Surfboard Foam Testing - What Type of Foam to Use
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- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- In this video see a comparison between the two main types of surfboard foam for the backyard shaper. The two foams: EPS and XPS were fiberglassed and then checked to see how well the glass stuck to the foams.
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I know this is an old video but re-stumbled on it after making a couple of xps foil boards. Regarding the bond strength on XPS I found that the strength was greatly improved by heavily texturing the surface. I used 40 grit sandpaper to really rough the surface up. I also spoke to someone who closely spaced hobby knife blades to put texture on the board. Because XPS and EPS are the same chemical compound I'm guessing that it is only the mechanical bond that is different not the PS - expoxy bond. Texturing the surface goes some way to simulating the pore spaces in the EPS that are created when the source PS beads are heated to make the foam blocks.
Matthew Ma check this out, all the tiny cuts in the foam fill with resin. I’ll be using vacuum on the foil board. czcams.com/video/naiVGYUolmE/video.html
RobSAtlanta that video is completely unrelated. Nothing in it about roughing up the surface and none of the foams there are ESP or XPS.
awesome vid. what helped when I used xps was using a carpet furring strip with nails and pressed it on my blank after rough sand and it helped huge with epoxy adhesion.
I've considered using a spiked carpet roller to achieve a similar effect. The funny thing is the first test strip I did was really resistant to delamination, so I wonder if there are other ways of improving the adhesion than just poking holes in it (e.g. temperature). It was definitely hotter in Texas than it's been in Wisconsin, and I wonder if that has had an effect.
Hey bro, excellent channel. I have no idea how I ran into it. Since I have been looking to build an XPS Kayak for my channel, I guess CZcams decided to hook us up. So, I have a bit of boat-building experience, and I have made many carbon pieces from my race cars, boats, and bikes. If I may make some recommendations, first, I know you like that epoxy, but I strongly suggest giving Alumilite a try! Second, if you want excellent adhesion to the substrate with minimum or no delamination, you need to start by wetting the substrate first, applying the glass mat, then more epoxy! And if you want TRUE professional results, you may need to bag the board! There is a company that sells supplies in the UK called *Easy Composites Ltd* with some pretty good videos. The videos are focused primarily on selling products, but the techniques are on point. Or I least the way I was taught! Also using a fiberglass laminating roller before the squeegee will tremendously improve adhesion to the substrate...
Painting the board in either case is probably not a good idea because it actually creates a separator between the epoxy and foam boards. So technically it is a test of the paint adhesion and not epoxy adhesion.
Here in EU you get 25cm / 10“ EPS in surplus stores / home depot / Bauhaus.
It is used in heat insulation for our house walls.
Stay psyched and stay safe everyone.
May God bless you all🙏🏼🙏🏼🤙🏼
XPS looks like a no go. I wonder what that test would do on EPS > Epoxy, PU > epoxy and PU > polyester resin (and wood etc...)?
I know it is a pain putting glass onto epoxied foam, but lamination sticks a lot better when you pre-epoxy the foam and then put the first glass layer ontop. Thats the way it is done on sailboat builds.
Great video. I really like how thorough you are on the differences. I have a couple other products I want to test instead of paint to improve the bond from the glass to the xps. Maybe I will do a similar video on my channel comparing those. I just love how ridged and light the xps is so I want to find something that will improve that bond.
Great info on XPS and Styro - epoxy bonding. Enjoyed watching your videos! Keep it up!
No experience but had a thought. What if you had a roller simular to the ones used to get air out of layup only very small sikes of some sort to "texture" the foam pre- layup? The goal would be to allow resin to be pushed into the "pores" created providing more surface area to grip.
well presented excellent content , very useful information great channel for building boards.
Amazing vid! But quick question, where do u order your EPS foam from. I shape board with low density and it leaves many little holes that I have to fill with spakling.
Don't use spackle. Seal with epoxy and glass microspheres (or microballoons as so many seem to call them for some reason). Spackle is almost as good as worthless.
I was wondering if there is a reason that you have never seemed to consider Polyurethane Blanks and polyester resin?
No expert here, but polurethane foam is generally harder to work with I believe. For instance, it cannot be hot wired. Other than that, its the resin is cheaper and much the same to work with. Perhaps he just prefers the epoxy+eps/xps boards as they are supposed to be more rigid/less flex and float slightly better (~12%).
Great comparison, thank you!
What kind of Fiberglass do you use? Did you try Polyurethane Foam?
Fantastic video! i look forward to seeing the XPS build. I do think that it would have been a more fair test to use the same paint on both foams. Do you normally seal your EPS before glassing? if so that would have been worth doing as a test too as it may have affected the adhesion of the glass.
Finally i wonder if you made the XPS really rough it would have a better bond? Its scary how easily the glass peeled away.
I really enjoy watching your channel. All the best
Good point about the paint, probably not a huge difference but it would have been good to use the same,. I usually seal my EPS with a sealer and I'm sure it does make a small difference. I have actually tried really roughing it up before but it ends up not looking very good and using more resin to fill in the little voids with minimal affect on adhesion but that's anecdotal.
@@AndrewWorkshop what is the sealer that you use?
What does happen to eps boards without a vent? Does it blow up like a baloon in heat?
I have the same question; a lot of (Factory) Eps/Epoxy boards are not vented btw?
I will have your opinion. I'm thinking about building a kayak. In my country the polyester for boats has low cost and epoxy resin has high cost.
So i have only one way using only polyester.
The same we have for foam. EPS has hight cost and EPS has very low cost
My Question
What do you think .
For a kayak 11 feet i can use EPS and polyester or later is destroy?
Any opinion is critical for me, before i starting
Thank you
Nice vidéo séries thanks. Can you give some info on floating in water how you calc7late for 120 kilos and if you can use vacuum infusion with those côté matériels. Thanks again
I picked up some white xps from home Depot today. will let you know how it is.
Great, can't get that color in the Home Depots around me.
What epoxy do you use not to melt the foam
Epoxy resin wont melt eps/xps when used correctly. Polyester resin melts the foam, and thats exactly why they use epoxy. If you let the epoxy pool and then exotherm the yeah, I'm sure it will melt the foam. But just use it correctly and you'll be fine.
hey, very interesting video.
Can you give some additional information on the density or kind of eps you are using?
in my country eps is categorized by its compressive strength (kPa)....with 50kPa being the weakest, and around 200 kPa being the strongest. Is that the case in Canada too? Which would you recommend?
Hmm I think from what I remember the EPS is 1.8 or 2 lbs per cubic foot, Canada is messed up with measurements we use imperial for some measurements and metric for others. Get the densest as possible, less compressive = tougher but there is of course the trade off of more weight. So you could get less dense foam and glass it heavier and still have a great board (lightweight shortboards) but it will off gas a lot more so it will be super important to vent. Not to mention fiberglass and epoxy is probably more expensive than dense foam.
The open cell foam allowed the epoxy to penetrate into the foam better so it held better. The XPS does not allow the epoxy to penetrate as much.
I think if you drilled holes into the foam every inch and allow the epoxy to fill the holes that will stop the delaminating.
Probably better to make up a little thing with spikes in it (like they use to aerate grass) but smaller, perhaps with pins or tacks in it. Would be quicker as you could just stab it around pretty quickly. And it wouldnt remove material, as negligible as it may be. Just my 2c.
XPS was very disappointing.
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