How Does Your Seed Phrase Work?
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- čas přidán 7. 07. 2024
- What do you know about your seed phrase, except that it is to be shared with NO ONE? Kyle Thornton, our US & LATAM Regional Head of Customer Success, walks you through what exactly is your seed phrase, and how to make sure it is secure - so that your crypto assets remain… yours.
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Very interesting, I think every crypto investor should have this knowledge at a minimum.
I'm almost a year in crypto and the way this works is new to me.
I knew all about private and public keys and about the odds involved but that a seed phrase is the key to generate adresses and there private keys is neww to me, great explaination!
Yes this is foundational
Finally... I understand!
I was always confused, how can a seed phrase that is generated in the initial phase recover accounts that are created later? It never made sense to me until seeing your video!
Yes... Love this. Big thanks!
That's awesome to hear that you now finally understand what's going on here! Let us know what else you might have questions on, and we'll put that in a backlog to address it!
I literally thought the seed phrase unlocked keys stored on Ledger servers or something. I really appreciate the explanation.
Thanks for your contribution to the crypto community. I still have many questions, but this video gives me the initial info for me to map out my security behavior journey.
It’s people like you that make the world a better place!
Awesome video. I loved the detailed explanations!
Excellent video with concise explanations. Thank you!
This video is very informative and Kyle is soo kind !!
Thanks, helped a lot
Ledger is the best
Huge kudos to the people who came up with the idea (and implementation) of the heuristically determined wallet - over the previous JBoK ("Just a Bunch of Keys") wallet that we had at the beginning...
Thanks for your sharing !
Great information!
So helpful thank you!
Thanks this really helped me understand how it all works
Excellent knowledge sir
Super helpful! Thank you Kyle.
Thanks for tuning in!
Thanks, man! Nice vid
I think i finally understood how all of this works. Thanky you Kyle and team for bringing this awesome series to youtube. Since i purchased my ledger i can finally sleep at night. I was always worried about leaving coins on an exchange or even a hot wallet.
Nice! Glad that we were able to help!
Great explanation of the seed phrase concept! Thank you!
Super helpful
Thanks!
huge thanks for explaining this topic, helped me a lot
Happy to help!
Brilliant explanation, really helped me. Thanks very much.
Always here to help ✨
thanks for this explanation, hard to find a technical explanation
This video is very informative. I have a question. This might be a stupid question, but I really want to know the answer to it. When we buy a trezor or ledger hard wallet. How do we know those companies don’t know the seed phrases. Because their device was the one that generated my seed phrase or private key. So how do I know they don’t have my seed phrase?
I had that thought also when I got a ledger lol. My thinking is that it would be a very elaborate scam to set up a company, create a device that needs lots of investment into plus all the rest of the investments needed to start a company. While for the device to make a legitimate seed phrase is easy .
This was amazing, i was so confused on how the account creation/generation actually worked on chain.. perfect explanation, thank you!
Happy we could help!
Hi Dean - Ledger NEVER stores your private key on either the Ledger Live app or anything on your phone or computer. Your private key only lives on your Nanos and within your 24-words (written down by you). The reason why the Ledger Live app can show your account balance is because the app reads the public address and therefore gives you the account balance for the moment.
@@Ledger Exactly what I thought! Just wanted to make sure. Your support is amazing! Even in the youtube comments. I stand by and recommend your product!! Thanks again.
You are very welcome, Dean! Glad that you appreciate what we do - please let us know if you have anything else we can help you with either here or via our support page: support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/categories/4404369571601-Support?support=true
I have always wondered how the seed phrase protects against the credential and makes ones crypto’s investment safer
Im a little confused on how ledger live reads the public key or address without compromising the safety of the private key. Ledger live shows my account balance without having my ledger connected so it is storing the address and public key correct? But ledger live never stores the private key right? So the only way to send a transaction out of the ledger live would be if the ledger device is connected right? I just want to make sure that ledger live is only storing the public key and address and not the private. Thanks
Awesome
So is 24 words seed has1,45E+76 possible combinations?
Great information! I have some questions. What is keeping a computer from randomly trying sets of words and seeing if there is money on those accounts and then draining? Also, am I able to just pick a bunch of words that I like and whatever random ordermake my own scene phrase?
but hypothetically, service that generates seed phrase can save it and it maybe compromated
Hello, your Ledger device randomly generates a 24-word recovery phrase based on the BIP39 standard (more information here: en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Seed_phrase) which is the same for all crypto wallets. Ledger does not have access to any user’s 24-word recovery phrases. Users must take all necessary steps to ensure that their PIN code and their 24-word recovery phrase remain confidential and are stored in a secure location, offline and away from prying eyes.
👌🏻
you know what doesnt make sense to me? You’re saying that metamask stores seed phrases in chrome cache, but how comes that if I buy a new ledger I can recover my account with a “cold” stored seed phrase from another ledger device. I dont get it, I can just assume that ledger stores the seed phrase locally and when it connects to the internet it stores it somewhere on your private servers
Hi. That's not how a Ledger device works. Your seed phrase is generated on stored on the secure element chip of your Ledger device. Ledger has no access to your seed phrase, private keys or account information. Your device just runs the function outlined in the BIP39 standard. This is also why if Ledger were to disappear, you would still have access to your funds via your 24-word recovery phrase.
More info here 👇🏻
www.ledger.com/academy/what-if-ledger-goes-out-of-business
When you first setup the ledger does the phrase appear on the phone/computer screen or only on the ledger device screen? I assume if it does appear on your computer then that could be recorded by spyware and you'd never know?
Hi there, it only appears on your Ledger device:)
Thsnks for the great explanation, i definitely understand how a seed phrase works in a more concise way ❤ A question though I know that a ledger and trezer are the best way to store your crypto but are there other ways to safely do so wothout using one ?
@kylethornton8660 great answer, thanks 😊
Thanks. That's very informative. Does it mean if your seed phrase of Ledger has been exposed you have no choice but to transfer it to another new Ledger device? you can't even reset your seed phrase because it's attached to your ADDRESS.
Hi there! You can access your device with your pin and reset your seed phrase. Here is a how-to: support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/4404382075537-Don-t-have-your-Recovery-phrase-?support=true
Anyone knows what the video about the probability of clash?
how does it not randomly create a seed phrase another Ledger already created in the past?
Your wallet phrase
So let’s say I have a crypto in metamask that is not supported by ledger. What would happen if regenerate the wallet on my ledger (yes I know it is bad). Would the crypto show up? If you find a seed phrase how would you know I’d it monero vs Bitcoin to know where to regenerate?
Hello, Even if you import your Metamask wallet to Ledger, your tokens will not be visible since they are not supported by the Ledger Live app which is a visual interface. There is no automated process that can tell you what addresses of your Ledger are on which blockchains hold tokens.
Great and very helpful video!
So one "seed phrase" lets us get access to all the accounts on different blockchains and tokens?
Can we generate a new seed phrase i mean different seed phrase in the same device? to make sure that the device dont have given seed phrase .and is there any sign that if our seed phrase used by more than 1 devices? Or let say i have 2 devices with the same seed phrase one primary and another is recovery.
If I create a recovery phrase on my ledger... then lost my device. I can still access to my cryptos (private keys) using the recovery phrase. Thus, someone stores which recovery phrase refers to what private keys. Who stores this information ? Or is there something I misunderstood ?
Hi, your 24 words recovery phrase is the master key to all your accounts. Your private and public keys are mathematically derived from your recovery phrase according to a standard derivation protocol. So you only need to secure and store your 24 words to gain access to your accounts on a new Ledger device.
More info here 👇🏻
www.ledger.com/academy/crypto/what-is-a-recovery-phrase
Thank you sir. I have 12 pharse how to show work: access settle early spread soup charge broom finger segment order seven health
How can a seed phrase be invalid? Does it mean that the corresponding private key just doesnt control any funds?
Hey, sincere apologies for the delayed response, If your recovery phrase is not valid, it means its incorrect:
1. Make sure the correct recovery phrase length is selected. Always enter all words of a recovery phrase (12, 18, or 24 words)
2. Verify that the order of the words entered on the device matches the order written on your Recovery sheet.
3. Check that all the words of your recovery phrase belong to the BIP39 word list.
If your device still tells you that the recovery phrase is invalid, this means that you have not correctly written down your recovery phrase. Your 24-word recovery phrase is your only back-up in case you lose access to your funds. If after multiple attempts you are still unable to restore your setup, unfortunately, this means that the recovery phrase is incorrect. This is also explained in this article: support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/4404382560913-Restore-from-recovery-phrase?support=true
The 24-word recovery phrase is only displayed once during the setup process. You are the only one to have ever seen it.
We hope this better clarifies!
is it possible to change your privet key if you believe it was compromised?
Hi - private keys and seed phrases cannot be changed once they're set up. If you believe your seed phrase has been compromised, the best thing to do is to set up a new wallet with a new seed phrase, and send your assets to the new wallet.
Is seed phrase same as security key code when you enable 2FA
Seed phrase is the master key to all your accounts on the blockchain. It is very important to keep it offline and never share it with anyone. For more information refer to our article here👇🏻
www.ledger.com/academy/crypto/what-is-a-recovery-phrase
What if trust wallet store your seed phrase privately without my knowledge
Is it possible to store your firstly ganrated private mnemonic seeds
Hey. I’m going to keep 12 words offline on a paper in multiple places, and the other words encrypted on an offline computer that will always be offline (raspberry pi with new sdcard that I will not reuse ever). The encryption key would be 40 long password made by random numbers, letters that I will never forget as it’s a combination of other passwords I use every day. Encrypted partial seed phrase I would store on multiple offline flash drive devices in multiple places. Do you see any flaws in this design?
The problem I have with just writing down the seed phrase is that I can’t be sure no one will find it, for example when I move to another place and lose that piece of paper. Or house gets searched by the police etc. This way only half of the seed phrase would be exposed, and it’s not enough to steal my money.
why do I get the error "Invalid mnemonic" if make my own seed from the BIP39 Wordlist?
So it only generates words from the seed, so choosing the words randomly we can't generate a seed?
When we start a new ledger, what guarantees us that a seed was generated randomly and not previously programmed?
Hey, to clarify, our Ledger Hardware wallets are designed to choose your 24-word recovery phrase for you. These are generated randomly with a huge number of possibilities, making it virtually impossible for any two people to have the same recovery phrase.
Our True Random Number Generator has the highest certificates possible when it comes down to the quality of randomness - you can read more about this here:
support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360010073520-Quality-of-randomness
It is totally possible that you might receive the same words in your 24 word combination.
However, we highly suggest that you give it your time (30 minutes recommended) to go through your words slowly while writing them and and placing them in their correct positions to avoid any mistakes.
- Please keep your 24 words out of any online activity
- Never share them with anyone but yourself
- Ledger will never ask you for your recovery phrase
- Keep it in a safe place and away from any possible damage.
- You can learn more about it here: www.ledger.com/academy/crypto/what-is-a-recovery-phrase
Let us know if there is anything else we can assist you with!
@@Ledger thank you for the explanation
No problem - glad that we could help!
I see word Dad as a word from seed phrase, and people are talking you only need first 4 letters of a phrase. what about when a word has 3 letters?
Questing ?? Is the 24 recovery phrase case sensitive ?
Nope, all you need to do is enter the correct words in the correct order.
Kyle I have a problem. I have a new genuine nano s plus. I have a coinbase pro account. Once I fire up the nano and it successfully gives me the correct address, I then go to CBP and paste the address in. it takes it ok, but as soon as I try and put a BTC amount to withdrawal the address goes blank. Now if I put the amount first and then address it is ok, but will not show fees or give me the blue symbol to withdraw, it gives just a grey withdraw icon. Man I am frustrated
Hey there, from what we read, it seems like an issue from CBP' side
If its possible to open a case with us and provide a screenshot so we can better understand! You could open a case by pressing on the help button and answering the chatbot until you are given a case number support.ledger.com/hc/en-us
Also, this could be an address format, make sure to add a BTC account in your Ledger Live, when doing so, there is an advanced option to choose which address format you want (Legacy, segwit, native segwit, and taproot)
You should choose native segwit as that's what exchanges like coinbase use!
We hope this better clarifies and remain available
@@Ledger can i video the issue and send the ledger people the video link.
Hello, could you please hit the “Help” button on the bottom right of our page to contact us directly, so support team can better assist you in resolving your issue? support.ledger.com/hc/en-us
Does my computer read my ledger as i am entering my seed phrase on the ledger to recover my account... this got me worried because my computer was online as i was entering the seed phrase on my ledger
I would like to understand the mathematics behind how a single 24 word seed gives rise to everything else. For example, how do we derive the public and private keypair for a wallet, and how do we derive an address? Can a single address be controlled by different private keys owned by different people? Specifically, different bits of coin associated with that address are encrypted by two different owners. And we're not limited to a single address either... how are we able to derive the entire sequence of addresses and how many are in the sequence? Do they all have the same private key or does each get a unique private key? How are the public and private keys actually used? How are these calculations different across the different coin and token types?
Hey, to simply clarify, our Ledger Hardware wallets are designed to choose your 24-word recovery phrase for you. These are generated randomly with a huge number of possibilities, making it virtually impossible for any two people to have the same recovery phrase.
Our True Random Number Generator has the highest certificates possible when it comes down to the quality of randomness - you can read more about this here:
support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360010073520-Quality-of-randomness
It is totally possible that you might receive the same words in your 24 word combination.
However, we highly suggest that you give it your time (30 minutes recommended) to go through your words slowly while writing them and placing them in their correct positions to avoid any mistakes.
- Please keep your 24 words out of any online activity
- Never share them with anyone but yourself
- Ledger will never ask you for your recovery phrase
- Keep it in a safe place and away from any possible damage.
- You can learn more about it here: www.ledger.com/academy/crypto/what-is-a-recovery-phrase
Should you prefer, you can use an additional 25th word of your own choosing on top of your recovery phrase. This is known as the passphrase, which is an advanced security feature. You can read more about it here:
www.ledger.com/academy/passphrase-an-advanced-security-feature
We hope this helps!
@@Ledger What a dooshbag. I asked technical questions and your going to use my post to advertise your product instead? How about you answer my fking questions.
say you used your ledger seed phrase in Keplr wallet, only for a few minutes, then delete it - would you say the seed phrase and its associated crypto is safe? given that the computer/internet was not monitored when it was written in and it was only written into the right slot
Hi, Once the 24 words recovery phrase has been exposed online there is always a chance that your funds are at risk. Never put your Ledger 24-word recovery phrase into any third party wallet. This would compromise your phrase.
@@Ledger if nobody got it while it was online, then it should be safe. because it is no longer available to hackers after it was deleted
Hi, Even if you have deleted your recovery phrase from Keplr its not 100% guarantee that it was not compromised. Your recovery phrase should be only entered on your Ledger device not on any online platform.
I’m in need of some help with my nano x how can I get help from you?
God.. Blockchain is a beautiful thing
Will ledger live ask for your seedphrase?
Nope, never! No one from Ledger will ever ask for your seed phrase, so remember to never share it with anyone!
@@Ledger what private info do you have to type into ledger live to get it to sync with your wallet?
What is I browse a lot on my pc, and I have some mining software, is it easy for my seed to be stolen?
Should I reset my ledger Nano X and use it on clean PCs from now on, that would take some work, I need to transfer my funds from ledger live to the exchange and vice versa. :)
Hey there, your seed is never online or in digital form unless you digitize it (which we strongly recommend to avoid)
Also, please note that LEdger devices are not suitable for mining proceeds! You can learn more about this here! support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360018969814-Receive-mining-proceeds?docs=true
Let us know if you have any further questions ^^
Regarding your battery, we are sorry to hear that. Could you please hit the “Help” button on the bottom right of our page to contact us directly, and share the ticket number with us, so we can assist you in resolving your issue? support.ledger.com/hc/en-us
@@Ledger I got a software update and now runs fine, thank you.
Only first wallet gives us seed and secondary gives only secret key
But if we use the mnemonic site we can find additional secret(private) key?
So, what if I take a random number that is as long as someone's real recovery number, and I "recover" someone's ledger? I wouldn't know who's is it, but it is someone's ledger, no? Now, maybe that number doesn't exist, but if I keep trying randomly I will manage to create someone's cryptographic key, and it may not have many coins, but it may have many coins. I don't see how is this protecting us. Sure, no one can guess your particular set of numbers (phrases) but it is someone's number.
Hey there - with a 24 word seed phrase, there are an almost unfathomable number of potential combinations. A 12 word seed phrase has around 340,282,366,920,938,463,463,374,607,431,768,211,456 potential combinations, so you can imagine what that number would be for a 24 word phrase! In short, given the number of potential seed phrases vs the number of people using a crypto wallet (and indeed, the number of people in the world), anyone who tries this is MUCH more likely to hit an empty address than one that someone is actually using. This is why scammers tends to use hacks and social engineering to attempt to get someone to give up their seed phrase, rather than randomly guessing them!
@@Ledger So, basically what you are saying is that the sheer number of combinations far outnumbers the number of used combinations, by a huge number... Would this change over time? I mean, if we are talking about Bitcoin and the number of addresses, this may be some small number like a couple of hundred thousand... but if other wallets are using the BIP39 standard, and there are hundreds of coins, some of which use way more addresses than BTC, in time I am assuming the number of these addresses will grow. I am at a loss here a bit... It would be great if you could explain all this in one video, the math behind all this.
Yes, you're correct. The number of unique BIP39-word combinations is finite while users generate new recovery phrases every day.
However, this is not an issue as long as your hardware device can generate secure randomness. Having secure randomness guarantees you'll never experience a collision and end up with the same recovery phrase as another user.
Our devices come equipped with a secure element that's able to generate very secure randomness, effectively protecting you against collision and assuring that your recovery phrase is and will stay unique.
You can learn more about how we generate randomness here:
support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360010073520-Quality-of-randomness?docs=true
Hope this answers your question!
"seed phrase" then "recovery phrase" no idea if these are the same or different.
Hi - in this context, both are referring to the 24 words!
When are you updating prices for all coins?
Say I generated the phrase, then bought 2 bitcoins. Then lost my device, bought a new device. Punched in pass phrase. Then How does Ledger know I have 2 bitcoins, if pass phrase only works on the device and not on your servers?
That's a good question, but this is blockchain 101. Essentially, your private keys (not your bitcoins) are stored on your Ledger. Once you have your private keys recovered in another Ledger, you have a copy of that same set of private keys, which give you access to your assets on chain. This article might help: www.ledger.com/academy/basic-basics/owning-and-using-it/what-is-a-private-key
Wallet address, not “account”
So why was that seed phrase not a valid one? Its a bit concerning, isnt it? I was under the impression that there were 2024^24 possible permutations of seeds, but in truth there is only a subset that are possible. That potentially narrows down the search for valid seeds by a hacker brute forcing this. What rules are imposed on the seed phrase that we dont know about?
Not really concerning, the subset must still be a giant giant number, no computation power can brute force it in hundreds of years probably. If there was any issues with BIP-39's security it would not have become the standard.
How did people log into their Bitcoin wallets in 2010?
I need help. I had a recovery with my 12words and I can only see my xrp coins and money my other coins is still 0$ help pls
Drop your seed phrase for help
Let’s grab a random generator to scan all the seed addresses and take the coins. Let’s get some NVidia cards and in time, I’m sure we could find someone’s wallet.
Ithink recovery frase will no be useful for life... Only this decade. With power of quantum computing you can crack this 128 bit numbers
nice