Choosing between the FX6, A7s III and FX9 | Part 1 - Ergonomics and features
Vložit
- čas přidán 30. 06. 2024
- Sony FX6: www.proav.co.uk/sony-fx6-cine...
Sony FX9: www.proav.co.uk/sony-fx9-6k-f...
Sony A7s III: www.proav.co.uk/sony-a7s-iii
Watch part 2 here: • Choosing between the F...
This video was filmed using:
Main Camera - Canon C500 MKII: www.proav.co.uk/canon-eos-c50...
Lens - Canon 24-70mm f2.8L II USM: www.proav.co.uk/canon-ef-24-7...
Audio - Sennheiser AVX-ME2 Set: www.proav.co.uk/sennheiser-av...
Contact our Sales Team
Email: Sales@proav.co.uk
Tel: +44 (0) 1442 292929
ProAV Website: www.proav.co.uk/
Follow us on Twitter: / proav
Follow us on Facebook: / proavtv
Follow us on Instagram: / proavuk
Follow us on LinkedIn: / proav-uk
Follow Carl on Instagram: / carl_proav
Follow Carl on Facebook: / carl.proav
00:00 Intro
01:38 FX6 Vs A7s III
08:08 FX6 Vs FX9
15:00 Conclusion - Krátké a kreslené filmy
I've pre-ordered an FX6 for the simple reason of this, it's the best choice for my career (cinematographer for short films, commercials, corporate videos etc.), and it has so many things I love about the A7S3 in a body as capable as the FX9, and the sad fact is, I need a camera that looks like this to be more client impressive. You wouldn't believe the amount of jobs I have lost just because of the look of my older mirrorless cameras, even when my showreel is "better" than who they ended up choosing.
I think a lot of people underestimate how a larger video style body can impact how much a client perceives how their money is being spent. A bigger camera does have a bit of a wow factor, but thats not to say there isn't a place for smaller mirrorless cameras in the world of video.
Dan
@@ProAVTV That's so true, to be honest if it wasn't for the client wow factor as you said, I would much rather use mirrorless cameras as they are so much more convenient for freelancing.
Very true
I’m in the same boat, currently have a couple pocket4k’s and have pre ordered the fx6, I have my concerns not having much experience with Sony but I feel like the fx6 is such a well rounded cam for my type of work. I like the larger form, 90% of my work is handheld so I’ll be making it heavier 🙃
Yeah bro I feel you. I’m getting the fx6 as A cam, and rigging out my a7siii as my B cam/Gimbal cam. I just put a cage, monitor, bigger lens on the a7siii lol but you are right about the small form factor and how it comes off to clients
Great comparaison, looking forward to the juicy stuff in part 2 :)
Amazing Review
I'm so excited for the next Part
This is a brilliant overview. Promote that guy!! Super clear and to the point. Best comparison overview I have watched to date.
Thank you, we're glad you found it useful! Part 2 has just been released if your interested: czcams.com/video/V9nPjhg6rzg/video.html
Dan
@@ProAVTV Yes will watch however as i'm from the corporate not broadcast side of things, it just makes me want the FX6 more over my FX9. Only point i'd mention is the A7S3 has IBIS which is why it doesn't have ND's and vice versa. This is actually quite a big feature if shooting with primes and want to grab some quick handheld stuff. Shame you can't have both :-)
If the larger body and broadcast features aren't needed, then the FX6 will definitely be a winner over the FX9. IBIS is fantastic for quick handheld shooting, hopefully one day they'll be a camera with both IBIS and internal ND's.
Dan
Thanks for putting the three next to each other! One observation is that because the FX6/A7SIII sensor has only very slight oversampling, I don't see how it can produce UHD resolution in all three channels after debayer. That might mean it can't be treated as EBU UHD Tier 1, unlike the FX9. It'd be really helpful if your part 2 test can look at any fine detail aliasing in 4k or UHD modes.
Can we just take a minute to appreciate the enthusiasm involved here 👏 I can’t afford any of these Sony’s but still watched the whole video anyway 👍
Thanks! Its hard not to be fairly enthusiastic when you are talking about 3 cameras as good as these...
Carl
Great Video.You are very professional.
Always struggle to have consistent foundation especially when recording for my channel. Nice vid. Thanks!👍🏽
The fact Sony didn't include one XLR on the FX6 body kills me, I understand size was limited, but it also limits my ability to add a 3rd party handle of my own, while still retaining a single available XLR. Two in-body would be preferable, but I'd take even one.
and an EVF.
Great video 💜
Really useful video again and very tempted by the FX6. Will you guys be doing the bundle with the G-master 24-105mm f/4 as a kit lens? I've seen that on some American sites but none of the English stockists seem to have that? Thanks.
This video series will likely be the most helpful for us FX9 users to decide if we should stick with the FX9 or move to the FX6. I'm really torn. I'm a very happy FX9 owner, but the FX6 does have a few features I really like. Although I'd almost rather see it in a slightly bigger body with the extra 2 audio controls and a couple more custom buttons like the FX9. Maybe once Covid dies down and work returns to normal I can justify owning both. Hahaha.
Thanks for the comparison!
Thanks for watching, be sure to keep an eye out for part 2!
Dan
I recently discovered that S35 lenses can indeed be used on the FX6 since there is the option of the smart digital zoom where it then upsamples? You could then just zoom to the level where the vignette is completely gone, according to Sony this has almost zero loss in quality - would love to see the difference to native 4k and check that out in detail! That would open up the FX6 to so much more available glass on the market!
Will the Atomos Shogun Inferno work with Sony FX6 (at 4k 60fps and Raw output via SDI) or do you have to get Shogun 7 for it to work? Thanks.
This is a great comparison. Thanks! I am on the fence between the Sony FX6 and the Canon C70. Will ProAV be doing a direct comparison between these?
Thats a request that we're getting a fair amount of currently, and is definitely something we'll be looking into!
Dan
Could you make a different specific test for rolling shutter, low light, autofocus, accurate color, slow motion, and make a zoom to see the definition in detail and noise levels?? 😃👍
Please include some recommendations in part 2 concerning the rigging of the A7S3, for example: ND filters (...or motion blur in post as alternative to ND filters), professional sound add ons (can the sound get at the same level as the FX6 with the right add-ons?), recording raw DCI 4K with the A7S3 to an external recorder, etc...
+1!
7S3 - External raw 4k with atomos ninja v. Sony XLR-K3M for pro audio. ND filter - well thats something I still on looking for
Very interested and some good points raised. Unlike the FS5, the FX6 does not seem to offer a 422 mpeg2 50 upgrade option for broadcasting. So I will be keeping the FS5 and FS7. I do lust after the FX9 however
You are right, it doesn't have Mpeg2 formats, thats reserved for the fx9
Carl
Thanks a lot for the video! Can't wait for the image quality comparison. It's between FX6, A7S3 and C70 for me. Any chance we'll see a comparison to C70 anytime soon? :)
Thanks for watching! It's something we're considering for sure, what are your thoughts between the three of them?
Dan
@@ProAVTV I want some clear recommendations about which way to use the C70 if you're not invested in any canon lenses. If you use the S35 RF lenses can you still get pleasing bokeh picking up on the client wow factor comment above? If you use FF view EF lenses is the image quality affected by the adaptor and is the AF coverage good enough for interviews?
I meant the FF RF lenses but you will be shooting in super35 mode btw
@@ProAVTV That would be awesome, thanks for considering it!
This is frustratingly difficult choice. So, here goes my thoughts:
- I like the C70 form factor the most, by far. Ideal size and ergonomics in between A7S3 and FX6. Gimbal friendly.
- C70 has XLRs in the body - a BIG bonus. Even more gimbal friendly.
- Menu system looks really sleek in the C70. I'm quite sure it's better than any of the Sonys.
- I am worried about C70 AF, tho. It's not the same DPAF II as in R5, covers only 80% of the view and I've even heard some complaints it's not even on par with C300. Bummer. AF is really important for me.
- DR and low light performance is good enough for me in all three.
- FX6 has the bragging rights about the ND system, no doubt. That alone kinda makes me lean towards FX6 at the moment. But not sure if it should...
- I quite dislike the looks of FX6. It has a bulky, plasticy 90s look...and it's too big for what you get. I mean, I don't know what's the justification for the size when A7S3 does almost the same in 1/3 the size...with IBIS and same sensor + processor.
- I would never use A7S3's beautiful view finder so I would have to actually give minus point to A7S3 for making me pay for that.
- One thing to consider is the Sony dual ISO vs Canon DGO. I am not clear which one is better. DGO works with all ISOs the same way, but not with all video modes and frame rates. Dual ISO works with all frame rates but gives the best results with only the 2 base ISOs...DARN IT! ;)
@@smallbizdigitalmedia Yeah, this is another good point. Also, You'll get a FF image if you use the EF-RF speedbooster but you're stuck with S35 with RF lenses. I want a .71x RF-RF speedbooster! ;)
Also can you tell us how rough are each? For the materials (in case they fell down) and how water resistant are each of it
It’s great they have all the same mount.
Nice video cant wait until part 2
We're glad you liked it. Part 2 will be coming later this week!
Dan
hey mike, im hearing some autofocus issues with the sony fx6 compared to the sony a7siii, i know there's touch focus tracking but just autofocus alone and following a person, is the sony fx6 reliable as the a7siii?
@@TimandLauren I'm not having any AF issues at all the only thing i wish Sony would do is add AF Tracking and the AF would be great over all but without the AF Tracking it's a bit harder to work but truthfully all cine cameras are like this or worse. I just know they would make everyones life much easier with AF Tracking.
@@town3 i see, thanks mike
Hmm trying to decide if thats a deal breaker
Image quality wise can you make both pretty similar?
@@TimandLauren I feel you can get very close but the FX6 is more detailed and cleaner noise wise in low light. To me after using them both it's really hard to make a clear decision by the image more so the form factor and types of environment you'll be using the camera in. Now knowing the cameras a bit better i would say this. If you enjoy the mirrorless form factor and don't care about the perception of the mirrorless body being small or (smh) not a professional look and you don't need all of the extra hardware XLR, ND,Timecode, bla,bla,bla I would go with the A7S3. and buy some good glass with it. I love the A7S3 the way it just works it's almost flawless to me. Image wise it looks great and its just a great work horse all around. but if your doing higher end mid professional production sometimes the look and the camera your using matter to some, not to me but to some. You'll still be able to get lots of work even professional work with the A7s3 most of the time it's about your work and who you know, personality. Anyway, the FX6 is slower to use and is made more for a controlled environment only because Sony decided not to put the AF Tracking into the camera. There's cons and pros to both cameras but I lean a bit towards A7S3 for usability and XF6 for a bit better image (not a lot but you can see it) and form factor. hope this helps lol.
Can you clarify that the FX6 will indeed record long GOP footage in 10-bit, 4:2:2? I have read conflicting information from trusted sources, some who have said that 10-bit is only available in all-intra, unlike the a7SIII.
I use the A7Siii's viewfinder all the time... but mostly because I find the flip-out screen too small to see any details. I can't imagine not being able to use a viewfinder.
What's your recommendation for third party bp-u batteries for the fx6? need a budget friendly alternatibe to the oem batteries
Great info, thanks! I assume the LCD screen loupe from the fx9 can be used on the fx6?
Thanks for watching! So we've put the loupe on the FX6 although its a tight fit, which I believe is due to the camera being a pre-production model currently.
Dan
@@ProAVTV Thanks!
@4:57 a Sony BP-U100?? That's news to me, had only experienced Sony BP-U90 batteries before as the largest
Where is part 2? Image quality comparison between A7Siii and FX6 is defo needed
Part 2 you say? It's just gone live: czcams.com/video/V9nPjhg6rzg/video.html
Dan
Great video Carl,....what are your thoughts on why the S-III and FX6 have their dual gain circuits spread soooo far apart? (the original S-III firmware had 640/16,000…thankfully somebody at Sony had th3 brains to change the final release firmware to 640/12800)
On the FX6, the “low” 0d is pre amped to equal 800 ISO. The “high” 0db is pre amped to equal 12800 ISO. To me, this seems to be somewhat crazy. This causes the middle and upper end of the first stage circuit to have way more noise then it needs. 4,000 - 10,000 are pretty bad. Shouldn’t Sony lower the second stage preamp gain to equal 4,000-6,000 ISO instead? I think the FX9 and Lumix S1H have more reasonable dual gain preamp values. 4,000 ISO fills the image quality “gap” that exists on the top end of the first stage. Yes, that would sacrifice all the crazy “25,000 ISO” values, true….but who uses those anyway? I’d MUCH prefer to have 800-6,000 range that has no severe gaps in noise performance.
Is it true the sensor in FX6 is better than A7S III? I heard Cinema Division Sensors, which are more in line with the sensor on the FX6 FX9, whereas the FX3 uses a "Consumer Line" sensor, closer to that of the A7S III.
I pre-ordered the FX6 as an A-cam for my existing A7s iii - perfect match. I love the s cine and the ND in the FX6
BUT:
as far as I know, the FX6 has no 10bit long gop codec ???!!! And will never get it ?!
I recently bought a ton of V60 sd cards for my A7s iii: 4K XAVC S 25 p is 140 Mbit/s - Perfect Codec for my long format interviews- shooting 5 to 7 hours daily on 2 cameras.
Going 10 bit 4K will result in 4 to 6 times more expensive cards and more than double the file size for the footage in the FX6... that’s a bummer !
Can you confirm, that the „non industry“ - but awesome- A7s iii long gop codecs will not see the light in the FX6?
cheers
Martin
and sorry, this should have been my first line: thank you so much for your nice work here!
Coming from the Canon XF Camcorder I'm used to using a servo zoom but it seems their are few options in the Sony Lens lineup. I see you have the FE PZ 28-135mm f/4 G OSS on the FS9 so would be interested in what you think of pairing this lens with the FX6. Also the new (and expensive) FE C 16-35mm T3.1 G E-Mount Lens does not have OSS, but I'd hope the longer focal range lens to come in this range will.
The 28-135mm you mention will be pretty much your only choice there, it works brilliantly with the FX6 (if a little large for this form factor maybe)
Carl
@@ProAVTV Is there a possibility to make the A7S3 zoom l(smoothly) like a camcorder, so the zooming can be a part of the footage?
I have ordered the 28-135 to go with my FX6, because it has true manual focus with hard stops. Unfortunately it does not have full manual zoom, like the 18-110 lens for the FS5.
The problem with using large sensor format cameras in live event settings where cameras like the Canon XF705 shine is that you will never find a lens capable of a 20x zoom and full-frame that isn't the size of a refrigerator. Canon does make a 50-1000mm cine servo lens, but it only covers s35 and costs over $70,000. These cameras are aimed at the narrative shooter; someone doing filmmaking, commercial work, music videos, interviews, etc. But if you want to film something like a concert and have the flexibility to do a slow creep zoom from the back of a theater and end up in a tight shot of the singer's face, there is still nothing that beats the 2/3" - 1" sensor cameras and their vastly superior zoom range. Just different tools for different types of productions.
@@daltonrandall4348 thanks for the answer. Not looking to shoot a concert... haha, lol. I do narrative work. Because gentle zooming can be a part of storytelling and it can be a part of the story, it would be nice to be able to zoom a "tad", not to reframe, but to emphasise something, for example on a 24-105 without touching the lens.
This question is super easy to answer without having to watch this video. choosing between the fx9, fx6 and a7siii : if you aren't in a position that you already know this answer, then you pick the a7siii, because you obviously won't benefit from the other ones if you have to ask this question. done.
Do you need sony e mount lenses to stablise in catalyst browse? Note - I plan on using Sigma 18-35 EF's through a Sigma MC-11 adaptor
No you don’t, that should work fine.
Carl
Remember that if you're using the 18-35 you'll have to crop to super 35 instead of using the full sensor, and that will change how the cameras behave quite drastically
@@gabrielmachadobsb thanks for the insight... If I use the sigma MC-11 adaptor will I have vignetting? or will it simply push my 18-35 to different focal length?
Can someone explain to me how the fx6 is really any better, in terms of video quality, than the a7siii? From what I've seen (and I"m a noob) the fx6 is just the a7siii with a built in nd filter and is bigger/more "professional looking".... but if you compared clips side by side would you really see a huge difference between the 2 cameras?
Has anyone done a dynamic range test of the Fx6 with noise reduction turned off? I’d like to see how it compares with the a7S iii’s dynamic range which always has noise reduction on
We have in our part 2 video: czcams.com/video/V9nPjhg6rzg/video.html
Dan
Any rumours from Sony (or a 3rd party) for a Hot Shoe or Audio adapter for that top connector so the FX6 can acquire audio when striped down?
None yet
Carl
None yet
Carl
I’m very hopeful for this, I’m sure someone will do it in time. I’d prefer to run a different top handle etc but obviously wanna keep audio inputs!
anyone no the best camcorder fixed lens or seperate lens for filming aircraft fast moveing stuff etc airshows that are good on sachtler video heads panning and tilting panasonic ag cx350 or sony FX6 which out of the two best for this
I've just bought an FX9 as I needed a lower noise output than my Blackmagic Ursa Broadcasts. I now feel I've made the wrong decision and a more expensive one...
Is easy, how much you got?
Test please FX6 vs FX3
If I were Sony right now, after the FX6 hype has died down, I'd release a new firmware for the FX9 that allows the processor to record 6K FF and increase some frame rates in Super 35 mode.
Also just frankly, change that stupid menu, it's atrocious. Worse than the original Alpha menus.
Use the right tool for the job
Is the FX6 better than FS7 II?
I would say so yes.
Carl
Where is the examples ?the comparison we wanna see side by side videos of those cameras , I wanna know which one is better
FX9 has the best image quality, but only goes up to 60fps on 4k. FX6 and a7s3 are basically the same (although on high ISOs a7s3 is still better, as demonstrated by Gerald Undone). But the FX6 has conveniences that the a7s3 doesn't
👏🏾🙏🏾
Test the AF in Part Two! A7s 111 will blow away the FX6 in terms of usability and touch screen tracking...
If the FX6 had IBIS, it'd be perfect.
The fx3 instead of the a7s iii would’ve been a better comparison, tbf this was filmed before it was released but I would like you guys to make an update video
The xlr's on the fx6 are NOT on the body, they are on the detachable handle. Remove the handle and there are no xlr connections at all.
The decision is easy for me. I want a proper cam thus A7siii is out. FX9 is too big, expensive, no handgrip and I prefer handhold rather than shoulder mount. FX6 is the only answer.
I think for a lot of people the video orientated body of the FX6 will be a solid reason to go for it over the A7s III, especially when they want a smaller camera.
Dan
@@ProAVTV a lot of buttons on a7s3 related to photographers and that is annoying.
i like to shoot handhold, too. But did you consider, that the FX6 has no image stabilisation? It might be difficult to shoot handheld, if you don´t use wideangel lenses. The A7SIII has image stabilisation and i think that`s really important.
@@jensuferiufermedia8457 IBIS in a7siii definitely is a bonus but FX6 being a bigger and heavier cam with side grip, I dont see the absent of IBIS a very big issue, especially when some of my lenses already have OIS and I use monopod, tripod, sliders and gimbal frequently too. For handheld shot, they usually last not more than 1 min.
During canon 5D mark ii era it also has no IBIS and I handhold frequently with no issue at all.
Why choose when you could buy all three? 🙃
Now thats a dangerous thought....
Dan
@@ProAVTV Words I SHALL NOT live by 😜
The FX6 + A7S III are the cameras for me. My shoulders and back can't take another FS7 weight camera these days!
Part 2??
It’s on its way! Dan is busy editing. Hopefully early next week it should be done and released.
Carl
Wouldn’t choose the FX9 for sure.
I think a lot of people will be thinking the same thing unfortunately. Would you choose the FX6 or A7s III?
Dan
@@ProAVTV Sony FX6. One question: Will the Atomos Shogun Inferno work with Sony FX6 (at 4k 60fps and Raw output via SDI) or do you have to get Shogun 7 for it to work? Thanks.
@@educatetube atomos b@stards ... there is no 4k120p
FX9 needs a serious firmware upgrade because it’s looking meh vs the FX6. The fact it only does 4K 30fps and does shoot 6K doesn’t help it
Fx9 does 4K 60p
@@JoshBenBernales but not in fullframe - it's cropped..
I am shocked: you call a camera like the fx6 with no evf a "professional tool"?
Of course. We sell lots of very high end cameras which do not come with an EVF out of the box. Most of RED's range, Canon's range, Blackmagic etc.
Carl
you're sooooo old man
It looks like a camcorder from the 90'. Especially that handle is really ugly. That's a huge turn off for me. Not buying untill and unless they do something about the handle design.
The FX6 just killed every other camera out there. No need to suggarcoat it.
Can you explain to me how the fx6 is really any better, in terms of video quality, than the a7siii? From what I've seen (and I"m a noob) the fx6 is just the a7siii with a built in nd filter and is bigger/more "professional looking".... but if you compared clips side by side would you really see a huge difference between the 2 cameras?
@@wcsdiaries better iso performance than the a7siii
@@wcsdiaries S-Cinetone, the ability to control NR in high ISOs.