The NHL Has A Hitting Problem
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- čas přidán 19. 12. 2023
- #nhl #hockey #vancouvercanucks
Recently, there has been a lot of controversy in NHL Hockey regarding hitting. More specifically hits from behind. We dive into this problem more & why it's becoming more & more prominent this season.
Links:
Justin Bourne's Article on the generational gap in hitting - www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/...
Mark Spector's Article on hitting from behind with Mathias Ekholm - www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/why-chec...
John Tortorella on the current state of hitting in the NHL - www.nbcsportsphiladelphia.com... - Sport
That Datsyuk dodge making the 2 players collide just encapsulates him as the genius he was
Reverse Uno card. I died laughing.
damn, how was he with the puck and still managed to see that coming...
@@joe_cannot_dance they call him the magic man for a reason 🙌
czcams.com/video/iCKLRkqvCdM/video.html&ab_channel=GTImkv07
straight out of a cartoon. i'd have a picture of that contact hanging above my fireplace 😂
Grew up as a defensemen and now when I watch the NHL I'm always shocked how they swipe at the puck when they just need to lay the body out
and how slow they go into the corner to retrieve a puck and don't look behind them or move. blows my mind
@@Trayne You would feel like it would be the opposite considering how fast the game has become, but for some reason these guys get the puck in the corner and are not expecting someone to come check them. A lot of times a defender will pivot the wrong way as the rusher is coming in, putting themselves in an awkward position and instead of trying to absorb the hit, they just put themselves in more danger.
Just viewing this video, a large portion are coming under the goal line and in the corners. Only thing I could think about to resolve this issue is developing a rule for checking when around these areas. Also if they truly want to protect their players from serious injury, they will need to start handing out tougher and more consistent punishments for the charging/hit to the head penalties.
@@Trayne remember touch icings as a young defensemen. What a thrill skating as hard as you can to meet your doom!
They cannot step up or finish forechecks or they will get penalty
I'm amazed how many crosschecks, slashes, elbows and hits from behind never get called. The league is getting dirtier because of the game management from the refs. Once the players figure out who the refs are favoring it's open season for headhunting. How in the world are they supposed to brace for checks when they're getting elbowed if they try to take it clean? The refs and Bettman are the problem.
The players have no idea what's a penalty so they can't just go out and play they're always trying to calculate their odds of a cheapshot because the refs are looking the other way. I've lost count of the times I've seen a ref looking directly at a headshot or a highstick turn his head away so he doesn't see it. The league is a freaking joke, worse, it's corrupt.
I grew up as a goalie in the 90s and millennium. Even we were taught how to body check and take hits against the boards just for the safety aspect.
And yet people still didn't always protect themselves then and still got rocked on these hits just as much as today. This is not a 'new' problem that the league is facing today. It's ALWAYS been in the league.
I didnt play anything but net for 18 straight years of hockey. and yes. even i knew how to take and recieve a hit. you had to if you were gonna play the puck
Hitting makes it so unskilled hockey players can equalize with those who out skate and deke them. it wont go away until penalty's double and fines are introduced. top 3 best hockeys games are games where theres no intentional hits and its all skill.
This is why I have such a tremendous respect for Crosby, Datsyuk etc. they were trailblazers in the crossover from physicality to skills, and they did it all in the face of ruthless defence that would blow them up every now and then
Jagr was the man. He would be the GOAT had he not lost 4 years cleanly in his career to lockouts / shutdowns
Always felt that the labeling of Crosby as a "crybaby" was a little unfair. Half of the young guys in the league today owe their style of play to him and wouldn't have been able to do it in the beginning of his era.
Crosbey had to retire due to concussions
@@YdoIneedahandle869what are you on about? Crosby’s still playing and is in top form right now. Do you watch the game, or just comment on the internet?
@@yeah-sn7jvhave you ever watched his career? He's an all-time crybaby. They literally started enforcing diving because everybody started copying him.
I think there is another answer to your question. I'd say that if the NHL wants to go this way with no dangerous hits and no head hits, they can make sure it's done correctly, they just need the Refs and DPS to be consistent when it comes to the penalties for doing these things. That includes embellishment penalties btw.
Don't blame the refs. They are put into impossible situation by the owners, GM's and coaches, as well as the league from other side.
Most penalties nowadays are set to a standard where it is easy to say yes or no to a penalty. Hits along the boards is not. There the range of things which that have to take into consideration is just way too wide to make all hits easy to call. It was way easier when harder and more dangerous hits were allowed. Other way is to call almost every hit a penalty. Both would be easy. But it is not how hockey is supposed to be played.
@@RoyalMelaSorry dude, but if you think there is an easy standard that everyone goes with your just not watching the game. A slash is a slash... unless it's late in the game, or the other team is on the PP, or the team already has had 4pps to the others 1. Or... whatever. Consistency is the biggest issue within NHL officiating and the DPS, hands down.
Players are taught to hit as hard as possible to injure their opponents, and to use the boards as weapons. There's no other reason than to injure your opponent to hit as hard (and high) as possible. You can "separate the body from the puck" without sending someone into the concussion protocol. But this is what coaches want, and what players do. I agree, the NHL DPS needs to x10 suspensions, ditch the fines altogether, and start meting out punishments for these hits from behind/slewfoots (dangerous trips!), crosschecks to downed opponents, etc. If you make in painful and make it consistent, the players will stop doing these idiotic things (barring that guy who gets called up from the AHL for the sole purpose of attacking your next opponents star player).
You're not wrong...player safety is laughable with their suspensions...it's literally like playing a slot machine in terms of what punishments they assign to hits... Zero consistency
@@ericweeks8386do you play hockey??? Mist if these players are friends... Shut the fck up if you dont know what you're talking bout
One of the best nhl hit avoiders is Panarin. If you just watch his game he knows when to take chances and always evades/prepares for hits before they come. He is like 175 lbs and does it effortlessly as a 32 year old. You were right, the older generation knows what they are doing when it comes to hitting.
if 150 kilogram psycho comes trying to kill me in wall i would move
I honestly think watching skilled players evade hits is one of the most impressive aspects of the game. Watching a Datsyuk dangle a guy while simultaneously evading a hit is so much better than just the crazy dangles of today but no threat
He learned from the best. Showtime was rarely touched.
Jaromir Jagr would toy any player today with these wobbly skaters
He's almost going backwards and forwards at the same time, loves to take fadeaway shots
I grew up in the 90's and 2000's when Scott Stevens, Chris Pronger and Adam Foote were laying people out almost every game... Scott Stevens especially embodies this period in my mind because not only did he hit you like a brick wall, his teams also won Cups. My favorite player back then was Pavel Bure and I can only dream of how much a player with his skillset would've dominated in today's game where it's more about finesse and hitting has largely gone missing from the game.
Grew up playing in Toronto’s GTHL, was a defence man and lived for the “art of hitting”. I am the same age group as Marner, we had hitting in our age group since we were 8.
Obviously, with hitting since we were young made us very good at that aspect of the sport. I remember playing stacked American travel tournament teams that were more skilled than us, but didnt have hitting in their leagues and we would literally bulldozer them.
With that being said, I had many teammates who ended up suffering from several concussions. Some of which were told by doctors they can’t play hockey anymore. Most of those concussions came from hits from behind when they weren’t expecting it. Despite being well trained to receive a hit, it just takes getting caught off guard once during a dangerous play to suffer a serious injury. Similarly, despite playing a physical game all my life, and honestly trying to be clean, I also managed to mistakenly receive a few suspension for hitting from behind.
Anyways the point I am making is that I had many talented friends who had to hang up the skates from competitive hockey early due to concussions. I know it is part of the sport, but it’s probably not worth kids getting brain injuries during critical years of their development… especially considering most won’t be able to make a living by playing hockey.
Do you genuinely see the first hit, the one from last weeks BuffaloMontreal game, as problematic from the standpoint of the guy laying the body into his man..?
The puck carrier makes a deliberate move to center himself between the puck and his man with zero lateral movement & no movement of the puck whatsoever; that's textbook delay of game, short of stopping the puck in its tracks. The conversations that start around this topic just hurt my brain...
I understand the sentiment here, and watched long enough to see some highlights that are genuinely problematic (especially Pasta & Kane)...
But Robinson literally hit the brakes before even hitting his man. That sticks out from all the rest, and this goon managed an entire thematic video essay without even noting any difference between the hits. This is the very serious issue; bundling up 10 highlights to make some grandiose statement as opposed to addressing incidents case-by-case as should be customary & efficient.
Robinson approached his man from behind, hit the brakes, waited for him to choose a side, and initiated contact without throwing a body check. Throwing your arms forward is an arms check, boarding match penalties do not typically get handed out for arms checks. The guy literally had one hand off the stick PLAYING THE PUCK. By the NHL rules this is genuinely textbook in terms of what they say you're 'allowed' to do on the boards there as a forechecker.
@@thewat3rcompany sort of...but, any time you see the numbers, you should hit the guy from the side. In a 'kids' league, he would of being thrown out of the the game.
What team in level did you play in the GTHL because I played for Bulldogs GTHL
@@thewat3rcompany I have no problem with that first Buffalo/Montreal hit, but "textbook delay of game" on the puck carrier? The puck is loose and in play.
Single A in the GTHL is non-contact for all ages.
I’ve seen a few games and its obvious that the kids are not protecting themselves around the boards. Even in open ice, they don’t seem to be aware of the potential for a collision or incidental contact. The play is slow, so the odds of something major happening is low.
NCAA womens hockey is non-contact, yet has an extremely high concussion rate. Safe to say that their game is significantly faster than boys single A, and perhaps blending “non-contact hockey habits” with a faster, more competitive hockey environment is the reason for such a high concussion rate.
I think non-contact single A is a good idea and that its important for the higher levels (AA AAA) to keep hitting in the game, to prepare kids for Junior, Collegiate or Pro. Considering that players can move onto Junior as young as age 16, I think hitting should start in U13.
Literally had a drill called the gauntlet... line players up 5 feet apart or so 2 feet from the boards, and you have to make it from one end to the other, and you get hit by every single player. Learned fast. How we played was clean hits, finishing every check. It was quite funny how scared the other teams would become to touch the puck let alone anything else. I'd love to see an nhl team play like that and see if it is as effective as it was for us.
Wow - completely forgot about this. I was a small player and this was always brutal. Kept my feet moving and 50% of my teammate would mistime the hit.
This is how i learnt, you entered the zone and took the hit or gave the hit
I’m very confused why we were taught this and players that have played for 10-15 years have gone against this. Crazy to me
Was my favorite drill probably🤣
@joelheise1916 It was definitely mine and I'm a goalie 😂
Another contributing factor is the NHL generally selects for players who grow early and generally big. As such through minor hockey their size lets them get away with never learning how to not get hit or take the hit in such away the contacts force is lessened. Every player that grew up somewhat undersized understands where and how not to get rocked.
The Hughes brothers are all undersized and can't take a hit.
@@captbloodbeardluke is 6’2😭 guessing u mean weight tho
@@ziippolighter yeah, I meant weight mostly, but Quinn and Jack are under 6ft and I know Luke's official height is listed 6'2" but he seems shorter but who knows
@@captbloodbeard fair, i’m sure it’s not always accurate
@@captbloodbeardas a Canucks fan I can’t say Q. Hughes has stood out to me as someone particularly good or bad at taking a hit. If anything I’d figure he’s pretty good at avoiding getting rocked given that although he’s smaller than a lot of his opponents and an obvious target that’s rarely an issue with oncoming hits.
For lightweights on the team I’d say Pettersson takes more contact but is also more adept than most at leaning into the hitter, which I don’t doubt has been learned out of necessity.
I played hockey in finland until i was 16 and i was playing one league below SM-liiga. Let's say the game was pretty rough in division 1 hockey. My father was our coach and i was playing defense. Every time i would take a big hit unprepared he pointed out to me that it's my own fault if i get injured in a situation like that. As a defensemen you need to be ready at all times to get run over by the opposing team. It's difficult to watch defensemen these days reach for the puck first and not be ready for impacts near the end boards. The same thing is happening in the Finnish liiga aswell.
Couldn't agree more, it's a sad path the game has taken in that regard
Suomi mainittu
No nice parenting i would say! I played Icehockey for 15 years and i learned: you can be aware as much as you can, but if some psycho on skates wants to smash you, he will find a way!!!
Meillä opetettiin/opeteltiin taklaamista ja kuinka ottaa se vastaan mun muistaakseni 13-14 ikäsenä
Whenever I go see my family in Oulu, I always try go to a few games, we don't get much ice hockey in Australia lol. Kärpät forever
The Crosby clip is wild compared to the newer clips. Just elite skill and awareness along the boards to stay out of harms way while still maintaining possession.
That mackinnon goal where he avoided hitting the goalies mask with his stick while at full speed was unbelievable 1:43
Not that good 😂
Yup! MacKinnon is the best after Crosby :)
Mcdavid is the best player in the NHL today and if he continues to play at this level he will be ahead of Crosby on the all-time list... @@tddongtv
The largest contributing factor, in my opinion, is teams focusing more on offensive defensemen, essentially a fourth forward, than on a physical defenseman who's just solid on defense. That's part of why Vegas won the Cup last year. They could put six defensemen on the ice who were large, played a physical style, and were solid in their own end. They, also, had a lot of big physical forwards who caused problems around the net, in the offensive zone.
Big reason why Colorado won the cup too.
@@thomasjames9678 Colorados defence were practically the opposite. They just had defence who could steal a puck and make a rush in a matter of seconds so fast the other team could catch them.
@@greathoonta3461 Makar, Toews and Byram yes. I was concerned when Girard was playing that this was going to be an issue, then he got injured and was replaced by J.Johnson. To be honest, I think it was a blessing in disguise as they didn't have enough physicality on D and it showed. J.Johnson, E.Johnson and Manson all were heavy hitters, not necessarily the heaviest but it was their job. Makar was also stepping up in this area as well. So they had 4 solid hitters on D alone. Nobody like Trouba, Gudas or Zadorov but their job was to hit.
Agreed. I’d go as far as to say the Norris is now an award for best offensive defenseman, instead of best defensemen.
I mean it helps when you can play like that and the refs won't call any penalties olagainst your team.
You’ve gotta be the best weekly summary/ current ongoings in the league channel rn. These past few weeks I’ve been watching all these hits all get different calls on all different severity’s and I’ve been bs the whole time que this video coming up and putting everything I feel into a much better worded nice to watch video. Keep it up
I lived up to mentality "Play the guy first, then the puck". Too many players tend to do the opposite. You can play the guy first while reaching the puck or being in posession of the puck, as well as not being in posession of the puck. Hands might be fast, but the guy never is. The body you can always catch. If you catch the body, you catch the puck.
The great ones can feel those checks coming and still 'head-man" the puck, take hits to make a play, & often 'roll' off of hits and maintain puck possession. I've watched Crosby his entire career, and yes he was concussed, (Badly so with small tissue damage & neck problems) but he 'absorbs' hits and makes plays as well as anyone ever to do it
The way players are going into the boards with their back turned is wild to me. I was taught never to do that and for some reason the best players are doing it. They are putting themselves into a dangerous position.
They're trying to get the puck, maybe people shouldn't check with their head down
you can get the puck without your face to the boards.......@@coastaku1954
Like it was said in the video - the *rules* say playing the puck facing the boards at a distance *is* the optimal play.
NHL players are going to try to milk every advantage out of the rules that they can, so is it really a surprise that they are going to play this way when the rules are telling them its the "better" way to play.
I don't think its necessarily a hitting or not knowing how to receive hits issue - its that the rules are saying one thing when we want hockey to be something else... and honestly its a tough situation cause it is dangerous so you want those hits to be penalized but at the same time those penalties reward playing that way.
Like ironically, making boarding not a penalty might be the best solution that way players are forced into playing around the boards better. And then just somehow have a way to penalize intentionally dirty hits
@@coastaku1954 what the fuck are you saying? Getting the puck without presenting your back is very possible. And who is checking with their heads down? No one and I mean no one checks with their head down
@@grahamschmuland1977 I agree. The rules have forced coaches to teach players to draw a penalty vs growing up a penalty was you being lazy. Now it’s finding every way to bend the rules. It really sucks cause we lose players early into their careers due to injury.
There's a real problem with everybody expecting to not ever be hit, clean or dirty, hits should always be expected. Most importantly though, guys have to stop freezing behind the goal line to make a play after the puck goes in. If the flow of play goes behind the net it's your job to follow through behind the net, and not just suddenly stop while somebody is flying in behind you.
beat me to this comment. guys have their head down too often and are either not expecting to get hit or get so upset after a good check you'd think they were NBA players getting a tap on the arm.
Exactly. Like even if you take physicality of it, dudes are skating so damn fast collisions are practically inevitable even if hits arent intended, and you have to know how to deal with it one way or the other
and more importantly, don't turn your back to the guy barreling down on you
Exactly this is hockey hits are going to happen clean or dirty people need to stop acting like it hasn’t always been a physical sport.
@@thatonelonghairedguy764 more like football players who overreact to the slightest tap on their shoulder
I always said it, NHL rinks are just too small for the speed of the game of today. It would be so much safer if it would be just a bit bigger, and also better for the game in a way, more space to setup plays.
Yeah, lets play bandy.
Agree. It's better on slightly bigger ice.
Olympic/World Championships sized Ice rink? I mean one My local High school level has for their league in South Dakota in Pierre (Pier) is almost the size of minimum dimensions now for NHL and is size of old Bunis rink when it was smaller in a slower game.
The thing is, players have decided to turn away at the last moment. It's very hard to near impossible to stop your momentum once you are half a second away from contact. This, turn around method has been going around for a while and it's dangerous.
I never understood the idea of, better put by back to a guy that is approaching me when originally he was aiming for my shoulder.
Gordie Howe remarked about the players today. He said there is a lack of respect for the other player that didn't exist before.
The players did not want to end another players career.
There were plenty of dirty players back then, but at some point, they had to pay a price.
There aren't many enforcers in the league anymore. If you banged somebody into the boards years ago you could be sure to receive similar retaliation. Now not so much.
Not true...there was a ton of terrible incidents done back in the day. And, this from the guy who threw his elbows around like crazy when he played. There never has been a price to pay, except maybe a fight here or there...not a big deal, in any era.
The players were not as big or as fast back then as they are now though.
@@JoelER78 Ask Ted Green about using his stick on players. He got his.
Yes, there were nasty incidents back then, but hits to the head were avoided as much as possible. No helmets, remember??
How big and fast now is not relevant to then. The players then were all approximately the same size and they were very skilled at the game.
the 70-80s bruins were nicknamed the Big Bad Bruins for a reason. couldn't shoot to save their lives but would just kill the opposing team
Boy, it's almost like having kids learn how to hit and take a hit later in their development than they used to was a bad idea. There is no stop sign on the back of the jersey in the NHL
And the junior leagues are starting to ban fighting leaving young players with the mindset that dirty illegal hits are the only form of retaliation
I heard that Rail Road companies take a hit on their insurance when they hit cars on crossings, so I park there at night now.
If they did put a stop sign on the back of every jersey no would notice it. Skating in at 25 MPH+ gives a lot of room for error. It's a fast game.
@@Stabsnipersthese kids are standing the danger zone with their backs turned to defenders. They'd be stretchered off the ice if they stood there a decade ago. They have no idea how to protect themselves
@@carlsoto1747 Or maybe, just maybe, these kids just want to shoot pucks, get goals, make plays, and have fun, instead of having their shit rocked. What happened to sportsmanship and skill? Now it's just "You weren't anticipating a hit? Well it's your fault!". It's like making kids go to school anticipating hits and wearing armour, clearly there is a problem with the school if they need all that just the survive
Very thorough and yet concise video. I am not a hockey player, but have enjoyed watching the game, and your explanation displayed a complete understanding of the ins-and-outs of not only the professional matches, but also how youth matches are impacting the sport. My complements to you.
Case and point: Bedard vs NJ. It was a nice clean open ice hit but he was not ready for that type of shut down. A tough welcome to the show lesson though.
(Coming from, ironically, a Hawks and Devils fan)
There are two bigger reasons that these hits along the boards seem to be more prevelant. Most of these boarding hits are on defencemen retrieving the puck and there were 2 major rule changes that have impacted this part of the game.
1. NHL cracked down on interfering with the forechecker. 10+ years ago the forward would dump the puck in and the close D would basically stand him up, allowing the other D to retrieve the puck.
2. The trapezoid. Goaltenders used be able to help their D out a lot more.
These 2 changes were designed to speed up the game, which they did, the problem is we've been teaching puck retrieval the exact same way forever and we still play defencemen so that their strong hand is to the outside (right handed D play on the right side).
That Tanev play at 4:45 has less to do with "Tanev assumes he won't get hit" and more to do with the fact that most players are better on their forehand. If this was a left handed defenceman, He'd pick up the puck on his forehand and wouldn't turn his back on the play.
So we're teaching and playing defencemen the same way we have always been, but now we also aren't giving them the same buffer they used to have.
Insightful post, nice!
Well forehand or backhand shouldnt matter because you should be able to gather information before reaching the puck and decide to keep going forward to avoid the forechecker instead of trying to go the other way which takes more time and makes you turn your back to the incoming forechecker. It used to be standard practice. Every defenseman should gather his information before reaching the puck by turning his head and ideally the second defenseman should call the play but since you never wanna fully rely on someone else you should gather your own info regardless.
Forechecker is at a certain distance : Go, Over since the forechecker needs time to catchup you keep the play fast to stay ahead of them.
if the forechecker is close : Reverse, Over or Hard (so you move the puck and brace for the hit
if the forechecker is cheating the middle THEN you can call Up so you dont move the puck in his direction.
You dont call Up if the forechecker is at that 10 feet distance right behind your defenseman because he will get laid out while changing direction. You learn that by Atom or Pee-wee AT WORSE and it should be automatic before bodychecks come in in Bantam. But you see shit like the Tanev hit where the lacking part is his information gathering he never knew number 20 was coming because he never turned his head to gather the info and we can assume his other defenseman never called him anything either. I dont recall the layout of the game i that moment but it seems like an obvious Over or Hard call because 2 players are forechecking on the same side so you wanna move the puck to the other side where your second defenseman should be and where you'll have numbers to leave the zone. Not turn around into the 1st forechecker while a second forechecker is coming at you like there was no end play there. Even if he didnt get laid out where was he going ?
@@jeanjacques9365 Watch the full play, not just the clip, forehand and backhand do matter. czcams.com/video/MGqPPnjhd4U/video.html
The puck gets dumped in and around the boards. Avs forward wins the initial race and taps it below the goalline. Avs have that initial forechecker, another player coming down through the middle and a 3rd forechecker coming around the net chasing Tanev's D partner.
At about 4 seconds of the video, Tanev does do a shoulder check and sees 2 Avs coming down, plus he already knows about the one who just tapped the puck behind the net. He can't backhand the puck behind the net because he's basically giving a grenade to his partner with 2 Avs on him. He can maybe try and feather the puck to the Flames forward in the middle, but that's pretty risky.
So he instead tries to make the forehand play which has a better chance of getting to the Flames winger on the boards.
If he's a lefty instead of a righty, he skates in and puts it hard around behind the net, absorbing the contact from the side. But because he's a righty, he's got to turn to reverse the puck the other way.
It's kind of insane we're blaming this on "kids not hitting early enough" or "NHL players are too stupid to look"... like maybe that's not the problem guys. They are elite level hockey players.
I would have bet my life the trapezoid would be eliminated within 3 years when they first implemented it. Seemed idiotic back then and still feels the same. All it did was create a bunch of dangerous situations where defenders are retrieving pucks goalies used to. If anything it slows the game down for the Brodeur types who can handle the puck well but it also removed the plays where the dumb goalie is wandering and screws up which were always entertaining. Both aspects were better without it. There is no plus to having it.
But of course its Betman's baby.
I was watching a game the other day where a player went to the corner to get the puck and a player from the other team skated up and then stopped short of hitting him and tried to stick fight for the puck instead of just hitting him against the boards and taking the puck. I couldn't believe it, either hit him off the puck or pin him against the boards. It's like watching 5 year olds.
women's hockey = NHL, no hitting allowed
Neanderthal thinking bud. There’s an issue where clubs and leagues in various sports are starting to get sued for long term injuries for failing to protect players. And this is fair enough. How would you like if your kid was fucked at 30 because everyone salivates at a blood sport?
A check in context is fine, but hitting (especially to the head) off the puck or when a player isn’t expecting it is going to be phased out.
Being an old fart and screaming ‘it’s a sissy’s game now’ is just moronic when players long term health is at stake.
I was in Croatia in 2014 at a KHL game and I walked out because the entire game was just like this. It honestly bothered me so much to watch I bailed and said to myself thank God the NHL will never be like this. Well, here we are… 😔
And people wonder why someone who loved the the game more than life doesn't watch it anymore.
@@mdipltd7404 because they like to see young men acquire life long injuries? Nice.
Played in southern Ontario through the 2000s and yes I notice this. They just don't know how to be careful in the high risk areas, they enter with no fear of receiving a dangerous hit. Great vid
As a guy who grew up playing hockey and football and experienced numerous concussions, I wouldn’t change my experiences for anything. When I played hockey we started hitting in peewee (12 and 13 years old), and I got absolutely obliterated during my first year of peewee, but that experience carried over into my second year and I turned the tables on everyone becoming skilled at hitting and receiving a hit. Without that experience I don’t think hockey would have been as fun for me, and even though I struggle with the consequences of those days, I don’t regret them one bit.
This. Concussions are over vilified nowadays anyways. They aren’t as serious as people make them out to be.
When i played single A during my teenage years the AMOUNT OF PLAYERS WHO TURN AND DON'T KNOW HOW TO PROPERLY BRACE AND RECEIVE A HIT IS ALARMING SOME KIDS EVEN TURNED THIER BACKS TO THE PERSON HITTING THEM AND THEN THEY GO HEAD FRIST INTO THE DASHER AND GET A CONCUSSION like this is serious people need to know how to absorb a body check and not be scared as a defenseman i knew i was gonna get nailed every time i was on the ice so i made shure that i was along the boards so most of the hit would be absorbed by the boards open ice you can't do much about except to try and keep your head up
Its also alarming how people don't use punctuation in their sentences.
The NHL did this. They made incentives for players to draw penalties 10 years ago. The NHL sped the game up by changing a bunch of rules then told the players to turn their backs and take it up the ass
I’m curious, what year(s) and where you were playing? I played a few seasons of AA, AAA and then finished up in a house league where hitting was permitted in North Van, BC, 2004-2010. Hitting became a part of things when I was 13 in 2007ish. From age 11 we were taught to protect ourselves. An opponent isn’t supposed to run you from behind, but they fuckin might so don’t give them the chance.
@@Captain.Dingus not the poster, but i started playing in '87 when i was 5 and i 11 (peewee), the first thing we were taught was how to throw a hit, how to take a hit/never turn your back to a hit and to NEVER hit a guy when you see his #s. Its crazy those basic skills arent taught anymore
@@Captain.Dingus Wiat you played in a house League where there was hitting because for the Etobicoke hockey League for house League there was no hitting but for Bulldogs and Etobicoke Canucks there was hitting
I get trying to protect kids from concussions and stuff but when I was 15 I was 5’6 or 7 130lbs soaking wet. Played AA against guys 6’ 200 pounds, thankfully I grew up when hitting was still a thing for 5/6 year olds and loved it so I learned to be solid on my feet but now you have kids who don’t learn to hit or take hits until 13 when this size difference becomes apparent. Teach them young even if it’s not allowed in play, coaches should still teach it in practice
Growing up, we always had a few things: 1) coaches always taught that the goal was to separate the man from the puck (and not take yourself out of the play doing so). 2) we had STOP patches above the nameplate that helped teach not to hit. “If you see stop, do not hit, wrap them up or make another play.” 3) you learned how to take a hit and be prepared for someone to follow through with their check.. as well as not putting yourself in a position to be injured. This 100% is an issue today, but the problem was I think it led to much less creative play. You couldn’t do certain things (such as cut across the middle) if you weren’t prepared to pay a price.
The onus is on both 1) players NOT to hit when they see numbers and 2) not to put yourself in a position where they can injure you. It was called “take a hit to make a play”. You make the play, brace for impact, and absorb the hit along with the boards, then everyone moves on.
Tom Brady said it best years ago and then again recently in the last year when talking about hitting in the NFL. He talked about how he had to learn how to get hit. How to lean and leverage his body when he knew a hit was coming from a certain angle. He talked about how it’s not just on defensive players to hit cleanly, but for offensive players to always be ready to be hit and for QBs to lead them properly. I wish I could find the quote but it was in a video podcast. It’d apply perfectly to the NHL now.
**Edit**
Also the NHL continues to reduce headshots as they literally still won’t admit that concussions lead to PTE. Despite it being medically proven. It’s ridiculous. They need to be teaching players how to hit and how to get hit. How to angle themselves when in each area to reduce the severity of a hit.
Let's not forget the increase in attempts to "dodge" hits, which increases risk of injury.
Yep, sometimes taking the hit keeps you in the game.
Half of the knee on knee hits that happen are exactly for this reason
Honestly it’s such an issue. I made a hit and the person tried to dodge so instead of me hitting dead center of their chest it was their head. They got taken to the hospital for the hit even the coach of the other team told me it was their players fault for not knowing how to take a hit
@@user-cl2jx8nm7s It's not your fault.
It's part of a bad trend in the game itself.
The saddest thing is not the lack of training nor any one particular injury. The saddest thing will be the day it is announced that fighting, and then hitting is taken out of the game for "being too dangerous" when the reality will be that that change is only the culmination of three decades of poor instruction fueled by bad thinking; evading the many decades where our modern "problems" were not occurring at all.
Until that day, shamelessly enjoy what you can while you can.
***3 REASONS****
1. Players not wanting to take a hit. Turning their back hoping the guy coming will let up.
2. Players not giving a sh*t about other players when they are in a vulnerable position.
3. The refs refusing to call hits from behind unless the guy is stretchered off.
I'd add 4. The Instigator Penalty
@@wheelsupbardown Investigator 😂😂
Very well said! Though I did not play much hockey, I did play a lot of football and was fortunate enough to have coaches that understood that being able to lay a big and safe hit was important. As well as that, they also knew it was equally important having the situational awareness to avoid putting yourself in a venerable position as well as being prepared and able to take a big hit. It was a skill I took with me in the little bit of hockey I played and it helped me learn quickly how to get caught in as safe a situation as possible.
I go to alot of ECHL games and tbh I think it helps alot for players to play in the lower leagues for a season or two. The era of the enforcer is pretty much over for every league but I would almost say, depending on the team, the physicality is definitely still there for the most part. Open ice hits are definitely rare but play can get pretty physical since ECHL teams pretty much only plays the teams in their division.
Man, this is basic stuff we were all taught growing up playing hockey... Head up, never turn your back to another player, tight to the boards, The danger zone, How to obsoard a hit... (seems to be a running theme in these hits) and you see the numbers or the stop sign you stop... Give these players a few suicide alley drills and they will learn... and maybe a checking clinic going into the pre season every year as a refresher might help?
Obsoard?
Did you also forget the “ take a hit to make a play “ rule?
This is just soft fans crying about hits that existed forever
agree. look at the D guy at 0:01 he is 2 feet from the boards, standing , not moving and holding the puck. If i was him, and would watch this, I would be very upset with myself. 10 -20 years ago he would have been killed
@@chriz9959 if he makes a habit of giving up the puck in that possession he will be out of the league to a defender who doesn’t.
Take a hit to make a play or someone else will.
The kids are being taught terrible habits when it comes to hitting. I know of a few different kids leagues that penalize players for hitting another player if they have their head down. Which instils the habit of avoiding giving the hit and not allowing them to learn to take a hit. Then these kids get to high school hockey and are getting destroyed.
I'll be extremely honest with you, ok?. People wants to see some action in this sport. Without this the fans would immediately lose interest and they'll stop buying our products... If a player dies, it's just an other great opportunity for us to make some cash on this story. We don't care about players health and we also don't care about the fans, they're both stinky and extremely dumb. We only care about our bank account and making sure it keeps filling up! LOL
@@Alfred-Neuman Not true. People want to see goals and thrilling plays, amazing individual displays of skill. Violence may have been some kind of a selling point back in the day when the hockey culture in general was vastly different. Just look at how many McDavid fan products are sold every year, and he's never been known for his physicality. Or how the Blackhawks got a massive boost from drafting Bedard, who's setting the league on fire not with his fists but his wrists.
@@tt128556 I think he's being sarcastic.
Mathew Barnaby - Keith Primeau - Darren McCarty
Darius Kasparaitis - Ed Jovanovski
this 5 man line can crush any NHL top team these days with the checking and defense.
@@tt128556hitting isn’t violent, it’s part of the defensive aspect of the game
You nailed it with your opening comments. Guys are not expecting to be hit, not protecting themselves. I recently watched a juniorB game and it looked like a non contact league. The biggest hit was a collision between two players on the same team.
I notice it too, and I'm 21, younger than a lot of NHL players. I was told when I was in U12 you need to have an exit strategy when going into the boards so you don't get hit in the back. It's like me and the NHL players grew up playing a different game because if I went into a corner like some of them did, I'd be in a wheelchair.
Bravo! You cited the best professional who has spoken out about the issue and hit the nail on the head that the @NHL are promoting players to making themselves VULNERABLE!!!! By getting a penalty reward.
I 100% agree that:
1) the NHL has (simultaneously) an older generation that is accustomed to rough (but legal) contact, with a younger generation that just simply isn’t aware of imminent physicality.
2) younger players (and some older players) are completely clueless about how to safely throw a clean yet forceful body check.
The NHL is in a crisis, even if people don’t want to admit it. There NEEDS to be an established and consistently enforceable standard for what constitutes a legal hit versus an illegal one.
coward generation who can't or won't play the man before the puck, they were taught stupid things by corporate leagues who want to speed the game up but make players into defenseless girls
@@timyumichuck9262 whelp… that’s an embarrassing, telling thing to write, Tim.
@@ryanshoults123 Another big problem is they want to increase the age for when hitting begins in hockey which will only make these players less prepared for eventual big hits. You need to learn that stuff early. If they end up raising the age these kids will be soft and then get into a league where the hits are all that much more hard and they will be injured
My god that slow mo shot of troubas hit on mier 8:39 is BRUTAL
Excellent breakdown with solid points on both sides, I’m glad you took time to understand each angle of this issue.
Thanks for the videos
When i was growing up in minor hockey, they moved back the age at which hitting was allowed on 3 seperate occasions in ontario. Not sure exactly how it went but for example kids were learning how to play hockey with hitting at age 15 or 16 instead of at age 12 or so. Kids are much less prone to injury and also much weaker than a mid teen so its a great time for them to learn safely. Not sure if that contributes to the nhl topic but i thought I'd share haha. Im 24 now so this potentially wouldve affected anyone that age or younger in the nhl now
Im 22 and we werent allowed to hit until bantam
@@rawbhd4477 I’m 60 with a kid in midget. Grew up playing hockey in the 70’s. Hitting needs to be part of the game earlier not later combined with better coaching and training around contact. This would better prepare the kids for bantam.
I’m 30 and got through not long before they moved it back to bantam. Hitting started in peewees for me. I always said they should have moved it forward to squirts if anything. For all the reasons he described but also 10 year olds are more close in size with each other compared to 15 year olds
They could start them hitting younger if they were able to organize kids/youth hockey by weight class. Until maybe 14/15. Some kids just mature so much faster than others. I remember some giants out there when I was 12, but by the time I was 15 I was 6'4" and able stand up to contact a lot better.
Nah that’s crazy, I’m 21 and we NEVER had hitting surprisingly. Sure there was contact and board play/battles but if you threw and open ice or against the boards hit, it’s a penalty
Well done and put together brother. Growing up in the 90's playing AAA hockey, this was something coaching heavily emphasized. Bracing yourself in those tough areas. Guys today are going into corners without a care or concern. Some of these hits are just the result of sheer speed and two guys coming together, but many are the result of just not being ready for impact. If anything, they should allow hitting earlier in minor hockey. We started checking at the age of 14 when I was playing. I recall some areas starting at 13. They should be doing this earlier, like 12. Kids aren't skating that fast at that point, and it will prepare them for when speed becomes more prevalent.
I play hockey at 14, and I am always careful on the ice. I am one of the bigger kids, so I use my weight as a advantage and I love to throw my weight around and hit people down. I can tell that the other kids don't expect hits, and they dont hit that much.
I think this is a point raised in the video, on the one hand we should train kids earlier. But studies show those hits and the potential brain injuries, while terrible at any age, are a much bigger PR problem at younger ages.
And as the other commenter here attests, it seems questionable to give earlier ages, with uneven physical let alone mental development, the legitimate use of violence.
I'm not against hitting in hockey, but it's not as black and white as "we need to teach them younger."
I'm 27, few weeks older than McDavid. I remeber one training, when i was 12, we just bumped to each other as much as we could. 4 guys in neutral zone trying to catch 1 player with only body and that one just bracing himself to cross the second blue line. Why? From 13, we had phisical league so we needed to learn how to protect ourselfs......
Half of the hits on this video are not mistakes, but carelessness.....
Where did you play? We started hitting in Atom (today’s U11) in the 90s where I played. I was small to and then between midget and bantam I grew from 5’7 150 pounds to 6’3 and 235 pounds and would destroy guys in the no fly zones
@@YerDaddY. Slovakia, we were actually second to last year where it was allowed at that age, kids born '99 and later could physically play from 15 y.o.
I'm dec. '96, so it was in 2010
As the parent of an extremely undersized U14 player, I really wish they started to learn the hitting side of the game earlier when all the kids were roughly similar size.
Size for sure. But younger would be better as the speeds are slower. Bring hitting back to peewees.
Just finding this channel. Great work man. Keep it up!
I think Trouba gets so much hate from everyone is because he’s so similar to Stevens in how he hits. He just catches players with their head down crossing the ice.
I mean hitting someone in the head with your elbow gets you a fair amount of hate too but sure go off
Only suspended once, years ago with Winny...So the Trouba train will keep knocking people off the tracks..
He has great hits but that chop with his stick was horrible
I love when devils fans cry about Trouba ,but love the old devils of the 90s and early 2000's
@@ryanshoults123 brother you are misunderstanding my comment, I don't think he should be elbowing people in the head either
Trouba’s specialty is jumping forward instead of actually body checking lmao
He's removing the time and space, we were taught to jam the brakes on at the blueline where possible, take the body and let the back checker pick up the puck. He's really good at this.
I grew up watching hockey in the 70's and the Broad Street Bullies won 2 cups on hitting, fighting, but the also had talent like Barber, Clarke, MacLeish, Leach and Parent.
So I've seen 5 decades worth of how the league is trying to turn what was a hard hitting league into almost a flag football league.
These days a good solid, LEGAL, hit erupts into a fight..
Those old teams knew how to take a hit.
Today, you look at these stars sideways and you get a penalty.
They NEED to TEACH these kids how to take a hit, and NOT every open ice hit is illegal.
A shoulder to the chest while the puck handler is looking down is just dessert for having his head down.
TEACH THESE KIDS HOW TO TAKE A HIT.
Great video, it’s always wild to see how players at the top level turn their back on the boards. I was trash at hockey, but the boards are the most dangerous area on the ice and always have been. Some guys definitely ignore that due to their own belief in themselves.
We need to start allowing hitting again before bantam. I grew up playing hockey when hitting was allowed as soon as you started. You learned to keep your head up and protect yourself. Gretzky knew how to avoid hits because he came up thru minor hockey in the 70’s when it was wide open. Checking was allowed down to tyke at that time.
That won't fix the issue. You need balance. A bug reason on why hitting has gone down is bc kids and teens are shoeing up with near cte and concussions that don't help them in the real world. In the nhl, all the enforcers used to be drug addicts due to opiods. They need to teach how to hit correctly and accept a hit, but lawless all out hitting like before. Esp when you have skilled thinner and younger players who cannot match up to the physicality. Will get run over everytime and ppl will wonder why there's no skill and speed in the league anymore
@@AC-ri2ph wasn’t suggesting free for all. There needs to be better coaching and training on how to take and give checks. They are showing up with concussions because there’s no exposure to contact early on and they don’t learn how to protect themselves. Then they hit bantam and it’s wide open with a couple of sessions - from what I’ve seen - on contact. The 70’s wasn’t the right way either, it was old time hockey keep your head up! or you’ll get rocked. This isn’t the answer either, better coaching, more attention and focus on contact, how to take/recieve hits earlier in time line, throughout atom and peewee.
Don Cherry used to say it the best...don't cross the trolley tracks.
I wonder what impact moving to European sized rinks would have...with how fast players are now the rink, in a sense, becomes smaller. Breakouts happen almost instantly (2 line off side removed), the forecheck creates pressure on D much quicker (pair that with the trapezoid and goalies being limited on playing the puck). That extra size could mean that extra second to move the puck and brace for the hit.
Better preparedness is key as well. Starting at 15 seems kind of ridiculous.
with olympic/euro rinks, it would make open ice hitting really hard if skill players have so much time and space. but the boards would still be a problem.
As a Short Track Speed Skater who needs Olympic sized pads, I approve of abolishing the NHL sized rink
No matter how much money leauges like the NFL and NHL put into creating studies that say the opposite, CTE is intertwined with the sports we love. Call me soft, but what we know now, it is important to take into consideration, and we need to take further steps (as we already are) to protect our players from concussions and TBIs, or at least acknowledge the problem. If people were fully aware of the impact CTE will have on their life, but chose to continue to play, thats fine. Right now, they're not, and the stigma is meant to keep us away from the very uncomfortable truth. This video brings attention to those areas where the information divide really shines, and makes this discussion invaluable.
How is every video you have so good! Keep it up man!
One of the first things i did when my son signed up for hockey this year was begin teaching that hockey is a rough and tumbly sport, no one is purposely trying to hurt eachother but you will get hurt just from the nature of the sport. Seems to be something that is lost on alot of people, hockey is a physical contact sport. People will get hurt no matter what
I come from a martial arts background. I was doing full contact sparring at 11😂
It's a little crazy to me that we are going to introduce bodychecking just 3 years before our kids could go pro? That's a recipe for disaster man.
I wasn’t a great hockey player but it’s crazy to me that I remember being around 12 and going to a hockey camp and we did drills on how to take hits every day. Guess maybe that’s not something they focus on now.
That’s the problem I play highschool and club and we don’t do hitting drills just skills and systems
literally.. at the end of practice we would line up on the boards and everyone would take a turn going thru while everyone else hits them LMAO
That literally sounds like abuse, why not learn how to shoot the puck and make plays, rather than be taught that anyone can hurt you any one time. Look at Short Track Speed Skating, the danger there comes from falling and hitting the mats or other skaters, so we learn how to fall, but I also know that when I skate, I'm not in danger of being checked or pushed, since those are instant disqualifications and even ejections from competition entirely, wanna know why? Because Short Track Speed Skating has rules and conduct, as well as the skaters have respect for each other, as well as a sense of good sportsmanship
@@RJ-be9yz Sounds like you'll become a great goal scorer, the League needs more of those
@coastaku1954 Knowing how to brace for hits and make a clean check should be a focus. I think it's an issue of safety. The better a player is at anticipating and preparing for hits, the less likely they are to get taken out of a game with an injury. Hits and fighting are a part of the game, and can be a useful tool when it comes to breaking an opponent's momentum, and turning the tide of a game. The fast pace and elite goal scoring is extremely exciting, but contact isn't going to go away entirely, no matter the rules.
It's the same in the Swedish hockey league (SHL) Players are just not schooled or not prepared to take the hit. In the end it's just bad play (generally from one taking the hit). So fully agree with your analysis. Hope to see some good match reviews from the junior championship's coming up next week.
This video hits the nail on the head. if you watch hockey games these days, it seems like players are Making more and more illegal hits on their opponents. but I don't think players are being properly taught how boo check properly. and how to receive checks as well. we've become such a coddled society where we don't want anybody hitting anybody too hard and sports anymore. but this has had a negative effect in hockey because there is no real emphasis in the junior's to proper checking. There's hardly any real in-depth videos on CZcams about this subject, when there should be a lot more. thanks for this video.
I completely agree. So many hits from behind go uncalled, and players don't know how to give and receive hits. It starts from the younger years though. No hitting until bantam? Til age 13? That's ridiculous. It only hurts these guys. They should be aware of the possibility of getting fucked up. Hughes example is prime. He should have already known that the flyers guy was gonna lay a big hit on him and give him a counter check instantly. Soft. It's ridiculous.
The problem of the NHL is that they don't recognize head hits as the cause for brain damage to the athletes. If they do, it will cost them a lot of money, so, they let it go, it seems.
Hits should be to separate a guy from the puck, not from his life...
Oh, they do. Not publicly, because of lawsuits older players filed, but look at the rule changes they have made. Also, you can get a concussion from a hit and not get hit in the head if the hit is hard enough.
What a great video. The title of it made me think this was going to be going in a different direction. I must say I agree with what you are saying in this video. How to cleanly hit a player and how to take that hit is something that should be taught at younger levels otherwise when they get to the NHL, they will be unprepared for the physical nature of an NHL game.
Bedard just got his jaw broken from entering the zone recklessly and trying to thread the needle through big defenseman. This video is spot on. Them kids need to learn how to play in the NHL, because you can't get away with it in that league.
The league should never consider ridding itself of hitting. It seems the biggest issue is hits from behind and boarding. In either case I believe there should be a more frequent call for a penalty against the one that gets hit. It’s never called when then the guy turns his back and the other guy gets a hit from behind call. While this type of play rarely gets called perhaps the league should consider it. Ref’s discrepancy by calling a potential 5 minute major and that gives them an opportunity to check on a possible duel penalty. This move can be done without new rule changes, just have the referees look at it for potential major penalties and game misconducts.
It's on the person doing the hitting to make sure that it is a legal hit, not the other player. Save for certain instances where the puck carrier ducks or turns at the last second.
To add to your points, in the US most leagues do not allow hitting until ages 16+. By then some of these kids are well over 6ft and 200 lbs. The game is already fast paced and now they are thrown a curve ball because the paradigm has shifted and the way they have learned to instinctively play the game can now get them hurt. Additionally, there is an absolute lack of respect among not just players but human beings in general. This season alone I've seen it all watching youth hockey: full McSorley stick swings to the head, kicking players when they are down with the skates, stomping on players, full bull rush charges ending with a cross check into the nameplate. And here's the best part: every single time the parents will go nuts and defend their child's actions no matter how egregious. Killed a kid with a stick to the head?: it's the helmet's fault not the kid that swung the stick. Kicked a player with a skate?: Well he had it coming because earlier he tripped someone. So yes, you're right. It's resulting in a league where the ability to take and receive a hit is lightyears behind other skill sets and players on the giving in don't care what happens to their opponent as long as they look tough on camera doing it.
the post bantam hitting rule is just apoplectically stupid.
Boom, there it is. "Hey, I just seriously injured a man, but because he was, ya know, playing hockey and focused on the puck and trying to make an opportunity for his team to score, while also minding his own business in the corner, It's all HIS fault that I don't know how to poke check or stick lift to cleanly steal a puck! And now I look like the hero to many other homicidal fans!"
i was just watching the 2010 and 2013 Stanley cup final games and the physicality really stood out. the other thing was someone would get lit up and the play kept going they didn't start a "fight"
Finally! I have played hockey since 1992 still playing. I se the same problem everywhere. A classic is the fast turn and someone gets hit to the board. Or standing still with puck one meter from the board. All this without protecting. This has gotten bigger also because its higher speeds now.
It's also insane to me how weak the league feels nowadays. I miss the big hits and physical nature of it. The death of the enforcer role was a sad reality. Also, a fight immediately after a big hit is so stupid to me. Take the hit, and your teammates will sort it out later with another big hit or a fight. It seems so cheap to me that players immediately drop the gloves after a good clean hit.
I like it better when it's all about fast players, awesome goals, and comradery, as well as sportsmanship. Big hits and fights stop the flow of the game and make it a matter of strength, rather than skill
@coastaku1954 are you already wearing your rainbow jersey?)))
@@hockeystream5081 What are you trying to say, man? Cause what I'm reading there is something very very homophobic and doesn't belong in Hockey
@coastaku1954 Watch a Family Guy episode "Patriot Games". I am for the ice hockey as it should be. All the "silly nannies" should play ⚽️)))) BTW, yes, I think it's stupid to make the players wearing the rainbow jerseys.
It's more than just not knowing how to take/give hits. The NHL is morphing into international hockey where the "dirty and rough" parts of the game are left out for offense and eXcItEmEnT.
And they don’t want fighting. If you don’t let ‘em duke it out, they will just do cheap shots
@@joseeduardo4327Then there is a problem with hockey if you think that the game HAS to be that physical. If that is the case, then players need therapy to reduce their homicidal tendencies
It's too bad the NHL isn't operating with international-sized ice sheets. Bigger rinks would add to the flow and curtail hitting. It's also too bad that fighting hasn't been outlawed.
@@mikephalen3162 The drama drives viewership. Good clean hockey isn't what makes the headlines. The NHL wants dirty hits and retaliation. Refs and the DOPS just exist to give them plausible deniability when a player gets a life changing injury.
@@coastaku1954 Hockey is a contact sport. You need to know how to hit and be hit. Just like American Football and Rugby. If you don't want physicality, play basketball or go be a grassy foot fairy
I've never played, but i've been watching for 40 years, and i always learn something new with these vids! Great videos!
This is a problem across most modern sports and I'm glad somebody is talking about it. Thank you.
Scott Stevens was the dirtiest player when he played it wasn't even close. Calling his blindside hit on Kariya "clean", even in the era when it happened is just staggering.
You wanna fix the bad hits and boarding? I've been saying this for years. You fine the hell out of a player, you suspend him for a dozen games without pay, and if he injured someone, he has to stay out of the lineup until the player he injured is back into his own teams lineup.
I'm willing to bet you start having a "zero tolerance" policy on bad hits and they'll evaporate really fast.
one man ruined 2 careers of 2 of the greatest up and coming talents the NHL had ever seen. Eric Lindros/Paul Kariya
Heavily agreed, they hand out these slap on the wrist punishments when one guy just tried to take another guys head off, unbelievable.
pronger, samuelsson both played in stevens' time and were arguably just as bad. stevens is only highlighted because he ruined 2 HoF level players' careers (lindros and kariya)
While I do not disagree with you, in general, have fun convincing the Players Union to go along with your proposal. Because they have to agree to it to, and if they wanted that strict of rules in place, they would be there already.
I think its a bunch of factors, one of the biggest things is how fast the game has become and everyone now is a big and strong. I think a lot of players take for granted they will not get hit and years ago you always assumed you were gonna get smucked, either way its damn dangerous and refs are terrible
I suspect you’re absolutely right on that. At the NHL level it’s a risk/reward situation where presently is reward outweighs the risk most of the time. A bit like standing in front of a 100mph clapper. Is it a good idea? Objectively, no. But they’re “in it, to win it” and all that.
One thing to consider is that in the US, under USA Hockey (where we don't start hitting till 13/14), it is explicitly written into the rulebook that the onus of checking is always - ALWAYS - on the player DELIVERING the hit. There is no subsection for players putting themselves in a vulnerable spot. I tend to like this rule, as it advocates for more responsible hitting, but it does mean that players are less aware of the dangers of hits and their own positioning.
That being said, I think more responsibility needs to be put on the players making the hit to make sure the hit is legal, not the other way around. I think it's wrong to ascribe the total responsibility to the player being checked.
You are by far and away the best hockey account on CZcams. Keep it up
Great video! Few observations i just want to mention as a referee of 14 years(played hockey since i could walk as well):
1. In Canada, hitting has been removed from all ages below Minor Bantam(13-14yr olds), Puberty hits everyone different so heights and sizes vary widely, and because there are two years in bantam, the first years who have never hit always get SMOKED by the second year kids. Back when hitting began in Atom(9-10 year olds), they couldnt really hurt themselves out there because they were all little. PLUS, the coaches in practice would bring out cushions similar to a gym mat material to push you with to teach you to resist the hit. I NEVER see practices do this anymore.
2. In defense of the players turning issue, i always agreed that th ereceiving player should be more aware and face the hit, but my referee supervisor said a hit from behind is a hit from behind because its a natural human reaction to turn away. Not that every hit is like this, but i think that reaction adds to the underlying problem with allowing any contact from behind even when no injuries are had
I feel like a big reason players turn their back to players bearing down on them, is because A. They know if they do hit them, they'll receive a penalty and B. It blocks the puck from the incoming player, basically allowing them time to make a play without having to worry about the player having a direct line to the puck.
I hate how players play the puck near the end boards now. They play in an entirely unsafe way because they know they are protected. Do I think players should be having their heads bashed into the boards? No. However, I think if a player intentionally turns himself away from a hit, there should not be a penalty on the hit as you are putting yourself in that position.
The hit in this video where Robinson hits Barrun, Barrun had PLENTY of time to move the puck, had PLENTY of time to prepare himself for the coming impact, and had PLENTY of time, to turn into the hit instead of away from it. Not to mention he wasn't even hit all that hard in my opinion and I honestly believe he embellished the hit hoping to draw a major penalty.
Wrong !... Hitting from behind should be outlawed ! Based on your theory....guys like Jack Hughes needs to learn how to take a boarding hit from Nakita Zadorov....the size difference and speed of the modern game (which is 3x faster), negates this Idea....they need to stop the hit from behind and shots to the head....period !
Mathew Barnaby - Keith Primeau - Darren McCarty
Darius Kasparaitis - Ed Jovanovski
this 5 man line can crush any NHL top team these days with the checking and defense.
Raising the age of checking to 15 will just make any future pros from Canada MORE susceptible to rough checks
Definitely a nuanced issue that needs more discussion at every level. Fantastic video and great analysis!
The other MAJOR reason is Betman has discouraged the 'Hitman" or "goon" on a club roster. Elite players don't know if they will have protection on the ice anymore.
Yeah you pretty much need a tough guy with a bunch of skill somewhere else and those are rare
@@bmac4 Exactly this, the overall skill level of the game has increased to the point where even your 4th line has to have talent, nobody has a roster slot they can waste on an enforcer. So a guy has to be big and tough AND pretty good at the game.
@@LazyLemming2Jacob trouba
Elite players haven't had protection since the mcdavid era started at least. What in the bs
Why would a Cap-Strapped team waste cap space and a man on the ice for someone who can barely shoot, can barely skate fast, and can only throw hits for minor transgressions while potentially ending people's careers and lives
Rule 41 - Boarding
41.1 Boarding - A boarding penalty shall be imposed on any player who
checks or pushes a defenseless opponent in such a manner that
causes the opponent to hit or impact the boards violently or
dangerously. The severity of the penalty, based upon the impact with
the boards, shall be at the discretion of the Referee.
There is an enormous amount of judgment involved in the
application of this rule by the Referees. The onus is on the player
applying the check to ensure his opponent is not in a defenseless
position and if so, he must avoid or minimize contact. However, in
determining whether such contact could have been avoided, the
circumstances of the check, including whether the opponent put
himself in a vulnerable position immediately prior to or simultaneously
with the check or whether the check was unavoidable can be
considered. This balance must be considered by the Referees when
applying this rule.
Any unnecessary contact with a player playing the puck on an
obvious “icing” or “off-side” play which results in that player hitting or
impacting the boards is “boarding” and must be penalized as such. In
other instances where there is no contact with the boards, it should be
treated as “charging.”
This is interesting. I haven't watched hockey in a long time so I didn't know this was even happening. Physicality was ALWAYS a part of the game and everybody knew that so these dirty hits with guys just standing there not paying attention weren't happening often. How are they not being taught to keep their heads up and be aware of your surroundings? That's like hockey 101 sh*t lol That Pavel clip you showed was a perfect example. With hilarious outcome😂
I'm on old school guy but the game is so much faster and more skilled now. Kids need to know how to hit and take hits cleanly and safely but the speed alone will always more players vulnerable.
There's more kinetic energy and momentum
It’s starting at youth hockey. We teach our kids to ignore the puck and initiate contact to slow down the oncoming check but there’s so many kids out there that actually don’t expect to be checked. We had a coach that wanted his peewee Major (no checking) kids to rush the puck up the ice along the boards. When they moved up to bantam (full checking) they were getting crushed because they thought no one would hit them. This video is right on.
I'm someone who grew up playing a non-physical sport and even we were taught how to avoid spots that you could get hurt, and if you did get hit, you didn't get injured. This is a must for high-speed, and contact sports. As hockey got faster, it got more dangerous, so we have to adapt.
Very good video highlighting a big problem in hockey. Unfortunately there are a few reasons why, maybe more.
I am 13. I live in New York, and recently played a tournament in a Canadian division. The division age was 14u. We were not allowed to hit, I received a penalty for it because we are allowed to here and I wasn't told about the no hitting rule in Xanada. I believe the hitting age in Canada is now 16u. I just thought that I would help inform people.
When I was a kid I live in Rhode Island they didn't let us check until we were pee wee like 12 or 13 is that how it is now
Hockey fans are insane. Some of you are seriously suggesting that subjecting a 6 year old or any one under the age to 12 to physical danger that could ruin their lives.
I remember when I was a kid playing hockey, where I was from in Canada they took away all hitting unless you were playing in the 'REP" levels of hockey (AAA, AA, A)
One guy in a clip looks back and clearly sees the defender coming to lay him out and he shows his back to him just waiting to get hit in the back instead of bracing
I agree with the new kids not being fully aware of who or where these guys are coming from. And Ekholm makes a point, it is a skill to know where danger is coming from. I think we could all learn some really good things from Datsyuk on being aware of everyone on the ice.
We were hitting at age 12/13 and the first like 5 practices were all about how to lay the body and how to be tight to the boards. From what I have seen there is a bit of ego with the new kids playing, thinking that their puck skills and skating makes them untouchable. In turn its getting them hurt.
The vets know how to lay the body and do it well 90% of the time. they either need to teach the new kids that keeping your back to the play in the corners is dangerous or have the refs call anything from behind that is a body check and not a pinch. Personally the kids need to not turn away from the play from that far from the boards its just stupid.
I literally could not find one thing I could disagree with in this analysis. Well done. Noting that the the NHL has a clash between younger less physical players and veteran physical players is dead spot on.
8:50 there is hitting and there is hitting. I believe the game is changing, and the trend is as we see it. less open ice hits, more just getting in the way and low impact body to body stuff. You say that Hockey cant live without hitting, which kind of hitting,. its apples and oranges. I think that hockey is very close to losing the big hits forever, and I am ok with that. I am an old school guy, grew up watch bobby Orr and his gen, but I really dig the high speed, fast and finesse of the new hockey play.PS Love the channel and how you present.
I find it wild that there was once a time where a player could be drafted based on how physical you were. The fact that there were "enforcers" that had to be considered. I also find it wild that people are throwing the blame onto the newer players when alot of older players are often clearly in the wrong. Sure knowing how to take a hit is important, but some of the most controversial hits of this year are hits that are actually textbook. Coming in for a hit from the blueline? Thats charging, and a textbook version of it too. The older players hold just as much responsibilty in knowing when to back out.
You pointed out the problem well. They need to properly take a hit and accept that hitting is a part of hockey. As a parent of a young hockey player that is coming to the age of hitting, I just want the entire hitting system to go away. It freaks me out.
The parent in me also wants properly worn helmets and mouth gaurds with full face guards is crazy as well. 12 years ago..... it would have been a different opinion. Scarry seeing some of the plays even in youth hockey without hitting and proper head protection.
From the title I thought I was gonna hate this video but just earned a sub. Personal accountability is a lost concept
Mickey Redmond (Red Wings colour analyst) has been on that for 15-20 years now.
Especially with altercations after clean hits.
Perfectly timed video with this Berdard incident.