Genteq x13 ecm motor with fm19 module REPAIR
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- čas přidán 17. 05. 2020
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DIY repair video. Watch as we disassemble a Genteq X13 Motor Module. Problems and Solutions. Please also if you would like to support our up coming music video follow the link below.
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We need more people like you on Planet Earth. Thank You...
Absolutely. The world desperately needs more people who can fulfill these two Commandments of God's law. Matthew 22:37 - 39
Thanks for the kind words.. be blessed
Not sure if anyone replied with this but if you are in a pinch you can simply twist the thermistor until the two leads are shorted to each other and the motor will run with no inrush protection. A simple fix. temporary or as long as it will run until the next power surge.
thanks, but don't really need any fires... but thanks for watching
I always give the customer the option on a PSC motor. Vast majority of units can be modified to use a conventional motor. No electronics needed. All this "energy saving" technology is about making money. It's not about saving the consumer money nor about saving the environment
ya I agree...
Thank you very much. How aggravating this company's practices are with regards to their electronics. Your comments were insightful. I greatly appreciate you sharing your learning experience with us despite ruining your board. Thanks to your trial and error, you are saving us all from doing the same! Also the background music was smooth.
Thanks you, that is the hope I have in making it - to save viewers time and money... Have a great day.
This video was a public service. Thank you for your candor, ...and ECM sacrifice.
This whole difficult to repair ECM thermistor deal feels a lot like planned-obsolescence. 😵😅
Nice music production channel! 😁
Glad it helped -- and thanks for the kind words about the channel.
Great video, that is exactly what gentec is doing. And knowing it can be made at a fraction of the cost. Now im about to decide what to do with my broke one. It is hot in my house, but im not paying gentec a dime
the drop in replacement is really the best way to go. I fixed the genteq for it only to fail soon after, put the drop in replacement its been fine for years.
@@jefferycurtismusic1602 I bought a psc motor and a relay switch. Bout to put it in, Hopefully that works.
The rubber is for moisture protection
A great help to me, and to many more I'm sure. Thank you so much. Very well done. Thermistor resistance was 1.4-1.5, should be 1.0. Hoping that's the issue. Certainly going to give it a try, replacing the thermistor without removing the composite material.
thanks .. I hope it works for you. have a great day.
Did replacing the thermistor work?
Did replacing the thermistor work?
I replaced an ecm fan motor for a customer on a carrier furnace. Tried to get a new motor module for it. The dealer said the only listing in his system was for a whole motor. No listing for the module. Dont know if the info was correct, but i didn't have a choice. Since then i have a chance to look at the motor and module and found the motor was fine and the module had 1 small connection burnt. No sure if it's a fuse or just a weak link in the design. The inrush thermister looks ok, not deformed in any way. Havent electrically tested it. I was thinking of resoldering a similar sized and gauge wire accross this point to see if it would work
THANK YOU ❤️. AGREE WITH EVERYTHING YOUVE SAID.
thanks for watching
Wish I would found your video sooner ..I got in our trade in 1995 ( belt driven era ) running residential service..sooo bought a new Bryant heat pump package unit last year ..thinking awesome no problem for many years …wrong …indoor blower motor starting staying on non stop …pulled the stat ..pulled the subbase checked all low voltage wiring ..changed the green wire one of my extra tstat wires …I’m frustrated now !!! Buddy said it has to be your board only board is the defrost board ..with no g terminal..but I changed it out anyway …still running non stop …now I’m mad …. Messed with those ac/dc relays for the additional heat strips I had put in ..with that Rectifier board ..( feeling like a dinosaur with this new technology ) …made myself even more mad ..anyway …started looking at the motor ..thought well why don’t you pull your speed leads ..sure enough ..pulled them …motor is still running …sooo I just ordered a new Module yesterday…this better work !! I miss belt driven motors and standing pilots just saying way more goes wrong with all the fancy bells and whistles !!! ..this one really had me saying what the …. !!!
I am so sorry for your pain. i know these things are designed to cost the owner money and prevent self-repair. If you watch my follow-up video, The new module only lasted a couple months, Finally I just replaced the motor with an Evergreen drop in replacement, which I am happy to say is still running fine. Good luck hope your module lasts longer.
Agreed 100%. Genteq OEM should make some quality improvements on these or soon they will be facing a likely class action lawsuit by the many defrauded customers. Aftermarket is the way to go with the X13 without any confusion. However, it appears that the "Genteq X13 ECM Motor" is now under the Evergreen model made by Regal Rexnord. At least it seems so plus they (Regal) apparently have it fixed, comes with real ball bearings and a 2 year warranty.
ya cause the drop in replacement is still going strong years later...
I did hvac for over 40 yrs. My 2yr old x13 did the same thing. I installed a new package unit when I moved. Can’t get a unit that does not use them. I am replacing that motor with tried and true psc ( old style) run many years motor. Physical size is the same. All you need is a relay and the motor capacitor. Every thing in this country has evolved to bankrupt us and we are all paying for it now! I have watched the hvac industry make their systems complicated and costly to the extreme. I was embarrassed to tell a customer what a repair would cost. I was at the tail end on this nonsense thank god. Good luck.
thanks for sharing.
Complete true all. You deserve my like and subscribe.
thanks
I understand where you’re coming from regarding the black potting compound. And I’m sure some of it is to dissuade repairs, but any industrial type equipment like that needs to be potted. Especially something near a constantly running motor. These motors produce a large amount of conductive dust… and Conductive dust, moisture, vibration, and all sorts of other issues will drastically shorten the life of this module without the potting compound.
Hear me out.....I deal with 300 or more of these every year, and have depotted dozens of them because of my own curiosity. I have the equipment and chemicals to do it safely, quickly, and somewhat cleanly…
And I can honestly say after handling thousands of these modules… If they weren’t potted… I think the lifespan would be drastically shortened.
That being said… Surely there’s some other way they could build these instead of potting them, while still protecting the components. Possibly sealed in their own watertight containment area with an O-ring or something like that… But that would add a lot of manufacturing cost which would be passed on to the customer.
I am the furthest thing from a supporter of these manufacturing practices… But there isn’t a better way at this time… To maintain the same level of robust design while keeping the price relatively low
But I mean no disrespect to you or your opinion. And wish you well with your repairs
My original Genteq module circa 2010 did NOT have potting compound. It lasted 7 years before the current inrush limiter failed. I soldered a new CIL in very sloppily. It's been going 4 years. These modules are extremely sensitive to dirty power coming from the power company or lightning strikes. I may buy a 35 buck Zebra VZPRO surge protector for my model of ECM (the other type is for X13 is Zebra X13PR surge protector). I seriously doubt my CIL failed due to vibration, dust, etc. The potting compound is total BS. I too will never buy another Genteq equipped blower fan. Next time it fails I plan to switch back to the tried and true PSC type motor using the Qwikswap V3 board even though it's slightly over a hundred bucks.
The potting in this case is surely to stop repairs; else they would have used conformal coating; which does the same thing (protection from FOD, contamination, moisture, vibration, etc…) but is easier to remove for test and repair actions.
So, actually they first over priced the motor in the A/C heating unit, so it's more expensive than other units, then they over price the new motor or the electronic controller for the motors, and the manufacturers will not sell or deal with the people who actually bought the A/C and heating unit, you would have to go to one of their distributors in order to buy the product/ motor or the controller for the A/c heating unit, why would anyone in their right mind, buy such a A/C heating unit, that was a great video thanks for sharing your knowledge, you are appreciated,
Thanks for watching...
The thermister is open if the blower will not turn on. You can jump a wire across each thermister terminal and if the blower comes on you know it is the thermister. You can cut the thermister out but leave its wires sticking up and solder a new thermister to those wires. Most thermisters fail from power spikes or surges. You can buy a surge protector that plugs in between the motor connection and wire harness to prevent motor or module damage in the future. I think the surge protector costs like $28. You can also buy a kit ($$$) to convert blower to the old style motor, capacitor and relay (points) system. Like I had for 25 years and never failed except for one relay replacement that cost 20 bucks. Yes like most modern stuff this crap is not meant to be serviceable. Replace parts but don't fix parts. It sucks.
@@cujobean542 the motor should run. Not shutting off is not the thermister.
I assume you completed all the other tests such as the themostat or thermostat wiring and motor OHM tests to eliminate them as the possible problem. If you did that pretty much means the motor controller is the issue. Therefore, jumping the thermister on the controller board to test it should not be an issue but I wouldn't run it that way for long. A thermister is a temperature sensitive resistor. As understand it in these motors it allows current to charge the capcitors at a different voltage, or maybe I should amps, depending on temperature. This somehow protects the capacitors. The capacitors are what start the electric motor. Sometimes the thermister is burned indicating it is bad. If that is the case no need to jump it just replace it. The part for my 220 volt 1/2 horsepower 5SME39HXL182 motor is an SL22 thermister but I don't know if that is correct for all motors. The old thermister should have a part number on it. Mine says it is 1.0 OHM and a 4 digit part number. The thermisters are on eBay for as little as $10. Don't cut the old on out until you get the new one. Leave the wires from the old thermister sticking out so you can solder the new one onto those wires. Thermisters do not have polarity so which way you solder it in doesn't matter. If you decide to buy a new motor controller you must know the exact motor part number to get the correct board programming for your motor. As I said my motor part number was a 5SME39HXL182. It's printed on the motor label.
Great idea. I’m gonna try cutting the next transistor off and solder and new one like you said👍
Would this fix a constantly running blower?
Probably not, once these things start failing, its been my experience that they will just keep going out, after I fixed mine it went out agian in a matter of months, I finally replaced with an evergreen drop in for like 250 dollars, I haven't had a problem since.
Any device employing a rotating assembly has the potential to create a "vibration environment". Long exposure to vibration can damage electrical components (think small parts being shaken back and forth countless times until that small but repeated movement eventually causes metal fatigue to break one of the leads). To protect the board they apply adhesive over the components to hold them in place and provide strain relief. This is commonly called "potting". Potting can also be used to protect against dirt, moisture, chemicals.
ok, thanks for the response.
Yes with AC motors however, DC motors do not vibrate as much, a lot less than AC. The problem with the Genteq OEM ECM is the crap part they are using.
@@Garth2011 The rotating assembly of fan and motor as is commonly encountered in the field is never 100% perfectly dynamically balanced. This is equally true for AC motor driven loads and DC motor driven loads. Any deviation from perfect balance can produce vibration. If you can put your hand on a device and tell by feel that it is running, you are experiencing a vibration environment. PSC style motors don't contain the same circuit board populated with a collection of electrical components like ECM motors do. This is why potting is rare in a PSC but common in an ECM. I agree with you that the high failure rate of many ECM motors appears to indicate inadequate design, capacity or robustness.
@@jblcontrol28crossover76 Yes but these ECM motors are really DC powered which means they have a level power Hz vs. 60 Hz per second as in AC. I believe that is where much of the "noise" comes from in AC motors vs. the more quiet DC motors. Our garage door opener is DC, our attic fan motor is DC and its night and day to the AC versions of those. Maybe one day homes will have a point of entry converter to swap AC power to DC power at the main breaker box ! Then we won't have this ECM problem, just what might fail at the breaker box !
@@Garth2011 DC motors do not operate on an unwavering stream of current. Historically they've employed a mechanical commutator or to switch power on/off to sequential sections of windings in the armature. In the newer style ECM motors they employ solid state components to switch power on/off to sequential sections of windings. Both older and newer style motors send pulsating current through the windings. The letters VFD stand for Variable Frequency Drive.
Thank you. Please help i am about to replace the whole module for the SECOND TIME in three years. Is there a problem i am not seeing???????? I worked machine shop 30 years so replacing part is not hard BUT playing with electronic is greek. HELP.
My advice is to replace the motor with an Evergreen Drop in replacement motor. This is what I did after the module failed a second time. Sorry for your situation. I bought mine on amazon for about 250. Hopr you Christmas turns out better.
My thermister measured 1.5 ohms. I bought the the new thermister and replaced it. I spliced it in on top without removing the rubber. It did not make a difference. Time to order a controller.
Please watch my update video, its better to just replace with and evergreen motor, cheaper in the long run also.
Does anybody know what the FM abbreviation stands for? I deal with a lot of these units, mostly FM19, FM20, FM07, FM38 and others. But I have no idea what the FM marking stands for, and can’t find reference to it anywhere online.
not sure... Frequency Modulated?? but ??
Where can I get Proto 703? This stuff is supposed to work wonders in removing the compound from the board.
not sure, but will remember that for the next one.
Mine failed. 6 years old. Out of warranty.
Tearing into it now. That thermistor seems OK.
My motor will start if you help it - and won't if you don't. I'm thinking one of the big capacitors on the board has failed. Motor just spins *very* slowly in a shaky motion.
Thanks for stepping in. Yes sounds like the start capacitor. Look for swelling, that many times happens when a cap goes bad.
Wow..great video. I have my ECM motor out of the air handler. Does not turn on at all. I can re-do the thermistor for sure. You checked the one in the video -- it was attached to the board ?
use the diode checker and see if voltage will go through is the quick and dirty way, this will only tell you if it is open, but many times this is the case.
@@jefferycurtismusic1602 Wow..fantastic thanks
Why would a company want to hurt their customers ? It's because when the company puts themselves above other companies and considers themselves the only source of applications for the A/C heating industry, in a world of always something more convenient for the consumer's advantages, at a period of serious conditions, I agree with you, wouldn't want to purchase a product that puts the customer in depth financially, not everyone is financially capable to spend their hard earned income on over priced products at such a time, great video thanks,
thanks for watching..
I wonder if that thermistor was really broken. You have to subtract the resistance of the leads. So you short the 2 leads together and that will give you a measurement. Usually in the 0.5-0.7 ohm range, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's 0.9 ohms.
Of course, Awesome video! I'm sitting here with a broken Genteq. I don't think it's the thermistor though. Turns on for 27 seconds exactly and then turns off. Weird stuff.
@@bigrob4781 In the end I think it's better just to put an evergreen motor in, Pls watch my follow-up video to this.
is it possible to lube the bearings in the motor? My unit has a faint squeak when on
yes on some models, heres a link. czcams.com/video/UKoK_U_GKZI/video.html
@@jefferycurtismusic1602 I have a Gentec Motor also. From 2018, already started squeaking. I fyou remove the fM19 module can you lube it?
Would 1.2 ohms still be too much at 80 degrees Fahrenheit room temperature? I cooled the thermistor with an ice pack and got a reading of 1.6 ohms. So it seems like it's working. What are your thoughts? Thanks .
Probably if it works, it works.
Replace the ECM with a PSC motor.
ya thats a great solution also.. thanks for watching.
Thanks man
My broke so I change it for a capacitor motor
F them
Did it work?. hope so... have a great day
the SL22 1R020 is 20Amp Use a SL32 1R030 its 30 amps and should not fail
thanks. and thanks for watching.
Good morning, I have a ZHONGSHAN BROAD-OCEAN MOTOR CO. LTD BOM: ZWK702D0551101 (0131M00389),? Which version of the ECM engine corresponds to, and where can I get information to test it?
Thank you very much for your help
My suggestion is to replace the motor, I have been using these evergreen motors, they seem to work. just make sure the hp is the same and your good to go. www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06Y3FDHW8/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
thanks for the support.
Blower motor, still working properly ... will keep that in mind for when motor malfunctions occur. the engine is approximately 7 years old.
gosh, thank goodness for uncle sam mandating the industry for these “energy saving motors” 😡 save a little in energy but screwed when we need repair
i’d like to add,,, thanks for the video. 👍
your welcome.. have a great day.
GREAT VIDEO BUT TURN THE DAMN MUSIC OFF!!!!!
lol.... Well just trying to keep it so its not boring, thanks for watching
Evergreen is genteq
drop in replacement
See I asked the qenteq's sales rep if they had fixed this issue he said it was to dangerous to change the limiter, he doesn't understand amps and watts aren't the same.
Jeez.....repeat yourself much ....😝
thanks for watching
Annoying music is distracting.
lol.. sorry you didn't like it...
Sorry, man. I had to stop watching: your 'music' is irritating and discracting.
Sorry, its just the free stuff from youtube audio.