Why Everyone is HATING on Pax Dei
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- čas přidán 24. 06. 2024
- Pax Dei has received a lot of negativity since its early access and I'm going to tell you why I think its not been a smooth Early Access for Pax Dei.
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Pax Dei is a vast, social sandbox MMO inspired by the legends of the medieval era. Here, myths are real, ghosts exist, and magic is unquestioned. In this immense, open-world playground, you choose the role you want to play. - Hry
I think the biggest problem is the price of entry, regardless of what the game may end up being, it's just too much for the very barren and shallow game it is currently. Had they gone in on a $20/35/60 starting point (instead of 40/60/100) for the founder packs, things would probably have looked much better as those prices I feel match what the game offers now much better. The very confusing and weak "You B2P and then pay a sub to keep your plots" is also a mistake.
Also the communication has really not been great, posting big images stating what your game is not (with not in capitals, underlined and bold face) is just not a good look. I get they tried to pre-empt the onslaught of comments in those areas, but it just comes across badly.
Also, it is a simple fact that the majority of MMO players like to go solo or at least tend to play mostly by themselves, even when they are part of a larger group. And the outright aggressive stance the devs take towards these types of players just sets a tone you do not want.
We have seen a whole slew of game which h "have potential" and there is ore on the horizon. And to be frank, you have been at the front of the hype train for a good few of them (both in the past and several yet to come), only to have to create near apologetic videos trying to spin the "bad press" after the fact.
Pax dei is damaged goods now and the devs have mostly themselves to blame. They tried to play the "we are former EVE devs" card and it backfired as they have so far not shown to have the vision or ability even to produce a game to the level where EVE is and remains at.
You investing in the game with the founder packs, helping pay for the development. The game is going to be 40 bucks either way, hell games been 40 bucks for over 20-30 years now, it's the one thing inflation hasn't touched. The only thing you get to keep is the game that is promised is you the exclusive skins and your char slots. It doesn't even promise you get the plots of land.
You still wouldn't be ok if the game was 5 dollars and you had to pay 45 more at release so they might as well charge upfront. The game is going to have a subscription so it might not work for you at all. What is your solution to finance the game without subscription? Over the last 20 years I noticed free to play games are the most expensive.
@@Derzull2468 That is a lot of assumptions.. Let's correct them.
I have a journeyman founder pack, if the game totally bombs, I could not care less.. it's disposable income.
I have backed games for much more money in the past and most of those are either dead or dying.
I have no issue at all with subscriptions as long as I pay something like 50cents/hr and I think people who object to subscriptions really do not understand why subscriptions are not a bad thing.
I have spent money on and have been involved with gaming since the early 80s ..
I'd say your uninformed assumptions would at best be based on what you think you read from my previous comments.
honestly the issue I have from listening to the content creators is you need at least $60 or $100 for this game up front in order to compete for resources. Plus, the resource nodes aren't random right now so that can make things even worse in the game. Plus, the combat isn't that great right now. Honestly, I would invest in $60 if they fixed these glaring issues. Yet again asking $60 instead of $40 at this point isn't great. To me you need content as well in the game but I haven't heard of content right now. Once you add up these glaring issues I agree right now the investment isn't worth $60 to $100 for this game unless I see a roadmap or the devs address these issues. I mean with the content I wish they would say, "well once you organize a village a guild could create a market place for content." Yet how can the content be created for everyone and how can there be a market place for goods? To me too many glaring issues right now. Unless these issues needs to be addressed I am holding out.
This !
They didnt need early access they needed testers.
Being puzzled about the decision of this company to release in such a poor state of content isn't hate, it's bewilderment. They wasted their first impression.
Perhaps the choice was to sell out to a large publisher and lose the vision of Pax Dei, or taking the chance with the community and believe this thing can be made as it was envisioned.
@@jonhelgiorarinsson8574 they arent an indie studio lmao
Why did they do EA in this state?
1. They need players to fill the world, because it is a true sandbox
2. They need the $
@@markgolson633 3. scam
@@markgolson633 if so theyre goin down with it
Undercooked "social MMO" with basically 0 social elements to it, plenty of store assets plopped into an empty map, grindy, a coming subscription system that fucks you over if you own the bigger founder packs...
does not take much to understand why people are not that amazed by it.
Other than grinding for resources to build a small house (if you are solo) or something bigger (if you enjoy being a farm slave for someone else) the game has nothing to offer, every "MMO" that so far told people "players will make the content and fill the world" has failed big time, this one is not different.
It just feels like another The Day before, doubt it will be around in a year.
On point.
Pax's mistake is believing that sandbox means stripping a game from anything and leaving the player without any gameplay features. "You're free to do anything you want". Yeah not really. I'm only able to experience thing within the confines of what the game offers. Here, what are the confines when you get absolutely nothing ?
Social and community-oriented gameplay implies features that promote this aspect. A messaging system to post in-game notices when looking for a craftsman? A pigeon system that would depend on a new profession branch? A guild system to organize these professions, agree on prices, or settle commercial disputes? A hand-crafted central hub with NPCs to create a flow and encourage people to meet in one place? A political election system? A tribunal and crime features?
People expect an ambitious game to offer ambitious mechanics. They expect from a game that goes against the grain, meaning one that promotes cooperation and community where modern games are all about immediate gratification, to offer new and unexpected mechanics. As it stands, the social and community aspect of a clan lives exclusively or almost exclusively thanks to features outside the game, like Discord. You go on Discord to chat, organize your guilds, find a craftsman, create quests and adventures. The game offers nothing to foster this community aspect within itself.
Okay, there's a text chat at least. And they plan on a VOIP. Wow.
The combat system needs to be created from scratch. Right-click to fight and swing your sword is not a "combat system." No directional blocking. No "chamber." No dodging. You can't attack and move at the same time... In short, they have nothing, no direction in which to go.
That, I could forgive. Personally, the combat gameplay of a medieval game is the central element of the gameplay loop that keeps me engaged. But, I could overlook that if the rest was solid enough.
Between the pitch used to describe and sell the game, and the promotion of "experienced Eve developers," Pax Dei is far from the product it could be. It's even far from the product it SHOULD be. Right now, it's just a construction and craftsman simulator for 40 bucks, in Early Access, with promises of being 1.0 in a year.
Sure, right. It will take 2 to 3 years, not at the development pace between the 2023 alpha and this month's Early Access release. They need to pick up the pace.
EVE Online is fairly successful and follows this design. The developers aren’t runofthemill ghost devs. They’re OG EVE developers with an actual vision.
Game will appease to plenty
lol ok you dont go do pois and stuff whatever
This game kind of changes the definition of Early access , this should have a new tag , Early alpha access , a good crafting and building system is about 300 Euros on UE asset store and the environmental assets are all provided for free by epic games and they expect ppl paying 40 euros for this to be happy ?
coming into the game blind (completely forgot about it's existence until i notice it released into early access), i will say, the game has really decent bones. Theres so many areas where they can improve the game and im looking forward to seeing it grow.
of course it has decent bones, most systems are from the asset store like chopping trees, hunting, gathering, all these animations are from the store, buuiilding, placing walls is from the building system that you can get on the asset store as well, nothing is that impressive in that game so far when you know where they got the "bones" of their game.
@@MrImmortal709Yet, there aren't games like it. So while you may buy milk, eggs, and flour from the store instead of harvesting it yourself, it's how you mix them together that determines what you bake.
100% did the same thing. I had heard the name, but never looked into it, but a friend wanted to play with him. I was more than impressed, and glad I gave it a shot, because it's my kind of game. Most people can't handle the grind or the slow burn, but I love it.
No Mans Sky also went from hype to hate, and its now sound and healthy. Only time will tell for Pax Dei.
This game is a straight up fun place holder for me until Light No Fire comes out. There's lots good stuff in Pax Dei I hope Sean Murry takes inspiration from. If LNF releases and it's crafting isn't as in depth as Pax Dei is now in EA everyone(me) is going to be like dude sean I want to bake bread, but not just bread, I want to get the rye stalks, make rye grain, then rye dough, then put some grapes in the dough and bake raisin bread. You can do that in this early access game over here Sean what's up?
The only reason NMS is decent now is because someone came along and bought the dev team. Otherwise, it'd still be the pile of steaming shit it started out as.
@@liamjonasscaleunfortunately I don't think it will be. I am totally looking to LNF as well, but it will want to appeal to the masses, and let's be honest, the masses don't like Pax Dei level of grind and craft complexity. But, maybe they will blow expectations away and we will get lucky! Cooking is always one of my favorite professions in games.
Some people think it's OK for games to be total dog shit when it's in early access. Then there is people like me who thinks it is not OK, and early access should be about helping developers steer content in the right direction. Instead we are nothing but software beta testers; but instead of being paid, we are the ones who pay, and that just seems fucked up to me. The EA cycle should go "add content -> release it as unbroken as possible -> get feed back -> made adjustments or do something different". I get that debugging, bug fixing and optimizing isn't fun. Hell, even documenting isn't fun; but it needs to be done. I don't see why it can't be done in succession. I've heard plenty of excuses, and it seems most devs will not bother to perfect their work, if they even bother, until the end. Just slap it all together like a stinky spam sandwich, and not care it's made of rotten pork and expired mayonaise.
I agree, some people think it's ok to release an unfinished game as unfinished, and that doesn't make sense. They should at least have some kind of warning that would alert people to the game not being completely done, so they could avoid playing something they don't want to play. Or maybe something saying the purpose is to test out systems to see if they would work or need to be expanded upon.
Oh wait, that's what early access is, and that's what it's labeled as....
If they'd put in mounts and carts, markets and farming, fishing and boating, etc. before EA, the game would have felt more playable. It would have felt like it had life, but it still wouldn't have been worth the prices they're charging. So many games are much more fleshed out for much less money. Archeage is free and Black Desert is 10 bucks. (yeah, I know their DLC's are expensive, but it's not in EA) Elder Scrolls Online is 19.99 and Guild Wars2 is free (I know they're not considered sandbox) but for comparing content for price, they're finished games for very little price.
i cant imagine your reaction when you hear about the plot based monthly sub! the real problem in my opinion is the poor combat system and lack of content(some bad monsters to kill i mean), if devs start to focus in mounts fishing etc i think they have taken the wrong path
If I wanted to play Archeage (never heard of that one, actually) or Black Desert, I'd play Archeage or Black Desert and not Pax Dei. Also - nice you think you can judge what I, personally, think is worth buying. There's plenty of people who obviously thought not only that it was worth buying the game but who also thought it was worth paying more for it than the base price and went higher tier instead.
@@konkats-tg7pf They took the wrong path anyway. 4 years, 30 millions, which is nothing for a MMO, BUT : no mounts, no farming, no classes, no trade, no market, no quests, no lore, no towns, no npc, no writing, no combat (right clicking isn't "combat"), no bosses. Nothing but crafting and construction. Which aren't even close to being feature completes.
That's a big problem if you think about it for about 2 minutes. Or just put all that aside and have fun. One can have fun with very little, like building castle in the sand. Doesn't mean I'll pay 40 bucks for it. And tbh, I do want to play and like this game. Truly.
@@mimmim13aiv 4yrs are nothing for a mmo development, that is why we are 2-3 yrs before true release. i think that devs want to work like Larian studios when they gave act1 of BG3 on early access, and that is fine with me. if devs need the$$$ i will suport with the40euro because i want a eu studio to succeed.time will show(btw i never buy EA games, this will be my first and last)
@@konkats-tg7pf I agree. That being said, I think that 1) game is way too ambitious for a small company with "only" 30 millions as it targets this whole "social sandbox MMO" experience. 2) The devs philosophy around this whole concept is wrong to begin with.
Pax Dei's error is just to fail to understand a simple mechanic : social and community-oriented gameplay implies features that promote this aspect. Its almost philosophical game design wise. Thinking a sandbox MMO means its up to the player to imagine everything, as stated by the devs, without deep and interconnected features to support it, will 100% lead to a fail.
What is social in Pax features ? Not much. Yet there's hundreds of features to be imagined.
A messaging system to post in-game notices when looking for a craftsman? A pigeon system that would depend on a new profession branch? A guild system to organize these professions, agree on prices, or settle commercial disputes? A hand-crafted central hub with NPCs to create a flow between the players and encourage to meet in one central place? A political election system? A tribunal and crime features? That's just ideas flowing through my mind. Theres hundreds of features to be imagined, not all may work. Some certainly do.
Like 95% of the so called "sandbox" MMO that didn't understand yet that if you're going for no classes, no quests, no writing, no lore, no market, no currency, no nothing, which is OK, you still have to build in game features to make your game a "social sandbox experience". That's the problem. How can I be a fisher or an animal breeder in game if the games doesn't give me a fishing rode or doesn't allows me to tame animals ? There's only so much I'm "free" to do in the framework the games gives me. Removing all the frame, meaning giving me no gameplay mechanics, doesn't make me free. On the contrary : it limits me quit drastically. That's the paradox the devs, be it from Pax or other games, fail to understand.
Even in a tabletop RPG, which is the epitome of "the player is free," there is a rulebook as thick as a phone directory to support the players' freedom within a framework of rules designed to encourage creativity and liberty. Plus, there is a storyline constructed by the GM to bring the game to life and guiding you, the player. This is a philosophy that works. The player's freedom is expressed within a well-constructed framework. The better constructed it is and interconnected, the less the players will even feel like there are rules and game mechanics. The more the player will have fun and use the rules to live their experience. Removing all the rules and saying "you're free" is an intellectual scam.
Any tabletop GM and any player who has experienced this idea of "do whatever you want" at least once the first time they played, understands what I'm talking about.
Unless they change that and begin to work on trade, money, markets, central hub to create a meeting place for players, complex guild system, craftsman guilds, law system, prison system, elections, quest boards run by players or guilds, anything that makes this "social sandbox MMO" alive and allows the player to navigate and experience an adventure, the game will sink. As of right now, if the players want to experience any of that, they have to organize and meet through other means, outside of the said games, like Discord. That's really a shitty way to create a game.
I'd check it out if it was for free to help them (pre)alpha testing for 1-5 years but this pricing model and the upcoming sub model is one of the most predatory in the mmo world.
because of the god damn endless running, no mounts, no ekstra bags, alpha players taking all the plots next to end game ressources, game is cooked, building crumbling despite having green foundations, plots getting smaller for every update, so many faults, the combat is extremely low responsive
That's the style of game. I've been having a great time playing. point of fact not everyone is going to like it, most I've seen enjoy it and I admit I have a lot of fun.
@@ferret1337 man, i played UO, starwars galaxies, everquest, this is 2024x even everquest had a better combat system. Comon..
The game has HUGE potential, But they didnt even Think of a salvage station
@Erumyr OK this guy has legit concerns, I mean if you played SWG pre NGE and UO I give you respect you obviously know good mmos. I believe it's WAY to early to count this game out. It has a very solid foundation, but resource stacking needs fixed badly. The combat they said is an after thought until they get other things worked on. Remember this is a very early alpha. I see where they are potentially going with this title, and I'm hoping people give it some time instead of trashing it in its very early state.
How can players build next to end game resources when those resources are in the wilderness???
@@woundedsqrl yeah I agree with your sentiment, it’s very early. But I really hope the combat system is a high priority
Personally I believe this is the game for me. Yes it needs a a shed load of work. But the bones of it are beautiful and the game play loop is addictive. Looking forward to see how it develops.
That’s awesome man, good to hear!! A lot of people do mirror that opinion too.. !
This feels like since after the very positive release trailer and first non-combat alpha, that everything is being done at a very quick pace and they are rushing this. I think EA is a big mistake, even in EA having persistent servers will be costly not just in resource but the support requirements that will start to appear too (higher needs for first line investigation, account admins, community managers, server engineers).
I also believe this game does not have a firm design foundation (system implementation and system harmonisation) for a majority of its parts that could lead to erroneous user feedback and that includes a well thought out monetization method which always has an effect on the rest of the game.
I am all for user testing and feedback, but i think its too early and bad feedback may be taken on and incidentally break parts of the game unexpectedly.
I'm having fun -- if you don't like the game don't play it. To each their own.
What do you like about it?
and stop buying a pre-order EA game if you don't want to play the unfinished game. wait until release and than buy it. I don't get these folks that invest in a founder pack (They even say this is an investment to help development) if you don't want to play a game still in development.
then again you are a weirdo. yeah, weirdos like weird things. pax is a dog game and only braindead people would enjoy this scam.
@@likeorasgod People are strange aren't they? LOL I understand it's early and not yet finished. Wife and I are having some fun with it while it cooks
This tbh.
I'm amazed anyone who played it, the devs or players, thought this was anywhere near close to ready. It's ridiculous.
They lit told everyone its not ready?
The devs say they are at least a YEAR out from a release candidate. This is true ea/alpha
@@thorjor1 One year, from alpha to 1.0 ? Does that sound ridiculous as a claim ?
@@mimmim13aiv yeah they're way too ambitious, extremely naive, you can see they're extremely new to this, a year to switch from alpha to 1.0 is ridiculous, and especially a damn mmo, combat is nowhere near even touched, it's literally unreal engine basic combat you find anywhere you go, they need to wake up
@@myst2212 As you said, especially for a MMO. Yet you know, "social sandbox MMO" somehow means no actual gameplay elements to back that social aspect. That also means no mounts, no farming, no classes, no trade, no market, no quests, no lore, no towns, no npc, no writing, no combat (right clicking isn't "combat"), no bosses. Nothing but crafting and construction.
That's truly innovative. I think we both doesn't understand how revolutionary that is.
I wish crafting based games would add in either recycling/ breakdown of items (like I think FF14 has) or a way to use them some other way. Like, why can't I take my chainmail and melt it down back into iron? Or, maybe, take something like the weak iron and refine it into higher level iron
I think being a game producer takes more than just the ability to lead and manage a team. You need to have a vision, know the audience you are catering to, and have the talent for finding and fitting the pieces together. It is like being a conductor for an orchestra. You have to know the music, the audience, and how to conduct your team in playing it.
They made an epic Tech Demo trailer for the game, that scratched that itch many of us long for in an MMO.
Then they launched a game, with the bare minimum of content carried by the awesome power that is Unreal Engine 5.
They charge people full premium for a game that shouldn't have been launched for several years.
They haven't added additional content - despite having long lists of lofty promises - there's only been bugfixes.
And a very long winded explanation of a "DNS problem". Who has any use for knowing about a DNS problem? No one.
Despite being transparent and open about - what you want for your game - there's still a very long way from those promises to actual 'physical' content.
If that ever happens - that remains to be seen.
because they want the {insert game description} while they've received the {early access description}. So they are not reading description and developers are not clear enough in telegraphing what is released.
ps. building does not feel finished but it's somehow good
Its not Early Access that is the issue, its the trend of expecting players to play full price for something that isnt finished (early access). The cost sets the expectation of the buying experience and not the labelling of Early access. It has to work both ways, if the Production Studio wishes for us to help fund the development, then its only fair for the paying public to expect some sort of discount
I don't think anyone should have any expectations with early access games. It's up the player to do their due diligence and look at the current state of the game and what people are saying about it to determine if they want to make the purchase or not. That said the developer has a responsibility to be as clear as possible about what to expect not only with the current state of the game but any continued development that could impact the player (like how drastic the changes will be, whether there might be progress resets, etc).
thanks for your review, i tested in a beta and thought it was a fun building crafting game and also thought the combat needed some work. I really hope it gets better with every patch and update, but im on the sidelines for now
To be clear; it never had a beta period. It went from alpha to early access. "Combat needed some work" is very polite; it is basically using the default combat that the UE5 engine comes boxed with... it's borderline unplayable combat with almost zero content to go with it. Its like combat and content are entirely missing which is 2/3 of the game's promise. We didn't need another early access gather/crafter/builder that has nothing more to it; especially one that was going to come out charging for plots.
@@heartless_gamer ok… it was that last alpha then 🤷🏻♂️ lol sure seemed like a beta with how soon after it went to early access. My apologies for not getting it correct lol
Haven’t played yet because I’m living in a van but I will have a home soon :D
Please keep playing, streaming and help the development!
Ayyy you in a Van too!? Niceeee!!!
I was interested until I saw all the early access footage and reviews. I'm no longer interested, but I don't hate the game based on my personal hangups of it. I'm sure it appeals to others.
Im playing the game solo. Started to work with my in-game neigbhour that is also solo. We are having alot of fun. Played several playtests before this. I can hardly stop play the game when I need to sleep.
This is an unfinished game. If you played a playtest before you would know this. Im guessing alot of people thought it was more finished than it is and therefor are not happy.
This is good to hear!! And yeah, exactly that!
That's not it.
4 years, 30 millions, which is nothing for a MMO, BUT : no mounts, no farming, no classes, no trade, no market, no quests, no lore, no towns, no npc, no writing, no combat (right clicking isn't "combat"), no bosses. Nothing but crafting and construction. Which aren't even close to being feature completes.
That's a big problem if you think about it for about 2 minutes. That's all "experienced EVE devs" are able to do ? Or just put all that aside and have fun. One can have fun with very little, like building castle in the sand. Doesn't mean I'll pay 40 bucks for it. And tbh, I do want to play and like this game. Truly.
I love it so far. I love building and crafting, more will come. I can wait!
Finally an adult in the room. I, like you - will be supporting this game for the long haul. In show of support, I bought the highest Tier. People can call me crazy, but my decision is solely based on the way the game made me feel during the play tests. I truly believe Mainframe has something special here. Great vid Danneh, you've earned my sub and I look forward to watching more of your content.
Thank you mate! Excited to follow along their development and hope they do an awesome job.. 😍
Pax Dei didnt release a real EA game though, thats the problem. And a lot of actual EA games are not commanding those kind of prices or tiers of pricing that instantly "P2W" players right off the bat. EA titles have the basics - Rust, Vrising, OnceHuman. They had a world, game play, vision that could be actually seen in their EA development cycle. Pax Dei just seems like a UE5 sandbox and not an actual game. Showing off an engine you didnt even make for money? Promoting 4xPlots at 100 bucks so you can park mules and take over spots while the peasant 1 plot people cant?
Idk man, I feel like they could of done something different for more money.. mainly cosmetics. This plot thing is crazy and if you dont get 100 dollar ticket then why bother. Here is our game -40 bucks, 2 plots, and whatever else is what they should of done. Giving any sort of paid in game advantage only attracted the sadist gamers who will cannibalize a game then move on to the next. They arent exactly an audience that will grow your game.
"When a game is in early access, it means that it is still in development but has allowed a certain group of players to test the game. The typical stages of early access can be described as pre-alpha, alpha, pre-beta, or beta phases." - pretty much what Pax Dei is, dude.
What players have come to expect from an EA title on steam is not what Pax Dei is, some pre determined wording doesnt change that. Is that the only part of my comment you disagreed with? Rest of it pretty spot on?
@@veladarney Yeah we are going to need to separate those.
Over all a good take but I don't see this recovering or doing exceptionally well. I think they get out of this is they completely abandon their business model and either change from mmo to a social survival game or they go into a battle pass cosmetic system like you said. The problem is they are definitely under pressure by their investors so it's past the point where they can make any meaningful decisions. I don't even know if this game will survive the time it takes before they switch to a subscription based model.
Looks fun, but the way the Plots are handled and that there will be a sub later on, just puts me off. The basebuilding and social elements look great, I really hope the game catches on but I am not sure if I will ever pick it up. So many games out there, I don't have the time for a paid sub game to make it worth it, especially since the only game I have ever played that i felt was worth paying a Sub for was Ultima Online. All the others since that I have tried I lasted 3 months at the most then stopped. Great video!
Monsters and memories is what I am looking for. You can try it 28-29 of june.
Great video! Totally agree. I'm working on a video about this as well. I just recently found your channel, I love the van life! I'm an off grid gamer and I run my system with solar and starlink so anyway I'm really enjoying the videos!
Amazing!!! I’ll be sure to stop by your content too!!
I haven't played yet but if they really goin to put a monthly sub for playing the game, I don't think i will get it
Monthly sub won't start until full release, so in 2025 (at the earliest). Until then, no monthly sub, just gotta buy the game. Always can bow out at full release.
The biggest issues for me right now are the subscription potential flaws, the fact it's a week later and the log in errors still exist, and the devs don't seem confident in their vision imo(idk, something just feels off hearing them talk about the game. Leaving too much weight in the players hands to figure out for themselves...is just not great). For the potential flaws in the subscription, what happens when you're running a Clan/Kingdom, players quit thus leaving you to pick up the plots as the leader in order to keep the village to your clan's visions. Meaning your subscription cost will go up. It's going to get to a point where just to run a kingdom/clan will cost you more (irl)money than it's worth. I'm all for subscription models, but their idea behind it is not consumer friendly at all. Just becomes: "Who's willing to pay more per month" to last out your rivals
Still interested in seeing where the game goes, but oof....
I like the idea and concept of PD and I liked the Alpha for what it was at that time. I see the potential. And Mainframe got a lot of feedback from Alpha testers that the game wasn't ready for EA yet. Because some important features are still missing like trading and markets. I suppose the angry reactions come from players also who warned over and over again that EA was coming way too early and feel ignored by the devs who did the EA anyway. Now we got a sandbox MMO in EA with many of the sandbox tools still missing. This frustrates old Alpha players and new steam players in a similiar way.
Not sure why most people expect a done gome, early access can be nisleading though. Like seeing a movie before it comes out to the public is early access too, but the movie is done.
It’s a great game. I’m 46hrs in and grinding to make my first wrought iron axe and pickaxe. The Tomb Raider base is evolving into an Amazon Warehouse as I’m spamming easy/moderate stuff to level up skills. I have 3 big bins of iron axes, spears and pickaxes 🤪😎👻
you are a cringe weirdo
Just trade for it
@@lyfzuxz no need as got it soon enough. 5 bins of free stuff outside 👻
If I compare the last EA game I bought (enshrouded) to pax Dai, yes I know they are difference types and scale of game but they have their similarities, open world, gathering and building. There is no way I can even consider pax by comparison. The price and level of content is just not there for me. For me personally as well, I don't want to spend money to support a dev for a game that may eventually be at a level of enjoyment. I do buy EA games but only those I feel have story and activity to warrant what I spending at that moment.
I will praise the scale of their game tho. Tho I only played a beta, the vastness of the world to explore was stunning
I played 40+ hrs .... I've enjoyed it , and I understood exactly what I was getting after playing alpha 2 .... BUT I'm already getting bored mostly because of the combat and AI , but I hope they get updates rolling , but to be fair I'm almost getting burned out of this "sandbox loop" of no content outside of building crafting etc .... I miss the days of MMOS having npc cities and monsters etc and just going abs buying gear without crafting EVERYTHING lol and yes UO was sandbox back 97 yet had content
For me the game has been fun & full of shit to do. Know why? BECAUSE IM LITERALLY RPING IN THE RP MEANT SERVER, no fucking "grinding", just a gameplay that fucking makes sense. Best shit ever.
Haha so glad you’re enjoying it!!
I played on the RP server no one was talking or being responsive... maybe i got unlucky...
@@user-lm6tv5fk8v only ever had 2 people not responding, but towns for sure are always up to RPing no matter who you find in said town, they'll give you time & the discussion almost always ends in opportunities for trade etc
I'm wanting to try it but the financial model puts me off, I don't even think they've said what their monthly sub will be....and I'm just not into that
I don't necessarily think that an early access title avaliable on mainstream should be charging the prices it is at this point either
I'm already a star citizen player and already anxious that project is going to fail, don't want to put money into something that will make me feel the same
Just buy it, play it during Early Access and when they release the full version in 2025 (at the earliest) and start witht he subscriptions, bow out. You'll get an entire year (at least) to play it for free and decide for yourself whether it'll be worth it to you to pay a subscription fee to keep playing.
It's because they were finished. That plus people don't understand the meaning of early access.
That plus people don't understand the meaning of early access. SO IT IS :D also Pay to win bc of more plots? i just cant see it \o/
@user-zc3pn4ux6v pay to win? I could see a conversation suggesting it but because it's a social game where you are more or less reliant on others, any one of them could have multiple plots or collectively they already do, I'd argue it's a pointless argument.
These filth should be paying people to TEST their game at this stage of development, not charging $40-100 to "play" it.
i like it though i have full iron tools. and 2 story house.
They need Early Access for players to breath life into the game.
Simple as that.
I had the game on my wishlist for a long time. But when i heard the negative comments i wanted to wait and see bevor i buy the game. After a friend bought it and liked it, i got it too. i must say that i like it, Grafiks are great and for the beginning i dont need 1000 different monster classes. i want to hunt, build, improve in my profession.
in my opinion the most important thing for the devs is to have a constant improvement and updates, so people can see that the game is heading in the right direction. I payed the 40 and thats ok for me. i don t need more plots to get to know the game.
i m looking forward and think this game has a very good future. dont mess up the price modell. Rather have many people paying small amounts then few paying big.
Sadly 20 years ago we where the golden Gen, buy a game, got a game. story finished. all good. now a days, ppl expect a full game when they buy in on EA or similar. I buy the vision of the game. it just speaks to me, the building, the crafting, so far its fine. I also am a fan of slow progress and building on a long term playing.
Loving this game, too many solo players trying to beat the system the MMO is trying to take, if the community was less toxoc and spent time to make kingdoms and pick a few professions to master it would be less abrasive. Hoping this game continues to grow and become something spectacular.
Yeah I too wish they an awesome time developing!
Yeah too bad most people want to play solo though. You cant force people to play in groups thats not how MMOs work. solos are like 80 - 90% of any mmos playerbase. Even the biggest guilds in any other MMO usually play solo until its raid time or something...? Telling solos they have to pay 80 dollars extra to enjoy an ALPHA test is wild and a sure way to kill the game. I want it to do well but as a solo player Ill tell you right now this wont work out for them if they keep trying to force it.
I bought a 40$ game and got a 10$ game. Not terrible but not a great impression. Feels like a game with a lot of placeholders, time wasters, and dead ends.
No you didn't, you pre-order the game and got to help with development. When the game releases you will get a full game. Stop thinking EA/Beta as finished game. It's not. All your doing is pre-order a game while it's in development and get to help until it's released.
I really don't get the mindset of people who buy an early access game and think they're getting a fully finished game. Just stop it. That's not what early access games are. Early access games are basically the foundations of the game they're gonna turn into. Back in 2020, I bought Endzone - A World Apart in early access. It had the bare bones of a post-apocalyptic city builder. I knew it wasn't a finished game when I got it. What I got to experience was watching a game grow into its "end form". It's so much fun to watch a game "grow up" - Endzone's still my second-most played game on Steam even though I haven't played it in at least a year or so (too many other games to try out). That's what early access is about - you pick a game with solid foundations (and I'm seeing those solid foundations in Pax Dei) and watch it grow. And HELP it grow by providing feedback tot he developers and by sending in bug reports so they can fix any issues the game might have.
@@veladarney No one expects a fully finished game dude they just don't expect a busted, buggy, empty game that asks for 130 dollars at the top tier.
we are the reason why developers release in early access and add microtransactions in their games, because we keep buying these trash games and accept p2w for faster progression
Devs seem incompetent. There's basic survival game mechanics QoL that's missing in this game. Considering how little the game developed since alpha 1 they move at a snail's pace
Everything else is WIP - Early Access.
I don’t understand why people feel like this because A) they’ve been very clear about all of this, including a YEAR at LEAST of EA and B) there’s plenty of videos SHOWING you this 🤦♂️
I don’t get why this isn’t invest in the game when Mainframe have been perfectly transparent about what EA means and how ready it is. If you didn’t read, you didn’t research and have a different opinion on what EA should be then this is your look out because this is not valid at all. What can they do differently here? They’ve communicated everything.
Yeah I like Pax Dei, I also agree it has a solid foundation to build on.
Aesthetically the world is beautiful, the building has depth, love the structural integrity and freedom to create All sorts of amazing designs/ideas.
The crafting feels rewarding, and also has depth, but the grind is real, this really is a social experiment.
I’m someone who enjoys content, questing, PVP, PVE and endgame goals.
So hoping Pax Dei delivers more over the coming EA year.
Well, you'll kinda-sorta be making your own content and quests ... it's not a theme park MMO where you'll get NPCs and pre-generated villages, towns and cities.
That’s kind of my point,
I’ve been play testing PxD since the F&F began. The content has to allow for the player to be able to drive there own quests, right now, other than resource farming poi’s, dungeons, caves, and exploration, there is no reason to do anything other than build and craft.
I have not seen a single content about pax dei that is not boring. Just people on a sandbox server grinding rock and wood. Some people like that but I don't think pax dei was intended to be a niche game. The game needs depth
Perhaps the "when you drop an early access game in 2024" is the whole problem. I have met an amazing group of strangers, we organically just kinda pooled together. We then formed a clan and now, I dare say we are one of the bigger clans on the server. I love this game, is it buggy? yeah, but there is a lot of fun to be hand in my opinion. Certainly there is a good framework.
That’s cool man, there’s lots of people enjoying it too!!
Is it still 65 to 45 for liking the game? I dont see where everyone is hating on the game. Im looking at aggregations... is there somewhere specific i need to be looking?
4 years, "experienced EVE devs", 30 millions, which is nothing for a MMO, BUT : no mounts, no farming, no classes, no trade, no market, no quests, no lore, no towns, no npc, no writing, no combat (right clicking isn't "combat"), no bosses. Nothing but crafting and construction. And both of them aren't even close to being feature completes.
That's a big problem if you think about it for about 2 minutes. Or just put all that aside and have fun. One can have fun with very little, like building castle in the sand. Doesn't mean I'll pay 40 bucks for it. And tbh, I do want to play and like this game. Truly.
I wonder how their idea to charge subscription based on plots with people that bought founders packs with multiple plots, under AU/EU consumer law, especially with no concrete plans in place at time of purchase.
It might turn out to be slightly illegal to restrict access to something you've paid for already, unless you pay more for it.
We knew there was probably going to be a subscription, but nothing about the amount being based on the amount of plots you have.
I think you can reduce your plots too after EA, based on what we’ve heard so far.
@@Danneh Yeah that doesn't negate what they said though lmfao.
So the game has been out a week, a lot of players are max lvl in their chosen profession. So now what do they do pick another one and grind it, in a week they will be max lvl in that one. People miss the point this is not a race to the top its a nice walk. And there's price this and price that, 365/100=3.65 daily cost lets face it we waste way more than that a day. This phase of the game is the best players get to be a part of the vision they can input suggestions see the growth of the game and be a part of what may or may not be, as long as the company pays attention to the players concerns and address them in a timely manner. The dev's don't have experience, well they got to get it somewhere, and I don't know asking a huge player base to provide input and suggestions you know asking for help seems like a good plan, good for the dev's. They used free UE5 assets, um so what grow up, someone worked really hard on those assets for you to belittle the talent and work they put in to the creation of the asset. I personally own a great many assets purchased from the market place, and I don't even make games but talent should be rewarded even if the product is never used. If you don't like the price the assets, the dev's or the state of the game take the 100 bucks pay for a game dev course and prove you got what it takes, and let the world judge your work. The 60 bucks I spent will provide at minimum a year of entertainment, and to me that is all that matters.
I think people expect promise, vision, and communication. I think once everyone paid their 40-100$ and then heard that one of the main devs had no gaming experience besides kards... that said a lot
That guy helped develop Eve Online… got quite the history outside of Cards
you mean the dev that was one of the founders of the studio that made EVE Online?
@@Danneh in that case, I'm quite wrong, but maybe my point stands to some extent. A passerby like me might skim through your interview and be put off by that haha
Honestly the game is good. You have to play with people. That's what they are trying to get people to do. Plus if anyone thinks this game takes to long, HAS not played Wurm Online.
I have seen negative reviews from players that only played .2 hours how can you decide the game is bad or worth hating on the first day the servers open. This game is not supposed to be finished it just opened. Where they went wrong in my opinion is bringing it to EA, they should have gone closed beta first. Some aspects of the game were great in the A2 but they got screwed up in EA. Not understanding the simple parts. I understood it to be that the founder packs were for investment boost. Yes I did it, 4 plots. Will not leave because I have played Beta games since the late 80 to include Ultima Online, hell we couldn't even sit when beta came out.
It´s early access. I expect an early access game in developement.
If you expect an early access game to be finished - the problem is not the game but your wrong expectations.
If you don´t like the game - that´s bad luck.
But don´t make anyone responsible for your decision to buy the game.
There are many ways to get enough informations about the game before you buy it.
Yes, the game is in a poor state, no question.
And I highly doubt the final release will be in a year from now.
But I knew that before I bought it. And I´m completely fine with the current state of the game.
For a game that makes you gather mats so much trees are the main one. This all needswork gathering feels empty to me. When you hit a tree with a axe it feels like I’m hitting nothing..
Maybe that’s because you’re numb after cutting the minimal amount of 696969 trees!!
Hahahaha facts sorry my English
Nah but the trees just need to shake a little or something. Then the game is perfect people will be happy than
@@Ilone3765 😂😂😂❤️
I love running around in Pax Dei, but I feel like I'm an Beta tester which is fine, I've done that for a lot of games. They really shouldn't have launched it on Steam in EA though, the masses don't understand.
"The masses don't understand." Spoken like a true kool-aid drinker. Here is an idea -- help them understand what they are missing. Make an appeal that makes the idea of doing a second job in a video game, sound like fun. If you love running around in Pax Dei, just load up Unreal and generate a landscape and run around, same thing.
Got to 1:55. Trust me.
I think companies are getting too comfortable releasing a game so early in development and call it early access.
"When a game is in early access, it means that it is still in development but has allowed a certain group of players to test the game. The typical stages of early access can be described as pre-alpha, alpha, pre-beta, or beta phases." - sounds to me like companies can release games pretty early and still truthfully call them early access ...
Im one of the hooked ones, playing this together withe me wife just chilling. Should be no surprise to anyone that the combat is bad if you watched any review on social medias, but im there for the crafting and building which is amazing. Gonna go combat as soon as the combat is ready for it.
Devs are working their ***** off fixing stuff and if you dont go into the game intending to break things its actually a nice game.
For me, this was worth my money 100%
Good to hear from you Swe and thanks for your comment mate, glad you guys are enjoying it!
the game is still too green for me to pay 40usd. but i feel people don't even know what the game is about before commenting on it
It doesn't take much time with the game to realize there isn't much there to comment on. It is too green and was not needed in early access in this state. It will be a long term mark on the game that they forever are fighting against. Unfortunate to be honest. Given time to redo combat from scratch and get some content in the game it would of been pretty solid. As it is any of us waiting on the outside for major updates will likely be on to other things because we don't want the stigma of joining a game later in its life cycle.
Than don't pay, the 40 bucks is you pre-ordering the game for it's released. It's not released part of pre-order they are allowing you to test the game while it's in development. The problem is folks are thinking EA is a release of the final game but it's not. It's like none you actually read what's on the Store page before you buy it.
I think they need a new category that's far below Early Access. Early Access games should never be in this poor of a state and I've played plenty of them.
Pax Dei always seemed overambitious. To me it seems like they've ran into financial problems and this was the best urgent solution (they could come up with) to keep the project going. I'm sure they wouldve liked to keep it in closed alpha and cook with their fnf community, but the vision of a vast MMO with fancy graphics and animations doesn't come cheap these days, sandbox or not doesn't matter. Hope they're able to sort out their shit out but it looks like this will remain in early access for quite some time.
Feelings. Feelings never changes.
Remember Life is Feudal MMO it's empty now.
People hating it because it's not complete while in early access is the epitome of adult children behaviour. You say people understand early access won't have content and then you say it's missing content. You say it's understandable to have bugs but actually that's too many bugs. Absolute child mentality. I'm ashamed to be a gamer in this community.
sub models shouldn't even be in the discussion until its got actual content. This game makes it look like Tarisland has content. close it down and release it in 2 years, we all know its a money thing. stupid to call it early access. its beta, maybe a fairly ok alpha. Manor Lords was barely early access and ppl get 1k hours out've that one. Put it back in the oven, it's making new world look good rn
I googled the definition of "Early Access" and got this here: "When a game is in early access, it means that it is still in development but has allowed a certain group of players to test the game. The typical stages of early access can be described as pre-alpha, alpha, pre-beta, or beta phases." - sounds like Pax Dei is, indeed, Early Access as per definition.
Tarisland does have more content than Pax Dei funny enough.
The problem with pax dei really comes down to a very simple issue. They are asking waaaaay too much, giving way too little and then expect everyone tk be generous with an entirely faith based project. 100 USD for a pay to win account for the game or pay 40 usd to get the least and yet it's still barely anything. They're asking you to pay rent in the game. ACTUAL rent as you have to pay irl money for each property you own. Give me a break. This game could be in the exact same state as it is but run on dedicated servers and a much better business model, say no p2w and maybe cosmetics if you need to continue making money after launch. But no instead they gave us a half baked game for an expense that's HIGHER than WoW. You look at the state of 7 days to die when it first came out and the game was literally blocks but they didn't ask for ridiculous amounts of money to play the game. It really isn't that difficult. The problem is they're clearly backed by some greedy companies that are starting to get anxious about their investment so they want to try and plunder the community they have garnered before backing out completely.
I actually believe these developers have a passion for their game but it's being ruined by whoever is in the background that's funding the project. It's a darn shame and a huge disappointment because I had high hopes for this game. It's what I had been looking forward to since hearing about it.
Edit: I didn't even know you were going to mention 7 days to die next which proves my point entirely.
They expect to much from early access games..!! Early Access is just a late Alpha or Early Beta.. That's all it is.
I said most wouldn’t like it it’s a hard grind and combat is primitive at best modern mmo players expect 10 years worth of content at launch they will never be satisfied with any modern MMO in 2030 when ashes of creation launches same thing will happen
I thinkt there ARE games that are getting Early Accesses right. Enshrouded was a great example; I alreary got a good 100 hours of fun out of it even though the final release is still almost a year away afaik. Shame about PD's rocky Early Access; I really think that game has potential. I wonder if they were running low on funds and were hoping to get a substantial cash injection from the Early Access.
Enshrouded and V Rising for sure
I had high hopes for this game, sadly it’s chasing a dying trend from the early 2000’s. More games lean to solo friendly gameplay for sustainability. Life in feudal is an example of this failure. I’m hoping Pax can bridge the gap to a happy medium. In the meantime Soulmask is awesome for half the price.
People hating it can’t see the forest beyond the trees
i dont think a pre-generated forest in UE5 is worth 100 dollars
Why are people expecting something special from EA games in 2024?? Is gamedevelopment easier now than what it was back then? I thinks its much harder bc there is so much more competition . This isint PAx Dei issue only.
That windows sounds triggers my ptsd...
😂😂 I actually googled windows XP sounds…
Great video man. Very fair points across the board. This game was NOT ready for EA release. Then tack on the insulting price point and it's no wonder this team is getting so much hate. Most games with very few exceptions make a comeback after a bad launch like this. You only get one shot at this and they blew it.
"When a game is in early access, it means that it is still in development but has allowed a certain group of players to test the game. The typical stages of early access can be described as pre-alpha, alpha, pre-beta, or beta phases." - so what's there exactly about Pax Dei that's not at least pre-alpha? It's not their fault people don't know what "early access" means and thus, got unreasonable expectations.
Its sad that the game is getting so much hate from people who dont understand what the game actuslly is. Ive put over a hundred hours into it, and most who i see in game are the same, so well worth the money. Most negative reviews come from those with less than 10 hours in, which isnt enough to judge a game like this.
The style of game is meant for the crowd who enjoys the grind and the social aspect, where you meet and play with people organically in game. The game is not on rails, there isnt an overarching story provided by the devs, its provided by player interactions over time, and the game is a slow burn.
If you dont like that style of game, thats ok, i can see why some dont, but it doesnt mean its a bad game. Try it out, or watch streams that arent filled with hate, and give the devs a chance to show you the game they are building!
New armor teir? Looks the same.
Spend 20min killing mos to get to the rare mob on a camp? Guy runs in behind you and loots your mob.
No fishing, no farming. "Gathering feels fun" try leather working...
Combat - bad
I played 100 hrs. It's missing a lot you'd expect for the price tag including basic looting mechanisms
The pricing is too much for an unfinished game. Imho. So, it's a money grabbed. Why make a game if you really don't have any money. And asked gamers to pay for them? lol! And its $160 Australian dollars for the full founder package that's a lot.
Was expecting more an hostile medieval environment survival mmo , with combat similar to kingdom come but third person, instead got safe space sims with ancient combat mechanics...
If three wolves ganging up on you about three bends in the road away from the spawn point and killing you is not hostile enough for you ... probably got lucky and didn't run into that kind of hostile environment, yet.
I think its an awesome game.
100% agree with you Danneh
i took one look at the combat and said nah fuck this
😂
The problem isn't that it's not finished. The game is just boring. I don't see how an economy will ever get started when players can just grind every trade skill in the game and every guild will have multiple tradesmen maxed out. They need to change a lot or this game will die off very early.
I didn’t try it. It doesn’t seem like my kind of game from what I saw..
Gen Y and Z cry too much over petty things. This guy is the prime example. It is rather simple, pay the price and play, enjoy yourself. Or, shut up, don't pay, and go away. In the old days, you purchased the game, then paid $9.99-$14.99/mn to play. All games were like this, until Gen Y came along and cried about the money.
Crafting is pretty dang good, gathering is meh, combat is BLEGH.. From playing alpha, demo, and now early access, there really hasn't felt like a big difference in gameplay itself. Combat is big sell point for me and none of the weapons feel unique, animation lock basic attacks and abilities is ok but when clearing a dungeon with 10+ people all just wailing on some mob all standing still gives a pretty dull experience. I refunded.
anyone remember crowfall? The combat was way better and it died. This is a game where you have 1 plot and not even all the crafting tables fit well in the space. 40 bucks and your shit does not fit. A builder game where you have no space to build at 40 bucks makes new world look like a gem on release. Do you have any idea how many games you can get on steam summer sale for 40 bucks that are finish let alone 100? If you spawn bottom right of the map it is a 2 hour run to the other side. Im sorry this game completely disrespects your time. Make inventory of arrows? hope you got 15-20 minutes to watch your character craft them.
I'm fine with games dropping in early access. I fully believe it is better to playing a game as it develops than to not be playing it. But that is where Pax Dei drops the ball for me. You really can't play the game. The combat is that bad and there is sign that this will change at any point soon. There is no real content. Building buildings is done in 1000 other games at this point.
We may not like it but EA is your game's launch. Having something as bad as the combat on Pax Dei is going to be a long term mark on the game and its unfortunate.
Then add in the approach to how they are selling access / plots and its just "what the hell" IMHO.
Im having a great time mate, Ive made a heap of new friends got a clan built heaps progressed alot bamed weapons and armor 😁👍🏼
Awesome to hear man!
Around 2:30 you talk about going down to the store, getting your disk and expecting it to work, or be finished. I'd like to present for the record The Elder Scrolls Battlespyre. It came out after Daggerfall and Before Morrowind. Bro that game never worked. It still doesn't work. Another game back in the day Lucasarts put out called Yoda Stories. It had all the depth of minesweeper. Both these games got my teenage job paycheck money. Total waste. Those games liter my childhood. I'd say 75% of all the games made for NES weren't worth the 50 dollars you paid for them. Every 3rd party NES game can't be BlasterMaster, Bionic Commando, or Crystallis. I love Pax Dei. I love that it has no story. Everyone living back then didn't, didn't have a story, they just woke up in the morning, went to work and built stuff.
Sounds like you’re talking about new world KEKW
Not defending this game (its kind of trash right now), but it is in early access. They almost certainly released it into early access as a cash grab. Hence the pay to win 100$ 4 plot edition for the game. I'll be following this game closely but im not spending a dime on it yet. If they exceed expectations, I'll buy the game. If it goes to a subscription service, but you can buy it forever before that, I may jump in on that, not sure.
Is not hate dude.. is more the fact of how can brain-dead players/streamers even fall for this trend, that has surface in the last two decades, of releasing games that are far from being a functional game? Throwing money out of the window to this pseudo gaming developers and or companies at the slightest hype because of a trailer was made with nice cgi or because you are seeking for the next hit to milk content out of it, blindfold in a pitch darkroom, without any regard for the impact you have on people that follow you, which most of them are young kids that don´t even have a job and live out of their parents hard earned money. I.E. Soulmask and 7 Days to die are better examples of how eventually a EA should be. In general these companies are money greedy and thirsty... there are many examples out there... 40 50 60 euros a pop, times 1 million, is enough for them to become millionaires and have lavish life styles sponsored. Bring back the 90s where the industry standards were that games had to be complete and functional and testers was a paid job and profession.