Infrared Heating - Proper Cheap Heat
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- čas přidán 9. 12. 2022
- Hi folks. Here's a video documenting our new infrared heating panel. Price to buy, installation parts and critically, if it's worth it or not.
The panel can be found here;
www.amazon.co....
The fittings can be found here;
www.amazon.co....
www.amazon.co....
Electrical connection, not used;
www.amazon.co....
We hope you enjoy the video. - Krátké a kreslené filmy
I’ve got 4 Herschel panels in my bungalow with no wet system, all electric apart from stove in living room. I also have 4 WiFi thermostats. They are good, getting the apps to work reliably on an iPhone isn’t great though. I aim to get them all on my Home Assistant controller soon though.
Electrics wise, not great to suggest wiring these into a lighting circuit, some might watch this and think to have one in every room, wired in similar fashion. The possibility of overloading is high and if the circuit isn’t properly protected (light switch??) you could end up with a cable fire.
It is interesting that IR heaters, especially in bathroom ceilings, were a very common thing in the 1960s especially in places without central heating. However, they rather died out once CH was common. Glad to see they are making a comeback as I want to use one in our downstairs shower room - the one I'm fitting out for our dotage (while I still can!)
Recommended. I have panels in every room and they are surprisingly cheap to run and very comfortable.
What size and make ,do you have a link? and how much to run approximately?
The principal of IR heating is that it heats up the objects that it irradiate by absorbtion. The air in the room gets only heated up by the contact it has with these objects. Therefore you might not want to turn on it an hour before you using the room. But its your call...😊
Just a pedantic point James from your opening statement, the roof is where your solar panels are, you have installed that on the ceiling. 🙂
Another option for an office in an under-desk IR heater. I have one from Herschel. It is 220w and is floor standing, designed to go under the desk and can be turned on and off with a foot switch. A brilliant bit of kit for an office.
Agreed. We bought one for our home office about 2 months back and it is really good. Discrete too.
Hi,, can you share a link to what you bought?
Hi Barry, you can buy direct from Herschel's website too.
I fitted IR panels to my Victorian terraced house in 1988. They were very good back then. Sadly, I sold the house a year later. I think now is the time for me to rediscover IR heating.
Love this video, after being hit with a ridiculously high heating bill I've been lookin into cheaper and more efficient alternatives to conventional heaters.
Also great to hear the perspective from both of you👏
yeah , not just the air space, but if the ceiling was vaulted and you make it flat when lowering it, less surface area for heat loss. Infra red is usually the way to go for poorly insulated area. However at some point once the insulation or drafts are improved then modern mini splits are unbeatable. Up front cost of infra red is very low though especially if you use heat lamps bulbs... spot heating with motion sensors for where you are, allow the rest of the house to be set at a much lower temperature.
I'm sure you know that most medium size houses have lighting circuits that are 1.5mm2 Vs 2.5mm2 and are on 5amp fuses. They could be exceeded by old 50w halogen but 200v X 5 amps = 1000w so you're really close with 800w on a lighting circuit depending on what else is on it... And if it's only 1.5mm2
Yes, wouldn't want multiple units on the same circuit. Not to mention you're supposed to get an electrician to sign it off. By the time you've done that, is it not just easier to get the guy to do the whole job?
I don't use to the lightning circuit other than for one heater in the bathroom ( it's a mirror).
@@mentality-monster you don't need an electrician to sign it off. you only need an electrician when doing notifiable work such as new installations, rewires, or additional work or modification to circuits in special locations such as bathrooms. Other than that, you can do whatever electrical work in your house that you wish.
that should be 800w/240v =3.3 amps so well withing the 5 amp breaker and cables
Max Amperage concerns aside, who here would also trust Amazon electronics in a permanent installation? Especially an appliance that is designed to get hot.
My kids’ school has been fitting these in classrooms (8-10 of that sort of size), they seem to work well, particularly in the high ceiling rooms where you’d be heating a big volume of air that would just sit above.
6kW a classroom, schools really have money to burn.
@@edc1569 As James says in his video, they're not at full power all the time. Heating 70sqm of high-ceilinged room tends to be quite expensive by any other means too.
@@kiteless1 You're correct about the heater operation. The cubic metres of volume are important, not the square metres of floor area.
That said, the schools must have them wired to higher power ring mains, not the low power lighting circuits.
I'm a DIYer....a very good DIYer. The wiring for a normal run of the mill house where lights are concerned, is a 'looped' system. This means that the 6A (A=amps) breaker (MCB) that you see in your consumer unit that says, 'upstairs lights', is a wiring circuit that serves probably 6 lights. The cable from the consumer unit goes to the first light, then loops out to the next one etc. and so on to all 6 lights. The cable that feeds this is normally 1.5mm twin & earth. This cable is rated above the 6A that the breaker is rated at, with the idea that if the circuit should see more than 6A then the breaker will trip (turn off) and your wiring circuit is thus protected, If it didn't trip, there is a serious risk that the cables would melt and could develop into a fire situation. The total Power (in watts) of a circuit is given by the formula that power = voltage (in V=volts) multiplied by current (in amps =I), often represented as the formula P=V x I. For this circuit we know that the voltage will be around 230 volts, the maximum current before the breaker trips is 6amps, therefore maximum power is 230 x 6 = 1380 watts. In any circuit you never really want to be above 70% of the maximum available for any extended length of time, so in your case, the maximum power of the whole circuit shouldn't really be above say 1380 x 70% = 966watts.... call it 1000w or 1kW. So I hope you can see, running a 800w heater on this circuit is a really bad idea. Even if you had LED lighting in all the other rooms and were only consuming say 10w per room, you would have 850w on this circuit when the heater is on. It wouldn't be a critical situation, but the size of cable for lighting is the smallest that is used in domestic situations and isn't meant for this job.
Just my tuppence worth...
Glad to hear you are pleased with the panel.
I will be buying 5x 750W panels shortly to heat a 8x5 meter apartment room.
Think the idea and theory are making sense, I also like them not having any moving parts that wear out.
The estatic doest really bother me, they look much beter then a TV or radiator imo.
Im not looking up much anyways when indoors.
Thanks for reviewing, cheers!
Thanks for the video. Though I honestly don't get the logic of infrared heating at all, aside from maybe a toilet that you only sit in for a few minutes a day and don't want to sit on in the cold!
If you're going to sit in a room all day, put a mini-split air con unit in (air-to-air heat pump if you like). It'll keep you warm in winter, cool in summer and will get a lot more heat for your money in the long run (it's a heat pump so puts out roughly 3 times as much heat/cold as it uses in lecci depending on outside temp). And it dehumidifies to some degree.
Most come with an app now, meaning you can program it so you never have to think about it, aside from changing the schedule for the seasons.
If you buy one with future upgrades in mind, you can add more rooms as you go by just adding additional wall units in the rooms you want. So you can gradually get yourself off gas to some degree.
We did the same as wfh full time now and heating the whole house was so wasteful especially with the high gas prices. We bought Herschel 220w panel heater and have it sat under the desk. Keeps us lovely and warm throughout the day and heats the whole room to about 22degres for less than £1 a day. Creates avery comfortable atmosphere in our home office now.
Great idea! But isn’t 800w on the lighting circuit a bit too much? 🤔
Agree it's very high for a lighting circuit! Popping a couple of these in, could toast your wiring!
3.4A well within the 6A mcb.1.5mm2 cable will take 11A in free air.
Its not
you're allowed 1,000w on a ceiling circuit
Also hope it has ground wiring with thise kinda Watts
We took this route last year just before Xmas! We are overjoyed with the results and heat our whole home with both ceiling and wall panels! The overall result is brilliant. We purchased our system from Warm4less, a local company in Lincolnshire who actually supply across the UK. The running costs are significantly lower than the state of the art electric system we had previously! They also free up wall space in a small bungalow and are all completely controllable from anywhere in the world!
I discovered that another way of conserving heat is to reduce the height of the ceiling. Less height means less area to heat. Upon restructuring the front part of my house to make a 'Granny flat', I reduced the ceiling height to the size of a Plasterboard (800cms). The dropped ceiling has 100mm insulating panels so it's less volume to heat up, doesn't affect free movement and retains the heat. Less volume to heat means mega savings on your energy bill.
Hope this is helpful.
@r3furbish3dbrain12
I know. Amazing isn't it. Lol
I've just got an hanging far infra red picture heater 430 watts they are fine for bit if extra heat or small room very cheap to run. Can get bigger ones that are more expensive for bigger space.
If you have gas central heating just install the Drayton Wiser smart heating control system. It’s so flexible you can heat just one room if you want to. I fitted myself in September 2022. So glad I did. In 12 months it reduced our gas consumption by 20%
Love it! The light feature just makes it a fancy a light fitting. I know a ceiling where this will go up 😊
840W is not advisable on a lighting circuit which takes a maximum of 1440w on a 6A MCB or RCBO. All depending what other fittings you have installed on that circuit you'll either have your circuit tripping out or worse. Heaters should go on either a circuit of their own preferably or be fuse spured off a socket circuit. Electricity is dangerous and if you get it wrong it bites back with a vengeance!
If only fitting one heater and you have all led lighting on other circuits should be fine
In this case it is a silent danger since it can overheat cabling over time, leading to a future fire hazard
Its not an issue at all, 1.5mm2 copper cable can be run at 10a continuous which is around 2.2kw
I mean, you can get different sizes & hang them on the wall... Also if you have central heating, you can turn down or off certain radiators, so you don't have to heat the whole house/ rooms etc... But obviously it will still cost more I'd imagine 👍 great vid 👍
I luv your channel brother but a 800w draw through a 100w light fitting, good luck! lol
The circuit is rated to 6a continuous. 6 x 240 = 1,440w. This is 3.3a, so all safe. I checked it with a sparkie first. Also, the whole house is on LEDs
Excellent, thank you for sharing. Will be getting some of these so we don’t need to run the heating for an hour in the mornings in spring and autumn
Thanks for the review! I just bought one to try it out myself, and I think the concept is great, but was curious how it would work in practice. This gives me confidence it will work for us, as well.
Have that very one and a few other of different sizes, all work very well.
My thinking is 850w heater on a lighting circuit is dangerous. Everyone is saying about 1.5mm cable but what if this cable is 1mm. Lots of lighting circuits have extraction fans on them and so on. Also if and when you move and someone else adds some extra lights. This needs to come for the ring main or a separate circuit
I visited the Herschel company in Avonmouth recently to discuss options on these panels for my box room, probably similar size to yours. If it works out may put in all my rooms as I am in the process of having solar fitted.
I just bought myself a seat heater from Amazon. Cost about £50 and draws around 40W. It turns on when I sit down and switches off again when I stand up. I don't need to have the central heating on with this and we've had below zero temperatures the last few days.
Yes, I think the days of heating the whole house with central heating with cheap gas are over, and infra red panels seem a good solution for little used rooms because they give instant heat.
Could use them in bedrooms, bathrooms and studies, or as you have done for when only one person is in the house.
You can heat single rooms with a boiler too, you just need to buy programmable TRVs. I’ve been doing it for years.
The future could be insulation between rooms with higher energy ratings given to houses that have 150mm put between rooms or even building regs
Electricity is 3 times the price of gas! James and Kate power the heater via their battery which means that they are on tariff subsidised by other electricity users to charge their battery at night at artificially low rate. Batteries are not cheap at all. Furthermore heat rises. It would be better to use electric underfloor heaters in their case. Warm feet is a lot more comfortable than hot head.
I think these are great. My guess is the light is not replaceable, so if I were you I would try not to use it much. You can get a warmer (color) LED lamp for the room that would look better and not use much if any more power.
That’s what I’m thinking of installing in wet rooms. I want to put an air to air heat pump for the rest of the house as with these mad summers and working from home we need air con. Which will be powered by solar for the most part in those hot summer days! Though… out light circuits are capped at 6A on each floor so hmmm.
You can get away with one on each floor essentially. This is 3.3a
You may consider the new models of ac/dc heat pumps. They take 30% more efficient DC directly connected to a few solar panels what they can, and supplement this simultaneously with AC when cloudy.
Nice one will be looking at three for my office in the new house (keys tomorrow!)
Congrats pal.
I have only really noticed it kept its heat with a lot of soft furniture , carpets, kitchen table etc The fact that you installed on the roof is the best , walls aren’t great as there quite directional with the heat , sparse, and hard floors or drafty areas it still feels cold don’t bother with smaller panels
I have one here in Bulgaria 1.7kw, Sited about 2 metres high facing downwards. Left on for a few hours the floor under the panel can get to 32c. How fast they warm objects is entirely dependant on the thermal mass of the object.
It's a ceiling not a roof. I bought a 400w infrared panel heater from Aldi for £24 which could be ceiling mounted. Combined this with a mobile, floor standing, oscillating bar heater of 400, 800 or 1200w output for about another £24. Add in a plug thermostat and you have a much cheaper, more flexible and just as effective solution. The real solution component in either scenario is the battery storage of cheap rate or solar electricity. The rest is just cake decoration costing £350.
You got a good deal on that. I bought mine from warm 4less. They are good. I'll not able to do away with gas though as there is a need to heat the whole house and gas is cheaper than electricity (it's a fiddle). If we are heating a limited area if the house they come into their own.
After my explanation, a better way of doing this might be to 'tap' into the ring main that serves the above floor. The ring main would be rated at 32A and with a few lifted floorboards, there's probably a plug socket near enough to tap into. That's off the top of my head so I haven't given it serious thought, but it would be much safer than what you've done. I would also add that 2.8kW isn't bad consumption for a day's heating. Everyone will be on a minimum rate of 30p by 2024 (even overnight) and possibly much more, so for about £1 per day, you're heating your workspace. Of course this means £30 per month and probably an extra £120 per year but still comparable to heat pumps in running costs.
All these comments about 800w being to much for a lighting circuit should be taken seriously. It's not good practice to plug heaters into light fittings and telling other folks about it is likely to invite all sorts of problems.😊
I had a sparky check this for me. The fitting is capable of running this continuously with 2a to spare. We are also LED'd to the max 👌🏻
If you need a certain amount of BTUs you need a certain amount of BTUs and it's that simple, whether it's a 1 Kw infrared panel or 1 Kw fan heater or 1 kw oil filled heater it's all the same only the fan heater and oil filled radiators are much cheaper.
As an electrician in Australia, I would like to point out that most light globes are 100-watt max (incandescent type)...........cabling for light circuits throughout your house are not designed for 850-watt loads.......you may be overloading (overheating) your building cabling...electrical heated cables can and does lead to ceiling space fires.
I am not saying it will in your case, but I put it out there as a caution if it has not been installed by someone qualified.
Thanks for the review, most reassuring and helpful, but a by the way .. I --think-- your timer/controller has an LED light cold/warm toggle between the cold white light you show as task lighting, and warm white, a far more pleasant light and similar to incandescent ones we are familiar with. Check if yours has this, i think it does as i have possibly seen the panel you have on Shmamazon.
7.5p per kWh that’s a rather good price. I pay 35.8p per kWh I thought we all did on the new price cap
From a tecnical point, 800w is WAY too big for that size of room. 200 to 300w max at design temperatures of -3*c would be fine. Also a point to note. Most lighting circuits are rated at 6 amps. One of these 800w panels is around 3.5 amps so just 2 of these on a lighting circuit would trip the circuit breaker. Lighting circuits are not designed for those kinds of loads.
Indeed, went too big, but it switches off for large parts of the day. We only have one and we're fully LED'd so all good.
@@Jamesandkate be interested to hear how this is still going in the new year 2024…
"I'm not a very DIY-y kinda guy".... and yet, give you a spanner and a screwdriver and you could have a car in bits in no time...!! 🤣
On the IR panel front, I've watched quite a number of different user videos on panels - with VERY mixed feelings and experiences all round, if I'm honest.
On the one hand, they do seem to be a really low-disruption option for anyone wanting to move away from gas central heating to electric - like you said, no pipes, no fuss.
I got the sense, though, that they might end up being a very 'room-specific' option - like you have, for the office specifically... I've seen others with them in a bathroom... or, in one case, a make-shift cinema room...!
I had toyed with the idea of testing one out in the spare bedroom in my loft space, where we don't have any radiators - one day, maybe...
Give it a bash, you get 30 days to send it back 👍🏻
We have them in the office (40 people), the building would have been very difficult to retro fit a wet system, and much easier to "rewire" if we rearrange partitions, rather than "replumb". They are 2' square ceiling tile replacements. We also have knee-hole 200W panels, because sat at a desk your legs are not in direct line-of-sight with the ceiling panel. Only the rooms with people in are heated, which is a significant saving over heating the whole building, and I think the same applies for someone working from home-office.
Is it safe to have an 800w heater on a lighting circuit? Our infrared panels are on a separate circuit.
I checked this with a sparkie. He said under 4amps is well within limits.
@@Jamesandkate the whole circuit is likely on a 6a breaker though, so with two on full pelt, could easily cause tripping. Likely at least two lighting circuits in house, but don’t forget many have extractor fans, shower pumps, heck even boilers tagged in that will decrease load headroom
It's a ceiling not a roof. I bought a 400w infrared panel heater from Aldi for £24 which could be ceiling mounted. Combined this with a mobile, floor standing, oscillating bar heater of 400, 800 or 1200w output for about another £24. Add in a plug thermostat and you have a much cheaper, more flexible and just as effective solution. The real solution component in either scenario is the battery storage of cheap rate or solar electricity. The rest is just cake decoration costing £350.
I've got Three 960watt Infared panels and I can tell you that Infared is USELESS in the coldest freeze of Winter here in the UK. A Convector heater of 2 kW or more is far better than Infared or radiant heat.
Infared panels would be more suited for small rooms with decent or better insulation.
I used plastic cement (glue) to improve the strength of the fix into the ceiling. A plop on the screw as it emerges spreads the weight. I was afraid of them falling but there's no risk of this.
If you have a gas boiler heated wet radiator system it should have thermostatic valves fitted to every radiator. These get stuck if not used frequently. With gas currently being over 3 times cheaper than electricity, I would have thought it was better to turn the radiators down in the rooms you are not using, then turn them up when you use that room - a bit like turning off the light.
Except that - unlike an electric light - it takes ages for the room to heat up from the rads. OTH, I would imagine you would get a pretty much instant perception of warmth from one of these IR heaters...
You can level the energy cost playing field with a heatpump - the coefficient of performance gives you 3 times the heat energy out for the electrical energy in... but, the cost of the installation not only of the heatpump but the UFH system that works best with it is astronomical. That said, it would be 'easy' to combine installing UFH with good underfloor insulation (on suspended floors at least) and so, as a whole package on a major renovation basis, the 2 work well together and would be worth doing for most older homes over their lifetimes (tho not the owner's lifetimes, necessarily - which is where government help will be needed).
£350! That's expensive, especially as others are cheaper & give 3 to 5 year warranty! Probably cheaper, with a 500w panel & an LED strip...
Still, I have Far IR heaters now, they are fantastic, I can run them through the app or via Alexa.. None cost me more than £140..
1.2kw, 720w& 430w variants, they cut in & out with the thermostats, & like you say give you a nice even spread of heat 👍👍
We’re in a similar situation - I wfh and I’m a cold north facing room with a too small radiator. We’re running the CH all day but the wrinkle is we have our daughter at home too. Otherwise I’d be tempted to try with the heating off middle of the day
Can you compare gas use with this in place? Assume if your house cools down it’ll use a lot of gas to heat back up in the evening so I’d be curious if that vs trickling it throughout the day
@@MrKlawUK we're quite lucky. Our house is well insulated and heats up in around 15 mins.
Great video guys. I will be getting one for my wifes office to.. I need to know how bright the light is when it is dark outside thanks
I later discovered that there is 3 different options for the light, ranging from office light style to a soft tone light. It's easily bright enough for all eventualities we have found.
@@Jamesandkate nice one mate. Thanks for the quick response. All the best to you and yours..
Really interesting as I am looking to heat a home office (garage conversion) of about 12 ft by 12 ft so will pinch this idea as I am having solar installed as well.
Greetings from Ireland 💚
If you hold the light button for a couple of seconds, it changes to a warmer light.
Thank 2139 you 1870 James and 10685 Kate!
I recognise that room ! Nice video mate 👌 im suprised Kate allowed it to go out with all that detritus on the floor 🤣🤣🤣👍👍
Would it have been better to use a radiator multiple zone kit? For example Honeywell evo home, Drayton wiser, Genius hub etc.
Having a weather compensated heating system may also be cheaper in the long run?!
All these types of heating are around 100% efficient I.e. 1kw in = 1kw out. In a small room like that a much cheaper fan heater or convection heater would have exactly the same effect and running cost.
Infrared is a more comfortable heat than convection, and as a result allows you to lower the temperature required. That results in a saving vs convection.
Whilst 1kw = 1kw is true the effect on heating you is very different. Fan / Convector heater needs the air to be warmed before you feel warm, so basically you need to pre-heat the room before you will be comfortable in it. Also fan or convector moves the air around, and that feels like you are in a draught which is also less comfortable. Far Infra Red heaters heat you from the moment they are switched on, same as how the sun feels warm on a cold day - and also heats the furnishings, which then radiate heat into the room - eventually heating the whole room. Bottom line is that you feel warm when air temperature is lower than would otherwise be comfortable. I have a 200W panel in the knee-hole under my desk. My legs feel nice and warm, and it isn't long before the whole underside of desk and floor is warm, so that small part of the office feels really toasty.
Fan heaters are pretty dodgy at the best of time, I wouldn’t use them long term for anything.
I've tried both. The far it panels are much more effective with a much nicer feel
IR panels don't heat the air they heat the fabric this is more efficient than convection heating.
Still considering one of these. Mainly for our conservatory/office/playroom which barely gets above outside temps in winter. Wondering if it'll be too hot to place next to polycarbonate...and if I could wire into wall lights 🤔 Opted for a 300W fleece blanket as an interim measure as we don't have cheap overnight leccy or battery storage yet.
They normally don't exceed 40c to the rear. The front can get up to about 80c normally. Oversize for a room like yours. Something like 35watt per m2 I think.
Maybe try and program it to shut off an hour (or more) before leaving the room. It will save you a lot of kWH and money. The heat trapped in the objects in the room will heat the room for the last hour.
Very interesting indeed. Thanks!
My takeaway is James needs to buy Kate a Model S. I saw the picture on her wall. 😁
That's our old Model S when we were in France😉
A lighting circuit is protected by a 5- or 6-amp fuse or circuit breaker. This fuse size allows bulbs with a maximum combined wattage of 1150 watts (5 amps x 230 volts) so sticking 840 watts on it in one device is not the brightest of ideas 💡💡
One thing lost when the busybodies banned incandescent bulbs was the local, radiant heat from them. Useful in winter, as you usually had a bulb on right next to you in the evenings. Of course, that heat was a problem in warmer periods. I've suggest to several elderly people who kept their thermostats up due to the difficulty of the elderly feeling warm, to use an incandescent bulb next to where they sit in heating season. Or, more easily acquired, those reptile heating bulbs and a brooder reflecting lamp. Just at the 100-150 watt range.
Bit unfortunate, they didn't arrange the LED lighting to reflect across the panel to brighten it up.
I use incandescent for that reason in the winter. I read that 90% of the energy they give off is heat.
@@Goddess.of.Victorythat's PRECISELY why they are banned, very wasteful of energy
@stuffoflardohfortheloveof Exactly but only wasteful in the Summer. I just use them in the winter. It was only 30 degrees lastnight & used my lamps for heat & of course so that I can see. So I save money that way. My apartment stayed warm with just my lamps.
@@Goddess.of.Victory that's fair enough, especially if your short of money. I'd rather see you spend your money on a cheap heater though, much more efficient
Not sure you can use lighting circuit for 800w?
It’s all good. This is 3.3a and the circuit is rated to 6 continuous 👍🏻
@@Jamesandkate Not sure all is good actually.
A lighting circuit normally has a 5 amp rated fuse, and is designed for say 12 x 100w bulbs so total 1200 watts.
1200w/240v = 5 amps, so theoretically you could use that circuit for 1 x 1200w heater.
However the WIRING is designed for 12 appliances(light bulbs), not a single 800Kw heater!
So you are putting 800w through a wire expecting 100w.
The cable for a 15amp rated ring main for sockets (suitable for up to say a 3kw kettle), is 3.5mm.
Up to 7kw electric showers are usually on a 40amp rated circuit and use 6mm cable, above 7kw require 10mm cable.
Lighting wire is usually 1mm or 1.5mm and could overheat if used for heaters and kettles.
I think you should ask a qualified electrician for advice.
Hi I'm an electrician and I just to say brilliant idea but be careful you consider that your wiring system is not designed to take that much power from 1.5mm cable there is a risk of fire
Quick question. Can the panel be fitted flush to the celing?
6:14 *Amazed it has not tripped out on Circuit Board !* 🥵⚡
That's because they are UNLUCKY!!! They're going to have a fire.
It’s only 3.3a
@@Jamesandkate But your lighting circuit is only 5 A for all the lights. Two of these panels in different rooms would inevitably trip it.
Reminds me of the days when people would plug their irons into the light socket using a splitter!
@@johnwinters4201 -It's 6 amps and he only installed one panel. Calm down.
What about a bathroom? Are they safe with condensation?
Important to understand that infrared will not heat the air but the objects that it hits, just like the sunshine. That’s why the feeling is so different.
Thanks 👍
I have a 750w Panel and it warms the room but the heat only feels warm when near it or from the side your facing.
Very interesting video. Do you feel the infra red heat as soon as it is switched on (while the background temperature might still be cold), in the same way as you can feel the sun on your back on a cold day?
No. It takes say ten minutes to heat. And up to an hour to warm the fabric.
@@robburrows2737Ten mins is great though. My gas boiler starts to heat up but it can take hours for the room too be comfortable, depending on how cold it was
Does it have an anti frost setting on the controller so that it can keep say a garage warm enough to stop icing of a otherwise unheated space ?
I can't help but think the aesthetics would be hugely improved if the panel was fitted flush with the ceiling... Possible?
It is an interesting idea that the fundamental efficiency of a heating systems (and therefore its running costs) can be warped by simply considering the perception of warmth and that appears to be what's going on here. You simply can't get away from the fact that using a heatpump, you get at least 3 times more heat energy out of your input (electrical) energy. However, if you have to access that heat by warming up the fabric of an entire room then, overall, I can see how these IR heaters may offer a cheaper route for specific situations. For me, sitting at my dest as I am at the moment, it's my feet and lower legs that are cold and here UFH totally rules.
2.8 kWh per day means about 90 kWh a month. Is this for a single panel? In my house i'd need at least 5 of them, which means that the bill would be really close to the gas bill we have now.
Fine as long as your not got your feet under a table.but works well with solar pv
I've been playing around with some, ceiling mount is perfect because they don't heat the air, just surfaces and if you have lots of furniture, low wall or free standing won't be as great, once sttled down for the evening, i've been turning off the central heating and just running one i have located in front of the fire place, and because it's heats surfaces, i even experimented taking my slippers and socks off, guess what, they don't get cold. :)
my fire place one has a picture of a fire on it :)
When the surfaces have been warmed do they in turn warm the air?
@@pussinboots1145 yes that's how it would work to heat the air : first, the object converts far infrared of the fixture to medium and low infrared heat waves which heat air through convective flow over the warmed solid surface. Fun fact, far infra red goes 4" into the body, heating the inside. this increases blood flow deeper onside so far infrared is used for healing effect. Anther fun fact: the Sun gives off medium infrared which we enjoy feeling as is natural. the same as red brooder lamps. but not far infrared, which may leave you feeling buzzy. And the jury is out weather its really healthy as its not like the Suns med infrared we are accustomed to. So some healers heat clients with medium infra red bulbs. medium doesn't go as deep or as fast, but doesn't annoy and potentially cause disturbance either.
Very interesting vid funny how it’s so efficient because they say heat rises ???.👍👍👍
It’s definitely against the regulations for a lighting circuit and it might void your house insurance, worth checking.
Any chance of an update, one winter later?
An interesting idea, but I would never install one on a 5 Amp lighting circuit. It's drawing about 3.5 Amps, so you could not fit a second one to the circuit, even if you wanted to. It will work, so long as all of the other lights on the ring together use less than the remaining 1.5 Amps. The protection device will trip if you exceed the maximum load for that circuit. It's also worth checking to make sure that the panel complies with U.K. electrical standards and laws. It's questionable. I'm no longer a certified electrician, but am pretty sure that a modern electrician would never sign it off as being safe, compliant and legal, unless it was connected to a higher power domestic ring main or spur.
This looks great but its frustrating as hell! Cant find this unit anywhere...At least not with the lites and remote or wall mount program unit. Can see just a cheaper or more basic type as in on amazon. Wexstar brand...no lite no remote or program wall unit. Just plugin only. The one here in your vid..Is this just Europe only?
Hi, excellent video and i think this is exactly what i need for my office renovation because i need to remove the radiator. Can you tell me the square area of your office please? It looks a similar size to mine, but i want to make sure i get the right size panel for my room. Don't wanna chuck £379 at one if its overkill for my needs. Many thanks and HNY :)
I prefer convection heating rather than radiant heat.
Astectherm is the way to go 👍
Mountable vertically - on a wall say? (Albeit with rigid mountings)
I've never really been convinced of IR heating, because 850W is 850W no matter how you heat it. The issue for us was the installation cost to get the wiring installed and a separate switch on the wall which was more than the cost of the heater itself.. Having a heater with a built in LED light that can replace an existing light fitting is a great solution. Not sure we can buy those here in New Zealand unfortunately.
yes 850w is 850w but instead of wasting 850w heating the air, that 850w is heating objects such as furniture, your body, etc instead. It works faster, you feel warm faster, which means you wont need it on for that long to keep warm.
Great video, does wiring the light also connect the heater?
What is the heat like under the desk when sitting
800 watts into uk lighting how is that allowed i'am missing something ?
Hi there, almost a year. How is the panel holding up? Would you recommend it?
I've just been watching your Nissan Leaf battery module swap outs, so apologies for my explanation of a domestic lighting circuit. I'm sure you knew all this, but it may be helpful for anyone else reading the comments and is a newbie. I've just bought a 6 bar 2011 Japanese import Nissan Leaf and looking at my options for extending the range. Any suggestions?
Does your cost reflect the recent electricity price hike?
That give the energy consumption so you can work it out. While the panel is 800w it seems to only be on for 3.5hrs in an 8hr day
I hope there’s no asbestos in that ceiling texture.
I hope not, the house is 15yo
Can you control the light separately to the IR heater?
I was wondering that too.
Yes you can.
@@abgmac67 You can
7.5 p per kWh that sounds like battery storage prices. I’ve looked at them but like you not for our house ok for office.
Indeed, we use stored energy prices.
That's not cheap to run though when you think of it. The best option is an air to air heat pump also known as air conditioning. Even the cheaper less economical units are around 400% efficient, at 800w in put you would get in excess of 3200w out. Or divide your kWh price by 4 to give you a comparable unit rate.
@easy likesunday morning. the biggest problem with an air source heat pump is that it represents a very large investment of money and they don't work very well in extreme cold weather. Their efficiency rating drops enormously. if you are going to spend that amount of money provided you have sufficient land space available you are far better off investing in a ground source heat pump also you cannot substitute an air source heat pump for a normal conventional gas boiler powered central heating system because the pipework and radiator sizes are far too small
Air source heat pumps as widely advertised today are very different to air conditioning. I can tell you as a fgas engineer of 18 years air to air or air conditioning very much does work in all weather conditions if correctly sized and poses a much lower initial cost than air to water heat pumps. My system will work down to -15 with no issues at all. I don't know why this isn't being more widely talked about.
@@fjspicer1 They do have portable heat pumps in the same form factor as portable air conditioners that have COPs of 2.7 or so. They cost maybe 500 pounds.
They have cop of 4 when outside air is at 16C or higher. at around -7c or sth cop goes down to 2, which means in cold climate you cant use it all year. But yes. I still think its waaaay better solution than this
How do you control the temperature?
How long does it take for the room to get up to temperature?