as a st albans resident i always liked the idea of the tube extending to us, but realistically it’d be no quicker than thameslink and much less convenient. would be cool to be on the map though!
Interesting to look at plans for tube extensions to other towns on the outskirts of London as well. When Harlow New Town was originally planned in the 1950s there was talk of an extension of the Central Line to Harlow, presumably from Epping, just 7 miles distant. But nothing ever came of this. There is presently discussion of this once again, Harlow Council backing a tube extension to help with regeneration plans for the town.
Imagine a world where Luton, Watford and Reading are all on the Tube map. It would surely not be long before someone got Brighton and Chelmsford in on the act too.
You're obviously too young to remember the Campari ads in the 1970s and 80s that really made Luton famous - Lorraine Chase is asked by a suave sophisticated gentleman "Were you wafted here from paradise", to which she replies in her best cockney accent 'Naaaoo, Lu"on Airpor" There was even a song by CATS UK called Luton airport.
My earliest railway memories are of Thameslink in the early 90s, as dad would take me into London while we were in Luton visiting relatives. It's an odd station, though I'm glad they've actually put functioning clock dials up after so long with a presumably defunct clock dial on each side.
My grandmother used to come over from Germany and go gallivanting off sightseeing somewhere in her 70s and even into her 80s,and she found Thameslink very useful.
On the opposite side of the road at Luton Station there was (is? Bute Street Station). Mr Pick may have reasoned a further rail connection was available towards Dunstable & out towards Oxon. On the same line In the opposite direction you could travel to Welwyn Garden City, then a promising Garden City in its infancy, & further on to the county town Hertford & yet further eastwards connecting with The Great Central. Many places were then served by rail. Pushing on to Luton back then was not so illogical.
Bute Street Station was closed in 1965 along with the rest of that line due to Beeching cuts. The main station there is what used to be called Midland Road
@@bobsteryt Can't help thinking that line, & many others, could be so useful today. Use to 'spot' from the footbridge over the Midland line at the station that provided viewing of arrivals at Bute Street Station too. Did'nt fully understand BR' Regions back then but was thrilled seeing LMS traffic as l lived nearer the LNER.
Rivalry between the two train companies, the Great Northern (Bute street) and the Midland (Midland road), consisted mainly of pretending the other didn't exist. Cooperation may have been a better strategy. The only time the two lines were joined was post Beeching when Blue Circle Cement had their northern connection severed and traffic was routed south by way of some sidings installed at Luton. When Blue Circle closed and Vauxhall declined the freight traffic which had been the main reason to keep that section open evaporated and it was eventually turned into a busway. Even in its heyday most of the Great Northens revenue was freight based and the mostly single track reflected this. Upgrading this to double track with all the points involved would have been a signalling nightmare. Even after nationalisation I don't think this was ever seriously considered and the line continued to decline even before Beechings axe.
@@peterallam6494 I believe the route Bute Street took to Dunstable is now used as a bus way so is handy but nothing like it could be. Luton used to have a small tram network as well but the local council sold it off to bus companies in the 30s or 40s.
I always remember Luton because in about 1986 when I was 6 years old my family was on a flight from Tenerife to Luton Airport and the pilot had to abort the landing 3 times because of fog, and land at Gatwick instead. We then had to take a bus from Gatwick to Luton. One of the scariest things I've ever experienced. (The aborted landings, not the bus ride).
And now you can make that same journey on - ahem - Thameslink. A railway that runs underground through the middle of London, but is not an Underground railway, good grief. As I found when I narrowly missed my plane at Luton and caught a later one at Gatwick, saving Christmas!
Some what later, when the new N-S large-diameter main-line tunnel was considered (to give the northern companies access to the West End at Charing X), there was also a suggestion that the line between Mill Hill East and Edgware might get a junction with the Midland main line at Mill Hill - an alternative Underground route to Luton. Of course, Herr Hitler got a vote on that one!
Great video, as always. I'd be interested in hearing more about the first class & pullman carriages on the underground. What lines/railways did they run on, & what did you get for a few extra shillings? Were they very similar to other contemporary first class services available on what we'd refer to as 'mainline' trains today?
Often wondered why there was no link at Hendon, Mill Hill or Elstree Thameslink to the Northern Line, probably easiest by following through on the Northern Heights proposal.
I spent an hour in luton and was advised to move my car if I didn't want it stolen, had a glass bottle thrown at me and was asked 3 times if I wanted to buy stolen goods by some teenagers wandering the high street with duffel bags.
If only the Tube had made it, but then Thameslink works well. The one thing which made me smile was hearing Luton with the 't'. Living there, I got used to Lu'n, and what a dump it was back then. 😊
From an American (or at least my) perspective, most current British and other European commuter and local trains (as opposed to long-distance trains) are more like "subways" in mostly being EMUs/DMUs, whereas most American commuter trains are locomotive-hauled (some lines of Metro-North and New Jersey Transit near NYC and Philadelphia's SEPTA are almost the only exceptions to this, and even they use locomotives on some lines).
How do the locomotive hauled commuter trains in the US change direction at the end of the route? Can they be driven from the other end, with the loco pushing, or is it uncoupled from one end and recoupled to the other?
@@andyjay729 We've used "push-pull" formations like that on medium to long distance routes in the UK, with a special vehicle called a DVT (driving van trailer) at one end and either a diesel (classes 37, 47 and 67 have been used, to my knowledge) or electric (class 73 or 91 and probably others too) locomotive in fixed formation at the other. Pretty much all commuter services are operated by multiple units these days and there's a general trend away from using locomotives to haul passenger trains now that the HSTs (which had a class 43 locomotive, for many years known as a "power car", at each end) have been phased out.
Reading the comments is always a laugh, everyone has such detailed knowledge of these particular areas and surroundings. I just know they're all somewhere in England! Subscriber from Australia 😉
I grew up in Harpenden (1970's) near where the current main line branched off to the Hemelite cement works at Hemel Hempstead. . My first job was in Luton - I took the train. The factory backed onto the old Luton-Dunstable branch line. In 1982 I moved within Harpenden to live next to the defunct Luton-Welwyn line (via Harpenden East). Railways - you can't get away from them! But this was a fascinating diversion from the normal "Tales from the Tube". Thank you.
Hearing about this, I find myself imagining a 'maximum Underground' alternate history, where the UERL becomes the British Underground, and can take you from Land's End to John o' Groats.
Theres probably a case (if there's luggage space) for all of London's airports to be served by "tube" lines. Then again, you'd have to ask, where do people arriving at London's airports actually go one they had "arrived". Im guessing for the majority, it probably isnt London. London just happens to be the hub for rail terminii.
It has some very interesting history but I'll only bore you with one snippet. From 1848 to 1914 horse racing on and around the common was very popular. Unfortunately it developed a bad reputation in some quarters who described some of its patrons a "the riff-raff of humanity". With the onset of war other priorities loomed and they had the perfect excuse to close it. down.
Space 1999! Wow that takes me back to my wasted childhood! 😜 Space 1999 and UFO had arguably the best theme songs and opening titles ever. “Luton” was one of the weaker episodes admittedly. Interesting premise but… Here in Canada they ran the show every Saturday for years, and in English and in French. It filled the void in science fiction before Star Wars’ arrival, Star Trek’s return, and Red Dwarf’s invention. And we all ❤️ Maya!
Didn't expect to see my neck of the woods pop on this channel! An interesting idea but I think the Thameslink/East Mids trains have ended up covering it pretty well.
I recall London Underground maps from the 90s which showed the bit of Thameslink from Kentish Town down to E&C and London Bridge, presumably to show a rail link between Blackfriars and Farringdon that didn't involve going all the way out to Aldgate. It showed it as a BR line of course, the same as the North London line. That was subsequently deleted though.
The was an episode called "The Rules of Luton " Jago put a screen cap up at 0:09 of the title card. I heard it was called that because the American producer of the show Fred Freiberger saw Luton on a road sign, Space 1999 being made at Pinewood at the time and liked the name.
Well yes the Northern Line could of extended to Luton. But now it’s served by Thameslink and is on the Midland Main Line. And other tube lines could of extend outside of London such as the Central Line that would of extended from Epping to Harlow. The District Line might of extended to Southend-on-Sea and Windsor (and Eton). And the Victoria Line could of been extended from Brixton to Croydon and also extended to Gatwick Airport and Brighton.
What is the history of Thameslink? I've taken the train from Bedford to Brighton a fair few times (having relatives in both places). Who decided to link those lines up and make them one?
They pull that London Luton trick all over the town. As someone who knows the place well it's about time the powers that be focused on ways to improve things rather than pretending it's part of London.
I didnt know the Metropolitan had Pullman coaches, how fascinating. My first experience of a Pullman, if I recall correctly, was travelling with my father on the Brighton Belle. I believe that was a complete Pullman train, all very posh.
If you need me I'm thinking about a channel relevant concept that would require a script with the frequent use of the words 'Peter', 'Piper' and 'Pepper'
Fascinating, never heard about that scheme before. I can't think of anything worse than being stuck in the cramped tube stock all the way out to Luton! Thameslink, the Metropolitan Line/Railway and indeed the District Line/Railway have full sized trains, that makes a massive difference.
Given the complaints from customers...or is it passengers.. about the new Thameslink trains seating perhaps it was fortuitous that the Northern Line wasn't extended to Luton .
I am consistently amazed by the quality, research and frequency of your tales from the tube and architectural offerings. Do you really still have a day job??
I agree with conclusions. Moreover, I think trying to provide for all the transportation needs with a single system will probably prove problematic, the standard structure currently in fashion seems to be trams/light rail for local, metro/something similar for urban and crossrail/rer/s-bahn/diameters/whatever for regional trips, many cities are working with this 3 stage solution
We could've had this for each of the mainlines: District line to Ealing Broadway, then down the Great Western to Reading. This I believe was tried at one point. Central line West Ruislip, then down the New North. Serious proposal. Metropolitan line to Rickmansworth, then down the Great Central to Aylesbury, Verney Junction, Brackley and Banbury. Bakerloo line to Queen's Park, then down the West Coast to Watford. Actually happened. Northern line to Hendon Central, Mill Hill Broadway, then down the Midland to Luton. This video. Piccadilly line to Bounds Green, New Southgate, then down the East Coast to Welwyn. Metropolitan line to Liverpool Street, then down the Lea Valley to Enfield and Hertford. Central line to Stratford, then down the Great Eastern to Shenfield. District line to Bow, then down the Tilbury to Upminster. Bakerloo line to Bricklayer's Arms, then down the Southeastern to Orpington. East London line to New Cross Gate, then down the Brighton to Coulsdon. We sort of got this with the Overground. District line to Victoria, then down the Brighton to Coulsdon; Wimbledon, then down the Southwestern to Hampton Court; & Richmond, then down the Windsor to Windsor.
LeviNZ approves this video. Our daughter, living in Hitchin until repatriating to this town 16 months ago, was a Thames customer but very infrequently.
Interesting video again Jago. It was a great shame the underground was not extended to Edgware via Mill East and Alexandra Palace millions of pounds wasted. Also Muswell Hill and Hornsey areas still suffer from crowded roads so buses cannot get commuters to Highgate and Finsbury Park tubes easily.
It’s a good idea, but maybe not as a part of the Underground. It sounds a lot more like a heavy rail commuter line, something which a separate company would be better suited to running (like Thameslink perhaps)
Luton isn't very famous for this but in the 1970s their biggest employer was Vauxhall & Bedford. Almost everyone seemed to know somebody who worked there.
I just flew once (or twice?) to Luton and getting out of there was quite a nightmare. Never again! I wish that there was a tube line! By the way, 2 guys on 5:30 or so notice that you are recording and one makes a weird gesture (hope it's not a rude one LOL!)
The planet Luton had intelligent tree life that tried to kill animal life, because they were paranoiac racists. It was a daft idea, but actually quite scary for little kids. 😊 The thing I remember about Luton is it's bus station, because you have to go there to get to Whipsnade Zoo, unless you have a car.
Pullmans on the Metropolitan? As a North American, Pullman conjurers up sleeping accommodations, but in Olde Blimey it probably means something different. Yes, yes, an episode about Pullmans on the Met.👍👍 Also: Here are three proposals. Take your Pick.
In the UK Pullman cars were high class day passenger saloons very often with catering to match. The Met had two such cars, Mayflower and Galatea. They were withdrawn at the outbreak of WW2 in 1939.
@@delurkor IIRC they were out into storage for the duration. I have a sneaking recollection (from reading several decades ago) that they suffered war damage and were scrapped. I'm sure someone will have posted details somewhere on the web.
What's the origin of the sign "If You Can Dream It, You Must Do It"? A copywriter for General Electric supposedly came up with the line, "If you can dream it, you can do it." in 1981. It was rewritten as, "If we can dream it, we can do it" by Imagineer Tom Fitzgerald, and used as a tag line in Horizons, the attraction in Epcot at Disney World. (It was not a Walt Disney quote. And Horizons was sponsored by General Electric...) Does the "Must do it" quote originate from the Disney quote?
To get from Hendon Central to the Midland, one would need a tunnel (as one has betwixt Hendon and Colindale), or, going back a century, at the very least a viaduct over the Brent River valley (as one has today from Woodstock/Brent/Brent Cross station) to reach the Midland, say in the area of the long gone Welsh Harp station (a little south of West Hendon station). As such, to say that no major engineering work would be needed is incorrect.
I've often thought that the Metropolitan could, easily, at the Widened Lines and/or at Finchley Road/West Hampstead, take over the Midland to St.Albans with an additional station at Edgware Broadfields (really surprised why there isn't one there), and the long mooted re-opening of Napsbury for London Colney. Thameslink could then race from St.Albans to West Hampstead non-stop, which they often do anyway.
Pick picked and prepared a pertinent proposal of piquant proportions,but the politicians provaricated and the plan was poleaxed by those pesky people who preferred another path.
I wonder if places like Luton and Harpenden did get their tube extension, granted that those areas became more metropolitan as a result, would those areas be included in tfl's travel zones like Watford and Chesham did?
If Putin is going to unleash a nuclear attack as he finds himself more and more in a corner, please let it be on Luton. I'm in a Dr Strangelove kinda mood at the moment.
"Were you truly wafted here from paradise?"
"No, Luton airport!"
Lorraine Chase.
@@johnm2012 👍👍👍
Also a comedy band from a local club used to announce there act as "Following our tour of L.A. (Luton Airport....."
and, of course, the even cheesier song - czcams.com/video/PCYhqYfs8Po/video.html
If the link works OK, it's Cats UK on T.O.T.P. from 1979.
as a st albans resident i always liked the idea of the tube extending to us, but realistically it’d be no quicker than thameslink and much less convenient. would be cool to be on the map though!
The Thameslink is my back-up/airport line and it's a godsend.
As you say though, it'd be cool to see it on the map
Interesting to look at plans for tube extensions to other towns on the outskirts of London as well. When Harlow New Town was originally planned in the 1950s there was talk of an extension of the Central Line to Harlow, presumably from Epping, just 7 miles distant. But nothing ever came of this. There is presently discussion of this once again, Harlow Council backing a tube extension to help with regeneration plans for the town.
I've heard of that idea being reconsidered
@@Keithbarber Up there with Slough asking for an extension of the Picc from T5. It'll never happen.
@@ttrjw Ssssssslooouugghhhhh....
The tube map now has it up to Radlett
Strange then that Ongar lost its station on the tube.
🎵Oh, baby, do you know what that's worth,
Ohh, Hendon is a place on Earth. 🎵
Hendon, I'm in Hendon, and my heart beats so that I can barely speak.....
Our Father, who art in Hendon
Harrow be thy name
Thy Kingston come,
Thy Wimbledon...etc, etc
I wish you included more maps in your videos for us who are not so familiar with the local geography.
Imagine a world where Luton, Watford and Reading are all on the Tube map. It would surely not be long before someone got Brighton and Chelmsford in on the act too.
Wasn’t the Ontario line proposed to go to Chelmsford long before the Underground took it over?
That world would be one if London could grow into the size of (not too far fetched) Moscow or Istanbul. Darn Nimbys and their green belt.
Watford already has an underground station.
Reading is now on the tube map, albeit as a far flung Elizabeth Line station.
watford is on the metropolitan line
You're obviously too young to remember the Campari ads in the 1970s and 80s that really made Luton famous - Lorraine Chase is asked by a suave sophisticated gentleman "Were you wafted here from paradise", to which she replies in her best cockney accent 'Naaaoo, Lu"on Airpor" There was even a song by CATS UK called Luton airport.
I love the idea of Leonard Rossiter as a "suave sophisticated gentleman"
The District Line made it to Southend so it was not that far fetched.
And to Windsor via Slough
It may be a better measure of the viability of the service to ask how long the District Line stayed at Southend or Windsor.
Please, do tell that whole other story about Pullmans on the Underground!
My earliest railway memories are of Thameslink in the early 90s, as dad would take me into London while we were in Luton visiting relatives. It's an odd station, though I'm glad they've actually put functioning clock dials up after so long with a presumably defunct clock dial on each side.
My grandmother used to come over from Germany and go gallivanting off sightseeing somewhere in her 70s and even into her 80s,and she found Thameslink very useful.
On the opposite side of the road at Luton Station there was (is? Bute Street Station). Mr Pick may have reasoned a further rail connection was available towards Dunstable & out towards Oxon. On the same line In the opposite direction you could travel to Welwyn Garden City, then a promising Garden City in its infancy, & further on to the county town Hertford & yet further eastwards connecting with The Great Central. Many places were then served by rail. Pushing on to Luton back then was not so illogical.
Bute Street Station was closed in 1965 along with the rest of that line due to Beeching cuts. The main station there is what used to be called Midland Road
@@bobsteryt Can't help thinking that line, & many others, could be so useful today. Use to 'spot' from the footbridge over the Midland line at the station that provided viewing of arrivals at Bute Street Station too. Did'nt fully understand BR' Regions back then but was thrilled seeing LMS traffic as l lived nearer the LNER.
Rivalry between the two train companies, the Great Northern (Bute street) and the Midland (Midland road), consisted mainly of pretending the other didn't exist. Cooperation may have been a better strategy. The only time the two lines were joined was post Beeching when Blue Circle Cement had their northern connection severed and traffic was routed south by way of some sidings installed at Luton. When Blue Circle closed and Vauxhall declined the freight traffic which had been the main reason to keep that section open evaporated and it was eventually turned into a busway. Even in its heyday most of the Great Northens revenue was freight based and the mostly single track reflected this. Upgrading this to double track with all the points involved would have been a signalling nightmare. Even after nationalisation I don't think this was ever seriously considered and the line continued to decline even before Beechings axe.
@@peterallam6494 I believe the route Bute Street took to Dunstable is now used as a bus way so is handy but nothing like it could be.
Luton used to have a small tram network as well but the local council sold it off to bus companies in the 30s or 40s.
@@bomb-de-dyl I'd 99.9% forgotten about the trams.
The Bedford to St Pancras BR line was always known by locals as the Bedpan Line.
The place name Luton means 'settlement by the River Lee', which is also the derivation of Leyton, which is on the Tube, though not the Northern Line.
Didn't know that, thanks
I always remember Luton because in about 1986 when I was 6 years old my family was on a flight from Tenerife to Luton Airport and the pilot had to abort the landing 3 times because of fog, and land at Gatwick instead. We then had to take a bus from Gatwick to Luton. One of the scariest things I've ever experienced. (The aborted landings, not the bus ride).
And now you can make that same journey on - ahem - Thameslink. A railway that runs underground through the middle of London, but is not an Underground railway, good grief. As I found when I narrowly missed my plane at Luton and caught a later one at Gatwick, saving Christmas!
You’d be pretty annoyed if you lived somewhere mid way and the bus passed there on the way from one airport to another
The best way to see Luton is definitely by train.
Preferably at over 100mph and not stopping. 🙂🙂
Or fly over at night during a heavy rainstorm
@@Marvin-dg8vj you pray for a heavy rain storm. The only time the streets get cleaned
Luton is the sort of place you take people from elsewhere in the UK, who think that all of the Southeast is prosperous and privileged...
Great video as usual. And happy you didn't resort to any cheap digs about Luton! (although the comments section couldn't help itself)
Some what later, when the new N-S large-diameter main-line tunnel was considered (to give the northern companies access to the West End at Charing X), there was also a suggestion that the line between Mill Hill East and Edgware might get a junction with the Midland main line at Mill Hill - an alternative Underground route to Luton. Of course, Herr Hitler got a vote on that one!
Great video, as always. I'd be interested in hearing more about the first class & pullman carriages on the underground. What lines/railways did they run on, & what did you get for a few extra shillings? Were they very similar to other contemporary first class services available on what we'd refer to as 'mainline' trains today?
Often wondered why there was no link at Hendon, Mill Hill or Elstree Thameslink to the Northern Line, probably easiest by following through on the Northern Heights proposal.
Mill Hill The Vale would have been a great interchange with Mill Hill Broadway.
The extension to Elstree was stopped because of the green belt proposal I believe.
@@nathanw9770 Yes, plus lack of money!
Shame they never moth balled the route.
Luton , also famous for a certain Eric Morecombe ,who was ,I believe, involved in backing it's football team.
And who lived in Harpenden.
Morecambe
Still you'd end up at Luton, This can quickly evolve into further problems.
I spent an hour in luton and was advised to move my car if I didn't want it stolen, had a glass bottle thrown at me and was asked 3 times if I wanted to buy stolen goods by some teenagers wandering the high street with duffel bags.
@@charlielouise2428 Could've been worse. You might just as easily have visited on a rough day!
Hilarious, and so unpredictable.
XAXAXAXAXAXAXAXAXAX
@@charlielouise2428 and that was just the friendly ones
Always love watching your videos.
If only the Tube had made it, but then Thameslink works well. The one thing which made me smile was hearing Luton with the 't'. Living there, I got used to Lu'n, and what a dump it was back then. 😊
Back then? Hate to break it to you; if it was a dump then it’s now become a complete landfill.
As a Hendon resident I do wish this proposal went through.
It might make it a bit less noisy and fumey sitting amid that tangle of traffic-clogged carriageways situated at the foot of the M1.
Space 1999. Now there's a memory! Life (and space) was much simpler then.
From an American (or at least my) perspective, most current British and other European commuter and local trains (as opposed to long-distance trains) are more like "subways" in mostly being EMUs/DMUs, whereas most American commuter trains are locomotive-hauled (some lines of Metro-North and New Jersey Transit near NYC and Philadelphia's SEPTA are almost the only exceptions to this, and even they use locomotives on some lines).
How do the locomotive hauled commuter trains in the US change direction at the end of the route? Can they be driven from the other end, with the loco pushing, or is it uncoupled from one end and recoupled to the other?
Apart from a couple of overnight sleeper services, I don't think we have any loco-hauled passenger services now.
@@johnm2012 They push when moving in reverse. Of course that means they have to have a "cab car" at the end of the train then.
@@katbryce if I'm not mistaken Transport for Wales still uses some loco hauled services for the long distance Holyhead-Cardiff route
@@andyjay729 We've used "push-pull" formations like that on medium to long distance routes in the UK, with a special vehicle called a DVT (driving van trailer) at one end and either a diesel (classes 37, 47 and 67 have been used, to my knowledge) or electric (class 73 or 91 and probably others too) locomotive in fixed formation at the other. Pretty much all commuter services are operated by multiple units these days and there's a general trend away from using locomotives to haul passenger trains now that the HSTs (which had a class 43 locomotive, for many years known as a "power car", at each end) have been phased out.
Reading the comments is always a laugh, everyone has such detailed knowledge of these particular areas and surroundings. I just know they're all somewhere in England! Subscriber from Australia 😉
TBH, I’m not exactly over-familiar with Luton myself. I’ve been there twice, once to use the airport and once to film this video.
@@JagoHazzard When can we expect the "Jago Goes Down Under" tour specials?
@@AshLilburne well... as the pandamic goes...
I had never heard of Napsbury before, but now I keenly regret that where I live isn't called that.
Gotta love rootin' tootin' Luton
Great lesson.😊
my local town woop woop
I grew up in Harpenden (1970's) near where the current main line branched off to the Hemelite cement works at Hemel Hempstead. . My first job was in Luton - I took the train. The factory backed onto the old Luton-Dunstable branch line. In 1982 I moved within Harpenden to live next to the defunct Luton-Welwyn line (via Harpenden East). Railways - you can't get away from them! But this was a fascinating diversion from the normal "Tales from the Tube". Thank you.
There are some pretty decent books on these now defunct branch lines. Unfortunately most can only be found second hand and these can be pricey.
Ha ha....I believe the 1999 episode was called Lutton and from memory, it had something to do with flowers getting pissed off when picked?
The Rules of Luton - and yes the planet was named after the town.
Hearing about this, I find myself imagining a 'maximum Underground' alternate history, where the UERL becomes the British Underground, and can take you from Land's End to John o' Groats.
_Maximum Underground' the lesser known Steven King film
That's what TfL seems to be aiming for
Theres probably a case (if there's luggage space) for all of London's airports to be served by "tube" lines. Then again, you'd have to ask, where do people arriving at London's airports actually go one they had "arrived". Im guessing for the majority, it probably isnt London. London just happens to be the hub for rail terminii.
Including London Oxford? :)
There's already "The Oxford Tube" ;-)
They could extend Metropolitan Line to Oxford.!!!!
The best thing about Luton; that the M1 allows you to leave in a choice of directions; North or South.
Harpenden. The unassuming country village outside London that was the home of two certified geniuses.
Stanley Kubrick
and
Eric Morecambe.
It has some very interesting history but I'll only bore you with one snippet. From 1848 to 1914 horse racing on and around the common was
very popular. Unfortunately it developed a bad reputation in some quarters who described some of its patrons a "the riff-raff of humanity". With the onset of war other priorities loomed and they had
the perfect excuse to close it. down.
Thameslink just way ahead of its time
Space 1999! Wow that takes me back to my wasted childhood! 😜
Space 1999 and UFO had arguably the best theme songs and opening titles ever.
“Luton” was one of the weaker episodes admittedly. Interesting premise but…
Here in Canada they ran the show every Saturday for years, and in English and in French.
It filled the void in science fiction before Star Wars’ arrival, Star Trek’s return, and Red Dwarf’s invention.
And we all ❤️ Maya!
Didn't expect to see my neck of the woods pop on this channel!
An interesting idea but I think the Thameslink/East Mids trains have ended up covering it pretty well.
If only Charles Yerkes had felt a love for Luton things could have been so very different 😊
My favourite comment of the year. So far.
That looked like a nice sunny day.
I recall London Underground maps from the 90s which showed the bit of Thameslink from Kentish Town down to E&C and London Bridge, presumably to show a rail link between Blackfriars and Farringdon that didn't involve going all the way out to Aldgate. It showed it as a BR line of course, the same as the North London line. That was subsequently deleted though.
When was Luton in an episode of Space 1999? You have me intrigued.
The was an episode called "The Rules of Luton " Jago put a screen cap up at 0:09 of the title card. I heard it was called that because the American producer of the show Fred Freiberger saw Luton on a road sign, Space 1999 being made at Pinewood at the time and liked the name.
@@neilscotter5191 It's a good thing he didn't see Wednesbury on a sign and make an unreasonable plot justifying a public inquiry.
Well yes the Northern Line could of extended to Luton. But now it’s served by Thameslink and is on the Midland Main Line. And other tube lines could of extend outside of London such as the Central Line that would of extended from Epping to Harlow.
The District Line might of extended to Southend-on-Sea and Windsor (and Eton). And the Victoria Line could of been extended from Brixton to Croydon and also extended to Gatwick Airport and Brighton.
What is the history of Thameslink? I've taken the train from Bedford to Brighton a fair few times (having relatives in both places). Who decided to link those lines up and make them one?
It was opened in 1988 to reuse the snow hill tunnel through the city of London
As there's a "London" airport in Luton, don't they deserve a tube line?
Stanstead and Southend then? 😆
They pull that London Luton trick all over the town. As someone who knows the place well it's about time the powers that be focused on ways to improve things rather than pretending it's part of London.
Even Oxford Airport has tried the ‘London Oxford Airport’ trick.
See also "London Oxford" Airport, which is in Kidlington, and closer to Birmingham than London.
"London Ashford"
Closer to France than London.
First Class? Luton??
I’m living for all the Luton slander in this comment section 😩😂😂
If the service to Luton had been implemented, one would not so much haven been wafted from Luton Airport as burrowed.
I didnt know the Metropolitan had Pullman coaches, how fascinating. My first experience of a Pullman, if I recall correctly, was travelling with my father on the Brighton Belle. I believe that was a complete Pullman train, all very posh.
Luton would be like Heathrow if that actually happened. 😂
Happiness is... seeing the name of your town in a Jago Hazzard video title🙂
Don't seehow it would have worked though
And also famous for Vauxhall motors .
Yet another enthralling episode Mr Hazzard!
First class tube sounds like an interesting story. Go for it.
If you need me I'm thinking about a channel relevant concept that would require a script with the frequent use of the words 'Peter', 'Piper' and 'Pepper'
No different than the Underground going to Southend, or Brill and Verney Junction....
Fascinating, never heard about that scheme before. I can't think of anything worse than being stuck in the cramped tube stock all the way out to Luton! Thameslink, the Metropolitan Line/Railway and indeed the District Line/Railway have full sized trains, that makes a massive difference.
Does that mean you would rather be a sardine in a larger tin?
Brilliant video sir!
Great vid as always keep it up
Oh Jago - how can you possibly have forgotten the elegant, sophisticated Lorraine Chase of Campari fame?
czcams.com/video/8ydVbn0gMk4/video.html
Given the complaints from customers...or is it passengers.. about the new Thameslink trains seating perhaps it was fortuitous that the Northern Line wasn't extended to Luton .
I am consistently amazed by the quality, research and frequency of your tales from the tube and architectural offerings.
Do you really still have a day job??
I agree with conclusions. Moreover, I think trying to provide for all the transportation needs with a single system will probably prove problematic, the standard structure currently in fashion seems to be trams/light rail for local, metro/something similar for urban and crossrail/rer/s-bahn/diameters/whatever for regional trips, many cities are working with this 3 stage solution
Great video, as usual !
We could've had this for each of the mainlines:
District line to Ealing Broadway, then down the Great Western to Reading. This I believe was tried at one point.
Central line West Ruislip, then down the New North. Serious proposal.
Metropolitan line to Rickmansworth, then down the Great Central to Aylesbury, Verney Junction, Brackley and Banbury.
Bakerloo line to Queen's Park, then down the West Coast to Watford. Actually happened.
Northern line to Hendon Central, Mill Hill Broadway, then down the Midland to Luton. This video.
Piccadilly line to Bounds Green, New Southgate, then down the East Coast to Welwyn.
Metropolitan line to Liverpool Street, then down the Lea Valley to Enfield and Hertford.
Central line to Stratford, then down the Great Eastern to Shenfield.
District line to Bow, then down the Tilbury to Upminster.
Bakerloo line to Bricklayer's Arms, then down the Southeastern to Orpington.
East London line to New Cross Gate, then down the Brighton to Coulsdon. We sort of got this with the Overground.
District line to Victoria, then down the Brighton to Coulsdon; Wimbledon, then down the Southwestern to Hampton Court; & Richmond, then down the Windsor to Windsor.
LeviNZ approves this video.
Our daughter, living in Hitchin until repatriating to this town 16 months ago, was a Thames customer but very infrequently.
Interesting video again Jago. It was a great shame the underground was not extended to Edgware via Mill East and Alexandra Palace millions of pounds wasted. Also Muswell Hill and Hornsey areas still suffer from crowded roads so buses cannot get commuters to Highgate and Finsbury Park tubes easily.
Yah, a store of the only railway station in England that I've been too :)
Ooooo-eeee-ooooo, Luton Airport!
Another fascinating video, Jago!
Consistently superb and informative videos
Hadn't thought of that before, but I suppose Thameslink basically is ‘Greater Tube’
It’s a good idea, but maybe not as a part of the Underground. It sounds a lot more like a heavy rail commuter line, something which a separate company would be better suited to running (like Thameslink perhaps)
Luton isn't very famous for this but in the 1970s their biggest employer was Vauxhall & Bedford. Almost everyone seemed to know somebody who worked there.
Still Luton did get a London Transport Green Line coach service, possibly route 717 or 727. Now private, but still running.
And it was at the northern edge of the London Country Bus network, served in part from a garage in Luton itself.
I just flew once (or twice?) to Luton and getting out of there was quite a nightmare. Never again! I wish that there was a tube line!
By the way, 2 guys on 5:30 or so notice that you are recording and one makes a weird gesture (hope it's not a rude one LOL!)
He was simply showin us what he was going to be doing to his daddy later when he got home 🤣
The planet Luton had intelligent tree life that tried to kill animal life, because they were paranoiac racists. It was a daft idea, but actually quite scary for little kids. 😊
The thing I remember about Luton is it's bus station, because you have to go there to get to Whipsnade Zoo, unless you have a car.
In my lifetime it's had four ....... probably the best known was the guildford street station which for much of it's existence had a cafeteria.
Great video Jago
Pullmans on the Metropolitan? As a North American, Pullman conjurers up sleeping accommodations, but in Olde Blimey it probably means something different. Yes, yes, an episode about Pullmans on the Met.👍👍
Also: Here are three proposals. Take your Pick.
In the UK Pullman cars were high class day passenger saloons very often with catering to match. The Met had two such cars, Mayflower and Galatea. They were withdrawn at the outbreak of WW2 in 1939.
@@RogersRamblings Thank you. wee they preserved or scrapped.
You mean Old Blighty I would suggest... Blimey is a mild swear word.
They were preserved think the are now on the Norfolk Coast line
@@delurkor IIRC they were out into storage for the duration. I have a sneaking recollection (from reading several decades ago) that they suffered war damage and were scrapped. I'm sure someone will have posted details somewhere on the web.
Really interesting! I think you need maps when you’re listing through destinations.
Glad you got Space 1999 out of the way early ;-)
What's the origin of the sign "If You Can Dream It, You Must Do It"?
A copywriter for General Electric supposedly came up with the line, "If you can dream it, you can do it." in 1981. It was rewritten as, "If we can dream it, we can do it" by Imagineer Tom Fitzgerald, and used as a tag line in Horizons, the attraction in Epcot at Disney World. (It was not a Walt Disney quote. And Horizons was sponsored by General Electric...)
Does the "Must do it" quote originate from the Disney quote?
I think this is bad legal advice. I've dreamt lots of things that would be illegal, dangerous or simply impossible to do.
Luton. Well enough said!!!!!!!!!!
To get from Hendon Central to the Midland, one would need a tunnel (as one has betwixt Hendon and Colindale), or, going back a century, at the very least a viaduct over the Brent River valley (as one has today from Woodstock/Brent/Brent Cross station) to reach the Midland, say in the area of the long gone Welsh Harp station (a little south of West Hendon station). As such, to say that no major engineering work would be needed is incorrect.
I've often thought that the Metropolitan could, easily, at the Widened Lines and/or at Finchley Road/West Hampstead, take over the Midland to St.Albans with an additional station at Edgware Broadfields (really surprised why there isn't one there), and the long mooted re-opening of Napsbury for London Colney. Thameslink could then race from St.Albans to West Hampstead non-stop, which they often do anyway.
What a lovely couple of gentlemen at 05:34... 🙄
Pick picked and prepared a pertinent proposal of piquant proportions,but the politicians provaricated and the plan was poleaxed by those pesky people who preferred another path.
Very interesting Jago
I wonder if places like Luton and Harpenden did get their tube extension, granted that those areas became more metropolitan as a result, would those areas be included in tfl's travel zones like Watford and Chesham did?
when you said "they dusted of the Pick..." I was sure you were going to say "they dusted of the Picks & shovels"
God bless you Jago. Not everyone is strong enough to brave Luton.
So, Thameslink is effectively OERL to the UERL? Overground Electric Railway of London... then again, they all are now aren't they.
How did I live in Luton for most of my life and not know this?!
As someone that used to live in/near Luton and still knows people in the area, I can't decide how I feel about this...
Could you IMAGINE if they still had Pullman cars, God help us, on the Tube?!
Great video so interesting. There is more history than you think on the underground.
If Putin is going to unleash a nuclear attack as he finds himself more and more in a corner, please let it be on Luton. I'm in a Dr Strangelove kinda mood at the moment.
Its Pick, yer knows.