Why the Disc sander is so important for knifemaking
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- čas přidán 7. 08. 2021
- the fast track to making great knives! watch how to use a disc to speed up the finishing process of knifemaking! Spend some time behind a good disc sander and you will definitely need one. The 2x72 is the king in my shop and the disc is my Queen! These are some of my tips and tricks for using a disc sander and maybe one of the pitfalls for using a disc.
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#DiscSander
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First knifemaker that ive come across that gives actual technical explanations of his movements. That invaluable as a beginner like me. Your videos have been a great help
Fantastic!
Agree
Those 3 knives are my absolute favorite YOU have made and quite frankly probably 3 of my favorite knives period. Love them 🤘🏼
"see this mistake?, well it is not a mistake it just needs fixed"
That was the comment that got me to sub.
Great video and i look forward to looking at the rest of this channel.
Highly recommended.
Thank you Jason! I'm glad to have you on the Channel with us. We are a lively bunch so if you have questions or comments please feel free to throw him out there. Cheers
Nice machine!! Started a sharpening business up here in Canada, was thinking of DIY like that, especially for salon shears freehand sharpening.
You should smooth out the disc edge so it sounds better when your knife guide hits the edge.
It's refreshing to see that I'm not the only one who can't work without cutting myself.
Thanks for the really helpful video.
No joke right!
Lol, I'm an amateur blackmith/bladesmith and this is the first video I've seen from this channel. Subbed both because you're funny and because you actually give technique explanations as you go.
Excellent!
The feathering compound is a game-changer. I've been so frustrated with trying to remove discs with PSA backing. Great tip!
Total game changer
I may need one of these...
It really is a game changer!
Awesome video. Can’t wait for your next project.
very amazing knife sharpening process👍
Nice! Definitely going to do this!!!
💥 💥 💥
Thank you for all the tips and the time you put into these videos
You are welcome, I definitely enjoy it!
Learned one new thing today. Thanks for the effort
What did you learn?
@@Aleeknives I've never even though of using it like that and that's a awesome way to get rid of the valleys and peaks. Definitely giving this a go
excellent video - thank you for sharing
You are welcome!
Excellent information Thank You
You are very welcome sir! Cheers
Awesome info. I bought a Rikon 1x42 sander with an 8 inch disc sander and use the disc for sanding handles after I split each of them to put side liners and turquoise inlays in the middle of them. The wood and all the liner materials fit so nice now. The feather compound and buying sheets of sandpaper for the disc is a great tip too. thanks so much!
Thank you for sharing Sir
Oh and love the shop setup mate 👍
I have been slowly building it up. I started 8 years ago. Thank you! Cheers! Favorite tool=the Bridgeport mill!
Wow ill be hitting up my disc sander combo and trying this technique out, thanks man great tutorial
Thank you!
Good job, and thank you. Exactly what I wanted to see today.
Also thought: How cool it would be to see videos of how to use your machines and tools in specific situations to make life easier. Clearly this is one such job. the other being flattening the ricasso area and getting a stick tang straight. 👌🏻
Great work, I've been doing pretty much the same thing for the last 30 years, I also taper tangs on the disc. My disc has the 1 degree taper plus the edge has a 40degree bevel for getting into corners and such, the motor is also reversible simply by hitting a rocker switch.
Man I love it!
I got the same disc and pretty much same setup. I love it. One thing i did that helped was to buy a foot pedal to turn it on so i can use both my hands on the blade. Lay it on there flat and hit the pedal.
You are the MAN I have been trying to figure this out for a year!!!!! Thank you so much love you’re videos !!!
You are welcome! Cheers
Yep, now i want one 😄
Great video, Airin!
So easy to set up!
Absolutely brilliant!!! Just got my disk delivered on Friday and it works beautifully.
Fantastic!
great channel , great content and informative, thank you
You are welcome!
Airin! I hear you brother! Let's collaborate on a design. 😁 Great video, learned a lot as always! 🤩
Thanks Brian!
Ahh, that's what that round thing is for on my 6x48 belt sander... Lol!
Great video, techniques, and advice, thank you!
Your welcome!
I want one of these disk sanders bad. The bevel on it is genius. And those 3 knives you show at the end are gorgeous, brother. Great video
Thank you sir!
If you go to my website www.118blades.co.uk you can see the B.A.VanDer SanDer Richard Beck has designed.
Multifunctional and awesome machine.
For sale in the USA and the uk/Europe 😉
That's why u call ur disc sander "Queen".Really it gives wonderful results in no time.Great video.👍👍🔥🔥🔥
I love it!
Awesome explanation of the usage of a disc sander.
A lot of knife makers will benefit from the machine.
I think so!
Great video, Airin! I need one of these for sure! Next purchase! Btw, it was cool to see that side of your shop, we rarely see that angle in your videos. 👍
This will be the last video on the old equipment! Just got home from Colorado and headed to Luisianna in the morning! Be back in the shop in a week!
@@Aleeknives hopefully you’ll be home for awhile after that?
@@TyrellKnifeworks
Agreed! Too much time away from the shop (although nothing beats being with family!!)
Verrry interesting 🤭 great work Sir 👍 thanks for your inspiration.
You are welcome! Cheers
Awesome video
Thank you Chris!
What's really awesome about video is I got a disc sander about 5 days ago and was about to try it for cleaning up just like this! Great stuff as always man.
You will love it
Very timely vid. I am in the middle of building a disc grinder for this very purpose. Bought a flat disc and now need to get a beveled one after you explained why. Awesome tips and keep them coming.
Will do! Thank you
I use a flat disk on my disc grinder on anything up to 15 inch blades just go below the center line
Great video
Thank you
A tip for everyone that wants a motor without spending a lot of money on it is to look for broken treadmills on Ebay some People give them away for free and the motors work most of the times. Mabe even the controler.
Can't wait to build mine!!! Love shortcuts and jigs!!! The purpose for tools is make better knives. Imho
Totalled agree and also to make the process even more enjoyable!
Thank you for the video
Sure thing man!
Hey.... Awesome video....great tips as per usual.... Really like the tip about 1 degree bevel on the plate, really cool... Please keep posting.... awesome work, nevermind the trolls....
Love it Dan! Thank you sir! Cheers
Hey, new sub here. Gotta say, I like the channel. Great info and easy to watch. Thanks for what you do, man.
That is awesome! I am glad to have you here on the channel! Speak up if you ever have questions! Cheers
I really like the first knife .
I'm going to have to try this. I hear tell it's an easy to way to get your plunge lines even, too.
Yes sir!
I glue a 1/16 thick cork backing onto my flat disc sander. That stops the vibration of the metal disc transfering through the paper to blade. Then put the tac glue on it, just like you demonstrated, on the cork, to allow for changing grit sizes comfortably. I find that since my dics is a flat 8", I can use 8.5x11 inch standard paper. I do have to watch out to avoid "bucking" the blade. Really Like your variable speed setup. I have a reversing switch on my 1 horsepower motor. Have to be very careful of the direction of rotation. Still, it kills any uneven grinding, high or low spots quick and easy. A shout out to Terry Mah, Calgary, Alberta, Canada, the guy who taught me knifemaking ... a real master at mirror finishing. Hint ... Auto body supply shops have sanding paper in really high grit counts.
Cheers. Nice video.
😜😎😉👍👌
Back in the day I used to sand my knives to perfection, and to a mirror finish. I started to look at my knives, and said to myself "what is the difference between my knives, and a factory knife finish? There was no difference, hence had no character in my blades. So now I prefer to leave my forge hammer marks on my knives. To me this looks better, and you can really tell the knife was hand forged, and custom made. Enjoy watching your content.
yeah, i'm kinda facing the same problem. I see all these wonderful talented knifemakers who make just insane heavenly blades, wich they virtually managed to erase their humanity from (no marks, no scratches, no mistakes). That is really impressive from a technical point of view, and i believe all blacksmiths should train until they can make their blades look like a factory finish. Just to learn how to make something really flawless. That being said everybody does that, factories do that, and even tho people are used to it (in our modern world, we're used to factory satin finish and perfect symmetry, wich wasn't a thing in the middle ages for exemple, where it wasnt shocking to see something not really symetrical, just beacause nothing really was and didn't need to). But some bladesmiths just grind out sheets of steel while i flatten ingots and then forge a knife just with a hammer, and i believe that's extra work that is completely lost with a pure flawless finish. So now i'm still a bit split. It's been a year since i've started making blades all day, with the aim of living of it, so i still have miles of practice to go, and that means i still dont know how to completely remove my "maker's mark" from my blades, there's always that tiny scratch here, an irregularity there... And i won't be satisfied of my craftmanship until i can remove all of these. But at the same time, i'm trying to develop my style and put forward my old school work, and that means leaving more soul to the blade, leaving the hammer marks that won't ever be similar to an other one ...
But i'd say don't let "oh but it gives it a soul" be an excuse for mediocrity.
Perfect video bro. Love it. I have a Black Fox 1 2x72 and the owner is making a disc sander attachment as we speak. I will own it.
Sweet!
I could have used this video about 12 years ago. I was building a huge 4 foot disk sander and had no idea what I was doing. Got all the stuff and ended up giving it all back because my parents didnt care about my happiness in highschool.
Just starting out and looking at a cheaper 1x30 and it's got a disk sander too so I was wondering if I'd ever use it... will now cheers mate
Excellent video! I have the same grinder, mine's 8" Dia. but isn't faced to 1 degree. I'm a machinist so that's my project for the weekend!! I know that 1 degree face will be a game changer for me and the projects I do on it.
I thought I should mention that I use Elmers spray on adhesive, its in an orange & blue spray bomb ( sorry I don't have the product code handy), it works good so far.
Thanks a lot!!
Thank you! I will give that a try! Cheers
I do all my beveling on a huge bevel guide that uses 2x72 belts. I am ready to move into a electric disc or conventional 2x72 grinder. Does either machine have the capabilities to be a stand alone go to machine without the other! Thank you for your time in making these videos, in my opinion you are the best video maker in the business. Thank you again!
2x72 is the king!
I’ve seen other makers use these but they didn’t really sell it the way you did. I need to get one now. Thanks for another great video. Also fuck the haters.
Agreed! Thanks for checking it out. Nick wheeler uses a disc in the same way, if he does it how could you argue right
Congratulations for the video!!! Today I adapted a 6" wood disc to my 5" disc sander and used hookit sand pads. They are softer and as I can´t control the speed for me it´s perfect! The result is excellent, it takes away all risks and scrathes. And I'm going to test Trizact 1500, 3000, 5000 grit pads for polishing!!!
Fantastic!
Aarron, this is a great video, however you failed to point out that the 1 Degree disc is actually a cone and so trying to flatten a blade will actually leave a very small hollow grind, the bigger the blade the more perceptible it becomes. I make almost only kitchen knives and it really shows up. My new approach was to buy a 12" woodworking disc sander and install a VFD. I have no experience with the feathering compound but it is something I look forward to trying out on my Beaumont 9". Thanks for the video!
Interesting! I have ground up to 3 inch wide stock and never noticed any hollow from the 1 degree
Another advantage is when you're moving the knife on the disk, the grit is moving in slightly different directions relative to the knife, which helps it cut faster.
Yes it does!
Great video, Airin! ，I also won't discard those sandpapers.
I definitely use it all
I found from doing this myself that if you don't press so hard the paper lasts way longer for a addition 3min of time. Also Red Label abrasives will make you those discs to any size in any grit. They will also last a lot longer. I use mine upto a equivalent 600 grit on a compound abrasive(also known as trizac) and that lasts near forever.
Interesting!
Thanks for the video. I really hate hand sanding, I spend a lot of hours doing it. A few years ago I develop tendonitis on my right elbow because of that...
At what RPMs do you use it?
don't think anyone loves hand sanding, often sit in front of the TV in the evenings doing it, far less boring that way, having said that a disc sander isa now on the list to buy when I can so cheers for that, most useful info again, and the knives look great as well
How do you like that AMK horizontal grinder? I just got an AMK-77 2X72 and I like it so far.
Good grinder but I could use a couple more small wheels and the guy doesn't respond well on ebay
Airin do you have a how-to video for those knife handle hex bolts
Not yet Rich!
Sweet! Couple questions. Who sells the vfd's like that and will they work on other types of motors?
Thanks
I bought mine off ebay but hundreds of sellers sell many different types of vfd units and yes they will work on different brand 3 phase motors.
@@Aleeknives Thanks. Found'em on ebay. Good news is they're relatively inexpensive, bad news is seem to be all sold out. They do have alternative suggestions though.
Thanks again.
I really like how thin those blades are. People forget that the primary use of a knife is to cut things, and it sucks to cut things with a thick chunk of metal.
I totally agree! Thin is fast and slicy😉
First off id like to thank you for the videos. Ive been making knives for a year now and your channel has helped me beyond words.
So, my question is. Does this technique only work with full flat grinds?
Yes
i'll spend some money to reduce hand sanding. I always dread that step.
Another fine episode Aaron. How much did the disc sander cost to build?
It cost me $300 but I bought the motor used on ebey
Time or the lack thereof is my biggest problem. Anything that will cut the time required to get a knife done is aces in my book. I already have a motor controller sitting on my shelf so all I had to do was order the motor, beveled face disc, and feathering adhesive. Everything should arrive this weekend so I look forward to kicking ass on hand sanding time next week.
That is awesome John! I guarantee your happiness with your choice!
Got the last piece of the puzzle in today and got it all put together. My initial feelings are it showed me some areas I need to improve on the 2x72 before heading to the disc. It's not a timesaver yet but I have confidence it will be. For now I will take the improvement in quality.
That alone will make it a time saver! If it has already shown you how to improve on the 2x72 and you can successfully make adjustments before moving to the disc that is huge! I don't know if it saves time but it definitely cuts the hand sanding time in half!
@@Aleeknives It was suggested to me to put a 1/8" rubber pad over the disc and under the paper. Your thoughts? I ordered a 12x12 sheet of 60 duro 1/8' rubber
Maybe if you are blending but I like the disc as it sits
Do you ever run into issues due to the disc spinning faster toward the outer edge than near the center? I would think if you didn't deliberately do anything to compensate, you would remove more material the closer you get to the ricasso since the abrasive is moving faster.
Looks great. Can it be used to polish hollow grinds?
I doubt it, for a hollow grind I would try the same diameter wheel you did the initial gri d with and then use scotch Brite belts to finish
@@Aleeknives Takes me 8 different belts to get an almost mirror finish and they arent easily available. Guess i'll use the sander for kitchen knives. Thanks for sharing.
do you use this beveled disk for flattening scales before glue up?
You could bit a flat disc would be better
If you had a wheel that was a little bit thicker and "flat" along the edge, could you put a thin strip of sandpaper around the outside perimeter and then work angles and such for finish "hand-sanding"?
I think you could!
@@Aleeknives Would it work to replace/swap out the metal turn plate with a wooden one with the outer rim of that wooden spin plate shaped to fit your grinding profile needs? Way easier to quickly make a wooden spin disk than a metal one. And a wooden disc would be less likely to dmg the blade if a slip or such happened.
@@Aleeknives Next stupid idea from the peanut gallery...
Would it be worth trying to make "grinding swages" for the disk grinder edge?
I'm thinking clamshell so they can be fitted to the outside of the wheel. Thumbscrews to secure them together around the disk. Have different swages available. One for grinding fullers. One for grinding side bevels, or s-curve bevels, or edge bevels, etc. And one to fit your standard knife design size that can do fullers, side bevels, and edge bevels all at once.
The swages, for visualization purposes, would be around the edge perpendicular to the disk face. Turn the edge into a larger work surface with a variety of quick-change out swages for different jobs.
The only thing bothering me in this, besides the high probability that the entire concept is stupid, is the seam in the sandpaper when put around the "grinding swage".
Been waiting on this vid, thanks! Like xthemadplumberx, I am curious on how this might work on lower grind lines. I think the best part of the vids was actually seeing that you come off the 2x72 with 'errors' or rough spots. I chase these with every knife I make and will think I'm good for hand sanding (which I find no therapeutic value in...it sucks) and after a short time, I move back to the 2x72 to further clean. This process takes me forever or until I say 'good enough' and FeCl bath it and stone wash. I'm hoping this will eliminate some of this. I also like the explanation of WHY you may have gotten one of the errors on the 2x72. It's those type explanations that makes folks like me see what they might be doing wrong.
How important is variable speed with this? I've not looked yet at pricing, but I imagine adding a VFD would significantly up the investment on this tool.
Thanks, as always! ....and great to see the dramatic increase in subs! Congrats!
I think the variable speed is a must. The 3 phase motor is $181.00 and cheap vfd's can be had for under $100 but I like the tech fm50 and it runs about $200
@@Aleeknivesdo you have a good source for a 3 phase motor
Check out Brian house over at House/work
Spraying it with windex will help unclog the grit and give your paper a little more life.
Nice tip!
Would it help to have a rubber surface on the disk sander ? Just curious, new to knife making, but do a lot of boat building so sanding is a big part of that, feels like it's sands easier.. great videos.
I know this is old, but adding rubber or any backing that has give, will defeat the purpose and your blade will become slightly convexed
Ho there from france !
I'm.going to make my own discsander, but i wanted to know wich motor i need to take, the power and rpm... Can you tell me this? Thx for your videos !
Hello sir. What adhesive do you use to attach the sandpaper onto the disc?
Thank you for your videos! I was looking to see a link to purchase a 1 degree sanding disk but was unable to find the company name? I hope the trolls don’t discourage you I personally love different ideas!
Hey thanks for watching Charles! No I don't let any of these guys get me down. After all, I am posting things to the internet you kind of have to expect that. I bought my one degree bevel disc from Beaumont Metal Works it was right around $100. Hope this helps cheers buddy
How do you keep the steel dust from blowing up your vfds?
Very useful, thanks!. What do you use to clean off the adhesive?
I use 3m adhesive remover
@@Aleeknives thanks for the reply
For sure Vince! Honestly I think acetone would work fine also but 3m sent me the adhesive remover and it works well also. It stinks really bad though. Acetone would be more pleasant on the nose
The 1 degree disc is a great idea! Where do you buy this disc?
Cool vid ! Just got a disc sander what grit ?
I like to run up through 220 before moving to hand sanding but you could go further
I would kill for a list of materials to build my own. Do you have to program?
This is an incredibly simple build! All you need is a three phase motor a vfd and the disc
Hey friend, did you ever try and sharpen a blade on that wheel? If so, was it good also? Best regards from New York!
"Do you love to hand sand when you're making knives?" The birds had some well timed "crickets" going there.
Honestly there is some joy there!
nice setup! Can you use this with longer blades?
Any length you throw at it because the disc has a 1 degree bevel so your stock doesn't touch the other side
@@Aleeknives Awesome deal. I couldnt tell from the video, did you hand-sand across the grain between using the disc sander?
Good question, I hand sand after the disc sander
What direction is the disk turning? Into the blade? Looked like it was going clockwise grinding both sides.
Clockwise when grinding on the right side and reverse when grinding on the left side
Aleeknives thank you much
What is the advantage of using a disc sander vs a higher grit on the 2x72 like moving up to 1000 grit?
On longer blades, the 2x72, can give you dips, if you are not using a jig ... not saying that there are no grinding wizards ... I've seen a few, however the disc sander ... try it, you'll like it ... said with a weird excent .... lol
There are a few challenges trying to go to "completely finished" on a belt grinder. First, higher grit belts on the 2x72 start to create a lot of heat and last about 20 seconds. The other inherent problem is that the belt, no matter how tight, pushes a wave shape across the flat platen and you get uneven surface finish that will have you chasing your tail trying to even out. Even if you slow the belt down to eliminate this 'wave' you have a splice in the belt which is thicker than the rest of the belt. The higher grit belts are thinner, and the splice becomes even more apparent. You don't see the problem when slack belt grinding, but on a flat platen the splice will bugger up your surface finish in a flash, causing you to have to drop back down in grits to remove and then work back again. It's a nightmare. The disc solves this because the paper is glued down. No ripples, no waves, no splice bump. You still get a weird swirly pattern which you need to hand sand out, but as the video shows, you only need to put a uniform scratch pattern on the blade to get a that nice satin finish rather than hand sanding out high/low spots.
Is there a link to the sander? I wanted to just make my own disc sander but hard to find the plate anywhere
I bought the disc from Beaumont metal works
I no longer care for full flat grinds myself. Will this work with a lower grind line?
It will easily work with lower grinds
@@Aleeknives well then, I see my next investment! My wife may shit a brick! I had one disk grinder at 12” and we could see it’s downfalls and I knew about them after the purchase. Now, I just have to explain with much more reasoning why another would help out with the cause. Can I refer her to you? She is a sweet lady, I promise
🤣
11:22 ouch. Careful 😮
What about grinding a knife from start to finish on the disc sander? If it easier to grind flat then why not?
That would take forever! It would also use a considerable amount more paper. The disc blows through paper fast
Get you some big magnets to place on top of your work bench to catch 90% of the metal dust.
Where did you get the disc for the grinder? The one degree disc? Can you share??
Thank you
I bought mine from beaumont metal works
@@Aleeknives thank you
Do you know if someone makes a 6" plate with a 1 degree bevel?? I've been searching. I already own a 6" disc sander.
no idea
I may have missed it, but what grit are you using on your disc grinder?
120, 220, 500
84 engineering the maker of the Steele grinder have a work rest attachment
That would be super handy
I have a question, you said the wheel has a 1 degree bevel does that mean it’s concave?
Convex
what grit sand paper are you using on the disc
I usually start around 220 and go up
What type of glue are you using?
This is 3m feathering compound