Frigate Duels of the War of 1812 - USS Constitution vs HMS Guerriere
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- čas přidán 5. 06. 2024
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Today we take a look at the first true frigate duel of the War of 1812, with more to come!
00:00:00 - Intro
00:01:55 - Constitution vs Guerriere
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Pinned post for Q&A :)
Drach- Excellent topic. Question for you: Are there any instances in which the Captains of frigates (or any vessels) duelled each other? Was this common or an issue for the RN or other navies during the Age of Sail when duelling was more common? (Clarification: I mean pistols at dawn and sending seconds to call on you, etc)
Can you find anything about what would’ve been played on the Mary rose drums they found? Was drums as important on naval battle as in land ones? I hope you could talk a bit about about how such signaling was done with bugles and drums from antiquity thru age of sail. Did galleys really have slave driving drummers beat out the rowing pace?
any chance of a mini-series on the 🇨🇦 Navy/merchant marine in WW!!? 😀(the world's 3rd largest Navy)
@@Marin3r101 Constitution, technically is still a commissioned Navy ship, crew of 75 officers/sailors are all active-duty Navy personnel.
In your opinion if the British frigate had been up to date, would it have been a more equal battle between the two ? And how do you think the battle would have really played out then?
As a former educator at the USS Constitution Museum, I find this presentation excellent. Many important little details about the battle that are often glossed over or forgotten are nicely brought up here, showing that while Capt. Dacre and HMS Guerriere were outmatched by Capt. Hull and USS Constitution, Dacre *knew* that and took proper steps to try and make the best of a bad situation. He simply had the misfortune that Joshua Humphreys (The designer and builder of Constitution) had created a ship that was nearly immune to long range fire.
Also, an interesting side note that few folks would know: one of the American fatalities in the battle was actually (and likely accidentally) self inflicted. As part of a task I was given while working at the Museum, I ended up going through the ship's entire medical records from 1797 to 1858. One account made it clear that this unfortunate sailor was putting a powder charge into a 24 lber long gun (probably during the time of close range broadside action). In his eagerness to keep the gun firing quickly he did so before it had been swabbed and the charge detonated in the barrel while his head was still in front of the bore. Poor man had his head blasted clean off his shoulders and out the gun port - possibly striking the Guerriere as a rather macabre projectile.
The lad really used his head on that one.
Minor correction there. USS Constitution was nearly immune to long range fire from guns typically carried by other Frigates.
I rather suspect she would have been far less immune to 24 or 32 pound shot. Which is why when the Ships of the Line started arriving the USN Captains took the rather sensible decision to avoid action with them.
I'm sorry, but I can't stop laughing at the likely reactions of the British crews to THAT projectile whizzing by...
So he headed over to the Guerriere to reconnoiter?
I would not take that as a self inflicted wound. I would be more of a Darwin Award.
I love the intro. It's rare that Drach makes videos about ships. Hope he makes more naval videos in the future.
One could only hope.
Probably, and this is a crazy idea, i know, a longer format to answer questions from.subscribers
It would be nice if he would feature engineering topics related to how antiquated naval vessels were designed and operated from time to time as well. Possibly on Wednesdays.
I wish his videos wpuld be funnier. They often lack humor like this comment section.
Like and subscribe, and he just might!
I recall reading in one book that Capt Dacre was very impressed by the curtesy that he was shown by Captain Hull and the Americans, up to and including the retrieving of his Bible, which had been passed down on his mothers side of the family. Also when he was brought abord Dacre tried to surrender his sword and Hull wouldn't hear of it. He also made his own surgeon available to help to tend to British casualties. Hull and Dacre being lifelong friends after the war and traded letters for many years.
You have to love Drachinifel's hat tip to Teddy Roosevelt. Compared to the standards set by him most modern presidents are pretty much only suitable to be his toilet paper. He won the Medal of Honor and the Nobel Peace Prize (legitimately I think). He wrote a number of books that I believe are still considered worth reading. And *after* he was finished as President he went on a trip up the Amazon river, which was still fairly dangerous in those days. That was how he relaxed after the stresses of being President. And he wrote a book about that too.
That trip up the Amazon was wild. It was bad in his book, and when I learned more about it, he was covering up the really bad stuff.
Trump wrote a book!
@@carbidegrd1 T.R. didn't need a ghost writer. And his books were actually true.
But he also hated to be called Teddy.
Let's also not forget that he used to challenge his friends to swimming races in the icy Potomac River in winter. I would imagine his Secret Service was not amused.
Supposedly, Hull was so overjoyed when the Guerriere ("Warrior") hauled down her colors he danced a jig so energetically, he split the seat of his trousers. He also gained Dacre's dress hat as the later had boasted that he would bet his hat he could defeat an American vessel.
From the various depictions, it would seem that after a certain age that Hull’s dress was under considerable strain even at rest.
I think I remember an apocryphal(?) story of Dacre's hat being an item in a wager or boast he made about being able to take on any American frigate.
I always got the feeling that US captains in 1812 were more like claymore mines, or Viking berserkers, just point them in the general direction of the enemy and stand back, lest you get cought up in the chaos. Barring obviously overwhelming odds US frigates seemed frightfully happy to give action.
The Barbrey Wars seasoned American naval officers in the virtue of extreme aggression.
A proud tradition that can be seen at the battle of somar
American captains during the War of 1812 were also well aware that their frigates were larger/more powerful than the equivalents in Royal service, which led them to be more willing to press home their advantage against other lone frigates they might find (such as in this duel).
Like their British counterparts. People forget how little the US and British cultures had diverged at this point in history. The USN of the period is pretty close to what the Royal Navy would have looked like at that size, with a little higher emphasis on the quality and strength of individual units.
Ahmmm that would be more applicable to the R/N Frigates than to the USN. In the War of 1812 not one of the USN ships took on a ship of equal or more guns Whereas 3 R/N frigates beat 3 of your ships.
Old Ironsides is really something. Boston's only undefeated team!
I watched this video today in a hotel room with a print of the USS constitution on the wall, then went to see the boat. 10/10 good boat.
50 years ago I came across a a book in the school library that covered the exploits of USS Constitution during the war of 1812, and it not only hooked me into a lifelong love of naval history but of history in general. I'm very pleased that you plan a series of videos covering the naval engagements of this war. Thanks Drach!
Have you read Theodore Roosevelt's book on the war of 1812? Maybe not the most stimulating writer, but he strove to write the most truthful history of the war.
As of about 30 years ago, Constitution's sea anchor from the slow-motion kedging race with the British squadron was preserved at the US Naval Academy museum in Annapolis, Maryland. It's probably still there. Kedging is the process of moving the umbrella-like sea anchor some distance forward of the ship in a boat, dropping it, and then getting a few dozen men on the ship's capstan to winch in the line. Repeat until the wind comes back or you've moved a sufficient distance.
If you were over the Marianas Trench, that means of propulsion would suck. :)
@@bf3and4highlights83 With a regular anchor, yes. With a sea anchor, you're trying to basically get a grip on the water itself against which to pull the ship. Sort of like an oar on an anchor chain.
I'm not sure that it was present at this battle, but at times, Constitution mounted "Chambers guns" in her fighting tops.
This was a muzzle loading multi barrel flintlock that fired a 2 minute burst of over 200 shots on one trigger pull.
Forgotten weapons has a video of one in a Dutch museum.
I'm going to love this series. When I was growing up, I read a book about Old Ironsides that, IIRC, was written for boys, and was very inspired by it. Later when I visited Annapolis and then Constitution herself, I had a deeper perspective of what I was seeing. Sadly, I'm not sure how many younger Americans (or of any age for that matter) are aware of this ship and its relevance to US history, but anyone who enjoys films like Master and Commander, pirate stories, Hornblower books, etc., would probably love to know the real stories about age of sail warfare.
That book was called "A Son of Old Ironsides". I can't remember the author . It was given as a gift to my Grandfather as a boy in the 30's and I read it as a boy in the 80's. An excellent book. My grandfather served in the US Navy in WW2 and I joined the Marines in the 90's.
@@MacFinn-wp2vn I don't think that was it. It was more of a straight history book and I think it was just called "Old Ironsides" which makes it almost impossible to look up. But yes, I had a great uncle who served in the Navy in WWII, and I myself served in the Corps in Desert Storm, and later aboard USS Nassau LHA-4. I'll look up the book you mentioned. Semper FI, brother.
At 13-20, the Constitution is flying the wrong flag, the 13 stars in a circle of the War of Independence. By 1812, Kentucky, Tennessee and Ohio had joined the Union and the flag had 15 stars in a rectangular pattern and 15 stripes (which would later revert to 13). Yes, it's a small thing, but it is not up to the attention to detail we expect of Drach. Twelve lashes at the gangway !
It's the flag that came with the kit 😀
@@Drachinifel Nice kit. Who is the Manufacture?
@@robertkelley3437 Warlord Games
They're very nice kits I have the Constitution from warLord and it's very nice
Not only that...but, unlike the paintings of the battle, there's only ONE flag...whereas the paintings have at LEAST 3 national flags...plus some additional (maybe an ensign and something else). 🤣
In addition to this 1812 series, I'd love to see your coverage of the USS Constellation's career fighting in the Quasi War against the French.
Or Constellation's interdiction voyages. I think only one or 2 British ships were more successful against the slave trade.
The invasion of Canada is a fascinating episode. America was determined to march north and liberate the poor Canadians from the chafing yoke of monarchical tyranny. Unfortunately, nobody had asked the Canadians about this plan, so it was only when the Army got there that they discovered the Canadians weren’t particularly troubled by living under the chafing yoke of monarchical tyranny and had no real desire to be liberated. However, they were very troubled by their southern neighbor showing up in their colony uninvited, and so went about removing the offending Americans in a way that made certain that they wouldn’t return unless invited.
How very polite of them!
I understand they did send the Yanks back with bellies full of poutine and wearing very stylish toques.
Let’s not forget the burning of York (Toronto) before the Americans made their exit. Many people are so enamored by the idea that the “polite” Canadians at one time defeated the future Superpower that they leave out such details. Many also like to pretend that the Canadians burned down Washington when it was British Regulars fresh from the Napoleonic War, but that’s another story.
@@drksideofthewal You lost get over it.
And look at Canada today🙄🤯
This battle, while like all battles being horrific, is also very comedic.
A neat bit of trivia is that the 1790 Mess Gong from the USS Constitution is on display at the White House Mess.
My favourite book about this war and its naval actions is The Age of Fighting Sail, by C.S. Forester. In fact, it's one of my favourite books, period. Can hardly wait for the next video. Many thanks, Drachinifel!
Patrick O`Brian`s Fortune of war is a fine novel on this topic too.
Theodore Roosevelt did a great job of describing this battle by quoting reliable sources, very glad you referenced his book. You're videos is simply outstanding, and I have no idea why you don't have more subscribers.
I first visited the USS Constitution when I was about 8 years old in 1967. I was so very impressed that I immediately became a long time fan of the ship, and still am to this day. I am overjoyed that she has been overhauled to the point that she can still work under sail at least once a year. I have always imagined the battles of this class of 44 gun frigates with the standard British 38 gun frigates comparable with the 19th century version of a pocket battleship engaging a heavy frigate in 20th century terms. After all, the Constitution class all had the scantlings and main deck guns of a British 74 gun 3rd rate along with a large number of 32 lb. Carronades. Her weight of fire was considerably higher than poor Guerrier's. Captain Dacres and his crew did all that honor and bravery could in the face of such a disparity in firepower and hull strength. I have always been in awe of the bravery of the British in such encounters. The American crews were a different kettle of fish compared to the French or Spanish enemies they had been facing up until then. Of course the disparity in numbers would have eventually neutralized the American blue water fleet. Blockade would ultimately prevent the American frigates from making it to sea in any numbers. Then there is the famous Chesapeake vs Shannon fight, but that's another story I hope will be covered in future. Love the work you are doing Drach!
Well done, looking forward to the continuation of this series.
I grew up in Erie Pennsylvania (now live near Gettysburg), visiting Misery Bay, the Perry Monument and Put-in-Bay Ohio. I can hardly wait for Drach’s take on the Battle of Lake Erie!
Drach, Thank you for this very detailed summary of the battle. Having fought this battle many times with "Wooden Ships and Iron Men"" and other miniature rules, it is usually a quick affair of Constitution demasting Guerriere and then raking her a couple of times. Sounds like it was a much closer affair than often advertised.
This channel has sure evolved from a robotic voice channel featuring brief summaries of famous ships.
I look forward to this series. I seem to recall that in a battle on the Great Lakes, a Captain had such favorable conditions that he was able to fire a broadside, then back up, reload and fire again rather than tack or wear. I cannot remember which Navy no ship though.
This particular event is one of my favorite engagements in US Naval history. I grew up on the song and the stories in the Time Life book series which includes a whole volume on "The Frigates" which is a very well illustrated book specifically interested in the early US Frigates. The book goes into some of the unique training and techniques used by the American gunners which made for faster rates of more accurate fire on their heavier 24 lber guns. It's fascinating reading.
This is up there with the battle off samar for my favorite
Don't know if anyone remembers Age of Sail 2, but Constitution was one of the ships featured. It's a very nippy ship in that game, with quite a punch. Interesting to see she was doing such sharp turns because I found that to be very effective, particularly against slower ships. Bit rough on the rudder, perhaps. .
I loved that game.
AOS2 became bogged down with online clubs with far too high an opinion of themselves however.
No game after it did naval warfare justice. My opinion was that computer programmers don't know squat about sailing and hence the water is just flat land and ships are just skins moving across it like trucks.
A game based fundamentally on a true sailing simulator placed on a sea surface that reflects waves, wind, tide, current,land formations etc would be lovely.
Boarding without a game crash and realistic sail and rig damage would be brilliant.
Fire on the uproll!
Nice thought.@@TermiteUSA
There have been several board games done over the past 50 years attempting to play our the various Frigate actions of the War of 1812. I have and most of them and have played most of them.
Wooden Ship & Iron Men, by Avalon Hill being on of the better ones.
USS Constitution vs. HMS Guerriere sounds like a naval version of Rock Paper Scissors. In this case, Paper Covers Cheese. Great video, and great topic, Drach!
Another great vid, well done Dracs.
What a fabulous ship Constitution is, I've never seen inside her before so thank you for this.
Frigates, a grand subject, the first frigate action I painted years astern was Maidstone and Lion, it's still admired and on my website somewhere.
More recently 'my' frigates have included a couple of Type 23's but that's not quite what you have in mind is it !!!
Which reminds me, I researched HMS Shannon intending to create a painting.
It'll have to wait a bit as at present I'm busy with paintings is Surcoff, the most famous French corsair, taking the Kent and the Golden Hind taking her most valuable prize, both good strong stories.
I am planning a visit to England at the end of April, if you are about it would be a pleasure to meet again.
I got my Kamchatka shirt from Drach’s Dockyard yesterday. It is wonderfully soft and has a good remembrance of my favorite CZcams videos. Now if you can find an artist who can draw Rozhestvensky cursing and throwing binoculars at Kamchatka….
I so loved visiting the Constitution when I was a kid. Next best thing to a time machine and I remember one of the crew being very patient with me.
As a historian, I have been waiting for Drach to post this battle ever since I stumbled onto his channel. I read about this battle when I was kid reading the Time Life Series "The Seafarers" when I was 9 years old. That was 30 plus years ago. I read Theodore Roosevelt's book on Kindle. I soaked up all the information like a sponge. I won't go into all the technical details about the different ships and how the USS Constitution and the HMS Guerriere stacked out against each other. Other people like Drach can do that. What I want to see is the reenactments and mockups.
Do not forget the HMS Endymion, HMS Shannon and HMS Phoebe that in turn defeated the USS President USS Chesapeake and USS Essex. The R/N always had a go regardless of the disparity in size
And coming forward 8 Dec 1941 Shanghai, HMS Petrel a single 3 inch Gunboat went down fighting a Japanese six inch Light Cruiser
While at berth not that far away the USS Wake surrendered without firing a shot.[ Its Captain was in town at his apartment while the R/N Captain was with his ship.]
Oh and that R/N Captain knowing that the Japs were not far away had thrown the breech block of his gun O/board and fought the Japs with .303s
I believe he was awarded the DSC
YES! More frigate duels! You should cover the moonlight battle.
Dacre was 24-years-old in 1812. Father was an admiral. You have to be pretty well-contacted to get a command at that age.
Dacres family was a naval dynasty- his father, both uncles, and brothers were all naval men of renown
@@williamcarter1993 The RN was a family affair. Two of famed author Jane Austen's brothers, Charles and Francis were RN officers - and while she ignored the Army, Naval officers were treated well in her novels.
"Admiral of the Fleet Sir Francis William Austen, GCB (23 April 1774 - 10 August 1865) was a Royal Navy officer and an elder brother of the novelist Jane Austen. As commanding officer of the sloop HMS Peterel, he captured some 40 ships, was present at the capture of a French squadron, and led an operation when the French brig Ligurienne was captured and two others were driven ashore off Marseille during the French Revolutionary Wars."
"Rear Admiral Charles John Austen CB (23 June 1779 - 7 October 1852) was an officer in the Royal Navy and the youngest brother of novelist Jane Austen. He served during the French Revolutionary and Napoleonic Wars, and beyond, eventually rising to the rank of rear-admiral."
@Drachinifel I love the use of the beautiful models to show the relative positions of the ships!
Who makes that ocean "game matt"? It's gorgeous!
Next time, you should put down some "cotton balls" to mimic smoke. 🤣
Good idea on the cotton balls! The mat I ordered from Warlord Games along with the ships :)
Love this series already, keep up the great work drach
Love this series, Drach! @13:41, a better man than the captain of HMS Macedonian
Good premise for a series Drach - looking forward to more of these.
So excited for this mini-series!
Thank you, merry Christmas
Merry Christmas and thanks for all your work during the year. Currently enjoying Boxing Day here.
Great video, I really appreciate the models used to demonstrate the movements of the ships
I appreciate that you added a chapter break for the change from sponsor to subject
Very well done, excellent clip. Professional job..
What good timing. I just finished a book about the US Navy in the War of 1812, and here come these videos.
Actually I'd like to preempt a question for the Shannon/Chesapeake action. I've seen artwork and scale models where both ships appear to be sporting the same paint scheme. That of a buff or white pinstripe beneath the gun ports. Nowadays we most commonly expect to see the band along the gun ports a la the Nelson Chequer. Was this pinstripe scheme common? Were either the Shannon or Chesapeake sporting it as a ruse or did they both happen to have it by pure happenstance?
Thanks for sharing and Merry Christmas to you and your family 😅
Another great video! One of these days you should do a video on the frigate battles of the war of Spanish succession. That would be epic!
Superb presentation. Thank you.
Thank you for the excellent video! I remember reading about this engagement but it was a history book written for young people and didn't have a lot of detail about the battle. The description of the fight, in particular the early battle of maneuver and long-range gunnery exchange was all new to me. I am greatly looking forward to the follow-on installments!
Thank You Drach!! My reading of this engagment as a 10 year old in the late 60s started me on my path to a lifetime of the study of history, particularly Naval History. I was fascinated by the Constitution. Followed up with the study of HMS Java encounter Had the boar game "Broadside". I got so into it. Dragged my parents to Boston to see her. Went to UK and dragged them to Portsmouth to see HMS Victory. Seeing this video makes this a special Christmas Present!!! Thanks and Salut.
This was wonderful! Like most Americans, I presume, I've known of the battle between the Constitution and Guerriere for most of my life. BUT, this is the first time I've really learned the details of the battle and how it was actually not only possible that the Constitution could have lost, but a shift in wind or fortune could have given the Guerriere a resounding victory. Fascinating!
A great description of the Battle, i have visited her and the Constlation in Baltimore. I'm always impressed with the Wooden Ships and the Iron Men who sailed them
Of course now everyone who cares knows that the present "Connie" is a rebuilt Civil War Era corvette with only fragmenta of the original frigate remaining. There's a story that when the great naval architect Howard I. Chappelle did his research and published a book explaining why the present ship,(since beautifully restored to her second life form) was NOT the same as the original frigate, rhe powers that be in Baltimore were very upset. Chappelle's book is wonderful, I have one of the few rare copies of it and will never understand how it made it's way to a library sale shelf in Orlando.
Cheers.
Four US Navy destroyers have been named for Hull: DD-7: Hopkins class, DD-330: Clemson class, DD-350: Farragut class, and DD-945: Forrest Sherman class.
I enjoy these sail age stories very much
VERY, VERY NICE ! !
I'm truly going to like these !
😎👍
Great work. Interesting video.
Another series to look forward too
Thanks for explaining about »battle sail«, even if it wasn’t specifically about my question from some videos earlier.
I love this! Thank you!
Loved the video. One thing occurred to me after watching it. other than the morale issue, I would think the Admiralty would be satisfied at the trade-off of one old, well-used frigate if it "mission-killed" a dangerous commerce raider before it could inflict much damage.
Love is time of Navel history. Growing up my local Game Store would run demo tabletop games every Saturday. One of them was Wooden Ships and Iron Men. I still remember commanding HMS Hawke as part of a British line vs the French and Spanish.
Great video!!
The clear winner here was the Live Oak used in the heavy US frigates. Drach should know that. I love Drach, but I’m still at loggerheads with him over John Paul Jones. I think Drach thinks he was a scoundrel. So was Sir Francis Drake. But, anyway, Flameboroughead (sp.) was a mini Pearl Harbor. And so what if the scoundrels within Jones’s own squadron was shooting at the Bonhomme Richard? He was also shooting at Serapis. Sort of off topic, but Drach is a big enough person to multitask
I mentioned the above average strength of the wood in her hulk. 😀
I fully agree Drake was an utter scoundrel, albeit there is a fine line between people disliking you and your own side opening fire at you 😀 JPJ is certainly and interesting character, I just think the USN has a few slightly better candidates for a founding figure 😉
Don't forget Humphrey's brilliant creation of the diagonal scantlings in the framing which helped prevent hogging.
Fascinating. Thank you
Excellent!
Thanks Drach.
A man who does 6 hour dry dock vids is concerned about going long.
Please do more of these
Ah Master and Commander eat your heart out. LOL You did a nice job on this story about my favorite ship (other than the one I was on).
I was in the Boston Museum of Fine Arts yesterday and I stumbled upon two paintings by Thomas Birch. One of the battle between the USS Constitution and the Guerriere. The other of the battle between the United States and the Macedonian. They are both beautiful paintings. It was very cool because I had watched this video literally the day before.
Thanks Drach
The Ships might have been becalmed but I’m sure the Crew of the Constitution was a bundle of nerves
I'm looking forward to this "series". Thanks.
These frigate duels having focussed the Royal Navy's attention, our ancestor & his Yankee Doodle privateer colleagues made a "pile of tin". Thankyou very much!
Excellent work as usual. Now to all Drach's followers:
Come fill your glasses full
and let's drink to Captain Hull (To Hull!)
And pass around the flagon of the brandy-o!
John Bull can boast his fill,
Let the world think what it will.
For fighting oh those Yankee boys are dandy-o.
HEY !!--I THOUGHT "GUERRIERE"-WAS A "FANCY FRENCH" CHEESE"-THAT CAME IN A "BOX"-???
I recall a story where as a teacher penned the question, "when was the war of 1812?" Half the class got it wrong.
I love the art showing square-rigged vessels at a broad reach. Points of sail are a very real thing for sailing ships but artists so often only show the wind at their back
Well, in order to trying to disturb the US ships, the Royal Navy used ships with French name but prefixed by HMS 🤣 Another great video! Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
The English lost that battle and you lost the battle to learn it.
@@carbidegrd1 😂 I never say they won the duel. Learn a bit of humour 😉. Have a nice day
Royal navy used french names (of course with the prefix HMS) mostly on the vessels they had captured from the french. And that was a big lot over the years. There was a running joke among the brits that you build ships and we take them… 😅
@@Ah01 well it was between a joke and a statement of facts. Funnier was the fact that some French ships were better than their English counterparts.
Drach- Excellent topic. Question for you: Are there any instances in which the Captains of frigates (or any vessels) duelled each other? Was this common or an issue for the RN or other navies during the Age of Sail when duelling was more commons?
You should probably post this in his Q+A section...
@@Marin3r101 I did. Drach didn't hace the pinned post up when I posted it.
Like ship to ship duel or pistols at ten paces duel?
Chesapeake v. Shannon was technically a duel as Shannon’s captain issued a challenge to Chesapeake’s captain to come out of harbor and fight. However Chesapeake already made sail of her own accord before the challenge arrived. So yes I imagine this wasn’t the only occurrence of this happening.
Oh, and spoiler alert: it didn’t end well for Chesapeake.
@@AdmRose Franco-Prussian War had a duel between two gunboats while a Spanish ship observed/served as the referee lol.
Thought I am pretty sure the other person meant a 1v1 personal duel rather than a ship vs ship battle.
If you are in Boston, visit the Constitution and the Fletcher class DD Cassin Young (DD 793).
BZ and Happy Holidays.
Great presentations Drach, got anything on the original USS Constellation ?
Great video. I live in Ohio about an hour away from Lake Erie where a very important battle in the war of 1812 took place. Commadore Perry defeated the British off South Bass Island to end the war of 1812. I hope someday you would report about those ships?
Check out my 'War of 1812 - Freshwater Edition' for the Great Lakes campaigns :)
Love this video and hoping we will get HMS Shannon and USS Chesapeake in the future
The bay still wants a re-match.
Guerriere's "howitzer" was likely a gun stationed in her one of boats, the barge or launch.
I'm always astounded at these British versus American battles. They just pounded the snot out of each other.
Faster and higher casualty battles than typically took place between the British and other European powers. Both sides were convinced they were going to win.
One small suggestion, if I may. The dioramas depicting the positions and maneuvers of the action would be even more informative if there were an arrow or other indicator of the wind direction. We want to know who has the weather gage.
Colonel Roosevelt, as he then was titled, wrote the 1812 section of Clowes's seven volume history of the Royal Navy, so was clearly recognized as the leading authority on that war at the time.
I'm paused at the 10:38 mark and have to share two thoughts that I love about this developing battle situation.
Firstly, I love the fact that the US Navy, from it's infancy, basically adopted the methodology that becomes the halmark of the US Military 200 years later. "Right, lads... in a war against pretty much anyone, we're going to be outnumbered, but by God we shall never be out gunned! Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition!" Thus began the traditional American way of war. If in doubt, add more firepower.
Secondly, I love that the captain of Guerriere is like, "Right, I've seen this ship before and she's a tough old bird that is stronger than our own ship. I'm quite confident that in a straight up fight, we'll beat her, and I'm quite happy that the Americans seem to be attacking. I've got them right where I want them." Very Age of Sail British Navy of him.
The early USN was so freaking lucky Great Britain was preoccupied with France and Spain. The focus of the RN on the Napoleonic War and defending its oversea holdings let the USN get away with a lot that an otherwise concentrated RN would have slammed shut. Great Britain considered the War of 1812 more of a nuisance than a threat. I've loved the Constitution since I was a little kid in the late 70s, but realistically, we would've gotten curb stomped if the RN sent its starter team over. lol
Thanks for the video. The models make the movements of the engagement clearer than any diagram I have ever seen in a book. It is somewhat questionable if Guerriere would have been a useful addition to the USN. The frigate John Adams spent most of the war laid up due to lack of crewmen and material, and Congress was laid up at the end of 1813 for the same reasons.
Very talented CZcams person 🎉
might have slipped my ears but USS may have had carronades at the time on the top. I visited them. It was as a way to add more dakka
OK? you made me cry three times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There is only one frigate duel that matters. The acid test of HMS SHANNON VS USS CHESAPEAKE.
Thats as close to an equal duel youre gonna get in this conflict. Otherwise the US super frigates may just as well have been 3rd rates. Not once were they up against an equal in scantling, armament or crew complement.