Should electricians plaster after work?
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- čas přidán 9. 05. 2023
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This video is for entertainment purposes only and is in no way intended as a guide or 'how to'. - Zábava
Put the water in the bucket first then gradually add to bonding until you achieve the correct consistency.
i find if you put water in the bucket first then add the plaster to it, its easier to get the consistency desired. also if you run out of bonding, multifinish plaster mixed with sand does the same job (the sand being the bulking agent and the plaster being the adhesive agent)
Or when you're fitting the back boxes use some mortar behind the box, this helps to get the boxes perfectly flush as you're not relying on the quality of the chase and fixing, with the added bonus that it fills in the chases at the sides of the box at the same time meaning you don't have that fiddly gap to fill in with a load of bonding afterwards.
OR..if you use your BRAINS........a thick bed of gunned adhesive. faster and a lot less messy. Plus don't use bonding..use One coat which is smooth and can be sanded and finished flush easily.
I find it a lot easier to PVA the chases before you put the cables in, which also stops further dust and mess.
If the electrician is competent and willing to do so at extra cost. Otherwise no, for the same reason I wouldn't expect a commercial airline mechanic to fly me to Ibiza.
Why would a spark plaster? Certainly not for free!!
It would come down to will the customer want to pay for me to do it?
The most lightly answer is no, they rarely want to pay me to clean up
You should meet the Pilot of your next holiday flight then you might be shocked
I used to plaster all my raggles and around the metal back boxes if any plaster had come away when raggling them in.
Our gaffer asked us to do that. It was a good impression to the customer and at the time, it felt to me as if we were leaving a more complete job.
And even though our vans all had hoovers in them, we were encouraged to ask the customer for a shot of their hoover. 8 times out of 10, the customer would tell you to leave it and they’d do it but it showed the customer that we weren’t looking to leave any mess behind. Unlike those dirty plumbers.
When you work for a smaller outfit, the good impression you give to a customer is key to getting repeat business.
Take a wide putty knife, and remove a few mm from the leading edge on the left and right side, leaving the center able to actually fit in your chases. Then you can fill the chases like you already do, then run the modified putty knife up the wall and remove just a few mm from the entire run in one go. The left and right sides of the putty knife will keep you from going too deep without having to think about it. Same concept could be done by attaching something to a wide putty knife instead of cutting away- either way, its just a jig to give you a quick, consistent result.
We don't do that here, but then again we usually run everything in conduits. So the builder chases the wall, puts the box and conduits in. When the wall is finished I go in and pull single cables in the conduits and second fit
The thing the plaster rests on before being trowelled is called a hawk, mines called Mike
Use a wet brush up the chase after bonding, gives the plasterer a couple of mm for finishing coat
If you put the water in the bucket first and then add the plaster it mixes easier and wont burn your drill out or give you dry lumps when its mixed - if you add a little bit - (small scraper size) of cement in the mix - and then you can make the mix wetter - which is easier to get into the chases / holes - blast them all in and then go back to the first one to finish it off - the cement speeds the hardening up - will save a load of time (and your wrist) using a stiff mix !!
Had to do plaster repairs when working on occupied social housing rewires... fairly dry and thick bonding mix as you've done here, but apply it so you've a millimetre or two left to fill the chase, it shrinks a bit anyhow, but we'd give it an hour and then we hit it with Easifill for a smooth finish. The spec was such that the tenant only had to do cursory sanding down to make good.
Great video! The only reason i fill all chasses is so i can second fix and get the hell outa there! Also Nick please use conduit in chesses, just think of the next guy!
Yes he should, as a plumber I fix up and plaster etc. also tilers should clear grout and shine the tiles
Does the plasterer do the electrics before they plaster? No. So why should you do their job.
Sometimes they do, unfortunately 😬
I agree with you
Defo threw me under the bus there mate, cheers
Add a bit of cement to it if you want it to go off quicker nick, you wouldn't get to use half a bucket before it goes off if put too much in , try 2 trowels full to half a bucket , saves time if waiting to 2nd fix
Toolstation or screwfix (cant mind which one) do a nice mini plasterers hawk, think its a ragni one, really nice hawk for small jobs
You could use a 1" scraper to remove excess so it doesn't sit flush. Flush is fine if the whole wall is to be skimmed, but they'll have to scrape it back, fill, and sand if not.
Alternatively fill it proud with a sandable plaster like easifill to begin with. Lots of dust down that road, though.
An old spark advised me to use Paris plaster mix to set back boxes in crumbling walls, adding that it also saves time when plastering everything back up
Yo did a good job , I think you are confident of your workmanship
Ive used a trigger type spray bottle...a few mins before filling.. just enough to dampen chase ...no runs ...less mess
When I done electrics with uncle he priced for filling hole's for customers to plaster after.
When we work on building site's every one had to do there bit in yhe right time or it held the next traders up.
Almost excellent. But you should fill up chasing applying preessure to both sides. You did it only to one side. Around the outlet boxes you should fill up till the bottom of chasing...
What I do nick is use metal capping and PVA it before I leave. However, if I'm cutting patches for joists, ect, I will fill the plaster after putting it in. My plasterers say its no good for them but I'm not taking advice off of someone who heats a spoon up at lunch time... if you get me.
With the filling big gaps around boxes, I've got a smaller trowel that's the same size as the height of a box so I can fill up to it without it going into the box
Same here, saves the faff of removing it all at the end
Great video Nick. Really useful knowledge.
Sod that game. Stick on a days labour for a plasterer and a bit for “project management” - he’ll do the bonding in his way home from another job one afternoon (they all finish early anyway 😂) then he’ll skim the next morning, you can start 2nd fix the day after no mess no hassle no delay.
Certainly don’t teacher you this in your city and guilds sparks course stay away it ain’t our forte
Great video - customer focused attention to detail - awesome!! Think there is site context to whether conduit/capping needs using.... but you explained that lol.
Disclaimer: not a qualified smart arse or plasterer = One thought on the bonding is that it will go harder quicker 😮 the older the bag is or the longer its open as it absorbs moisture from the air - also it is a chemical reaction and gives off heat..........fun fact Fursday!!
When mixing plaster, I thought you put the water in the bucket first then mix the plaster into the water, for a nice smooth mix.
I’m not a plasterer, but I have done some and that’s how I mixed it? Hope this may help someone, any comments/advise welcome. 👍👍👍
Always plaster into the water, same with powder filler wallpaper paste, etc.
Water first reduces the risk of dry powder in the very corners of the bucket not properly mixing in. That’s how I’ve always done it anyway 👍
@@paulf2529 Thank you Paul for you reply and information. 👍
@@InTruServ Thanks for the information, yep it makes sense.👍
Builders I know don’t use pva they use SBR instead,
When you mix your bonding are you using warm water if so that's why your bonding goes off quicker than it should do
I love the banter between you guys 😅😅
Best thing bout bonding.. goes off quick ..later on , creamy filler , flexible filling knife ...if you work it right . Just perfect
Glad you mentioned about putting conduit on the bare wires.
As a decorator I couldn’t find anywhere whether I should or not cover the bare wires.
Nice to know.
Also, why not use easyfill 45 for jobs like this.? Instead of bonding. That way they wouldn’t need a plaster to finish the job as a decorator could easily sort it..
Cost
Never thought I would see the day Nick was teaching how to plaster. 😅
one thing you dont do it flush with wall as when skim comes there will be a bump leave about 2-3 mm depth to allow for multi
I agree capping is only useful if rewiring. Plus the plaster takes better without the capping.
Nick , Adam good to see you both.O my god ,electricians doing plastering the next we will hear is plasters doing electrics, O they do! that why you get an electrician to re do the electrics the plasters has done.once again great video take care see you on the next one.
Great video. If you had metal capping in place, would you still PVA it or should the capping be roughed with sandpaper to allow the bonding plaster to adhere?
Pva is for the wall mate so it don’t suck the water out the plaster as it seals it off, shouldn’t need to sand the capping either mate it would be fine
Metal capping is a waste of space
It's never going to bond to the metal (or PVC if you use that) anyway. Chase needs to be wide and deep enough for the plaster to support itself.
We all round band all cables in chases spot on job 👌
That's lovely work indeed.
you are leaving the bond flush - therefore the plasterer can’t skim properly/can’t do his job without undoing/altering what you have done and/or leave the customer with a crap finish- which I don’t think is what you want to do . Leave it to the correct trade Nick.
i'm not even a plasterer and I know you aren't supposed to leave the bonding coat flush as it has to be partially undone by the plasterer before they can skim. You might think you're saving them some work but it's actually about the same if you're not going to recede your bonding coat and score it slightly
Did you use sds drill and then sds Chisel to do the chasing. Need to chase in sockets in a concrete house, made out of fairly tough bubble type concrete. 🤔
You do such neat chases that after bonding you could easily do the second coat - get a tub of SINIAT Smartmix. Dead easy to use, doesn’t shrink and sand downs really smooth after. A tub lasts for ages….
Thats where the London / Manchester style industrial installs win hands down when you can install surface mount conduit and metal clad accessories with no plastering!
Would it speed up the process if you used a piping bag to push the bonding deep around the boxes instead of troweling it on? Still smooth it out after, but the bag would speed up applying it, especially to small areas like around the boxes.
I'm sure I've seen someone fill old silicone tubes with material for this purpose.
@@JasGawera I know they actually make construction grade piping bags, like very large, very rugged versions of an icing bag for baking, but using old silicone tubes is definitely a cool idea, especially if you need very granular control.
@@chaseohara4781 They make mortar guns specifically for this, too. Just a refillable caulk tube, at the end of the day. They also sell caulks and silicones and so forth in bags, and guns to suit, to avoid the tube waste.
Amazing work
do you need to turn off the electric supply before pva/plastering?
I presume you test all the cables (power, data & coax) before plastering?
Use a roughneck mortar gun for the fiddly small stuff, much easier and gets the mortar righ to the back of the cavity
I can see both sides, good workmanship exyends to looking after thr next guy and so i can see that partially filled chases are a good thing (plasterer has to just finish) BUT equally we're not plasterers and a wel meaning gesture can quickly turn to shit if, when the customer does get a plasterer in, thr plasterer has to do MORE work because thr wrong stuff was used.....6 of one, half dozen of the other.
Love these guys and videos 🙂🇮🇪🍀
Are you not taking out the old back boxes and filling those holes in?
How tall is the side zipper pocket on the nb100?
Nic,. I'm chuffed to see that other sparks ( its rare) fill in their chases,..
Ive been in the house bashing game for over 43 years and always plaster up after myself ( it's the way I was taught / not optional)..
My only recommendation to you and others is to use " White One Coat " Plaster.... you can rough in today and do a smooth coat tomorrow, leaves a nice finish...
Anyway, crack on guys...
You Adam... Good job 😅
Personally I didn’t mind a bit of bonding when I was labouring for a electrician but I wasn’t going to skim when the plasterers were in at some point anyway
Get a 2" Scraper and cut the sides away to 1.5mm depth leaving 1" full length in the middle. You can then simply put the 1" section in the chase and run it up the wall scraping out 1.5mm ready for plastering or easyfill.
The reason you use plastic conduit is not for protection obviously its so it can be rewired years later but I realise tradesmen don't think about tradesmen who may come years later
Ye charge ! May aswell fit that at new tub to
Hmmm… would not the plasterer andd the plaster to the water?….it cuts down the dust but ensures it’s mixed thoroughly.
I think it's bollocks to be fair. If capping is used and they have a plasterer coming, why would I do half his job? He didn't help run in the cables
you never use bonding on old brickwork it pull the salts you should leave this platering job to the people that know what they are doing an as for your pva running down the walls they will have to sand it all out for the paint to take
Great video mate, very informative! What do you use to secure cables in a chase? PS. Just bought myself a Unilite as a result of one of your videos.
What would really help you guys if you were to get a sleeve 3D printed (single and double socket). Simply place it inside the box, it projects out past the surface... then simply plaster in... and remove the sleeve. Protects you from getting plaster into the box, making it a quicker job.
Good work lads
Easi fill 60 is fine for those chases, more expensive but comes in smaller bags
Buy a proper halk and trowl. Doesnt have to be Marshall Town or anything but you'll get better finishes and speed it up
You don't need to p.v.a brick work. Water does the same job because p.v.a is just water based and only stays on the surface. Just wet down the chases as you go. Use a bucket trowel for putting bonding/plaster in bucket and you can mix with it also and prob dont really need a mixer. A Gauging trowel for finishing bonding is better then a filling blade.
Well done 👍
When did you stop using capping/oval tube? I can never bring myself not to use it!
Glad to see at least one person thinks that.
Someone puts a nail in the wrong place, then that length of oval is priceless.
@@acelectricalsecurity wouldn't stop a nail or screw though?
old city and guilds part A plaster repair was on the course most plasterers hate patching and social housing rewires the electrician had to do it
I’m not bonding it so I don’t care 😂😂😂 fair play tho it looks easier than I thought, I may try this on the next one cheers
Does the chemicals in the plaster not affect the cables hence why capping/conduit is needed to protect the cables from deterioration by chemical reaction over time???? 😳🤔
the fact that it's even legal in the UK to plaster in bare cables - without the conduit - is insane to me... flexible step-proof conduits here cost around 3€ / 10 m rolls, so even if you just use conduit between the socket/switch and the loft it would be still around 30-50€ tops? and you wouldn't need to demolish a wall if and when you want to change anything
Nicks normally a bit of a pro with FlexiCon ! 😂
When I was in the trade as a lad, back in the 1830's, our gaffer would write a simple clause in to every quote "redecoration is the responsibility of the customer".. end of.
You found your Dad’s brush you found your Dad’s mini trowel - is a pattern appearing Nike ?
I always easy fill my jobs when I’m not down to do a second fix visit, I sleep better knowing my sockets and switches are screwed back safe with no gaps for fingers
Up to the spark , I use to make good .. that was it ..
The plaster does not adhere to the pva. Its to control suction noting else.
Your clients pay you to do the electric, why do you not pay a local plasterer to do a job they are good at.
NO ... under any circumstances. But what they can do is
Set the boxes at the correct depth for the plasterer. Where possible cut the cables and wind up the part you need into the backbox. Sweep up all the clippings and put all the packaging for electrical items in a bin bag ... 🥰
Fair
No, do electricians actually check whether the wall is suitable to use bonding on especially on a ground floor ? Solid (no cavity walls) should not have bonding using especially on the ground floor. not saying it applies to this house its a general point.
Do all plasterers check that? Not in my experience. Still trying to find a really decent one…. 🤞🤞
why use a knife to clean the boxes when u can use plastic?
Only if we feel like it and the customer is going to pay the same or more than a proper plasterer would get 😁
Best thing is we all know thats the best plastered back-box ever in stafford
Poor Jack.. don't let that mean Mr B get to you.. hehe.. 🤣
Why no capping....?
I’d say it’s personal choice but i know an electrician who bonds it out so all his work is concealed then customer or plasterer just has to put a finish coat over it
Where adam drilled through XD 😜😜
All trades should do whatever they put in their quotation , if you don’t want to do it, make sure to state it . Simples
Try bonding 60 it will dry fast
I started using this recently. Makes the job so much quicker.
Get ya self a hawk trowel ! Lol
Everything goes in conduit here, to plaster issues are less complicated here.
I’m going to clean the back box out in a minute. 😂. Yeah right.
No dust when you use PVA
Water goes in the bucket 1st nick
You made that look hard.
Did you never work with other trades and pick up on how they worked.
With the deep gap and you used a filling knife, would you not consider expanding foam to save time. And when it's dry, scrape out the surface and skim with plaster ?. I think with you including the part plaster is good. Some clients do expect the walls to be plastered after the wires have been put in, but it's only companies that have multi trades that do that..great video again guys....
How's the coefficient of expansion of foam vs plaster? All you'll do is upset people if their skim just cracks straight off once the heating comes on.
@Monkeh616 unfortunately I'm not a plasterer, so I was only trying to see if he scared out 1 inch of expanding foam and plaster instead of trying to force plaster down the sides of the box. Would you have any suggestions 🤔. But thanks for letting me know about skimming and heating bit.
@@stuarth540 I actually don't know how foam will behave, that's kinda my point - plaster is a known quantity, anything else is not.
For filling down the sides of boxes, a simple mortar gun (or an emptied out sealant tube, but that's a bit of faff) will make it easy to pump the mix in without mess.
@Monkeh616 I have used expanding foam on boxes on uneven holes in the past, the last time I did it was when was in my sons new flat the had hidden issues, the backbox was secure and any overhang of foam we could cut away with a stanley, but the plasterer who did the walls said their was no issue with plastering the wall..
@@Monkeh616 thanks for the tip with the empty sealant tube.
there should coz normally they dont care how they make there holes so if they had to do it they would take more care
Why would you not put the cables in conduit. Now if there's a fault in future the whole track needs pulled out as apposed to just pulling the faulty cables out.
Yeah right 😅
Oi Nick, omg no capping 😒😒😒😒😒😒