A Look at Juggernaut (Voyager)
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- čas přidán 16. 01. 2023
- Opinionated Voyager Episode Guide has a run-in with the Malon while Torres is upset. Not for any reason, just upset in general, when you have only one dimension to your character, you have to stick with it I guess.
I always liked that Neelix starts out with 'Hey, this is what I did for a living back in the day, I'd be glad to help!' and it soon devolves into 'Oh god this was a mistake, shoot me if I ever volunteer again.' Enthusiasm isn't always for the best.
His name was Ensign Hogan.
The sad thing is that this is a solid case of him being qualified.
Worked in waste disposal, and his soup and physiology actually help him survive radiation exposure.
Heck, you could actually rope him in against his desires, with him not wanting to go through that again, but sucking it up for captain and preventing contamination.
I think Chuck is overlooking the horror elements of this episode. Yes, the story and character development are weak. But they did a pretty good job with the oppressive atmosphere of the Malon ship and there was a good sense of unease and tension. And you very rarely see people get so dirty in a Trek show. I think they did the horror elements well enough to elevate this to an above average Voyager episode.
If the cause for the horror can't be taken seriously, then it's very difficult to appreciate any elements of it.
I absolutely agree. Good tension on this one. Otherwise I liked the review
Its a very low bar to clear since we're talking about Voyager but yes I tend to agree with you
'We start the episode with anger management and end it with Torres beating a labourer with a pipe'
The thing that always got me about the Malon was, your job is to dump toxic waste. Why not just dump it over a star or into a black hole? You have to pass plenty of un-inhabited star systems on the way. Your trip will a shorter, therefore more profit / longer survival time, plus the star will burn / fuse whatever it is you're dumping.
That requires more than 5 seconds of thought put into them, and that's 4 seconds more than the writers of Voyager were willing to put into the show.
@@mikegates8993 Unfortunately.
It makes as much sense as a species being native to a void with no star systems. The whole Malon arc is baffling.
Then Captain Janeway couldn't throw her brass balls into everyone's face.
Dumping waste into a star is a short term solution at best. Sure, there's not much effect initially, but increasing the star's mass increases the rate of fusion, so the star is A) brighter (which means any orbiting planets get warmer) and B) it runs out of fuel sooner. Oh, and C) it's never going to fuse, because the star will die first, either because it's not heavy enough to support carbon fusion, or because carbon fusion will blow the the star apart.
To be fair, you're not likely to notice for hundreds of thousands of years (unless you've got a _lot_ of waste) and even then you're likely to miss the difference because stars heat up as they burn up their hydrogen anyway.
A black hole would work, as long as your aim is good or your waste doesn't do anything nasty when subjected to absurd amounts of heat (such as can be found in an accretion disc.)
Voyagers fascination with "isotons" as a unit of measure got a hell of a lot funnier when I took middle school physics and learned that "iso-" is the prefix for "single".
"Like a captain planet villain without the subtlety." Whoof, we're in one of the really bad ones then, eh?
This episode is Juggernaut, bitch!
...I dunno, man, everyone in the comments of these videos is really smart and analytic but I'm barely smart enough for memes
I do like some aspects of the Malon. They work (at least in theory) well as allegories for how developed nations have a really bad habit of exporting their economic and material waste to less developed nations and dressing it up as 'environmentally friendly/sustainable/job creation' when really it's just pushing the problem out of sight out of mind onto people who can't fight back. Unfortunately they suffer from the typical Voyager problem of having an interesting concept in a show whose writers were basically not allowed to do anything interesting.
It's my dream to to torture Berman and Taylor to 💀 someday
Is that too much? It may have sounded like a little too much but I'm actually holding back
gd dude! lmao! your Janeway is just so uncanny lol "...I was waiting for the part where that affects me." hilarious man
"I missed the part where that's MY problem"
I know that "destroy everything within three light-years" sounds terrible, but there's a pretty good chance there's actually *nothing* in the danger zone. Because, you know, *space* - and the episode never mentions the explosion being a threat to anything but the two ships involved, and their crews. And while USS _Voyager_ may not be able to clear 3LY in the time available, she should easily be able to outrun the front of the blast wave - unless Malon garbage explosions propagate at FTL speeds I guess, in which case... _whatever,_ and I'd like to take this opportunity to laugh bitterly at people who still claim this franchise is "based on Real Science(TM)!"
Also, the episode's "dump it into a star" resolution... doesn't make a lot of sense. The star has to be within the 3LY radius of destruction - is it not part of the "everything" the Malon ship failing would destroy? And how is a glorified trash barge supposed to survive the conditions of the star's corona long enough to deliver its payload to a depth where it wouldn't be blasted outward on the star's solar winds rather than contained within the gravity well? Canonically, the conditions of a stellar corona are so brutal that not even the Borg are willing to brave them (in the ST:TNG episode _Descent, Part II)._ (Also, if the explosion can be contained by stellar gravity then it *definitely does not* propagate at FTL speeds. Just sayin'.)
Right ... the nearest star to our solar system, Proxima Centauri, is more than four light-years away. There might be star systems closer to each other, but three light-years still isn't much in galactic terms. They didn't even mention there are inhabitated planets in range - we need to assume this for the story to make sense.
This whole "we cannot escape the blast radius"-thing is also crazy. Unless of course theta radiation works through subspace or something (again, not stated in the episode itself, even thought VOY is infamous for its technobabble).
I think the writers just forgot that no form of radiation in the real world is faster than light.
Shouldn't The Malon captain be anxious to help? Isn't he liable for any damage that he does?
These guys are out here to make a profit - If he's going to be financially ruined by it, then he should be anxious to help. Why is he so reluctant?
Simple: because!
Malon captains are always more like Captain Planet-villains. So he actually is in line with the guy from "Night".
"this is gonna be like the packleds all over again" , something nobody ever wants to hear, for any of the possible circumstances lol, that one made me laugh out loud.
So, it seriously took Janeway 5 years to decide Torres needs anger management training? Are we sure Chuck's interpretation of Janeway being a crazy person who delights in watching her crew suffer isn't the canon Janeway?
I mean, at least a Vulcan might be a good choice since they suppress emotions instead of booting up emotionless inn the cradle.
Janeway belongs in prison.
@@kevinramsey417 Prison's too good for her. She should be in the Phantom Zone.
Like Chuck once said, his Crazy Janeway sadly makes way more sense than normal Janeway.
If you break someones nose you get a promotion. Just be angry and you need therapy. That could only be the logic of Crazy Jane ...
@@kevinramsey417 I'm sure she has a personal logic to explain all of her shit but my biggest offense by her is the first one, the Caretaker's array. Laziest sci-fi writers ever! As if that was the only way to get them stranded far from home. If I was a crew member and some crazy B***h just destroyed my only way home I'd be singlehandedly attacking that b***h or planning a mutiny. At that point nothing would matter and if I died trying to take her down I died.
And I actually like Janeway - somehow. I guess I just pretend there's more than one Janeway - a decent one and a self-centered narcissist megalomaniac one.
Say what you will about how lame the Malon are, but at least we got a heaping helping of Ron Canada!
The man elevates every role he plays!
Thank you for making this series. Ever since CBS removed Voyager from Netflix this has been my only way of watching it
Paramount+ app on any streaming device will do ya
@@YourCapyBro_windows95_3DPipes Thats true but Im not paying a monthly fee just to watch Star Trek Voyager
@@NovaDelta it's only $5 plus there's much more than just that. It's a decent app actually
@@YourCapyBro_windows95_3DPipes Its still just another streaming service. I live by the rule of if its not on my family's Netflix plan, I don't have it on DVD/tape, or i cant easily find it on an opendirectory, im not watching it
@@NovaDelta I hear ya.
(14:30) I really like the set design. I'm particularly fascinated by the...toilet tank float???...that is affixed to a panel just behind Torres (to the immediate right). I wish I could work building sets like these. I think it would be a lot of fun. 😎
it is kinda scary that Neelix was kinda useful with his remedy this episode, if he was written more like this he'd be okay
The _Doink_ made me lose it.
(12:52) That shot to the head was awesome! 🤪🤣
10:16 Are you sure that isn't a screen shot from some horror movie? Saw or The Cube maybe?
3:50 "Anti-matter waste"? There's no such thing. It annihilates with matter. There is no waste. What the hell are they talking about.
Why is Neelix wearing one of Seven's jumpsuits?
🤣😂🙃
😱 omg that's true ... but do you really want to know the answer?!
@@lordmontymord8701 No. No I do not.
@@lynngreen7978 🤣 thats what i thought.
Btw: Why wasn't Seven part if the away team? Her Borg implants should give her better protection from the radiation like they did in "One" in the season before.
Heck, they could have written it better if Chakotay chooses Seven over Torres for this reason (and of course Torres' anger issues). Torres of course looses her mind because she thinks she's more qualified.
But then it turns out this special kind of radiation fucks with Sevens implants, so Chakotay has no other option than replacing her with Torres ...
Even in advanced societies, tech problems just happen.
If you don't install a VPN on your tricorder, you risk the blue tank top of death.
So where is that big dude with the brown armor? I would have thought he would go up against Capt. Picard.
Chuck often says Torres episodes are “pissed off, fuck someone, or fix something.” One could be as dismissive of, say, Kira by calling her stories either “pissed off, fuck someone, or learn that cardassians aren’t all that bad (again).” This story feels like a necessary bridge between “Faces” and “Barge of the Dead.” S5 is definitely the strongest season of the show.
Yeah but Kira has agency and depth.
B’elana, like the entire cast sans Doc & 7, is a cardboard cutout.
Don't forget Troi. Fuck someone, mommy issues or psychic shenanigans.
@@EnjoySackLunch Torres also has agency and depth. It’s rather myopic to say otherwise.
@@musicamaxima I disagree. Rather silly to even compare the 2.
@@musicamaxima Kira had some character development. Or do you think season 1 Kira would have helped Cardassians, no matter the reason, like she does in s7? Sorry, but Torres always goes back to her anger issues to the point it's ridiculous. The only point where i see some development is her relationship with Tom. And that's just sad.
Ah the Malon ... Treks version of a Captain Planet-villain. How many species live in this region of space other than the Malon? But only they seem to have this waste-problem. Which makes them more stupid than egoistic.
If we would at least see some normal Malon ... but no, everyone we see works in the waste disposal business (yes, even an artist) and is already disfigured by the radiation. They could have created a better concept if we actually see the Malon homeworld or colonies, beautiful and with plenty of energy to give the Malons everything they need. And the normal population doesn't know or doesn't care what's going on outside ... And Voyager shows them what they are doing to other species.
Wait: Wasn't the last episode with the Malon, "Extreme Risk" also a "Torres is very angry"-episode? What a coincidence ...
So in what order are these Voyager episodes going to appear?
Was just thinking how good the show could have been if crazy people hadn't been in charge. It could have been built up into a fine, very decent series. But that would have required serious writers who took the show seriously and Berman to be overruled.
Its too bad that never happened.
Wait, Captain Planet villains had subtlety??!!
When you said sending a Fry Cook along I imagined replacing Neelix with SpongeBob & tried to decide if he would be an improvement. He would certainly still irritate Tuvok, but would he actually be more charming?
I’m sorry but the claimed technobabble complaint at 3:55, I think is invalid. I’ve heard wayyy worse in voyager. More to the point… I think it’s safe to assume most people watching voyager would know what antimatter is. If you know what antimatter is then “4 trillion (of whatever) of it igniting” is pretty straight forward and simple to understand. There will be a big explosion “3 light years across”.
Damn. I hate when all three thingies stop working at the same time.
Discovery, the show that used sonar in space had better science? Really Chuck?
He didn't say they had _better_ science. He said they didn't use _deus ex machina_ 'explained' by obfuscating gibberish (with ostensibly a tech excuse) to solve their problems.
I hate STD, but you can't say they overuse technobabble. This is the one positive i will give the show.
And now i feel dirty for saying something nice about "The Burnham-Show"
@@lordmontymord8701 I feel your pain
@@boobah5643 maybe but I’d take technobabble over science a third grader can tell is wrong.
Trust me, I can make up better science gibberish.
"You want to help, Neelix? ... Don't help!"