. He also had the guy who hit us handcuffed in the back seat.
I finally told him we were leaving, he gave me a ticket for $160.00 for failing to yield the right of way.When he gave me the ticket he said" I am taking it easy on you, it is only $160.00"/
I was told I could get the police report in 1odays if I gave them $10. I when to their office and paid the $10 but never got the report.Came home and put the case together and emailed, phoned and wrote to the FHP, no report this went on for 3 months. I finally contacted a judge in Orange county he flipped, They emailed the report withing half an hour. The guy who hit me was a suspended driver.
A principal is always worth fighting for, I fought it and won. I am sure that I got the ticket because I was from outside the states. I have several friends who have gotten BS tickets they all fight them and they all go away.
Right on , UHP is not worth a sh@t....!
Well your just an easy target and as a tourist a guarantee payment$$$
It is bizarre to actually hear concern such as Utah's concern over how to police their citizens. We all know what's happening all over the country that makes absolutely no sense.
It really is refreshing to hear some people care to do the right thing. Bravo.
I’m a retired LEO. States need to learn that they are only hurting themselves with a heavy handed approach to law enforcement of recreational activities in public areas. It absolutely does leave a bad taste in the mouth of tourists who are often unfairly targeted with dumb, obscure regulations that seemingly exist for no other reason than to harass tourists. Had such an experience in Yellowstone national park with some overzealous park rangers while just trying to enjoy some quiet time. I’ll never spend another dime there.
The dropped it after they posted a video that they would sue out of principle. Good Job
Glad Paul Cox gave this issue some visibility.
It was the DNR officer bouncing on his feet that made this all happen, watching him screamed "problem" but I didn't expect it would get as big as it did. Thanks Paul!
The thing to really note about all of this is the the only reason this was dismissed is because the accused turned out to be a CZcamsr with a large platform. If it been a little guy like most of us, we would’ve been screwed over…
Always good to see you post Kevin! Love what you're doing by keeping us informed. Peace and love from offroad Diaries!
You have a great channel! Thanks for stopping by!
Awesome job Kevin 👍🏼
I’m sure Paul Cox @fabrats is going to love watching this video!!!
Great! Thank you Kevin. I think this change will improve things. I would like to say, thank you for the videos and information. Regular recreational citizens don't hear about this type of information. Unless they are heavily involved, or care enough to oversee the bills, laws, etc. Thanks for the info. Keep the law updates and information coming! And any legislator information on Utah trail, road closures, bills, etc. would be nice to watch and be informed about.
I have heard that these rangers have been issuing tickets for people swimming without a life jacket. How do you swim with one. That has to be the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard. And the person was standing in 3’ of water.
Invasive species movement is a serious challenge and problem across ALL of USA, but realistic approaches must be considered. For ten years I have worked in New York to identify, survey and eradicate such invasive species with the cooperation of federal, state, county and clubs involvement. Big job and logistical challenges!
Thanks for the update, Kevin! Great work! 👍
I wonder how many of the cases that were tossed involved DNR officer Micah Evans? 🤔
Hard truth time. Govt is not a jobs program. It is not my responsibility as a taxpayer to pay retirements if the position is not necessary. It is a shame that people turned on you for seeking justice 40 years overdue. We should all want a slim, efficient, fair and just govt. Great video tho! Thanks for sharing.
Exactly what I thought. I don't care if "good guys" are going to lose their retirement. They certainly wouldn't care if the citizen lost his. They certainly didn't care that Paul Cox was being railroaded and incurred significant legal costs. How many other hundreds or thousands of people either incurred the legal costs or just got convicted because they couldn't afford the legal cost. Government never cares about the lives THEY ruin but always cry about the teachers, cops and firefighters when they want more money to squander no nonsense.
I’m with you. That’s the only reason I’m Republican is for a lean government. Should establish order and then get the heck out of the way.
The only thing alive on that boat was the mouse.
and the van halen tape.😂
and Hunter! (Paul's cameraman)
Thanks for the truth , fire him ,,they are above the law!
It's sad that someone has to publicly shame people in power to get them to do what is right
I personally emailed everyone from the Governor down to the Rangers a link to Paul's video. About 12 officials in total.
Gov. Spencer J. Cox knows the value of tourism.
More funding to trail planning and maintenance is needed, not closures!
Great planning is all inclusive to every aspect of adventure, rock crawling, hiking, biking, ev'ing, rc operators, and more. Properly planned out these Adventurer's can all play side by side reveling in each others abilities while bringing revenue to the city.
Thanks for the update and well done Kevin.
In many countries there is a provision in law about malicious prosecution - it is a criminal offence.
I don't know about the law in the US and given the way that public officials are exempt from the law, I'd guess that there is no such thing there.
Most states have this law. Some have different names. Almost never enforced.
In the fab rats case the key issue is that the boat had to have been in the water within the previous 30 days which was the point the ranger intentionally ignored that part of the statute when he charged them
I was happy to hear of the changes that came about the "Fab Rats"/Paul Cox unjustified charges levied against him, & unnecessary legal expenses, and Paul, as his family, going thru a very & unnecessary stressful time.
Thanks for keeping us informed. I agree with what you are doing.
I bet I can guess what Sheriff how will kick them out.
Well done Kevin and everyone involved! Thank you all for your efforts!!
The boat was on dry land for over a year lol
Elected accountable sheriffs versus career DNR unaccountable police.
Great job. Thank you 😊
At Lake Powell, you have DNR and Federal Park Rangers with boats on the Lake patrolling. No one has been able to tell me
what the difference in jurisdiction is.
I’m a fellow lake Powell boater and I’ve been asking the same question. Utah has statewide jurisdiction for law enforcement. Federal Law Enforcement has jurisdiction only on public lands but POST certified Utah Law Officers have jurisdiction everywhere. Even on public lands.
try making a list of all entities and sub-entities of the state government. then do a spread sheet.
in the federal government....it's amazing how many entities AND sub-entities have their own swat teams armed with all the full-auto weapons they can carry.
Thanks for the update Kevin. Hope people will watch but I had an advertisement approx ever 1.5 minutes trying to watch this video.
Yes the ads suck
I wish I could control that. I hate ads myself.
Brave browser
Thanks for posting this video
Should be a cleaning station for all water vehicles.
I live in Wash St., and they are free.
Where are those? I never see anyone washing thier boats except at home. I have been all over the west side with kayaks and I always wash them at home in my yard because I have never seen a "free boat wash station". Please inform. Swift, Yale, Merwin, upper and lower Cowlitz river, Columbia river, Coldwater, Mayfield, Riffe, Lewis river, Kalama river, Silver Lake. Not any beach, Long Beach, Copalis or any northern beach. I have yet to see ONE. What Washington State do you live in?
While the intentions of this presenter were well intentioned, as a person not living in or being from Utah; it was a pretty disjointed presentation to follow without some clarity. From what I could tell I'm glad the governor's office was able to enact legislation to further clarify the roles of the departments and agencies to reduce overlap and provide a more definitive role of responsibilities.
Very informative video! Thank you for your efforts.
As a life long utah hunter and fisher I can tell you there have been systemic issues with DNR law enforcement.
Too many CO’s have become unaccountable and citizens have been treated so poorly for too long.
At least sheriffs are accountable to the citizens.
So looking forward to needed changes!!!
I hope the officer who contacted the Cox's lost his job of intimidation
Same situation in Maine. Warden Service is part of Inland Fisheries & Wildlife but are really LEO. There is also Marine Resources (salt water) and Bureau of Parks & Lands Rangers and zoning enforcement for the unorganized towns. All should be combined with the State Police in one agency, separating law enforcement from resource management. However, there is a lot of turf protection and 'tradition'' so don't expect it to ever happen.
That's a reasonable outcome for reform. Here in Indiana DNR and state police are the same thing power wise. Except for DNR are over recreation and state police are over public safety. Same power different division and separate control. Sounds like Utah is on the road to making the state more welcome to visiting people and better check and balance for the future.
Two words: Stanford experiment.
Well Paul. You sure rocked the boat with that recovery. Amazing what happens when some one cries BULLSHIT!
Thanks for fighting the fight that not everyone agreed upon. The county sheriff always has the last say as he was elected and not hired. Has there been any update to the lawsuits filed against the trail closures in the Moab area?
Governor Cox has filed about 100 lawsuits on those. So the fight is ongoing. We anticipate widespread closures and long court battles. But the governor and legislature has given the team an open checkbook to protect our access.
“Recreation rangers”!!😂🤣
Thanks for clearing this up, I was confused about what happen. And what happen to the blabber mouth tyrant that started this nonsense?
If the laws do not conform to the Constitution they are null and void!
DNR blocked the main road/trail through Monte Cristo to check snowmobile regjstrations and licenses this past winter. Seemed like a bit of a trap setup to me. When it comes to DUI checkpoints, they have to publicly announce those in advance. You would think something similar would apply to stops for registration checks.
The Fabrats Outdoor Recreation Bill of 2024.
Way to push back Paul Cox.
I only have my information from FabRats, however, I thought there was sufficient documentation the boat had been out of the water for way long enough.
This was a major change. I can't wait for my next off-roading trip to Utah, from WV.
Those tyrants NEED to be out of work.
I watch Fab Rats and I love them. But I am glad this happened to them because it looks like it was the trip wire that set these things in motion and got some things cleaned up in Utah. Stay strong and keep up the good work.
Great Explaining everything. Great Video Brother.
Fab Rat's and the Coxs Family are Great People ❤🙏
I would like to see those citizens that payed the fine rather than fight with a lawyer get their money back due to faults in the law. It's justice.
its the same with traffic stops 9 out of 10 people just pay the fine instead of going to court and fighting it..And your right even if your in violation or said so..get legal help and fight it..at best they may reduce your fine or just drop it..Peace..
I think the day is coming where access to public lands and water is going to be heavily restricted for the protection against invasive species whether it exists or not. Some national parks in Canada have already restricted lake access to where nothing is allowed on the water except their own tour boats. Its probably a matter of time before these restrictions are implemented on more lakes.
Just another person given a uniform and a small amount of power and all common sense regarding those laws they enforce disappear and we end up with the Fab Rat situation. The D.W.R. officer knew damn well what he was doing by confronting the Fab Rats. Notoriety. He thought the letter of the law over-rode charity and a good act from caring people.
Making a decision based on an employees retirement is a bad decision.
So no one got fired, got it.
Utah is by no means the only state that has this same issue.
Our whole nation is this way, as the man said for forty years Utah has been doing this to us citizens. It took Paul Cox to bring it to light through his CZcams channel, thank the heavens for Paul Cox and CZcams or we wouldn't know anything about anything.
This is why our elected politicians want to try to dissolve our 1st and 2nd Amendments, once they have these 2 amendments out of the way the rest of our Constitution will disappear.
Where do you think all of the other states got the same idea?
From our federal government that's where, just think about how many federal agencies control us citizens daily for whatever we do, we can't breathe without breaking some law that was made for nothing than to control our every move. And then we have state, county, and city laws and policies we must identify and follow.
Citizens must become Philadelphia Lawyer's to find and obey all of the laws that are forced upon us by our elected government officials, for our own good.
Just think about it. We have more and more laws created every year to control us and our movements, some laws are legitimate and are needed no doubt, but we citizens have one county sheriff on our side, or are they on our side? maybe not.
If the county sheriffs were really on our side from the beginning, we wouldn't be having this problem today. right?
The moral is: Trust No One and Question Everything. Especially politicians!
We all done this to ourselves by becoming far too trusting, lazy, ignorant, gullible and brainwashed with division, fear, chaos, and confusion by our elected politicians to keep electing and reelecting the same insanity. Hear that, smell that, feel that? a change is needed and is on its way.
But that's just my opinion I could be wrong.
Thanks for auditing these demons.
I know very little about this issue, but I get the impression that the officers got very cozy with the idea that they could cite and fine anyone on sketchy issues and dangle an opportunity to pay a fine. They did this full well knowing 98 % of the victim’s would rather pay a fine than get neck deep into the quagmire to fight it. Why did the officers do this? My guess is the incentive of filling their own coffers . Or maybe their just a bit power mad.. Just like the small town speed traps we hear about. You know, where the sheriff, judge, tow truck company owner is the same person.
It’s great that fab rats double downed on their bluff. Less government is the way to go. Although this resulted in an additional law, it did set in motion the process needed to control these runaway regulators..
This whole thing just makes the case for less, smaller government.
Have you read the new road and area closures at Lake Powell put out by the superintendent of Glen Canyon National Park!
Yes we have been following that.
its not appropriate to forgo making necessary changes because it might take way retirement compensation. if it was illegitimate form the start it makes no sense to keep legitimizing it.
Loss of retirement benefits that the government agreed to provide employees is a huge issue to me. That said you would think there would be some mechanism to allow the state to meet it's obligations regarding retirement while still being able to re-org itself.
Great video. I think that the environmental authorities in Utah have had their focus on harassing citizens, rather than the actual, authentic environment catastrophe that is occurring in the state. Utah and Idaho are the two largest consumers of water per capita in the United States, yet as we all know these states are desert or near desert. This heavy water consumption is largely for cattle feed, and it's doing no good for people. Citizens, including the LDS church, have been doing a better job at conserving water. But it isn't enough to stop the toxic arsenic clouds rising above the Great Salt Lake from water overuse. 100% of the focus of the environmental authorities needs to be on this issue. Not on some CZcamsr towing a salvaged boat with long-dead quagga mussels. The farmers need to chill out on their water consumption, or they will destroy the holy lake forever, and the people of Utah will die from toxic dust clouds. Priorities, people!
Those people that have dedicated their lives to working for the state need to feel the exact same pain the rest of us in the civilian world feel, i.e. you can be fired at any time or funding can be terminated for your job at any time. Because they are insulated from this is the reason why they become arrogant in how they treat the public and create useless sub-organizations to hire their friends and relatives. Bottom line the Sheriff is the elected law enforcement of the county and all law enforcement needs to be administered by the Sheriff period. This kind of heavy handedness by non-elected officials and the co-towing by the Sheriff to these non-elected officials is the exact reason I no longer use BLM land, state, or federal land here in Wyoming, I don't have any more patience left for this BS. Hats off to your accomplishments Ride Utah, but needs to go further IMO.
Not making changes just to protect someone's pension is criminal. When changes need to be made then suck it up princess and get it done. This is why government keeps getting bigger.
We agree. But the state would have lost in court. Theres a lot to be said for upholding our obligations.
We've hired waaaay too many state & federal agents if they have time for this.
I hope that the public doesn't alow these government entities to divide them because that is what they are doing.
Other states already have that model, Utah was behind the times; sounds like about 40 years behind based on your audits. I don't agree that the sheriff should be contacted befor any enforcement actions, it should have limitations of what requires sheriff involvement.
Local sheriff and local police are in place to protect local citizens from over reach of corrupt government
Tell whole story, they pulled a boat out that has been out of water longer then one year, video proof was shown. These muscles die after 30 days out of water. Coxes also cleaned them off boat. The officer came by their shop and admitted that what they did was ok, again video recorded. This officer used harassment in other events a few times.
How does this tie in with the Moab trail closures!
That’s another video! We will have an update coming soon!
well done
In Florida a wildlife officer does'nt need a search warrent to search your home for criminal activity none pertaining to wild life preservation . So if a wild life officer thinks your coffee por is stolen he can kick your door in and search your home .
Could you point the "wildlife officer" clause in the constitution?? I don't remember seeing it..
No matter where you live, every town, township, county etc. that has a police force always has their Barney Fife to muck things up.
It’s refreshing to at least take some of the abusive power away from a deputy dawg rogue officer that can’t differentiate from the spirit of the law vs the letter of the law.
The DNR state division needs to be totally shut down and closed permanently.
#GOVERNMENTOVERREACH
A lot of government agency are just a massive Job Corps. Reports, comms, little projects they spent money on like drunk sailors; mostly all busy work. Law enforcement is a large part of this waste. Their biggest chore is to collect their wages and benefits in this workfare scheme. A private business would have this rat's nest of waste squared away the next day.
Want-a-be cops out of control. We had similar issues with the game wardens here in Ohio.
Our government has too much control
Mussels. Not muscles.
It's good to learn that Paul Cox's situation led to the discovery and elimination of inefficiency in the state's affairs. What the DNR officer was trying to do in Paul's case seems appropriate but misguided, since the officer wasn't properly familiar with quagga mussels. and his agency's notion of courtroom evidence was inadequate. My recollection of the case is that Paul dragged home a small boat hull thoroughly dried out by being long ashore and carrying dead mussels that the DNR agent mistakenly considered viable.
The boat was dry and sun baked for over one year, the law states some thing about 30 days or less, it must be cleaned/inspected. So the officer was a clown.
Perfect example of the "Peter's Principal!" Far too much money was wasted by Paul Cox & the state of Utah!
How did Paul Cox waste money? He didn't do anything wrong?
@@richardjensen6753 You missed my point, I agree he did not violate any regulations, however, he had to retain council and waste his time fighting the fraudulent charge. Utah spent taxpayer's dollars to charge him unnecessarily! Both of which were time and money wasted because of a criminal official.
@@papalilburn Ok I get how you're looking at it now! Thanks!
There are reasons I live in Colorado and not Utah. It has been well known that they're lookin' to gitchya at any and every opportunity whether you are rafting, cycling, jeeping, or fishing... and the Mormons oh my they are a strange group indeed.
Mormons strange?Never!Just ask my wives.
@@Z4Zander, I'm not legal as soon as I wake up! Coffee, a puff, maybe a beer with breakfast. Or not, but for sure that's gotta be a deal breaker and I haven't even left the kitchen! They'd string me up in less than a week for sure.
@@nytrocircus Tbh.I'm not a Mormon,never was ,never will be.Also was married once and nearly a second time.but never again.To quote some half remembered movie,"Don't drink ,don't smoke,don't kiss no wild wimen.Just kiss my horse."Now coffee! That's a whole different ball game.p.s.I don't really have a horse.🏴☠
Note to self: DO NOT go to Utah to recreate. Summer plans will be officially changing. And I thought Arizona was bad.
Disband the new department of recreation. We don’t need them at all.
Other states found out the hard way that over regulation, over policing and fining tourists is a stupid idea. Once it gets a bad name for burocratic thievery it can take decades to recover if ever. Bureaucrats will do anything to try to justify their jobs even if it means stealing from the public. Sand hollow is just one of many areas in more than one state with dunes and rocks. The outdoor folks do a fantastic job of policing the areas to a large extent. Some law enforcement is necessary, but not at the level that it rose to with fab rats. There are a billion muscles in the ohio river. They aren't about to go extinct anytime soon lol. Especially if they are already dead haha. Great job on pushing for reform at the state level. Always start at the top
Ok, so there were problems with predatory prosecutions over Quagga mussels, are they going to go back and review those cases? What about the officer that went after FabRats? Has he been investigated?
Promoted
sounds like a manager directed his rangers to CREAT REVANU by issuing citations - fins .
What happened to the officer who started all the trouble ?, he should have been replaced by a person with more human common sense.
Ride Utah ? Here is my complaint to pass along. Noise. I am a hiker, camper, canoeist. Unmuffled POS all day long and often all night long,, No excuse. There is zero reason why these vehicles need to make noise. Put a muffler on them. I walked there,, I paddled there,, and yes,, I am always envious that someone had breakfast in Moab and is now where it took me two weeks to get to. That's on me. But listening to the roar or chainsaw like racket 20 hours a day and from 10 miles away. Nope. Don't like it one bit. Should not be allowed. And there is no reason why they cannot where a muffler.
WE THE PEOPLE ARE WATCHING
All the petty dictators want power, more power.
Money maker, pay or Guilty till proven innocent,
Not to change the topic But why is it to book a camping spot in UTAH you half to call California to book? We have been camp hosts for 6 years but not any longer. And people have asked over and over why UTAH can not take care of there own state. Every thing California touches goes down the tube un wiped. Maybe also that is the reason some of the camp grounds are going down the same tube un wiped. I understand this may be a little left field but wish someone could look into it. California has way to much say in the Country and can't take care of there own state. There is some kind of warning on every thing it may be bad according to California.
quagga mussels