Moving Magnet and Moving Coil Cartidges
Vložit
- čas přidán 22. 08. 2024
- Your stylus sits at the end of a cantilever. The other end of the cantilever disappears into a little magic box called the cartridge. You'll often hear the terms MM or MC when describing the cartridge. But what are they?
Find out more at JoyOfVinyl.com
Written & Produced by Rick Coste
To learn more about Rick and his work go to RickCoste.com
"A little magic box..." Perfect description.
A MC cartridge has a flat response through the audio band typically. So connecting to your pre-amp is a no worry experience apart from the pitiful output. A MM cartridge will be affected by interaction of cable and input capacitance with the cartridge inductances. Get it wrong and the cartridge may sound dull and lifeless or have a sibilance which will drill teeth. All are sensitive to tracking weight and VTA. Getting the arm bias setting right helps as well. The VTA gets more critical the fancier the needle profile.
Great simple and concise explanation! The illustrations worked well and nice editing to get it all in in under 5 minutes. As a fairly recent convert to MC, it was nice to see the difference after hearing and enjoying the differences. Nice work.
Thank you @S Park!
Get yourself an MM or MI cartridge with a Micro-Linear stylus fitted (Micro-Line, Micro-Ridge, SAS, OCL "Optimised Contact Line...😉). THEN get back to us & see if you still feel the same way!😉
Very nice video and well described. I always used MM carts until hearing my first MC cart on my turntable. Luckily my Tavish phono pre has enough gain for MC carts, as the DL103r cart I’m using right now only puts out .20 mV. Can’t forget to add MI (moving iron) cartridges, like Grado and Soundsmith produce. They seem to be a best of both MM and MC, imo. Thanks for the fantastic vid! 👍🎶🔊✨
Same experiance here - you're liking MM until you hear a good MC :)))
...& then you're LOVING them.🥰😍🥰🤣🤣🤣
Very good video. You used a viewer's own intuition built from the physics lesson to apply it to the topic of interest!
Thanks, Jacob!
Thank you, very much, for this explanation.
Welcome!
Very helpful, as are the comments. I was thinking about a Technics 1500 tt, but discovered that the joy of headshell changing comes with the sacrifice of no moving coil. And while I could probably live content with an Ortofon Bronze for the rest of my life, I’m awfully curious about MC and not sure I’d want to preclude that world of audio possibilities. So consignment mmf 9.3 or new Pro-ject X2 .. . Happy choices! 😎
??? OF COURSE you can use detachable headshells with MC cartridges!🧐
Every bit as easily as you're using your MM cartridge right now!😇
All that you can't do with MC's is swap out your stylus assembly by simply pulling it out with your hand, as you do with MM's when you wear it out or otherwise damage it. Because MC's have ultra-fine coil wires attached to the cantilever rod, that are internally soldered to the pins at the back you slide your headshell leads onto, making the stylus assembly user-removable is impossible without destroying the coils!😬🤦
So instead of saving maybe 10-20% by just replacing a stylus assembly, instead of having to replace the entire cartridge 😱🤣🤣🤣😉, you have to replace the ENTIRE cartridge.
On very expensive MC's, the cost of sending your worn-out one to a Specialist for rebuilding can be worth the $500 or so to they usually charge.
Many MC cartridge companies have generous exchange and/or trade-up policies when you send your old one back to them, too.
The biggest advantage to being able to keep the cartridge body of your old MM & just replace the stylus assembly instead, is that you don't have to do all the installation & set-up work you did the first time around all over again!😵💫
Great explanation. The invention of the MC and MM cartridges came from a creative mind, the creation of the universe from an even greater mind...God. He was the big BANG.
Thank you ever so much for explaining it for a dummy….me. I’ve been looking in to buying an MC cartridge and am aware of the power needs of it. So I’m also looking for a decent pre-amp.
You are definitely not a dummy @jmad627. I’m learning new things about my love of vinyl decades after buying my first LP. I’m thrilled you’re here! Spread the word.
For the extra money 💸💸💸 involved in getting a preamp "decent" enough not to make an MC sound worse than a decent MM, DON'T BOTHER.
It's fun to look, so by all means investigate my words by yourself. But "decent" MC preamps cost $2000+USD...Put that money into a better MM cartridge instead (Audio-Technica VM-95ML, Ortofon Black LVB 250, a JICO SAS stylus fitted to a vintage Shure V-15 II-V, M97, M95, M91, M75, etc...) & you'll still have enough left over to perhaps consider getting a worthy vintage TT, since all the ones that they make now are pure 💩 until you spend $10k+!!!😮🧟🤦
Even a $50 Dual 1214 from 1973 will sonically clobber anything made by Pro-Ject, Rega, Audio-Technica, or a Technics SL-1200! Imagine what paying a qualified technician another $100-200 to completely clean & overhaul it will further add to its sound!😇
And the 1214 was Dual's bottom of the range piece of 💩!!! So maybe find a 701, 1229, 1219 (sleeper bargain alert!), 1019, 1009, or (more sleeper bargain alerts!!!) even a 1015, 1009f, or 1009SK/SK2. Happy hunting, & happy trails!😊
In both systems you need two coils as it is the coils that carry the signals to be amplified.
Im not so sure about the end. My understanding was that MMs are less mass than MC designs.
Check Soundsmiths Moving vs Fixed Coil article.
Exactly, there's definitely more mass on the cantilever of an MC cart vs an MM cart. And besides its not as straightforward as just saying "MC carts are always better than MM carts". That can be the case for sure but not always. Most of the MC carts I've heard are definitely more coloured in their sound signature than a typical MM tends to be. So a lot of it comes down to personal preference tbh. It is a massive shame that Audio Technica stopped making truly high-end MM carts. Things like the legendary AT-ML170 which was preferred over more expensive MC alternatives back in the 80s by no other than Doug Sax himself as well as other proven names in the industry. Even something like the AT-150MLX with its gold plated boron cantilever (amongst other great construction choices in terms of materials) doesn't exist anymore. And I'm not convinced that the latest VM540/750 etc. series is actually a worthy successor as the materials there are clearly cheaper (no boron cantilever or PCOCC wiring). Also with the vast array of improvements that magnets have seen over the years, we should be able to not only have as good MM carts as the ones from the past but better ones even.
The industry is clearly still very much AGAINST moving magnet cartridges just like it was back in the 80s. If a cartridge is truly considered "high-end" than it has to be MC, no exceptions. Its true that in some cases more expensive can mean better, but in the case of MM vs MC I am not convinced that is the case. Especially when so many standard MC carts on the market still come with inferior stylus profiles than what is on a similarly priced (or in many cases lower priced) MM cart alternative. After all when the majority of the budget has to go towards what happens inside the generator due to the more costly MC design, corners must be cut somewhere and usually the where is the stylus and or cantilever. In my opinion that is not a part of a cartridge that should be looked at as an afterthought.
@@werk4408 Thanks 😊
@@werk4408 RIGHT ON! Everything, EVERYTHING, you say is true!!! The A-T VM-95ML has the Micro-Linear stylus that the 540 & 740ML has, AND it sounds noticeably better than either of them, never mind the more expensive VM-95SH with its inferior Shibata stylus! 🙄🤦
It probably sounds better than those older ML models you mention...but not the ones that had boron cantilevers fitted to them. The fatter, anodised aluminium cantilever on the VM95 series tames the excess brightness & especially the annoying Audio-Technica thin-sounding midrange...which they eliminate. Yet, go up to the 540 & 740 models, & they have the traditional thin & shiny aluminium cantilever of yore. Result? They actually manage to sound noticeably WORSE than the 95ML at 50% & 200% more money, respectively.😳😵💫
Way to go, Audio-Technica!🤪🤤🤤🤤🤦🤗
And NO, there are NO new designs from the established & establishment cartridge companies. Nagaoka & Goldring are a joke, Grado is an insult, & Ortofon is downright disgraceful.
All very cynical rehashing of the same 💩 they made in 1985, 1975, even 1965!!!
Nagaoka at least has the "honesty" not to hide the fact that they're still using the exact same tooling they used back in 1975. Grado's goes back to 1965 for their improperly shielded half-Metal humboxes, formerly the FTE & GTE & Signature series, now the "Heritage"(?) & "Prestige"😂😂😂 series. All the EXACT SAME CARTRIDGE, only the dots on the stylus grip or the colour of the (half!🙄) metal body differs. Even the fancy-looking wooden ones; same crap but now with NO shielding & a glued-in non-removeable stylus!🤪
But just as EVIL are Goldring & Ortofon:
The guts are the exact same as 1975-85, but they sprung for some new injection molding to hide the same old 💩 underneath!
What's the difference between the old & recently discontinued OM series & the new(er) 2M series? Underneath the hood, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. A 2M cartridge ain't nothin but an OM in an Armani suit! 2M Red? OM5e! 2M Blue? OM20! 2M Bronze? OM30!!! Only the 2M Black, at around $900, has no OM series equivalent. It has a Shibata stylus, which no OM series cartridge ever had. OM40, anyone?🧐
The best part of the joke is the stylus interchangeability. Take ANY OM series stylus & try sliding it onto a 2M body. Not only a perfect fit, but the exact same sound, too! And why not? Take an OM & a 2M body, & put them side by side with their stylii removed. Look closely at the coils & the shielded case. Not only are they ABSOLUTELY IDENTICAL, but if you took an old 70's FF or VMS series body & looked inside them with the stylus removed, you'll see the exact same thing AGAIN!!!🤯🤧
It's one thing to slip a dainty OM series stylus onto a chunky 2M body. But did you know you can ALSO slide that hulking 2M stylus assembly onto an OM series body & IT FITS & WORKS PERFECTLY???🤣🤣🤣
Sure, it looks like the cartridge Batman would listen to in the Bat Cave. But other than that...
Don't just believe me, go find the various CZcams videos of guys doing it & playing them!
Despite the Vinyl Revival being into its 15th+ year, & beating CD sales BY UNIT VOLUME for the first time since 1987, cartridge manufacturers STILL think & act like it's a fad that's going to disappear tomorrow & leave them with yet another pile of useless expensive tooling like what happened in the late 80's.
So they're making MINIMAL expenditure & doing NON-EXISTENT Research & Development.
The most bleeding-edge cartridge technology ever was the hollow single-crystal sapphire cantilever; used only in a bare handful of premium models in the early to mid-80's. I owned 4 of them: first the Accuphase AC-2, then a Nagaoka MP-50Super, then Bang & Olufsen MMC1's & MMC2's (by far the best of them!).
Only one company in the entire world, in Japan (of course 🧐), had the technology & tooling to make those cantilevers: Namiki.
But when Vinyl died out in the late 80's, Namiki scrapped the high-powered laser machine(s) & lost the artisans that mastered them/it.
Namiki is still around. They're back in the OEM cantilever manufacturing business, big time.
So where's the "new" hollow sapphire cantilevers, much less the hollow diamond ones that would be an even further step above & beyond?
Yet all we see are SOLID diamond cantilevers & SOLID Sapphire, & even solid Ruby. All very much 1970's tech!
Sorry my friend; it seems that there's no cartridge manufacturers out there, whatever they're charging for their best ($15k+!), that's truly interested let alone brave enough, to "MOVE THE NEEDLE"!🥱🕸️🙄
AMAZING video!
Thank you!
Great video, nice concise explanation. Just curious if you have a preference, I've always had MM cartridges including my current Ortofon Bronze. Keep up the great content!
Thanks @john miller! I've always relied on an MM from Ortofon as well.
Nice to see the Channelmaster has made a wise choice! Magnetic cartridges are actually the better design than MC cartridges are. I don't know where you got the bizarre idea that MM cartridges exert more "pressure"? on the pivot than MC's do. If anything, it's the opposite! It's the MC cartridges that have to overcome the resistance of moving the 4 wires around that allow the coils to generate their signals, whereas MM & MI cartridges work in free space.
Add the weight differences between a pair of coils & the "form" they're usually wound on (to give them & hold them to their proper shape) versus the little magnets or pieces of permeable iron that usually weigh less, too!
The result is that MC's ALWAYS have inferior tracking ability due to the greater moving mass than even vastly less expensive MM's.
To help overcome these characteristic MC disadvantages, correspondingly higher tracking force is almost always specified for them as well.
There's plenty of other serious performance deficiencies to MC cartridges. I can happily blather on about their non-existent voltage outputs of ⅒th of MM's, the amount of information that gets lost in the hum & especially hiss that results, & the vastly greater sums required to obtain the preamplification required to overcome all this hassle.🧟
Great video. You should also include ceramic and moving iron cartridges
Thanks @josemeyer7464 ! I probably should do another one which covers these. There are some exotic cartridges out there, to your point.
Beautiful
Thank you Renata!
There is also moving iron cartridges. Stanton and Grado made some.
I did not know that. I learn something new every day. Thanks!
@@TheJoyofVinylRecordsyes these started to show up in the sixties. At the time the alnico v magnet was essentially the only choice. So moving iron designs with fixed coils ( some had four for stereo ) and fixed magnets. This allowed a small piece of iron ( lowering the moving mass) to create a Flux in the electromagnetic field and producing a current and signal. In my personal opinion these such as the Stanton 680/681 where some of the best. They could usually be used in a standard MM phono preamp and definitely benefited from the reduced moving mass especially when a nude diamond was implemented. That Stanton 680/681 is the cartridge I keep coming back to since 1978. There is some magic in the way the iron armature controls the signal ( sorta like rudder) . Creating a wonderful sound stage. 😊. And yes it's less expensive like the MM and the user is able to easily replace the stylus like the MM. I'll continue using the Stanton it is within my budget and the half dozen replacement styli wouldn't get me a moving coil cartridge anyway. There is a reason why the circle of friends and relatives one by one ended up getting a 681. It was the common thread that we all shared with vastly different approaches to the equipment we used.
@@stevengagnon4777 Thanks, Steven!
Nice Video!!!
I have one of the better Audiotechnia movingly magnet cartridges and as far as I am concerned it's better than many entry level moving coil cartridges. I am not about to go out and buy an expensive moving coil along with an expensive compatible Amp. I may upgrade my speakers and phono stage at some point but having the albums and cds is also more of a priority than moving coil .
I am also at a stage where I am happy with my setup. I also never stay satisfied for long and always look at what I can upgrade. I think my next will be a new set of speakers.
If your Audio-Technica is a $250USD VM-95ML, you've got the best-sounding MM cartridge in current production. The meaningless cartridge upgrade merry-go-round stops right here! For about 4 times the money, you COULD get an A-T OC9mXL or AT33PTG/II, & get an MC cartridge that is merely as good. Or perhaps, with the right $10,000USD valve phono stage preamp, 10-15% better sounding than the VM-95ML. PERHAPS.🤨
LOVE IT! Are either of these designs more susceptible to errant static? I know one of 'em is what necessitates turntable grounding... That's the Moving Coil, I think?
Hi @willhouse! I usually recommend connecting the ground when available regardless of the cartridge. It's not a perfect science with all of the models out there. If a user experiences a hum when connected then I suggest disconnecting. It's seems to be hit or miss depending on the setup to be honest.
As far as errant static - great question. I've never heard that one is more sensitive or susceptible to static than another.
Static, or static-y noises, have absolutely NOTHING to do with your cartridge OR stylus type.😳
Static is as static does. Ensure as best you can that you have at least 40% humidity in the air, use a conductive record brush with Carbon-Fibre bristles (Audioquest makes a superb one for under $40USD), DON'T use a "sticky" super-soft rubber platter mat...OR one of those stupid lousy-sounding felt things that lift off when you put your LP away🤣🤣🤣🙄!
Replace all your original paper LP sleeves with polyethylene anti-static ones ASAP (I like Mobile Fidelity's "Mo-Fi" sleeves. Pack of 50 usually $30USD or so).
If you play an LP & you ALWAYS hear the same static noise at the exact same place in a given song, you're either hearing scratches on the LP surface (permanent damage!🤦) or especially on records made after 1990 or so, the LP itself is defective due to poor manufacturing (usually from the plating process of the original lacquer master), or the vinyl is crap (despite being twice or three times as heavy as LP's made in the 1970's🙄😑)...
Nice video
I am using an mm with my Kenwood turntable
Can i install an mc on the same turntable?
That's hard to say without knowing more about the turntable. You can swap an MC for an MM on some systems. There are some things to consider though. The preamp would need to be able to handle an MC cartridge (not all can). The tonearm would also have to be able to work for an MC cartridge. You'll also want to be able to adjust the tracking and anti-skate if needed. I wish it were a simple "yes" or "no" answer. If the turntable is old you may be better off swapping the stylus with a new one that matches what you have.
Yes it's old
Kenwood kd4100 made in 1979
Subscribed.
So Music is produced via a spark
Static!😂
finally which system is better?
I suspect MC but have yet to experience an MC cart on my system. One of these days.
Deca
How does the needle determine L/R channels?
It's amazing and it took me awhile to visualize it. Basically the shape of the groove dictates it, with lateral and vertical movements. The lateral movements translate to the right channel and the vertical movements to the left channel. A great visualization of this can be seen here: www.vinylrecorder.com/stereo.html
@@TheJoyofVinylRecords thanks, amazing
@@TheJoyofVinylRecords so kinda like Waveforms.