NEACE coached a Senna player... the Rank 1 Senna reacts (INFORMATIVE!)
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- čas přidán 14. 10. 2022
- NEACE coached a Senna player so I decided to see if he knew what he was talking about! The Rank 1 player reacts to NEACE coaching!
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#Neace #Senna #LeagueOfLegends - Hry
GOOD VID!!
Thanks big guy
@@i0kiVids The Neace respect i love it he deserves it, i do think its pricy but he has his reason hope you guys ever do a collab that would be fire asf
Haha love you both. So painful to watch all my mistakes for the 100th time, but it hurts so good.
Neace, please make a video of you reacting to this, I need it
If he didn’t charge $350 he would have too many people to coach… Look up supply and demand people. He wouldn’t charge 350 if people weren’t paying it lol
Now I want Neace reacting to i0ki reacting to Neace coaching
and then I would react to him reacting to me coaching
@@i0kiVids lmao legendary content 100% 🤣😂
@@i0kiVids I need it in my life, i0ki, make it true, and I will die in pizza
@@i0kiVids Na, then he invites you to be the Senna Specialist and you coach him on the champion. I'm not joking he does do this! Would be awesome to see.
@@i0kiVids And so the content cycle continues...
If you actually want to learn a TON about Senna and how to Support in general, make sure you watch this ENTIRE video! Let me know your thoughts down in the comments!
VOD vs LIVE coaching:
I agree you can teach the concept and explain in depth with just vod, BUuuuuT..... live gives you the on the fly, how you need to actively be thinking in the moment while under fire experience.
It’s like learning how to box from a BOOK VS going to the gym and getting professionally trained and sparing
@@shintori2808 Could always just do both like Lathyrus does. Pretty sure he will go through a game with someone and then go through the vod after. Also I think that generally the people getting coached never take anything in when they are being spoken to during the game. The amount of coaching vids I've seen where someone is being told what to do and they just don't do it is kind of nuts.
This was amazing. Sone great info to have
loved this. please, please, please, do this kind of content more often. I main senna but i'm stuck in silver, and i've learned a lot just from this one video. I watch you play all the time and i keep wishing i was as good as you, but I simply am not. This vid was extremely helpful and I would love to see more like it, even with your perspective on other champions. Support is my main/fav role, and I struggle with champions that are JUST support and don't have damage. Thank you for making this vid. Love your content.
Also, my GF thinks you're cute XD
@@ashrannafkhiend9728 is your girlfriend single?
This is definitely the most helpful and informative support/senna vid I’ve seen. So much good info on positioning and warding. Also helpful tips on senna specific things like ward q and ultis. I don’t know who neace is but I love that you are basically giving this person free coaching to fix/clear up things they paid a stupid high amount for. Coming from you, someone who actually plays a lot of Senna, is going to be so much help. Also, I don’t know what happened in champ select but I would’ve at least asked to we the runes they were using just to see what they are so you aren’t asking while the game is already going. Maybe just me. Great video from the GSA!
Edit: I also didn’t realize crit was better than lethality on senna now so thank you for that (I’m definitely not big into meta since I’m still learning how to play better and knowing how all the champs work since I’m pretty new to the game)
Dude big brained they system and got a free Ioki coaching
Actually though LOL
I only recently started playing and I think this is one of the best support vids I've seen yet! You don't talk down and are super concise w the information! Thanks for the vid ^_^
Glad you enjoyed!
@@morssusurri8316 bro did you even watch the video? Also it's strange that the actual coach who he is reacting to enjoyed the video and thought it was very informative and well done. What a world lmao
Just a perspective about efficiency in coaching, live vs. VOD: You are right that there is a higher level of efficiency in some ways for VOD reviews. And most people need a mixture to learn anything, especially when thinking about concepts. But VOD's are doing something called cold change. In counselling we talk a lot about this where the counsellor room relies on non-aggravated states (cold) to talk through issues, when in reality those issues happen when emotions are high (hot - or with an activated neural system changing your perception).
Cold change is good and helpful and maybe even better for the higher level, macro-level understanding, but what NEACE does with his life coaching service is provide an avenue for hot change, which can be more helpful for execution learning because there are nerves.
Just thought I'd share as I think this is a nuanced way to talk about the differences you have with Neace, recognizing why each style works or doesn't for difference clientele.
I liked the advice. Ward tips were great. I catch myself warding for no reason as well.
As a senna main, I find going to watch your videos as one of the best sources to learn how to play Senna. This video, by far, has been one of my favorites in terms of how much information and detail has been given in the mindsets needed for warding, each of Senna's abilities, and microeconomic management of all things Senna. Thanks for posting this video and I hope to see more like this.
Good stuff! Now I look forward to see coaching a coaching a coaching session.
Amazing coaching. I’d love to see more videos like this for other supports in different elos. Keep up the great content!
iOKi, love your channel and your gameplays. I have to say though, I really think you are at your best when you do these educational videos, the way you break it down and explain things is really high quality man. Great vid! Would love to see more like this!
I'm so glad I started watching your vids, you add so much to the FFS, and your own channel is a gem. You are so smart, with quick analysis. in the group vids you use both your wits and your quick humor. Especially compared to neace, its like his mind is in slow motion, and he misses so much. Of course it is a live coaching, so its different, but now I totally see why you like coaching a VOD
Bro i follow you a few months ago. i can say that i have learn many of the game fundamentals cause of you, so thank you for everything.
And it's curious than just the other day i watch a Neace video randomly and now you just react and comment one of his couching videos, so crazy!
Keep it up with the good work!
Greetings from Chile 🇨🇱
I appreciate that!
Man, I watched this vid last night. Really awesome coaching. So many useful general tips that can be applied to low elo rather than Senna herself. It's the mindset that differentiates low from high. Great video!
Love to hear this, Ryan!
@@i0kiVids I know it's not really your standard content but I do think you would have a market for this. I feel like I've learned a ton from watching you and you/heiz (even if you are goofing off a lot, the concepts still apply the majority of the time)
The video I learned the most from!! Such good content!! Hope you will be more videos like this :)
This coaching was so insightful and well explained, I learned so much from it thankful ♥️
Never watched a coaching video in my life and after playing since season 4, I can honestly say I've learned a good few things from this one video. My peak is diamond 4, looking forward to check out more of these.
Such a great vid. Thanks pal
You should really thank that guy that tweeted this idea to you, it was a great idea.
And that was a good call on your part to see it and actually make the vid
You should absolutely make this a series
Great content! Keep it up
Sincerely,
An ADC main 😘
With all that's going on around Neace, I think this vid was super professional and informative. Good vid!
I0ki I would love to see more vod review videos as a low Elo new player I found this super helpful
I actually enjoy these types of videos ALOT! These are so informative and help getting better and the game more than the usual videos. Both have their place of course but if the algorithm doesn’t screw you over posting vids like this, more of them would be greatly appreciated! Much love i0ki ❤
Great video!
i don’t play support (mostly mid/jg) but your game knowledge is super helpful for everything, great vid
i think by concept we have a problem here... Neace teach how to macro and how u have to approach the game by identify your win con. on the other hand, u talk about how to maximize the use of the champion. it's a totally diferent thing
Yeah it is. But with Neace pricing his coaching so highly, you'd think there would be more champion specific things that he would bring up. Realistically anyone still paying for his coaching is a moron with too much money since he just repeats himself in pretty much every session. IWillDominate said he stopped coaching because he felt like he was just repeating the same stuff over and over and Neace is at the same point.
I mean tbf, not standing in front of a hook champ isn’t exactly super specific to Senna is it
@@darkdemon9013 No, he prices his coaching so high is because so many people are buying. Even at $300+ a pop he's always sold out.
I love ur style of coaching. “What’re you doing bro???” Lol
great! finally some good advices for senna !
I love your Senna coaching session and surely will look to try her out in some games again. For me it feels so hard to play her though, with other squishy immobile champs like Zyra, Brand, Swain, they seems so much easier to play, I got caught? No problem, press all my buttons, and usually somebody from the enemy team die from my empowered plants or I one shot them, if I have zhonyas, I can usually outplay most assassins that goes into my face, but with Senna, it feels like I try to land an auto attack, and I just die for it.
Live coaching is just a different ball game than retrospective analysis. Both are really helpful and should be used together to achieve max results. People learn in different ways. Some people have harder time integrating retrospective information to their actual play while learning fast through live coaching. Neither of these coaching approaches does the same alone as they do separately and also neither of them do that of what they do together. In retrospective analysis you can point out a crazy amount of information available, while in live coaching it is REALLY limited what you can communicate and guide the student in. If you do too much, the student can't even play the game and its a disaster. In sports they do analyze, watch fights, find mistakes but you also have to spar and listen to the cornermen. Quality does not come in quantity of information but in lessons learned ;) Never compare live coaching with retrospect guys, nice video thanks
Excellent format
i agree. i think reactive coaching is better as well. because they can then see WHY to do something differently and what happens when you dont it wrong.
live coaching has great advantages, you can see live how the client respond, and adapt to your demands, very important to analyse him
"the game begins at 0 seconds" expect for the fact that it literally has a barrier around the well until 15 seconds
15 seconds to shop 😅
LIGHT MODE **hisses** MY EYES!!
42:44 flamin Zwag when he's not even here. For shame. Great video. I don't play much support but there's quite a bit of little tips that never even crossed my mind. Even outside of support there's plenty to learn here.
Free coaching session poggers :)
Two of my favorite streamers, one downto earth senna otp, the other a fellow military streamer that has a hard shell. Love it
Neace is a vet? I dont know much about the guy I've just seen a video here or there.
Big thing I've learned from this vid even after religiously watching all i0ki Senna vids over the years - don't E to speed yourself to get somewhere. I did this often, a bad habit of "that one second advantage is important!" Not with Senna's E. Thanks for the vid!
I'd love to see a collab between you two.
Sometimes Neace does "Neace gets coached" by people who are experts on certain champs (5fire Yone, Karesmi Kayne, Broxah Lee Sin, etc.) It would be dope to see you coach him on Senna.
What elo is this...
Quick comment. I’m pretty sure neace does vid reviews at the end of the session. I agree it’s still not a perfect teaching strategy, but it’s a good one. He’s trying to teach the player good habits LIVE and then critiquing the mistakes afterwards
26:51, best line "people in league of legends haven't developed object permanence" beautiful.
Bro, this legit made me pick up Senna as an alt and I have been enjoying it so much. So much good info in here and I made a Draven's life a living hell.
LOVE TO HEAR IT!
Hope is live video, but if it is not... let me say, try to fix the audio. I had to do a lot of ups and downs volume on my headphones. Thanks for the video!
I main jg but I learned a lot about senna listening to you. She seems very solid.
There’s a couple champs that can get that first plate, but not many. Tristana maybe can, sett top sometimes can, maybe garen. There’s not many though, because you basically need both a good wave state already, a champ that has good early stats l, and an auto attack reset or bonus turret damage of some sort. And you need to be able to kill a lone jungler fan king after you’ve just won a fight against a laner. There’s not many champs that fulfill all those requirements.
hey i0ki, random question, ive been picking up senna and using your build and with the new eclipse do you still buy that after the changes? i dont play much league so i can never keep up with the meta, do you buy eclipse or is the tank senna in your recent video the meta?
I go crit Senna, Kraken Slayer is OP
"Don't throw the W where Kayne is, throw it where Kayne is going to be"
- Sun Tsu
IM DYING this video is the most entertaining thing ever I love when you say zac do you hear me at 21:41
This was really helpfull,
I'm pretty sure Neace also does post game vod reviews, I've heard him talk about it in his videos. Pretty sure that's why it's so expensive, it's live coaching AND a vod review, both of high level
Yea he does vod reviews while in queue of previoud games, and after game on important spots. 75,% of the coaching doesn't make CZcams
to add to your control ward thing
I as a jungler always have an eye on objectives, and I love control wards in the pit. Each control ward doesn't just give you vision, it denies them vision equal to one ward; so as a jungler, when we have a control ward down, I know that for them to steal it's pretty much a dice roll each time
Gonna keep these lessons in mind
10:00 Dont outplay, let them outplay themselves
19:34 Punish mistakes
25:17 Mirror movement
32:20 Stun in front to force enemy to stop
So you mean literally watch Neace?
It is sad how underrated i0ki is tbh. I wish you all the best i0ki!
need an ioki pyke coaching vid!
Could we see a video of you trying the #1 Senna NA’s senna build? Duoking1 builds defensive boots, Lockett, BORK, rageblade. And takes typical fleet page with absolute focus and gathering secondary
Duoking is extremely good at Senna, I'll be checking out a Locket build soon.
I feel like the bork is the questionable part not locket. But manamune > locket > umbral sounds fun. Basically subbing locket for iokis moonstone senna
@@droid5785 not my build lol, the top ranked senna runs it. Wanted to see what Ioki thinks as another high ranked senna player
The thing about live coaching is, you force a player to either break a bad habit by changing their focus and mindset OR when they make a mistake or bad play, you teach or guide them out of it.
That's what I notice since I watch Neace videos. Neace does say often that you got to learn to play. What he's really saying is learn to notice opportunities, adapt/adjust to situation/circumstances, and how to recover. Teaching you while you play, although harder because the person with the problem is at the driver seat... However if you play like shit, easier to learn to notice your mistake in that moment and fix it then recap with vid to reinforce it. Like learning to drive... Extremely hard to learn to drive by just learning the drivers manual.
Learning from pre recording coaching does help but it's like studying for a test... Everyone hates studying for a test, almost everyone usually hands on/on the job training and then later reflect and learn from the experience.
Good vid. Advice from two people from different POV.
Love the vid bro, only thing id say is like match making and champion picks are where like most silvers go wrong. Im no pro or challenger but what helped me reach plat was learning silver bullshit. For example, veigar rengar vs Morde Kayn is essentially asking to lose just because veigar is a late game dominator but early game turret hugger, now hes playing in the longest lane hes doomed for going past that first brush x)
I think neice focuses on not over loading the player with facts and tips. He goes more in depth after the game but ultimately focuses on three or four major issues.
He works on mainly macro decisions on what to do where to rotate what’s good and bad and doesn’t really focus on micro such as CDs mana cost etc etc
@@DLoading1477 That's so weird. You can focus on macro decisions much better after the game where you can pause and think about the current situation, while you can't really do anything about mana usage, cd management and micro after the game. Sure you can talk about it but you can't change it after the game. So why doesn't focus on those things while live coaching? I think the live coaching is completely useless anyway, but how Neace does it is even more ineffective.
@@anniekujo it's a misconception to say neace doesn't talk about micro, he does, but most losses happen due to decision making, aka macro. He WILL harp on really important micro stuff in games, when it's relavant to winning, or depending on the students level and goals. However, the macro IS his bread and butter, because that IS where most games are won or lost. And the reason he does it while LIVE is because it gives the student an chance to hear and see and FEEL how those decisions lead to a win. He WANTS them to win the games he is coaching, and then they break it down much more in depth after. I agree that MOST people shouldn't be spending a DIME on ANY coaching, because all the resources you need to reach gold or even plat are already available for FREE here on CZcams. On top of that, I am willing to bet 95% of people are not vod reviewing on their own regularly
@@TheWbhaugs I agree, very good comment. You gave me a good perspective on this. I remember when I first vod reviewed I started realizing so much things, but then I also realized how many people don't vod review. It's really sad because this is where you learn the most. But coming back to the coaching, it does make more sense if you want your client to feel the impact of certain decisions. But I still think it's kind off sub optimal because of 2 reasons. 1 You gotta concentrate when playing the game. Having someone watch over your shoulder and talk in your ear while you are playing, would make me really uncomfortable and nervous. 2 You should make your own decisions. It is way easier to spott the problem of someone when the person is making their own decisions. I never said that Neace never talks about micro, I'm well aware that macro is the most important thing in league and that you should definitely focus on that. But my point was that focusing on macro while live coaching is not really effective, since the student doesn't really have the time to think about it. You can talk about macro after the game so he can adapt and take this information into the next game but if he does live coaching then it would be more effective concentrating on micro. Small example: Student gets always hit by skill shots, so Neace tells him to click closer to his character so his mouse doesn't travel a long distance and he can dodge skill shots easier (Yes I'm aware that this can also be taught in vod reviewing, but this only strengthens my point that live-coaching is kinda useless).
Ioki you think you can do pyke like this or nah, or any recommendations
i love watchin neace content
Question, aren't Crit builds for support senna really hard to get since there expensive? Curious to know.
Yes they are. Kraken Slayer is 300 more gold than Duskblade, has no ability haste, and has less healing capability since Q scales with lethality. Frankly, Support Senna should be building her mythic item last, as her utility is more valuable than her damage is, unless the rest of your team lacks damage. Umbral should still be her first item followed by either Chainsword vs heal champs, Serpent's Fang vs shield champs, LDR vs tanks, or Maw vs AP champs. Then, go either RFC or Wardstone and then finally your mythic.
Yeah, Senna can be played with a lot of suboptimal or niche runes and builds. I personally ran first strike with the old Duskblade+Storm Razor, was mostly experimenting with a oneshot build in a smurf account, quite fun ngl...
I appreciate that you are giving him free couching.
I like how he prefaced this
at 13:20 when i play support and am in a situation like that, i just hit the tower 2-3 times to get gold from my supp item and then go back, is it still good to do that, or dont waste time and just go back on the spot?
My 2 favorite streamers! I know you like vod reviews, but I think the interaction talking, and seeing how people move their camera has a lot of value too.
Could we get a video of you playing dark harvest senna?
I like how you labeled this one (INFORMATIVE) as if every video I have ever seen you do has not been.
if you do one of these videos again can you maybe turn their volumes up a little? Your voice was clear and all, but I had to have the video on full volume so I could hear the other coaches views. love the video otherwise!
Yep will do
Spikes are a Sonic thing 😂
21:40 haha. I hear you I hear you! Ok fine!
My mans just finessed his way into an extra free coaching
The thing is that the man Neace himself said he don't think his coachings are worth the price. he just raised the costs to get more free time but people still kept buying the sessions.
I think there is some benefit to a live coaching in that you can sometimes see and feel the direct benefit of the instruction. Especially if the player has developed bad habits. I think it works well for lower elo. For higher elo, I think vod reviews are much more effective.
What's the benefit of live coaching compared to vod reviewing? Like what can you do in live coaching what you can't in vod reviewing, which will give you a clear benefit?
One thing that is very useful for live coaching is when he pushes the client to limit test once fed. They are usually very hesitant and passive. It's one thing to have a coach tell you over vod review to take fights, but it's another to have him push you live and for you to see the results yourself. It also makes them more likely to try it in the future.
@@dan-wp8ls This is a actually a good reason. But nothing that can't be done in vod reviewing, you can also tell them that they should generally play more aggressive and limit test more, if they are ahead. The only difference is that he isn't doing this instantaneous.
Don't use Q to clear wards noted. But would I use it for taking towers? is that ok?
i'm loving all these coaching, coaching neace videos. Neace isn't a botlane main, clearly.
I know people don't want to get into the drama, but people don't seem to realize that Neace is popular. I started watching him when he was relatively small, not tiny, but no where near what he is right now. The dude use to charge like 20 bucks I think at one point for coaching, then he bumpped it up. People learned from and liked the content, and so more people signed up for coaching.
Next thing you know he is booked up for a month. Supply and demand people its as simple as that. The demand is high, but there is only him, unless you go with one of the coaches that he has vetted. So the prices have to go up. He's said this in a video some time ago.
If you come in looking to learn and improve, and leave your ego at the door. Neace is gong to devote that hour or whatever you've paid for to you. He's going to point out what he feels is needed, and that all depends on your level of play. The higher up the ladder you are the more he is going to nit-pick, where as the lower you are the more hes going to hammer into you the basics.
You don't like the prices, the don't purchase his services. He has other coaches to choose from, and there are several other organizations that have really good coaches as well. Proguides i've used them many times for TFT coaching, and that took me from struggling to get to gold, to I make plat in a decent ammount of games, adn i'm just going casual with the game right now.
Watch Neace's content, and Ioki's and make up your own mind. Stop letting these other people trying to get views, or start some drama make up your mind for you.
It makes me really happy Hearing ioki thrash the lethality build
Back when i was a support main and played senna support/adc i always went crit on her
And then i just kept playing crit even when everyone else played lethality
I wish more adcs would watch your coaching...a few days ago I had an insanely toxic adc, who died after solo pushing a lane and blamed me for it (because obviously I should have stayed with him and died to his horrible macro too). He even added me after the game to continue wishing me death, telling me to uninstall and hoping for my family to get cancer (: It really had me take a break from league, even tho its literally my favorite game. But that's how gaming with other people works I guess haha
People are so toxic to supports just because they’re supports. I had someone flame me for not body blocking them when they died in a 1v3 when I was on ashe support with half health. Not only can i not rotate to you but we would just both die. They get mad when you take their cs they were gonna miss anyways. ADC players are so bad sometimes. Also, my first game I was in a 5 stack with me, 2 people who’d been playing about a month and 2 gold players. Enemy adc TF added me after and flamed me for being bad and boosted (I got first blood on him and then ended like 2/12). Just take the loss and get off atp
They'll blame supports for anything and everything they do wrong in lane because they cant blame themselves and take initiative, dont listen to them, adcs are absolutely toxic and being a sup main, I dont even solo queue unless im duoing with my friends or 5 manning, I've had people pinging me and blaming me for not healing even though i was dead?? You cant do anything abt it
@@alzwai bro its not just adcs lol like i cant count ho many times a support has inted the lane and then blamed me for it and then the team just agrees and starts flaming me aswwell and then just never showed up bot again or got killed like twice and proceed to stay base... like i dont think u can objectly pick whats the most toxic right, and this is coming from someone who plays both
@@MrEedduu11 i never specifically stated ONLY adcs are toxic, and im sorry if you misinterperted it as me only aiming it at adcs commenting under an adc rant but ok lol, i too play both when i want to, but i aint the only one who commented under this comment so why only target me?
ADCs in particular seem to suffer from "main character syndrome".
My league started to show up as a black screen when i try to load a game. SO I kinda stopped playing. Still having fun watching your senna content from time to time. Kinda miss playing Senna.
You guys complete each other
do you think that duskblade can be better than eclipse for senna now?
40:40 He was aiming it at Sivir and he was a little bit slow. You can tell his reactions aren't very fast I wouldn't be big on blaming him for it. There's a bit of queuing and cast time here, it's true that Kayn is leaving as he's casting but think about when he's actually pressing the button it was literally less than 45 frames, pressing comma on YT it was less than 12 but idk how good YT frame search is in relation to the actual game being played. [For those that don't know if you pause a video you can go frame by frame with comma and period. But video frames are different than game frames even if being run at the same amount, but not by much in that case, and I don't know what frames Zack is playing at, Neace is watching, and then i0ki is watching, :( I have 3 degrees of separation.]
I put my consumables on 5, my line of thinking is my finger is right there and R is my least used ability (unless I'm kass or something)
40:37 didnt you see the enemies in narnia xD
Do you have any tips on leashing and autoing on senna without taking a lot of damage? I feel like every time I walk up to auto I get taken to half health lane phase. I know q and fleet can help with sustain but when I see you do it you take a lot less damage and trades. Same as when I fill jhin bot
When the enemy adc walks up to last hit the next minion, that's the time where you can attack the enemy without him trading back. Just make sure to watch your minions health and you'll have a very easy time poking your enemys.
very good video
42:14 _"Before you do the objectives, push the waves"_ I always say that but nobody listens (in high silver at least :D)
"absolutely people at this elo don't think about the level 2" i think about it and i'm in bronze
Im pretty sure that NEACE's coaching involves vod reviews? Please correct me if I am wrong.
Sometimes he does, sometimes he doesn't.
Just like sometimes he will go into practice tool and teach ADCs how to tether, othertimes he'll just scream at them in live even if they have no idea what tethering is.
There's really no consistency in his coaching. Sometimes he provides a lot of good info,other times he's the equivelant of paying an eGirl to sleep on mic.
I'm silver and lvl 2 is one of the most important things I try to manage every game. ^^
love your content but the LIGHT MODE CZcams WHY??? lol
this kinda highlights the importance of finding the RIGHT coach for you. I'm not saying don't take Neace on as a coach but you definitely wanna find a coach who excels at the position/champion you play or want to get coached on because they'd probably have a lot better insight than most other coaches out there.
i0ki is scary at coaching, we should give him credit (or else).
Obviously the person being coach reallyyyyy neeeed to be coached, seriusly. So, good for him!
who isn't a mario guy? a SONIC GUY!!!!
I learnt a new word too, Pinglish.
Sometimes i wouldn’t base after my first push. I would have a level advantage on my opponent.