@@krishbohra5536 Another myth that Oda has clarified. Kaido doesn’t have the fish fish fruit. He has the Fish Fish Fruit Model Azure Dragon. The same way Onimaru has Hito Hito no Mi Model: Monk. Kaido is not a fish.
@@acetofresh1 so why hasn't he chosen to drown if he's been trying to die for so long? It's still the fish fish fruit regardless of the model, it probably means dragons can breathe underwater too.
Really like option 4. Makes the most sense and it's definitely something Big Mom would do. It would also kill Kaido's dream in the biggest way and he would die in a similar manner Oden did. It would also be another demonstration on how savage Big Mom is and be a reminder to the audience that she is Kaido's senior and has been the Pirate game much longer.
That would make BM properly threatening as a villain. So far she came across more as a deranged child in the body of a monster, which isn't bad for a villain, it just doesn't sell the villainy as fully.
I wonder what'll happen to Perospero, now that he's beaten up by Nekomamushi? Maybe Perospero is gonna be the new Ceasar, being held captive against his will.
I think there is a sixth option: they become non hostile Big Mom could get Amnesia again and be perhaps talked into or outright get captured by the marines (since she's not as strong during her amnesiac state). Or she could befriend Luffy & Co. by partying with them. As for Kaido his goal was to see the next Joy Boy. That's why he was on Wano all this time. So with his goal fullfilled he might want to sit back and see what Luffy can do.
I like the idea of Big Mom and Kaido being sent off to some far away land, where they realize it's easier to just chill and have fun, rather than trying to amass power and influence.
I agree. Kaido was a lackluster villain who got happier and happier when luffy became a worthy opponent. then he kinda figured out he was joyboy who kaido was waiting for all along. while battling bajrang gun, he asked luffy what kind of world he wants to create. so I can totally see him laying back and watching what luffy will do.
Option 2 or 4 seems the most likely to me. However, it also leads to the problem that Big Mom and Kaido, even though they were defeated... are still amongst the most strongest people in the World. Literally, if they're allowed time to recover, Yonko or not, they're going to be a huge problem further down the line. Kaido is still the strongest creature alive, and Big Mom is still a force of nature. Individually, they're dangerous. So honestly, if they have no more purpose in the story, they're better off dead. Hell, dying from a Volcano explosion isn't exactly anything to laugh at, especially if you consider the damage they all took throughout the Raid.
Yeah narratively it makes sense. Luffy is pretty much demonstrating that he’s a big threat to the government, but if kaido and big mom were still alive and allied they’d be a much bigger threat. Oda wrote himself into a corner with these two unbelievably powerful characters. Even when they lost it didn’t feel legit.
Does not matter how strong kaido and Big Mom were in past narrative, the world has moved on. Without crew Kaido is not a threat. We also wants to keep some good opponent for luffy for future. Otherwise OP world will become so boring for luffy after endgame. IM and blackbeard will have to die because of that significance and threat to world, and rest of strong pirates like future yonko or law, shanks,kidd, mihawk, katakuri all are allies of straw hats. So if that ocean that luffy will sail, he will have no strong opponent that wants revenge, that is a boring adventure for luffy. Kaido and BM are out of picture for now but keeping them alive will be interesting. Like in epilogue every thing has happened, after a huge party, straw hats again sneaked off on ship. saying they are pirates even thought whole world is in their debt. Then they see an armada((Think Shiki vs Rodger pirate) at a distance with big mom and kaido on its helm. And luffy says lets do it.
tbh the only way I can think of for them to get captured is by akainu cause yes they were damaged by the raid and they've been in magma for a week now but they might have recovered imo either they somewhat recovered or they are ded so akainu 1 vs 2 extremely weakened yonkos while them being in magma would give some akainu hype and answer the question of how they got taken out from the volcano
I think Option 2: Volcano Escape fits in best with Oda's chief way of doing things. If they were team-rocketed out of that volcano to parts unknown it opens up the most potential for both characters. While Kaido is still an impossibly strong individual, his crew, yonko status, and tyrannical rule have been dismantled. This leaves him far from powerless, but much more limited in range and scope. What will he do now? As for Big Mom, her yonko status is also gone but her entire crew and empire were left completely out of this entire conflict so she has a few more legs to stand on. what will SHE do now? My gut tells me that if they survived, they'll be key players within the story, but never serve as main villains again, and as long as they do something interesting I'm more than okay with that.
At this point, this is what I hope for the most. Gives oda the chance to continue to flesh Kaido out and keeps two major wild cards active in the story.
Here’s what I see happening: Panel covers depicting Kaido & Big Mom climbing out of the volcano, and then living out the rest of whatever they’re doing. It leads up to both of them being shown to have regained some status, and then they both come back as wild cards in the final war.
I think the big mom pirates are gonna mutiny against big mom herself and exile her from Totland, under probably katakuri's rule being the strongest son, kaido I don't know what he's gonna do
@SMB superfan I super agree that they might come as wild cards to help Luffy against the Celestials. The fact that Kaido and Big Mom always thought of one piece means that they also never liked the Celestials and their methods of doing things. Especially , I'd like to see Kaido regretting to die or suicide again just because now he found Joy Boy and he might wanna live just out of curiosity and he might wants to witness how Luffy (Joy Boy) is gonna change the entire world.
Kaido has lived in Wano for the past 20 years while pursuing many different way to die. I think its ridiculous he would die from lava because surely, after living beside a volcano for the past 20 years, he would have attempted the most metal way of dying by jumping into the volcano. Him dying here would not only be anticlimactic, it would really make me question the intelligence of a man who wanted to die but was too stupid to notice the most obvious solution that was literally in his view for the past 20 years.
I think that maybe Gear 5 could have altered the lava to make it able to kill Kaido, it is capable of changes like that so all he would need to do was knock out Kaido
I wonder: is it actually known to the people on Wano, that there's a volcano under their feet? Has it been stated anywhere in the Manga they knew about it, before that panel with both BM and K in it? Maybe I've just missed that scene/comment in those four years, totally possible. To me personally it came as a total surprise that there was a volcano underneath Wano.
Kaido was already low health and unconscious when he was sent into the volcanic eruption. Also Kaido still wants a good grandiose death like Roger or Whitebeard since he says they did it right. Stupid comment lol
The reason Jack survived underwater for so long was because he was a fishman, so he could still breathe, however he couldn’t move. Big Mom and Kaido are humans so they wouldn’t even be able to breathe underwater, meaning surviving the second option is unlikely if they do land out somewhere.
@@dariuswilliams7509 ... which makes him able to breath underwater. That's why no one could kill him before. Queen said himself that 2cm of water is enough to kill a human being regardless of how powerful they are when he was drowning Kid and Killer. Since Kaido can breath underwater, that never worked on him before and he didn't die even when he sank all those marine battleships mentioned on his debut. He wouldn't be able to fly away during the sinking because obviously the marines cuffed him with seaprism.
I just can't imagine that Oda wouldn't clarified that they died. The word choice of how Big Mom and Kaido have "fallen" tells me that they're still alive and Odas gonna use them when he needs to
Nah Big Mom deadass said "don't you dare assume this will kill me" that woman has GOT to be alive, I feel like she really wouldn't just say that if she really wasn't confident that she was gonna live thru that. Makes me wonder tho if she saw herself falling into a pool of MAGMA and was confident enough to say that she'd live do you think she ever had an encounter with Akainu or someone else with the Magu-Magu no-mi? Bc Akainu is only 55 Big mom is like 70 so there is at least a 15 year time period when someone OTHER than Akainu had the fruit or nobody at all. And then, we don't know when he got it, there honestly is a chance she might've scrapped with a mag mag user. Just a theory tho
@@serotonin6404 Exactly, BM has to be alive definitely. Like, Oda wouldn't just drop that phrase for nothing lol. Not because he is Oda. But because he is the author. When you write your work, you don't just put things and make the characters do and say things because you feel like it, you do it with some kind of purpose (even it f it's just showing how your characters relax, eg). That was so specific that it has to mean "you, READERS, don't forget about this". It just scream to us that she will come back in some way! xD
i think its not disappointing at all lol. you guys shat on the fights as they were going so you couldnt see the absolute epicness that was the way big mom went down.
I feel like Kaido still has the potential to tell some interesting stories, so I hope Kaido isn't dead. Maybe even a mini redemption, because imo, Kaido is capable of changing. (Also I really like him as a character, so I have some bias :p)
really enjoyed the editing, sounds and the intro, I really like seeing this "more produced morj", great video. also think that the idea of big mom killing kaido is really cool
Big Mom rides around on a miniature sun, Kaido's final attack was turning into fire in his Dragon form, so I would guess they have resistance to heat. Also, why was Kaido defeated in his potentially weakest form (dragon form)?
Well his dragon form is the biggest so it definitely has the most sheer strength. Hybrid form is considered the "strongest" because its a balance between physical enhancement while also not losing speed and versatility due to a large, non-human body. Luffy's bajarang gun was literally just sheer power and strength, so Kaido's best answer is to use his strongest attack as well. If you asked Kaido to destroy a city in one attack, he would choose beast form over hybrid form any day.
Before I watch the video, my personal take is that they were sent flying Team Rocket-style out of Wano due to the eruption. We know that Big Mom's crew was still down there at sea level, and I doubt they were just sitting on their asses. They were trying to back Big Mom up all this time, and seeing that a yonko crew didn't manage to climb the waterfall, they surely are somewhere else following linlin's vivre card. As for kaido, maybe he went in the same direction, maybe not. But I'm sure they're alive.
My issue with this has always been: why wouldnt Oda show that? We got that sizable panel of the volcano erupting and not a hint of this anywhere in that drawing. Not saying you're absolutely wrong, just that if you're right Oda missed another opportunity to actually show rather than tell.
@@eman3061 I think they're both dead and it wouldn't make sense for big mom to be in another arc we already had her in whole cake island and wano. She's finished.
Since Kaido fell, my bet was on them dying. But I admit that is most out of spite because people seems to forget that the magma is the devil fruit with the biggest offensive power in the world, according with Oda himself, so, by that logic, if anything non haki related would badly damage any of them is magma. So, if any of them survived, either Linlin cheated death using Kaidou's life, or they got blasted in the eruption
Im offering option 6. They escape but are scarred and crippled . I mean we need both of them for the Rocks backstory. However, In order to remove their status as threats Oda might have made their wounds cause permanent damage. They simply would be able to operate with a fraction of their former power.
@@powerscallingfiendbro how many fights did kaido go through before fighting luffy once? Kaido literally killed/defeated luffy twice (if not 3 times) if it wasn’t for plot armor, sure luffy reached a level where he can 1v1 kaido, but full power kaido still defeats luffy in a pure 1v1
I believe this is the most realistic option. Because it takes it back to whitebeard vs akinu. When akinu hit Wb with the magma in the chest. It will hype up akainu and his magma attacks. Because if the magma can passively crippled Ex yonkos. It just boosts any akinus fights and damage output
I think the volcano escape is the most likely, the cracks that led to the sea are how they get out. But they probably are maimed and won't be able to fight as well as they did in the raid making them less of a threat (like Kaido told Oden after an hour of boiling). Kaido might accept Luffy's dominance over him and welcome the new Joy Boy. Big Mom seems like she will still antagonize Luffy but maybe the kids will have a say on this.
I agree completely, Oda has demostrated time and time again to be such a softie and that explosion wasn't just for the show imo, Kaido won't antagonize Luffy anymore so it doesn't really matter if he survives and Big Mom has been sort of a meme since quite a long, trying to get her hands on Luffy and the SHs but always failing somehow, even getting outfought by them without any monster trio present (they might have not damaged her but you don't need that to just survive an encounter with her), I totally see her appearing a few more times and they will always manage to avoid her just like Roger did.
"the cracks that led to the sea are how they get out." They are Devil Fruit users who escaped out into the sea??? 😂😂😂😂 you guys come up with some crazy stuff.
@@femiosusa510nah if you watched clearly there was an explosion or some kinda volcanic eruption that happened after both Kaido and big mom were thrown into the lava, if they survived they must've been carried back up by the eruption but still very weak and injured. Kaido might accept his defeat, but linlins ego is too big accept it and might come back. This is only if they survived, and so far, since we have yet to see if their devil fruits came back into circulation or not, it's likely to assume they're somehow still alive
@@yaseen9044 LAVA basically killled Whitebeard. It can kill Kaido and Big mom also.They are dead, they arent needed in the story anymore.They served their purpose in making Luffy into a Yonko. Its his story, not theirs, and its coming to an end soon.
Stone is just cooled-down magma, and seastone originates from Wano. My theory is that both Kaido and Big Mom are encased in seastone after flying out of the volcano, and since only the Kozuki know how to chisel it, they're essentially paralyzed. That way, Oda gets to remove them from power without killing them.
They have some pretty crazy durability but I doubt that they're immortal. If they are stuck down there, encased in lava (seastone) and unable to get out, they'd most likely starve to death, at least after a few weeks.
Up until now everytime Luffy beats the enemy, it had a mindblowing concluding effect - its one of those times you as a reader might think: „Ah, this finisher move makes sense!“ EXAMPLES: Crocodile was beaten flying up to the sky for the public to see him as the one behind the war - thus stopping the war. Enel was beaten by Luffy ringing the bell by the momentum. Rob Luci was beaten crashing the wall falling down from the building same way as Luci used to beat Luffy back in Water Seven. Doflamingo, a celestial, was beaten knocking from the sky down to the ground (also literally getting down to earth). When Luffy beat Kaido, both fell down to the ground. There was a panel showing how Kaido fell down and the next panel was Luffy falliing down and we can see Yamato running to catch one of the them and thats Luffy, while Kaido is falling down further.
Afraid of her. Also, I think haki or at least "will" is what you need to counter her ability, just like Law who is unable to move Kaido or Big Mom with Shambles due to their strong haki. So Kaido might not be able to defend himself in his current state. I can really imagine a gigant, more powerful BM making a new Napoleon with Onigashima's sword and a new Prometheus with Onigashima's fire. (Btw Moria's last transformation back in Thriller Bark would be a clear foreshadow if this ever happened)
I am in the camp of option 4, especially since oda left hints that the big mom ship was doing things in the chapter. Other then perosparo the rest of the children didn’t do anything without their mama, so for them to now make a move is a clue that she may be on the ship. Some say even kaido may be on there which idk, but it’s possible.
Whether one or both escapes, I believe they will find Pluton hidden in the magma, able to withstand heat, and able to dig underground. Sort of the opposite idea of Enel's journey to the moon, the 1 or 2 former Yonko will get a cover story through the center of the vearth
Why Big Mom ain't dead 1. Punk Hazard, the beggining of the Yonko saga. Luffy says he will beat all 4 emperors. - that's his goal. Did he beat BM? No. 2. There's an unresolved conflict between BM and Luffy - Fishman island. Have Luffy fulfilled his promise to declare Fishman island as his territory after defeating BM? No. Why? Cause he hadn't "kicked her butt" yet. 3. In WCI it is repeatedly stated that Luffy will COME BACK for BM. Oda set it up from then that BM will be dealt after Kaido. Also Katakuri asks Luffy whether he's gonna beat Big Mom, and Luffy answers "of course, i am gonna be the PK". This line is very crucial, it implies that for Luffy beating Big Mom is a necessary step for becoming PK. 4. Did BM defeat seemed final? No she literally says to us readers not to be foolish and believe she's dead. 5. You know how many established plot points would just fade away is this the end of BM? Especially Elbaf connections, her entire character arc is centered around her dream to collect every race in the world. When the villain is defeated - it's when fighting for his ideals and goals. In Wano she's defeated not for fighting for her primarily established goal( gathering all races and creating world of equality), but via a new created in a Wano country(alliance with Kaido to find the one piece) 6. How ridiculous it would be if BM died from bombs and lava?? So Big Mom is done temporarily, the one to permanently end her story will be Monkey D Luffy. In Elbaf or WCI..
Yea kaido can stay down but BM has to get back up because there too many motivations related to her and luffy. Her crew is literally on the move rn there no way she can stay down.
It was reiterated Kaido owed Big Mom his life due to God’s Valley and his DF. It would make a lot of sense if she escaped on the ship clashing with the Marines rn.
Oden survived hours of being submerged in boiling oil, kaido and big mom have been explicitly described as having bizarrely thick skin, so maybe it’s a hint to their survival in the lava pit?
He didn't boiled to death though, he was shot before that happened. And he wasn't a yonkou with unusually strong skin xD Yes, it sounds cheap, but there are ways for them to survive as nothing is written/proven yet (we got no reactions of anyone, which at least is quite suspicious...).
I like option 4 the most, Big Mom and Kaido honestly in Wano were underwhelming for me, giving Big Mom an opportunity to at least show of the 2 clearly more villainous Yonko of her and Kaido how powerful she is is something I would take. Plus I also like how it ties into the theme of betrayal and trust between pirates that hasn't really been explored in the arc but as you said Morj references a fair few times, I'm yearning for Wano to pay off more for what it set up that's where my head is at with this.
Saying Big Mom or Kaido were underwhelming makes no sense. You're only saying that cuz they lost and they kinda have too for the story. I really think yall just complain about anything sometimes lol
Big Mom wasn't underwhelming but she most definitely could have been better had she been coating her attacks in conquers haki during the fight then her defeat would've felt more justified. Kaido on the other hand was totally amazing. Bro search "kaido vs Luffy manga full" on CZcams and you'll see how much of a savage he was. He knocked out Luffy 2 TIMES and KILLED ONCE. RE READ THAT. LUFFY GOT KNOCKED OUT 2 TIMES AND KILLED ONCE BY KAIDO. Bruh come on, it's not Kaidos fault the awakening of the Nika fruit was too much for him to handle, Luffy literally became on par to Kaido or maybe even a little better in terms of durability after awakening. He got stronger than Kaido, he could've ended the fight a lot sooner had he been more serious instead of playing around trying to figure out how his awakening works. Anyone saying Kaido is underwhelming is nuts, you're probably saying that because you didn't see him awaken but fuck who cares. Kaido got fucked up at the end but don't act like he wasn't fucking shit up the entire time. Just remember he's the only antagonist in the story that's managed to kill Luffy and I say kill because once ones heart stops, you're presumed to be dead which was the case for our protagonist.
I would say big mom is the only one that is underwhelming to me. Kaido is definetly surpassed my expectation. If we just had more kaido flashback it would make him a perfect character. For big mom I don't like the way how oda handled that character. Most of the time(before BM vs law&kiidd) oda made her a joke character like how SH embarrassed her. Like cmon she is a yonko. I know oda is trying to make a joke scene. But that makes her a less threatening. Even in rooftop fight we can see supernova are mostly focus on fighting kaido. I didn't feel her as a villain/powerful/threatening character that I felt in wci arc.
@@thetruth997_ my guy the amount of ppl that thought Kaido and/or Big Mom were ending the arc in a W is negligible compared to the amount of ppl that are dissatisfied with a lot of the arc's conclusions. Even ppl that thought the raid would fail only thought so in the context of them losing the fight on onigashima, not Wano ending in a loss for the Straw Hats
I think it's kinda counterintuitive to kill Kaido. He was looking for a magnificent death BECAUSE nothing in this world could kill him. Giving this big bad what he wants defeats the purpose.
I don't know how much this is, since I think dying unconscious and melting into lava isn't a glorious way to die. Oda gave an honorable death to Roger and Whitebeard for being good people, Kaido is the complete opposite so he would deserve a horrible death. I think this is as simple as that.
I mean, not really. All that matters is putting him out of commission. If he dies, getting what he wants, who tf cares? It would just be less satisfying because people want revenge, but taking down Kaido isn’t merely about revenge. It’s about taking back Wano. Revenge is purely secondary. Depriving him of what he wants is nice for readers, but objectively it’s in no way necessary
I think it’s reductive to say that Oda “just puts defeated villains in Impel Down”, imo a more accurate take is that he provides narrative reasons for why they won’t “just come back and do it again” when Luffy leaves. Crocodile is out of Impel Down, but he isn’t going back to Alabasta any time soon. That goal is dead, and his character is in a different place than it was 850 chapters ago. He has different goals and a different motivation now. Something similar can be said for CP9, or Enel, Moria, or hell even Wapol. These characters are all at a different place in life that doesn’t line up with their past ambitions.
@@ryanmitindonga1128 right. So traveling to the moon/his past business in Skypia isn’t his goal anymore. His character is in a place where it make sense that he wouldn’t return to finish off Skypia
For all I know, Kaido and Big Mom could be floating in molten sea prism stone atm. I'm not so sure about them coming back, but it would be untypical for One Piece that the ones defeated by Luffy actually die and it would be great to see these two characters again.
Kaido is one thing but his backstory has a lot of holes that were withheld for obvious reasons and so if he isn't the one to tell the full story regarding Rocks in his POV it'd be a lingering question of how such a significant event effected him, even Big Mom didn't know why he disappeared. And speaking of BM she has more of a chance considering the last chapter mentioned her crew intercepting CP0 and most likely leaving Wano. They wouldn't just leave Big Mom because at the end of the day they are loyal to her as her children. Ntm Oda made her quote that what happened wouldn't be enough to kill her, so chances are pretty good for her being alive.
I've been saying the Rocks flashback needs to happen in Wano so that Blackbeard's connection to Rocks when he comes in the Elbaf arc is already contextualised. Also like you said Kaido's entire character was shaped by his time with Rocks. The last panel with them in the lava simply isn't a conclusion. We've heard that the Big Mom pirates likely took out the WG ships, I bet they're both being hospitalised, utterly wrecked by the lava, only able to talk and think about how they got there.
@@ThatCringeCalledIggleboz That's... actually a great idea. Like, yeah, that way they would come back someday but if they're too hurt NOW, they won't be a problem for the time being, which is the main point 🤔 I like it! 👍🏼
Seeing how Zeus seems to be a powerup for Nami, and how we've seen that homies disappear if the user dies, I think it's more likely that Big Mom will not die here
I still don't understand how Nami can control Zeus, which he is literally made from a part of BM soul. You mean to tell me BM can't recall back something she created with her own DF? That's crazy to me.
@@wegipciacocomas Exactly. We've seen Mother Caramel made homies, but it seems she didn't really made anything particularly useful with them, outside of for show. And since no one reallt feared her, nor she wanted to die (she just wanted to be retired with a lot of riches, so, she more than likey wouldn't spend her own soul to make more homies), all her hormies would have been probably short-lived.
@@ThatControlUser Bad analogy, you can't just BM powers without her having control of it. I know they gave a reason why Nami is using Zeus she needs a power up but, according to how BM DF works she should still be in control of Zeus.
I’d like to see Kaido and BM crippled by the magma and attacks they took, like being blind, missing limbs, permanent organ damage, and their Conqueror’s spirit being weakened. This way Kaido can come back as an ally of Joyboy without making Luffy’s alliance too strong and BM can come back as a minor villain in Elbaf but her defeat won’t have to be drawn out. Shanks, Fujitora, and Kyros kind of proved that disabling people doesn’t really make someone too much weaker though, so idk if this option makes sense in One Piece.
It will be incredibly disappointing if they died from that. After all, Kaido has been captured and defeated many times and never been able to be killed. Big mom whs shown to be basicslly indestructable.
We have another Madara problem. Oda made the villians so powerfull that it would be illogical for them to be defeated in the story. I think he should've just stuck with the whole "Super powerful, but can still get stabbed" thing with Whitebeard because even tho he was the strongest, it made sense when he got hurt. With Kaido and Big Mom however, Oda hyped up there durability so much that people think they should be absolutely ok after being unconsious in a magma chamber for 7 days. Presumably with no oxygen.
@@YokaiGotha i dont think that it's a problem and that oda should have done anything differently. The emperors are too strong to kill, but not too strong to be defeated, and that isnt a bad thing. Big mom and kaido were the most influential people in the new world an i think they should keep being a part of the story, because they are too strong to stop being a part of the story. The video kept trying to find a way to keep them out of the story, but they arnt going to be and dont have to be. Big mom and kaido def can be defeated, but that doesnt mean that they have to stop playing a role.
what would be a satisfying send off? the story just couldn't continue if luffy was getting chased by big mom and kaido while fighting his next opponents like blackbeard. unless luffy manages to flip them into allies for the final war then they're going to be out of the story.
I have a strong conviction that Kaido will, someday, become an ally and then he will die in the final war, but not now. For me, that would be the perfect closure for THE character that had most related things with Joy Boy until now. First a villain to the Sun god, and then an ally. Out of every option you presented, for that to be the case we need 2 things. First, he has to be alive and not captured (or eventually escape, which seems likely, since King is a big reason why I feel like Kaido may become an ally). Second, he has to discover some motivation for fighting along side Luffy. Both of these options may be possible with option 2 or 3. He may discover some important thing in a random sky island that motivates himself to help Luffy bring the dawn of the world (passing through a redemption arc, kinda like Crocodile in MF, but more actively), or he may develop an even bigger hatred towards the WG and swear to destroy it (in that case he would be an ally by conviniece, kinda like Kid or Bege). My only problem is Big Mom. I honestly don't know where she could fit in the story. PS: Saying that Kaido will become an ally doesn't necessarily means he will become a good person. Bege is a horrible person and became allies with Luffy, and so are the Germa 66, and even Crocodile in impel down (and to an extent, even Kid). Luffy does make alliances with bad guys some times, if their goal is similar. And I also don't believe Luffy hates Kaido more than he hated Crocodile for example for it's allience to be a no go (unlike Doffy or Akainu, which idk if he would ever work with).
Ikr The way Oda wrote Kaido is so different from so many previous villains. He's the only person I can imagine standing with Luffy, as compared to the other villains.
Knowing big mom she's very ambitious and disloyal she might leave kaido for dead at wano while she calls loki in order to make a move on shanks territory loki is still in love with lola!!! So she'll be at elbaf to try and overthrow the kingdom big mom isn't knew to taking over kingdoms also big mom knows about the secret treasure tree adam which is actually a devil fruit tree and where she stole kaido dragon fruit!!! Kaido will be executed at holy land instead of having a public execution like roger they executed him underneath holy land!!! I'm Sama was the one who killed him since Oni race was an ally of joy boy kaido dies wishing he was luffy nakama!!!!
@@mridstaid414wdym bro this happens in every story not just anime. It’s pretty obvious that Kaido wouldn’t be an enemy if he comes back because he’s not strong enough to challenge Luffy and Joyboy is specifically stated to fill people with joy/whatever and get them on his side. Ur gonna have to take that argument up with the series creator because he already explained it, whether it satisfies you or not
@@marcialopez7228one of the Manga chapter covers revealed Lola is now married to beges right hand, so loki is not going after her, and maybe he's already with someone else. There is absolutely no way anyone in Elbaf welcomes linlin back, especially not hajruddin, who's bringing back the giants pirates
I think Big Mom will make an Alvida-like return in her Hot, young, Roger area appearance. That she will sacrifice all her lifespan except for, say, one year or one month, in order to regain her peak powers and get revenge/get out of the magma. It will be just like with Alvida
The immediate thing that makes me think Kaido at the very least is still alive, is that at the very least in the anime, it showed him sinking INSIDE the lava without any visible damage from the lava itself - meaning he could very well find a way to emerge from it later. Big Mom I'm much less sure about, and her life flashing before her eyes gave me more of a feeling of finality than anything relating to Kaido.
Option 7: they're both alive and show up again in the series, maybe with slightly different roles; maybe as allies, maybe again as villains Personally, I feel killing one or both of them off in this way would be extremely lame and is the least likely scenario.
im not trying to start a fight but how is it extremely lame. i thought it was lame aswell that he was defeated "quickly" and by a big punch, but sending him down to the lava pits and having a giant eruption be the panel where kaido is proclaimed dead was utterly amazing. Boiled to death just like Oden, His death was not grand in the way he wanted it to be. Luffy denies him his one and only dream while also killing him just like Oden. Its PERFECT. like really try to actually write a better ending to this conflict, its possible but this is nothing to complain about
@@SunnyOddny it's ok but the problem is Kaido was the biggest villian in the series. And he wasn't fleshed out like his predecessors like katakuri and doffy. And those two villians were awakened, but the final villian of the saga doesn't have an awakening? It's all too rushed it seems oda downplayed his significance he could have for a reason
@@oliverbicanic8517 Kaido will most likely be fleshed out in a backstory with the rocks pirates in the future, right? and also remember we dont really know anything about awakening with zoans except the guards couldnt control theirs, kaido is probably already awakened in some sort of way
@@SunnyOddny Because their death will then happen off-screen. Usually when Luffy defeats a villain for good it's a triumphant moment illustrated and told unambiguously. If they were to have been killed, it should have been definitive at the moment they were defeated, not relayed to us later, almost as an afterthought. Not to mention the fact that, as mentioned above, Kaido's backstory is incomplete. There's so much we don't know about his backstory and motivation and how exactly it ties into Joyboy. And the fact that he ties into Joyboy makes me think he'll resurface later when we learn more about Joyboy and the Ancient Kingdom
You missed option 7: Kaidou wakes up in an Island somewhere without his followers, withour is factories, withour his son, with absolutely nothing of the vast empire that even for him took decades to build. And just retires. A Yonkou alone is strong, but is not a Yonkou, and in Wano Kaidou lost everything he has. He has to start everything from scratch, and he may not be interested. He got to see Joyboy, he saw the hero he wanted to see, he lived to have his great battle he wanted. And he can't just get back alone and pretend his empire still exists. He could just retire. Big Mom still has her sons, empire and island. Altought the mini-story of Germa is exactly about Big Mom losing what remains of her empire. And her last words, about how miserable she has been ever since Roger died, and that she didn't enjoy having this target on her back for the new generation that made her life hell, makes sense for her to retire too. It would take another 10 years to rebuild what they have lost, they are old, and either didn't really enjoy the empire they built, or have their emotional need fufilled by their last battle. So they can now just watch what will happen with the world. Not very different of what Rayleigh is doing.
My one thought on this, ever since they first showed them down there, that alot of people tend to forget that one of the few people to be killed off so far was whitebeard, another emperor. I also agree that he basically has to kill them for the story, since it doesn't really make sense for them to stick around or come back as enemies again (except maybe in movies). Edit: I suppose option 2 could also be viable if they only come back in cover stories like Morj mentioned, but I still think death is the most likely outcome that makes the most sense to me
Imagine how bad this makes Sakazuki look if they survive a week in magma. I see this as Kaido dying through boiling like Oden did but obviously his death wouldn’t be seen as glorious like he wanted.
True, Akainu is being setup to be a big villain yet two characters that Luffy can beat can survive in magma for a week? Maybe Akainu's magma is way hotter or he awakened?
Bruh I’m tired of seeing this. No way natural magma has the same lethality as concentrated magma from someone who’s most likely awakened and has coc coating plus advanced armament . Stop this narrative
If they actually *die* in the lava, it’s just disappointing. Not even including the *how* they were defeated. Also very questionable. Alotta chapters in this arc have been chalked up to “wait til the anime drops maybe it will clarify/fill this in”. This topic might not be an exception.
The "wait til the anime drops maybe it will clarify/fill this in" are all fights that would have slowed down the raid tho, it would not make sense to cut such an important part from the manga
Kaido respects Joy Boy so he might respect Luffy and become more like White Beard. And Big Mom has a split personality, Linlin, which was protective towards Strwa Hats. This might foreshadow Big Mom becoming more of an ally rather then enemy or at least neutral. We saw enemies becoming allies, I wouldn't surprise if that's the case. They have a mutual enemy, marines, and somewhat similar objective building a big family and protect the people they love.
yea in my opinion, he been looking for someone to dfeat him all these years plus they know how long thye been fighting for the one piece since even roger, and to have been defeated i believe theylll come to accept that luffy is the one and just live in seclusion as they watch the next pirate king, id think theyd understand that its something more than being strong to become king, its the ability to bring everyone together even enemies ;)
Personally, I don’t think its so ridiculous to conclude that they are both dead and gone, BUT, I also think that Big Mom could potentially survive and reconstitute via her soul powers. She basically has an entire kingdom made of her life force.
I like Option 4 the most because it combines the cunning and treachery of Big Mom with the indomitable strength of Kaido to become something stronger than the two by themselves. It would make sense for Big Mom to coerce Kaido into giving up his lifespan if it means dying a true warrior's death. Even if it means being a thrall to get that. And really, it'd be a devilish twist of irony, imo. Kaido is the pinnacle of Zoans, but even the strongest of animals end up trophies for the human who outsmarted him.
Personal theory.. Morj was partially right with his video on the raid. The problem is he didn’t realize because of this analysis that the raid was destined to succeed. Morj pointed out that Kaido is being written in the style of a protagonist and therefore would have his power up last and win. However it was the opposite if you think of Kaido as the hero of ACT III he becomes destined to fail only to come back and reclaim Wano in ACT IV, due to kabuki play structure. Now I don’t think he comes back a villain I think that’s where Odas twist comes in to bring him back as a believer in Luffy being joyboy but still be the “hero” of Wano. Like Luffy said he doesn’t want to be known as the hero and so I think this twist plays well together and if looked at in this light can bring a new respect for the Wano saga.
Seeing how the story has continued the way it did and nothing was shown that could imply that one of them survived, i haven't changed my mind and still think option 5 is the case. They are both dead😅
me too, oda has a lot of characters to focus on in this saga (strawhats, shanks, buggy, teach, garp, aokiji, admirals, mihawk, sabo, dragon, kuma, gorosei ...) kaido and big mom are done
I doubt big mom would be able to steal kaidos life force at all because it’s been made clear he doesn’t fear death and he doesn’t exactly fear big mom either
I think that kaido could offer up his lifespan to big mom. Wanting the warriors death and has been set up as a suicidal character just seems fitting. Could be interesting if big mom leaves him with a few seconds and we see him thinking how Oden felt since they’d die the same way. As far as big mom this could set her up nicely to show up to elbalf. This time as she shows up with her crew we could see Katakuri finally standing up to her and the rest of the big mom pirates behind him. Alone it would just a fight between luffy and big mom. This would be a good moment for luffy to show 1v1 no planning, no scabbards, he can take on a yonko on his own
Just finished your 4th of July stream. Just wanna second that Hajime no Ippo and Eyeshield 21 are indeed the best sports mangas. You really should give them a try!
The only way I see them coming back is if Kaido comes back as a member of the Straw Hat Grand Fleet now that he knows Luffy is Joyboy, and Big Mom is only relevant in Elbaf now and the story of the giants there
I think Big Mom is coming back. Unless Oda decides to suddenly throw a curve ball, it's looking like the next One Piece arc is gonna be related to Elbaf especially now with the appearance of the Giants during Egghead arc. And Big Mom is a huge part of the Elbaf history, so there's no way her part of the story is finished, plus you also gotta consider that Pudding is involved with the Blackbeard Pirates, what happened with the BM Pirates after Blackbeard Pirates attacked on Whole Cake, the other fraction of BM Pirates that are around Wano that's supposedly trying to rescue Big Mom, Zeus still being around and alive despite that (on theory) he should be gone too if Big Mom did died....there's just a lot of factors, Big Mom is most likely returning. And I really hope so, I would love to see the actual final battle with her, considering Luffy's promise to her of "After I'm done with Kaido, you're next Big Mom!" And as far as Kaido goes, uh, I think he's pretty much done with the story outside of occasional flashback appearances.
I like the Big Mom stealing the remainder of Kaido's life span option. Unlike most I don't mind her as a antagonist, and I think Kaido being denied his grand death and instead dying in ignominy and betrayal where no one can see is very poetic. World: "Ay, what happened to Kaido?" Big News Morgans: "He got packed up by Luffy and nobody ever heard from him again" Perfect.
That'd be good in my eyes I like Big Mom tbh. After all they did say most pirate alliances end in betrayal, and we know BM likes to slime people out like she tried with Germa. She slimes out Kaido, her last words to him being something along the lines of "you aren't getting your glorious death. I'm your senior after all" or something like that. I feel like it would be beautiful for Kaido bc duhh and it would subvert the idea everyone has that Big Mom isn't a 'real' yonko bc how you gone slime out KAIDO of all people.
Really good points. What I think is the more "Oda like" thing to happen is to keep them alive doing something else (the cover story maybe?) but that's still kind of odd given the importance and power of the characters, so the more plausible possibly seems to be that they are both dead, or at least one of them (Kaido) and the other one may be crippled in some way, so that they can't Act right now. Ofc we are speculating here, so I don't really lean to any option.
I had to look up how jack survives in water at the part he got wrecked by zuneisha and come to find out jack is half fish man so he can still breathe underwater. Just can’t move since he has a devil fruit
I concur, in land, air and Sea,, sea? Kaido's supposed to be the strongest in these areas but we've yet to see the sea part, it probably wouldn't play out as with Jack underwater, there's also the 'hundred beast part'
In the past I might have given a lot more weight to "Oda had Big Mom say this was not enough to kill her," but Wano specifically was chock-full of quotes and statements that went nowhere. Maybe Big Mom's is just one more of those. Personally, I wouldn't use it as any sort of evidence that she's not done.
by those fans logic if somone had a gun pointing at me i say you better not think shooting me is enough to kill me so after he shots me i wont just because i said it wont i swear some op fans are so dumb
I really like your idea of big mom stealing Kaido's lifespan when weakened, killing Kaido for her to be able to return later. I had not heard that idea before and I really really really want it to happen now.
I think Volcano Launch fits best with Odas style. The volcano errupting seems like merely an asthetic touch to signal the end, as well as a logical thing to happen after the magma under the island got disturbed so much. It is something that gets stuck in the attentive readers mind, but something they can't be 100% sure of until Oda actually confirms it many many chapters later. Think of Sabos "death" in Luffys flashback, we got a couple panels that strongly suggested Dragon saved Sabo, but we couldn't 100% be sure of it until he came back 100s of chapters later.
Thank you for that bit about Big Mom’s “unfinished business” with Elbaf. I’ve been saying for years that Big Mom has absolutely zero motivation to go to Elbaf. The community has been endlessly regurgitating that headass take for so long and it’s just irritating at this point. Her whole gigantification plot was to get around having to go there in the first place! Rather than voicing any explicit desire to go there at some point, she has explicitly given them the cold shoulder. People need to understand that Big Mom’s backstory containing plot *points* in Elbaf is not the same as her backstory containing plot *threads* in Elbaf.
What I am asking myself for quite a while now, when Big Mom dies, shouldn’t that deactivate her devil fruit powers, meaning all the homies would turn back into objects again like we saw with sugar? Nami would then lose her poweup with Zeus. But even if she isn’t dead but rather unconscious, the same thing should happen shouldn’t it. Either way the homies should turn back to normal. Except it was stated somewhere that this fruit works differently. Kind of never saw that anywhere popping up as a topic.
Exactly! Big Mom can't just die after Nami finally getting Zeus back. Would be very disappointing if him just outbound the DF powers for the sake of Nami's development
Homies have their own life force because of BMs power. It's not the same as Moria's/Sugars as it would mean she would be revived and she'd revive anyone once her DF deactivates where everyone she took lifespans from would get it back. Her power is more of a permanent change and that makes sense as there are conditions which must be fulfilled to activate it.
@@tbu987ify I understand the when she takes someone's life force and implants in objects that's more of a permanent change. To not have control over something you literally created out your own soul doesn't make sense to me, which means Nami has control over a part of BM own soul by force. They would've been better off just having BM agree to let Nami keep Zeus which would've made alot more sense.
Big mom said she wouldn't die by the likes of law and kid and i know you can't put too much emphasis on words but she is a yonko so she might be alive and then escape wano with the big mom pirates ship Kaido um..i don't think you can keep him caged or restrained..he is just that powerful so i think he is dead..if he isn't and he is just unconscious or somehow finds himself to a abandoned island then i would like to see how he will enter the story once again
Kaido & Big Mom have been defeated and most of the time when an enemy gest defeated they aren't relevant as an antagonist anymore and get taken out the story somehow.
hey morj, love the video, what about a combined option where they are imprisoned, but also relocated. we know that both island clouds ( pyrobloin), and sea stone comes from volcanoes. With both BM & Kaido being in a volcano, they probably can't move due to sea stone effects. If the volcanic eruption relocated then, they would be covered in magna making it a molten prison even after it hardens.
I think the most narratively satisfying solution here (at least for me) is the volcano escape but have it be underwater where Kaido wakes up first (having a zoan regen) and uses dragon fish powers and good genetics to lift himself and big mom out of the sea. Flashback ensues, Kaido’s debt is repaid, big mom’s crew arrives and Kaido passes out from exhaustion (cause water and magma don’t lift your energy very well) and maybe a flashback happens and both emperors are alive albeit without kaido’s crew, and then they come to the final battle cause neither of them like the world government. Big mom’s Elbaf arc starts sometime between the final war and now. Now that Ithink about it Kaido doesn’t hate Luffy, and does hate the world government, so I don’t see a reason for him not to join in on their side (except that Luffy and the straw hat crew all hate him) which would bring up some interesting dynamics and other stuff. The end.
The option 4 with big mom surviving by using kaido's life force seems somewhat plausible. It may be possible that big mom turns the lava into one of her homies with the help of kaido's life force and gets carried out of the volcano with the assistance of a potential new lava homie.
Its kinda confirmed tho that people fearing her is the condition for the activation of her soul stealing power - soul pokus? - and if anyone thinks there is a world where Kaido is afraid of her, I'd like to know what story they've been reading^^
@@smichael7852 neither bm, nor kaido ever mentioned an awakening, which given how big a deal it is, one would assume they would if they used it. But the fireform and the eating your own soul for strength sure do look like what you'd expect their awakened powers to be...
I love Big Mom's character. I love how she was ripping the Sunny apart during their escape. Her power is ridiculous and plus she's pretty savvy. I hope Oda brings her back in a big way--so she can be properly defeated by Luffy at Elbaf.
I forget what it's called, but I remember in Wano they discussed part of the process to make sea stone involved volcanic magma encountering ocean water. I think that BM and Kaido have been sealed in sea stone either somewhere in the volcano, or blasted out with the eruption. But encased in sea stone is the only way I can imagine either of them being contained.
I think you forgot the scenario of Crocodile who, for personal reasons, fought alongside Luffy at Marineford. Similar thing can happen with Kaido and Big Mom. I say this mainly because I think Oda is saving their awakened forms for the final saga.
For some reason I can't shake off the feeling that the strawhats have made a colleague out of Kaido. Will we see him face off against Green Bull to protect Wano and the straw hats? Maybe. That might be a way for him to get the heroic death he always wished for. Saving BM along the way will close his arc as he returns her gratitude for gifting him his zoan devil fruit. Seems simplistic but I kinda dig this. That will also up the ante in terms of the Navy's fire power for the final colossal struggle, what with an admiral being able to defeat Kaido.
@@DonatiVI Big mom used advanced haki against page one but didn’t against kid and law she was obviously Nerfed just like Katakuri Enel Crocodile and law during dressrosa
Imagine that Big mom and Kaido do survive, step back from the main storyline, 30-40 years pass they become old and take over a small side of the grand line (maybe some of Kaido or Big moms older territories) while Luffy rules as the pirate king, setting them up to be the antagonists of another pirates story. Wouldn’t that be interesting
I think big mom killed Kaido, and escaped Wano. Then on her way home/to elbaf, she will end up being attacked by the marines and killed by their new weapon, the one that's supposed to replace the warlords. That's a solid way of hyping up how powerful the new marine weapon is, and gets big mom out of the story, and they can kill her while still keeping the info about what the weapon is a bit unclear. Just show big moms corpse, some reaction images from perospero/smoothie/daifuku and have them say some comments about not believing what's happening, and then show the silhouette of the weapon
Damn dude/dudette, that sounds like a legit theory that could happen! I can almost see it in my head. Maybe big mom doesn’t even necessarily kill kaido, but mortally sounds him even worse than they are when they come out the volcano, and this betrayal could lead to kaido maybe not having to be killed, but potentially redeemed? Or something… still, great idea yo!
@@Faintwolf Yeah, I think it would also help put Katakuri into a part of the story that would make sense for him, he's all about self-sacrifice to protect his family, and he was at odds with Big mom in many ways. So if the marines kill BM, and imprison Pero/smoothie/daifuku, he'll surely make an attempt at rescuing them, which ends up having him be indirectly on the strawhats side, and the remnants of the BM pirates are basically katakuri, cracker and brulee who all 3 have some history with luffy
dude that's actually a great theory and could be executed really well. We last heard of CP0 coming into contact W Big Moms ship and then going dark. Possibly, a HEAVILY injured Big Mom being nursed back by her crew only to get pulled up on by the weapons, Boom pack up Big Mom rq which I feel would be a good end bc as much as I like her, she's had a lot of time to shine. I lowkey would wanna see BM take Kaidous life span and try to pull back up on a Luffy a little bit later thinking that he's still just a brat but gets dogged on (not negative diff obv but i feel like itd be cool to see big mom furious at the fact that some little brat actually can whoop her. Give her a line saying something like "This is past the strength of an emperor, this is the strength of a pirate king/sun god/whatever) you get it just basically using her to show that they not on games no more and we really getting to pirate King level.
I think "Usopp" beats Big Mom in Elbaf and cements his title of The Brave Warrior of The Sea. Usopp is the other character who befriends giants throughout the story while Big Mom makes enemies of them. I think it would be fitting that Usopp defeats the giants' worst enemy of the giants, Big Mom. Remember that the giants were known as some of the fiercest warriors of the sea, so it makes sense that Usopp becomes their hero.
I still want to see Big Mom remember what she did and see the impact it has on her. I also want to see Kaido roll up on the party and having acknowledged Luffy as Joyboy joins in and starts drinking and laughing. Having them just die in a volcano is so underwhelming.
the man who ravaged the lands for 20+ years just casually laughing and partying (while the alliance is in totality celebrating "his" defeat?) One Piece fandom has gone off the rails. Everything you lot come up with is so stupid... well what can we expect when the story has become so exceedingly mediocre
@@ChibiTalha I'm not ready to quit but I have lost the excitement I used to have for the new chapters. I don't know if rushed is the right word but the last few chapters were unsatisfying. But as stupid as it sounds. I would not put it past Oda to just have Kiado join the party like noting happened and expect everyone to be cool with it.
@@necogreendragon Its because Oda is slow to unravel things. We got only a slice of the big news. What about the other crew members bounties? What about all the events that have transpired outside of Wano during this time? What will Aramaki do when he shows up in the flower capital? What will the worst generation members do now and how will this event affect their relationships to one another? We still have many questions to be answered and I am pretty excited to see what happens next.
i like the idea that they were either Team-Rocketed or captured by the Marines or picked up by the Big Mom pirates, but theyve been so permanently damaged by the lava that they pose no physical threat anymore. i can also see Big Mom stealing Kaido's life because of the alliance thing and also because she said that he owed her his life from the God Valley incident
If they are dead (which I highly doubt) then my trust in oda would plummet. Already so disappointed in Wano's end and finishing the villains off like that would be the nail in the coffin for me.
x2... I'm quite sad if this is actually their real end... :c I'm still surprised that this was written by the same guy who invented the G5th plot twist. I still believe there's more to say (I really hope).
Option 6: Both find Pluton and try to get it work. Edit: Kaido announced he is collecting the ancient weapons, he is staying on Wano because Wano is special and Big Mom asked what kind of secrets Wano holds when she fell down the hole. This to me looks like a setup, just how Nikka was foreshadowed by Who's Who. I am baffled how the One Piece Community completely ignores this theory.
Option 2: Volcanic Escape seems like the most sensible approach to this. And Kaido being blown on to a sky island would actually be pretty cool, since maybe the same thing could have happened when Shanks was fighting Kaido when Kaido wanted to come to marineford. Kaido will wake up on the sky island like "not again..."
I think there's also the oppurtunity that "Opening the Borders of Wano" somehow includes destroying the volcano Wano sits atop, which could be another way to free them, later on. Additionally, it's possible there's some other kind of refuge under the Volcano of Wano, and Big Mom and Kaido will sink to there, and return to the story at a later point.
The giants know about what Big Mom did to Mother Caramel and the children. There was a giant that watched it all happened and ran in fear to tell all of Elbaf. Big Mom still doesn’t know what happened and that definitely needs to be resolved. Finally, I believe in Luffy’s promise to Katakuri that he’d come back and defeat Big Mom.
People always say this but does she really need to know what happened? It's not a mystery to us the audience and the tragic part of her character is that she spent her whole life not knowing, which informed the person she is today. Why does that need to change?
@@ThatCringeCalledIggleboz It all depends on what way Oda wants to go. Pound’s story of never being in his daughters lives and unable to protect them until his “final” moment and Chiffon didn’t even know who he was and that story could’ve ended there. However, Oda had other plans and it wouldn’t make sense for Big Mom to be finished in Wano because nothing about her “defeat” was symbolic to her character. Kaido boiling in lava with no wittinesses being the exact opposite of Oden’s death fits very nicely. If Oda wrote BM differently in this arc I might think differently but this feels intentional on his part. Big Mom is now stripped of her title and her reputation is in absolute shreds she will be even more of a menace.
1 year later and yeah, ig it's confirmed they really aren't coming back. What a disappointing end to 2 Yonkos tbh. I'm not someone who supported the theory of the raid failing, alright? All I wanted was to give these 2 being given more ideology exploration, mindset, intelligence and a decent backstory.
Idea: When the Red Line falls (creating the all blue), there will be seismic shifts sending Kaido and Big Mom flying up into the final war arc of the series or whatever
RE: Being trapped under water. I thought the only reason Jack was able to wait for rescue was because he is a fishman. As a Devil Fruit user he can't swim or escape, but as a fishman he can't drown. So he was just stuck. As far as I'm aware Kaido and Big Mom can't breathe water and don't have gills. Surely if trapped under water they would eventually drown.
Big Mom should be able to drown, yes. Kaidou, probably not. Otherwise that would make a gigantic plot hole regarding why Kaidou never tried to drown himself if he's been trying to die for so long. Why not jump from a sky island directly into the sea instead of falling on land? It'd make no sense unless he can breathe underwater too.
you forget that the reason jack could wait under water is because he is a fishman. although not able swim he could still breathe
Yeah. This is why Big Mom can die in water. Kaido? Well, he has the Fish-Fish Fruit and he's called the strongest creature in land, SEA and air.
@@krishbohra5536 Another myth that Oda has clarified. Kaido doesn’t have the fish fish fruit. He has the Fish Fish Fruit Model Azure Dragon. The same way Onimaru has Hito Hito no Mi Model: Monk. Kaido is not a fish.
@@acetofresh1 so why hasn't he chosen to drown if he's been trying to die for so long? It's still the fish fish fruit regardless of the model, it probably means dragons can breathe underwater too.
kaido has a fish fish fruit, so It's possible he can also breathe in water
@@userusernomi drowning is not a glorious death. He wants death but a glorious one.
Really like option 4. Makes the most sense and it's definitely something Big Mom would do. It would also kill Kaido's dream in the biggest way and he would die in a similar manner Oden did. It would also be another demonstration on how savage Big Mom is and be a reminder to the audience that she is Kaido's senior and has been the Pirate game much longer.
Also the BM pirates already left and as they never saw BM defeated I doubt they just took the alliances word for that.
That would make BM properly threatening as a villain. So far she came across more as a deranged child in the body of a monster, which isn't bad for a villain, it just doesn't sell the villainy as fully.
I wonder what'll happen to Perospero, now that he's beaten up by Nekomamushi? Maybe Perospero is gonna be the new Ceasar, being held captive against his will.
Luffy hasn’t really held up his promise to kick Big Mom’s ass all over the New World yet, so I think we will still get a short Luffy vs Big Mom fight
@@Chobin29 yes
I think there is a sixth option: they become non hostile
Big Mom could get Amnesia again and be perhaps talked into or outright get captured by the marines (since she's not as strong during her amnesiac state). Or she could befriend Luffy & Co. by partying with them.
As for Kaido his goal was to see the next Joy Boy. That's why he was on Wano all this time. So with his goal fullfilled he might want to sit back and see what Luffy can do.
I like the idea of Big Mom and Kaido being sent off to some far away land, where they realize it's easier to just chill and have fun, rather than trying to amass power and influence.
I thought kaidos goal was to die that's why he jumped.off sky island
I agree. Kaido was a lackluster villain who got happier and happier when luffy became a worthy opponent. then he kinda figured out he was joyboy who kaido was waiting for all along. while battling bajrang gun, he asked luffy what kind of world he wants to create. so I can totally see him laying back and watching what luffy will do.
Option 2 or 4 seems the most likely to me. However, it also leads to the problem that Big Mom and Kaido, even though they were defeated... are still amongst the most strongest people in the World. Literally, if they're allowed time to recover, Yonko or not, they're going to be a huge problem further down the line.
Kaido is still the strongest creature alive, and Big Mom is still a force of nature. Individually, they're dangerous.
So honestly, if they have no more purpose in the story, they're better off dead. Hell, dying from a Volcano explosion isn't exactly anything to laugh at, especially if you consider the damage they all took throughout the Raid.
Yeah narratively it makes sense. Luffy is pretty much demonstrating that he’s a big threat to the government, but if kaido and big mom were still alive and allied they’d be a much bigger threat. Oda wrote himself into a corner with these two unbelievably powerful characters. Even when they lost it didn’t feel legit.
Kaido is still stronger than luffy so he might just reside on another island and live of off drinking and give up being a pirate
Does not matter how strong kaido and Big Mom were in past narrative, the world has moved on. Without crew Kaido is not a threat. We also wants to keep some good opponent for luffy for future. Otherwise OP world will become so boring for luffy after endgame. IM and blackbeard will have to die because of that significance and threat to world, and rest of strong pirates like future yonko or law, shanks,kidd, mihawk, katakuri all are allies of straw hats. So if that ocean that luffy will sail, he will have no strong opponent that wants revenge, that is a boring adventure for luffy. Kaido and BM are out of picture for now but keeping them alive will be interesting. Like in epilogue every thing has happened, after a huge party, straw hats again sneaked off on ship. saying they are pirates even thought whole world is in their debt. Then they see an armada((Think Shiki vs Rodger pirate) at a distance with big mom and kaido on its helm. And luffy says lets do it.
tbh the only way I can think of for them to get captured is by akainu cause yes they were damaged by the raid and they've been in magma for a week now but they might have recovered imo either they somewhat recovered or they are ded so akainu 1 vs 2 extremely weakened yonkos while them being in magma would give some akainu hype and answer the question of how they got taken out from the volcano
@@TheNilayAnurag bro wrote a while fan fiction
I think Option 2: Volcano Escape fits in best with Oda's chief way of doing things. If they were team-rocketed out of that volcano to parts unknown it opens up the most potential for both characters. While Kaido is still an impossibly strong individual, his crew, yonko status, and tyrannical rule have been dismantled. This leaves him far from powerless, but much more limited in range and scope. What will he do now? As for Big Mom, her yonko status is also gone but her entire crew and empire were left completely out of this entire conflict so she has a few more legs to stand on. what will SHE do now? My gut tells me that if they survived, they'll be key players within the story, but never serve as main villains again, and as long as they do something interesting I'm more than okay with that.
At this point, this is what I hope for the most. Gives oda the chance to continue to flesh Kaido out and keeps two major wild cards active in the story.
Here’s what I see happening:
Panel covers depicting Kaido & Big Mom climbing out of the volcano, and then living out the rest of whatever they’re doing. It leads up to both of them being shown to have regained some status, and then they both come back as wild cards in the final war.
I think the big mom pirates are gonna mutiny against big mom herself and exile her from Totland, under probably katakuri's rule being the strongest son, kaido I don't know what he's gonna do
@@eliaspanayi3465
Good luck trying to exile a monster like Big Mom ..
@SMB superfan I super agree that they might come as wild cards to help Luffy against the Celestials.
The fact that Kaido and Big Mom always thought of one piece means that they also never liked the Celestials and their methods of doing things.
Especially , I'd like to see Kaido regretting to die or suicide again just because now he found Joy Boy and he might wanna live just out of curiosity and he might wants to witness how Luffy (Joy Boy) is gonna change the entire world.
Kaido has lived in Wano for the past 20 years while pursuing many different way to die. I think its ridiculous he would die from lava because surely, after living beside a volcano for the past 20 years, he would have attempted the most metal way of dying by jumping into the volcano. Him dying here would not only be anticlimactic, it would really make me question the intelligence of a man who wanted to die but was too stupid to notice the most obvious solution that was literally in his view for the past 20 years.
I think that maybe Gear 5 could have altered the lava to make it able to kill Kaido, it is capable of changes like that so all he would need to do was knock out Kaido
But this time kaido is knocked out with many scars. Lets be real 1 week in the lava is enough time to melt kaido in his current state.
Maybe he drowns in the water?? Since he has a DF
I wonder: is it actually known to the people on Wano, that there's a volcano under their feet? Has it been stated anywhere in the Manga they knew about it, before that panel with both BM and K in it? Maybe I've just missed that scene/comment in those four years, totally possible. To me personally it came as a total surprise that there was a volcano underneath Wano.
Kaido was already low health and unconscious when he was sent into the volcanic eruption. Also Kaido still wants a good grandiose death like Roger or Whitebeard since he says they did it right. Stupid comment lol
The reason Jack survived underwater for so long was because he was a fishman, so he could still breathe, however he couldn’t move. Big Mom and Kaido are humans so they wouldn’t even be able to breathe underwater, meaning surviving the second option is unlikely if they do land out somewhere.
Kaido is an Oni though as bad as Oda has fleshed that out😂😂😂😂
Kaido has a fish fruit
@@ordep1234555 fish type model azure dragon
@@dariuswilliams7509 ... which makes him able to breath underwater. That's why no one could kill him before. Queen said himself that 2cm of water is enough to kill a human being regardless of how powerful they are when he was drowning Kid and Killer. Since Kaido can breath underwater, that never worked on him before and he didn't die even when he sank all those marine battleships mentioned on his debut. He wouldn't be able to fly away during the sinking because obviously the marines cuffed him with seaprism.
@@rottenpotato4733 2cm?
I just can't imagine that Oda wouldn't clarified that they died. The word choice of how Big Mom and Kaido have "fallen" tells me that they're still alive and Odas gonna use them when he needs to
x2!
Nah Big Mom deadass said "don't you dare assume this will kill me" that woman has GOT to be alive, I feel like she really wouldn't just say that if she really wasn't confident that she was gonna live thru that. Makes me wonder tho if she saw herself falling into a pool of MAGMA and was confident enough to say that she'd live do you think she ever had an encounter with Akainu or someone else with the Magu-Magu no-mi? Bc Akainu is only 55 Big mom is like 70 so there is at least a 15 year time period when someone OTHER than Akainu had the fruit or nobody at all. And then, we don't know when he got it, there honestly is a chance she might've scrapped with a mag mag user. Just a theory tho
@@serotonin6404 Exactly, BM has to be alive definitely. Like, Oda wouldn't just drop that phrase for nothing lol.
Not because he is Oda. But because he is the author. When you write your work, you don't just put things and make the characters do and say things because you feel like it, you do it with some kind of purpose (even it f it's just showing how your characters relax, eg).
That was so specific that it has to mean "you, READERS, don't forget about this". It just scream to us that she will come back in some way! xD
@@serotonin6404 New Magma Homie incoming ?
If they are dead, might be the most disappointing villain defeats in the series
The only magma that can kill them is Akainu😊
Why?
Maybe Big Mom, but Kaido dying makes more sense than staying alive
Facts
i think its not disappointing at all lol. you guys shat on the fights as they were going so you couldnt see the absolute epicness that was the way big mom went down.
I feel like Kaido still has the potential to tell some interesting stories, so I hope Kaido isn't dead. Maybe even a mini redemption, because imo, Kaido is capable of changing. (Also I really like him as a character, so I have some bias :p)
He lose his only chance to die honourably the moment he and his crew tricked oden
Kaido is capable of changing?? What story are you reading lol
@@milzhere probably reading naruto
@@donnerkebab1052 lmaoooo
King also. Especially since I really don't want the government getting their hands on the last lunarian
You're videos are really amazing, apart from the weekly chapter i definitely look forward to your uploads, keep up the good work, cheers
really enjoyed the editing, sounds and the intro, I really like seeing this "more produced morj", great video. also think that the idea of big mom killing kaido is really cool
Big Mom rides around on a miniature sun, Kaido's final attack was turning into fire in his Dragon form, so I would guess they have resistance to heat. Also, why was Kaido defeated in his potentially weakest form (dragon form)?
Well his dragon form is the biggest so it definitely has the most sheer strength. Hybrid form is considered the "strongest" because its a balance between physical enhancement while also not losing speed and versatility due to a large, non-human body. Luffy's bajarang gun was literally just sheer power and strength, so Kaido's best answer is to use his strongest attack as well. If you asked Kaido to destroy a city in one attack, he would choose beast form over hybrid form any day.
@@doug2555 I suppose that is true.
@@TheAbleacher dont listen to that bro
I mean big mom had fire for hair at a point...
Before I watch the video, my personal take is that they were sent flying Team Rocket-style out of Wano due to the eruption. We know that Big Mom's crew was still down there at sea level, and I doubt they were just sitting on their asses. They were trying to back Big Mom up all this time, and seeing that a yonko crew didn't manage to climb the waterfall, they surely are somewhere else following linlin's vivre card. As for kaido, maybe he went in the same direction, maybe not.
But I'm sure they're alive.
My issue with this has always been: why wouldnt Oda show that? We got that sizable panel of the volcano erupting and not a hint of this anywhere in that drawing. Not saying you're absolutely wrong, just that if you're right Oda missed another opportunity to actually show rather than tell.
This doesn’t make sense since big mom’s crew has already been shown twice to easily be able to climb up to wano and kaido staying alive is a taboo
@@azrael1316 he just said last thing cp0 saw was big moms ship not big mom did I miss something?
@@eman3061 I think they're both dead and it wouldn't make sense for big mom to be in another arc we already had her in whole cake island and wano. She's finished.
@@onepeak7032 hope so.
Since Kaido fell, my bet was on them dying. But I admit that is most out of spite because people seems to forget that the magma is the devil fruit with the biggest offensive power in the world, according with Oda himself, so, by that logic, if anything non haki related would badly damage any of them is magma.
So, if any of them survived, either Linlin cheated death using Kaidou's life, or they got blasted in the eruption
or oda maned up and let them stay dead
Im offering option 6. They escape but are scarred and crippled . I mean we need both of them for the Rocks backstory. However, In order to remove their status as threats Oda might have made their wounds cause permanent damage. They simply would be able to operate with a fraction of their former power.
True like kaido is still capable of defeating luffy 1v1 so he cant be around like that
shanks is going to explain god valley
@@broperfect7669 no is not ,he couldnt beat dying luffy what makes you think he can fight a healthy luffy !?
@@powerscallingfiendbro how many fights did kaido go through before fighting luffy once? Kaido literally killed/defeated luffy twice (if not 3 times) if it wasn’t for plot armor, sure luffy reached a level where he can 1v1 kaido, but full power kaido still defeats luffy in a pure 1v1
I believe this is the most realistic option. Because it takes it back to whitebeard vs akinu. When akinu hit Wb with the magma in the chest. It will hype up akainu and his magma attacks. Because if the magma can passively crippled Ex yonkos. It just boosts any akinus fights and damage output
kaido and big mom are about to make the 370th child of the charlotte family, using lava as lube
Cursed comment
delete this
nah they are dead we are done with them
I think the volcano escape is the most likely, the cracks that led to the sea are how they get out. But they probably are maimed and won't be able to fight as well as they did in the raid making them less of a threat (like Kaido told Oden after an hour of boiling). Kaido might accept Luffy's dominance over him and welcome the new Joy Boy. Big Mom seems like she will still antagonize Luffy but maybe the kids will have a say on this.
I think Kaido is defo the kind of guy that accepts his defeat. He's shown many times he gets pissed when someone interferes with his fights.
I agree completely, Oda has demostrated time and time again to be such a softie and that explosion wasn't just for the show imo, Kaido won't antagonize Luffy anymore so it doesn't really matter if he survives and Big Mom has been sort of a meme since quite a long, trying to get her hands on Luffy and the SHs but always failing somehow, even getting outfought by them without any monster trio present (they might have not damaged her but you don't need that to just survive an encounter with her), I totally see her appearing a few more times and they will always manage to avoid her just like Roger did.
"the cracks that led to the sea are how they get out." They are Devil Fruit users who escaped out into the sea??? 😂😂😂😂 you guys come up with some crazy stuff.
@@femiosusa510nah if you watched clearly there was an explosion or some kinda volcanic eruption that happened after both Kaido and big mom were thrown into the lava, if they survived they must've been carried back up by the eruption but still very weak and injured. Kaido might accept his defeat, but linlins ego is too big accept it and might come back. This is only if they survived, and so far, since we have yet to see if their devil fruits came back into circulation or not, it's likely to assume they're somehow still alive
@@yaseen9044 LAVA basically killled Whitebeard. It can kill Kaido and Big mom also.They are dead, they arent needed in the story anymore.They served their purpose in making Luffy into a Yonko. Its his story, not theirs, and its coming to an end soon.
I hope they aren’t dead, Bog Mom was such a sad child and didn’t deserve this
Nonsense
Stone is just cooled-down magma, and seastone originates from Wano. My theory is that both Kaido and Big Mom are encased in seastone after flying out of the volcano, and since only the Kozuki know how to chisel it, they're essentially paralyzed. That way, Oda gets to remove them from power without killing them.
This was my thought too that they could be encased in sea stone. Almost like a star wars reference
this is hard to believe because we have no idea how seastone is actually made yet.
You're conflating stone and seastone right now. Seastone isn't magma, hence the name.
They have some pretty crazy durability but I doubt that they're immortal. If they are stuck down there, encased in lava (seastone) and unable to get out, they'd most likely starve to death, at least after a few weeks.
Up until now everytime Luffy beats the enemy, it had a mindblowing concluding effect - its one of those times you as a reader might think: „Ah, this finisher move makes sense!“
EXAMPLES:
Crocodile was beaten flying up to the sky for the public to see him as the one behind the war - thus stopping the war.
Enel was beaten by Luffy ringing the bell by the momentum.
Rob Luci was beaten crashing the wall falling down from the building same way as Luci used to beat Luffy back in Water Seven.
Doflamingo, a celestial, was beaten knocking from the sky down to the ground (also literally getting down to earth).
When Luffy beat Kaido, both fell down to the ground. There was a panel showing how Kaido fell down and the next panel was Luffy falliing down and we can see Yamato running to catch one of the them and thats Luffy, while Kaido is falling down further.
I thought Big Mom could only steal souls from those afraid of death. There’s no way she could successfully use soul pocus on Kaido
Afraid of her. Also, I think haki or at least "will" is what you need to counter her ability, just like Law who is unable to move Kaido or Big Mom with Shambles due to their strong haki. So Kaido might not be able to defend himself in his current state. I can really imagine a gigant, more powerful BM making a new Napoleon with Onigashima's sword and a new Prometheus with Onigashima's fire. (Btw Moria's last transformation back in Thriller Bark would be a clear foreshadow if this ever happened)
Well she doesn't have to necessarily take his souls she could just kill him
@@franck4727 You think Big Mom can actually kill Kaido. Kaido is far superior to Big mom in every way!
@@ashiqurrahman1343 not far they are close in strenght
@@bensylver5113 my guy they are a moderate distance in strength
I am in the camp of option 4, especially since oda left hints that the big mom ship was doing things in the chapter. Other then perosparo the rest of the children didn’t do anything without their mama, so for them to now make a move is a clue that she may be on the ship. Some say even kaido may be on there which idk, but it’s possible.
Whether one or both escapes, I believe they will find Pluton hidden in the magma, able to withstand heat, and able to dig underground. Sort of the opposite idea of Enel's journey to the moon, the 1 or 2 former Yonko will get a cover story through the center of the vearth
Why Big Mom ain't dead
1. Punk Hazard, the beggining of the Yonko saga. Luffy says he will beat all 4 emperors. - that's his goal. Did he beat BM? No.
2. There's an unresolved conflict between BM and Luffy - Fishman island.
Have Luffy fulfilled his promise to declare Fishman island as his territory after defeating BM? No. Why? Cause he hadn't "kicked her butt" yet.
3. In WCI it is repeatedly stated that Luffy will COME BACK for BM. Oda set it up from then that BM will be dealt after Kaido.
Also Katakuri asks Luffy whether he's gonna beat Big Mom, and Luffy answers "of course, i am gonna be the PK". This line is very crucial, it implies that for Luffy beating Big Mom is a necessary step for becoming PK.
4. Did BM defeat seemed final? No she literally says to us readers not to be foolish and believe she's dead.
5. You know how many established plot points would just fade away is this the end of BM? Especially Elbaf connections, her entire character arc is centered around her dream to collect every race in the world. When the villain is defeated - it's when fighting for his ideals and goals. In Wano she's defeated not for fighting for her primarily established goal( gathering all races and creating world of equality), but via a new created in a Wano country(alliance with Kaido to find the one piece)
6. How ridiculous it would be if BM died from bombs and lava??
So Big Mom is done temporarily, the one to permanently end her story will be Monkey D Luffy. In Elbaf or WCI..
Yea kaido can stay down but BM has to get back up because there too many motivations related to her and luffy. Her crew is literally on the move rn there no way she can stay down.
@@TyRendition true
@@TyRendition their both at the same place so if one survived, i cant see the other not surviving but im open to being wrong
@@Hamzah_08 i feel like Kaido is also not dead here, rather oda will save him to give him a better death during the final war
Luffy said he was gonna fight Jack look at how that turned out
I like the Big Mom surviving idea. Love the character so much and she is very capable of betraying her former crew mate.
It was reiterated Kaido owed Big Mom his life due to God’s Valley and his DF. It would make a lot of sense if she escaped on the ship clashing with the Marines rn.
Oden survived hours of being submerged in boiling oil, kaido and big mom have been explicitly described as having bizarrely thick skin, so maybe it’s a hint to their survival in the lava pit?
He didn't boiled to death though, he was shot before that happened.
And he wasn't a yonkou with unusually strong skin xD
Yes, it sounds cheap, but there are ways for them to survive as nothing is written/proven yet (we got no reactions of anyone, which at least is quite suspicious...).
@@sakura5sango6 yeah the lava is like the boiling on a bigger scale 😂
I like option 4 the most, Big Mom and Kaido honestly in Wano were underwhelming for me, giving Big Mom an opportunity to at least show of the 2 clearly more villainous Yonko of her and Kaido how powerful she is is something I would take.
Plus I also like how it ties into the theme of betrayal and trust between pirates that hasn't really been explored in the arc but as you said Morj references a fair few times, I'm yearning for Wano to pay off more for what it set up that's where my head is at with this.
Saying Big Mom or Kaido were underwhelming makes no sense. You're only saying that cuz they lost and they kinda have too for the story. I really think yall just complain about anything sometimes lol
Big Mom wasn't underwhelming but she most definitely could have been better had she been coating her attacks in conquers haki during the fight then her defeat would've felt more justified.
Kaido on the other hand was totally amazing. Bro search "kaido vs Luffy manga full" on CZcams and you'll see how much of a savage he was. He knocked out Luffy 2 TIMES and KILLED ONCE. RE READ THAT. LUFFY GOT KNOCKED OUT 2 TIMES AND KILLED ONCE BY KAIDO. Bruh come on, it's not Kaidos fault the awakening of the Nika fruit was too much for him to handle, Luffy literally became on par to Kaido or maybe even a little better in terms of durability after awakening. He got stronger than Kaido, he could've ended the fight a lot sooner had he been more serious instead of playing around trying to figure out how his awakening works. Anyone saying Kaido is underwhelming is nuts, you're probably saying that because you didn't see him awaken but fuck who cares. Kaido got fucked up at the end but don't act like he wasn't fucking shit up the entire time. Just remember he's the only antagonist in the story that's managed to kill Luffy and I say kill because once ones heart stops, you're presumed to be dead which was the case for our protagonist.
I would say big mom is the only one that is underwhelming to me. Kaido is definetly surpassed my expectation. If we just had more kaido flashback it would make him a perfect character. For big mom I don't like the way how oda handled that character. Most of the time(before BM vs law&kiidd) oda made her a joke character like how SH embarrassed her. Like cmon she is a yonko. I know oda is trying to make a joke scene. But that makes her a less threatening. Even in rooftop fight we can see supernova are mostly focus on fighting kaido. I didn't feel her as a villain/powerful/threatening character that I felt in wci arc.
@@thetruth997_ my guy the amount of ppl that thought Kaido and/or Big Mom were ending the arc in a W is negligible compared to the amount of ppl that are dissatisfied with a lot of the arc's conclusions. Even ppl that thought the raid would fail only thought so in the context of them losing the fight on onigashima, not Wano ending in a loss for the Straw Hats
but for big mom to take kaidos lifespan he would have to be scared of her so that option doesnt work
I think it's kinda counterintuitive to kill Kaido. He was looking for a magnificent death BECAUSE nothing in this world could kill him. Giving this big bad what he wants defeats the purpose.
I don't know how much this is, since I think dying unconscious and melting into lava isn't a glorious way to die. Oda gave an honorable death to Roger and Whitebeard for being good people, Kaido is the complete opposite so he would deserve a horrible death. I think this is as simple as that.
@Jay if it gets leaked that luffy awakened his fruit, essentially meaning kaido got beaten by sun god nika, then i say kaido got a glorious death.
@Jay the cherry on top is that even the ppl of wano never realised that and Luffy refused to take the credit
I mean, not really. All that matters is putting him out of commission. If he dies, getting what he wants, who tf cares? It would just be less satisfying because people want revenge, but taking down Kaido isn’t merely about revenge. It’s about taking back Wano. Revenge is purely secondary. Depriving him of what he wants is nice for readers, but objectively it’s in no way necessary
@@joselynruiz2632 It’s a glorious death because Kaido was defeated at the hands of Joyboy which is exactly what he wanted
I think it’s reductive to say that Oda “just puts defeated villains in Impel Down”, imo a more accurate take is that he provides narrative reasons for why they won’t “just come back and do it again” when Luffy leaves.
Crocodile is out of Impel Down, but he isn’t going back to Alabasta any time soon. That goal is dead, and his character is in a different place than it was 850 chapters ago. He has different goals and a different motivation now. Something similar can be said for CP9, or Enel, Moria, or hell even Wapol. These characters are all at a different place in life that doesn’t line up with their past ambitions.
But where is arlong (my guess he is a slave on Marijois, and when the strawhats raid marijois, Nami is the one to save him)
Enel never changed motivation he always wanted to go on the moon
@@ryanmitindonga1128 right. So traveling to the moon/his past business in Skypia isn’t his goal anymore. His character is in a place where it make sense that he wouldn’t return to finish off Skypia
@@aldonisenberg537 Im pretty sure hes still in prison?
@@notxon300 if he was in prison, we should have seen him in impel down right?
For all I know, Kaido and Big Mom could be floating in molten sea prism stone atm. I'm not so sure about them coming back, but it would be untypical for One Piece that the ones defeated by Luffy actually die and it would be great to see these two characters again.
Kaido is one thing but his backstory has a lot of holes that were withheld for obvious reasons and so if he isn't the one to tell the full story regarding Rocks in his POV it'd be a lingering question of how such a significant event effected him, even Big Mom didn't know why he disappeared.
And speaking of BM she has more of a chance considering the last chapter mentioned her crew intercepting CP0 and most likely leaving Wano. They wouldn't just leave Big Mom because at the end of the day they are loyal to her as her children. Ntm Oda made her quote that what happened wouldn't be enough to kill her, so chances are pretty good for her being alive.
Exactly, I agree with this opinion as well.
I've been saying the Rocks flashback needs to happen in Wano so that Blackbeard's connection to Rocks when he comes in the Elbaf arc is already contextualised. Also like you said Kaido's entire character was shaped by his time with Rocks. The last panel with them in the lava simply isn't a conclusion. We've heard that the Big Mom pirates likely took out the WG ships, I bet they're both being hospitalised, utterly wrecked by the lava, only able to talk and think about how they got there.
@@ThatCringeCalledIggleboz That's... actually a great idea. Like, yeah, that way they would come back someday but if they're too hurt NOW, they won't be a problem for the time being, which is the main point 🤔 I like it! 👍🏼
Seeing how Zeus seems to be a powerup for Nami, and how we've seen that homies disappear if the user dies, I think it's more likely that Big Mom will not die here
We don’t know how homies work. Caramel didn’t have any active ones when she died. I don’t think they are dead either but ur argument is weak.
I still don't understand how Nami can control Zeus, which he is literally made from a part of BM soul. You mean to tell me BM can't recall back something she created with her own DF? That's crazy to me.
@@wegipciacocomas Exactly. We've seen Mother Caramel made homies, but it seems she didn't really made anything particularly useful with them, outside of for show. And since no one reallt feared her, nor she wanted to die (she just wanted to be retired with a lot of riches, so, she more than likey wouldn't spend her own soul to make more homies), all her hormies would have been probably short-lived.
@@nukeboy4939 that's like saying why can luffy be stretched by others, even if he doesn't want to be stretched
@@ThatControlUser Bad analogy, you can't just BM powers without her having control of it. I know they gave a reason why Nami is using Zeus she needs a power up but, according to how BM DF works she should still be in control of Zeus.
I’d like to see Kaido and BM crippled by the magma and attacks they took, like being blind, missing limbs, permanent organ damage, and their Conqueror’s spirit being weakened. This way Kaido can come back as an ally of Joyboy without making Luffy’s alliance too strong and BM can come back as a minor villain in Elbaf but her defeat won’t have to be drawn out.
Shanks, Fujitora, and Kyros kind of proved that disabling people doesn’t really make someone too much weaker though, so idk if this option makes sense in One Piece.
@cara lidstone kaido and big mom was and always be evil same goes for mingo they are the most evil in the show
@@38achref26 All of those aren't as evil as the world government though
It will be incredibly disappointing if they died from that. After all, Kaido has been captured and defeated many times and never been able to be killed. Big mom whs shown to be basicslly indestructable.
We have another Madara problem. Oda made the villians so powerfull that it would be illogical for them to be defeated in the story. I think he should've just stuck with the whole "Super powerful, but can still get stabbed" thing with Whitebeard because even tho he was the strongest, it made sense when he got hurt.
With Kaido and Big Mom however, Oda hyped up there durability so much that people think they should be absolutely ok after being unconsious in a magma chamber for 7 days. Presumably with no oxygen.
@@YokaiGotha i dont think that it's a problem and that oda should have done anything differently. The emperors are too strong to kill, but not too strong to be defeated, and that isnt a bad thing. Big mom and kaido were the most influential people in the new world an i think they should keep being a part of the story, because they are too strong to stop being a part of the story. The video kept trying to find a way to keep them out of the story, but they arnt going to be and dont have to be. Big mom and kaido def can be defeated, but that doesnt mean that they have to stop playing a role.
How is being punched by a literal God 100s of feet through the earth into a magma pit a disappointing death
what would be a satisfying send off? the story just couldn't continue if luffy was getting chased by big mom and kaido while fighting his next opponents like blackbeard. unless luffy manages to flip them into allies for the final war then they're going to be out of the story.
@@cocncnc7092but she can be allies for the final battle they have a common objective "defeat the mondial gourvenement"
Knowing Oda, I was never able to be too sure. With a Morj video on the subject however, I can now be certain it won’t happen… thank you, Morj
I have a strong conviction that Kaido will, someday, become an ally and then he will die in the final war, but not now. For me, that would be the perfect closure for THE character that had most related things with Joy Boy until now. First a villain to the Sun god, and then an ally. Out of every option you presented, for that to be the case we need 2 things. First, he has to be alive and not captured (or eventually escape, which seems likely, since King is a big reason why I feel like Kaido may become an ally). Second, he has to discover some motivation for fighting along side Luffy. Both of these options may be possible with option 2 or 3. He may discover some important thing in a random sky island that motivates himself to help Luffy bring the dawn of the world (passing through a redemption arc, kinda like Crocodile in MF, but more actively), or he may develop an even bigger hatred towards the WG and swear to destroy it (in that case he would be an ally by conviniece, kinda like Kid or Bege). My only problem is Big Mom. I honestly don't know where she could fit in the story.
PS: Saying that Kaido will become an ally doesn't necessarily means he will become a good person. Bege is a horrible person and became allies with Luffy, and so are the Germa 66, and even Crocodile in impel down (and to an extent, even Kid). Luffy does make alliances with bad guys some times, if their goal is similar. And I also don't believe Luffy hates Kaido more than he hated Crocodile for example for it's allience to be a no go (unlike Doffy or Akainu, which idk if he would ever work with).
Ikr The way Oda wrote Kaido is so different from so many previous villains. He's the only person I can imagine standing with Luffy, as compared to the other villains.
Knowing big mom she's very ambitious and disloyal she might leave kaido for dead at wano while she calls loki in order to make a move on shanks territory loki is still in love with lola!!! So she'll be at elbaf to try and overthrow the kingdom big mom isn't knew to taking over kingdoms also big mom knows about the secret treasure tree adam which is actually a devil fruit tree and where she stole kaido dragon fruit!!! Kaido will be executed at holy land instead of having a public execution like roger they executed him underneath holy land!!! I'm Sama was the one who killed him since Oni race was an ally of joy boy kaido dies wishing he was luffy nakama!!!!
Is one piece fairytail now? Villains willing to die for the hero just because they beat him
@@mridstaid414wdym bro this happens in every story not just anime. It’s pretty obvious that Kaido wouldn’t be an enemy if he comes back because he’s not strong enough to challenge Luffy and Joyboy is specifically stated to fill people with joy/whatever and get them on his side. Ur gonna have to take that argument up with the series creator because he already explained it, whether it satisfies you or not
@@marcialopez7228one of the Manga chapter covers revealed Lola is now married to beges right hand, so loki is not going after her, and maybe he's already with someone else. There is absolutely no way anyone in Elbaf welcomes linlin back, especially not hajruddin, who's bringing back the giants pirates
I think Big Mom will make an Alvida-like return in her Hot, young, Roger area appearance. That she will sacrifice all her lifespan except for, say, one year or one month, in order to regain her peak powers and get revenge/get out of the magma. It will be just like with Alvida
U might be spot on
That's actually a great and Oda-like twist lol
The immediate thing that makes me think Kaido at the very least is still alive, is that at the very least in the anime, it showed him sinking INSIDE the lava without any visible damage from the lava itself - meaning he could very well find a way to emerge from it later. Big Mom I'm much less sure about, and her life flashing before her eyes gave me more of a feeling of finality than anything relating to Kaido.
Option 7: they're both alive and show up again in the series, maybe with slightly different roles; maybe as allies, maybe again as villains
Personally, I feel killing one or both of them off in this way would be extremely lame and is the least likely scenario.
im not trying to start a fight but how is it extremely lame. i thought it was lame aswell that he was defeated "quickly" and by a big punch, but sending him down to the lava pits and having a giant eruption be the panel where kaido is proclaimed dead was utterly amazing. Boiled to death just like Oden, His death was not grand in the way he wanted it to be. Luffy denies him his one and only dream while also killing him just like Oden. Its PERFECT. like really try to actually write a better ending to this conflict, its possible but this is nothing to complain about
@@SunnyOddny it's ok but the problem is Kaido was the biggest villian in the series. And he wasn't fleshed out like his predecessors like katakuri and doffy. And those two villians were awakened, but the final villian of the saga doesn't have an awakening? It's all too rushed it seems oda downplayed his significance he could have for a reason
@@oliverbicanic8517 Kaido will most likely be fleshed out in a backstory with the rocks pirates in the future, right? and also remember we dont really know anything about awakening with zoans except the guards couldnt control theirs, kaido is probably already awakened in some sort of way
it will be lame if theya re alive to you make you fans happy it will be best if they get vergo and monet treatment and stay dead
@@SunnyOddny Because their death will then happen off-screen. Usually when Luffy defeats a villain for good it's a triumphant moment illustrated and told unambiguously. If they were to have been killed, it should have been definitive at the moment they were defeated, not relayed to us later, almost as an afterthought. Not to mention the fact that, as mentioned above, Kaido's backstory is incomplete. There's so much we don't know about his backstory and motivation and how exactly it ties into Joyboy.
And the fact that he ties into Joyboy makes me think he'll resurface later when we learn more about Joyboy and the Ancient Kingdom
You missed option 7:
Kaidou wakes up in an Island somewhere without his followers, withour is factories, withour his son, with absolutely nothing of the vast empire that even for him took decades to build. And just retires.
A Yonkou alone is strong, but is not a Yonkou, and in Wano Kaidou lost everything he has. He has to start everything from scratch, and he may not be interested. He got to see Joyboy, he saw the hero he wanted to see, he lived to have his great battle he wanted. And he can't just get back alone and pretend his empire still exists. He could just retire.
Big Mom still has her sons, empire and island. Altought the mini-story of Germa is exactly about Big Mom losing what remains of her empire. And her last words, about how miserable she has been ever since Roger died, and that she didn't enjoy having this target on her back for the new generation that made her life hell, makes sense for her to retire too.
It would take another 10 years to rebuild what they have lost, they are old, and either didn't really enjoy the empire they built, or have their emotional need fufilled by their last battle.
So they can now just watch what will happen with the world. Not very different of what Rayleigh is doing.
My one thought on this, ever since they first showed them down there, that alot of people tend to forget that one of the few people to be killed off so far was whitebeard, another emperor. I also agree that he basically has to kill them for the story, since it doesn't really make sense for them to stick around or come back as enemies again (except maybe in movies).
Edit: I suppose option 2 could also be viable if they only come back in cover stories like Morj mentioned, but I still think death is the most likely outcome that makes the most sense to me
Good video, Mr Morj. Keep them coming.
Imagine how bad this makes Sakazuki look if they survive a week in magma. I see this as Kaido dying through boiling like Oden did but obviously his death wouldn’t be seen as glorious like he wanted.
True, Akainu is being setup to be a big villain yet two characters that Luffy can beat can survive in magma for a week? Maybe Akainu's magma is way hotter or he awakened?
Bruh I’m tired of seeing this. No way natural magma has the same lethality as concentrated magma from someone who’s most likely awakened and has coc coating plus advanced armament . Stop this narrative
yeah they are dead it has been 7 DAYS if they were alive they wouldve fought luffy law and kid again already
If they actually *die* in the lava, it’s just disappointing. Not even including the *how* they were defeated. Also very questionable. Alotta chapters in this arc have been chalked up to “wait til the anime drops maybe it will clarify/fill this in”. This topic might not be an exception.
The "wait til the anime drops maybe it will clarify/fill this in" are all fights that would have slowed down the raid tho, it would not make sense to cut such an important part from the manga
Great point about Ryokugyu maybe being able to help capture Big Mom and Kaido. I could see that happening too. Gr8 analysis and insights. Well done
Definitely one of my favorite videos on this subject and most likely the most in depth
Kaido respects Joy Boy so he might respect Luffy and become more like White Beard.
And Big Mom has a split personality, Linlin, which was protective towards Strwa Hats. This might foreshadow Big Mom becoming more of an ally rather then enemy or at least neutral.
We saw enemies becoming allies, I wouldn't surprise if that's the case. They have a mutual enemy, marines, and somewhat similar objective building a big family and protect the people they love.
yea in my opinion, he been looking for someone to dfeat him all these years plus they know how long thye been fighting for the one piece since even roger, and to have been defeated i believe theylll come to accept that luffy is the one and just live in seclusion as they watch the next pirate king, id think theyd understand that its something more than being strong to become king, its the ability to bring everyone together even enemies ;)
Personally, I don’t think its so ridiculous to conclude that they are both dead and gone, BUT, I also think that Big Mom could potentially survive and reconstitute via her soul powers. She basically has an entire kingdom made of her life force.
I like Option 4 the most because it combines the cunning and treachery of Big Mom with the indomitable strength of Kaido to become something stronger than the two by themselves.
It would make sense for Big Mom to coerce Kaido into giving up his lifespan if it means dying a true warrior's death. Even if it means being a thrall to get that.
And really, it'd be a devilish twist of irony, imo. Kaido is the pinnacle of Zoans, but even the strongest of animals end up trophies for the human who outsmarted him.
Awesome new editing!
Personal theory.. Morj was partially right with his video on the raid. The problem is he didn’t realize because of this analysis that the raid was destined to succeed. Morj pointed out that Kaido is being written in the style of a protagonist and therefore would have his power up last and win. However it was the opposite if you think of Kaido as the hero of ACT III he becomes destined to fail only to come back and reclaim Wano in ACT IV, due to kabuki play structure. Now I don’t think he comes back a villain I think that’s where Odas twist comes in to bring him back as a believer in Luffy being joyboy but still be the “hero” of Wano. Like Luffy said he doesn’t want to be known as the hero and so I think this twist plays well together and if looked at in this light can bring a new respect for the Wano saga.
Seeing how the story has continued the way it did and nothing was shown that could imply that one of them survived, i haven't changed my mind and still think option 5 is the case. They are both dead😅
me too, oda has a lot of characters to focus on in this saga (strawhats, shanks, buggy, teach, garp, aokiji, admirals, mihawk, sabo, dragon, kuma, gorosei ...) kaido and big mom are done
Thank you for making this video i was wondering
Damn. Nice edits bro
I doubt big mom would be able to steal kaidos life force at all because it’s been made clear he doesn’t fear death and he doesn’t exactly fear big mom either
Jinbe either, then again, we saw B using Soul Pocus on him, as well as many others on the last scene of Whole Cake.
yup
being engulfed in lava might have an effect on his state of mind.
Yeah but don't forget she hasn't awakened her devil fruit yet we might not know it's power's once it's awakened
I think that kaido could offer up his lifespan to big mom. Wanting the warriors death and has been set up as a suicidal character just seems fitting. Could be interesting if big mom leaves him with a few seconds and we see him thinking how Oden felt since they’d die the same way.
As far as big mom this could set her up nicely to show up to elbalf. This time as she shows up with her crew we could see Katakuri finally standing up to her and the rest of the big mom pirates behind him. Alone it would just a fight between luffy and big mom. This would be a good moment for luffy to show 1v1 no planning, no scabbards, he can take on a yonko on his own
I mean if you go by the Manga, then Luffy can't touch Big mum since her fruit literally drains Haki.
Just finished your 4th of July stream. Just wanna second that Hajime no Ippo and Eyeshield 21 are indeed the best sports mangas. You really should give them a try!
The only way I see them coming back is if Kaido comes back as a member of the Straw Hat Grand Fleet now that he knows Luffy is Joyboy, and Big Mom is only relevant in Elbaf now and the story of the giants there
I think Big Mom is coming back. Unless Oda decides to suddenly throw a curve ball, it's looking like the next One Piece arc is gonna be related to Elbaf especially now with the appearance of the Giants during Egghead arc. And Big Mom is a huge part of the Elbaf history, so there's no way her part of the story is finished, plus you also gotta consider that Pudding is involved with the Blackbeard Pirates, what happened with the BM Pirates after Blackbeard Pirates attacked on Whole Cake, the other fraction of BM Pirates that are around Wano that's supposedly trying to rescue Big Mom, Zeus still being around and alive despite that (on theory) he should be gone too if Big Mom did died....there's just a lot of factors, Big Mom is most likely returning. And I really hope so, I would love to see the actual final battle with her, considering Luffy's promise to her of "After I'm done with Kaido, you're next Big Mom!"
And as far as Kaido goes, uh, I think he's pretty much done with the story outside of occasional flashback appearances.
I like the Big Mom stealing the remainder of Kaido's life span option. Unlike most I don't mind her as a antagonist, and I think Kaido being denied his grand death and instead dying in ignominy and betrayal where no one can see is very poetic.
World: "Ay, what happened to Kaido?"
Big News Morgans: "He got packed up by Luffy and nobody ever heard from him again"
Perfect.
kaido punishment is to die a dishonorable unmemorable death. opposite of oden
That'd be good in my eyes I like Big Mom tbh. After all they did say most pirate alliances end in betrayal, and we know BM likes to slime people out like she tried with Germa. She slimes out Kaido, her last words to him being something along the lines of "you aren't getting your glorious death. I'm your senior after all" or something like that. I feel like it would be beautiful for Kaido bc duhh and it would subvert the idea everyone has that Big Mom isn't a 'real' yonko bc how you gone slime out KAIDO of all people.
Really good points. What I think is the more "Oda like" thing to happen is to keep them alive doing something else (the cover story maybe?) but that's still kind of odd given the importance and power of the characters, so the more plausible possibly seems to be that they are both dead, or at least one of them (Kaido) and the other one may be crippled in some way, so that they can't Act right now. Ofc we are speculating here, so I don't really lean to any option.
you did a great job analysing
I had to look up how jack survives in water at the part he got wrecked by zuneisha and come to find out jack is half fish man so he can still breathe underwater. Just can’t move since he has a devil fruit
I concur, in land, air and Sea,, sea? Kaido's supposed to be the strongest in these areas but we've yet to see the sea part, it probably wouldn't play out as with Jack underwater,
there's also the 'hundred beast part'
hundred beast is just a mistranslation im pretty sure
They meant sea as in sailing on it (ex. Fugi and Sengoku vs Jack at sea). Not literally underwater.
@@dennyv1999 Likely
@@TPShanks May be
In the past I might have given a lot more weight to "Oda had Big Mom say this was not enough to kill her," but Wano specifically was chock-full of quotes and statements that went nowhere. Maybe Big Mom's is just one more of those. Personally, I wouldn't use it as any sort of evidence that she's not done.
by those fans logic if somone had a gun pointing at me i say you better not think shooting me is enough to kill me so after he shots me i wont just because i said it wont i swear some op fans are so dumb
I really like your idea of big mom stealing Kaido's lifespan when weakened, killing Kaido for her to be able to return later. I had not heard that idea before and I really really really want it to happen now.
I think Volcano Launch fits best with Odas style. The volcano errupting seems like merely an asthetic touch to signal the end, as well as a logical thing to happen after the magma under the island got disturbed so much. It is something that gets stuck in the attentive readers mind, but something they can't be 100% sure of until Oda actually confirms it many many chapters later. Think of Sabos "death" in Luffys flashback, we got a couple panels that strongly suggested Dragon saved Sabo, but we couldn't 100% be sure of it until he came back 100s of chapters later.
Thank you for that bit about Big Mom’s “unfinished business” with Elbaf. I’ve been saying for years that Big Mom has absolutely zero motivation to go to Elbaf. The community has been endlessly regurgitating that headass take for so long and it’s just irritating at this point.
Her whole gigantification plot was to get around having to go there in the first place! Rather than voicing any explicit desire to go there at some point, she has explicitly given them the cold shoulder. People need to understand that Big Mom’s backstory containing plot *points* in Elbaf is not the same as her backstory containing plot *threads* in Elbaf.
Frl
What I am asking myself for quite a while now, when Big Mom dies, shouldn’t that deactivate her devil fruit powers, meaning all the homies would turn back into objects again like we saw with sugar? Nami would then lose her poweup with Zeus. But even if she isn’t dead but rather unconscious, the same thing should happen shouldn’t it. Either way the homies should turn back to normal. Except it was stated somewhere that this fruit works differently. Kind of never saw that anywhere popping up as a topic.
Exactly! Big Mom can't just die after Nami finally getting Zeus back. Would be very disappointing if him just outbound the DF powers for the sake of Nami's development
I honestly don't know how Nami can control BM's DF in the first place, when BM should be able to deactivate Zeus.
nah they are part of her soul so if she is dead they will be alive
Homies have their own life force because of BMs power. It's not the same as Moria's/Sugars as it would mean she would be revived and she'd revive anyone once her DF deactivates where everyone she took lifespans from would get it back. Her power is more of a permanent change and that makes sense as there are conditions which must be fulfilled to activate it.
@@tbu987ify I understand the when she takes someone's life force and implants in objects that's more of a permanent change. To not have control over something you literally created out your own soul doesn't make sense to me, which means Nami has control over a part of BM own soul by force. They would've been better off just having BM agree to let Nami keep Zeus which would've made alot more sense.
*Imagine Oda pulling an Enel situation with both Big Mom and Kaido...*
what is the editing? Very nice!
Morj has nothing to lose at this point. That’s why I luv this guy
Big mom said she wouldn't die by the likes of law and kid and i know you can't put too much emphasis on words but she is a yonko so she might be alive and then escape wano with the big mom pirates ship
Kaido um..i don't think you can keep him caged or restrained..he is just that powerful so i think he is dead..if he isn't and he is just unconscious or somehow finds himself to a abandoned island then i would like to see how he will enter the story once again
If she's dead it wasn't because of kid or law though. She was still fine after their attack, it was the bombs that finished her.
Nobody heard what Big mom said. She was silenced
Kaido & Big Mom have been defeated and most of the time when an enemy gest defeated they aren't relevant as an antagonist anymore and get taken out the story somehow.
They have already been defeated and lost their yonko status. They're done they might as well be dead lol
she was just being salty
hey morj, love the video, what about a combined option where they are imprisoned, but also relocated. we know that both island clouds ( pyrobloin), and sea stone comes from volcanoes. With both BM & Kaido being in a volcano, they probably can't move due to sea stone effects. If the volcanic eruption relocated then, they would be covered in magna making it a molten prison even after it hardens.
I think the most narratively satisfying solution here (at least for me) is the volcano escape but have it be underwater where Kaido wakes up first (having a zoan regen) and uses dragon fish powers and good genetics to lift himself and big mom out of the sea. Flashback ensues, Kaido’s debt is repaid, big mom’s crew arrives and Kaido passes out from exhaustion (cause water and magma don’t lift your energy very well) and maybe a flashback happens and both emperors are alive albeit without kaido’s crew, and then they come to the final battle cause neither of them like the world government. Big mom’s Elbaf arc starts sometime between the final war and now. Now that Ithink about it Kaido doesn’t hate Luffy, and does hate the world government, so I don’t see a reason for him not to join in on their side (except that Luffy and the straw hat crew all hate him) which would bring up some interesting dynamics and other stuff. The end.
The option 4 with big mom surviving by using kaido's life force seems somewhat plausible. It may be possible that big mom turns the lava into one of her homies with the help of kaido's life force and gets carried out of the volcano with the assistance of a potential new lava homie.
Its kinda confirmed tho that people fearing her is the condition for the activation of her soul stealing power - soul pokus? - and if anyone thinks there is a world where Kaido is afraid of her, I'd like to know what story they've been reading^^
Good point, I sort of forgot that the person needs to be afraid of big mom for her soul power ability to work.
Have we ever seen big Mom awakened devil fruit state? Or has she used it already
@@smichael7852 neither bm, nor kaido ever mentioned an awakening, which given how big a deal it is, one would assume they would if they used it.
But the fireform and the eating your own soul for strength sure do look like what you'd expect their awakened powers to be...
I love Big Mom's character. I love how she was ripping the Sunny apart during their escape. Her power is ridiculous and plus she's pretty savvy. I hope Oda brings her back in a big way--so she can be properly defeated by Luffy at Elbaf.
She’s a terrible character
@@Thehokage36 you're a terrible reader
I forget what it's called, but I remember in Wano they discussed part of the process to make sea stone involved volcanic magma encountering ocean water. I think that BM and Kaido have been sealed in sea stone either somewhere in the volcano, or blasted out with the eruption. But encased in sea stone is the only way I can imagine either of them being contained.
Ya know, a Big Mom and Kaido cover story would be a ton of fun haha
I think you forgot the scenario of Crocodile who, for personal reasons, fought alongside Luffy at Marineford. Similar thing can happen with Kaido and Big Mom. I say this mainly because I think Oda is saving their awakened forms for the final saga.
For some reason I can't shake off the feeling that the strawhats have made a colleague out of Kaido. Will we see him face off against Green Bull to protect Wano and the straw hats? Maybe. That might be a way for him to get the heroic death he always wished for. Saving BM along the way will close his arc as he returns her gratitude for gifting him his zoan devil fruit. Seems simplistic but I kinda dig this. That will also up the ante in terms of the Navy's fire power for the final colossal struggle, what with an admiral being able to defeat Kaido.
@@DonatiVI Big mom used advanced haki against page one but didn’t against kid and law she was obviously Nerfed just like Katakuri Enel Crocodile and law during dressrosa
Imagine that Big mom and Kaido do survive, step back from the main storyline, 30-40 years pass they become old and take over a small side of the grand line (maybe some of Kaido or Big moms older territories) while Luffy rules as the pirate king, setting them up to be the antagonists of another pirates story.
Wouldn’t that be interesting
there's no way he do big mom that dirty. I think there's way more to explore with her character.
Ussop is going to get his David vs Goliath moment in Elbaf, fighting Loki to finally recognize himself as a brave warrior of the sea
They’re prob alive
Thanks, now i don’t need to watch the vid 😊
I believe so
I think big mom killed Kaido, and escaped Wano. Then on her way home/to elbaf, she will end up being attacked by the marines and killed by their new weapon, the one that's supposed to replace the warlords. That's a solid way of hyping up how powerful the new marine weapon is, and gets big mom out of the story, and they can kill her while still keeping the info about what the weapon is a bit unclear. Just show big moms corpse, some reaction images from perospero/smoothie/daifuku and have them say some comments about not believing what's happening, and then show the silhouette of the weapon
Damn dude/dudette, that sounds like a legit theory that could happen! I can almost see it in my head. Maybe big mom doesn’t even necessarily kill kaido, but mortally sounds him even worse than they are when they come out the volcano, and this betrayal could lead to kaido maybe not having to be killed, but potentially redeemed? Or something… still, great idea yo!
@@Faintwolf Yeah, I think it would also help put Katakuri into a part of the story that would make sense for him, he's all about self-sacrifice to protect his family, and he was at odds with Big mom in many ways. So if the marines kill BM, and imprison Pero/smoothie/daifuku, he'll surely make an attempt at rescuing them, which ends up having him be indirectly on the strawhats side, and the remnants of the BM pirates are basically katakuri, cracker and brulee who all 3 have some history with luffy
dude that's actually a great theory and could be executed really well. We last heard of CP0 coming into contact W Big Moms ship and then going dark. Possibly, a HEAVILY injured Big Mom being nursed back by her crew only to get pulled up on by the weapons, Boom pack up Big Mom rq which I feel would be a good end bc as much as I like her, she's had a lot of time to shine. I lowkey would wanna see BM take Kaidous life span and try to pull back up on a Luffy a little bit later thinking that he's still just a brat but gets dogged on (not negative diff obv but i feel like itd be cool to see big mom furious at the fact that some little brat actually can whoop her. Give her a line saying something like "This is past the strength of an emperor, this is the strength of a pirate king/sun god/whatever) you get it just basically using her to show that they not on games no more and we really getting to pirate King level.
Another thing to add : There is SEASTONE in the magma of wano, since they come from that country.
I think "Usopp" beats Big Mom in Elbaf and cements his title of The Brave Warrior of The Sea. Usopp is the other character who befriends giants throughout the story while Big Mom makes enemies of them. I think it would be fitting that Usopp defeats the giants' worst enemy of the giants, Big Mom. Remember that the giants were known as some of the fiercest warriors of the sea, so it makes sense that Usopp becomes their hero.
I still want to see Big Mom remember what she did and see the impact it has on her. I also want to see Kaido roll up on the party and having acknowledged Luffy as Joyboy joins in and starts drinking and laughing. Having them just die in a volcano is so underwhelming.
the man who ravaged the lands for 20+ years just casually laughing and partying (while the alliance is in totality celebrating "his" defeat?)
One Piece fandom has gone off the rails. Everything you lot come up with is so stupid... well what can we expect when the story has become so exceedingly mediocre
@@ChibiTalha you have another comment where you say Kaido kills Zoro. Seems you have gone off the rails too.
@@ChibiTalha I'm not ready to quit but I have lost the excitement I used to have for the new chapters. I don't know if rushed is the right word but the last few chapters were unsatisfying. But as stupid as it sounds. I would not put it past Oda to just have Kiado join the party like noting happened and expect everyone to be cool with it.
@@necogreendragon Its because Oda is slow to unravel things. We got only a slice of the big news. What about the other crew members bounties? What about all the events that have transpired outside of Wano during this time? What will Aramaki do when he shows up in the flower capital? What will the worst generation members do now and how will this event affect their relationships to one another? We still have many questions to be answered and I am pretty excited to see what happens next.
@@ChibiTalha facts it’s so popular that we’re bound to get horrific fan canon like this
The reason of Linlin's back story is also to show how devil fruits powers can be acquired by eating the original possessors whole.
i like the idea that they were either Team-Rocketed or captured by the Marines or picked up by the Big Mom pirates, but theyve been so permanently damaged by the lava that they pose no physical threat anymore. i can also see Big Mom stealing Kaido's life because of the alliance thing and also because she said that he owed her his life from the God Valley incident
If they are dead (which I highly doubt) then my trust in oda would plummet. Already so disappointed in Wano's end and finishing the villains off like that would be the nail in the coffin for me.
x2... I'm quite sad if this is actually their real end... :c
I'm still surprised that this was written by the same guy who invented the G5th plot twist. I still believe there's more to say (I really hope).
i hope oda let them stay dead it will be so trash to make them stay alive
Option 6: Both find Pluton and try to get it work.
Edit: Kaido announced he is collecting the ancient weapons, he is staying on Wano because Wano is special and Big Mom asked what kind of secrets Wano holds when she fell down the hole. This to me looks like a setup, just how Nikka was foreshadowed by Who's Who. I am baffled how the One Piece Community completely ignores this theory.
...lul
What did they do for a week tho
@@RaffyDGoat figuring out how Pluton works
i hope this happens for some reason
Option 2: Volcanic Escape seems like the most sensible approach to this. And Kaido being blown on to a sky island would actually be pretty cool, since maybe the same thing could have happened when Shanks was fighting Kaido when Kaido wanted to come to marineford. Kaido will wake up on the sky island like "not again..."
I think there's also the oppurtunity that "Opening the Borders of Wano" somehow includes destroying the volcano Wano sits atop, which could be another way to free them, later on. Additionally, it's possible there's some other kind of refuge under the Volcano of Wano, and Big Mom and Kaido will sink to there, and return to the story at a later point.
The giants know about what Big Mom did to Mother Caramel and the children. There was a giant that watched it all happened and ran in fear to tell all of Elbaf. Big Mom still doesn’t know what happened and that definitely needs to be resolved. Finally, I believe in Luffy’s promise to Katakuri that he’d come back and defeat Big Mom.
People always say this but does she really need to know what happened? It's not a mystery to us the audience and the tragic part of her character is that she spent her whole life not knowing, which informed the person she is today. Why does that need to change?
@@ThatCringeCalledIggleboz It all depends on what way Oda wants to go. Pound’s story of never being in his daughters lives and unable to protect them until his “final” moment and Chiffon didn’t even know who he was and that story could’ve ended there. However, Oda had other plans and it wouldn’t make sense for Big Mom to be finished in Wano because nothing about her “defeat” was symbolic to her character. Kaido boiling in lava with no wittinesses being the exact opposite of Oden’s death fits very nicely. If Oda wrote BM differently in this arc I might think differently but this feels intentional on his part. Big Mom is now stripped of her title and her reputation is in absolute shreds she will be even more of a menace.
Forget it bro Oda speedrun the entire wano they aint commin back
1 year later and yeah, ig it's confirmed they really aren't coming back. What a disappointing end to 2 Yonkos tbh. I'm not someone who supported the theory of the raid failing, alright? All I wanted was to give these 2 being given more ideology exploration, mindset, intelligence and a decent backstory.
Speed run wano that arc took years bro
Ayeee he made a video about how they’ll probably die so I can expect them to come back in a few chapters
Idea: When the Red Line falls (creating the all blue), there will be seismic shifts sending Kaido and Big Mom flying up into the final war arc of the series or whatever
RE: Being trapped under water.
I thought the only reason Jack was able to wait for rescue was because he is a fishman. As a Devil Fruit user he can't swim or escape, but as a fishman he can't drown. So he was just stuck.
As far as I'm aware Kaido and Big Mom can't breathe water and don't have gills. Surely if trapped under water they would eventually drown.
Big Mom should be able to drown, yes. Kaidou, probably not. Otherwise that would make a gigantic plot hole regarding why Kaidou never tried to drown himself if he's been trying to die for so long. Why not jump from a sky island directly into the sea instead of falling on land? It'd make no sense unless he can breathe underwater too.
Kaido’s devil fruit is the fish-fish fruit: model dragon, so he should be able to survive underwater - at least until he died of thirst or hunger.