Bolt-on HORSEPOWER? Tuned Exhaust Installation - Power Flow Systems
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- For the longest time, I've been wanting to install a Power Flow Tuned Exhaust on N80991, and we finally made it happen! Power Flow made filming this process so easy, too, by giving us all the dialogue and data needed to give you the full picture of how this changes our airplane!
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Y’all are so worried about the fact he is wearing a mask. It’s called being respectful to the company he is working with for the exhaust. I’m sure if he was asked to wear a mask he would of done it out of respect. Josh is a upstanding guy, and you’re not gonna upset the people working on your pride and joy. Just calm down and enjoy the video.
@@chrisnedbalek2866 holy shit you're one of those, I hated the mask mandate but I still wore it out of respect for private company or if it made people feel uncomfortable. Stop acting like youre some entitled "woke" know it all. That is probably 80% of the internet today. We do not care if you think it looks stupid because you look stupid trying to argue something Josh has 0 care in your opinion for. I also think it looks silly but I do not care. It will eventually be over soon stop pushing people on your views its not going to change anyones mind. Stop assuming your view of thinking is the correct one. Theres 7 billion people on this planet and youre one.
3:22 ohh yeah baby
@@bits_for_bytes I get the reference
@@bootleg0012 Nobody cares about your opinion
@@bootleg0012 Yeah but nobody cares about your too
3 years ago we overhauled the engine and installed a Power Flow exhaust on our 1980 172N. Last year we put 175 hours on the plane and calculated the overall fuel flow at 5.92 GPH. We have amazing climb performance too. It was a great investment.
I work for a company that owns 7 airplanes fitted with Power Flow exhausts. Great power and a great sounding engine!
Josh,
It's not magic, it's superior engineering and installation.
Those people rock!
Cheers,
Rik Spector
We've been doing this to road vehicles for years. It's good to see that it's being adopted in the aircraft world as well.
About time, we been slapping headers on forever!
I've had a Power Flow exhaust on my Cessna 172M (1976) for about 10 years (I'll have to look it up in my log books) and it made a huge difference.
As an A&P (long retired now) I appreciate that the recips are really still using 1940's tech for power plants. It's nice to see some of what used to be called hot rod modifications from cars be applied to small aircraft and reap the benefits of it. That bird is REALLY nicely equipped. Loved the panel and all the "toys".
Anytime one can save fuel and go faster with less required of the engine, the better.
Work smart not hard 👍
@@ryanawilson8549 3:22 ohh yeah baby
Great video. I'm slapping a short stack on my 172 after seeing this. Thanks for putting this video together. It was a nice production.
Love products like this! Increase performance and engine life with a quantifiable savings while not rebuilding the entire power plant. I will certainly look into Power Flow products when the time comes. Great job bringing us the actual test run with data presentation. Josh, this may well be your best technical content video ever!
Thank you Bruce! Lots of skeptical comments from people who didn’t watch/listen to the full video, but I guess the value of such an upgrade is too hard to communicate to some. Thanks for the support!!
Was looking forward to this content and see what gains are unlocked.
I read this and immediately thought "achievement unlocked" 🤦♂️
EAA Oshkosh purchase w lots discounts to buy this summer during show may definitely be offered w a delayed payment plan to save for it! Worthy exhaust system to install 👍✈️
The manual data collection would drive me nuts. I love engines with full FADEC for this type of testing.
Nice mod, and enjoy the performance and efficiency gains.
Great video explaining exactly what most of us hotrodders have understood for decades. Ever since the late 40’s when the pioneers of the drag-strips started looking for more horsepower from their flathead Fords, there’s been no easier upgrade than a good set of well made & tuned headers.
I’m genuinely surprised that with the advent of programmable EFI, turbo & intercooler advances, & other ways to make an ICE more powerful & efficient, that so few of them have made their way into the GA industry & onto these flat 4 air-cooled engines which have their basic design roots go back to before WW2.
Thankfully this is one modification that has no downside other than initial cost, which is not just about getting your ROI which most of the comments seemed overly concerned about (why are they even interested in GA if that’s their main concern) but the fact that it makes the engine work less for the same result. Less RPM’s, less fuel burn & generally less overall engine stress for the same result has got to be factored into any ROI equation. With the expense of an overhaul, this seems like a no-brainer to maximise the total allowable hours.
Get this man a TV show. More common sense in 3 paragraphs than I've seen in a week.
Thanks Josh, I've always wondered how those things really perform. That is a pretty impressive improvement.
Neat to see behind the scenes. Thanks!
I have a Power Flow on my Musketeer but since it was installed by past owners I can't say how much of a difference it makes. I can, however, say how much performance a rebuilt engine got me, and how much damage it did to my back account.
Great presentation of a wonderful product / company. I enjoy the benefits on my C177RG
Better flow AND timed pulses at the collector = tuned performance. The OEM missed the opportunity and simply "value (cost) engineered" the stock exhaust to fit under the cowling. Kutos to Power Flow for waffling through the quagmire to get STC's for much of our GA fleet
So beautiful to give this old bird some TLC! Way to go! Many happy flights!
Josh I had to watch your video again today! I love all the benefits of the performance exhaust system! I feel your satisfaction! Good things come to those who wait and work for it!!!
This sounds like a really smart installation for improved performance. I trust it works out well for you. I'll be interested to hear future comments on how the transition went.
Wow it's been a while between drinks , definatley missed the last few vids some how . As usual another great watch
The hot rodder in me is super excited about this.
It’s definitely an improvement, the exhaust is a big part of the engine. Too bad they don’t make it for every type of engine. For a Piper Arrow 180 HP it’s not available.
The tuned exhaust is an absolute added benefit and increased efficiency. The problem is justifying the cost.
ROI on fuel saving is 1 gl per Hour at Cruise. Price of Avgas is $5.25 (Average). Cost of unit $5K.
So $5,000/5.25 = 952 or Gallons worth of saving, so roughly 1,000 hour of operation and the system has paid for it self. with the average flying time of private pilot at 40 hours per annum. That's roughly 25 years.
So to your point not really worth it for your average private pilot, unless you fly more than 300 hours or so annually. (ROI of 3). So for private schools planes and other services. Yes. Its worth it.
For the average joe.....not really, but would be a nice to have.
@@fredpinczuk7352 Then again, not everything is money. The extra performance has to be worth something as well.
@@fredpinczuk7352 Not sure the ROI is in the fuel savings. For me it's the potential to significantly increase the rate of climb. That is an extra level of safety I would be willing to pay for if I can go from 400-500 FPM to 700-800 (as they advertise) If I gain a few knots in cruise or save a few bucks on fuel that is great too, but not the main benefit for me as a PA28-150 driver.
ROI of course for average private doesn't pan out but to me factoring in faster cruise/climb and now longer range making 500 mile trips easy on range may be worth the $. Now to find an installer.
34:56 - Whos hand on whos leg... ;-) haha.. like the subtleness.
Received my custom exhaust for my experimental Pacer and have nothing but praise for the Powerflow staff. Very pleased with my experience dealing with them. Unit is a modified Aviat Husky unit to fit a O-320. Can't wait to install it and see how the plane performs after the rebuild.
I added the PowerFlow on my 1971 Cardinal RG. Not only is the exhaust a far higher quality piece than my ever-cracking OEM exhaust, but it provided a nice performance boost. There is no question it resulted in a better rate of climb, and nearly a decade down the road, no cracks!
That's really cool that they do tuned exhaust systems for airplanes. The way Power Flow does their testing an application for their product is very similar to doing aftermarket exhaust and intake systems. I am shocked to hear that airplane manufacturers don't install high performance exhaust and intake parts when they fabricate the planes. Seems very counterintuitive seeing as how engine performance and speed of the plane is everything during operation. Awesome vid Josh, love to see all that technical behind the scenes stuff with planes.
Good to see you got the engine breathing better overall. That filter reminds me of the K&N I put in my truck. Noticeable difference in performance when they breathe better!
The 35 minutes of this video "Flew" bye! It's a fascinating process and it clearly adds up to better performance, better fuel economy and will result in longer engine life. Thanks for the detailed look at this outstanding company and their products.
I'm definitely gonna look further into doing this on mine. Have seen many exhaust tunes but after talking to the owners they aren't seeing much improvement. These guys seem like the real deal and the data proves it 👍
It made perfect sense to me. The headers looked like the equal length headers I put on my car for performance when I was a lot younger, and the air filter looks like the K&N I run on my truck now.. Both got/get better performance over stock. 8)
Good eye. I just checked their website and it says they use K&N media for air filter.
Gas consumption = better for the climate and the cooler temps mean longer engine life. The killer of any combustion engine is HEAT! I am sold just knowing that. When I hit the lottery and own my own plane, I know where to go for an exhaust system. Awesome video and those "Dad" jokes were top notch!
Excellent. I've been contemplating a Power Flow for my '69 M20-C. Summer (Arizona) climbs are an exercise in temperature management and this might help.
I remember when flying 152's/172's (all used for training), you could almost always smell exhaust. Always had to have the vents open. They also all had air leaks around the doors, so even more fresh air came in. That muffler seems to be exactly what glasspack mufflers on automobiles are.
I wouldn't use one of those foam filters on my car since they let in dirty air, and not sure I would on an airplane, even though you aren't running the engine on the ground long. On the Mooney I flew, you could bypass the air filter when at altitude (ram air).
Best mod you can make. My buddy did the same with his 172 but he also installed the higher compression pistons. The thing put out so much more power that he had to get his prop re-pitched, Better yet, his fuel burn remained the same - an indication of how much unburned fuel is going out the exhaust on the stock engine.
A very helpful, informative, educational, interesting video...that is very much appreciated!
When we finally locate and obtain one of the following "ideal for us" Cessna 172's:
1964' E model through a 1969' K model, one of our first upgrades will be the Powerflow Exhaust System. It's actually 1 of our 3 top priority upgrades during our refurbishment project.
Thanks again!🙏🇺🇲💪
Great advertisement for PowerFlow. Hope they gave you a discount. If I ever get a plane again, it will be looked into.
A discount? They should have paid him a large lump sum + a free exhaust for a 35 minute advert of this quality. After watching this I want this upgrade and I don't even have a plane! lol
3:21 ohh yeah baby
OK, I'm sold. Might just get one of these for my Mooney - cheers.
I am looking at purchasing a Mooney down the road. Have you looked into the powerflow for Mooneys? Are they available for all models?
@@brucecuratola1836 I've only looked into the E, F and J models with IO-360 and IO-390 engines. FAA STCs exist for Powerflow exhausts for these Mooneys. Not sure about the later models though.
@@brucecuratola1836 BTW, I have a M20J:)
That was an outstanding and very informative video Josh! We've been looking into the Powerflow exhaust for our C177 RG and spent some time talking to Darren at Fun-n-Sun. Your video strengthens the argument for the addition of the the tuned exhaust. Looks like it's great bang for the buck! Thanks for making a very thorough video on your experience.
So glad you made this video. I’m neck deep in all my data since I changed my 4 cylinders 15 hours ago.
We did this to our Cherokee 10 years ago. Tracking the fuel burn, we calculated that it paid for itself. Can't beat it when an upgrade pays for itself and continues to lower the operating cost.
So is like a MagnaFlow used in cars, slowly you're transforming your vintage airplane into a hotrod 👍👍
I love my 172P with Power Flow, she really pulls & beats published fuel burns.
Really nice review of a system that all planes should have. Just like putting some headers on a car. Got to get that engine to breath better.
Thanks for sharing your love of flying.
I have one on my piper 140. It definitely makes a difference! I bought my aircraft with it installed. It's about time for the muffler noise attenuator to be replaced.
It's a really good upgrade to have! Cruising at 2450RPM in my piper at 7GPH and 105kias is sweet, sweet music.
I’d like to do this. I think I’d like to upgrade to the O-360 first though
You said the prop was balanced but never spoke about the improvement in speed or less vibration? I've been in aviation in another facet for years and am very excited to see this technology.
I love my powerflow. I’ve been up to 17,000 with my Ram 160 and a classic powerflow gross weight. There are a lot of off airport spots that I go into I wouldn’t even attempt without one.
Awesome video. I've always wanted to know if adding a Power Flow exhaust system to my Tiger, which runs a Lycoming O-360 180 HP engine, would be beneficial. Your in depth analysis has definitely peaked my interest. Up here in Colorado, flying high, hot and lean is the norm and, unless we turbocharge our engines, we normally aspirated types have to figure out ways to squeeze maximum horsepower without abusing our engines. I'm definitely putting this upgrade on my list. As always, excellent job with the video.
Fly safe and fly often!
What about a scooped Ram Air intake, similar to the late 90's Pontiac Trans Am? Can't wait until the 'vette engine is approved.
I like it. Great video. I have also done a ton of research. Sold my C400 and getting a C177RG. In Florida & going to the Bahamas, I still wanted to be able to get up to 17,000'. Data with a power flow and an M&T 3 blade composite prop, 17k will be no problem. Actually the M&T 3 blade composite prop will save me 5lbs on the nose in the already nose heavy C177RG.
Josh, Very good video here. Real informative on the benefits of the Power Flow Exhaust. I have a 180 Piper and am now thinking maybe I would like to get my near full 180hp out of it. Thank you for all you put in to these videos.
Simply an Awesome Video. Lots of info to digest. But your last 3 minutes really brought it all home.
I've been enjoying and learning from your videos for years and want to say "Thanks" for everything from showing us all that you genuinely care about our safety all the way to just sitting back and enjoying the beauty of flight and grandeur of Gods creations. Keep all the great content and production values coming Sir!!
Blue Skys and Tailwinds.
Ordered mine for my 177b. Can't wait. Congrats on getting yours.
" 1/2 hr from start to finish" on replacing attenuator? My experience with this system is on a Sundowner, this exhaust system may work good on some planes but some things to consider before buying that I didn't see in the vid is:
Weight vs OEM muffler
Captive customer parts replacement cost
Time it takes to remove lower cowling with extra piping in the way
Instructions for continued airworthiness remove tail pipe and lube every 100hrs
Cut a two foot square hole in lower cowling to install and plug and paint existing exh.hole.
After un butchering the lower cowl with a servicable replacement I would not recommend this for the Beech Sport/Sundowner with minimal performance on HP increase.
Just needs a cam, Holley efi, and some rims.lol
The fuel savings was definitely some good numbers.
You say niner niner one too slow. You gotta speed it up a bit
Yes it should be installed on most general aivation training aircraft to reduce maintenance cost.
Absolutely would not reduce operating costs due to the increased maintenance involved in maintaining the exhaust
@@MrBe787 No correct. Plus, it’s not just about saving money (even though it does). It’s also about added performance and engine longevity.
@@Aviation101 yes...increase in HP but increase in operating costs due to increase in maintenance
@@Aviation101 don’t get me wrong though, Power Flow definitely increases performance but you’re gonna pay 💰
I’m over in Lockhart and I really enjoy your channel. Keep on doing what you’re doing!
Better performance, saving on heat / fuel / oil temps. Win Win. Thank you for the video - be safe. Looking forward to the next video. 'Spin'
Very impressive! A gallon an hour for the life of the aircraft, especially 80991, is going to add up quickly. Basically $3-$5 / flight hour, ish.
Will only take 1500 hours to make that back 🤡
Ah perfect for ending a workday ;)
Yes, this is my dream one day. To be financially independent enough to travel as Josh does.
Solid upgrade. Speaking of upgrades, it's time for a 182 bro. 😜
182 RG would be the icing on the cake
Ha! November 809er9er2
You are going to make me go grab a C172 and Beef it up... I love the vids and the insights to what you have going on. Keep em coming... Congrats on the new Pipe!!
I have had radios with tuned exhaust. Some have even had variable tuned-exhaust controlled by engine RPM. 😊
Nicely done. Very good rundown and you went deep enough into the performance numbers to certainly make a believer of me, thanks. In the beginning, you were talking about propeller balancing but the video didn't seem to go into that. I've long been of the mind that this is a sorely neglected area beleiver.of GA maintenance. More on balancing if you have it, please?
Excellent video, really enjoyed the technical aspect with the Power Flow guys explanations, thanks
Josh is a film maker who happens to fly. An amazing combination.
Equal length headers with a resonator at the exit. Hot rodding 101, and it works.
I streight piped my Cessna 152 sounded good had a right chop
So, basically what you're saying is, you're slowly turning 991 into a brand new bird.
Isn’t everyone?🤣
Grandfather's axe.
Great video Josh, your plane is looking great!
Fly safe.
Wow that is awesome. And your Girlfriend, she looks to be a keeper. Getting in there and working and good looking at that.
She’s an A&P I would hope she would be okay with working on it.
Dude, you literally have THE MOST POWERFUL Cessna 172 IN THE WORLD!
Great video Josh. Very interesting stuff even tho I don't know what it all means... lol
But in the end it makes sense as you are getting better fuel economy at the same rate of speed than you were before the upgrade!
Great Video, full of content! Keep them coming Josh! Fly safe
Awesome video! Look at them arms! Must be hitting the gym!
Watching that video was pretty EXHAUSTive
Very COOL Josh, thanks for sharing!
Data, data, data. Love it!
very good Capitan 👍👍❤
Great informative video, thank you for putting all that together
? 7:10 reporting will run lean of peak with power flow! They have distanced themselves from that idea in past conversations. Surprising to hear.
Thank you very much for this video. I really love such technical Videos. Very interessting. Could you make a Video about leaning? Looking forward to your next productions with your wounderfull Copilot.
this is really good info. I've been wondering how the performance ends up
A VERY fascinating episode!!
The downside I can see here is that there were too many variables to attribute the performance gains to any one thing. Balanced the Props, Added Intake, Modified Exhaust... Together, they all gave you a great performance boost... but what would have happened if you'd just balanced your prop and put a stock exhaust and intake on, etc?
I'd say you would get the same performance with lower vibration. I'd like to see the difference the intake made alone, if it's big enough to be quantified.
A prop balance won't make any difference in performance. The K+N airfilter will. As will the PowerFlow exhaust.
It's good to know that the performance boost from the tuned exhaust is a well documented, and very real "thing" .
Great video. I liked and appreciated how thorough the guys at PowerFlow Systems are at the work they do. If you were to directly amortize the cost for your system and based on 200 hours a year of flying, how long will it take for you to recuperate your cost for this upgrade? I know you will not be able to figure out how much less wear you will have on your engine but I believe it allows your payback to be even faster. I am curious about what other types of upgrades a GA pilot could do with their plane to get enhancements in the productivity?
cant wait for the next video
I don’t understand a lot of the technical mumbo-jumbo here, but Chelsea and the clouds sure are pretty to look at.
I like the longer episodes great information if I ever buy an airplane
We are going to go Fast & Furious, but on airplanes now. YES!!!
Very impressive performance improvement 😁👌👏👏👏👏❤️❤️
Good stuff.
Nice video...and data collection and analysis.
I just installed a Power Flow on my 1971 Cessna 172, and I got 125 extra RPM
I wish they would have discussed why you can't run Lean Of Peak with stock exhaust but you can with Power Flow.
I was going to point out that that wasn't a fair comparison. I don't know why he couldn't have run LOP with the other (or any) exhaust.
You are able to run LOP with stock exhaust, but likely not as smooth or as lean.
All fuel-powered, non-electric engines available to date are just air pumps. Better the flow = better efficiency as proven you the data collected. Good job all the way around.
I'd be curious to know the effect of the PowerFlow by itself. Josh made three changes (new air inlet/filter, PF system, and dynamic prop balancing) simultaneously so parsing out how much of the improvement is due to each is difficult.
Answering my own question; from Darren Tilman (President, PFS), the prop balancing has essentially no impact on performance (it's more about vibration), the filter adds about 10 RPM, and all the rest is the PowerFlow. Also, if you're thinking about getting a PF, you might want to hold off until OSH when I believe that they will be re-running their SnF promotion (the more orders they get during the show, even online, the more you save). Just sayin'... 💲💲💲
As an ultralightaircraft/motorglider pilot the idea of being a couple of miles off the coast, having fixed landing gear makes me a little queasy to say the least.