The Truth About the Harley Pan America
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- čas přidán 7. 07. 2024
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I owned the Pan America for almost a year. I've create a bunch of videos on it, but never did a full synaopsis. Well, here you go! Let me know what you think in the comments!
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Ride safe, seek adventure, and keep your wheels rolling in the right direction! right direction!
This bike cost me $31,000 for nothing. Never made a payment and it broke down on me and harley was going to give it back to me broken. They convinced me to trade it in. I paid 31k for a low rider s and they refused to sell me the extended warranty. will never buy another harley again.
That’s fricken crazy!!
the fact you spent 31k on a bike means you were milked by the dealer AND you just accepted it. I got my 22 for 22k with extended warranty, service package and GAP.
@@JustAnotherLuke94 I was screwed, I should've sued.
Ive had problems not with just bikes but with all car manufactures. I have 32k miles on my Pan GI . No problems. Its part of the gig for all machines. Again, the Pan rides awesome. Its a bad ass bike it happens with problems.To me in this world nothing is perfect.@@chueb
@JustAnotherLuke94 depends on the time I picked mine at the height of the pandemic. They were in short supply and high demand.
31K US dollars ?
You got shafted royal.
I paid 23K US dollars out the door for my 2022 PA Special.
Other than a noisy fuel pump replaced at 21,000 miles no issues and now have 22,893 miles.
On it.
I absolutely love this bike it is a great all around machine as I use it for sport touring, commuting and long haul touring.
Had it off road once on an unimproved dirt road.
Was fine .
But trail riding never.
Too big and heavy for that.
FYI 2024 Pan Americas have all been upgraded with higher output charging systems, higher CCA batteries, larger main positive Battery cable and heavier duty side stand mount bracket.
I keep mine plugged in to a NOCO maintenance charger when not in use and carry a NOCO 40 jump starter when traveling which I have never had to use as yet.
2021 models were the most problematic.
What first production year machine isnt.
Most important things to is avoid dealers who overcharge, do not embrace the Rev Max bikes, do not have veteran techs performing the service on these bikes and all 2021 PAs.
PS
I agree.
Great Egret has one of the most objective You Tube channels on motorcycling.
Depends when you bought it. Older bikes get discounted...not first run when demand is high.
@shegocrazy depends on your dealerships scruples.
My dealer never prices any bike over MSRP.
No matter availability. And some models Below MSRP .
which is why I have been buying from them since 1987.
They also have a top shelf service department .
I looked at the PA, but decided on a Suzuki 1050 Vstrom. Put 15,000 miles on it in the first 6 months, and not a single problem.
I’ve owned 2 PAS bikes and 20k miles and no problems.
@jvc350 why two?
@@GreatEgret Becuase he wanted another color THATS WHY EGRET THATS WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have been riding Harleys on the street since 1970. Although this is not my type of bike, I'm glad Harley is coming out with something that people will ride and keep the name going. My oldest motorcycle is a 1949 Harley Panhead. My newest is a 2018 Ural Gear Up. Between those is a 1957 flat head Servi car trike and a 1968 Sportster.
I owned my AT for 3 yrs. No issues … the only bike I’ve ever owned… I knew one thing when I was shopping for a bike, you never hear anyone complain about a Honda.
I love my AT! It gets an unfair bad wrap from adv riders that want more power snd stiffer suspension, but for my needs the AT is perfect!
I’d never buy a HD, but Honda isn’t bulletproof- AT had fork issues. But my point is, any brand has issues. You just want to be supported when something goes wrong!
@@martyn_g I don’t really care that much… I was joining the conversation… don’t take stuff so seriously
I would say to anybody looking at this mans videos , you are on the right track , he tells it like it is and i can testify to most of what he says especially in this video , one of the best reviewers iv seen or heard !!
Its the bad stuff you need to listen to , this is where you will lose money and time , not to mention stress !!
Yes there are flaws with all bikes but when your losing HUGE MONEY !! on resale there is a serious problem that pales all its other problems!
These manufacturers will only change if we hit them in the pocket 😉
That’s right, people need to check resale value on the PA before buying. I’ve heard of dealers making ridiculous low ball offers on used PAs because they don’t really want them around. I was lucky to sell mine (not to a dealer) before resale really tanked.
@@seniorp9444
I have one Harley fanboy on here telling me I'm this and that , a negative ninny lol 😆
I can assure you and anybody else I am far from a negative person but these bike are expensive, especially the PanAm and simply NOT WORTH THE MONEY but its people like you that are making the public aware of the HUGE pitfall of the Harvey Davidson Panam ,
Well done 👏
I had to sell my 2021 after 8 months because it so unreliable I couldn’t take it out of town because I was afraid it would fail to start and leave me stranded. Lucky for me motorcycles were hard to find in early 22 and I got a good price for it. I’m glad he mentioned the heat. I could live with it but it was pretty extreme. I have had much better experiences with other Harleys and my Road King Special is rock solid reliable.
Every Harley I’ve owned, except the PA, has been dead reliable.
I love my 2022 Pan America 1250 Special it's a awesome bike and i love it.
Technically this is not HD's first adventure bike. They offered the Buell Ulysses in the early 2000's. It was actually a nice bike. As long as the adventure bike segment is popular they'll keep making it and hopefully refine it.
I have a 2021 PAm and it's my go-to bike. Of course,
I made upgrades to correct the HD failures for this model like installing a windshield that is solid and usable in all positions, installing radiator fan hot air deflector and cat con heat shield. My bike has no electrical or starting issues (after HD fixed the lacking starter clutch gear). HD shot itself in the foot with all the bad publicity of the PAm unreliability, IMO, by not recalling all 2021 models and have dealers replace the starter clutch gear, check wiring connectors due to miss wiring at the Factory, update the software (clock issues, HH functionality, known glitches)!, reload software associated with the ARH, check battery drain to ensure it was within acceptable levels when the bike was turned off.
Great video! I have a 22" with just over 20,000 . It's a love hate relationship! I've had the same RH control replacement but my main issue is the fuel pump! 4 fuel pump replacements and it's on the 5th one now! It's like clockwork right in between the 5,000 mile service! dealership said they're not replacing it just yet because it's not as loud as the previous
I think I have a lemon
at this point! Just swapping out/Replacing the fuel pump isn't working or solving anything! I tried different gas station thinking it was a fuel quality issue, tried keeping the fuel levels up past the last quarter tank. I live in the PNW and ride year round so it's not the heat/ warmth of the outside temperature.
It has to be some kind of electrical issues or the fuel pump itself it a flawed design and needs to be recalled and redesigned!!
It's still one of my favorite
I've had two fuel pumps and three batteries in mine along with the RH switch controls. No starting issues, dying unexpectedly on the road at speed. They are lemons.
@@oldninjarider now mines in the shop because it lost 75% engine power. I’m trying to get HD to purchase the bike back! In my state it’s way past a lemon it’s fcking lemon juice! I’d be forced to pay for an extended warranty another $3-5,000.
@@nw2732 It may be time for a class action suit. I also just received an e-mail from livewire with them desperately trying to sell S2 Del Mars for only $149/mo. Frankly I'm not interested in any new products from HDMC until they start addressing all of the issues with their current products, including my less than 6,000 mile Pan Am Special.
@@nw2732 My local dealer just called me, $850 for a new battery, which I just replaced last November and a RH Switch assy. Like I said, previously this bike is on a fast track to be gone.
I live in Canada. Have a great HD dealer with awesome service people. My 2021 PA is absolutely amazing. I understand the first buyers were beta testers to a degree and there were gremlins at the start. Most of that is all worked out. My bike has been wonderful. This bike gets a lot of hate, but I will sing it’s praises from my experience. I do feel this platform is not fully adopted by all HD enthusiasts and is out cast by the euro and Japanese faithful. Hands down, this is the best bike for me. Everyone should look in to this bike if you are looking at large adventure/ touring bike. Just my opinion. Whatever you ride is your choice and I will ride with anyone on two wheels. 👍🏽
How long will Harley build this bike? I am not sure if they are in for the long haul. I got some Buell owners I know that would tell us.
Extremely well made video. Factual and delivered in a straightforward manner.
I appreciate the pan America coverage!
I love my 22 pan am special !
Thanks, dude! I work hard on these videos, so that means a ton to me! Have fun on that Pan America!
@@GreatEgret thank you very much. Great content strengthens the moto community! Keep it up!
I still want one.... lol..... I actually got to ride the CVO Pan Am last week and wow... super freaking nice. Great video Joe.
'22 Used, 5K miles, fully loaded, 13K, always starts :)
Good to see a bunch on here have a good experience with their PAs!
Good honest review!
I have got a sportster s (same engine), I have had starting issues as well!
Wow. It’s crazy how many riders have had issues!
I’d really like to hear your take on the 2024 BMW R1300 GS.
My 2021 pan am after 6 months too suffered the dreaded dead battery system. My dealer replaced the dead agm battery promptly. I didn't wait for the new one to fail as it only has 225 CCA. I solve the problem by getting an Anti gravity lithium ATX 12-HD! Over 430 CCA 3 years later and no more starting issues. I currently own 3 HD bikes. Each is unique in its own way. The pan am by far is incredibly fast in traffic. Nimble and out maneuvers any HD on the street. It's not for everyone. I'm 6'3" so it's perfect for my body size. My road king is good on long trips, and my new Lowrider st is a great rider with the gang. 3 distinct bikes all have a different feel. My next bike will be a new 24 CVO to complete the stable! 🏍👍✌️😁🇺🇸
Those are some really nice horses in your stable!
I have a lot of respect for HD making this bike. It certainly has some impressive numbers and features. Unfortunately they all count for nothing when it won’t start and spends weeks at the dealership being fixed.
I hear what you say regarding the first version of every new model has problems, but generally Japanese bikes don’t.
When I tour, the number one priority is reliability, and for that reason I’ll stick with my Honda.
Thanks for this video, very informative, and thanks for your honesty.
Reliability is super important to me too. Especially after owing the Pan America. I’ll be riding my ATAS from now on. Especially for long distance trips.
Absolutely agree , reliability is everything when your travelling to those out back desert roads, my Honda crf1100 Africa Twin is absolutely amazing, unlike my Harley I didn’t find the need to throw a fist full of money at it to meet my expectations,
@@Rod-rx4go that’s another thing that’s wonderful about the AT. I installed crash bars, a Touratech rack, and some LoneRider Motobags. Don’t need much more than that for my travels.
I took my 2019 CB500X on a three month tour of Europe and Scandinavia last summer, a lot of wild camping, gravel, forest roads etc. I did 13,000 miles and all the bike needed was oil changes and tyres.
When I got back to the U.K. I spent a whole day cleaning it and it came up like new.
Another similar trip coming up this summer and I go with confidence 😁✌🏻
@@warrenr4 I love it! Have a great adventure this summer!
finally HD build an engine that looks like it fits in the 21st Century. Almost comparable to the competition .. they are getting there slowly - a few more iterations of this and it may be worth a look in 10 or so years if they keep driving their development to catch up with the competition
Looking at the Pan America to supplement my Goldwing. However I concerned about buying another Harley. When I was a young airman in the USAF in the early 80’s I made a bad decision to spent 60% of my savings and bought a basic Sportster. I put about 10K miles on that bike but I must have pushed it 8K of that 10K. It was a disaster. That left a very bad taste about Harley in general.
Go with the Africa Twin. There will be zero disasters with that bike!
Reliability, in my opinion, of Pan America overall is about the same as BMW GS and slightly better than KTM. I think I'm going for Suzuki when it comes to ADV.
I’d definitely like to know the stats on these. If you know a good source on brand reliability that includes the PA, I’d give you a mention in an upcoming video.
Look up Mongrel Dog Productions. He’s hammered his GS and had very few problems.
Wow
Yes, no bike is perfect but my 2022 is on a short path to being sold/traded away. It's had more vacation time in the shop than I have in the past 8 months. No more new Harleys and if this one fails again I'm going back to Yamaha. The one thing about adventure bikes is having an adventure, or at least that's what I thought. Instead my adventure is a never-ending frustration with issues necessitating weeks in service. This bike from a quality perspective is terrible.
“An adventure bike should be able to go around the world. This one can’t even go around the block”.
Interesting that you found the transmission to be smooth. I felt it to clunk around, which I something I like and feel was a smart idea, because it contributes a harley feel to the bike. Many other bikes dont clunk anywhere near as hard as the PanAm and its always weird when gear shifts, have to wait for the clutch out to feel if it shifted.
I actually pointed out that I liked that clunk in my test ride video of this bike.
I think the biggest mistake with the PanAm, and Revonax Sportsters is actually... the turn signal button. They ditched the harley 2 button system that's awesome for generic "i hate these things" side to side rocker press switches. BOOO LAME HARLEY BOOOO.
The entire industry should use per side switches like the standard harley kit does. It's perfect and the refusal to adopt it by other companies is just their own hubris, lol.
As mentioned in the video, the smoothness of the transmission I talk about is relative to other Harley bikes. Though, it’s just as smooth as or smoother than the other adv bikes I’ve ridden.
@@GreatEgretHmmm maybe the one I rode just had a heavy clunking transmission then or something. It reminded me a lot of the Softail transmission with shifting. Felt great.
The triumph tiger 800 was so smooth at shifting it didnt feel like it shifted at all, so the PanAm having that chachunk! was pretty cool.
Harley, like KTM are gambler's bikes. You're rolling the dice on whether or not you're getting an actual motorcycle or a pile of crap. BMW? Rock solid. Ducati? Believe it or not...pretty rock solid. Japanese bikes? Well you already know. For every one person that says they have a perfect PanAm I see three saying it's the worst thing they've ever spent money on. I don't hate HD but the bar is higher now. The competitors have all stepped their game up. I'm not spending 20k+ for a bike to give HD a participation trophy. Just buy a GS or Multistrada.
This. Exactly this is the way every rider should look at the PA.
Its uglyness is a positive for me.
I love this comment so much!!
Love my 22 Pan Am. Its a bummer some dealers actively hate it (see uncle bogators video on the CVO pan am) but many (myself included) have dealers who are interested in learning about the issues and addressing them the best they can. I will say, most people who've had issues usually get them resolved by upgrading to the Antigravity lithium battery. I haven't done this, likely because my bike is on a tender 24/7. Either way, dont listen to the doom and gloomers and get the bike if you like it. ADV bikes dont hold the value like a road glide would but i think thats the only negative i can think of! Ride safe yall.
However, this Rev-Max platform has been nothing but trouble and Gremlins. H-D used it's customers as beta testers and Guinea Pigs for this engine, and even on the SportsterS it's been nothing but headaches. "Hopefully" the 2024 models are different but I'm sure the faults of previous years have left bitter smells for potential future buyers ???. And As far as looks, It's Good, it's American. It looks the the Turret of an M-1 Abrams Tank, and you can't get more American than that.
The more tech, the more problems. It's simple. If you want or need that much comfort and convenience, you'd be better off with a car.
I’m finding myself agreeing with this more and more.
You haven't mentioned the rust !
Man these bikes get rusty in the hardware, screws especially around the headlamp, may not be an issue in warmer climates but here in UK it is very bad indeed, also how UGLY it is from the chain side of the bike , any pics you see of this bike are more offten than not from the side without the chain ,
Also resale value is garbage over here in comparison to BMW and Honda , the only worse one on resale value is KTM , you can't give them away !!
Yeah, I’ve seen your comments on the rust. I haven’t experienced it myself, so I can’t comment on rust. But I can 100% say the resale value is really bad. I lost $9K US on mine after 2200 miles and one year of ownership!
@@GreatEgret
Your video is very honest pal as were all your videos on adventure bikes , I just think it is a sin to let people waste this kind of money on an absolute Lemon of an ADVENTURE bike,
It is far too much money to lose , its no joke and completely unnecessary when there are bikes such as BMW GS1250 , Africa Twin and even Yamaha Tenere that you can get for the same money or less ,
Please people save your money and buy virtually anything else !!
Until they get their shit sorted out.
Keep up the good work and at least you told it straight about the flaws , some I didn't know myself, well done pal
@@gatti493 Everyone I know that has one including me, have had zero issues. Unfortunately the negative have taken the time to spread negativity while the majority of us are out riding and tearing up trails... Dont think we will every be able to undo that.
@@JustAnotherLuke94
This is not personal pal ,
This man himself has lost $9,000 in resale on a bike with only 2,200miles on it , that IS NO JOKE !!
There are other bikes out there that are better and have a decent resale value, NOBODY should lose money like that , END OF !
you only rode for 2200 miles?Wow@@GreatEgret
It’s a shame because of how well the bike rides.
I do miss that rev max engine!
You can find something wrong with ANY of the bikes. Actually harley didnt just start doing offroad bikes look into the history of harley. Anyways i have had over 12 bikes over the years.I well tell you this is the best bike i have ever had . I need not say anymore.
Too true that you can find something wrong with any bike. There is no such thing as a perfect motorcycle.
I'm sorry but your answer is very misleading and could cause people to waste their hard earned money on this pig of a bike , too many people make comments with no facts long term , the op. Of this video himself lost over $9000 in 12 months on resale alone , this is NO JOKE !!
and there are bikes out there that this terrible thing doesn't happen with !!
You may well be VERY lucky with your bike but when you come to sell it , you'll see how "LUCKY" you are !!
And I haven't mentioned all the other issues with it !!
@@gatti493 damn you are just a negative nancy arent you? @greenrush4313 is just another one of us fellas that have had zero issue. Unfortunately the main negative thing I can say is actually about the HD community. Yall are ridiculously negative. I am riding the hell out of this 22 pan am and have 0 issues. 29k miles isnt luck pal.
did you have a Pan or watch a video?First off i have had many bikes like i said. Dont know your backround. You had a pan????Or watched a video? If you have not had one please dont comment you could hurt someone from buying a great bike.Get it got it good.@@gatti493
He also has to move on to different bikes for his channel@@gatti493
Your wrong on the skid plate, it's completely garbage for off-road, and it has to be switched out, as with every manufacturer....sooooo, i gotta ask, do you still have your Pan America or just doing videos on it?
Not my experience I have a 2022 Pan America Special 1250 S and the bike is awesome it's never let me down or failed to start a cracking bike.
@@kencarrcarr3751 me either, i really like mine....
No thanks
I have a 2023 PAS I bought it 4 months ago. It's an enjoyable bike to ride. I did have a fuel pump issue at around 10000 km. At 19000 km Unfortunately I had the rear tire replaced in Green Bay Wisconsin at Vandervest Harley Davidsons. They didn't properly adjust the chain after installing the new rear tire. At 22000 km It cost me 3800 dollars to replace the swing arm sprockets and chain.
Do you live in the Green Bay Area? I live in south central Wisconsin now and I grew up in Oshkosh.
@GreatEgret no I live in Canada . I was on a four corners true X ride after completing the great lakes cabot trail challenge
A 1992 mongoose with a Briggs and Stratton duct taped to it could compete with the Honda Africa Twin. Worst bike I’ve ever owned. If the Pan America existed when I bought my AT. I would have absolutely bought that over the Honda.
What don’t you like about the AT? What year?
Adventure bikes are for a different kind of poser. A $30,000 600+ lbs off road bike. Get real! But as they say a fool and his money 💰🤑.Ha Ha😂😂😂😂😂
I guess there’s a lot of fools in this world because it’s the best selling type of bike on the market now. Only one comes close to 600 lbs. I’d rather own a 500lb adventure bike than an 800lb Harley touring bike.
Listen to me. They elect to use a chain drive because the gear ratio is easily changed. With a shaft drive, you can’t change the gear ratio. Racing off-road bikes use chain drive so you can easily change the gear ratio. So there’s a method to the madness.
Only lame highway bikes you shaft drive because the people driving them have no idea about Gear ratio or have any desire to change it
Real motorcycles use chain drive so that the rider can easily change the gear ratio, depending upon the course they are racing
What's the negatives on my Honda Fury, then? You'll have to tell me because I can't think of one. Go big four, or go home unhappy.
It’s a rare breed of rider that has the perfect bike. Kudos, brother! I hope I find my unicorn someday. (This may sound tongue in cheek, but I’m being sincere here).
@@GreatEgret Ty sir. I smile every time I start her up. She's graceful, reliable and stylish. Plus the smooth delivery of power from the shaft drive is beautiful to feel. I have indeed found my unicorn