Forget An Anvil! Get yourself an ASO!
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- čas přidán 26. 07. 2024
- Anvil Shaped Objects are just what the doctor ordered for a beginner. Forget trying to find a damaged anvil for 500 bucks, check out other options for much cheaper!
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I have been a professional blacksmith since the early 90' and what this man is saying is 100% correct. Mass is key.
Around the world: Watch smiths working in countries like India, Philippines, SE Asia, South & Central America, etc. on youtube. You will see most smiths using simple pieces of scrap steel as an anvil.
Don't use gray cast iron: It will stay soft, not work harden and eventually crumble. Steel will work harden over time so your scrap steel anvil will harden with use.
Work hardening: Don't expect extreme hardness from work hardening. Just a bit harder. You can excelletrate hardening early on by hammering the edge of your improvised anvil as your hammer is probably much harder than your improvised anvil.
Flame hardening: If, through spark testing, you find that your scrap anvil is higher in carbon than mild steel. You can flame harden the edges of your improvised anvil by heating the edge with a torch and using the coldness of the anvil's mass along with water to harden the edge of your anvil. A garden hose at full flow without the nozzle works well for this.
Forging cold steel: If you are denting the surface of your improvised anvil while attempting to forging hot steel, it is probably because your hot steel is not hot enough.
Black heat: Remember, at the temperature that you no longer see a red color, is about the temperature of what is known as a Black-heat, This black-heat is actually harder than when the the steel you are forging is cold. So keep the steel you are forging in the upper to middle forging temperature range. Tool steels have a lower forging temperature range than mild steel.
Heavy hammer: By using a heavy anvil and hammer, (A hammer you can work with comfortably), you will move more metal for each blow of the hammer and actually add heat to the piece you are forging so you can forge longer between heats.
Hammer mass vs speed: There is a balance between, mass of the hammer and the speed of the hammer's head. Human strength: Heavy hammer = slow speed. Light hammer = fast speed. Our muscles work most efficiently and can do more work before tiring when they are moving fast as compared to moving slow. (For example, look at professional bicyclists. They keep the cadence of the peddles at 60 or more revolutions per minute and adjust their gears according to the terrain as this is the most efficient and least tiring.
Mushrooming: If you find that you are mushrooming the surface of the steel you are forging, this is because the hammer is too light for the mass of steel you are forging. Either work on smaller cross-sections of steel or become stronger and work with a larger hammer.
Cold anvil: If you are forging in winter, on a cold anvil, heat your anvil before you start as a cold anvil will suck lots of heat out of your work being forged.
Weight of the anvil: Ratio of about 50 to 1 is ideal. So a 3 lb hammer ought to be used with a 150 lb anvil. This is ideal. Half this ratio will still work of course, just not as well and less efficient. This also applies to the size stock you are forging. Smaller material cross-sections can be forged with a smaller ratio. Plus figure the mass of what your anvil is resting on. A 50 lb anvil, for example, securely held down and bedded to it's base, so that there is no gap between the anvil and base, will certainly help. This way, the mass of the base, concrete for example or other suitable mass will help the anvil have more mass. This way, you can get away with a lighter anvil.
The edge of the anvil: The vast majority of the work is done on the edge of the anvil. The edge of the anvil and the edges of the hammer ought to have a radius. For the anvil, on one end the edge has a small radius, on the other end there is a large radius of as much as a 1/4 inch. In between these two ends of the anvil's edge, the radius transitions. This way the smith has access to any radius desired. This is done on both the far and near edges of the anvil. Remember, radius is half of the diameter.
The hammer face: The center portion is flat. As you move toward the outer edges, the radius of the face of the hammer face keeps decreasing to about a 3/16 inch radius at the outer edges of the hammer's face. This is done on all four edged of the square faced hammer. This way you have access to all sorts of different radii on the face of the hammer depending on what part of the face of the hammer you allow to impact the surface of the work you are forging simply by twisting the hammer a bit when your hand is in the air at the top of your swing. Anywhere from flat to a 3/8 inch round )3/16 inch radius surface.
Sharp edges: You almost never use sharp edges on the anvil's or hammer's face, so don't have any.
Cold shuts: Sharp forging edges on anvils and hammers will create cold shuts. Always avoid these.
Anvil Orientation: Remember that the orientation of the anvil's mass ought to be inline with the direction of the hammer's blow. Think vertically. Hammer moving vertically and the mass of the anvil also vertically in line with movement of the hammer.
Anvil base: Have an anvil base that is small enough so you can stand with your right leg against the anvil. I have a tripod base. I usually have my right foot a bit under the anvil as I work.
Standing at the anvil: With your right leg against the anvil. This minimizes bending over to reach the anvil. This way your right shoulder is above the far edge of the anvil and your arm is swing inline with the far edge of the anvil. This way the right edge of the square hammer face is in line and parallel with the anvil's edge. You are not bending over either. Provided your anvil is at the correct height for you.
Feedback loop: As you work, you create a feed-back loop between what you see as a result of your last hammer blow and how you hammer's face was oriented. You adjust your hammer's face for the next blow, then strike the work, then observe the result by seeing the light that reflects off the surface of your work , then adjust your hammer's face for the next blow and so on and so on. This is all done very quickly. In the process, you are training your mind and body to forge and move the metal as you wish.
Hammer handle: It is very important to have a bit of squareness to the hammer's handle. The reason for this is that the hand's contact with the handle tells the brain the orientation of the hammer's face. Try forging with a hammer that has around cylindrical handle. It is impossible to know the exact angle that the hammer's face is in relation to the stock and the anvil's face.
How to hammer: Study the forging style of Uri Hoffi. The style he teaches saved my blacksmithing career as I was hurting myself by not holding and using the hammer in an ergonomic way. Keep the hammer handle in your hand in such a way that the hammer, which will bounce when it strikes, is allowed to rebound. I do this by actually holding the hammer handle on the right and left side of the handle. Not top and bottom. Never with the thumb on the top of the handle !!!! Between my thumb which is pressing on the side of the handle closest to me and my index finger and a little bit of my ring finger on the far side of the handle. When coming down I squeeze a little with my other fingers, not much. When the hammer strikes the surface, the head is allowed to bounce upward. In this way, I allow the hammer to bounce up after it hits the work being forged by allowing the hammer to pivot between my thumb and index finger. Now the hammer head is more vertically above the handle. I bring the hammer up and prepare for the next swing,. This is very important. If you hold the hammer too tight, you will stop the hammer from bouncing up after it strikes the work. This shocks your hand/arm as your hand and arm are still traveling downward as the hammer head wants to travel upward. This also results in more work as you have stopped the hammer's upward movement, then have to restart it again.
The angles. So, depending on the angle between the anvil face and the bottom surface of the stock which is determined by how high the smith holds the stock above the face of the anvil as the stock rests on the far edge of the anvil's face, determines the profile of the anvil that is engaging with the stock being forged. As the hammer is traveling vertically down, and the hammer is twisted a bit to the right, the iron is being forged by both the top and bottom radiuses at the same time. These two radiuses working together and will quickly move the metal in the desired direction. This is especially true when forging a point. The two radiuses work like two rolling pins. Points in one heat are easy this way.
One heat points: Taking the info on "The angles" above, hold the end of your stock just past the edge of the anvil with your left hand allowing the stock to angle downward. With the hammer, strike the work with the hammer face slightly twisted to the right. This will create a matching angle between the stock & anvil and stock & hammer face. Strike so the edge of hammer is directly above the edge of anvil to pinch the stock and make a nub on the end of the stock. Of course you are twinning your stock 90 degrees each time for square and round stock. After establishing a nub, continue to pull the stock back as you make 90 degree twists. Focus the on the nub that is continuing to get smaller. Reduce the power of your blows as you go. The nub will continue to getting hotter because it is not loosing heat into the rest of the stock, anvil or hammer and only the radius of the edge of the anvil and hammer are making contact with the steel. After roughed out, smooth to the desired finish surface.
May this be helpful to all smiths and aspiring smiths. :)
Any questions: paulemorneault@yahoo.com
Wow, thank you. Never read such a good comment on blacksmithing. I'm starting as a knife maker right now and learned all that from a black smith who himself was a student of Hoffi. Back then I really took all that for granted, but many people don't know/use half of those tips. Thank you.
Man great info for a newbie like me. Thank you very much for taking the time to post that!!! 👍 Really appreciate it!
Thank you sir! A lot of great pointers, holding the hammer in particular. I saved it for future reference. Do you have a CZcams channel or website, by any chance?
Wow ! Awesome heap of knowledge condensed there. Thank you sir for taking the time to share it !
Wow intro to blacksmithing!! Pdf form !! Thank you sir!
I work at an oil change joint, and we have a few railroad guys get the company truck serviced there. My grandpa was looking for a short section of track to use instead of the "anvil" on his vice. I asked the guy if they had any scrap track that we could buy a section of...he came back an hour later with a one foot section of railroad track, and said happy birthday. Never hurts to ask.
Yep. I got a couple of flat rail plate (I think it's called) about the same way. There was a crew replacing ties and rail along a section of track. I said, "Heah, fellahs! I'm a beginner blacksmith and I was wondering if there's any of that plate or spikes I could get for salvage or scrap prices..." The foreman gave me all I could carry. He wrote down his name and said if anyone wants to know, here's his contact info, etc. Just don't try to sell it for scrap.
Christopher Neely
That's *great*!
My dad is a electrician and he was working on a job at a railroad and they had a pile of scrap stuff do he pulled his truck up near it, and loaded up a piece of railroad track about a foot long, it sat in his garage since before I was born, and I found it about six months ago and have been using ever since
Cooper Vistrand c
I work for a RR company. I have no problem giving a few chunks of rail away. Just wont take money for it. That kinda stuff can get a feller in trouble.
When I started with the idea of knifemaking I was working with my brother (he's a carpenter) so I started looking around to see how hard would it be to get all the tools I needed... A week or so we finished a deck around a pool in a house of a... hmm.. rich man to say something... Well, we finished, we were taking all the tools and machines from the pool to my brother's truck through an alley (you know, at the side of the house, with trees and plants at both sides) and suddenly I look to one side and there was an anvil, a 76 kg fking anvil! The owner of the house was walking right behind me, I looked him and said "Hey, what's up with that?" (the best poker face I've ever done) and he said something like "It's been sitting there for quite some time, do you want it? it's yours"
Damn, I have never been (and probably never will again) so happy having to lift a 76 kilograms objet from the ground.
Lucky...
You on the outside: Yeah I guess I could take it off your hands
You on the inside: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
@Piper Mccoy Also, don't forget that to the rich guy with big, heavy chunk of metal, you're offering to solve a problem for free. He's not going to take his time dealing with people on Craigslist who want to pay him a couple hundred bucks/euro/whatever, or calling a junk hauler to just remove it. On the spot, he's got someone who wants to take it away right now. Sure, he knows it's got some value, but the value of making it go away is worth it to him. Add in the bit where he's clearly doing a small favor for someone who just did some good work for him, and everyone's happy with the deal.
@Piper Mccoy I think you're _drastically_ undervaluing how much people value time. Getting rid of the clearly unwanted thing, right now, with zero effort, and no time spent dealing with anyone else, is worth a substantial amount of money. If you're an attorney billing $500/hr you don't have enough money for fulltime staff, but you certainly don't care about the price of an anvil vs. your time dealing with it.
I cant lift that i can only 40kg or less since i am 14year old skeleton
You want an anvil? You've just gotta find that cliff edge that Roadrunner kept throwing Wile-E Coyote off... there'll be anvils a'plenty at the bottom of that!
Genious, super genious.
There damaged
ACME repoed all of them cause he had no money, spent it all on bird seed
Hahahaha. That is great
The way they dropped anvils in the old cartoons, I thought they'd be cheap and plentiful. Not in 2018 they aren't at least!
Great advice. I have been a full time professional blacksmith for 20 years and I tell this to my students all the time. Here in Canada anvils are even harder to come by than in the US. I can't tell you how useful a big chunk of steel is. Even though I have a 450 lbs anvil in the shop those big pieces of steel get used a lot.
Chris Waters isnt that the truth been looking to
Start blacksmithing anvils
Are few and far between any that people want to get rid of are usaully 9lbs and nothing big but my
Grandpa has a homemade anvil made of an I beam he cut
Wolf Coyote I beams would not make a great anvil because the working face isn't supported. For the same reason as people don't use the bottom of railroad tracks as an anvil because the top has more mass supporting it. If you were dead set on an anvil head to princess auto and buy theirs for $300 on sale.
Chris Waters i
I have no interest in doing any of this in myself, I'm just fascinated by the work you do. What I wanted to say was I really enjoy how quick to the point you were with this video and explained things instead of dragging it on like most videos of *anything* on the internet. Thank you!
I appreciate it! I make a point not to ramble and thats years of debate and speech coming out!
Firedan1176 You spoke for a lot of us.
Firedan1176 so true.
purgatoryironworks that's funny. And thanks for the inspiration because I am wanting to start this and the prices of everything tell me no. You just gave me a little bit more hope. Ty
He does make very good videos. Explained well and professional.
I am not blacksmith, but I needed a small anvil for some of my crafting. But I couldn't find an affordable small anvil, so I bought a sledgehammer head instead and I am using it as an anvil ever since. It is heavy, surfaces are flat, it is tempered steel, has a hole in the middle that can be used as a hardy hole, narrow triangular side can be used as the horn of an anvil. It is quite useful.
I do believe that’s not a sledge
That’s probably a splitting maul
I have a book with a photo of Vietnamese smiths using an artillery AP round set into the ground as an anvil. Just got to be creative.
Well how big are you looking for? There are a lot of good jeweler's anvils out there for some really reasonable prices.
You’re the man on this advice. I’m going to start calling around to see what I can dig up. Sköl
I'm hoping for the same kind of sutuation. Some rich person that doesn't really understand what they have.
A good option to railroad track is crane rails. You can find them for scrape or new and the profiles are larger (up to 4" wide x 6" tall) than railroad track and they are not railroad property. Crane rail is designated by "CR" followed by three number which are the weight of the rail per yard (3 foot). Example: CR135 weighs 135lbs/yard.
Never thought about going to a machine shop. Great tip, thanks!!
I built a railroad anvil in 1969-70 in high school machine shop. We first heated it almost a translucent red/white, then buried it in lime for 3 days to soften it. We completed machining using a lath, milling machine, and drill press. After machining/polishing, we heat treated, hardened and tempered the anvil. We used it in my father-in-laws body shop for over 20 years.
Have no idea. We didn't have a hardness tester in the HS shop, and I've never had it checked. We beat on it, on and off, in the body shop for 20 years, and it is still in good shape It rings like a gunbarrel when you hit it with a hammer. It was a heavy webbed, thick rail. Guarantee you won't pick it up with one hand.
faultroy most of the ones I've seen done will skate a file across the top after hardening. Not sure where it's at after tempering. Dont want it too hard or it will crack. Most of the railroad anvils I've seen made are two pieces sided by side and welded with a thick steel plate welded to the top. Then a section of thick round bar shaped into a horn on one end and squared off on the other and they slide the square end in between the two pieces of track and weld in place. When it's done, it's a pretty stout chunk of steel.
Battenkill Rambler so true. I got a small taste of metal and wood shop in Jr high and loved it. Which sucked because all shop classes were long gone by the time I reached high school. Graduated in 96 and the shop classes had been gone for years when I got there. I think it’s good for all kids to get a little experience working with wood and metal. That will serve them their entire lives.
@Battenkill Rambler My school gives the option to go to vocational school once you get to jr. Year. They let you take 4 rotations and you take the one you like the most. They have everything from Carpentry, plumbing, automotive and auto collision, to welding. They got everything and I love it.
Thank you for saying this, I was starting to get discouraged with everything telling me I needed an anvil to start. This brights up my spirits that i can realistically get started in this hobby
I am just starting out, I wish I had found this video a few months ago! Your advice has proven itself to be straight forward and honest! Thank you sir.
Forget the ASO, forget the anvil too. Just grab the red-hot metal with your bare hands and beat it into submission like a REAL blacksmith would.
Kidding of course, awesome informative video. Great personality. You deserve more subs.
Zach Volkov lol best comment ever.
I usally use my fist and a rock
Zach Z And make it call you Daddy.
Zach, please add "like my grandpa used to do." Gives it that nostalgic twist. :-)
take it from me
i really did just grap a big piece og red hot pipe as a 7 yo kid and trust me that is one thing you only do ones in your life i got 3. degrees burn all over the inside og my right hand, so i learned it the hard hot way
but i got no scares from it today now 42 year later :D
for a beginner, also is good to have something that is mild and not hardened steel, as beginning blacksmiths tend to miss the work and strike the surface of the anvil and hardened steel can chip and send a shard flying where mild steel will not.
So, basically get a Harbor Freight anvil if you're a newbie? Definitely will be a good way to instantly tell when you're working the steel way too cold...
This is great advice that I hadn't even considered. Thank you for taking the time to make this video
I very much enjoy your videos. While I won't be doing any blacksmithing, I have always been impressed by the skill and fine detail I have seen in blacksmith work. The cabinet hinges, in a colonial style, that I watched being made at a demonstration were truly amazing.
Dude thank you. I just got less stupid and it feels good
Me too
That's about the perfect compliment for an instructional CZcams video. Well done!
Yeah, we will get 'learned up' eventually.
Ain't that the truth.!!? I'm 53 and was just educated.!!!
Scrapyards DO buy rail, but they'll only buy it from the railroads themselves. What you want to do is find a major scrap yard, one that actually has it's own rail head - Newell in East Point Georgia is one. Go on a saturday about an hour before closing time, because they're not busy and they'll actually have time to talk to you. Ask around.
What happens is that the rail companies when they replace their rail will sell them to the scrap yards. The scrap yards turn around and sell them to the mills, but the mills can't take rail into the smelter because of the size. So, the scrap yards have guys out there cutting up rail into 4' sections. They'll charge you a few bucks for their time, but you can get out of there with a chunk of rail. A few hours with a grinder and and a six pack of beer later, you should have yourself a small steel anvil.
Yes I have had the opportunity to buy hundreds of feet of it from scrap yards. I even have a place about an hour away that sells just railroad salvage, ties, track what ever you want. Also there are different weights of rail. I have a chunk that is about 2 or 3 times the weight of the piece he has in the video.
I’m a beginner and I GREATLY appreciate your free advice on this.
I’ve been anvil shopping on the net and as you’ve said the prices are already expensive and seem to only be going one way and it’s not down.
Thank you for a very informative video.
This video is 150% the truth . I have an old German anvil & Swedish anvil - 220 pounds & 260 pounds . My home shop has train track anvils ( aprox. 60 pounds) made 40 years ago and they work Great mounted on a base made from oak and filled with cement .
I called a field supervisor at Burlington rail and asked him if I could have 2 pieces of train track that had been laying along a siding for years . He not only said "yes" , he set up a time to meet a friend and myself while we loaded 6 foot and 8 foot pieces into a truck and he wrote a note with his name and phone number .
A very polite young guy came to my company (heavy metal fabrication and machining ) and asked about purchasing some heavy scrap for use as an anvil . Two days later he picked up his custom anvil made from W-2 tool steel = 182 pounds & complete with hardie & pritchel holes + aprox. 50 pounds of old drills , taps , endmills and assorted tool steel . He asked me "what do I owe you ? " . I told him "a pizza" . That afternoon , 3 large pizzas were delivered to my employees .
What is the moral of the story? --> A lot of stuff is free if one simply asks for it and is polite . Pass it along and pass it forward my friend . Lefty
Hello there from deep down across the pond in sunny South Africa.
Very sensible, practical and down-to-earth advise we've heard first time, just for Free !!!
Although we have a couple of just massive Anvils in excellent condition, it was worth listening to Your ramblings.
Nice of You to share Your advices and thoughts. Keep up the good work. Just subscribed !!!
ATB
aRM
I just bought a hunk of steel from my local scrap yard. It is 12"x 8" x 2.5" about 80 lbs for $20. Thank you for the advice on an alternative to an anvil. I go to an auction Saturday for a forge!
Awesome!
Did you get your forge?
I've been using a 6" section of railroad track for a mini anvil for over 20 years! It was a remnant from an overhead crane installation. Works so well for me! Great common sense video!
Thank you Sir, great advice. As a beginner, I appreciate your honesty and knowledge.
I was looking a piece of railroad for months although every gate in Ireland is hung from A piece of railroad I still couldn't find any until I found a length of it in my own garden
Ferguson 20 diesel I've never seen a gate hung from rail. Take a picture! And how did you find the rail in your garden? (I believe that means "back yard" in American English, no?) Was it buried?
matthbva yeah garden is can also be refferd to as your yard. Yeah I forgot that I had it. It was sort of covered by other things. I actually pulled it up out of the ground about 10 years ago as it was a gate hanger. I cut a nice piece off with my power hacksaw
yeah there is an old farm near me where the fence is made of railway track and the old sheds have the doors off railway carriages
david houlihan we actually make sheds out of railroad. Instead of girders sometimes
I know lad, coming from kerry and the old railway line going back from killorglin to waterville parts of the track still exist.
although that is an issue due to the line/ land being now owned by farmers but being cpo for a green way. so lots of track will be available
I used a slab of concrete forever until I made blades I could actually sell. Once I sold enough blades I was fortunate enough to buy an anvil from NC Anvil for around 300$... but in reality- you don’t NEED one to make a straight blade. Thanks for getting the word out.
Ps- I started with just a flat slab of concrete, a hole in the ground, a hair dryer, some coal, and an ordinary 2lb hammer.
NC Anvil. Literally just a few miles from my house PG. NC.
i've been looking at getting into blacksmithing for a while and have watched a endless amounts of videos and i have to admit this is probably the best advise, that actually makes sense, that i have seen yet. thanks!
The most useful info I found today Thanks. Love the straight talking.
I was looking for an avil, came here... seems i already have one :D ... best advice ever!!!
I agree... then save your pennies until something better comes along.
It's a shame that the antiquers have Ruined the anvil market.
Thanks for the video...
I've been going to auctions for over 50 years and when many farm auctions were being held in my area I could have bought many fine looking anvils for 50 cent's to A buck A pound. Now there are very few farm auctions as the children did not like the hard work and people that would like to farm couldn't afford the land so it was sold to housing developers.
If I had bought all those anvils I could have retired richer than I am today!
I don't think antiquers have ruined the market as much as hipsters
yeah but now they will exist a 100 years from now, and not sold as scrap, just sayin old man mike bengyak
Forged By Hammerhead
What are you talking about. Hipsters wouldn't buy anvils or have very much of anything to do with blacksmithing.
Yup. Bored old ex-hippies who think "preserving" old world craftsmanship is buying everything you need to be a craftsman & letting it sit in their bullshit tax-shelter storefront, well anyone who actually wants to use those items is stuck having to scratch their heads, cobble things together and possibly hurt themselves because they can't find proper tools & workshops just shut their doors now w/ no one carrying on because doing business is too expensive. Can't make any money making anything anymore and it costs a fortune to do stay open especially with employee turnover costs from federal policy making it impossible to be a small business.
Hipsters help to ruin the market by falsely inflating prices (by creating a superficial demand w/o the ability/desire to follow through & pay for all these awesome tools), prices that can only be met by jerk off retired turds who think it's cool to have tools you never use.
I don't know what's worse antique collectors hipster dorks or blacksmiths who found their market niche, sell expensive stuff to Old dorks and young hipsters then use the money to buy up everything you can learn on so that they can make CZcams videos showing how many anvils they have and hanging out on forums talking to people about how rad their Anvil collection is.
Great advice! Im new into blacksmithing and knifemaking and I looked into getting an anvil but dont like the prices so I thought outside the box! My grandfather owns a huge construction company and has a large collection of larg equipment so when a fork from his large frontend loader got bent I took it and cut me a 18inch section off (its about 4 inches thick the full 18 inch length and about 5 1/2 inches wide) it works like a dream!
Thank you for saying mild steel. You just opened up my possibilites 10 fold.
I agree, there is no reason to rush into a 6-700 dollar anvil purchase because "you need one to forge properly" because that's a bold faced lie. You can get into forging for pennies if you keep your eyes open, learn a little, and use your imagination.
Rule of thumb is the anvil should be 5 time the weight of your largest hammer.
Had not heard that to this point. Good to know and makes sense, thank you!
Can you go heavier or more dense than 5X?
@@ruthmclemore2959 I think the rule is for the minimum size. More weight is better.
Im gonna make an lead anvil.
Im a genius.
Ruth McLemore i heard somewhere that it should be a 40 to 1 ratio. I.e. a 40 pound anvil to a 1 pound hammer.
I'm not a blacksmith I've only worked with steel a couple times but my friend you really created a great video here. Very valuable to those starting out.
thank you for this honestly this took a lot of weight off me i've been stressing out about an anvil for a long while
I used a big ass rock I dug up for my first knife came out great
Best advice ever 👍👍
I agree, and thank you Sir for all your advice!
Thank you guy for watching me run my mouth!
I was just about to purchase an anvil, as a beginner. Then I saw your video. THANK YOU SO MUCH
I work at my home town scrap yard 1/2 mile from my shop and I find the most amazing things while processing loads of steel! Go get friendly with your local steel/scrap yard (most towns will have one) and you’ll find iron good for anvils, swage blocks, fresh machined parts that for whatever reason was discarded by milling and machine shops! It’s crazy!
I know I'm quibbling over semantics, but we have a little terminology issue here. An "anvil shaped object" is something that looks like an anvil, but that you can't pound hot metal on with reasonable efficiency. Gray cast iron "anvils" from HF are ASOs. But something that doesn't have a horn, a heel, or a hardy hole--i.e., doesn't look like a modern European/American anvil--can still be a real anvil. Lots of ancient metalwork was forged on heavy square and rectangular blocks of iron and steel. Those are anvils.
Every smith *does* need an anvil...but an anvil doesn't have to look like a Peter Wright or a Refflinghaus.
i was about to say something about anvils being at harbour freight too lol. got a 15 poound anvil today for 20 dollars
matthbva sounds like you hang out on Iforgeiron.com. If not, you sure should because you are like-minded with that crew.
Lou L I used to. I have been away from smithing for a while. I'm just getting back to it.
Several years ago Harbor Freight actually sold a Russian made anvil that was really not bad, I bought 6 of them to help people get started. I think at the time they were $50 or $75 USD, I wish I had bought 100 of them as they were perfect for somebody getting started or someone that is just doing this for hobby.
Spear Brave yeah, I remember being very excited when I read about those anvils. Then I went to my local HF and discovered that now they only sell shitty Chinese cast iron. I was too late to the game.
I plan on winning the lottery tonight so I can buy an anvil-shape anvil. I can't wait! If not, one could also use the head of a sledge hammer.
Damn I'm glad I saw this. I'm trying to get started with some knife making and I've been looking for an anvil or track for about 2 months. There's a ton of machine shops around here as well as scrap yards. I've got my work cut out for me this Saturday
Loved this video, years ago when blacksmithing was still a dream I bought a piece of railroad iron at a farm auction for under $10. It’s about 3 feet long and someone had shaped a point on one end. The unique thing is the point is on the flat side so I welded tripod legs on it and have been pounding on it ever since. In essence it is a railroad iron turned upside down with the flat broad surface up. Likely not as hard as the wearing surface but very functional.
A big brick of steel like you have there will definitely serve you better than a cheap cast iron ASO from Horrible Freight.
The HF anvil is actually great for working brass and other soft metals because it doesn't ring even if you don't attach it properly.
Im need to build a forge, my 8 year old really got into blacksmithing, so far using old bitup anvil and simple torch of oxygen and acetylene tanks, i need to improve thinks for him, first is forge. Looking for instructions, accurate and effective, no Ferrari needed here. Thank you
In my setup at home I use a small brakedrum forge. (I'd recommend a drum from a truck not a car. Trucks are bigger. learned that the hard way.) Go to your local mechanic, and see if they have some on their scrap pile. I got mine for free. Had a friend of mine weld some square tubing on to it to create an ash chute and blow pipe, and had him fill in the holes that were in the bottom. I use lump charcoal as fuel, but if you can get your hands on proper coal its much more efficient.
All in all, it works pretty decently. However, if you look around on youtube there are definitely better designs out there, that take a little more work to put together.
Hope my advice helps, bear in mind i'm pretty new to this myself.
and as for an anvil, honestly i'd recommend make a post/stump anvil. That's what I'm going to be using in my setup
Remember when running on material/coke fuels(coal, charcoal, etc...) you need to either A. Keep it WELL insulated or B. Do it outside. Seeing as the child listed above is using a torch that’s fine but eventually he’s gonna want to have control over the heat of his forge for specific metal work such as creating Damascus Steel, bonding separate raw elements such as nickel and basic steel should he not be able to get his hands on 15N20. In order of stuff I would get if I was first starting out would be....
1. A decent rounding hammer/flat. Cheap, nothing special but immeasurably useful.
2. A cheap slab of steel, and I’d just mount or even just set it on a decently sized stump for proper height.
3. A better forge. There’s a lot of forge designs out there, I’m a coal kinda guy but there’s a lot out there for real cheap material. Some I’ve seen just involve basic brick and a casing. That simple.
A little late but if you have anymore questions, let me know.
An 8 year old with a torch hammer and red hot metal? Why not? What could possibly go wrong??
Thank you for the tips, I started doing leather work a year ago, have always loved knives, now I'd like to embark upon knife smithing, this will help me get going.
I think its great to see so many people getting back into making things this way,
Different continent different story.Here in Eastern Europe people sell large anvils for 150-200€ ,i have seen railroad tracks in the junkyard for scrap price of 0.80$,
People here dont make knifes,blacksmithing is something that people are not interested,maybe couple of people do it for hobby,there is no way to earn money from it as far as i know.
Probably only horseshoeing in your part of the world. I have relatives in Finland and when they visited the states I was told that the only commercial blacksmithing was farriers.
Are railroad brackets a good alternative
Do you mean a tie plate
@@emmittberg8001 sounds like what he means. The chunk of steel that ties two pieces if track together.
I've seen it cut in half, then welded together (angled sides together). And used as an anvil.
That is such great advice! As you have shown one can even learn to love an ugly chunk of steel if it is heavy enough, flat enough and tough enough!
Awesome ideas on the plate or shaft steel. BTW, saw you are serving as a Judge on "Master of Arms", that's pretty cool. Loved the "Battle ax flint lock gun combo".
What about someone that isnt a beginner and isnt looking to pay craigslist prices. I want something thats actually a GOOD thing to work on. I currently have a ton of railroad track that i dont use, a harbor freight cast iron "anvil" and what im using right now; a 75 pound steel anvil thats pretty old and it dents easily. I think its had a soft plate welded to the top because its almost as soft as the cast iron.
I have around 35 or more Anvils in my barn. I think one day I may sell them.
No way. What kind of anvils? What sizes? Words cannot describe how much I want to see your barn.
Isaiah Streblow yeah. I hear that all the time.
Pics or it's just bs
forkliftwizard I don't have a phone or computer so I can't take any photos
Will Ellison how the hell are you on CZcams then?
Best anvil-oriented advice I've seen on CZcams. Many thnx
I probably already commented this on this same video before. If you find a shop that works on industrial or agriculture heavy equipment you can probably work out a cash deal with the service manager. The scrap yard is going to give them the scrap price for all their steel(usually less than $0.10 per Lb) that means you can get a lot out of $20.00. if you want to be very extra, get a job there; you might get something like a John Deere 6-series tractor axle for free. Places that maintain forklifts have more tines than they know what to do with. If you can get between a shop and the scrap yard you can save yourself a lot of digging and zero in on the type of scrap you want.
The towers were not sitting in a furnace, most of the jet fuel burnt up on the collision in a ball of fire, it was not a continuous fire or furnace on the metal, the other fires were of furniture, wood etc that don’t burn hot enough. Ok. Yes, the initial impact of jet fuel was high enough to melt steal, but it only lasted a few seconds ok, the metal did not catch fire and keep burning, it wasn’t 2 hours of 1800 degrees, it was a few seconds at that temperature. Not only that, his theory doesn’t explain the thermite residue found by scientists conducting their own investigation. Military grade thermite
Don't you need to be writing some anti Ukraine propaganda?
MIT estimates they burnt for 10 min not “a few seconds”. Check out their paper.
@@purgatoryironworks you're hopeless
Hey let's put 1/2" pig iron rod stock in a blast furnace for 20 minutes and pretend that is the same as ASTM rated structural steel, (heated only by atomized kerosene and office furniture) - box columns w. 1" thickness and 3' OD,, all cross-connected and welded. 🙉. No wonder you turned the comments off... 😉.
Awesome information Trent, thank you. Machine shop and scrap yards, here I come.
Thanks man. This was very helpful. I certainly don't have a lot of money and I need to get a forge up and running. I am excited to start learning.
I see you disabled comments on your jet fuel video, lol. Did too many people explain to you that the majority of the jet fuel would have been destroyed in the initial fireball?
Or did the structural engineers explain that these 3 structures would never have collapsed the way that they did with zero resistance from the lower floors.
As I recall there are around 1000 men and women with way more letters after their names than I have ever seen who say that there is no way that these 3 structures collapsed from a jet fuel fire. But hey what do they know right.
Too many morons that had to write a book for a response....
Less than 0.1% of engineers in the world signed that letter and agree with you. 99.9% engineers easily prove they’re and you’re wrong. There are many explanations, pages and videos explaining WHY you’re wrong. Why do you ignore them? Hmm, probably cuz they don’t conform to your conspiracy narrative.
@@strnglhld Because they didn't sign a letter that doesn't mean they disagree it means they didn't sign a letter
@@purgatoryironworks lol you mean too many facts that you looked over in your emotional posting?
@@bigmike9333 That you don't know what the word "fact" means? Means only that.
You are creating quite a straw man because the fires weren’t even 1500 degrees as most of the jet fuel burned off on impact leaving office fires in a steel superstructure designed to withstand office fires…You actually proved the vertical structural integrity by pounding the steel down with a heavy force and it stayed together…Had any columns bent gravity would have brought them down in the direction they were tilting NOT straight down in a free fall collapsing into their own footprint…This doesn’t even address building 7 that wasn’t hit by any jets and had minor sporadic fires in a building that was newer and better designed to withstand collapse
Of course, Machine Shops! I've been scratching my head for a good place to get an "Alternative Anvil". Scrapyards are few and far between were I am. This was very helpful, thank you!
Well a big thanks to you, bud. Watched your junkyard "anvil" search. Went out to my local shipyard. Manager there knew my dad and GAVE me a 1' wide x 2' long x 4" thick hunk of rusted steel laying on the ground. Forklifted it into my Jeep and rode SLOW all the way home. American Steel, a big supplier over here in Corpus Christi had piece in their drop section 2/3 of that size and wanted almost $400 for it. SCORE! The metal I FOUND is worth at least $500. Thanks for the inspiration, dude! Now for a forge.
From a beginner, you sir, are a godsend, liked and subbed, thank you very much.
Great advice....a big barrier to any craft is expense and or scarcity of tools.
This has to be the best and smartest advice I've gotten from any video I've watched..You are awesome!!!
Thank you, sir!
This guy in the video hit the nail on the head!!! Couldn't have been said any better by anybody else!! All that's needed is MASS. 👍
Good advice. Thanks for your knowledge and time.
You are so right got some track and the mass is greater than the sledge head I used prior. The track moves metal soo much easier. Can't wait to upgrade again!
That is some great advice! I never would have thought of something like that. I figured I’d have to go to harbor freight and get a small beginner anvil.
Another option is a fork froma forklift. I am fortunate that I work in a rental yard. We had a customer bond a fork. It worked out great for me and a buddy. Not only is it heavy there is plenty of it. Plus it's hardened steel
It was great to meet you today. Thanks for taking the time to show me around the shop.
Yessir, thank you for dropping by
this was super helpful, my dad works in construction, and he has some hunks of mild steel like this sometimes lying around.
I’m thinking of picking up blacksmithing as a hobby and I never considered this option. Glad I came across this video. Subbed.
I'm just starting out and I appreciate the advice
The phrase "ASO" was originally minted on the junkyard forum for cast iron "anvils" that broke and generally turned to scrap as soon as you started pounding it.
Im not an ironworker but i do cut and pound metal from time to time. I appreciate your effort to keep people from trying to pilfer from the railroad. Also i have several pieces of metal that i use as an anvil and they work for my purpose. A chunk of metal doesn't have to be shined and mounted to something to be effective.
Thanks for the clear and great info in this video!
Thank's for the Head's up Buddy.. I'm just getting started & your advice I greatly appreciate !
Appreciate you folks stopping by
I was remodeling my first house and we pulled out all the lath and “farmer’s skim” plaster. I found a long length of rail used as a header of a large doorway. I’m sure it’s still there. Pretty versatile material.
You actually gave good info and I appreciate your honesty. Awesome
You sound surprised.....
@@purgatoryironworks Unfortunately there is no schools that teaches us about real life and tools etc so. The only teachers is experience and You Tube :D
The only helpful person while I looked this stuff up.. Just thank you so much.
I subscribed because of this knowledgeable guys no nonsense, straight up explanation. Thanks
Lots of great advice. Thanks mate.
You sir are a genius! And as somebody who is literally trying to find the stuff to make a small coal forge and try to make my 1st rebar knife this is very helpful!
Rebar is terrible for a working knife. Its "unknown" metal... Mainly a soft steel. Unless you know how to add the carbon to it, it'll not hold a decent edge... No matter how nice you make it.
With me saying that, I too have a wood/coal forge I made out of a brake rotor (brake drum would be better in my opinion)... And am using a hunk of rebar to practice on. Doing so I sunk the 2# sledge head I was using as an anvil into the tree trunk I had dug out a hole to hold it in. Sunk it flat. Took me a good 30 minutes to dig it back out. Absolutely no power tools. (Other than an angle grinder and a blower motor from an air mattress).
Great, direct, plain-spoken advice. Subscribed.
The local steel supplier in my town sells drops for reasonable prices too. I've seen 4" plate there as well. I hadn't thought of a machine shop. Great tip.
Smashing advice, thank you!
Great advice thanks.
I got a meter length of railroad track which works super, as well as an old Ox-wagon axle, which has the tapered round ends where the wheels fitted on. The latter i found in the veld in the mountains above the little village where i live, and it was used as a post for a fence or something. The concrete did a bit of a corrosive job on the one end, but the other end is sweet to make smaller round things on, and the whole thing is pretty solid, a 2 man job to pick it up.
I'm a Tool & Die Machinist who has started looking into Blacksmithing. I can get a "scrap pass" at work for a big hunka chunka high carbon steel that some Engineer screwed up. With a little "off the clock" work I can use your idea to make a nice little work piece. What an awesome awesome awesome beginner's tip. Thanks for the great video!!!
people always must have the same exact thing or they cannot move forward. i have experienced this with nostalgic razors, and bronze Weber grills. good for you, i am subscribing because you are bold.
thank you very much bud i didint thought about that and machine shopis just down the road, saved me alot of money :) and still does the job
Fork lift/ fork truck forks are great for this kind of work. I got a pair for $60.00 & you can cut then up & weld them together.
As a small anvil or basis for a anvil.
Man, thank you! Great advice.
On cattle stations (ranches) in northern Australia,
50 years ago we used true anvils,
railway line anvils and old steel wagon axles
to shape our horse shoes on
I totally agree. Any proper surface will work wonders for someone just getting started, and once you get bit by the bug, it will help you make hundreds of projects to sell that donate towards a real anvil. Thanks!
Holy hell. As a barely about to be 18 year old who's been trying to do forging and metal work since he was 15 I have to say that this information is priceless to me. Thank you sir, you've done me a service and I truly appreciate it.
I picked up a 16 inch piece of track, believe it or not, at a scrap yard. It weighs about 60 or 65 pounds. I took a grinder and ground the crown of off about 14 inches of it. I used a combination square to insure I was creating a square edge. I kept the crown on the last two inches just in case I needed it. I drilled 3/4 inch holes in the bottom flange and mounted it to a 30 inch long piece of Oak log that I found on the river bank.
Excellent rebound, pretty mobile, and it doesn't take up a lot of space in my garage.
I made my forge out of an old Kenworth semi truck rear brake drum that I picked up at a shop for $50.
I have been somewhat looking for an anvil for a couple years now. I see them at auctions for over $500. I watched a Peter Wright go for over $1000 about two weeks ago. The edges were all chipped up and it had more rust on it than my car. What I have works just fine and I think I will stay with it for quite a while.
this just saved me a ridiculous amount of money. thanks!