Do Christians Have To Forgive?
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- čas přidán 7. 08. 2018
- Do Christians have to forgive? Pastor Jeff Durbin of Apologia Church teaches this powerful and convicting sermon on what the bible says about forgiveness. True forgiveness is vital to the Christian life and a blessing to the soul, don't miss this important message.
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I love that you give the encouragement of community church, rather than just putting out your sermons and never making the distinction. That shows real maturity as a pastor and not arrogance as though you're the only one that Christians should listen to. God bless you pastor Jeff and thank you for spreading the Word around the world. 😊
I😅p😅ap😂0😊
Pastor Jeff- Thank you for the encouragement to be connected to a local body of believers- This is so vital in our active daily walk-
Thanks again for your ministry!
Wow! You are one brave pastor. Iv’e never heard a pastor cite rebuking elders in presence of the congregation. Praise God for you, brother.
YES! Jesus said that unless we forgive every one from our hearts, the trespasses they commit against us, our Heavenly Father will not forgive us our trespasses we commit against Him. Jeff did very well to ask us to pray and ask for our hearts to be softened and ask, "is this me?" About the unmerciful servant. We must forgive. We MUST forgive. Lets take a minute and think about anyone we haven't forgiven. Please lets all forgive everyone. To that prayer Jeff prayed, Amen!
Thank you, Pastor Jeff. For being true to the word of God, this was My Lord speaking to me using your message to answer me. It has answered many prayers, I just want to say thank you and may God bless your ministry to be even more effective than it already is.
Dear brothers and sisters,
Please help me.
I found that this specific church is preaching the 100% truth.
It fits my beliefs 100%.
But I live in Germany. And I really really need a church like this. I want to get baptized from people who do it right and who are real Christians. Can you help me finding a church? Is there anything even like the apologia church here in Germany? I feel so alone with my faith. I can't find a church like this :/ the people I know who claim to be Christians are nothing else than atheists who say they're Christians. It's really heartbreaking.
I listened to this sermon before. This is my second time listening to it and this is a very powerful sermon. I go to a men's bible study on Wednesday night with the guys of my church at my church and we're doing a study on a book called Total forgiveness by R. T Kindell. It's a great book and everybody should know what forgiveness truly means because there is too many pretenders, too many people putting on the God face. This is a powerful sermon. I say that again, yes because it is. Gossip is wrong, homosexuality wrong yes we should still love those people. Let's forgive those who's offended us. I think if we do that then this world would be a better place.
Good word brother. While I don’t always agree with every video, this was heart felt and definitely Spirit led.
We must hold each other accountable to Romans 6, Phillipians 3, and Matt 5:48, which leads of course to Leviticus.
Truth Ministries AMEN sir i don't agree with hardly any of his video's he is not even reading out of tha kjv so it is kinda hard to take him seriously just my thoughts
Wow thanks for this and I met a guy who believes that there are many Jesus’s . He had a turban head piece on said he was a si religion?
The idea of confronting sin vs forgiving sin is significant for both husbands and wives. After signs of repentance, a brother or sister should always forgive their significant other. Sex, whether male or female, has nothing to do with forgiveness.
Which bible do you guys read?
When is Next Week coming back?
End of August or beginning of September. Thank you for asking! We have a brand new format and some exciting surprises!
Apologia Studios yay can’t wait!
Forgiveness is hard 😔
Is 59:44 supposed to be "Satan" instead of "God"?
I am wrestling with forgiving an unapoligizing heathen, continued offences...can you refer me to the word on this matter
Derek DiMaso Forgiveness is not to heal the offender. If you donot forgive it hurts your spirit and your emotions, Forgiveness of the unrepentative does not mean you go back for more. It allows you to put it behind you and clear your conscious and keeps your heart with the Lord.. Remember your father in heaven rewards us for doing good.. Forgive and let it go. This to will pass.
I would love to have an indepth conversation with someone about forgivness in light of church discipline . Matthew 18 (ALL OF IT IN CONTEXT) Luke 17:4 1 Corinthians 5 - While the forgiveness is the best path, there seems to be a condition of repentance and desire for mercy before it is given. Are we to grant forgiveness (the same way/definition Jesus forgives us) when one does not repent or even acknowledge the wrong-ness of their actions. Does Jesus forgive those who do not repent or seek mercy? are we held to a higher standard than Jesus? oh... and what happens when an "assembly of christian believers" does NOT execute church discipline, but has the mentality of GRACE AND FORGIVENESS FOR ALL - FORGIVE EVERYONE FOR EVERYTHING UNCONDITIONALLY? lets see the scriptures on those please?
(John 8:1-11 NASB) But JESUS went to the Mount of Olives. (2) Early in the morning HE came again into the temple, and all the people were coming to HIM; and HE sat down and began to teach them. (3) The scribes and the Pharisees *brought a woman caught in adultery, and having set her in the center of the court, (4) they *said to HIM, "TEACHER, this woman has been caught in adultery, in the very act. (5) "Now in the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women; what then do YOU say?" (6) They were saying this, testing HIM, so that they might have grounds for accusing HIM. But JESUS stooped down and with HIS finger wrote on the ground. (7) But when they persisted in asking HIM, HE straightened up, and said to them, "He who is without sin among you, let him be the first to throw a stone at her." (8) Again HE stooped down and wrote on the ground. (9) When they heard it, they began to go out one by one, beginning with the older ones, and HE was left alone, and the woman, where she was, in the center of the court. (10) Straightening up, JESUS said to her, "Woman, where are they? Did no one condemn you?" (11) She said, "No one, LORD." And JESUS said, "I do not condemn you, either. Go. From now on sin no more."
(1Co 4:6 NASB) Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively applied to myself and Apollos for your sakes, so that in us you may learn *not to exceed what is written,* so that no one of you will become arrogant in behalf of one against the other.
If you are in CHRIST, then your certificate of sin debt was paid for / forgiven at the cross, before you were physically born, while you were still dead in your trespasses and sins.
(Col 2:13-14 NASB) When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, HE made you alive together with HIM, having forgiven us all our transgressions, (14) having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and HE has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.
trying to figure out the context of this reply with my comment?
Are we to grant forgiveness (the same way/definition Jesus forgives us) when one does not repent or even acknowledge the wrong-ness of their actions. Does Jesus forgive those who do not repent or seek mercy? -
(Luk 23:34 NASB) But Jesus was saying, "Father, forgive them; for they do not know what they are doing." And they cast lots, dividing up His garments among themselves.
(Acts 7:59-60 NASB) They went on stoning Stephen as he called on the LORD and said, "LORD JESUS, receive my spirit!" (60) Then falling on his knees, he cried out with a loud voice, "LORD, do not hold this sin against them!" Having said this, he fell asleep.
GOD the SON was requesting that GOD the FATHER not hold the sin of murder against those who were not believers. Stephan follows suit as an example against unbelieving murderers.
are we held to a higher standard than Jesus? -
The standard is perfection. Are you perfect?
(Mat 5:48 NASB) "Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.
The standard is 'be holy". Are you holy?
(1Pe 1:15-16 NASB) but like the Holy One who called you, be holy yourselves also in all your behavior; (16) because it is written, "YOU SHALL BE HOLY, FOR I AM HOLY."
(Rev 15:3-4 NASB) And they *sang the song of Moses, the bond-servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, "Great and marvelous are Your works, O Lord God, the Almighty; Righteous and true are Your ways, King of the nations! (4) "Who will not fear, O Lord, and glorify Your name? For You alone are holy; For ALL THE NATIONS WILL COME AND WORSHIP BEFORE YOU, FOR YOUR RIGHTEOUS ACTS HAVE BEEN REVEALED."
what happens when an "assembly of christian believers" does NOT execute church discipline, but has the mentality of GRACE AND FORGIVENESS FOR ALL - FORGIVE EVERYONE FOR EVERYTHING UNCONDITIONALLY? -
That is not biblical. The problem with the "assembly of christian believers" that you may be referring to is they don't follow the steps outlined in Matthew 18, or they may be legalistic, or they may not know what sins are church discipline issues. Should every church have church discipline issues outlined in their by-laws? Without a reference to what is disciplinary, you would HAVE TO discipline for EVERY SIN committed by EVERY MEMBER in order to execute church discipline biblically.
Step 1A: (Mat 18:15 NASB) "If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private;
Step 1B: if he listens to you, you have won your brother.
Step 2A: (Mat 18:16 NASB) "But if he does not listen to you,
Step 2B: take one or two more with you, so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED.
Step 3A: (Mat 18:17 NASB) "If he refuses to listen to them,
Step 3B: tell it to the church; and
Step 3C: if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.
Why did JESUS say:
(Mat 18:33 NASB) 'Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?'
(Mat 18:35 NASB) "My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart."
(Mat 9:13 NASB) "But go and learn what this means: 'I DESIRE COMPASSION, AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
(Mat 9:13 ESV) Go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.’ For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners.”
(Mat 12:7 NASB) "But if you had known what this means, 'I DESIRE COMPASSION, AND NOT A SACRIFICE,' you would not have condemned the innocent.
(Mat 12:7 ESV) And if you had known what this means, ‘I desire mercy, and not sacrifice,’ you would not have condemned the guiltless.
Quoted from the Old Testament (LXX)
(Hos 6:7 Brenton - LXX) For I will have mercy rather than sacrifice, and the knowledge of God rather than whole-burnt-offerings.
(Mic 6:8 Brenton - LXX) Has it not been told thee, O man, what is good? or what does the Lord require of thee, but to do justice, and love mercy, and be ready to walk with the Lord thy God?
Allow me to spell it out. While Jesus OFFERS forgiveness to everyone, there is a heart of repentance required (not to be confused with "works" as repentance is not necessarily classified as work to earn forgiveness - so if you want to rabbit trail on that, we can)
Jesus DOES NOT forgive EVERYONE. Simply because some go to hell.
If we are to Forgive others AS (in the same manor as) Christ forgave us: are we to then forgive (absolve responsibility) for those who call themselves "brother" if they do not repent, nor consider what they have done to be wrong?
Thus the perspective: we hold ourselves to a different standard than Jesus in that we have been teaching to FORGIVE even if they are sorry or not.
By doing this we are holding only to grace and denying justice. (see: the weighter matters of the law: Mat 23:23 - and your quoted Mic 6:8)
I could give scriptures to support all this, I simply assume that you know the scriptures well enough to acknowledge these things.
Should we neglect justice?
I certainly don't want to say we should neglect mercy, compassion and love. but love does include justice (does it not?)
Please don't make this a matter of my scripture is bigger than yours - lets allow the WHOLE of scripture speak truth.
Please don't make this a matter of my scripture is bigger than yours - lets allow the WHOLE of scripture speak truth.
It is important to note that SCRIPTURE does not belong to me or you. This is not about me at all, but a proper understanding of the heart of GOD.
(Mat 12:1-5 NAS77) At that time Jesus went on the Sabbath through the grainfields, and His disciples became hungry and began to pick the heads of grain and eat. (2) But when the Pharisees saw it, they said to Him, "Behold, Your disciples do what is not lawful to do on a Sabbath." (3) But He said to them, "Have you not read what David did, when he became hungry, he and his companions; (4) how he entered the house of God, and they ate the consecrated bread, which was not lawful for him to eat, nor for those with him, but for the priests alone? (5) "Or have you not read in the Law, that on the Sabbath the priests in the temple break the Sabbath, and are innocent?
Based on the above verses, should justice have been enacted on the disciples of JESUS for "doing what WAS NOT LAWFUL ON THE SABBATH"? Plenty of eyewitnesses. JESUS HIMSELF saw it. NO WHERE in SCRIPTURE does it say that the disciples were "repentant, sorry or even asked for forgiveness" for DOING WHAT WAS NOT LAWFUL ON A SABBATH DAY - WHICH REQUIRES THEM TO BE STONED TO DEATH.
Does JESUS HIMSELF not bring up other instances from the Old Testament of the SABBATH being broken (the ESV says that the priests "profaned" the SABBATH and are GUILTLESS. (Mat 12:5 ESV) Or have you not read in the Law how on the Sabbath the priests in the temple profane the Sabbath and are guiltless?
I certainly don't want to say we should neglect mercy, compassion and love. but love does include justice (does it not?)
No where did I say to "neglect justice". Do you understand what happened at the cross? Justice and mercy kissed.
If you want to start screaming "JUSTICE, THERE MUST BE JUSTICE!" then be careful that GOD does not require JUSTICE from you.
NOWHERE in SCRIPTURE does it say "While Jesus OFFERS forgiveness to everyone, there is a heart of repentance required" Did Rahab The Prostitute have a heart of repentance for being a prostitute? Is her name not included the Hebrews 11 (the faith chapter)?
This is how SCRIPTURE speaks:
(Eph 2:8-9 NASB) For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; (9) not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Here is another instance when forgiveness was given WITHOUT AN ACKNOWLEDGEMENT of repentance or sorrow.
(Gen 18:12-15 ESV) So Sarah laughed to herself, saying, “After I am worn out, and my lord is old, shall I have pleasure?” (13) The LORD said to Abraham, “Why did Sarah laugh and say, ‘Shall I indeed bear a child, now that I am old?’ (14) Is anything too hard for the LORD? At the appointed time I will return to you, about this time next year, and Sarah shall have a son.” (15) But Sarah denied it, saying, “I did not laugh,” for she was afraid. He said, “No, but you did laugh.”
(Gen 18:15 NLT) Sarah was afraid, so she denied it, saying, “I didn’t laugh.” But the LORD said, “No, you did laugh.”
(Gen 18:15 HCSB) Sarah denied it. "I did not laugh," she said, because she was afraid. But He replied, "No, you did laugh."
(Gen 18:15 DRB) Sara denied, saying: I did not laugh: for she was afraid. But the Lord said: Nay; but thou didst laugh.
Where is justice for lying directly to the face of the pre-incarnate CHRIST in those verses?
Hey guys I really love your ministry and what the Lord does through you all. I think this sermon is great overall. The only thing I would like to point out is that it is very possible that the verse in Luke that Jeff said people might quote as a response in regards to this message, might not be actual scripture. It is a textual variant. Just a thought. Nice teaching though!
Here is an article on the matter by Alpha and Omega Ministries:
www.aomin.org/aoblog/tag/luke-2334/
45:50 - 46:23 - I know that you said "people" but I'm sure you meant "brethren in CHRIST"
GOD the SON was requesting that GOD the FATHER not hold the sin of murder against those who were not believers. Stephan follows suit as an example against unbelieving murderers -
(Acts 7:59-60 NASB) They went on stoning Stephen as he called on the LORD and said, "LORD JESUS, receive my spirit!" (60) Then falling on his knees, he cried out with a loud voice, "LORD, do not hold this sin against them!" Having said this, he fell asleep.
There was no reconciliation in those two instances.
Marks Of The True Christian (as according to the apostle Paul - although I am probably wrong as I am 99% of time, I don't think "acid test" is a biblical term)
(Romans 12:9-21 NASB ) Let love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is evil; cling to what is good. (10) Be devoted to one another in brotherly love; give preference to one another in honor; (11) not lagging behind in diligence, fervent in spirit, serving the Lord; (12) rejoicing in hope, persevering in tribulation, devoted to prayer, (13) contributing to the needs of the saints, practicing hospitality. (14) Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. (15) Rejoice with those who rejoice, and weep with those who weep. (16) Be of the same mind toward one another; do not be haughty in mind, but associate with the lowly. Do not be wise in your own estimation. (17) Never pay back evil for evil to anyone. Respect what is right in the sight of all men. (18) If possible, so far as it depends on you, be at peace with all men. (19) Never take your own revenge, beloved, but leave room for the wrath of God, for it is written, "VENGEANCE IS MINE, I WILL REPAY," says the Lord. (20) "BUT IF YOUR ENEMY IS HUNGRY, FEED HIM, AND IF HE IS THIRSTY, GIVE HIM A DRINK; FOR IN SO DOING YOU WILL HEAP BURNING COALS ON HIS HEAD." (21) Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.
I hope this blesses you.
Haven't started watching yet, but I'm pretty sure we should.
43:12 "Despite sinning you stand before God covered in the righteous of His Son and never counting them against you."
Okay, major problem. Obviously works have nothing to do with salvation but Jeff, sin does. Jesus Christ says, quote: "Repent or perish" -- If a man who acknowledges Christ and accepts Christ into their heart but falls away and dies in his unrepentant sin, by the words of Jesus Christ, that man will perish. Jeff, even in the Old Testament we have verses that talk about a man losing his salvation...
*"But if a righteous man turns away from his righteousness and practices wrongdoing according to all the abominable practices the wicked carry out, will he live? All his righteous acts will not be remembered; because of the unfaithful acts he has done and the sin he has committed, he will die." Ezekiel **18:24** ✞*
I do not fall in and out of my relationship with God while He is sanctifyng me.
Ephesians 1:13-14 King James Version (KJV)
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, 14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
I struggle with both views about losing salvation but I also know:
Philippians 1:6-7
6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
7 Even as it is meet for me to think this of you all, because I have you in my heart; inasmuch as both in my bonds, and in the defence and confirmation of the gospel, ye all are partakers of my grace.
I trust that God is always working on me and I try my best to truly turn from sin. This is why I am thinking we cannot lose our salvation unless we renounce Him completely.
(Respectfully responding in a non argumentative way, God bless and I hope you have a wonderful day!)
You not reading out of tha kjv
nor did any christian for about 1600 years of the church
THIS is why "KJV only" matters:
www.jesus-is-savior.com/Bible/NIV/300_changes.htm
Those "removals" and "changes" are not "removals" or "changes" at all. they did not remove or change anything from the KJV - the kjv is still the same. the newer versions simply compiled & translated the Greek manuscripts in modern english. In many cases (such as in the NASB) they do so better than the kjv simply because they have access to more manuscripts. You are assuming the KJV is the standard - it isn't.... the original manuscripts are the standard. If we understand that translating originals into the vernacular is the goal then we can see that sometimes the later versions actually do better than the kjv.
Bro Dale Says get behind me satan
lol not an argument.
I’d like to refute Jeff durbin because he adds to the gospel of Jesus Christ. He doesn’t rightly divide the scripture, combining tribulation doctrine with church age doctrine which is the result of faith+works for salvation. The deceitful “salvation is faith alone, but if you’re genuinely saved works have to accompany it for your salvation to be true” Romans 4:5 says to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly it’s counted to him for righteousness. Eph 2:8-9 also shares the same message. Salvation is not of works, but by grace through faith only. Jeff is tricking people to focus on their works, and worry about their salvation when they should be looking to Christ, and knowing that they are saved by faith in him, and that their soul can no longer sin because of the circumcision made without hands, that separates our soul from our body. So our body sins, but our soul no longer sins because we are purchased by Jesus Christ’s blood.
Ryan, If God has saved you, and has given you a new heart, will that be reflected in the way you live?
Calvin Parsley well if Christ’s Church isn’t appointed to wrath, as Paul wrote how is the truth post millennial? Post millennium is a heresy, and you guys are looking for the anti christ instead of the blessed appearing of Jesus Christ, when we will be taken out of here before the tribulation.
Patrick Hegarty for some people it does because they understand the depth of Jesus Christ’s gospel. But not all Christians, some are carnal and need to be chastened. God considers the most weak Christians In the body of Christ are necessary 1 Cor12:19-25 states. Any member of the body cannot be cut off.
Being born again is going from unbelief to belief in the gospel of Jesus Christ. Eph 1:13 “in whom also after that ye believed you were sealed with the Holy Spirit Of promise. Right after you believe you are eternally secure in Christ.
Calvin Parsley one thing you’re missing is scriptural evidence for this post millennial view. What you believe is man made, This one belief cause us to be on two opposite ends of eschatology. And if you’re learning this from Jeff durbin he’s in trouble with God because he is deceiving many. He’s even been refuted by a heretic Satan Anderson, I mean Steven Anderson. While I can show you a verse in revelation that Jesus Christ comes down from heaven and rules with a rod of iron for 1,000 years. It’s a physical rule of Jesus Christ. Not a spiritual. Today this world is ruled by Satan. And this kingdom is spiritual which is Christ’s body, the body of Christ. So you believe that Jesus Christ is Satan because you think he’s ruling right now. While I believe Jesus Christ hasn’t came yet but will and will cast Satan in the pit for a 1,000 years.
Calvin Parsley it seems to me that you just fell away from the truth. “In the last days they will not endure sound doctrine” I only judge by the fruits, and what doctrine is preached. I know what the Bible says, and how there is different dispensations in the Bible. You can claim all of the Bible for yourself saying it’s talking to you. That is a clear and obvious fact. There is two kingdoms in the Bible kingdom of God and kingdom of heaven. Kingdom of God is spiritual, and the kingdom of heaven is spiritual. It’s not that I’m going to change your mind on any of this matter and neither are u going to change my mind. I will not be swayed by every wind of doctrine. The Christian Church (body of Christ) isn’t confused and we all believe the same thing. Other Christians of other denominations are the ones confused and are spiritually discerned. There are 33,000 different Christian denominations. This is why it’s so hard for atheists, agnostics and other false religions to come to the faith. People don’t know what to believe in nowadays. What I know is true is the word of God and that is my absolute standard for the faith. That is bottom line, and I hope you pray and ask for the truth and have God show you.
A believer does not have a law to sin under; Ephesians 2:8-15, Romans 4:15, 1 John 3:5. It's an impossibility. The kingdom of God is no longer here ( Luke 17:21) as Jesus has gone. It cannot be inherited without him here (1 Corinthians 15:50). Quit asserting a believer can sin, you dote!
Zach Waddill wait but he's in us now isn't he? I'm not asking as I don't know the question.
eagle clan, nonsensical; reiterate.
Zach Waddill as you cantell I'm not a very good writer so beat with me please.
You're right we don't have a licence to sin and scripture doesn't support it either.
However, there's a difference between premeditated sin, willfully sinning, and falling because of our human nature. God knows our hearts and says it repeatedly buy saying I never knew you. Implying you never really knew me.
I was replying to your comment that Jesus is no longer with us.
Luke 17:22 simply is saying to his disciples (at that time)that one day your going to long to see me. Probably because of the coming persecutions.
Your comment about can't inherit the kingdom I don't understand because when we believe in Jesus (believe to me means much more)
You become a child of God. As children of God we have joint inheritance with Jesus.
I have to do some reading and studying on exactly when the inheritance takes place.
The bible says that Jesus dwells in a believer.
eagle clan you are conversing with yourself. Did you read the verses I gave?
Zach Waddill you gave 5. Which one?
Matthew 6:14-15
Matthew 6:14
For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you
Matthew 6:14-15
[14]For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
]But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
If God doesn't forgive you for not forgiving men, but why God didn't forgive Esau and Devil?
please show us your tax forms
By showing yours first right?
False teaching in direct opposition to what The Word Clearly states.
??
[Mat 6:14-15 KJV] 14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.