This is a fun experiment! Definitely not an over-unity machine, free energy hoax or perpetual motion device. What I like about it is it's a governed oscillator with a potential of adding contacts to employ a bifilar buck and boost coil set instead of employing a transistor. I think its brilliant and built one this morning at the shop. It was cold this morning and the guys copied what I was doing playing with different configurations of boat yard junk. We had fun playing with it for a couple of hours. We tried all kinds of configurations with different weights lengths and strengths of springs and different fly-wheels and resistance of bearings. It warmed up so we need to get back to servicing boats but this was a great break in routine. Thanks Robert!
I noticed how everyone was pointing out that it's not more efficient than some other thing. To me though it's cool because it is a very simple way to use two different types of mechanical energy and motion at the same time. It could link together two devices in fun ways
it really doesn't matter if it goes longer mate - going longer is not the issue - the issue is energy transfer - it will only 'go' as long as it has energy - the number, arrangement and position of the springs and weights has no effect on the amount of energy contained in the flywheel - it gets that from my initial push. What we are then trying to do is transfer that energy. If it 'goes' longer all that means is we have transferred less energy per rotation and the more components we add the chances are the more inefficient the transfer as been
@@ThinkingandTinkering But this is not a resonant system. The resonance of the mass/spring system is very much higher than anything you've shown (other than when you plucked it). The flywheel would need to be turning at several hundred RPM to match the approximately 10Hz the mass/spring oscillates at. All that is happening here is that the flywheel pushes some energy into the spring as the pin descends then the spring pushes it back into the flywheel as the pin ascends. There is no "resonance" here as you would find in a tank circuit, guitar string or other resonant system. Sorry mate.
There's also the vibrator which was used to convert DC voltage to Ac. Was used in mobile vacuum tube gear. Supposed you could consider it an electro- mechanical oscillator.
This kind of setup reminded me of Autoparametric Resonance, where if you get the tension of a spring & the correct weighted mass hanging from it, it initially moves vertically, but then starts swinging like a pendulum, & reverts back & forth until the external forces make it lose enough energy to stop. (it can take a very long time until it does)
I think that this would have a great potential coupled to a mechanically triggered pulse coil. Maybe w/common shaft, and serpentine coil genny. Maybe? I'd love to see you botch one up Bobby. And as always, another, great idea for a series, btw.
If you're having trouble understanding what this is then remember the most important point is that the frequencies are the same and consider why that is more efficient than if the frequency was different on this same machine. Frequency is key here and doesn't apply in other types of motor like a piston and crank arrangment
The reason I brought up my concerns on the last video was that the video you were referencing was very different from the video you were trying to make. In the original video, the creator alleged that it was a spring *powered* motor and that this setup would keep the flywheel spinning longer than without the spring. And the video even shows this, with the flywheel accelerating steadily in the last run. Of course, most people with a science background would realize that this is impossible and conclude that they must have been powering it in some other way, such as a small electric motor. But it did strike me as odd that this wasn't originally addressed in the previous video, because that gives people the wrong idea that you're trying to accomplish the same thing the original creator was alleging, which is to power the motor with the spring. And it seems like that did end up being the case as there were several people comparing it to a setup with no spring. As for the original video, its comment section is full of people talking about how to get it over unity and why they think it gets more energy than you put into it. And the video itself was even reuploaded by a much more explicitly free energy based CZcams channel. The mechanism itself is still interesting on its own and I'd especially be interested in seeing it with some sort of speed controller on the flywheel to match the spring's resonant frequency.
There is no such thing as "free energy". Except for the extension cord I have running through the bushes to my neighbor's house...... anyway, it is a neat display of principle, but putting any real load on the flywheel will change how long it runs for. I really enjoy the videos!!
I think a lot of people were comparing this system to a flywheel alone, and correctly thinking that a flywheel alone would run for longer. However, a flywheel alone is useless for many applications. The better comparison would be this system vs a flywheel with a 4-bar linkage (such as a steam train) where reciprocal motion is required. This example being more efficient because it delivers so much of its energy back into the flywheel when correctly tuned. (Rob, correct me if I'm wrong)
Adding magnetic bearings and setting a flywheel in a vacuum can help reduce frictional losses from the environment, but, of course, coupling it to the outside world then, might end up being slightly difficult... Although, I suppose, if you have coils on the outside of the flywheel that keep it in perfect balance, the fields can both be the bearings and the driver/receiver simultaneously. With an input 'motor' field, set so as to ensure the armature [flywheel] is not deflected against any other physical part of the device, in theory, it can sit there and spin for very long times, with magnetic resonance based on capacitance in a ringing circuit, making it a hybrid of both mechanical and electrical resonance. One merely need put an optional tap somewhere along the ringing circuit wherein they can add another ringing circuit so equally tuned as to get the optimal power out, and into the system.
What blows my mind isn't the Physics. I'm familiar with the Physics because the math for it is covered in a standard first year course in Physics. But what I'm very in awe of - is you using a barbell weight - for a Flywheel ! That, Robert - is Genius 😂
I was thinking it can even out the work of pedaling a bike since it's hardest to pedal when the arms are vertically aligned. Or to try to use an LC circuit to control an ebike motor (the motor being the inductor itself). I first would need to fix a big enough capacitor. Perhaps such a dongle like you have here can be used as a relay to charge the capacitor in time with the LC circuit oscillations from a battery. I very much also like your idea of transferring the bike suspension to rotational wheel motion
The spring cannot return more energy to the flywheel than the flywheel has already stored in the spring. So there is no gain. There has to be an external source of engergy to keep the system in oscillation. As Rob said, this is not a free energy machine. They don't exist!
I think the free energy machine idea came from the previous video where you showed a cast iron one that seemed to go on much longer then expected. If a weight is attached to a crankshaft on the fly wheel, is that equivilent?
What people are saying, is you put very little energy into spinning the flywheel, and it continues to produce the motion for a very long time not indefinitely, but for longer than what you invested in it there is no perpetual motion, but what there is is using the energy that is already being produced almost indefinitely in the universe around us. It is like solar energy. You can use it for all intents and purposes perpetually, because when it stops, we’re all dead anyway, the same thing occurs with wind, which is also created by the sun and the atmosphere interaction, the thing most. People don’t consider as a continuous energy source is gravity, and this is where it gets interesting creating an oscillating lifting system, and then as the weight returns downward generating energy. The thing you want to start looking into is if your flywheel is hollow and you fill it with a magnetic liquid metal that is like mercury. Now you can generate a magnetic field using a fly wheel assembly and you would have something quite fascinating. And of course, I find it very humorous that the government tells us how dangerous mercury is win for decades and hundreds of years we’ve played with it with barely any side effects. What do they not want us to do with it? This is your question to consider.
Now you just need a miniature Galloping Gertie above it, a little wind, a rod to shove the spring down lower, some fine tuning and feed energy back into the flywheel. See how fast you can get that flywheel spinning and/or see how much energy you can store in the flywheel.
Hi Rob couple of tips to investigate 1) check it's speed 2) have the flywheel rotation same direction to earths rotation and (lined up) to earths rotation direction West to East , doesn't sound like a big thing but that's one force you don't want to go against. Also if you can build one to rotate at 1800 rpm earths rotation speed you'll find a big benefit. Hidden secrets , small gain but same as rolling flywheel down a very long small decline cheers.
I can see at the 4:00 mark that I could see adding gravity, pendulum motion, and coil wound around magnets and possible electric motor for interesting possible generator
This discussion wouldn't be complete if we didn't examine the effect the field from those balancer magnets has on the spinning flywheel. Can we get some before-and-after calorimetry on that mass plate? Eddy currents and whatnot.
@@ChrisHillASMR What? I answered exactly what he asked. Admittedly in a very abbreviated form omitting details that have only negligible effects anyways but that still doesn't invalidate the answer in itself. So don't you dare to elevate yourself with an answer that doesn't explain those minute details either.
um so frigin glad you make videos . im so close to solving a dream i had about driveing a silent like gocart car . it had a crank that i used to crank on this box then once light cam on i got in hit sim switches for like lights and hit the throtal like on hydrstat hydrolics with nutiral pistion center . um fill im so clise to haveing my efinity nija i can all most fill the instat pow just like tnt. 😅😅. but yea i grew up in a junk yard so my dad hand fabricated his teactor and moved a hill into a gully with a grader blad as a dozer lol. but made flat land and farmed cars .said with live sock or crops theirs maintaince and rick of death bad crop. with junk cars theirs no vet bill ?? lol 😅. yea my pops was pretty wise yup. . um am serioys about solveing and makeing my forever car mechanical from me cranking the fly wheel one way to compress the spring then lock light comes on and the click works begins to get a constat force . thenn maybe convert that to electric ? or hydrolic. if can get rpms for pressire up. fly wheel will help alot . was seeing gyroscopes in torpeadoes that was spring driven . it was rwally spinning yup . so think i about got it licked almost te for a makeing montauge yup . . hope truely you stay strong 💪 🙏 pray too yup. 😊😊
Use the whole saw blade,held down in middle. Then put another flywheel on other end. Connect both flywheels wit a band, maybe 180 degrees apart. Will it keep going? Then use with the push button generator?
OK. So, I just need to move next to a Railroad Switch Yard, and make a BIG one of these, and park a weight hanging from a spring next to it to absorb the shaking of the ground and transfer it to the Flywheel setup. Do I kind of see where you're going?
So would this improve an existing flywheel set up that has an outside force on it like your gravity generator bicycle flywheel? Nice to see new things, and thinking about it. Thank you.
Now I'm reminded of a video of many metronomes on a table staring out of synchronisation but all falling into step after say ten minutes. Vaguely I remember something about frog species falling into mass synchronisation with their calls .
Your sewing machine example does not apply to damped spring oscillation and flywheel, or oscillating circuit analogy. I would compare it to a boost circuit, or mechanically, a gear reducer (~20:1) driven from the slow end. The treadle is a force multiplier (a lever) to make it easier to impart rotation to the large wheel because the treadle connects to the large wheel close to it's center. The drive belt riding on the outside edge of the large wheel multiplies the rotational speed imparted to the small (hand) wheel. The handwheel is technically a flywheel, but does not have enough mass to store it's energy for more than one rotation. It's purpose is for "smoothing" because, of the two actions of the sewing process (advancing the fabric and making a stich) that are completed by each rotation of the handwheel, one takes more force than the other. The last thing you want is a sewing machine that's hard to stop after you're done sewing. A needle through the fingertip is an ugly, painful experience.
How about spinning the wheel without the spring and then with the spring and see how much the difference is with a stopwatch people have the tendency to think that the spring is assisting the wheel when I say it's creating drag
It would be interesting to see if the rotational time constant is the same in a vertical orientation vs the horizontal one it was made in. I think I will make one of these and play with it
..the reason why some see this & think energy is due to its continuous motion through a simple method. Our imaginations open up, why not a serpentine coil on the rim o the flywheel & magnets on a separate ring around it + a coil around the magnets on top o the flat spring 🧐
5:19 ::: THE MACHINE ::: IF THE SPRING IS ON TOP ::: AND THE MAGNET IS BELOW ::: ANDYOU PUT A MAGNET UNDER THE MAGNET ON THE BOTTOM WITH OPPOSITE POLE ::: THAN YOU HAVE A "GRAVITY MOTOR" :: THAT IS A COOL IDEA DO THIS !!!!
The person speaking about the flywheel/oscillator system you showed in the end of the video said something about a capacitor, so I think it runs on some stored energy. However, his video was unclear. I don't know if he spoke of free energy or not, but I was unable to see any motor or electronic component.
When flywheel spins anticlockwise, the shaft push down the spring at longer end of the spring, but upward stroke push by spring at shorter contact point which is stiffer than downstroke. If the flywheel is spinned clockwise, push down is stiffer than pushing up, so it acts reverse. So it looks like direction of rotation matters
My theory is now that he's going to drive a flywheel somehow with windstalk oscillations, and then use that more evened out rotation for generation. I'm looking forward to seeing how one solves for converting that horizontal oscillation of the windstalk somehow into vertical oscillation to drive that wheel... maybe? I dunno - this is just my imagination running wild.
@thinkingandtinkering I saw one where you generate from wind stalks - 2079 - but it didn’t have a flywheel like this… which one had a flywheel? (Maybe I am using that term incorrectly) The one I saw was the button generator which was using a ratchet mechanism to keep a wheel turning and the rotation was very stop and go… maybe I don’t understand it enough but it seems like if you could get a weight spinning with the mechanism from this video it would capture a lot more energy by being smoother and not having repeated “start up” costs for each turn that it seems are in the button generator… Maybe I have a fundamental error in my thinking - that a smoothly continuously spinning weight spinning quickly would generate more output than the ratcheting button one… that each oscillation from the windstalk imparted into a weight would keep the weight spinning faster and capturing more energy than each buildup to get a ratchet to move another click…
So is the point to try and achieve/maintain a certain speed of the flywheel? It seems like that would be the result of the analogy to a tank circuit (pendulum or LC) where the idea is to maintain a certain frequency. That also seems to be what the mass-spring oscillator would tend to achieve. If so, it seems like the Nyquist effect might come into play, and doubling or tripling of the resonant frequency (flywheel speed) would be possible. (Not sure how it would be useful, but it would be interesting to try and measure.)
One is good, how about adding a second or third wheel? How about asding multiple pins? More pins should give more power, right? 6 pins should provide 5 times more power as they fill in the empty area where the wheel is coasting down. Shortening the distance between pins should cause acceleration.
I'm seeing a larger rotor, in a vacuum . Magnets on the rotor and pulling just enough to get trickle chargers to work and poof. You have a very efficient long life phone charger, battery charger. Works on hard circuit, no chips. Am I taking crazy pills?
Wonderful simple explanation of a complex physics model. You have to laugh about as soon as you show something like this, people start commenting “Free Energy!” Like a video of a plastic bag caught up in a car park thermal is immediately a UFO. Oh well......
A flat spring has less strength the further away from the mounting point. The rotation direction of the cam has to compress the spring farther away from the mount than where the release pressure happens. I think you are spinning the flywheel backward.
An "Elliptical Trammel" would be a better mechanical equivalent of a tank circuit. Unlike the flywheel/spring, it requires both parts to actually oscillate.
I like the idea of recovery of energy from the suspension of a car. Perhaps transferring the bumps using the 'self winding" mechanism to the spring or strait to the flywheel could generate power otherwise lost. especially in an electric car.
I found this to be a good showing to a tank circuit, now the oscillation does not seem to degrade over fairly short time, I think this could what is leading thought of over unity and trying work out how the spring helps keep the fly wheel going, when far as I can tail it don't do this. but really the fly wheel stores good bit of energy and the spring does not take very much energy to move and when there in match in tuning power lose is fairly small, so it seem to keep going with out noticeable degrade for a bit. I think this give a feeling that something more is happening.
is there a way to use wind flutter to drive an oscillator as an energy generator? The damper would have to be adjustable to sustain maximum safe oscillation and the flywheel would have to efficiently accept subtle input. By the way, I love your videos. I wish I could have seen this when I was in school.
can you put the spring above the flywheel center line and try it with a larger throw "gear" to see if you can find the ultimate sweet spot for maximum efficiency or does gravity not care about placement/orientation?
Do you think moving the spring upwards to the top until it's unladen will oscillate more power between the spring and the flywheel thus theoretically increasing the flywheel size?. I think by having it at the bottom just decreases the friction time on the pin so it would spin longer. increase the spring length, line it up at the bottom of the pin when it's at the top then the effect would be enhanced, although friction on the pin would now have a more dramatic effect since it's present for most of the rotation.
What if it has multiple springs timed differently? And bridges, a bridge could be fitted with a 10 ton struct a bit worse then the narrows bridge with a central rod to spin a generator, with a spring in the rod. To make the over stroke nondestructive! If 10 tons is moving it is building up alot of energy! Just the gravity pulling the crank down could spin a generator with a lot of force, if the wind moved it, or traffic got the bridge moving it could use a over drive gear, 6-24 strokes per minute, 10 tons at 1meter between 6 and 24 strokes / min. could be 3600-4800 +/- rpm easily.. and maybe 1kw/1000rpm Minimum.
i think people got the wrong message by not showing the flywheel run by its self, and running down by its self, and the driven spring run through to stop (even if you edit it down or speed up the footage)
Smart but the oscillation would stop spinning the wheel unless the oscillation has enough force to attach to the driving spoke on the wheel ! I believe Active Kinetic 1 remains the easiest method to turn mechanical energy into electricity !
Well, al that stir and discussion about energy with or without a spring is due, at least, to the title "[...] Spring /*Motor*/" (emphasis on motor); the title was confusing for some of us ?
i looked it up mate - apparently MIT define motor as 'any power unit that generates motion' - it certainly fits that definition - it might be that i was the power input - I gave the initial push to the flywheel - and we are mostly accustomed to thinking of the power input in a motor in terms of internal combustion or electricity and think of that as integral to a 'motor' - I would say it isn't - after all what is a jet engine but the 'push' of gas and a water motor but the 'push of a jet of water - but i see what you are saying
I don’t think it’s free energy! However close minded people wouldn’t believe the little they were allowed to read about Tesla because they were so simple minded they couldn’t comprehend beyond what their indoctrination taught them.
What happens if you place an additional spring on the opposite side -- 90 to 180 degrees out of sync with the current spring you have shown there? Will it cause a pick up in speed or a constant speed? Also, what if I took and put a magnet/coil assembly on the flywheel that would generate enough current to drive a solenoid that would push up on the tongue spring at the right moment to give it force on the flywheel? Would that aid in additional speed or constant rotating? If so, would that be enough to claim it were a motor that could drive a generator?
The spring can't return more energy than you put in. Since the spring is compressed by the flywheel, I suspect the flywheel would run longer without the spring. The interesting way it looks makes you believe the spring is helping.
I'm wondering how much the spring actually helps? Maybe try spinning the flywheel with a drill and setting how long it turns by itself vs with the spring? Can't think of any other way to test it.
As the spring bends it extracts some energy from the flywheel slowing it down slightly. Then the spring puts some of that energy back into the flywheel speeding it back up. It cannot put it all back in because bending the spring typically wasts some converting it into heat. So yes the spring definitely slows down the flywheel and it would definitly spin for longer without it.
it really doesn't matter if it goes longer mate - going longer is not the issue - the issue is energy transfer - it will only 'go' as long as it has energy - the number, arrangement and position of the springs and weights has no effect on the amount of energy contained in the flywheel - it gets that from my initial push. What we are then trying to do is transfer that energy. If it 'goes' longer all that means is we have transferred less energy per rotation and the more components we add the chances are the more inefficient the transfer as been
so?it really doesn't matter if it goes longer mate - going longer is not the issue - the issue is energy transfer - it will only 'go' as long as it has energy - the number, arrangement and position of the springs and weights has no effect on the amount of energy contained in the flywheel - it gets that from my initial push. What we are then trying to do is transfer that energy. If it 'goes' longer all that means is we have transferred less energy per rotation and the more components we add the chances are the more inefficient the transfer as been
I think saying "Spring Powered Motor" and "Ran and ran and ran" in the last video made people think the spring was somehow going to make the flywheel rotate for longer than without it.
I guess the confusion comes from, as the machine sits, there is no point to it. The force required to push down the spring will, at best, be equal to the force it pushes back up...but then w/ all the friction of that pin riding against the spring....you're better off just spinning a standalone flywheel. Now, if you have other ideas to use this, that's a different story, but in the 1st video, I don't think you made that clear. It was just - hey look at this flywheel driving a spring driving a flywheel!
it really doesn't matter if it goes longer mate - going longer is not the issue - the issue is energy transfer - it will only 'go' as long as it has energy - the number, arrangement and position of the springs and weights has no effect on the amount of energy contained in the flywheel - it gets that from my initial push. What we are then trying to do is transfer that energy. If it 'goes' longer all that means is we have transferred less energy per rotation and the more components we add the chances are the more inefficient the transfer as been
0:40 I've had horrific headaches since I was a s kid. Had multiple "head-scans" throughout life.. But, funnily enough: .. 1. I hate the word "funnily". Not sure why. But it's existence just irritates me. Especially considering the plethora of much better choices to use in it's place. 2. I care even less than you do about my last point made in No.1! 3. Through out the years I've never really got to see the images produced by these jello-microwaves that I've willingly stuck my head into. Until yesterday when I just got up after it shut down and marched marginally-straight(I got up to fast.) over to the connected computer and said;... "HEY, LET ME SEE MY HEAD SCAN IMAGE!".... Well, since no one was actually sitting there in the room when I blurted that out, The reaction was typical!.. Which many might disagree with me, but that response essentially holds the same value as "Yes Sir, ..Sure, come on back and look on the screen." Imagine my surprise today with Roberts new video here... This is essentially the same thing that was displayed on that monitor yesterday!
This is a fun experiment! Definitely not an over-unity machine, free energy hoax or perpetual motion device. What I like about it is it's a governed oscillator with a potential of adding contacts to employ a bifilar buck and boost coil set instead of employing a transistor. I think its brilliant and built one this morning at the shop. It was cold this morning and the guys copied what I was doing playing with different configurations of boat yard junk. We had fun playing with it for a couple of hours. We tried all kinds of configurations with different weights lengths and strengths of springs and different fly-wheels and resistance of bearings. It warmed up so we need to get back to servicing boats but this was a great break in routine. Thanks Robert!
nice one mate and i like your idea - thanks for sharing - oh one other thing it's cool to hear a sensible voice lol
Ignorant people like you would deny the existence of electromagnetism if you could. Try to be something other than a scientism worshipping sycophant.
@@ThinkingandTinkering hi can u put together this and archimedes wind turbine?
I noticed how everyone was pointing out that it's not more efficient than some other thing. To me though it's cool because it is a very simple way to use two different types of mechanical energy and motion at the same time. It could link together two devices in fun ways
exactly mate lol
Just to be clear as already stated yesterday, the flywheel will rotate longer if the spring or any other attachment is done away with all together.
it really doesn't matter if it goes longer mate - going longer is not the issue - the issue is energy transfer - it will only 'go' as long as it has energy - the number, arrangement and position of the springs and weights has no effect on the amount of energy contained in the flywheel - it gets that from my initial push. What we are then trying to do is transfer that energy. If it 'goes' longer all that means is we have transferred less energy per rotation and the more components we add the chances are the more inefficient the transfer as been
@@ThinkingandTinkering But this is not a resonant system. The resonance of the mass/spring system is very much higher than anything you've shown (other than when you plucked it). The flywheel would need to be turning at several hundred RPM to match the approximately 10Hz the mass/spring oscillates at. All that is happening here is that the flywheel pushes some energy into the spring as the pin descends then the spring pushes it back into the flywheel as the pin ascends. There is no "resonance" here as you would find in a tank circuit, guitar string or other resonant system. Sorry mate.
You may need to make a video showing a side by side comparison of the weight spinning with and without the spring.
I N D E E D. You get big brain award. 🏆🧠🏆
And in different directions
well folks could try and get hold of a very basic principle that is clearly explained here
If it spins longer with the spring, you'll violate Newton's laws. Which would be unlikely...
Lol, but we can't get enough of your content!@@ThinkingandTinkering
There's also the vibrator which was used to convert DC voltage to Ac. Was used in mobile vacuum tube gear. Supposed you could consider it an electro- mechanical oscillator.
This kind of setup reminded me of Autoparametric Resonance, where if you get the tension of a spring & the correct weighted mass hanging from it, it initially moves vertically, but then starts swinging like a pendulum, & reverts back & forth until the external forces make it lose enough energy to stop. (it can take a very long time until it does)
so, a small solenoid could keep this going enough to do work? The flywheels mass size maintains the frequency of revolution.
Yes, but no more work than that added by the solenoid.
yes it could mate
I think that this would have a great potential coupled to a mechanically triggered pulse coil. Maybe w/common shaft, and serpentine coil genny. Maybe? I'd love to see you botch one up Bobby. And as always, another, great idea for a series, btw.
If you're having trouble understanding what this is then remember the most important point is that the frequencies are the same and consider why that is more efficient than if the frequency was different on this same machine. Frequency is key here and doesn't apply in other types of motor like a piston and crank arrangment
Calling it a motor is what set people off.
The reason I brought up my concerns on the last video was that the video you were referencing was very different from the video you were trying to make. In the original video, the creator alleged that it was a spring *powered* motor and that this setup would keep the flywheel spinning longer than without the spring. And the video even shows this, with the flywheel accelerating steadily in the last run. Of course, most people with a science background would realize that this is impossible and conclude that they must have been powering it in some other way, such as a small electric motor. But it did strike me as odd that this wasn't originally addressed in the previous video, because that gives people the wrong idea that you're trying to accomplish the same thing the original creator was alleging, which is to power the motor with the spring. And it seems like that did end up being the case as there were several people comparing it to a setup with no spring.
As for the original video, its comment section is full of people talking about how to get it over unity and why they think it gets more energy than you put into it. And the video itself was even reuploaded by a much more explicitly free energy based CZcams channel.
The mechanism itself is still interesting on its own and I'd especially be interested in seeing it with some sort of speed controller on the flywheel to match the spring's resonant frequency.
There is no such thing as "free energy". Except for the extension cord I have running through the bushes to my neighbor's house...... anyway, it is a neat display of principle, but putting any real load on the flywheel will change how long it runs for. I really enjoy the videos!!
you are spot mate - cheers
I think a lot of people were comparing this system to a flywheel alone, and correctly thinking that a flywheel alone would run for longer. However, a flywheel alone is useless for many applications.
The better comparison would be this system vs a flywheel with a 4-bar linkage (such as a steam train) where reciprocal motion is required.
This example being more efficient because it delivers so much of its energy back into the flywheel when correctly tuned.
(Rob, correct me if I'm wrong)
no need mate - you are spot on
Adding magnetic bearings and setting a flywheel in a vacuum can help reduce frictional losses from the environment, but, of course, coupling it to the outside world then, might end up being slightly difficult...
Although, I suppose, if you have coils on the outside of the flywheel that keep it in perfect balance, the fields can both be the bearings and the driver/receiver simultaneously.
With an input 'motor' field, set so as to ensure the armature [flywheel] is not deflected against any other physical part of the device, in theory, it can sit there and spin for very long times, with magnetic resonance based on capacitance in a ringing circuit, making it a hybrid of both mechanical and electrical resonance.
One merely need put an optional tap somewhere along the ringing circuit wherein they can add another ringing circuit so equally tuned as to get the optimal power out, and into the system.
What blows my mind isn't the Physics. I'm familiar with the Physics because the math for it is covered in a standard first year course in Physics.
But what I'm very in awe of - is you using a barbell weight - for a Flywheel !
That, Robert - is Genius 😂
1:44 OOOoohhhhhh, ..... So that's what that ridiculously unstable bottom storage shelf is for. Thanks Robert!
Witchcraft on Halloweens day.
lol
My eyes are still spinning with rotational oscillation Robert LOL. Great clarification. ThaNK YOU FOR THE UPLOAD.
I was thinking it can even out the work of pedaling a bike since it's hardest to pedal when the arms are vertically aligned. Or to try to use an LC circuit to control an ebike motor (the motor being the inductor itself). I first would need to fix a big enough capacitor. Perhaps such a dongle like you have here can be used as a relay to charge the capacitor in time with the LC circuit oscillations from a battery. I very much also like your idea of transferring the bike suspension to rotational wheel motion
The spring cannot return more energy to the flywheel than the flywheel has already stored in the spring. So there is no gain. There has to be an external source of engergy to keep the system in oscillation. As Rob said, this is not a free energy machine. They don't exist!
In 1970s usa, the "kick n go" scooter was a flywheel and lever which you pumped. I thought it was genius
I think the free energy machine idea came from the previous video where you showed a cast iron one that seemed to go on much longer then expected. If a weight is attached to a crankshaft on the fly wheel, is that equivilent?
yes
What people are saying, is you put very little energy into spinning the flywheel, and it continues to produce the motion for a very long time not indefinitely, but for longer than what you invested in it there is no perpetual motion, but what there is is using the energy that is already being produced almost indefinitely in the universe around us. It is like solar energy. You can use it for all intents and purposes perpetually, because when it stops, we’re all dead anyway, the same thing occurs with wind, which is also created by the sun and the atmosphere interaction, the thing most. People don’t consider as a continuous energy source is gravity, and this is where it gets interesting creating an oscillating lifting system, and then as the weight returns downward generating energy. The thing you want to start looking into is if your flywheel is hollow and you fill it with a magnetic liquid metal that is like mercury. Now you can generate a magnetic field using a fly wheel assembly and you would have something quite fascinating. And of course, I find it very humorous that the government tells us how dangerous mercury is win for decades and hundreds of years we’ve played with it with barely any side effects. What do they not want us to do with it? This is your question to consider.
Now you just need a miniature Galloping Gertie above it, a little wind, a rod to shove the spring down lower, some fine tuning and feed energy back into the flywheel.
See how fast you can get that flywheel spinning and/or see how much energy you can store in the flywheel.
instantaneous action at a distance
The magnets that near the moving iron flywheel will create energy sucking eddy currents.
Hi Rob couple of tips to investigate
1) check it's speed
2) have the flywheel rotation same direction to earths rotation and (lined up) to earths rotation direction West to East , doesn't sound like a big thing but that's one force you don't want to go against.
Also if you can build one to rotate at 1800 rpm earths rotation speed you'll find a big benefit.
Hidden secrets , small gain but same as rolling flywheel down a very long small decline cheers.
I can see at the 4:00 mark that I could see adding gravity, pendulum motion, and coil wound around magnets and possible electric motor for interesting possible generator
Very good explanation & purpose statement.
Love this channel so much: gets the brain synapses goin' every time!
This discussion wouldn't be complete if we didn't examine the effect the field from those balancer magnets has on the spinning flywheel. Can we get some before-and-after calorimetry on that mass plate? Eddy currents and whatnot.
The adjustable lever spring might be a useful mechanism to be able to tune the optimal (SHM) damping/reinforcing to a windbar at different windspeeds.
I'm not familiar with the concept. Would you please explain?
Would it make any difference if the spring is at the top of the peg, so it springs down with gravity rather than against gravity ??
Non besides the tuning weight would sit at a different spot.
Thats a poor reply and non explanation. Dont reply to anyone else. The wheel would have to overcome gravity and nullify any benefit.
@@ChrisHillASMR What?
I answered exactly what he asked.
Admittedly in a very abbreviated form omitting details that have only negligible effects anyways but that still doesn't invalidate the answer in itself.
So don't you dare to elevate yourself with an answer that doesn't explain those minute details either.
And there is it again, YTs weird double post bug 🙄
This and the last peaked my interest. Thank you RMS. DVD:)
um so frigin glad you make videos . im so close to solving a dream i had about driveing a silent like gocart car . it had a crank that i used to crank on this box then once light cam on i got in hit sim switches for like lights and hit the throtal like on hydrstat hydrolics with nutiral pistion center . um fill im so clise to haveing my efinity nija i can all most fill the instat pow just like tnt. 😅😅. but yea i grew up in a junk yard so my dad hand fabricated his teactor and moved a hill into a gully with a grader blad as a dozer lol. but made flat land and farmed cars .said with live sock or crops theirs maintaince and rick of death bad crop. with junk cars theirs no vet bill ?? lol 😅. yea my pops was pretty wise yup. . um am serioys about solveing and makeing my forever car
mechanical from me cranking the fly wheel one way to compress the spring then lock light comes on and the click works begins to get a constat force . thenn maybe convert that to electric ? or hydrolic. if can get rpms for pressire up. fly wheel will help alot . was seeing gyroscopes in torpeadoes that was spring driven . it was rwally spinning yup . so think i about got it licked almost te for a makeing montauge yup . . hope truely you stay strong 💪 🙏 pray too yup. 😊😊
A rightful way to have prevented a misunderstanding is a side by side comparison ie with without!
or learn some very very basic physics - that's another option
Use the whole saw blade,held down in middle. Then put another flywheel on other end. Connect both flywheels wit a band, maybe 180 degrees apart. Will it keep going? Then use with the push button generator?
OK. So, I just need to move next to a Railroad Switch Yard, and make a BIG one of these, and park a weight hanging from a spring next to it to absorb the shaking of the ground and transfer it to the Flywheel setup.
Do I kind of see where you're going?
So would this improve an existing flywheel set up that has an outside force on it like your gravity generator bicycle flywheel?
Nice to see new things, and thinking about it. Thank you.
The Large wheel on the sewing machine continues to rotate because it has 'momentum'.. you said 'because it has inertia'.
Now I'm reminded of a video of many metronomes on a table staring out of synchronisation but all falling into step after say ten minutes. Vaguely I remember something about frog species falling into mass synchronisation with their calls .
'Difference harvesting' very clever adaption Robert.
cheers mate
5:40, The idea that some people thought its "free energy" is because you did not show the machine stopping.
Excellent physics teacher
The idea that it was a free energy machine was probably wishful thinking.
Your sewing machine example does not apply to damped spring oscillation and flywheel, or oscillating circuit analogy. I would compare it to a boost circuit, or mechanically, a gear reducer (~20:1) driven from the slow end. The treadle is a force multiplier (a lever) to make it easier to impart rotation to the large wheel because the treadle connects to the large wheel close to it's center. The drive belt riding on the outside edge of the large wheel multiplies the rotational speed imparted to the small (hand) wheel. The handwheel is technically a flywheel, but does not have enough mass to store it's energy for more than one rotation. It's purpose is for "smoothing" because, of the two actions of the sewing process (advancing the fabric and making a stich) that are completed by each rotation of the handwheel, one takes more force than the other. The last thing you want is a sewing machine that's hard to stop after you're done sewing. A needle through the fingertip is an ugly, painful experience.
How about spinning the wheel without the spring and then with the spring and see how much the difference is with a stopwatch people have the tendency to think that the spring is assisting the wheel when I say it's creating drag
I use Free Energy every day... when I ask my spouse for another Beer!🤪🤪
lol
It would be interesting to see if the rotational time constant is the same in a vertical orientation vs the horizontal one it was made in. I think I will make one of these and play with it
Rob, you need to remember 30% of all adults should not leave the house without supervision. 😄
..the reason why some see this & think energy is due to its continuous motion through a simple method. Our imaginations open up, why not a serpentine coil on the rim o the flywheel & magnets on a separate ring around it + a coil around the magnets on top o the flat spring 🧐
5:19 ::: THE MACHINE ::: IF THE SPRING IS ON TOP ::: AND THE MAGNET IS BELOW ::: ANDYOU PUT A MAGNET UNDER THE MAGNET ON THE BOTTOM WITH OPPOSITE POLE ::: THAN YOU HAVE A "GRAVITY MOTOR" ::
THAT IS A COOL IDEA
DO THIS !!!!
you do it
no time ... sorry .. but you know what i mean @@ThinkingandTinkering
The person speaking about the flywheel/oscillator system you showed in the end of the video said something about a capacitor, so I think it runs on some stored energy. However, his video was unclear. I don't know if he spoke of free energy or not, but I was unable to see any motor or electronic component.
When flywheel spins anticlockwise, the shaft push down the spring at longer end of the spring, but upward stroke push by spring at shorter contact point which is stiffer than downstroke. If the flywheel is spinned clockwise, push down is stiffer than pushing up, so it acts reverse. So it looks like direction of rotation matters
sure why not
Put a coil around the magnets/mass, you got a rudimentary solenoid that if paired with some electronic controller, could run the flywheel.
My theory is now that he's going to drive a flywheel somehow with windstalk oscillations, and then use that more evened out rotation for generation. I'm looking forward to seeing how one solves for converting that horizontal oscillation of the windstalk somehow into vertical oscillation to drive that wheel... maybe? I dunno - this is just my imagination running wild.
i ave already done that in a previous video mate
@thinkingandtinkering I saw one where you generate from wind stalks - 2079 - but it didn’t have a flywheel like this… which one had a flywheel? (Maybe I am using that term incorrectly)
The one I saw was the button generator which was using a ratchet mechanism to keep a wheel turning and the rotation was very stop and go… maybe I don’t understand it enough but it seems like if you could get a weight spinning with the mechanism from this video it would capture a lot more energy by being smoother and not having repeated “start up” costs for each turn that it seems are in the button generator…
Maybe I have a fundamental error in my thinking - that a smoothly continuously spinning weight spinning quickly would generate more output than the ratcheting button one… that each oscillation from the windstalk imparted into a weight would keep the weight spinning faster and capturing more energy than each buildup to get a ratchet to move another click…
So is the point to try and achieve/maintain a certain speed of the flywheel? It seems like that would be the result of the analogy to a tank circuit (pendulum or LC) where the idea is to maintain a certain frequency. That also seems to be what the mass-spring oscillator would tend to achieve.
If so, it seems like the Nyquist effect might come into play, and doubling or tripling of the resonant frequency (flywheel speed) would be possible. (Not sure how it would be useful, but it would be interesting to try and measure.)
One is good, how about adding a second or third wheel? How about asding multiple pins? More pins should give more power, right? 6 pins should provide 5 times more power as they fill in the empty area where the wheel is coasting down. Shortening the distance between pins should cause acceleration.
I'm seeing a larger rotor, in a vacuum . Magnets on the rotor and pulling just enough to get trickle chargers to work and poof. You have a very efficient long life phone charger, battery charger. Works on hard circuit, no chips. Am I taking crazy pills?
Wonderful simple explanation of a complex physics model. You have to laugh about as soon as you show something like this, people start commenting “Free Energy!” Like a video of a plastic bag caught up in a car park thermal is immediately a UFO. Oh well......
Interesting and simple, now to see it applied to ultra low energy consuming vehicles would be epic !
( Watch out for big auto company hitmen 😉)
A flat spring has less strength the further away from the mounting point. The rotation direction of the cam has to compress the spring farther away from the mount than where the release pressure happens. I think you are spinning the flywheel backward.
An "Elliptical Trammel" would be a better mechanical equivalent of a tank circuit. Unlike the flywheel/spring, it requires both parts to actually oscillate.
Could you turn the fly wheel with wind and use occilating action to say pump water from a well
Thank you :)
I like the idea of recovery of energy from the suspension of a car. Perhaps transferring the bumps using the 'self winding" mechanism to the spring or strait to the flywheel could generate power otherwise lost. especially in an electric car.
cheers mate
I found this to be a good showing to a tank circuit, now the oscillation does not seem to degrade over fairly short time, I think this could what is leading thought of over unity and trying work out how the spring helps keep the fly wheel going, when far as I can tail it don't do this. but really the fly wheel stores good bit of energy and the spring does not take very much energy to move and when there in match in tuning power lose is fairly small, so it seem to keep going with out noticeable degrade for a bit. I think this give a feeling that something more is happening.
It's not because the rotational frequency of the flywheel is no where near the resonant frequency of the spring/mass.
Reason being they don't realise it will run out but slowly
is there a way to use wind flutter to drive an oscillator as an energy generator? The damper would have to be adjustable to sustain maximum safe oscillation and the flywheel would have to efficiently accept subtle input. By the way, I love your videos. I wish I could have seen this when I was in school.
can you put the spring above the flywheel center line and try it with a larger throw "gear" to see if you can find the ultimate sweet spot for maximum efficiency or does gravity not care about placement/orientation?
Do you think moving the spring upwards to the top until it's unladen will oscillate more power between the spring and the flywheel thus theoretically increasing the flywheel size?. I think by having it at the bottom just decreases the friction time on the pin so it would spin longer. increase the spring length, line it up at the bottom of the pin when it's at the top then the effect would be enhanced, although friction on the pin would now have a more dramatic effect since it's present for most of the rotation.
What if it has multiple springs timed differently?
And bridges, a bridge could be fitted with a 10 ton struct a bit worse then the narrows bridge with a central rod to spin a generator, with a spring in the rod. To make the over stroke nondestructive! If 10 tons is moving it is building up alot of energy! Just the gravity pulling the crank down could spin a generator with a lot of force, if the wind moved it, or traffic got the bridge moving it could use a over drive gear, 6-24 strokes per minute, 10 tons at 1meter between 6 and 24 strokes / min. could be 3600-4800 +/- rpm easily.. and maybe 1kw/1000rpm Minimum.
A spin counter or timer would have been beneficial, does it run longer with or without the spring??
i think people got the wrong message by not showing the flywheel run by its self, and running down by its self, and the driven spring run through to stop (even if you edit it down or speed up the footage)
I'd love to see what you come up with with this one RMS
Smart but the oscillation would stop spinning the wheel unless the oscillation has enough force to attach to the driving spoke on the wheel ! I believe Active Kinetic 1 remains the easiest method to turn mechanical energy into electricity !
My OCD wants to mount the spring vertically from the base.
Well, al that stir and discussion about energy with or without a spring is due, at least, to the title "[...] Spring /*Motor*/" (emphasis on motor); the title was confusing for some of us ?
I think it's the word "motor" that's throwing me. I hear motor I think power unit. And yes, much clearer, thanks :)
i looked it up mate - apparently MIT define motor as 'any power unit that generates motion' - it certainly fits that definition - it might be that i was the power input - I gave the initial push to the flywheel - and we are mostly accustomed to thinking of the power input in a motor in terms of internal combustion or electricity and think of that as integral to a 'motor' - I would say it isn't - after all what is a jet engine but the 'push' of gas and a water motor but the 'push of a jet of water - but i see what you are saying
Could extra springs be added at particular angles to increase the spinning speed or drive a heavier flywheel?
Maybe even cause it to self start and run longer. You should try it .
So does it slow down and eventually stop.
People that think it would work for free energy are just simple-minded.
I don’t think it’s free energy! However close minded people wouldn’t believe the little they were allowed to read about Tesla because they were so simple minded they couldn’t comprehend beyond what their indoctrination taught them.
What happens if you place an additional spring on the opposite side -- 90 to 180 degrees out of sync with the current spring you have shown there? Will it cause a pick up in speed or a constant speed? Also, what if I took and put a magnet/coil assembly on the flywheel that would generate enough current to drive a solenoid that would push up on the tongue spring at the right moment to give it force on the flywheel? Would that aid in additional speed or constant rotating? If so, would that be enough to claim it were a motor that could drive a generator?
How badly would it reduce output if a generator was attached? 🤔
Use magnetic repulsion as the spring to reduce friction?
What if you used a pulley system to give the spring oscillator a mechanical advantage to put more torque on the flywheel?
lol,some peoples kids!
So say you were going to use this as battery charger in a car. Once a load was put on it would your speed have to increase to be at the best balance
The spring can't return more energy than you put in. Since the spring is compressed by the flywheel, I suspect the flywheel would run longer without the spring. The interesting way it looks makes you believe the spring is helping.
Cannot be used to recover energy from suspension movements? Independent of the recovery from breaking in electric engines....
I'm wondering how much the spring actually helps? Maybe try spinning the flywheel with a drill and setting how long it turns by itself vs with the spring? Can't think of any other way to test it.
I bet the spring only adds friction
As the spring bends it extracts some energy from the flywheel slowing it down slightly. Then the spring puts some of that energy back into the flywheel speeding it back up. It cannot put it all back in because bending the spring typically wasts some converting it into heat. So yes the spring definitely slows down the flywheel and it would definitly spin for longer without it.
it really doesn't matter if it goes longer mate - going longer is not the issue - the issue is energy transfer - it will only 'go' as long as it has energy - the number, arrangement and position of the springs and weights has no effect on the amount of energy contained in the flywheel - it gets that from my initial push. What we are then trying to do is transfer that energy. If it 'goes' longer all that means is we have transferred less energy per rotation and the more components we add the chances are the more inefficient the transfer as been
so?it really doesn't matter if it goes longer mate - going longer is not the issue - the issue is energy transfer - it will only 'go' as long as it has energy - the number, arrangement and position of the springs and weights has no effect on the amount of energy contained in the flywheel - it gets that from my initial push. What we are then trying to do is transfer that energy. If it 'goes' longer all that means is we have transferred less energy per rotation and the more components we add the chances are the more inefficient the transfer as been
Coupling is probably never going to happen in a car suspension system.
Why in vehicles can we not use the suspension damping to recover energy?
I think saying "Spring Powered Motor" and "Ran and ran and ran" in the last video made people think the spring was somehow going to make the flywheel rotate for longer than without it.
maybe
I guess the confusion comes from, as the machine sits, there is no point to it. The force required to push down the spring will, at best, be equal to the force it pushes back up...but then w/ all the friction of that pin riding against the spring....you're better off just spinning a standalone flywheel. Now, if you have other ideas to use this, that's a different story, but in the 1st video, I don't think you made that clear. It was just - hey look at this flywheel driving a spring driving a flywheel!
could this be used to generate electricity from waves ??
If you spin it to 100 rpm 2 times, once with the spring, once without, I’d assume the springed version would stop first?
it really doesn't matter if it goes longer mate - going longer is not the issue - the issue is energy transfer - it will only 'go' as long as it has energy - the number, arrangement and position of the springs and weights has no effect on the amount of energy contained in the flywheel - it gets that from my initial push. What we are then trying to do is transfer that energy. If it 'goes' longer all that means is we have transferred less energy per rotation and the more components we add the chances are the more inefficient the transfer as been
Not inertia, MOMENTUM.
0:40 I've had horrific headaches since I was a s kid. Had multiple "head-scans" throughout life.. But, funnily enough: ..
1. I hate the word "funnily". Not sure why. But it's existence just irritates me. Especially considering the plethora of much better choices to use in it's place.
2. I care even less than you do about my last point made in No.1!
3. Through out the years I've never really got to see the images produced by these jello-microwaves that I've willingly
stuck my head into. Until yesterday when I just got up after it shut down and marched marginally-straight(I got up to fast.) over to the connected computer and said;... "HEY, LET ME SEE MY HEAD SCAN IMAGE!"....
Well, since no one was actually sitting there in the room when I blurted that out, The reaction was typical!..
Which many might disagree with me, but that response essentially holds the same value as "Yes Sir, ..Sure, come on back and look on the screen."
Imagine my surprise today with Roberts new video here... This is essentially the same thing that was displayed on that monitor yesterday!
What do you think about turning a metronome into a generator?