WATA “Authenticates” a False SNES Prototype
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- čas přidán 22. 08. 2024
- It was discovered that the Wata grading service authenticated an SNES prototype that wasn't really authentic.
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Here's the full coverage on SNESCentral.com - snescentral.com/article.php?id=1238
WATA has now officially demonstrated that they are NOT the authority on Video Games' conditions or authenticity.
They should not be trusted to verify the legitimacy of any video game items (including sticker sealed games).
How can they demonstrate that they know for sure that the cellophane and sticker are legit, when they can't be bothered to even open a cart to verify it's legitimacy of the pcb?
It does not matter, anyone that pays for the "grading" of games is a tard. Those that buys "graded" games are tards. Grading games is just stupid.
Now that I think about it somebody could be getting a water game open it up take out the cart board and put it right back in and just screw wata off and make it look bad
WATA yah tryin to pull??
They’re trying to push a market and make money for themselves they just don’t know what they’re doing with video games they think it’s the same as comics and coins and shit. And they’ve been driving on prices on eBay and it literally makes me want to ball punch them!!!
Grading is so dumb. This also proves that you can't trust anybody. If a company that is supposed to be the top of the line when it comes to game preservation shouldn't it know what a real proto is? Like this is pathetic.
As someone who' had family members who dealt in antiques and collectibles and grew up around that sort of business, the elephant in the room when it comes to authenticating anything is that even the best experts can't tell you with 100% certainty what is truly a genuine example and what is a fake. The best they can do is determine that everything that should be there in a genuine example is and nothing that shouldn't be there is present.
That said, even that standard doesn't see to have been met here, but even the best authentication systems can be gamed by a good enough fake (which is part of the reason Pat and Ian always point out the problems with unmarked repros etc.)
Grading video games is dumb yes, cards and comics not so much.
@@Clay3613 I can agree with those mediums but slabbing games just goes against their intended purpose and it's no secret the hobby is being monetized more than ever. I just think it sets a bad precedent especially when there company that is supposed to be the forefront of this kind of preservation just shows that they're more interested in money than research
@@timf7413 thanks for the response I do understand that mistakes happen but you said it yourself the standards weren't met
Well they have no competition in the market either so they can do whatever they want.
So sad that people do this, even worse when "professionals" can't catch it... *WATA SHAME*
👏
Well considering the people that run WATA don't really seem to know much about retro gaming other than whatever quick research they do on the internet it's not really all that surprising tbh
Professional video game graders arent a real thing that's the problem. They're just some people who started a company to make money.
This aged surprisingly well.
Future prove past
I guess WATA hired some Gamestop employees who recently lost their jobs.
Oh WATA mess...
But seriously they should keep the prototype authentication to the experts ...
should've sent it to you guys first to see if it was a legit prototype
They should authenticate the Wind Waker prototype! Haha!
This is as if you went to grade an old rare comic and they didn't realize it's just the cover filled with some other common comic's pages.
Avgn: wata they thinkkkkkkking????
I wanna thank Evan for the time and effort he spends on such a niche but extremely important part of our community. Good job, E.
"community" lol
"Graded and authenticated".....
Lmao.
There's got to be at least a few fake sealed games sitting in graded slabs right now. Surely someone has managed to pull that scam off.
And the worst thing is that the immediate value loss if the case is broken open means that any slabbed fakes will no doubt go undetected for years or even whole decades. 🎮🎰⚠
If you happen to have an X-Ray machine to hand and know the genuine article intimately well enough that you could spot a fake from an X-Ray image alone, then that's about the only way you can check a graded item without having to break open the case/box. But good luck getting permission to have an X-Ray machine (And its radioactive imaging source) in your home! 🙃
But even then an X-Ray still won't tell you if the cart inside is the authentic unused example which you _hope_ is in there, or a used and heavily battered example which cost under a dollar from Goodwill... 🎰
Love that this is recommended now. Lol
Like a fine wine. . . or cheese.
Further confirms my belief that these services are a scam.
Was just a matter of time for this to happen.
lol, as if it hasn't happened before. This is just the first time they've gotten caught!
Grading is arguably the most worthless endeavor one could throw their hard-earned money at.
When I was a kid I remember getting some crappy NBA game for my Game Boy from Toys R Us. After about a day I realized I didn't like the game but knew it couldn't be returned since the seal had been broken. This was incredibly unlike my mom but she had some weird sort of heat gun she'd use for scrapbooking that could reseal plastic and she was actually willing to reseal it so I could return it. I remember it looking pretty convincing. I went to return the game and my mom waited in the car while I went inside with the receipt to return it and buy Pokemon instead. I remember them looking over the game really carefully but they never said anything. Anyways, I was instantly reminded of that story when Pat said people are going to invest in convincing ways to seal games. They absolutely will and the thing about it is that nobody will ever open the games to check what's inside since they want it to stay sealed. Yikes.
Exactly...too easy today to replicate anything "vintage"
Why wouldn't people do it? As long as you don't forge the Wata grading, then you can truthfully advertise as "graded by Wata" and it's on them. People might as well cash in on this stupid market before the whole thing crashes.
Imagine that sealed super mario 64 that "sold" for 2 million is cracked open one day only to find it has a used game or even no game at all just something to make it feel like it did like a rock.
Good job, WATA! As I've been saying since they arrived on the scene, these dudes have no fuckin clue what they're talking about, make up their own rules and grading standards and just do whatever they like in order to convince people to use their services.
That reminds me of when I was a kid, saved up my money, and hunted for Mega Man X3. Found it, bought it, got it home, booted it up, and BATTLECLASH was on the screen. Someone swapped out the boards between a $60 used game and one worth less than $1. I was not happy.... Not saying that was a prototype, but in regards to a customer being duped by a board swap.
The only reason I'd even grade a game would be like with cards to protect them so only game's like NWC cause your never gonna play it might as well protect it the best you can.
BUT ITS A GAME
@@sunnohh I mean if you wanna play the $27,000 game go right ahead
I get this. You can find NWC repros for cheap if you just want to play it - if you buy it, it’s a collectable.
@@elphive42 Or just emulate it. You're not missing much anyways. It's just watered down versions of 3 extremely common NES games.
Graded games are a joke
Oh no. Who can we trust now?
Getting this in my CZcams recommended at current date (09/17-2021) after all the Video's been out after the Karl Jobst investigation on Wata practices, this hits different and more impactful then when you made this video even.
I got it recommended too.
Good thing this video is being re-trended after the recent exposure of WATA.
I know that you guys personally know the WATA folks and don't want to throw them under the bus, but this is about the worst thing that could happen to them considering their WHOLE PURPOSE is to authenticate games and drive up the price for auction. Considering this (mistake??) presented the items as authentic and they aren't I would think that would set them up for lawsuits. Personally I don't trust them. All they are doing is helping drive up the prices for various collectors.
At some point couldn’t someone make a machine that created the H seam seal the same way the original machines did? I’m not sure how the machines work, but I’m sure there are plenty of people out there that do and the initial investment could bring massive returns, if it hasn’t already happened.
If people can counterfeit money, people can counterfeit games, the boxes, seals, etc. The key issue, if you want to call it that, is that those whom are knowledgeable do not have the means and those who do likely do not see counterfeiting video games as a worthwhile business. Counterfeiting money is the go to because everyone knows what a $20 bill looks like, most don't usually inspect every bill that is handed over and the counterfeit testing machines are readily available making it fairly easy for counterfeiters to know what is and isn't like-for-like.
WATA grades homemade CD-R's lol
Grading is for chumps. taking the word of a total stranger who says they know what they are talking about.
Taking their word while they take your money!
Have we learned nothing from Pawn Stars????
Coming from the UK I can certainly say 51,9% of our lot (Not including myself) were duped by that sort of thing in 2016... 😉
Pat, you have to do a book of prototypes with this guy. I'm sure it would sell and he would get rewarded for all his hard work.
I would not be interested in a prototype-book with all respect. I rather say that than someone going into a failed business venture.
Watching a New Episode of CUPodcast for My Birthday. A Great Way to round out the Night!
@@chasejackson7248 I was born on my Fathers Birthday. We Celebrated Every Birthday Together. He passed 7 years ago. My Bestfriend, My Hero. Birthdays arent very exciting in general anymore. Just some more of the same. Pat and Ian take me back to a childhood long forgotten with all of the hustle and bustle of the worlds problems, if only for the moment.
I never heard "slabbed" until I tried to sell my comic collection last month
I just would like to say that I’ve been collecting and playing video games for like 35+ years. WATA you don’t know anything about video games and you shouldn’t be appraising and authenticating shit they don’t know about.
Well we know now that Wada whole gig was to overly inflate the games values to make millions off it.
Wonder how many people are going to send in resealed games into WATA
Hmmmmm. I wonder if Wata put the wrong board in on their own. Knowing what we know now.
Aged like wine!
Future prove past
...hahaha
I was waiting for this to happen. It was a matter of time.
Yea they need to f&@$ing drop the price on this grading BS. Buying prototype carts is deadly water. In some cases there is no way to validate some of these carts.
Might be cold of me, but it brings me some joy that WATA screwed up and someone was scammed out of a lot of money. Hopefully more of this happens so we can go back to this continuing as a hobby and not as an investment.
I have an innocent question - can you be indicted for fraud if you claim to be an expert on something, and sell products and services predicated on you being an expert, if it turns out that you are not in fact an expert?
For something to be fraudulent you the person at fault has to have malice and knowledge of what they are doing is false. This looks like a mistake.
Get well soon Ian
WATA is fake. Faker than this "prototype"
where is the street fighter 2 snes prototype featured in the EGM april 92" issue?
Came here to watch this again
Pat the only thing you didn't cover in this video is what compensation water was going to make to those who bought the fake prototypes
Gratz on your slabbed copy of Madden 95
Wata just keeps seeming worse and worse to me!!!
I've always been curious about this, but never had the stones to follow through with it. If one were to make an immaculately detailed reproduction, what are the odds it would get through the grading process. Particularly with sealed games. The simple act of opening the game would destroy it's value, so they're simply grading the print quality of the box and the quality/integrity of the H-seam. Now, high end printing presses and the right die-cutter, etc. could easily replicate this. At least with a rare comic book each page is typically gone over in detail to assess its condition and print quality. With sealed games this is very much not the case. I would almost venture to guess there may be a couple of these floating around already, and we may just never know. Particularly if said person were to already be known to be an owner of a given rare game, and have access to proper materials, it would be a snap to pull off, honestly.
Your long question can be answered with a simple a direct "They'll throw a slab over anything and 'grade' it if you throw enough money at them."
None of the other factors you mentioned are likely ever even taken into account.
@@cabbusses Mildly cynical, yet acceptable, answer. I suppose it was more of a thought experiment in the flawed nature of sealed game collecting more than anything.
WATA hasn’t got a clue. Its like if gamestop started grading videogames
I like that Spectre is close to the word Speculator.
I'd be better at authenticating a prototype than WATA.
And yet no one would hire me for such a thing.
I've been out of gaming since N64 days so I would never hold any grade I give to be _informed,_ but I have a fairly detailed eye and think I could still _sift-out_ a lot of the less obvious fakes. 😇
Of course; The absence of serial numbers and batch codes from the outer boxes makes non-destructive authentication of anything *considerably more* difficult... 🎰
Watatage.... The worst that ever happened to the collector's scene.
Being able to research obscure oddities is definitely the responsibility of the grading entity. If they can't say with 100% confidence what something is, they should return to sender. Their name is on the line.
I don't think for NES or SNES games it would actually be too difficult to fake factory seals. You can still find factor sealed copies of "undesirable games" for under $100. Just very carefully remove it and transfer it to a desirable game like Chrono Trigger. Even if you have to spend a few hundred to get a crappy factory sealed game, it's worth when idiots are paying thousands or tens of thousands for "good" factory sealed games.
Prime reason to not give a shit about these "authentications".
Authenticating items never before seen by human beings. Yup, makes sense.
So... Aliens? Is this from the Mayan Temple?
There are SO many fakes we come across...and fakers have stepped up their game. Lately a lot of GameCube NR disc fakes...😶
Sealing a prototype is gross, and fake prototypes? Unbelievable.
So much for WATA being > than VGA.
What is worse is that games that were once common place games are being bought up and held at ransom because the Speedrunning community is needing/wanting them when emulators are band for some games. Kills me. Bonk NES, Bonk GB, Super Bonk, Spongbob Battle for Bikini Bottom, Conkers bad fur day, the list goes on. @.@
I never expected this from Pat the NES punk! Not like this, if a topic like this lands on Pat! It's so outrageous.
Never believed in the grading system boom for selling and trade. Personal collection? Sure. In a lot of ways, I'm glad the integrity took a hit because for too long, too many people have taken advantage of it. Game over, kids.
i think grading should be illegal anyway, since it sets something that is subjective anyway. grading and authenticating are 2 different things of course. when you authenticate you should really know what you're doing of course :D
Why did I almost read your username as Steiner Bros? Lol
Seeing how Shawn from Reserved Investment talks about comic book speculator/investor getting out of comic and now into videogame, they will be duped into buying these fakes without knowing since they put all their trust with the grading companies. Hope they learn their lesson
I don't get grading one of a kind items, like prototypes. The whole point of grading is to have a numerical comparison between 2 similar mass produced items... so you know one is better quality/better preserved then another...
In theory, it should also be good to have an expert verify an authentic copy of a product vs. a "really well-produced" pirated copy, but in practice it's almost always used by collectors to try to drive up prices of once-common games artificially.
man it is tough to do this with games proper let alone prototypes it just seems like more trouble than it it worth
more people should have listened to you guys
8:04 Even some "retrogaming" stores have been resealing games for years... When there is money to be made, people will do anything...
It's full of Wata quick!...give me a glass!
insane that this happened
@@darkspartan566 Not really, it was bound to happen some time. It's insane it's taken this long.
Linus Tech Tips: We WATA-cooled this fake prototype board still in its holed cart and grading slab :P
@@maxxdahl6062 true now I know what else to look for...but for me personally I'm more into the imports as I find them to be not tampered with if you get what I mean by censored to taking sprites out etc...just the game being nerfed period as they split between regions I feel like I get more experience out of them as they are original.
@@IanNewYashaTheFinalAct lol
Credibility nullified
PCGS authenticated many fake coins, so it does happen once in a while, but not good for a new company like WATA
As Pat said before, buy stocks instead if you are looking for an investment.
When things get to be of a certainly value and rarity you really need to know the provenance of what you are buying. Without that its worthless.
The chinese are faking guitars now that are very close to original USA guitars. It won’t be long and the video game fakes will be absolutely perfect. So much easier.
100% this, counterfeits are big business and even I must admit I was almost deceived by a fake Les Paul Custom, dodged a big bullet...
*Laughs in Final Fantasy Tidus*
I also think it’s a problem to affix a price to a 1/1. You have to let the market dictate the price of something like this. Naw it’s a million, for reasons.
Can WATA Authenticate and Rate an 800 pounds ITG Dedicab?
Wow, just wow
You need to fix the NES app. The last update messed up the search making it useless
Please reach out to contactus@ceruleangames.com with any app issues. :)
yea but its a prototype, they can still authenticate regular games
Then they test the cart and its madden lol
Pea and Beckett sports cards authenticators have been fooled many times it happens it’s inevitable. It’s only a problem when someone gets scammed for a lot of money
WATA ya mean this is a fake?
In the background why below the picture of pat is a picture of the teacher from beavis and butthead
I’m busy working hard on an NES H-seam shrinkwrap machine as we speak! I’m gonna be rich!!!!!! Lol.
Too bad SNES Central is pro-censorship (talking about the recent Goemon fan translation). Would rather support neither them nor WATA.
I do get sick of this fake games though. Screw the people who do this crap.
Graded games get... B-
..... :-)
Hey Pat my NES guide App is acting up.. can you help me out?
WATA bunch of con men, eh?
Holy sh*t... wtf
This instantly loses value of all graded games- doesn’t make sense- it’s a glorified protective case that’s all
Will never use a grading inc service.
Here, give me a glass pre-labeled and the money. NEXT.
WATA story!
Are they even qualified to do this?
NOPE, just opportunists.
BRING BACK FUNCOLAND ALREADY!!! 😢😢🤣🤣
Not surprising. Wata is a scam
I remember dreamTR’s post on these from na 😂😂
What does WATA stand for?! WATA suka is going to buy this inflated game ? WATA sucker is born every second? And the list goes on and on. Good thing I have my Atari PONG rookie card Graded!!
WATA is a SCAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I ALWAYS think you all are talking about Satoru iwata when you talk about wata.
I always thought they were talking about Boston H20.
575forza We got wicked good wata out here guy.