Ancient Historian Describes The First Steppe Nomads (450 BC) // "SCALP NAPKINS and SKULL CUPS"
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- čas přidán 12. 03. 2021
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Extracts taken from The Histories by Herodotus (translated by AD Godley).
Music courtesy of:
Epidemic Sound
Artlist.io
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Image credits:
Darius Relief By Osama Shukir Muhammed Amin FRCP(Glasg) - This file has been extracted from another file: The Darius seal. Darius stands in a royal chariot below Ahura Mazda and shoots arrows at a rampant lion. From Thebes, Egypt. 6th-5th century BCE. British Museum.jpg, CC BY-SA 4.0, commons.wikimedia.org/w/index...
Scythian Archers By PHGCOM - Own work, photographed at Musée du Louvre, CC BY-SA 3.0, commons.wikimedia.org/w/index...
Man with cap By I, PHGCOM, CC BY-SA 3.0, commons.wikimedia.org/w/index...
Scythian petrogylph By Paul Munhoven - Own work, CC BY-SA 3.0, commons.wikimedia.org/w/index...
Wooden Pole © Copyright Graham Hogg and licensed for reuse under this Creative Commons Licence.
Scythian gold By Jean-Pierre Dalbéra from Paris, France - Applique de vêtement kazakh (musée Guimet), CC BY 2.0, commons.wikimedia.org/w/index...
Scythian Grave By Boris Rezvantsev - Own work, CC BY-SA 4.0, commons.wikimedia.org/w/index...
This video is a big steppe for your channel.
How dare you
YES!
It's a steppe in the right direction.
Lollerskates 😂
Hahaha great pun, brother.
Herodotus is such a kill joy. First he tells me they got shapeshifting wizards. then he tells me it's bullshit.
Lmao
Same with the men with goat feet, he's a real buzzkill
lmfao I laughed for a good while at that
@@hannibalb8276 These are from the jinn
Lmao insane@@user-xu9ji4dd4e
From now on I’m putting ‘has many scalp napkins’ on my resume.
You're hired!
Not many positions open for murderous horsemen these days though
@@chris-2496 honestly what is the world coming to?
@@gododoof Maybe a time when that will make an impressive resume? Who knows.
@@gododoof Industrialization and normalized daily harm instead of rare, intergenerational conflict?
The battles between Scythians and Assyrians must have given a whole other level of brutality to the world.
That must have been massive fuckfest of blood and skin pieces.
Also it is said that a Scythian woman was not allowed to marry till she killed five men from horse back.
It short the men will met you in spear combat, and they used their women as back up horse archers.
No doubt they took bets on how long it took their children to strangle prisoners of war.
@Blanc Neige YT has plenty of videos covering the history and culture of the Scythians. Some are a bit PC and others are very hardcore. The horses we have today didn't exist back during the bronze age, so they were semi nomadic pony riders that control herds of cattle. During that time nearly everyone was pretty ruthless. Their main religious totem was the Griffin and they had the rep of screaming like eagles when they charge into battle. Many believe that they were one of the root causes for the myths of the Amazons. The character of Xena Warrior Princess was partly base off of them.
If you want a single source, I don't have one. I had been readying about them since the late 1980's.
That moment when "rivers of blood" appearing in an ancient text may be indeed quite literal instead of a literary device
@@krispalermo8133 Yea a lot of the Women from the steppes were archers and horse riders, back in the day
Herodotus has a nice voice. Speaks good English, too.
He's clearly a classy dude.
It sounds like Frazer Douglas, who's one of the best book narrators around these days.
Assassin's creed Odyssey
that's not him it's the youtube channel pretending to beb him an it trslate from shrubby l
He is actually puerto rican
I like Herodotus. He’s like, “they say beyond the mountains are men with goats feet who sleep 6 months of the year, but I’m not buying it.”
"They say they turn into wolves one day a year. I'm dubious, but they're really insistent".
It's bullshit but I'd believe it.
It seems that he went to the Middle East because we believe that when demons are formed, they have goat feet
I too judge the best man by his collection of " scalp napkins"
Me too, though I prefer the company of people that have less of those.
Classic Herodotus.
King: I need to figure out how many people are in my lands. I know! Everyone bring me an arrowhead or I'll kill you.
King: Look everyone! I melted down the arrowheads and made a nice bowl.
Scythians: It's lovely chief, so how many did you get?
King: Oh shit I forgot to count them.
The question is, was the Scythians counting system capable to express that number?
@@unnamedchannel2202 one , two , many , lots
@@unnamedchannel2202
Scythians: It's lovely chief, so how many did you get?
King: a big bowel
Scythian Town Cryer: The result of the King's census is that we have 1 big bowel of people living in Scythia.
Scythians: Yay!?!
@@snuscaboose1942
modern humans: Maths is so complicated!
Scythians: What's wrong with you?
me: Rougly a million pointy bits at 10 gramms each ... uhm ... that's a truck load! A huge truck load to be precise! ;-þ
He just wanted a shitton of bronze for his work of art, and didn't want to make it too obvious that he was levying a tax.
so basically, they made their kings into * checks notes * a giant sausage for burial
Scythian Dude: "Ah, I can be the royal cup-bearer... how hard can that be?"
Rayrard you're up the king just died.
I always remember how Herodotus was like "Ye these dudes are polygamous and love to hotbox smoking weed, also btw they make cloaks of human skins"
Gotta be high to smell rotten skins, and use fragrant oils and incense. Bleh. Gross.
I don't mind
@@Sk0lzky don’t mind what, Herodotus, the weed, the polygamy, the cloaks made of human skin or all the above?
@@garrettallen7427 If you throw in blind slaves, all of the above.
Your comment made my day!!!
For a people that didn't have a written language, the symbolic act of creating a large vessel from countless small arrowheads is a fascinating insight into a culture vastly different from ours today. Certainly more poetic than a number written on a piece of paper.
They do look like kind friendly chaps.
@Ed Ducate no their not scyths lived in Europe and with hunnic invasion were pushed deep into Europe were they became some modern europeans afghans are related but not exactly them
@@l5475 scythian already dissolved before hunnic invasions took place
@@pinkyfinger9851 dissolved into Sarmations which are genetically very similar but with more european
@@l5475 bs scythians went all over Asia and even India
@@l5475 Alexander the great father Philip stopped the scythians invasion in to Europe
Jeez, I had no idea, Paul the apostle was really being edgy when he mentioned "Scythians".
Those guys were friggin brutal.
This description makes me grateful to be living in modern times
Someone's going to say that about us, too. 🤭
I guess it’s a good thing that they are no longer around
At least you’re honest about your cowardice.
@@faramund9865 Settle down keyboard commando.
@@twonumber22 I complimented him for honesty. I'd never admit that I'd be a cuck of civilization even if I was. If only it was for the reason to keep my own spirit up.
At 7:45 someone got lost in translation.
How to describe people roaming those cliffs with ease other than saying they have goat's feet?
How to describe the arctic winter other than it's a 6 months long night?
How was it in the actual greek text i wonder...
Saw Scalp Napkins supporting Slayer. Great gig.
Robert Howard and George RR Martin must have been inspired by Herodotus for a lot of their fictional worldbuilding.
no doubt. definitely some steppe people
They were.
The tale of the tyrannical king's sons being secretly baked into his pie and eating it, as vengeance for his killing of a man's family, was obviously taken from one of Herodotus' many stories. IIRC, it was in regards to an old tale told to him of a past king in Asia Minor in Herodotus' Histories.
They were inspired of much the legends of the ancient world hence “hyboreans” -> hyperboreans for example
I would like to hear more of Herodotus's writings, other ancient Greeks too. Especially Aristotle.
I believe Herodotus wrote something about Scythians who were enslaved by the Assyrians, they rose up and fought with the Assyrians.
Greek the only religion they teach in school. :(
Hey Zeus.
Odin said Mankind was made from Wood, morning Wood Nature magic.
Ash and Elm Æ
Adam and Eve Æ
Fingerprints and Woodrings.
Holly- Wood has deep roots , it's parasitic with poison berries just like the Mistletoe nightmare.
Our botanist Idunn & her apples were kidnapped by Loki and Giants .
Yes, his writings are indeed very fascinating. However, we should take everything he writes with a grain of salt. Remember, historical records were written with a different perspective than today, and Herodotus often excagerrates, and makes up aspects in his writings. But he is the best we have got, and it is interesting to understand how people saw the concept of history before:)
@@Jon.alfred Yeah, plus a lot of it was hearsay, 10+ people from the original account. That being said it is still probably more accurate than CNN.
@@Jon.alfred
Yeah, with several grains of salt. It wasn't his intention to try and find the truth behind his stories. His main interest was to collect stories and publish what he thought was interesting. What is really cool about this is that sometimes he accidentally comes up with accurate accounts he himself doesn't believe in. The phoenician circumnavigation of Africa for example.
@@Nazdreg1 Yeah, the modern concept of history was not «invented» yet. Thats interesting, though. He accidentaly verstes accurate sources. I did not know that.
"Why were the ancient Slavs hiding and building cities and villages in swamps and dense forests?"
*Ancient scythian gallops with human skin saddle and scalp napkins while high on marihuana*
Berlin name comes from Slavic(Polabian) word for "swamp" and the fact that the city is now the capiatal of Germany explains well why Slavs were building strongholds in hard to get "swamps" and lakes(like for example stronghold in Biskupin 747-748 BC which was located in the middle of a lake)...
@@Bialy_1 I know my Slavic history Beli.
I also know why half the Serbs went south and the rest are now either assimilated or dead with a meagre population of 80.000 remaining in Luzica.
There is no such thing as ancient Russia because during ancient times the slavs did not populate modern Russia...
@@alekshukhevych2644 Do you mean that the Keivan Russ are not slavic? Are slavic people seperate from the viking tribes of the Russ?
@@olliefoxx7165 Slavic people don't equal eastern Scandinavian sea bandits.
In Serbian saying "Skita" means when someone walk/live around wast land. When you say "Nemoj da skita okolo" It means "Dont let him wonder around(usually city)"
I love Serbian Culture 😻😻😻 I especially love the story of Dorde Martinovic. My mother used to tell me about his adventures before night time, god bless her soul.
Старобългарският език има глагол "скитати" - скитам.
In Hungarian it's séta but not that specific, it just means (a rather slow)walking.
Can you imagine scoring the job of cook to a geriatric old scythian chief, you just know that your day's are numbered.
I can't stop watching your videos. I discovered your channel last week and thats the best thing that happened to me thus year. Thank you for this great content
MAROC
I absolutely love this channel...always interesting.
Herodotus: *casually mentions* "the Scythians blind all their slaves..."
Me: 😲 😨 😭
I think another source recorded the same, but I have a hard time believing it was a universal or common practice. What good is a slave that can't see his work?
@@copperlemon1 likely a punishment for the ones who tried to escape, blindy them then would make sense but how useful they would be afterwards would be debatable
Fun fact the Byzantines captured 15 000 Bulgarian soldiers in a battle, removed their eyes except for every 100th who was left with one eye and released them. The 1/100 one eyed pridoners were tasked with guiding the remaining blind ones home.
@@antonioklaic4839 Those were brutal times. In 1201 Bulgarian Tzar Kaloyan took Odessos (Varna) and buried alive byzantine garison and citizens in the moat of the fortress. After that he was called a "Romanslayer"
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Varna_(1201)
@@alexmag342 Well they probably tethered them to poles and used them for 'entertainment' purposes - no point in being barbaric if you can't also be degenerate!
Great video as always! I really enjoy the "Outsider in a foreign land" accounts, Even if you can tell they have biases from their own culture that we already know a bit about, it can be pretty funny and interesting
Astonishing stuff as always. Cheers.
Ever heard of the Konungs skuggsjá(Kings mirror)? A pretty cool circa 1250 norwegian book that goes on a lot of stuff concerning geography, norwegian culture and customs, huscarls and how they should behave ,warfare and more. I am pretty sure that there is one public domain translation thar you can google but i belive that it is a quite old translation.
This is the first time that I read the source before you made a video on it.
The Scythians were surely a fine nomadic people back in the day. Nice video.
You guys have one of the greatest channels around
beautifully made thank you
Rimworld level shit right here!
How can you deduce the population of your kingdom, when you have an arrowhead for every man, woman and child in your kingdom?
a) Count the arrowheads
b) Smelt the arrowheads down, make a bowl, then make a guess based on the size of the bowl
🤷♀️
This telling by Herodotus is simply Amazing! Today’s society is so far removed from these various lifestyles of ancient peoples (and thankfully! So barbaric) but just to imagine how one must live and survive during those times.
Conan the barbarian, the chad lifestyle
@@ManiacMayhem7256 The modern Western person is a Berber, there is no difference
So interesting!!! I love your work!!!❤
How ever accurate or exaggerated, its simply amazing that the words of Herodotus still survive today.
Not to mention he is the most likable character in Ac odyssey.
I love the that a scythian chieftain gives wine he brewed to those of his followers that have killed someone while those who haven't stay sober and in a corner
Hey, can you post the text of these videos somewhere? I'm not hard of hearing, but it's a real shame that the deaf can't easily access the awesome historical content on this channel!
Too bad YT removed the ability for viewers to submit subtitles, would have prevented this issue
Black cloaks: " Hello! "
Everyone : " No. "
The Scythian lands always stuck out to me in Herodotus, glad you apparently felt the same!
Awww yeah, we're talking about the scyths
Scythian Scandinavian Scottish ⚡
The dance of the sugar plum fairy.... Tchaikovsky secret weapon. 🎶
Japanese doctor Masaru Emoto water study.
@Elvis Musso
Farmer vs- Pharma 🐍
The MindWar is strong.
@Ksjs Jdjdb You again? Scythians are Iranian. Stop
@Ksjs Jdjdb you're wrong
@Ksjs Jdjdb ok lol
Excellent mate cheers!
They sound so barbaric in this descriptive and yet their artworks were stunning. Only after the Soviet Union ceased to be did their burial mounds and artifacts become accessable.
We simply do not hear enough about these horse archers overshadowed by Parthian, Mongol and Hun.
This is classic Herodotus making bs up, he as some good sources but many times its pure fantasy made up of tall tales he likely heard from travelers
@@alexmag342 you think herodotus is the only one who gives an account like this about the scythians?
From archaeological digs we have found scythian corpses who still have tattoos on their skin, having long blonde and red hair, and human sacrifice was common.
Their wives are often buried with them because when the husband dies it was considered honorable for the woman to die with him. So she would volunteer to have her throat slit and put in her husbands grave. It was a great honor in their society. They killed their horse as well. What physical evidence does exist of them shows an incredibly brutal warrior society, and this is backed up with multiple historical accounts of their customs and their nature.
Theres no reason to not believe his account
@@AudioJeep There is no evidence to back your ludicrous claims about what 'wives' thought... There is every reason to doubt many of the accounts of ancient historians for reasons which would be obvious to you if you were more familiar with ancient history.
@@kadensmike8190 your skepticism is not your own. You did not think for yourself and conclude that there is reasonable doubt. You are nothing more than a parrot copying what you hear other people say.
You know nothing about the scythians, i guarantee you probably didnt even hear about them until you clicked on this video. And id be willing to bet youre some zoomer. No one else would name their child kaden. Youve said nothing.
@@kadensmike8190 @Kaden Smike you are aware we have found preserved scalps all over scythia, as well as tattooed skin samples which are detached from the bodies. This is PROOF that they were skinned, and the skin was also preserved with care, which is also PROOF that after being skinned their skin was valued and maintained.
All archaeological evidence we have uncovered (which is backed by herodotus) confirms herodotus' story.
This isnt my claim you absolute halfwit moron, this is well known scythian history, and the same accounts are not only backed by herodotus but by many other ancient historians. They were alive at the time that they existed. I would say he is far more credible than some bed wetting dork from 2021 who has never even set foot in the region, and hasnt even heard about them until just an hour ago.
Egyptian records of the Minoans
Elaborate?
Hmmm is herodotus just copying egyptian history?
You did not say it but Scythians are Not Minoans
Smokin that reefer boiiii 😎
I’ve been interested in the Scythians for some time now and this was fantastic info
Haplogroup U2 is an extremely old lineage, going back at least 40,000 years, when Homo sapiens first expanded from the Middle East into South Asia and Central Asia. Two of the oldest Homo sapiens DNA samples from Europe tested to date, a 37,000 and a 33,000-year old Cro-Magnons from the Kostenki site on the Don River in the Russia, both belonged to haplogroup U2. Scholars believe that this group, after migrating north, became the dominant lineage among the foragers who eventually settled in Central Asia and South Asia and became the Indo-Iranian groups.
Slavs were farmers from the woodlands. They always settled near woodlands and rivers. Their houses, and even their larger structures were made of wood.
Scythians were nomads from the plains. They used to inhabit the western parts of the Eurasian steppe. Furthermore, they spoke an eastern Iranic language.
The Mongoloid (Proto-Turkic) peoples in the Altai Mountains embraced Iranic Scythian culture (horsemanship, nomadic way of life, traditions, clothing) and mixed with the Scythians to form their own unique Iranic-Mongoloid.
History has preserved the names of some of them: Ishpakaia, Bartatua, Madyes, Idanthyrsus, , Skyles, Tigratavā , Octamasadas, Xāravalāna, Artavatauxma, Zarinaea, Sodasa, Sawarmag, Saurmag, and Zari- "golden". This was the name of a legendary Saka (Scythian) warrior queen. They are descended from what is called andronovo horizon they are Indo-Iranian horse nomads Iranians speaker, they have Iranian names.
I enjoy imagining the bewilderment they will feel when one of these Scythians somehow arrives in Athens.
For a long stretch of the classical period the Athenian government employed 200 Scythian archers as a sort of Capital-Guard. This was before any notions of public guardians or police so they were mainly used to guard statesmen, important buildings, and in extreme cases as riot-police...
Herodotus is the best. Great book.
The you tube channel Asha Logos tells of Scythian history. Really worth your time.
love these videos
Scalping steppe nomads? Reminds me of the Comanche
Well, it is believed that humans migrated to the American continents though the now-sunken land-bridge between Russia and Alaska, from Siberia, 20 thousand years ago. Cultural remnants from those people, maybe?
@@SeymoreSparda no.
@@SeymoreSparda There's genetic evidence linking Australasians to some South American tribes IIRC so there might've been some sea travel too at some point, unless they went on a VERY long walk or both tribes started somewhere in more central Asia and then went in opposite directions.
@@Arkantos117 While I'd like to believe that to be true, I myself am related to those people (of the Austronesian descent), I know that we were known for out seafaring skills, but to me,okay..some things in that supposition doesn't add up.The old world deseases. It came from domesticated animals.We were one of the people who first domesticated chicken (among others in other parts of the world). If they indeed came into contact with those South American tribes, then wouldn't those tribes be immuned of those deseases before the Spanish came there? It's as if. when those people came there, they came without bringing their livestock. If they really did manage to come to the Americas, it must had happened before written history, before the domestication of chicken. To this day, it is advised to cook chicken thoroughly before eating, cause salmonella.Heck, we still have wild chicken breeds that can still fly a little in the jungle in South East Asia.
@@SeymoreSparda check out the Siberian Ket tribe, there’s DNA and linguistic research that proposes links between them (and other migrations over the Beringia land bridge). with peoples in the Americas.
It would be very interesting to hear readings of Ptolemy’s Geography
I can’t be the only one wanting one of those rock saunas for the shine skin 😅
Scythians never wore scalp napkins and drank from skull caps, in fact, they weren't cannibals at all.
Rather, this refers to two possibly Finnic tribes, the Androphagi and Melanchlaeni. I am saying they are probably Finnic as I don't know of any Iranian peoples inhabiting areas near the Arctic.
Yea, you are right. I have read about the Androphagi in a Russian source that they were even more cannibal like and at some point more animalistic/brutal, but had the clothes of Scythians but spoke a different language.
Historian Marija Gimbutas has hypothesized[4] that "Androphagoi" is a Greek translation of *mard-xwaar "man-eater" in the old North Iranian language of the Scythians. From *mard-xwaar one can derive "Mordva" or "Mordvin", the Russian name of the Finnic Erzya and Moksha peoples of east-central European Russia. From Herodotus we can deduce a location for the Androphagoi that is approximately the same as that occupied by the modern Mordvins. Max Vasmer rejected this etymology as unsubstantiated.
Herodotus first wrote of andropophagi in his Histories, where he described them as one of several tribes near Scythia. An extra note indicates that the andropophagi are cannibals, as reflected in their name:
The manners of the Androphagi are more savage than those of any other race. They neither observe justice, nor are governed, by any laws. They are nomads, and their dress is Scythian; but the language which they speak is peculiar to themselves. Unlike any other nation in these parts, they are cannibals.
- Histories, Book 4 (Melpomene), trans. George Rawlinson, 1858-1860
Pliny the Elder later wrote in his Naturalis Historia that the same cannibals near Scythia wore the scalps of men on their chest.
The Androphagi, whom we have previously mentioned as dwelling ten days' journey beyond the Borysthenes, according to the account of Isigonus of Nicæa, were in the habit of drinking out of human skulls, and placing the scalps, with the hair attached, upon their breasts, like so many napkins.
- Naturalis Historia Book 7, Chapter 2, trans. John Bostock and Henry Thomas Riley, 1855
@@CultOfSol777Damn they are Chad
don't you hate when you and everyone else in your country is driven away by snakes
And turned into wolves.
This is metaphor same as a county being devastated by a “dragon”
@@eliezercohengoldberg1381 Nah dude it actually happened I'm telling you
Cursed Naga.
Not really my ancestors had a guy drive away the snakes instead.
Man i love Nomadic Cultures, its crazy hearing about what is essentially the edge of the Greek World
Please, tell me you don't believe half of it.
7:36 "As for what lies beyond the bald men.." My good sir, nothing is beyond bald men.
One of the more hilarious Herodotus accounts is of these Sythians getting stoned on hemp...tough to do on seeds but there must have been *many* used in that ritual that put them all into such a good mood. And the free love tribe...got to experience that in the early '70s myself 😂
Fascinating. I cant help but notice some of the traditions with the Picts of Scotland. Beheading, taking scalps, drinking the blood of notable warrior's. Also the artwork, not to mention i have DNA matches to Scythian burial DNA samples.
Beheading is pretty much standard execution method all over the world back then, before lethal injection and electric chair were invented.
I’d say it has to do with both having indo-european roots. In isolation, not much changes.
What’s wild is Anglo celts have the most dna of the Egyptian pharaohs…
The legend of princess scotia for which Scottland is named is about a Egyptian princess marrying a Scythian and traveling to The British isles.
And Plato and other said ofc the pharaohs and gods of Egypt were the descendants of Atlantis…
Very interesting to think of this and I can’t help but be mind blown how it lowkey ads up
@@kommando5562The foolish Greeks who believe that the ones who built the Assyrian capital, the city of Nino or Mosul, are the giants
@@kommando5562None of what you said is true. The legend about the egyptian princess was simply medieval fiction, no one ever took it to be real until idiots in the modern era heard of it and took it seriously.
Pharaohs don't have European DNA, despite what poorly written articles by poorly educated journalists might say
Scots have nothing to do with egyptians or scythians. Nothing. It's idiots online who keep tripping up over this non-existent connection
Dang! I was making hamburgers while listening to this episode! Quite the visual.
The world was such a mysterious place back then.
I finished The Histories a couple months ago. Extraordinary! I must say, I can't stomach listening to it though. I could barely read this part.
Issedone is a Greek rendering of a tribal name with the same root as Ossetian, Osi, Asii, Aschina, which are the same people that the Chinese recorded with the name Wusun. Osi, Aorsi, Asii - these all come from a generic term that simply means 'horsemen' (think of the modern English word 'Ass', meaning 'Donkey', which shares an etymology with an old word for horse/equine) in the Scythian/Indo-European languages, so it is more of a self-descriptor of groups who were widespread, intermingling, horse-riding steppe people, rather than being a narrowly specific tribal name in most cases.
In the case of the Issedones that Herodotus refers to living far in the East, these were the semi-settled group, known in historical records from Eastern civilizations as Wusun and Aschina, who merged with other neighboring tribes and became influential in the Turkic ethnogenesis and first Gokturk empires. Today, you can find their descendants, along with descendants of other related Indo-European steppe tribes, among many Turkic ethnicities who carry significant levels of y-dna haplogroup R1 (normally indicative of Indo-European ancestry), such as the Bashkir, Kyrgyz, and various Tatar groups.
By the way, for anyone interested, Scythian with a hard 'C', like 'Skythian' is closer to the original pronunciation. Also 'Cimmerian' would also have a hard 'C' or even a 'G'. The middle-eastern cultures knew the 'Cimmerians' as 'Gimmerai' or 'Gomer'.
The identity of the Issedones is unknown. They might as have been one of the many smaller tribes inhabiting Scythia. They have nothing to do with the Wusun, let alone the Ashina clan of the Turks. That would be extremely far-fetched.
@@privat3160 I've studied this topic extensively and I'm confident that what I said is accurate, taking the reliable truth to be found where there is overlap in portions of the testimonies of the ancient Greeks, Chinese, Indians, giving explanation and context to the echoes of history in folk legends of the Bashkirs and other Turkic people, and reinforced by modern archaeological, linguistic, and genetic evidence. Issedone/Wusun/Aschina refer at least largely to the same groups of people, who were significant in Turkic ethnogenesis and the rise of the first Turkic states.
@@_Painted You are looking at this far too simplistically and are generalizing to the extremes, thereby missing (or outright ignoring?) key details that make such conclusions which you've arrived at improbable.
1) Again, we do not know who the Issedones described by Herodotus in the 5th century BC were. We do not know for certain, where they were located. We have virtually nothing, other than what Herodotus wrote about them. Can you show me some archaological remains of the Issedones?
2) The same issue we also have with the Wusun in Chinese chronicles. We do not know, who these people were, what language they spoke or what they looked like. People like to point out that they were described as 'red-haired, green-eyed', but like to ignore that they were even described as quite the opposite, as extremely swarthy and dark haired, in even more older and contemporary sources, regardless of the fact that this doesn't bring us one step closer in connecting them to the semi-legendary Issedones. We have no archaelogical remains on them and they still are an enigma to us.
3) The connections with the Ashina are even more obscure. People like to connect them with the Wusun, purely based on speculative ties between their mythical legends of the she-wolf. There have been many papers on this, none make as definitive claims as you do. We also have no idea what their genetics were, and no, they did not have R1a. This was claimed in one dodgy paper and is now purported mindlessly by pop-historians. None of this lets us connect them to the Issedones of the 5th century BC. We can't simply ignore a THOUSAND (!) years between these people and expect continuity throughout, especially not in the highly diverse regions as the Central Asian steppes.
I do not reject the notion that the former Scythian tribes played a role in the ethnogenesis of the Turkic people. Quite the opposite actually, modern Turkic people are the closest to the ancient Scythians than anyone and science is very clear on this on multiple fields. The only thing I criticize is how confident you are in connecting all of these different people from different eras of history and throw them all in one pot, when that is scientifically impermissible with our current data we have. Doing so would sure be very amateurish.
@@privat3160 their language is neither Turkic nor Iranian.
“so uses it for a drinking cup”
I WILL DRINK FROM YOUR SKULL!
Interesting topic
"Scalp napkins". I had never thought to put those two words together, yet now I will often do so.
Krum of Bulgaria made a skull cup of the Byzantine Empire, so I can believe the Scythians did it too.
The thing is that many people don't realize that Scythians, Thracians, Arians, Dacians, Getae, Masagetaes, Persians, North Indians, Agathyrsians, and Thyssagetes were the same people... You might call them Indo-Europeans as they all spoke the same language (similar to Sanskrit), and lived in Eastern Europe and Asia. People are confused because they think that all these that I mentioned above are different, but the official history is twisted on purpose for exactly that reason, to confuse
@@aurelianstanica2708Why did some of them worship the dragon when they were the dragon, for God's sake?
Herodotos is a Hellenic men, thats why, maybe he shocked to see or hear a very different culture, first of all, they don't stay, they'll always moving with their cattle
@voicesofthepast -any chance of doing an east meets west Baroque/classical music exchange of culture?
Oh frick yeah. More plz
Do one on medieval Hungary. Otto the bishop of Freising bishop described us in great detail and it's very interesting to read back
Native of the land: The neighbouring tribe is very vicious, they make us pay tribute.
Interpreter: The neighbouring clan eats human flesh.
Ancient historian: So they have snake heads, ok.
I see your point but it's not like eating human flesh was that rare before "modern" religions like Islam and Christianity came along.
Exactly.
Would be a good explanation for the "goat feet" of the mountain people.
They probably learned to move quickly in steep, rocky terrain and could climb well, just as goats can.
@@smalltownfarmer4826 Yep, probably someone mistranslated "They can climb mountains like a goat!"
@@charaznable9209 or more likely, imo, they said "they have goat's feet", but that was just an expression meaning "they are good climbers". But the people they were talking to took it literally.
Who is the pianist in the background halfway through- great channel I would like to add.
Great presentation! Herodotus Histories is a great source of true history (at least for some ages and tribes) not that i am Greek but cause i like true facts and not hoaxes.
sure lmao. I love the men with goat legs too. Sounds attractive innit?
@@hannibalburgers477 When your spirit and mental iq reaches the ones you cant understand keep your opinion for youself cause you will be dissapointed if you are ironic. Otherwise if you like them go learn some true facts about them instead the hoaxes you`ve learned so far
When you have feeling that you are living in a wrong time and after hearing this you simply know that for a fact.
I see you're in the scalp napkins business
Cannibal urges?
Yeah it must have been cool if you don't mind the whole "living a brutally harsh life before dying early and violently" thing.
@@Hungabrigoo I'd fucking love diying violently at a young age!
Honestly I find really weird cuz the idea of a long life=good life is really really modern, like, up until the 1920-30 the concept of glorious death wasn't that weird, now it's just fantasy and it makes confused on how the fuck did we become such cowards
@@cahallo5964 you need help.
Everyone who liked this video should go read ‘The Scythian s’ by Barry Cunliffe. Superb read!
Thanks! It's on my to-read list now along with The Horse, the Wheel, and Language.
So interesting that the Scythians settled northern Scotland and became the Picts several centuries later
Now their offering views of exiting empires, such breathtaking views of the scythian empire.
O que seria de nós sem Herodoto...
What would be of us without Herodotus...
Any chance of The Oera Linda? Many believe they were also the scythians.
Herodotus is my favorite piscine wyvern.
Old Herodotus what a guy ,
There is a very strong similarities between Herodotus Scythians descriptions, and many indigenous groups in North America. Some of f those with the most are the Lakota's and their unique Oceti Sakowin idea.
Given that the “indigenous” people of North America are from Siberia, they had close proximity with the ancestors of the Scythians, so I’d imagine a lot of cross cultural contamination happened.
@@monkeymoment6478 🤔🤔🤔 Siberia ... I don't know if that will be accurate. The Seven Dakota Fires did not have any records of it.
Because like many of the native tribes of America, the Skythians were originally Gaelic. They spread out in both directions.
Love anything to do with the scythians shame there isn't more content on them I'd love to see a full history time documentary about the scythians
Asha logos episode on the scythians?
@@KingPyrrhus yea it's a awesome doc I love all of the subverted history docs but I carnt get enough of the scythians but I don't think there is really that much known about them
@@jmddetecting5503 love them myself! Also got really fascinated with the Scythians after that video. Such a mysterious ppl, regarded to be more ancient than the Egyptians too maybe. Maybe there are some old books on them that's worth looking into?
@@KingPyrrhus I'm sure there is and it wouldn't surprise me if they are older then the Egyptians, it's a shame more effort isn't put into researching this
@@KingPyrrhus , where did you hear that?
great
You had me at scalp napkins
To be fair 450BC was far far from the first nomads of the steppes. It may be the first invasion into roman territory by nomads but these people's lived, migrating to and from the steppes and the mountains for 10,000bce. These were herding ppls and cultures, and they would periodically descend from the mountains to raid and plunder the sedantary farming communities and empires that protected them. Often toppling entire ancient cities and empires. Sometimes they would even occupy the empires and become sedantary "city ppl" themselves, only to later be toppled by another group of nomads. I could be wrong, I'm not a historian, but that's my understanding of it
Your not wrong. For example the Persians themselves did the same thing only to then complain of their “uncivilized” cousins generations later.
@@XBclemX thanks, I thought so
We know it goes back to at least 2300 BC per "The Oera Linda".
Lol. I'm actually doing my final essay on the Scythians in my History of the Ancient West class.
Scythians in ancient west class dude you got it wrong.Scythians are from the east.
@Ksjs Jdjdb I thought they were proto Iranian?
@Ksjs Jdjdb Unless they left Siberia to escape the proto-Turkics.
@Ksjs Jdjdb Please share your time machine.
@Ksjs Jdjdb Jesus Christ you must be a rural Turk with an IQ like that.
@6:11 Herodotus describes Scythians hot boxing in a tent
DAYUUUM
"how should these not be invincible and unapproachable"
german thoughts on Stalingrad, 1943, probably
The French looking at the Ardennes*
And the British at Trafalgar, and the Americans at Pearl Harbor, and the Romans at the Rhine, the history of war is one of great victories and defeats. It is a comfort that not all defeats end in total loss and not all victories mean the end.
@@sid2112 lol. British defeat at Trafalgar. Plz. Tell more.
@@garrysekelli6776 I believe he was referring to Trafalgar as a victory.
"scalp napkins" I like to write horror fiction. Immah hang on to that one.
Anyone knows where I can find the map he uses in the video?!
before turko-mongols in central asia , there were the scythians ....
Turks origin xiognou origin altai skythians
Mongols origin donghu origin manchuria
@@seljukkaganat8588How, for God's sake, can you tell the difference between Turks and Mongols? They have the same appearance and small eyes
@@user-fl5mq9kp7g Turkics have got more than one apperance and not all of them look Mongol.
@@ordafles5360 No, the original Turks, according to ancient Arab historians, have small eyes and a shape similar to the people of China
Fun fact:
In te 9th century, the Turkic Yakut people migrated up north from around Lake Baikal to the middle Lena due to pressure by the Buryats, a Mongolic group.
I did not know that,thank you.
It is thought that the ancestors of the Yakuts fled Genghis Khans expansion in the 12th century, not the Buryats in the 9th. Buryats didn't exist back then.
@@privat3160 Nice.
Siberia was like Americas depopulated by disease and massacres caused by Russian conquests, and there's no way to establish links between present day survivors and ancient ethnicities.
@@abuhammad Actually,there is a link.
Herodotus is sometimes funny.
My estimate for the weight of the container came out to 28 tonnes. If the typical arrowhead was 626 grains, (44 grams) (the heavier estimate for the points) that would give a population of about 600,000. My estimate is probably off, especially because i don't know exactly what six fingers converts to but there you go.
*vid suggestion- chau juk kua's description of the pi she yeh pirates that raided china*