@@TheCoremeltdown no doubt. If I didnt have the Lib I would have lost em all turn 3. I had 4 Aeldari units pinned in melee and the Librarian saved em all.
What Psychic power would he get, do you think!? It could be a defensive or offensive ability... and I a little bit hope it's a offensive one. I would love him to have a Smite ability and then a mortal wound dealing power, perhaps.
They could give a -1 damage but cannot be pair with whatever other character, it would stop the biologus/captain combo. If you wanna have the 5+ FNP GW would need to change the Iron Father and give them -1 damage, it would give him more screen times.
On that note, GW are cowards for making the Biologis the unofficial Lieutenant in Gravis armor with none of the weapons and is unlikely to proc his own ability.
Would love to see a terminator video on how to make them work. Big squads. Leaders and strats. They always get the short straw but are so epic in lore. I will make them work if it kills me lol
10 man assault terminator squad with terminator chaplain running the BT Righteous Crusaders detachment are 45 wounds of 2+, 4++, 5+++, +1 to wound in melee, 4+++ against mortals (now dev wounds)
brother, 10 man squad with capt and ANCIENT. everyone sleeps on the ancient but as soon as 1 termie is dead the entire squad gets +1 to hit for the rest of the game, and when they're below half strength (3 boys left with captain and ancient) they get +1 to wound as a lil bonus (not to be relied upon) if theyre in cover with armour of contempt they are truly the most sturdy marine unit, captains free strat is well spent here. A 12 man termie squad in rapid fire range with all those storm bolters will shred with weight of fire ideally using the cyclone missile launchers for dat 48" range anti tank or infantry and 12 more power fists coming in to slam. I always walk my termies on the board from turn 1 drawing enemy fire and soaking up most of it with their durability. never go for the 9" deep strike charge i have lost too many termies to this ambitious move, walk and staunch or rapid ingress this THREAT and you will be happy. They are your meat, beat with your meat.
I use one with a 10 man stern guard vet squad with Deathwatch. Use the deep strike enhancement on him. Drop them in on the tome of ectoclades round (reroll all hits and wounds). Be in sustained doctrine and they pop off for about 9-12 dev wounds. Their pistols also have dev so when in combat they can still pop
Running Champions of Russ and starting the game with the 6+ feel no pain sounds like a fun way to make 10 intercessors way more tanky than they have any right to be
Love these videos, recon you could do one on the iconic terminators? How best to use them in 10th, 5 man squads vs 10 man etc expensive but always want to field them because… well, it’s terminators. Keep up the good work. Listening from London ✌🏻
Blasphemy, a Librarian needs to lead a squad of Sterns, with their massive range deeeps(boltrifles in my case). Hell blasters need a lieutenant and maybe an apoth if you have points spare, so they can fallback and shoot, for another round of pew pew, when they finally meet up with the enemy.
While not overtly strong I think y’all hit the nail on the head with his primarily use being giving a unit the defensive capabilities needed to stand on an open objective cheaply. Personally, while lower OC, I think a max unit of Infernus to threaten overwatch on melee is the way to go to hedge your bets on their safety. He’s also just a nice cheap option to have in a meta with a decent amount of psychic armies, where you could have a unit you normally wouldn’t have him lead but when you see the match up can decide to switch out the captain for example with him so you can get that FNP (similar to sideboarding in card games). I do it with my commanders in Tau where I have 3-4 and would attach Farsight to the crisis team he would benefit the most
This is another example of a situation where players may need to be mindful of some of the less used stratagems. I like a lot of your comments about how this librarian could combo with certain units to make a surprisingly effective option - like the tactical marines, for instance. But one way to deal with something like this is to remove the librarian himself from the squad. This is where the Epic Challenge stratagem would be a good play from someone faced with this kind of character/unit combo. Yes, it means having a character that can kill the librarian get into combat with the librarian/unit, but will make getting through the squad infinitely easier once the librarian is gone.
I am running the DA combo right now in some test games! I love it! Also... our bad with the enhancement mess up, we didn't have it in front of us during filming and we were just chatting 40k, should have checked, sorry!!
I like the idea of hellblasters with fire discipline, makes them very hardy. Also like the idea of assault intercessors being super hard to remove from a point they can fight over
You overlooked Deathwatch like GW always does, You can Do DW Veterans with 4 DW thunderhammers, and 4 Fragcannons/infernus, Sargeant with Xenos phase blade and long vigil ranged weapon, and another vet with bolter and long vigil melee, or go full melee replacing the 4 heavy weapons with long vigil melee weapons and bolters if you want to make an anti infantry blender with hellfire rounds before charging with long vigil melee weapons OR giving Proteus kill team 4+ invulnerable on the non terminators and then the psychic FNP on everything including the 4 terminators i have 3 librarians and plan to use them frequently in different lists
Ian, I totally agree with you about taking a Librarian with Infernus Marines….the problem is the Drop Pod transport capacity…why it’s not limited to 1 unit or 11 Tacticus models is beyond me…
Awesome video! Took me way too long to get to it with my schedule change messing things up, but I made it. As I said, great video as usual! Nice to see the banter. Fun video and goes right along with what I said previously about off meta picks or unused picks, and this is a great example. Low points, pretty high versatility, could totally make some big moves against certain armies, and Pariah seems like the time to include one or two for sure if someone hasn’t before. I typically have run one with my Sternguard and that invul has really helped across the board!
Once again, great video! You guys continue to inspire me to go shopping for new models! My bank account disagrees haha! I will add the primaris librarian to the list of future purchases. Maybe I will come up with a cool kitbash or proxy instead!
If you have an old Librarian, just put him on a 40mm base. That's what I do! Old models are still great and the new datasheet just says "librarian", nobody says it needs to be the primaris version.
Exactly the kind of unit I love hearing from you about! It's not going to set a super major on fire but could definitely catch people out at a smaller tournament! I've been on the wrong end of a librarian and 10 intercessors. Just super annoying to remove without overcommitting.
Building my first list 1000 points looking to run a captain with assault intercessors in an impulsor and had been searching for an alternative fire discipline combo than the biologis thank you so much guys! Gun boat with libby here I come
A great unit I’ve found to join him to are space wolves blood claws you can have up to 15 models in the squad so thats 30 wounds with a 4+ invuln, in addition if your playing champions of Russ you can start the game with a 6+ FnP and that is a durable unit you can take 3 of!!!
Unforgiven with Azy + 10 Assualt int & Librarian + 10 tac marines, you spend 500 points to have 2 really tough bricks that can squat on objectives and force your opponent into dealing with that
Totally awesome. And if the rest of the list is a nightmare to deal with then, chances are they will leave those units alone till late game, and then they become unkillable because the recourses are not there.
@@hyperspacehobbies yea planning on running a 10 man DW termi brick with a captain (with weapons of the first) and a ancient termi (with a 6+++ for the unit), the Lion, a Redemptor, 6 aggressors with a bilogis, and then some infiltrators to squat home, and some jump pack boys to do actions and be annoying
""Ian lowers the gun he has been point at you from across the room, 'yes thanks for the sub"" ""Ian tries to holster the gun, accidentally lets a round off"" "Hey i just shot myself in the foot, please, call for help, please, please"
Look who showed up for work. Ian the slacker. I felt so sorry for SMS in the last video. Like Atlas holding up the world SMS held this program together. 😊😊😊 Good show
Ian IS a slacker like WTF, SMS is just so used to carrying the show, on his back singlehandedly. It just comes naturally at this point. Also Ian smells bad.
I understand why it got changed, but I sure was looking forward to infiltrating a Black Templar Crusader Squad with a Celestial Lions Librarian. Alas some dreams are just dreams.
Very glad I came across this channel. I had enjoyed watching the games Steve takes part in on PlayOn and it was his salamanders v night lords game that really cemented me wanting to go all in on the hobby and start with a salamanders army! It's great to find a channel discussing space marines and this one has given me a lot to think about with adjusting my list for pariah nexus. Playing into a lot of chaos armies who can field rhino's, I hadn't really considered the counter being tactical marines to do the same thing. I will probably be taking a librarian with my infernus Squad to give them the 4+invuln as they really struggle with surviviing more than a couple of turns.
Since he can join Stern guard, he can join wolfguard and space wolves no so everybody 's hitting on twos. Both melee and shooting. I do it all the time. People hate it
You know in Champions of Russ this guy can be pretty good. Pick the 6+ FNP at the beginning of the battle, and then its just like you were talking about for the Anvil Siege Force enhancement. So you could take the Librarian in Champions of Russ hellblasters and have effectively the same hellblaster unit with a 4++ and a 6+FNP. Maybe better is you could throw him in a squad of assault intercessors and now the assault intercessors are 4++, 6+ FNP. If you get into combat you play Go for the Throat and all your chainsword attacks are -2 ap rerolling 1s to wound (or full rerolls to wound on objectives) and the librarian himself is now -2 AP as well with those same rerolls. Bonus points if you're up against those hated Thousand Sons.
@@hyperspacehobbies Oh, it still was with 9 Hellblasters! Sustained on 5+, rerolling all hits and wounds usually meant more save rolls than what I originally had attacks😀
Not sure if you guys mentioned it, but don’t forget about the recent buff! The Libby can now use his FNP against psychic damage from a failed hazardous check on Smite. So you could still do the Hellblaster trick, but there’s a nice little buffer if you don’t run them also. I really like the DA setups due it being a nice way to capture that old Deathwing Invul spam. The occasional Smithing on 2+ from ICC and DW terms is nice as well.
Ive Edited that part out, should take a few hours to fully reach youtube. I appreciate you catching this thanks! sometimes we get to excited and skip the important stuff.
Hellblasters + Librarian with Fire Discipline enhancement is extremely powerful. Sure the Lt maybe a better option (because then you get Sustains & lethals), but give me strength. Because as a Thousand Sons player, the way I deal with Hellblasters is Double Doombolt (which for all rule purposes IS a Psychic Attack).
Death watch Spectrus kill team and phobos libby. This gives a deepstrike redeploy unit stealth... stay out of 12" and it's not targetable. great support unit.
Marines are missing some interactions that I wish they could get at some point. Double leaders with librarians would be great. Attaching apothecaries to more units too, especially the company heroes!
This video is awesome. You will have me spend money to buy and try one with assault intercessor now. This is definitely a morning cuz boy you get the energy. I was worry you were mad at eachother because Steve made a video alone and you had really spiked his punch LOL. Seriously guy the keep doing the good work can't wait for more already.
the problem with librarian is that all units he can join are just bad, trash or just not worth. however... "THERE IS ANOTHER" (cit.) Enter the humble inquisitor with 5+ fnp vs mortal wounds.. attached to any battleline such as a T6, 3+ save, OC 2, permanent armour of contempt vs dmg 1 heavy intercessors. That's something I can see me playing.
I think assault intercessors is where I'd be most likely to use them, you really need that extra toughness to get them about. I do like to play aggressively.
As a Tsons player who has to drop an extra 35 points to get that same benefit of a 4++ on my Rubrics, I’m astounded at how few Space Marine lists are seizing on that kind of power honestly
@@hyperspacehobbies Yeah I got in late 9th, have played probably around twenty games, so truly not THAT many, but I've never played Tsons, Grey Knights, Demons... Most of what I've played against are "generic" CSM, Knights, Tyranids, Tau, Necrons, Guard
@@Oncomancer Not a lot of Psykic heavy armies. But still the 4++Invun save might help with some Necron destoyer/ doomsday ark/ Tau Railgun or plasma, and Knights close combat and shooting too.
*you wake up in the middle of the night, something in the room but its to dark to see, something pinged your keen senses* from the shadows in the corner you hear very quietly in a familiar voice "Hey why don't you think Ian's Better huh...HUH?" *you stay still in fear, but the fear fades and you wake up in the morning wondering if its a dream* Until you realize after your morning coffee that all the Toilet Paper in the house has been stolen, and someone drew mustaches on all your family photos, even the dogs...
YES SPEAK THE TRUTH IAN! 😂, Edit: all jokes aside, great vid as always I thought you guys were gonna go through all the libs but you didn’t so that would be cool vid to rank all the libbies including maybe the best one Tigurius 👀😏
My local meta is absurdly competitive with multiple GT and Majors winners. Against some of these players, sometimes the answer is spending those 65pts on more scouts to hide. However if I were to run a libby I can see them do well in Sons of Sanguinous Assault Intercessors (they give wound rerolls and pushes the libby to str 8) or potentially in 10man sternguard with fire discipline standing out in the open to get into rapid fire range popping storm of fire to get sustained 5s I don't think the Libby is bad, possibly just overshadowed by other options like some good named characters, Lt, Judiciar, or even a captain. You all make a great point though that the missions in Pariah Nexus might push libby stocks up just by wanting at least 1 battleline unit to be in no mans land to deny a secret mission
@@hyperspacehobbies entirely agreed. SM have so many options that we get to choose from meh vs good vs great and everything in between. Sometimes in a game of efficiency and trading, 65pts to keep a unit alive is better than just more bodies
I didnt even realize tactical squads still existed in 40k, would love to know what weapon loadouts would be best for a 10man tactical squad, also if its easy enough to just slap tac squad bits onto intercessor marines
I’ve really been struggling with terminator librarian vs terminator chaplain for my original flavor terminators with cyclone mission launcher. The librarian sustained hits is INSANE but the chaplain’s +1 to wound is also bonkers. Plus the terminator librarian was one of my first models and it hurts to cut him from the rotation
I understand your loyalty to the Terminator Libby. The sustained hits in the combat phase is pretty nasty. especially against the oath target and fishing for 6's while hitting on 2's I wonder how it compares with the terminator chaplain vs most targets, that's some math-hammer I'm not good at.
@@hyperspacehobbies trying to do mental math hammer keeps me busy on my commute. I THINK it’s actually about an overall wash. Librarian slightly better against low toughness targets, chaplain slightly better against high toughness targets. I think my final call is the chaplain, just because the 4+ FNP for mortal wounds feels extra good in a world where devastating wounds are also mortal wounds (and five storm bolters + a missile launcher is probably just enough in any case to wipe or almost wipe most squads of low toughness units)
Yes, it is! I actually JUST tried this. The Judiciar feels like the right choice, but without an invul save they just don't have the longevity. -1 to hit is great, but -1 to hit plus an invul means a lot. The judiciar is awesome and fights first is a big deal... but really, to avoid that defense, your opponent just needs to shoot them, and the invul will help that immensely
@@spacemarinesteve6057 I had been considering which to go for but have not had a chance to play with either yet... Glad to know what your experience has been and appreciate the reply 🤘
I'm curious to run one with a 10 man assault intercessor squad, the extra durability with OC2 bodies sounds pretty annoying to try and shift off an objective in the combat phase.
@@hyperspacehobbies exactly, and as you mentioned in the video, with the prevalence of AP 2 melee weapons that they are likely to be up against, it allows you to save Armor of contempt to use on another unit that may need it in that phase.
The thing I don’t like about him is it has to be AP -3 to matter basically. You pretty much always have cover so ap -2 would put you on a 4+ anyway. And then the times it does matter and you get hit with ap -3 you can just armour of contempt and still be on a 4+. Also if you compare to Tigurius you get wayy better value out of him for just 15 more points. Although he doesn’t go with hellblasters which is a shame.
I am going to respectfully disagree. While your insight here does have some really good points: cover can sometimes be plentiful, and Armor of Contempt is a legitimate answer to higher AP weapons... My counterpoint would be: 1) with the change to the captain's Rites of Battle ability, you only get one, very crucial AoC per phase, and using it on a unit of more basic units might not be the right choice. 2) The Pariah Nexus has presented multiple missions that require longevity in actions and missions where central objectives are actually really open, getting cover all the time I have found actually more difficult. 3) cover can't help us against a brutal close combat phase. While your points are very valid and I don't think you're wrong in how to use the units and strategy you referenced there, I still see a lot of value in what we put forward here :) Thanks for the comment and your ideas! Cheers!
You are not too negative, at all! @Youschnoob649 It's okay that we disagree! The game is so layered, and what you see and you like are going to be different than what I see and like, all that is okay. I just wanted to talk with you a little and bounce off of you how I see it! Your comment made me think and really out my thoughts in to words! Cheers!
I dont know if i agree that Marine battleline is cheap. 200 pts for that unit is just a lot! I think SM battleline is in a weird spot, theyre arent tough enough to survive but then they arent cheap so you can bring a bunch. I think the best way to run a librarian would be with hellblasters in the anvil siege probably, with the fnp enhancement.
@chrisprime7767 Well, with a few of the Pariah Nexus missions, it mentions battleline units getting additional points for doing actions. So I find myself playing a few of them. In this instance, it's just a weird way to play the libby with a cheap unit like assault intercessors or Tactical marines. We still need a few more playtests to be sure.
I think going for that 4+ invuln on chaff for annoying OC units it’s solid enough for u to win games through running the clock out. With that being said if that’s what we really wanna do with the marines then going for that 6+ FNP enhancement seems like the logical route to take. Just lean in even more to the survivability u know what I mean?
@@hyperspacehobbies at their very worst they r absurdly tough models that will take bare minimum 2 turns of focusing. All that just for chaff. At their very best they r guaranteeing objs and the lascannon u take with em is always a scary profile. Pretty solid strategy u guys found and I’d love to see Steve take this to playon.
These are exactly the kinds of ideas that come from drinking from mason jar goblets.
Last weekend I took a Librarin + 6x Inner Circle Companions. That Librarian kept them alive till the end and they spanked.
I am running this exact same set up and I love it!
I run a lib with them as well they are really durable
Yah I need to build my Inner Circle dudes haha... really nice choice instead of using Azrael
@@TheCoremeltdown no doubt. If I didnt have the Lib I would have lost em all turn 3. I had 4 Aeldari units pinned in melee and the Librarian saved em all.
I have a list that has a Libby and 6 x ICC and the math checks out
What we need is a Gravis librarian.
What Psychic power would he get, do you think!?
It could be a defensive or offensive ability... and I a little bit hope it's a offensive one. I would love him to have a Smite ability and then a mortal wound dealing power, perhaps.
I think something defensive would be amazing. The apothecary already buffs the offense, so maybe a fnp? Or a 5+ invuln and a nasty smite?
They could give a -1 damage but cannot be pair with whatever other character, it would stop the biologus/captain combo. If you wanna have the 5+ FNP GW would need to change the Iron Father and give them -1 damage, it would give him more screen times.
On that note, GW are cowards for making the Biologis the unofficial Lieutenant in Gravis armor with none of the weapons and is unlikely to proc his own ability.
Giving gravis a 4++ invuln would be pretty strong. Attach to a unit of heavy intercessors and they will be super hard to shift.
I really hope that when the Dark Angels Ravenwing gets “refreshed” that we get a Librarian on Bike model again.
Awe... YEAH!!!! I would be real happy with that!
Sternguard for durability, Assaults for surprise punch and durability, and Hellblasters while using them a bit more aggressively.
Would love to see a terminator video on how to make them work. Big squads. Leaders and strats. They always get the short straw but are so epic in lore. I will make them work if it kills me lol
We can totally do this!
10 man assault terminator squad with terminator chaplain running the BT Righteous Crusaders detachment are 45 wounds of 2+, 4++, 5+++, +1 to wound in melee, 4+++ against mortals (now dev wounds)
brother, 10 man squad with capt and ANCIENT. everyone sleeps on the ancient but as soon as 1 termie is dead the entire squad gets +1 to hit for the rest of the game, and when they're below half strength (3 boys left with captain and ancient) they get +1 to wound as a lil bonus (not to be relied upon) if theyre in cover with armour of contempt they are truly the most sturdy marine unit, captains free strat is well spent here. A 12 man termie squad in rapid fire range with all those storm bolters will shred with weight of fire ideally using the cyclone missile launchers for dat 48" range anti tank or infantry and 12 more power fists coming in to slam. I always walk my termies on the board from turn 1 drawing enemy fire and soaking up most of it with their durability. never go for the 9" deep strike charge i have lost too many termies to this ambitious move, walk and staunch or rapid ingress this THREAT and you will be happy. They are your meat, beat with your meat.
3 squads of Deathwing Knights.. Otherwise you're in the wrong chapter!
As a proud blood raven, I have to gaslight myself to run non librarian characters
Sterngaurd are actually 4 attacks each, i was surprised too
Good lord... what!? How did I not know that!?
Wait..what? Awesome!
4 attacks? How long have I been doing that wrong dang. thanks!
Yea, though for maximum slaps, the company heroes have 5 attacks each, real shame they can't attach to a libby
I use one with a 10 man stern guard vet squad with Deathwatch. Use the deep strike enhancement on him. Drop them in on the tome of ectoclades round (reroll all hits and wounds). Be in sustained doctrine and they pop off for about 9-12 dev wounds. Their pistols also have dev so when in combat they can still pop
I quite like my Firetruck in Firestorm; its a librarian and 5 infernus marines driving around inside an Impulsor.
Have you tried 10 Infernus w/Librarian in a Land Raider?
librarians are so good
I play Black Templars: Abhor the witch, Destroy the witch! Great video guys, lots of good uses for a character.
Running Champions of Russ and starting the game with the 6+ feel no pain sounds like a fun way to make 10 intercessors way more tanky than they have any right to be
Love it!
Love these videos, recon you could do one on the iconic terminators? How best to use them in 10th, 5 man squads vs 10 man etc expensive but always want to field them because… well, it’s terminators. Keep up the good work. Listening from London ✌🏻
Second comment for terminators! We can totally do this!
@@spacemarinesteve6057 looking forward to it 👍🏼
Blasphemy, a Librarian needs to lead a squad of Sterns, with their massive range deeeps(boltrifles in my case).
Hell blasters need a lieutenant and maybe an apoth if you have points spare, so they can fallback and shoot, for another round of pew pew, when they finally meet up with the enemy.
Great video as always! As a Dark Angels player, I want to run him with audit of Inner Circle Companions.
Yup! I'm doing this exact same thing right now!! Testing some DA lists
@@spacemarinesteve6057 Please so a video on how it goes 🙏
While not overtly strong I think y’all hit the nail on the head with his primarily use being giving a unit the defensive capabilities needed to stand on an open objective cheaply. Personally, while lower OC, I think a max unit of Infernus to threaten overwatch on melee is the way to go to hedge your bets on their safety. He’s also just a nice cheap option to have in a meta with a decent amount of psychic armies, where you could have a unit you normally wouldn’t have him lead but when you see the match up can decide to switch out the captain for example with him so you can get that FNP (similar to sideboarding in card games). I do it with my commanders in Tau where I have 3-4 and would attach Farsight to the crisis team he would benefit the most
Thank you! It isn't game busting, but not every model needs to be, sometimes, you just need something to serve a more mundane purpose well
Librarian + Infernus Squad + Firestorm Detachment + Drop Pod = very solid 👍.
This is another example of a situation where players may need to be mindful of some of the less used stratagems.
I like a lot of your comments about how this librarian could combo with certain units to make a surprisingly effective option - like the tactical marines, for instance.
But one way to deal with something like this is to remove the librarian himself from the squad. This is where the Epic Challenge stratagem would be a good play from someone faced with this kind of character/unit combo.
Yes, it means having a character that can kill the librarian get into combat with the librarian/unit, but will make getting through the squad infinitely easier once the librarian is gone.
Great insight!!! We will definitely get to it!
I agree with it, but a CP there is worth 65 points to chew through some whatever unit you have.
True and he might just spike his 4++ and then you've really burnt your opponent.
You are blowing up my spot! My themed soul drinkers army always sneaks up on people with two librarians split into my infernus or stenguards.
YES! I bet any psyker heavy army army just hates going against the Soul drinkers! nerfing damage so hard.
@@hyperspacehobbies I just need GW to make a gravis librarian. If they do I’ll build a list around having one of each and see what happens.
Hunters Instincts is mounted only...
In DAs you can take him with Inner Circle Companions to give them the needed 4++
I am running the DA combo right now in some test games! I love it!
Also... our bad with the enhancement mess up, we didn't have it in front of us during filming and we were just chatting 40k, should have checked, sorry!!
Ya we caught that this AM, Edited it out of the video. Thanks for the catch!
Welcome back Ian. Comment before I watch, I rewatched the Bebop v Sanguinor game last night. Such a great battle.
Link to that one?
@@illiteratebrian1707 czcams.com/video/v2cnEBW9oFI/video.htmlsi=bmkLMeToEkHtFvsw
@@illiteratebrian1707 czcams.com/video/v2cnEBW9oFI/video.htmlsi=1qPnnpIDI8n_Tw-Y
@@illiteratebrian1707 czcams.com/video/v2cnEBW9oFI/video.htmlsi=Wu0DqBtH8DI8hVLv
I like the idea of hellblasters with fire discipline, makes them very hardy. Also like the idea of assault intercessors being super hard to remove from a point they can fight over
totally and a Repulsor to deliver them is fairly cheap and durable too.
You overlooked Deathwatch like GW always does, You can Do DW Veterans with 4 DW thunderhammers, and 4 Fragcannons/infernus, Sargeant with Xenos phase blade and long vigil ranged weapon, and another vet with bolter and long vigil melee, or go full melee replacing the 4 heavy weapons with long vigil melee weapons and bolters if you want to make an anti infantry blender with hellfire rounds before charging with long vigil melee weapons
OR giving Proteus kill team 4+ invulnerable on the non terminators and then the psychic FNP on everything including the 4 terminators
i have 3 librarians and plan to use them frequently in different lists
Ian, I totally agree with you about taking a Librarian with Infernus Marines….the problem is the Drop Pod transport capacity…why it’s not limited to 1 unit or 11 Tacticus models is beyond me…
I am right there in the picket line with you 11 models could possibly bring back the drop pod into main play.
Awesome video! Took me way too long to get to it with my schedule change messing things up, but I made it.
As I said, great video as usual! Nice to see the banter. Fun video and goes right along with what I said previously about off meta picks or unused picks, and this is a great example. Low points, pretty high versatility, could totally make some big moves against certain armies, and Pariah seems like the time to include one or two for sure if someone hasn’t before.
I typically have run one with my Sternguard and that invul has really helped across the board!
Sternguard seem to be the go to for a lot of people. and they are fairly cheap for there damage output as well.
I just want to give props for actually editing in the psyker abilities in post. Almost no one follows through on that stuff.
Yes! I've been borrowing power from the warp and honing my editing skills, I'm sure nothing negative will come from it. Thanks!
Once again, great video! You guys continue to inspire me to go shopping for new models! My bank account disagrees haha! I will add the primaris librarian to the list of future purchases. Maybe I will come up with a cool kitbash or proxy instead!
If you have an old Librarian, just put him on a 40mm base. That's what I do! Old models are still great and the new datasheet just says "librarian", nobody says it needs to be the primaris version.
Exactly the kind of unit I love hearing from you about! It's not going to set a super major on fire but could definitely catch people out at a smaller tournament! I've been on the wrong end of a librarian and 10 intercessors. Just super annoying to remove without overcommitting.
Totally, and the over commitment can cost them in the long game.
Building my first list 1000 points looking to run a captain with assault intercessors in an impulsor and had been searching for an alternative fire discipline combo than the biologis thank you so much guys! Gun boat with libby here I come
I actually run it with my sternguard vets and it really keeps them alive to hold obj
I run a librarian all the time, it feels like all the stuff thats only now coming out ive been doing already. 😂
A great unit I’ve found to join him to are space wolves blood claws you can have up to 15 models in the squad so thats 30 wounds with a 4+ invuln, in addition if your playing champions of Russ you can start the game with a 6+ FnP and that is a durable unit you can take 3 of!!!
haha taking 3 of them would be hilarious!
Unforgiven with Azy + 10 Assualt int & Librarian + 10 tac marines, you spend 500 points to have 2 really tough bricks that can squat on objectives and force your opponent into dealing with that
Totally awesome. And if the rest of the list is a nightmare to deal with then, chances are they will leave those units alone till late game, and then they become unkillable because the recourses are not there.
@@hyperspacehobbies yea planning on running a 10 man DW termi brick with a captain (with weapons of the first) and a ancient termi (with a 6+++ for the unit), the Lion, a Redemptor, 6 aggressors with a bilogis, and then some infiltrators to squat home, and some jump pack boys to do actions and be annoying
Actually forgot to sub, thx for reminding
Thanks for the sub!
""Ian lowers the gun he has been point at you from across the room, 'yes thanks for the sub""
""Ian tries to holster the gun, accidentally lets a round off""
"Hey i just shot myself in the foot, please, call for help, please, please"
Look who showed up for work. Ian the slacker. I felt so sorry for SMS in the last video. Like Atlas holding up the world SMS held this program together. 😊😊😊 Good show
Ha!
Ian IS a slacker like WTF, SMS is just so used to carrying the show, on his back singlehandedly. It just comes naturally at this point. Also Ian smells bad.
I understand why it got changed, but I sure was looking forward to infiltrating a Black Templar Crusader Squad with a Celestial Lions Librarian. Alas some dreams are just dreams.
Very glad I came across this channel. I had enjoyed watching the games Steve takes part in on PlayOn and it was his salamanders v night lords game that really cemented me wanting to go all in on the hobby and start with a salamanders army! It's great to find a channel discussing space marines and this one has given me a lot to think about with adjusting my list for pariah nexus. Playing into a lot of chaos armies who can field rhino's, I hadn't really considered the counter being tactical marines to do the same thing. I will probably be taking a librarian with my infernus Squad to give them the 4+invuln as they really struggle with surviviing more than a couple of turns.
Since he can join Stern guard, he can join wolfguard and space wolves no so everybody 's hitting on twos. Both melee and shooting. I do it all the time. People hate it
Oh dang!
@@hyperspacehobbies yeah an they can go in a rino
Clearly, we need an episode of Ian without Steve to even the score.
YA! Why does he get to have all the fun!
You know in Champions of Russ this guy can be pretty good. Pick the 6+ FNP at the beginning of the battle, and then its just like you were talking about for the Anvil Siege Force enhancement. So you could take the Librarian in Champions of Russ hellblasters and have effectively the same hellblaster unit with a 4++ and a 6+FNP.
Maybe better is you could throw him in a squad of assault intercessors and now the assault intercessors are 4++, 6+ FNP. If you get into combat you play Go for the Throat and all your chainsword attacks are -2 ap rerolling 1s to wound (or full rerolls to wound on objectives) and the librarian himself is now -2 AP as well with those same rerolls. Bonus points if you're up against those hated Thousand Sons.
Just crazy strong, that added little 6+FNP makes them an even less appealing choice for opponents.
Librarian with Fire Discipline leading 9 Hellblasters coming down in a Drop Pod used to be my go-to method before Oaths got nerfed
haha oh ya! feels bad that drop pods cant take 11 models. That would have been a true Delete unit.
@@hyperspacehobbies Oh, it still was with 9 Hellblasters!
Sustained on 5+, rerolling all hits and wounds usually meant more save rolls than what I originally had attacks😀
Blood claws can come in 15 man units
Plus a wolf guard.
17 man unit with 4++
Ok GW and the police want to talk to you about how your abusing the rules.
OMG wait then you can choose the Saga to give them a 6 FNP WHAT!
Can yall please drink more during videos? It definitely added to the experience
Do you like our Mason Jar Wine Glasses??? Lol
Really classes the experience up
Awesome discussion, thanks!
I have no idea why, but I have never considered him on any squads. Making a baby BGV unit with assault inters seems very tasty for Sons of Sanguinius.
Ya, that would start some Red Rage for sure, probably in your opponents Psykic heavy army haha.
This is a fun discussion!
Not sure if you guys mentioned it, but don’t forget about the recent buff! The Libby can now use his FNP against psychic damage from a failed hazardous check on Smite. So you could still do the Hellblaster trick, but there’s a nice little buffer if you don’t run them also.
I really like the DA setups due it being a nice way to capture that old Deathwing Invul spam. The occasional Smithing on 2+ from ICC and DW terms is nice as well.
love my librarian with a squad of 10 man sternguard
Hunter's Instincts is Mounted Model only sadly =(
Yea, that's our bad
Ive Edited that part out, should take a few hours to fully reach youtube. I appreciate you catching this thanks! sometimes we get to excited and skip the important stuff.
Hellblasters + Librarian with Fire Discipline enhancement is extremely powerful. Sure the Lt maybe a better option (because then you get Sustains & lethals), but give me strength. Because as a Thousand Sons player, the way I deal with Hellblasters is Double Doombolt (which for all rule purposes IS a Psychic Attack).
Death watch Spectrus kill team and phobos libby. This gives a deepstrike redeploy unit stealth... stay out of 12" and it's not targetable. great support unit.
OH ya that pretty difficult to shift.
Love my Firestorm Primaris Librarian and 10 Sternguard Veteran combo ❤❤
Marines are missing some interactions that I wish they could get at some point. Double leaders with librarians would be great. Attaching apothecaries to more units too, especially the company heroes!
Ya company heros for sure should be able to take... more heros?
Phobos Librarian with Incursors would be a great combo. Adding one to the hit role would be beneficial to the army.
This video is awesome. You will have me spend money to buy and try one with assault intercessor now. This is definitely a morning cuz boy you get the energy. I was worry you were mad at eachother because Steve made a video alone and you had really spiked his punch LOL. Seriously guy the keep doing the good work can't wait for more already.
Thanks so much! we try and have fun, But that's easy when talking 40k with your bros.
the problem with librarian is that all units he can join are just bad, trash or just not worth. however... "THERE IS ANOTHER" (cit.)
Enter the humble inquisitor with 5+ fnp vs mortal wounds.. attached to any battleline such as a T6, 3+ save, OC 2, permanent armour of contempt vs dmg 1 heavy intercessors. That's something I can see me playing.
Librarians in 10man stern . Great unit
I think assault intercessors is where I'd be most likely to use them, you really need that extra toughness to get them about. I do like to play aggressively.
Its a great way to make an aggressive unit stay on the tabletop for a little bit longer, they way they can really chop things up!
I think they work really well with Grey Hunters.
As a Tsons player who has to drop an extra 35 points to get that same benefit of a 4++ on my Rubrics, I’m astounded at how few Space Marine lists are seizing on that kind of power honestly
The most psychic I've ever faced in all my time playing is like one tyranids unit
REALLY? Thats interesting, there are plenty of armies with Psykic offensive units. You should play Ians DAEMONS! lots of warp flame blasting!
@@hyperspacehobbies Yeah I got in late 9th, have played probably around twenty games, so truly not THAT many, but I've never played Tsons, Grey Knights, Demons... Most of what I've played against are "generic" CSM, Knights, Tyranids, Tau, Necrons, Guard
@@Oncomancer Not a lot of Psykic heavy armies. But still the 4++Invun save might help with some Necron destoyer/ doomsday ark/ Tau Railgun or plasma, and Knights close combat and shooting too.
@@hyperspacehobbies So true! 4++ is nothing to sneeze at
Steve best commentarist
Well, thank you!
*you wake up in the middle of the night, something in the room but its to dark to see, something pinged your keen senses* from the shadows in the corner you hear very quietly in a familiar voice "Hey why don't you think Ian's Better huh...HUH?" *you stay still in fear, but the fear fades and you wake up in the morning wondering if its a dream* Until you realize after your morning coffee that all the Toilet Paper in the house has been stolen, and someone drew mustaches on all your family photos, even the dogs...
I added a Librarian/ Rune Priest to a Pack of 10 Blood Claws. Works like a charm 😁😁 Even playing the Champions of Russ is now actually kinda fun.
YES SPEAK THE TRUTH IAN! 😂,
Edit: all jokes aside, great vid as always I thought you guys were gonna go through all the libs but you didn’t so that would be cool vid to rank all the libbies including maybe the best one Tigurius 👀😏
Oh Tiggy is #1 without a doubt. thats a good Video Idea, like a tier list thing.
My local meta is absurdly competitive with multiple GT and Majors winners. Against some of these players, sometimes the answer is spending those 65pts on more scouts to hide. However if I were to run a libby I can see them do well in Sons of Sanguinous Assault Intercessors (they give wound rerolls and pushes the libby to str 8) or potentially in 10man sternguard with fire discipline standing out in the open to get into rapid fire range popping storm of fire to get sustained 5s
I don't think the Libby is bad, possibly just overshadowed by other options like some good named characters, Lt, Judiciar, or even a captain.
You all make a great point though that the missions in Pariah Nexus might push libby stocks up just by wanting at least 1 battleline unit to be in no mans land to deny a secret mission
Overshadowed for sure. But they can be pretty solid.
@@hyperspacehobbies entirely agreed. SM have so many options that we get to choose from meh vs good vs great and everything in between. Sometimes in a game of efficiency and trading, 65pts to keep a unit alive is better than just more bodies
I run Sternguard with Tigurius
Tiggy Is Insane! he is such a powerful unit!
Same. One man Hellblaster squad and thats only the beginning….
Sternguard have melee of 4, intercessors have 3
I didnt even realize tactical squads still existed in 40k, would love to know what weapon loadouts would be best for a 10man tactical squad, also if its easy enough to just slap tac squad bits onto intercessor marines
I'm so surprised people don't run a librarian. I put mine with assault intercessors
I’ve really been struggling with terminator librarian vs terminator chaplain for my original flavor terminators with cyclone mission launcher. The librarian sustained hits is INSANE but the chaplain’s +1 to wound is also bonkers.
Plus the terminator librarian was one of my first models and it hurts to cut him from the rotation
I understand your loyalty to the Terminator Libby. The sustained hits in the combat phase is pretty nasty. especially against the oath target and fishing for 6's while hitting on 2's
I wonder how it compares with the terminator chaplain vs most targets, that's some math-hammer I'm not good at.
@@hyperspacehobbies trying to do mental math hammer keeps me busy on my commute. I THINK it’s actually about an overall wash. Librarian slightly better against low toughness targets, chaplain slightly better against high toughness targets. I think my final call is the chaplain, just because the 4+ FNP for mortal wounds feels extra good in a world where devastating wounds are also mortal wounds (and five storm bolters + a missile launcher is probably just enough in any case to wipe or almost wipe most squads of low toughness units)
I miss psychic phase
I agree, I liked that it made psychic units feel more special, instead of just shooting with the units ect.
I have always used a librarian with DA. Just because I have one and not much else to choose from.
Inner circle companions with a librarian is great but is it better than a Judiciar?
Yes, it is! I actually JUST tried this. The Judiciar feels like the right choice, but without an invul save they just don't have the longevity. -1 to hit is great, but -1 to hit plus an invul means a lot.
The judiciar is awesome and fights first is a big deal... but really, to avoid that defense, your opponent just needs to shoot them, and the invul will help that immensely
@@spacemarinesteve6057 I had been considering which to go for but have not had a chance to play with either yet... Glad to know what your experience has been and appreciate the reply 🤘
Ya that's a hard one to argue, the abilities and buffs they provide are so different, I say it depends on your playstyle at that point.
I put him in my Inner Circle Companions as well. Haven't got it to work quite yet, but still trying.
One of my friends ran companions with Asmodai, that squad was pretty nasty put of a transport. Might be worth a try
Inner Circle + LIBBY is nuts, like Bladeguard, but much much better.
I'm curious to run one with a 10 man assault intercessor squad, the extra durability with OC2 bodies sounds pretty annoying to try and shift off an objective in the combat phase.
For sure, It allows that unit to soak up just a little more damage than usual.
@@hyperspacehobbies exactly, and as you mentioned in the video, with the prevalence of AP 2 melee weapons that they are likely to be up against, it allows you to save Armor of contempt to use on another unit that may need it in that phase.
The thing I don’t like about him is it has to be AP -3 to matter basically.
You pretty much always have cover so ap -2 would put you on a 4+ anyway. And then the times it does matter and you get hit with ap -3 you can just armour of contempt and still be on a 4+.
Also if you compare to Tigurius you get wayy better value out of him for just 15 more points. Although he doesn’t go with hellblasters which is a shame.
I am going to respectfully disagree. While your insight here does have some really good points: cover can sometimes be plentiful, and Armor of Contempt is a legitimate answer to higher AP weapons...
My counterpoint would be: 1) with the change to the captain's Rites of Battle ability, you only get one, very crucial AoC per phase, and using it on a unit of more basic units might not be the right choice.
2) The Pariah Nexus has presented multiple missions that require longevity in actions and missions where central objectives are actually really open, getting cover all the time I have found actually more difficult.
3) cover can't help us against a brutal close combat phase.
While your points are very valid and I don't think you're wrong in how to use the units and strategy you referenced there, I still see a lot of value in what we put forward here :)
Thanks for the comment and your ideas! Cheers!
@@spacemarinesteve6057well said. In combat it is a nice boost for sure.
Sorry if I was too negative I like this form of video !
You are not too negative, at all! @Youschnoob649
It's okay that we disagree! The game is so layered, and what you see and you like are going to be different than what I see and like, all that is okay. I just wanted to talk with you a little and bounce off of you how I see it!
Your comment made me think and really out my thoughts in to words!
Cheers!
I dont know if i agree that Marine battleline is cheap. 200 pts for that unit is just a lot!
I think SM battleline is in a weird spot, theyre arent tough enough to survive but then they arent cheap so you can bring a bunch.
I think the best way to run a librarian would be with hellblasters in the anvil siege probably, with the fnp enhancement.
Fair point.
Might just be my experience with them. Do you guys run a lot of marine battleline?
I never run any battleline with my SMs
@chrisprime7767 Well, with a few of the Pariah Nexus missions, it mentions battleline units getting additional points for doing actions. So I find myself playing a few of them. In this instance, it's just a weird way to play the libby with a cheap unit like assault intercessors or Tactical marines. We still need a few more playtests to be sure.
So how does a librarian fit into a firestorm assault force list?
What does the wise masters think about the fleet commander enchantment? (Anvil)
I've run the Librarian in terminator armor, meh. What are your thoughts on Ancients in the Marine army.
First!
Congrats!!!
Librarian, ancient, sternguard x10, stormraven for mid-table drop turn 2
I think going for that 4+ invuln on chaff for annoying OC units it’s solid enough for u to win games through running the clock out. With that being said if that’s what we really wanna do with the marines then going for that 6+ FNP enhancement seems like the logical route to take. Just lean in even more to the survivability u know what I mean?
Totally, even though it seems like a small defensive buff the 6+FNP can change how your opponent targets, and uses Damage 2 guns.
@@hyperspacehobbies at their very worst they r absurdly tough models that will take bare minimum 2 turns of focusing. All that just for chaff. At their very best they r guaranteeing objs and the lascannon u take with em is always a scary profile. Pretty solid strategy u guys found and I’d love to see Steve take this to playon.