Spring Drive: A True Expression of Nature and Time, by Joseph Kirk
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- čas přidán 8. 09. 2024
- June 3, 2019
Joseph Kirk, Brand Curator and National Trainer for Grand Seiko Corporation of America, with special guests Akio Naito, Chairman and CEO of Grand Seiko Corporation of America, and Kazunori Hoshino, Product Planner and Designer at Seiko Epson Corporation
I have a GS Snowflake. It is so amazingly accurate that I use to set the time on my other watches. If you love watches you must get a spring drive.
I Concur! My Snowflake is Amazing!
Guys the integrated circuit is the weak link. That prevents the watch from being truly amazing. As it is is is just a quartz where battery was replaced with a spring. But it still has a chip for the watch to work. This makes is cheap for collecting. It's like calling a watch where solar cell replaces the battery a mechanical watch. It's not mechanical. They need to cut the integrated circuit all out even if accuracy suffers a few seconds.
@@tomhunter3848 Is a Tesla not a car because it doesn’t have an internal combustion engine? There were people telling Louis Breguet a timepiece only belongs in one’s pocket. Embrace innovation.
@@glennharris3862 he didn't say it's not a watch. He said it has no collector's value just like u will not find a Tesla in an automobile collection.
@@fleischpflanzerlmitsenf I might present the car analogy as a gas engine with a computer driving the fuel mix, ignition and valve timing. Not as traditional as a purely mechanical engine, but there are still plenty of collectable examples.
Holy shit I will never look at a Grand Seiko the same ever again 😳😳😳😳😳🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯
Thank you so much for making the entire session available to the public. Not only the presentations by all those three gentlemen from Seiko/Epson but also the discussion in the Q&A session is really informative and instructive as well. Now I am convinced I will keep my 9R66 Spring Drive GMT during my entire life and hand it to my son.
It was a pleasure to stumble across this video while researching the GS Spring Drive.
This is by far the best presentation on Grand Seiko movements, design, and culture I’ve ever come across...especially for the non-horological person like myself.
This is the best explanation I've seen for spring drive. Development started in the seventies and innovation is still going on.
The amount of work they put into this.. and yet market below Rolex and other big brand.. it's just amazing.. I bet if Rolex or other big names did the same. They would sell rh watch easily 3-5x the price
Thank you.
Really appreciate the times my 7 year old and I gaze at “our” snowflake and talk about its beauty.
Joe kirk has a pretty awesome job..
Just bought one off the strength of this presentation, something ethereal about this movement…if you care about the passage of time then this is pretty much a transcription device.
It's not eternal. It has a integrated circuit so a computer chip. It will fail and makes it comparable to cheap quartz. They need to remove any circuits and have it pure mechanical. Am disappointed I learned after purchased one that there are still computer chips inside. If I want that I buy a cheap quartz. They need to remove any circuits from the watch and make it pure mechanical as spring drive should be. This is a quarz where battery was replaced with spring. It's like calling a watch where battery is replaced with a solar cell mechanic. All the wheels are only there to provide power, while all the watch time showing is the chip or integrated circuit. I feel cheated. You see all the wheels and you think it's mechanics. But that's just to replace battery. The watch working is still in that integrated circuit or chip which makes is not last after the circuit dies and makes it worthless for collecting and passing down to generations like a Patek Philippe watch. For same reason it will also lose value except if you buy a very limited edition. But it's a electronic watch, not a high-end mechanic. Don't be fooled by the wheels as I was. I wish I knew about the damn Biden integrated circuit before. It's a cheap circuit watch sold as a mechanical. It should have no chip inside. Very upset. I don't care about the accuracy. I want a watch that will not fail because of a chip and I can pass on and I know will work for hundreds of years. This one will be absolute due to the chip in next 10 to 20 years not to mention in 100 years or more. F integrated chip circuit...
@@tomhunter3848 he said ethereal, not eternal lol.
Dude we get it, you don't like Spring Drive. But comparing it to "cheap quartz" watches is just asinine. Sorry you got "fooled by the wheels", next time spend your money elsewhere.
Terrific presentation! Bravo SEIKO!
Excellent video 🎉 Thanks
An excellent presentation by all. This is a fantastic movement that demonstrates Seiko's commitment to horology. A real labour of love and pursuit of excellence. I do wonder at its commercial viability vs a traditional movement, especially given the western snobbery around quartz. That Seiko can master the disparate needs of mass manufacture with innovation, technical engineering and aesthetic value demonstrates their (Grand) sophistication.
thanks for sharing these presentations! Loved the insights about the IC and the design philosophy.
can't stop watching.. this is a great lecture
Great video! Great content! Good job Joe and company.
saw my first spring drive watch last week and the engineer in me just fell in love
now i know about the extra hand work and precision work grand seiko does and how amazing spring drive is. but pinion polishing ? my jaw just dropped im still amazed 5 years after learniing of the spring drive.
Wow .... loved whole presentation ! Thank you !!! Best way to dig into GS !!
Very good presentation, heard it 2 times :) Have also 2 springdrive watches from GS. Thanks from Norway.
Extremely interesting presentation and and esteemed representatives from Seiko. Thank you for sharing. Perplexing position having what would appear as a technologically superior method for operating a wrist watch, but so difficult to overcome the apparent perception of watch enthusiasts that the integration of the quartz mechanism diminishes the appeal of their products. Certainly, their Grand Seiko line is on par with so many “high end” Swiss and German watch manufacturers. Interesting dilemma.
Edit: At 6:39 someone mercifully, quietens the crowd.
This was a great presentation. I just purchased a snowflake and can’t wait for it to arrive.
Thank you.
Thanks
Joseph is a great presenter
Great presentation - i've been fascinated by this invention / this is one of the best explanations.
7 min in and I’m already subscribed. Amazing content!
Outstanding presentation!
They are really spectacular watches
Very interesting series on Seiko and their spring drive mechanism. Great content !
Very good video. I wish he would’ve at least glossed over the advent of the Seiko Kinetic movement during his rundown of Seiko’s history. He went from water clocks to mechanical and then to Spring Drive. Seiko Kinetic gets little to no acknowledgement at all, ever. I’ve worn a fairly expensive (at least to me) Seiko Kinetic for the last 25 years, and it’s fantastic. It was a graduation present from my dad and my late mother, and obviously it’s very sentimental to me. I don’t understand why they just get no love.
You may have seen this collector's videos. He has a ton of GS watches AND loves Kinetic movements. Rare to see someone speak their mind. czcams.com/video/kgqREm1XO8Y/video.html
Thanks you so much for video
GS is changing the watch game!
What a great lecture. I think that's Teddy Baldasarre at 1:07...
I don't know how I found your channel but it is amazing!!!
spring drive.....thats my holy grail.....but for now i have a bulova precisionist. The poor man's spring drive Ü
I love spring drive but I do miss the tic tok sound of a traditional mechanical watch.
This gave me the weirdest feeling. The setting feels like a boring presentation in a hall like in college, but finally a subject I'm interested in!@
Thank's a lot for the insights. I wonder, what invention will come after Spring Drive.
Thank you for taking the time to provide us such a great presentation. I have been on the fence about buying a spring drive watch, but after watching this I might have to jump on it!
Edit: I'm also wondering if it would be possible to bypass the quartz crystal, at least for timekeeping. For example if the integrated circuit (IC) were able to calculate the voltage produced by the glide wheel such that it's spinning fast enough to move the seconds hand at 1 second. The faster that glide wheel moves, the more voltage it produces. Therefore there is a specific voltage produced when moving the second hand at exactly 1 second every second. I also know that this voltage can vary slightly at different temperatures as temperature affects resistance. Perhaps they can use the quartz crystal to instead read the temperature and send those readings to the IC which will use an algorithm to determine what that change in voltage should be to be running at that 1 second rate per changes in temperature. This may be slightly less energy efficient overall but it should produce a more precise rate of timekeeping.
You sir are an idiot and have NO idea of how things work. Please refrain from trying to sound intelligent, as you are just spewing idiocy in it's finest form. Have a nice day and stay quiet:)
The Spring Drive movement is a the biggest threat to Swiss watch industry.
GS 4 life!
What's the weakest link for the spring drive? Will the electronic component, e.g., IC, will outlive its mechanical components?
I agree my friend. The chip is the problem. As long as there it's a cheap watch and Rolex will be ahead. Nobody cares about the 3 or 5 seconds accurately. Whose who care buy 20$ quart. This is still just a quartz. All the wheels in the watch are just battery, while the watch itself is the chip, hence a cheap quartz not worth collecting. Big mistake. They need to cut out the integrated circuit and go pure mechanical. This is not a mechanical watch because all mechanical is just power. The watch is the chip and that is cheap technology not worth collecting. It will be abolete. I worry they will even drop the technology when they figure it out. They will have to cut out the chip or drop the spring drive. The chip is making it a cheap watch
@@tomhunter3848 Seiko never said its purely a Mechanical watch, that's why the presentation is explaining the technology and how spring drive works to cut out all the confusion and assumptions. Spring drive is about removing the entire escapement out of the equation to make the movement more robust and reliable. I own a few spring drive for years without issues at all. My friend has one from late 2000 without no issues and maintains accuracy like the day he bought it.
@@josevasquez1781 this guy is all over Spring Drive videos slobbering over himself saying Grand Seikos are just "cheap quarts" and he's upset that he bought one because he "got fooled by the wheels".
He has problems.
@@andrewcalvarese I don't believe SD are cheap at all, i have many watches including hand wound, auto, SD and have owned Kinetic and solar a years back. Spring Drive is accurate, long service intervals and a combination of quartz and mechanical. I do favor mechanical as I own a few of those, my father worn quartz for years and I would never say he own a cheap watch or look down on him and say some dumb shit.
@@josevasquez1781 I was talking about the guy you were replying to, Tom Hunter. I wasn't talking about you. ☺️
Teddy Baldassarre spotted! 1.08.33
so it's unofficial; Seiko makes the most technologically complex, and masterful time-pieces. but the Swiss seem to own the prestige...
Every time this guy says "Right" or "Alright" drink a shot... On a serious note, my first foray into watches (Above $500) will be the SBGE257.
Upon consideration, I suspect that having one huge spring in one large barrel might increase the torque too much. The electro-magnetic brake is powered by very weak current, so I would assume the amount of braking power is limited. I imagine by stacking low-torque springs in one barrel one might be able to regulate the problem of too high a torque output from that barrel somewhat. Although I'm unsure how to regulate it the torque doesn't simply add up to too much torque. not knowing the spring dimensions of the single spring versus the dimensions of the double springs. Are they individually thinner? Is that necessary?
But why the quartz question was treated so velvety and circumspect is beyond me. Quartz as a technology really beats the living daylights out of any mechanical movement in terms of shock resistance, positional variation (or the absence of it) and accuracy. That said, quartz is unjustly considered "less" by snobs.
One would assume that members of a horological society would be interested in ANY technology that measures time, be it spring driven, mechanical, digital, battery powered or capacitor driven. I've said this elsewhere: A simple 50 buck Casio quartz is the culmination of 2500 years of scientific progress in measuring time. We've known mechanical time for 2200 years now, but it took from the Antikythera mechanism until 1969 to come up with a working quartz watch.
More respect for that technology would be justified. Regardless of a fondness for mechanics. :)
yeah quartz snobbism is so stupid
Every other sentence ends in "-aight?"
If you can not add the audience soundtrack to future videos that would be greatly appreciated as it gets annoying trying to hear the speaker over it when you’re wearing headphones.
And who said grand seiko was not complicated
Will Spring Drive accuracy be affected by machine that emits strong magnetic field?
Yes. There are a number of warnings in the user manual (in my case the 9R66 movement) warning about external magnetic influences. Parts of the mechanism can become magnetised which then adversely affects the watch accuracy. The watch then requires a professional service to disassemble and demagnetise the affected parts.
20:18 Nagano Prefecture, not Nagno
Name me a swiss watch company that is constantly upgrading its movements like GS?
Hublot
@@coolboy5428 aren't they kind of like the joke of the Swiss watchmaking companies
I don't believe the hands actually receive zaratsu, yes?
The 7 who thumbs down the video are from Rolex fanboys.
Great material...pretty sure the presenter used the word "right" over a thousand times though 🤦🏼
Why are you using masonry symbolism in your logo? Mason?
I dont understand, why not just use a quarts watch? Why all the mechanical Frippery? Spring drive is a quarts watch with a bunch of unnecessary and expensive mechanical parts. A mechanical watch on the other hand needs those mechanical parts because its keeps time mechanically.
The white elephant question in the room nobody dared to ask is, what is the live expectancy of the integrated circuit in the spring drive? And what happens to the watch when the integrated circuit fails as it eventually all does? Am sure it won't last hundred of years as pure mechanical high-end watches like Patek do that can be passed down the generations. And this is the problem for collectors and why high-end watches are not quartz. Quartz is same as fast food is to master chef dining. I purchased a few spring drive not aware realy there is still integrated circuit or computer chip in it and I hate it. It is not about accurately Seiko, else we could stay with the 50$ watches. It is about the idea to last forever at least as an idea. An integrated circuit will not. It will become absolute and so the watch worthless. Yes no friction of some parts in spring drive is a way forward, but going to quartz chip not. For all purposes a spring drive watch is not really a mechanical watch but a quartz watch. Only a watch that can function purely without any computer chips integrated circuit is truly a pure, and eternal watch worthy of passing down the generations. Spring drive simply replaced the battery with a spring, but is basically a quartz due to integrated circuit. It's like calling a watch where battery would is replaced with solar cell to no power it that now it is mechanic. It is not. And so a spring drive is still just a quartz with manual battery source. And only pure mechanic watch is worthy of high end price and collecting. Please Grand Seiko develop a spring drive watch without integrated circuit of any kind. Let the electricity from spring drive directly power the watch without integrated circuit and develop some other pure mechanical system if desired to serve as feedback to keep same accuracy. Even if accuracy is less watch will be better and closer to the ideal of the eternal watch. An integrated circuit destroys the beauty of the test of the watch and is nothing like nature the watch watch to represent. It is artificial, unnatural. Cut it out go back to drawing board and if accuracy is so important develop a mechanical replacement for the integrated circuit. That will be the true beauty.
I was ready to purchase a spring drive until I saw this video and read your comments specifically. Thank you. I can't waste six grand on a quartz.
So you’re just speculating on the obsolescence of a circuit? Circuits are far less likely to “go bad” than any mechanical device as there is no wear. Unless you are pretending that mechanical watches never need any of their mechanical parts replaced from time to time which is silly.
"Am sure it won't last hundred of years as pure mechanical high-end watches like Patek do that can be passed down the generations." There's no way in hell a mechanical watch is lasting hundreds of years. It's a watch of Theseus at that point, with most of its components having been swapped out many times.
Also, do you really care what happens to a possession of yours hundreds of years after you die? I don't. Spoiler alert: It's gonna get sold off.
Dude if you dislike Spring Drive so much why did you buy them instead of one of the many mechanical Grand Seikos?
@@andrewcalvarese I’m pretty sure he’s full of it.
"It vibrates at 4hz PER SECOND". I have never in my life heard something so idiotic, and from a speaker at HSNY no less. That is like saying something vibrates at a rate of 4 times per second per second.
chill dude