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Ellen G. White and the Doctrine of the Trinity
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- čas přidán 13. 09. 2023
- In this presentation we will take a look at what the Seventh-day Adventist Church believes regarding God, and compare this belief with the writings of Ellen G. White to see if the two harmonize. This presentation for educational purposes, we pray you will find it a blessing and an encouragement to stand on the pillars of our faith regarding the personality of God and of Christ.
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“To believe that doctrine [The Trinity], when reading the scripture we must believe that God sent Himself into the world, died to reconcile the world to Himself, raised Himself from the dead, ascended to Himself in heaven, pleads before Himself in heaven to reconcile the world to Himself, and is the only mediator between man and Himself.
We must believe also that in the garden God prayed to Himself, if it were possible, to let the cup pass from Himself, and a thousand other such absurdities.”
J. N. Loughborough, Review & Herald, November 5, 1861
❤
O how humans know NOT THE MIND OF GOD & underestimate HIM ! JESUS CHRIST IS THE WORD OF GOD (KJV John 1:1-18) ; John 14:6:,15-18,23,26,28,31; 15:26 ,27 = THE GODHEAD ! (1)ALMIGHTY AUTHORITY GOD,(2) GOD'S WORD CREATOR LIFE LIGHT POWER, BORN NOT OF flesh, WORD WAS MADE flesh, GLORY GRACE TRUTH, IN THE BOSOM OF THE FATHER THE LAMB OF GOD THE SPIRIT RABBI MASTER MESSIAS THE CHRIST; John 3:13,16, 18 COMFORTER = (1)GOD (2) JESUS CHRIST (3) HOLY SPIRIT= John 15:26,27 = 10 COMMANDMENTS CHARACTER OF GOD(John 14:28), JESUS CHRIST COMMANDMENTS (GOD'S 10 & HIS 2 ADDED) = GOD JESUS CHRIST CHARACTER (John 10:29) & THE GIFT OF THE HOLY SPIRIT FROM GOD THROUGH JESUS CHRIST PRAYER FOR us GIVE us HIS CHARACTER if we diligently seek GOD DAILY IN JESUS CHRIST NAME= THREE DISTINCT BUT ONE IN CHARACTER= John 10:30
*@watchmanofthenight2700* How are you doing watchman? Oh, how I love that statement.
@@seekertruth3577 I am doing very well my friend, I pray that you and yours are all likewise. Grace to you and peace from God the Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ, Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father.
@@JudyAnn17 Grace to you and peace from God the Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ, Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father.
I am so sorry brother for being so bias, you did not project the statement by EG White about the word trio and triune God that she referred to. You are not honest in your presentation brother.
The trinity doctrin 😢came in after EGW die 15 years latter 1931 by our friend Jesuit LeroyFroom.
Froom was a SNAKE! EVERYTHING he touched was truth mixed with errors, so - I tend to suspect every quote I see from "Evangelism." If I just MUST know, I track the quote to it's earliest source AND read the entire context!
I don't know about the claim that he was a Jesuit priest, but it is clear that his many lies put him on the same side, membership or no!
I don't think it it fair to call it a Trinity Doctrine. The heresy ( if there is one) would be in the use of the word Persons. It is not entirely wrong to speak of who/what God/Elohim is as a trinity. God/Elohim is: God the Father, the only begotten Son, and the Holy Spirit which they have always shared and always will. It is the Word that became Jesus/Emanuel(God with us). It is at the very same time when God became a Father that the Word became the Son. Before the Incarnation (or His birth if you like) there was no Father, or an only begotten Son. To be a Father you must have a Son, and you can't be a Son without a Father. It all happens at the same time. The use of the word Persons is just completely wrong. Only Jesus/the Word became a man. Men are people, and all people are persons. But the rest of what God is did not become a person. They are not "God in 3 persons, blessed trinity". That's just a lovely and poetic hymn. Not a theological statement.
I hear this often - "But they have personalities so they are Persons." Wrong. My dog has a personality too but that does not make him a person. Where do they get the idea that a Deity can not have a personality?
"For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one...." John 5
" I and my Father are one." John 10
"And Elohim/God said, Let *us* make man in *our* image, after *our* likeness: ..." And They did! Gen 1
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made." John 1
God/Elohim has always been these same 3 Holy beings, and they always will be. And they exist from eternity past and into eternity future.
That's Adventist Theology and 100% Biblical.
Perhaps someone would like to explain to me what "the Trinity Doctrine" is. ?
@@sjepson100
There is no Doctrine of Trinity in the bible, only the Doctrine of JESUS CHRIST in the New Testament. No one should teach any other Doctrine other than the Doctrine of CHRIST. 2Jn.9-10 ; 1Tim.6:3
The Doctrine of CHRIST is the Word of Righteousness (Godliness or Image of GOD). Jn.7:16-18
When we call 'Trinity' a doctrine, we have strayed from the Truth, since there is no such doctrine. The 'Trinity' is not a doctrine but a 'Mystery'. A 'Mystery' is only understood by the Revelation of the Spirit. It cannot be taught but revealed by the Spirit. 1Cor.2:6-7, 9-12
1Tim.3:16 The mystery of Godliness is the mystery of the Son of GOD. Eph.3:1-5 Matt.16:15-17
The Mystery of the Trinity
Statement: ELOHIM is one Family, made up of three Entities, GOD the FATHER, CHRIST (represent all Mankind), and Angels. Eph.3:14-15 ; 4:6 ; Jn.10:33-36 Mankind become sons of GOD, and Angels are sons of GOD. Rom.8:14-16 ; Heb.2:10 ; Job.1:6, 2:1
JESUS said the FATHER is the only true GOD. Jn.17:3
GOD has many sons, but there is only one Firstborn Son, and HE is JESUS CHRIST, Who came from Humanity. Adam was appointed as the Firstborn but he fell and the replacement was JESUS CHRIST.
@@sjepson100: What the RCC came up with which they called the Trinity it was so confusing that hardly anyone believes it is its pristine form anymore. Each has their own opinion as to what it should be.
The reason being, anyone who dissented was named a heretic and burned, then.
Now the Bible is at the fingertips of anyone interested. Getting scriptural backing is another matter.
thanks Mr. Contreras for your.explanation. God bless
😇😇😇
Can you show in scripture before baby JESUS, WORD YHWH being called the son? Phil. 2:6 is a JESUS in the form of GOD, equal with GOD, emptied Himself to be a servant of GOD, then took on the form of man. HE became a servant of GOD then took the form of man. Your mixing up the order to fit EGW. "Let US make man in OUR image" are still "echad YHWH" in unified oneness. In the Image of GOD has no number it says spirit if the three are unified in spirit aka agreement are one. Man leaves his parents and they become "echad" flesh. in Gen, 1. WORD YHWH is 1st found in Gen. 15:1 and 15:4.
One more question, 1st Pet. 3:18-19 JESUS quickened in spirit, descended to the heart of the earth "Abraham's bosom" the paradise side of hells prison and thaght the gospel to spirits obviously wide awake. Who do you believe Ellen or JESUS "Verily, verily I say to you, TODAY thou shall be with me in paradise.
Why do you preach from EGW writing when 2nd Tim. 3:15 says scripture alone is sufficient?
The problem here is that no scripture was quoted.
Perhaps because the title states the nature of the talk. Ellen White and the trinity
@@PeacefulMoments1844 - When you start talking about Christianity, you should back up what you say Biblically.
@@NumberSixAtTheVillage , sure. But again this talk dealt with what the SDA church teaches in contrast to Mrs. White.
@@NumberSixAtTheVillageThis channel has tons of videos dealing with the trinity using scripture. This one specifically deals with EGW and trinity as per title. Stop nitpicking. Search for truth as for hidden treasures.
Yes ,the preacher is appealing to the Brothers and sisters in SDA conference using their own SOP writings and their own church histories..I am sure the SDA's need to go bck to their old paths Jeremiah 6:16
There is great confusion amongst SDA pastors - some preach tritheism [3 gods] while others preach trinitarianism [modalism] - *where does it leave the members? - in a state of confusion.*
The confirmation bias in psychology suggests that people will ignore evidence that challenges their ideas and only accept evidence that supports their premise. So, they walk around convinced that they have the truth. The beauty of truth lies in its simplicity. When we are honest with ourselves, we get more accurate information. Both Tritheism and the Trinity are pagan concepts.
A Trinity doctrine is commonly expressed as the statement that the one God exists *as or in* three equally divine “Persons”, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Every term in this statement (God, exists, *as or in,* equally divine, Person) *has been variously understood.* The guiding principle has been the creedal declaration that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit *"supposedly"* of the New Testament are consubstantial (i.e. the same in substance or essence, Greek: homoousios). *Because this shared substance or essence is a divine one, this is understood to imply that all three named individuals are divine, and equally so. Yet the three in some sense “are” supposedly the one God of the Bible.* - The Trinity tradition demands the numerical distinctness of the Persons. Anyone-self theory is also hard to square with the Son’s role as a mediator between God and humankind. These teachings arguably assume the Son to be a self, not a mere mode of a self, and to be a different self than his Father.
The Persons of the Trinity are so many selves constituted by something analogous to a matter. These selves, like the lump and dough, are numerically the same without being identical, but they don’t stand in a relation of accidental sameness, as they could not fail to be related in this way. Father, Son, and Spirit are three quasi form-matter compounds. The forms are properties like “being the Father, being the Son, and being the Spirit; or perhaps being unbegotten, being begotten and proceeding.” The single subject of those properties is “something that plays the role of matter,” - “the divine essence” or “the divine nature.”
*No wonder there is so much confusion because the one wants to outsmart the other trying to explain God.*
After its formulation and imperial enforcement towards the end of the fourth century, this theology reigned more or less unchallenged. But before this, and again in post-Reformation modernity, the origin, meaning, and justification of trinitarian doctrine have been repeatedly challenged.
SO RIGHT
the FUNDERMENTALS
in 2023
HAVE NO MENTION OF CONTEX
JESUS IN THE SACTUARY
GOD ON THE THROWN
HOLY SPIRIT WITH US
yet pastors are asked to sign some ambiguous statement
yet they OPENLY attribute GODHEAD to past MATRIACHAL philosophy
I give this a like as you have clearly done some research and have something of substance to add. I personally appreciate the comment and would only add that though you are correct that the Nicean creed (325) came to a conclusion concerning "Homoousion" I would add that the concept of a 3 person/1 being God was spoken about before then in the second century. Consider Ignatius' words here:
adopted it and or defiled it is no surprise. However, that is not the point. The point is that we should not assume that the fact that we get the term “trinity” from Rome does not necessarily mean that a correct concept of the Godhead is not found in the scriptures. One of the early fathers of the Church, Ignatious, commented that
“My spirit is but an offscouring of the cross, which is a scandal to the unbelieving, but to us it is salvation and life eternal. Where is the wise man? Where is the disputer? Where is the boasting of those who are called understanding? For our God, Jesus the Christ, was conceived by Mary according to a dispensation of God, from the seed of David, yes, but of the Holy Spirit as well.”-Thesaurus Linguae Graecae D
I came across this quote in a book called The Forgotten Trinity" by James White which I highly recommend. God bless
I always believed that the Holy Spirit is the spirit of God and the spirit of Jesus, when the trinity became a subject of confusion, for me i want a truth and clear understanding of the God i worshipped all my life, i now stand and worshipped as i always have.
Take the example of Jesus. He told the Samaritan woman:
(John 4:22) You worship what you do not know; WE WORSHIP WHAT WE KNOW, because salvation begins with the Jews.
Jesus obviously knew who and what he worshiped. He certainly wasn't including himself.
Same here, when I started hearing about the trinity a couple years ago I said WHAT? that don't make sense to me.
Amen brother, thank you!
Because Jesus says He cannot come unless I leave has me in disagreement with this message. In the Greek, what do the words another and Comforter mean?
1 Timothy 3:1-5 (KJV) 1 This [is] a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. 2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; 3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; 4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; 5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
The problem is that we want to appeal to logic whereas we are dealing with a mystery:
"I am the resurrection, and the life." He who had said, "I lay down my life, that I might take it again," came forth from the grave to life that was in himself. Humanity died; divinity did not die. In his divinity, Christ possessed the power to break the bonds of death. He declares that he has life in himself to quicken whom he will. YI January 3, 1905, par. 1
Why more and more people are over complicating the plain thus says the Word of God.
It teaches the Godhead.
The “Godhead” simply means the head of all gods. Read Deut. 10:17
@@glorialoo3165 The Father is greater in terms of rank/position.
Very timely message
God bless you brother.
For me there is no confusion. The answer is in Deuteronomy 29:29
1 John 5:7 Says, There are Three that bear record in Heaven, the Father, the Word (Son), and the Holy Spirit, and these Three are One.
I found this exposition very interesting. I cannot help but notice that there are plenty of quotes from SDA publications, and also from Ellen White. What I really missed were biblical references, of which there are many. Why? I would suggest that we are finite beings attempting to explain and understand an infinite God, and that it will take eternity for us to even begin to understand our God.
No, not one. Her writings are held up as equal to scriptures, although some don't realize they do this.
Using false reasoning against falsehoods is easy.
Backing these up using the scriptures is another matter.
Jesus knew whom and what God he worshiped. He certainly wasn't included.
(John 4:22) You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, because salvation begins with the Jews.
Very powerful sermon brother. I'm so glad that there are still people who believe like I did and like the pioneers believed. Understanding God and His Son as a person is very necessary. It is also important to understand that the Spirit is not a separate person, but the Spirit of God himself. Thank God brother for the clear preaching and unequivocal quotations of the spirit of prophecy and the pioneers of Adventism. May God bless you.
POWERFUL ENOUGH TO SEND YOU TO HELL READ YOUR HOLY KING JAMES BIBLE YOURSELF AND YOU WILL SEE THE LIES THAT THE SDA ARE TELLING YOU AND I AM A SDA AND I NOT HAVE PEOPLE BELIEVE IN THE LIES OF EGW NOT HER LIES BUT THE LORD JESUS CHRIST AND HIS GOSPELS AND NOT EGW’S FALSE GOSPELS BUT THE HOLY BIBLE KJV SHE IS NO PROPHETESS WAKE UP AND READ THE HOLY KJB YOU ARE ACCURSED
@@richardwalters8585These people are not Seventh Day ADVENTIST, they are just wolves in sheep clothing so what you are hearing is not the bleating of sheep but rather the baying of wolves!
John 14:9 two Person!! And John 14:6 two Person. Spirit of Prophecy says " the holy Spirit is both,the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ".( PTUK-Jan.9.1896 pg.19.1)+ ( CCH 76.5)
I don't pretent to understand God likr some seem to, but can you explain Isaiah 9: 6, Matt. 1: 23, Gal. : 4: 6, The Son also has a Spirit, Heb. 1: 6, 8. Jesus receives worship from both man, (while on earth) and angel in heaven. The Father calls Him God. John 1: 1, 2. And this is just a sample. If you want to 'debunk' the trinity, begin with every verse of the bible. Jesus said He will send another (similar) Comforter. The Holy Spirit presents our petitions to the Father 'with groanings that cannot be uttered'. Seek to give a balanced perspective. In Rev. 1: 8 Jesus cannot be the 'beginning' if He had a beginning. If He had no beginning, then He IS God.
We need to realize that the Holy Spirit, who is as much a person as God is a person, is walking through these grounds.- Manuscript 66, 1899 (From a talk to the students at the Avondale School.).
Had God the Father come to our world and dwelt among us, veiling His glory and humbling Himself, that humanity might look upon Him, the history that we have of the life of Christ would not have been changed in unfolding its record of His own condescending grace. In every act of Jesus, in every lesson of His instruction, we are to see and hear and recognize God. In sight, in hearing, in effect, it is the voice and movements of the Father. But language seems to be so feeble! I refrain, and with John exclaim, “Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew Him not” [1 John 3:1].-Letter 83, 1895.
So well done...Thank you so much... this sermon was like water for the thirsty... So grateful ... All Praises to the Most High Yah
As the saints in the kingdom of God are accepted in the beloved, they hear: “Come, ye blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.” And then the golden harps are touched, and the music flows all through the heavenly host, and they fall down and worship the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. And then what? What next did I see? Ms139, 1906 para 32.
At time-lapse 19:24 - *Why would that man compare God with an egg? Is he sound of mind?*
To whom will you liken God [Isaiah 40:18]. Why would any sensible person compare God with an egg or any other thing in nature? God has no equal. [Isaiah 46:5]. There is nothing or no one to whom God can be compared.
“To whom then will you compare me, that I should be like him? says the Holy One.” [Read Isaiah 40:25-29]
“To whom will you liken me and make me equal, and compare me, that we may be alike? …remember the former things of old; for I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me…’ [Isaiah 40:12-18, 25; 46:5, 9].
Seems like these types of illustrations are common among Trinitarians. - *Profanity*
If you read fundamental belief 2, you actually have 2 definitions. You have the 3 persons in 1 being Trinity and then, further down, 3 beings.
Most don't pick this up.
Truly there is so much confusion that they can't even get their version correct.
What baffles me the most about this corrupt wresting of the scriptures, so sneakily inserted into the SDA FBs, is that the 'proof texts' they list FAIL so miserably to PROVE ANY SUCH THING! And when anyone tries to call them (the pretentious BRI) they seem to ignore that charge (of 'this makes NO sense') in their HASTE to discredit the person calling it!
If their spirit in so doing is not the most telling indicator of their sold-out position, I don't know what else to say!
*@jmrdrgz* There is much confusion amongst SDA pastors - some preach tritheism [3 gods] while others preach trinitarianism [modalism] - where does it leave the members? - in a state of utter confusion. It appears that all is on board as long as they use the phrase trinity.
Or maybe people like to cause confusion when there is none
How do you guys understand that?
Christ is the manifestation of God's love for man.
I was wondering who it was that told you it was a good idea to start a war with God over the Father, Son and Holy Spirit and at the end where do you think it will take you?
THE SECOND COMMANDMENT, THE TRINITY AND THE OMNIPRESENCE OF GOD
I always wondered what was so significant about the second Commandment that Rome found it necessary to remove it altogether from the Ten Commandments. But it appears that there is a fundamental truth in that Commandment concerning where God's presence is that is intended to protect us from all forms of false worship.
The second Commandment tells us that we should not bow down before any image. This implies that God is not in any image. Which means that God is not everywhere. The Bible tells us that God is in heaven; and heaven is not everywhere. Heaven is above the earth and that is where we should direct our worship to God, where He is. He knows everything that happens everywhere and can go wherever He pleases but His abode is in heaven where Jesus, our High Priest and intercessor, is presenting our cases to Him. - "Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens" (Heb. 8:1).
Furthermore, both the prophets Daniel and John saw God in heaven with the angels gathered around His throne and Jesus being separate and distinct (Dan. 7 and Rev. 4, 5). Daniel said "the Ancient of days did sit" (Dan. 7:9) and "one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days" (Dan. 7:13). John said "one sat on the throne" (Rev. 4:2) who was worshipped as the Creator to whom it was said "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created" (Rev. 4:11), with Jesus appearing before Him to receive a book and power and authority, as the Lamb who was slain, while the angels sang, "Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever." (Rev. 5:13).
God is not everywhere all at once like a vapour while part of Him or an image sits on the throne representing Him. God Himself sits, of whom man was made in His image after His likeness, "made after the similitude of God" (James 3:9).
Logically, if God is everywhere, He can be worshipped wherever He is. One could then bow down and worship before a stone, a tree, a person or any object, not as worshipping the object but as worshipping God, since God is in it. That would open the door for the worship of false Gods as no one would be able to tell the difference whether you are worshipping the true God or not.
It would not be consistent to forbid worshipping before an object if God is in the object and one is worshipping, not the object, but God who is in the object. This is evident in the experience of the children of Israel in the wilderness. God appeared to them in a cloud and they were not forbidden to bow before Him in the cloud - "And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud" (Ex. 19:9), "And all the people saw the cloudy pillar stand at the tabernacle door: and all the people rose up and worshipped, every man in his tent door" (Ex. 33:10). If God is not in a particular place, say in an image, it means that there is at least one place where He is not. He cannot be everywhere and not everywhere at the same time.
The idea that the Holy Spirit is God present everywhere was precisely the argument that Dr. John Harvey Kellogg put forward to justify his pantheistic teachings. And Ellen White told him that he was wrong. Initially, he said that God was in everything. And when God instructed Ellen White to oppose it, he modified it by saying that at the time of his first presentation of the matter in the book "The Living Temple" he did not believe in the Trinity. Because of that, he said he had not given a clear explanation of the matter. He went on to explain that he had now come to believe in the Trinity and could better explain his idea. The new explanation was that it was not God the Father, but God the Holy Ghost who was everywhere and in everything. Ellen White told him that he was wrong. And we can see why. If God the Holy Spirit is everywhere and can be worshipped, it is a doorway to replace worshipping God and Christ in heaven entirely.
Another modified version of Kellogg's idea is that the Holy Spirit is really Christ himself or both God and Christ in an omnipresent form. This is also not correct as it places God and Christ on earth rather than in heaven.
The pioneers of Seventh-day Adventism stated in their Fundamental Principles of faith published in the 1889 Yearbook that God was everywhere present by His representative, the Holy Spirit. At face value, this would suggest that this representative is omnipresent. But it is perhaps more consistent with scripture to say that He is everywhere present by His representatives the holy spirits. Holy spirits are ministering spirits sent from heaven - "And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hereafter ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man." (John1:51). "Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?" (Heb. 1:14).
This is consistent with the Hebrew word ruach and the Greek word pneuma that are translated in the Bible as spirit. These words are also translated spirits, thus indicating that the Holy Spirit need not be seen as one individual being who is omnipresent but many spirit beings representing God everywhere.
From this perspective, there is no denying that the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, sent at Pentecost is a person - only not a God-being to be worshipped. Like the Angel of Revelation 18 who comes down from heaven with the latter rain - a similar occurrence as that which took place at Pentecost except more extensive - the Comforter would be seen as a messenger sent by Christ from heaven, as stated repeatedly in John 14-16. Ellen G. White describing the latter rain speaks of a mighty angel from heaven being sent to do this work and further said, "Angels were sent to aid the mighty angel from heaven" (Ellen. G. White, Story of Redemption, p. 399).
It should be noted that Jesus's warning against blaspheming against the Holy Spirit is not implying that the Holy Spirit is more to be revered than Jesus Himself. Jesus went back to heaven and promises to return to this earth to take us to His Father's house in heaven. He left the Holy Spirit to guide us until He returns. If we reject that guidance by blasheming against the the Holy Spirit, there will be nobody to guide us. The situation is similar to what God told the children of Israel in the wilderness - "Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for my name is in him." (Ex. 23:20, 21). It is simply warning us not to reject the Holy Spirit's guidance. It is not forbidding us seeking to understand who the Holy Spirit is or what the Holy Spirit does.
So, there we have it. The church has now fully accepted Kellogg's idea. Ellen White said that the initial presentation by Kellogg was the alpha of deadly heresies. She said that the omega would follow shortly afterwards and would be accepted. And it did follow shortly afterwards in Kellogg's modified version, based on his acceptance of the Trinity. And the church has now fully accepted it - that God (the Holy Spirit) is everywhere and should be worshipped. So, based on current practice, Jesus is worshipped, the Holy Spirit is worshipped but the One true God is almost entirely ignored. Jesus, praying to His Father, made it clear who the "only true God" is and identified Himself as the one sent by God - "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:3).
Nowhere in the Bible is worship given to anyone else except the one seated on the throne who is referred to as "LORD God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come" (Rev.4:8) and to the Christ, the Lamb, as it will be in the new earth - "And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it." (Rev. 21:22). God is the Father of Christ. Accordingly, Christ, the Lamb is seen with "an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads" (Rev. 14:1). It is the name of the Lamb's Father that will be written in their foreheads.
Whatever one's concept of the Godhead, the term "godhead" is used only three times in the Bible (Acts 17:29, Rom. 1:20 and Col. 2:9) and in none of these places is the expression used to replace the idea of God being a single individual who has a Divine Son who is worshipped alongside Himself. And not even once does the term "godhead" in scripture allude to the worship of anyone else.
All worship should be directed to God and Christ in heaven. It is not about where we are when we worship but, like sending a petition to the king of England, we do not send it to Spain or Australia but to him in England where he is. Similarly, Jesus in teaching us how to pray directed that we say, "Our Father which art in heaven".
We should not be praying to nor worshipping anything on earth. We should pray to God in heaven, approaching His throne through Christ, our Mediator, and we should direct our worship to heaven where God is. This is the substance of the second Commandment that Rome has removed.
Will you copy your comment for me and send it to me.
Amen.,., Gbu.,., The truth will set you free
The EGW Book Evangelism page 616 is very clear. Unfortunately you have turned turned a non-subject into a subject and are misusing the moment we are to preach the everlasting gospel to sour people and bring about conflict. Missions to lost people will clear your mind to what is really important for this time.
Ameeeen, bendiciones hermano.
Since the Trinity was a concept brought forth by the apostate church (Acts 20:30), it would explain why each one has a different explanation to what is should be.
FALSE
Actually the doctrine that states Jesus is Not God which is now called Anti-Trinity, came in through the Alexandrians, who, if you recall, were disputing with Stephen in Acts 6:9. They were eventually called Ariens, and we're the cause for the need of the Nicean convention if you will in 325 AD.
@@themanlymansite: The teaching that Jesus is NOT God is all over the Bible.
Logically, the prophecy at Acts 20:30 which tells us that after the death of the Apostles, twisted teachings would surface meant that the Trinity was one such.
Ever heard of Christian doctrines being decided on by a pagan Roman Emperor?
Guess who presided over the Nicene Council.
If the RCC was the one true church why did the Protestants sects break away? What would that logically make these Protestant sects into?
@@themanlymansite :(1 Corinthians 8:6) there is actually to us one God, the Father,
The TO US refers to True Christians.
JWs today.
Others are free to believe whatever they like or want to.
What about the quotation?
"Now a little point. As the saints in the kingdom of God are accepted in the beloved, they hear: “Come, ye blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.” [Matthew 25:34.] And then the golden harps are touched, and the music flows all through the heavenly host, and they fall down and worship the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. And then what? What next did I see? One meets another; and they say, as they fall right upon their necks with their faces shining with the glory of God, “It was you, it was you that brought the truth to me, and I would not hear it at first, but, O I am so glad.” Now that will be acted all through the heavenly courts, thanksgiving and praise to God for those that have been the means of winning others to the truth, that they should come and have an interest for them, and then they are united among the saved. O what a meeting! what a meeting!" (Ellen White, Manuscrito 139, 1906)
I am from Brazil and want answer.
I don't think they can answer such a clear statement, brother.
Eu nunca vi uma citação de adoração ao Espírito Santo vindo de EGW, então logo achei estranho esse texto não ter sido publicado em algum livro.
John 4:24 says God is a spirit. What does that mean?
Yes with the power of the air!!!
How can anyone think reading EGW is "Sola Scriptura"?
These are a few from EGW l could get quickly.
Desire of Ages page 671 Ellen white refers to the Holy Spirit as the third person of the God head
Evangelism Page 615 "Three living persons of the heavenly trio"
EG white Letter 8 1896
Evil has-been accumulating for centuries and could only be restrained and resisted by the mighty power of the Holy Spirit, the third person of the God head who is in the fullness of divine power
1 Timothy 2:12-14 (KJV) 12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. 13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
So, what is your point in posting this scripture here? Are you saying God didn't use Ellen G White to communicate His instruction? Or what?
Also can be translated wife. Peters virgin daughters prophesied. Anna in the temple ,Debora judge etc
I have just watched the other side of this controversy, in a series by Pastor Stephen Bohr, called Revisiting the Godhead. It's a four-part series. Anyone studying the subject should hear both sides. It is possible, to do great harm, to one's own salvation, by listening a particular aspect of God isn't so clearly revealed in Scripture . People should stay away from this subject if one is not fully convinced. What is better; to uplift the glory of God by accident or diminish a personality of God by accident??? I think a person can make a grave mistake in doing the later, and then teaching the subject as if it's the truth. Maranatha!
Does he preach in Spanish?
Yes. You can find them on our spanish CZcams channel. Thank you for watching.
Thank you@@Seventh-dayChurchofRevelation
To say “ it doesn’t matter what view point people have as long as it’s called “trinity” is dangerous. If the HS is believed to be a separate person/ entity, then the HS becomes the Father of Mary…. Which is the position Satan has been vying for…to be father/head of the gods. which puts a very sinister slant on the concept of a Trinity. Who is the entity trying to be acknowledged at a level above God? In Genesis when it says “ Let US make man in our image and likeness, it is referring to God the Father and God the Son. Remember Jesus said “ I and the Father are one”. He didn’t include the Holy Spirit in that.
When God said they are one, they are one. Don’t explained what is not revealed by God
Jesus said that He and God ARE one. ARE is a plural.
Like the Board of Directors say they ARE one on some issue.
It just means UNITED in thought. 1 Corinthians 1:10.
They are ONE GODHEAD The Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
"The eternal Godhead-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost-is involved in the action required to make assurance to the human agent.”-Upward Look, 148.
Juan: It seems that beliefs, dogma & theologies are the contaminators of religion because they produce a spirit of antagonism & pride-a spirit that spoils the beauty of stillness & compassion for all? Does that make sense?
Yes, if these beliefs do not originate with the Bible.
Where does the God Head come in then?
Nowhere.
The word godhead means divinity.
Romans 1: 20; Colossians 2: 9
@StevenDragoo Thanks, but do those verses have any definition of the Godhead? Romans chapter 1 verses 3, 4, 7 and 8 we read God, His son, Jesus Christ, God, the Son of God, we read God, our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ, God through Jesus Christ. Then there's 9 God and his Son. So you see there are lots of definitions and phrases that Paul uses. Doesn't he want us to understand God is...the Father and His son is Jesus Christ?
Colossians chapter 2: 9. Tells us that in Jesus dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. Paul doesn't say what the Godhead is... But he does say who God is, and chapter 1 verse 2 it states God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ, and then again vs 3 God and the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
So from these, can we see that Godhead means divinity? So am I being unscriptural when anyone tells me that Godhead is a 3 in 1 being, yet l understand that it is man's thinking and not a Bible definition?
Still seeking to give a true direction to her faith, Jesus declared, “I am the resurrection, and the life.” In Christ is life, original, unborrowed, underived. “He that hath the Son hath life.” 1 John 5:12. The divinity of Christ is the believer's assurance of eternal life. [DA 530.3]
The MOST compelling point to me of the evidence that the Holy Spirit absolutely cannot be an entity is this:
The Bible says the Holy Spirit impregnated Mary.
That would make the Holy Spirit Jesus’ father.
That would mean God the Father is actually not Jesus’ father.
That would make Jesus a liar. And God not the Father. And the holy spirit then would take the seat as the Father of the godhead/god family.
HS Impregnated Jesus is not correct. Jesus' birth was not a normal human birth. See the prophecy ay Micah 5:2.
The holy spirit which is God's active force, made a transfer of an angel into a human form.
Philippians 2:7 No, but he emptied himself and took a slave’s form and BECAME HUMAN.
Luke 1:35 In answer the angel said to her: “Holy spirit will come upon you, and POWER of the Most High will overshadow you.....
There is only ONE God, the Father. - 1 Cor 8:6.
@@jimjuri6490 You are deluded! This is so wrong.
@@jjcam56 : I certainly didn't write those scriptures. I was only quoting them to help.
Let me know what you cannot accept or understand.
@@jimjuri6490 Hmm may I ask how you view the holy spirit being described as a seperate name in the Gospel commission? In the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost. I myself am a non trinitarian but I'm not sure the nature of the Holy Spirit and see evidence for both sides.
@@mrpologuy9293 : The holy spirit is a force God uses to accomplish whatever He wills.
Luke 11:13 Therefore, if you, although being wicked, know how to GIVE GOOD GIFTS to your children, how much more so will the Father in heaven GIVE HOLY SPIRIT to those asking him!”
Note that the holy spirit is compared to a good gift.
Eligible candidates who want to become Jesus' disciples, must know who the Father is as He is the ONLY TRUE GOD ( 1 Corinthians 8:6, John 17:3). Then these potential candidates for baptism should also know who Jesus is and what role he plays in God's purpose. Plus, these should know what the holy spirit is and what part it plays.
The command to baptize in the name of .... at Matthew 28:19 is the above. No one was ever baptized using a Father, son and holy spirit formula.
NAME doesn't mean an actual name.
God has a name - Jehovah.
God's son has a name - Jesus, the Christ.
God's holy spirit? What name does it have?
God is in heaven. How does he make things happen on earth. He uses his holy spirit. Check out Newton's first law.
Hope this helps.
The J W site will explain anything and everything related to the Bible. Check it out.
Ephesians 3:14-15 KJV
“For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, [15] Of whom the whole FAMILY in HEAVEN and EARTH is named”
I haven’t received an answer yet from any Trinitarian when I ask this question: If you believe there’s a Family in Heaven as well as believing the Holy Spirit is not God nor Christ but a third divine being, how is the Holy Spirit related to God and Christ? Because a Family consists of individuals who are related to each other and all have personal names. For example: God(Jehovah)is related to Christ in that he’s his Father,Christ is related to God in that he’s his Son, the Angel who stands in the presence of God is a member of the Heavenly family who’s personal name is Gabriel, So how is the Holy Spirit related to the Father and the Son? Again no answer/response
Good point
*@DonjohnsonBG* Excellent analogy.
A natural Son has a beginning, while within the Godhead the Son is eternal. The term “Son” is used metaphorically when applied to the Godhead, the deity. It conveys the ideas of distinction of persons within the Godhead and the equality of nature in the context of an eternal, loving relationship.
"God cannot be compared with the things His hands have made. These are mere earthly things...We must not attempt to lift with presumptuous hand the curtain behind which He veils His majesty. The apostle exclaims: “How unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out! Romans 11:33." (EGW, The Faith I Live By, p. 39)
The answer to your question is God consists of three eternal Persons who are self-existent, and they have a eternal loving relationship.
A unitarian God does not possess love and would require a change in nature the moment any other individuals come into existence. Yet the bible declares God to be unchanging and has always been that way.
A unitarian God exists in the case of selfish love. Only a God exists in three persons can express love in a devoted caring and sharing manner!!
The issue with people is they don’t understand Oneness in the bible. There is unity, you can’t have love without another to express that love, unless it’s Self love. Self love is not love.
@@ChristAdventwitnessBefore the incarnation the Angel told Mary the Son birth of her was the Son of the Highest and the Son of God (Luke 1:32 & 35) I see you calling God a liar; At the Baptism and the Transfiguration God clearly says This is my Son! Not Mary. What’s your understanding of what a Son is? Because you are a Son to your Father who you took his life and nature from; Christ is the same to his Father notice: John 5:26 KJV “For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he GIVEN to the Son to have life in himself” This is not natural life but divine life the Father gave to his Son. Furthermore the quote you posted by EGW she clearly called God He and His which denotes one individual person not three persons. If you believe Jesus is not! a real Son to God the Father this is the spirit of Antichrist (1 John 2:22-23)
Good explanation .
God's word: Let us make mankind in our image is plural Psalms says God's I heard There are 3 great powers in heaven I say 4+ because of the mighty angels billions likely
No one can understand the nature of God. And it is not a sin to misunderstood the nature of God (Isaiah 55:8). If we can understand the mystery of God, then He is not God at all. Waste no time about arguing whose theology is correct. It doesn't matter to the "One True God". What matters most to Him to have a saving relationship with Him.
Why are you quoting from this woman and the Bible plays second best .???
I don't get your logic at all .
Thank you for your question. The reason why quotes from Ellen White were used was because this particular talk has to do with her views on the personality of God in contrast to the views of the SDA Church today. I hope this helps.
Seriously!! Did you just say the Holy Spirit IS IN THE SEED OR THE INSECT AT THE 42 MINUTE MARK??
That's the Pantheism Kellogg endorsed! Is He in the sinner too...because Ellen White refuted that idea as well.
"We have been brought together as a school, and we need to realize that the Holy Spirit, WHO IS AS MUCH A PERSON AS GOD IS A PERSON, is walking through these grounds, unseen by human eyes, that the Lord God is our Keeper and Helper. He hears every word we utter and knows every thought of the mind. 14LtMs, Ms 66, 1899, par. 11
"The Holy Spirit always leads to the written Word. THE HOLY SPIRIT IS A PERSON; for He beareth witness with our spirits that we are the children of God. When this witness is borne, it carries with it its own evidence. At such times we believe and are sure that we are the children of God. What strong evidence of the power of truth we can give to believers and unbelievers when we can voice the words of John, "We have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him." 1 John 4:16. The Holy Spirit HAS A PERSONALITY, else He could not bear witness to our spirits and with our spirits that we are the children of God. HE MUST ALSO HE A DIVINE PERSON, else He could not search out the secrets which lie hidden in the mind of God. "For what man knoweth the things of a man save the spirit of man, which is in him; even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God." 1 Corinthians 2:11. 21LtMs, Ms 20, 1906, par. 31-32
Bible Training School, March 1, 1906, paragraphs 1-2, 6- “The Father cannot be described by the things of earth. The Father is all the fullness of the Godhead bodily, and is invisible to mortal sight. The Son is all the fullness of the Godhead manifested. The word of God declares Him to be “the express image of His person.” “God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” Here is shown the personality of the Father. The Comforter that Christ promised to send after He ascended to heaven, is the Spirit in all the fullness of the Godhead, making manifest the power of divine grace to all who receive and believe in Christ as a personal Savior. THERE ARE THREE LIVING PERSONS OF THE HEAVENLY TRIO; IN THE NAME OF THESE THREE POWERS-THE FATHER, THE SON, AND THE HOLY GHOST-those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, AND THESE POWERS WILL COOPERATE WITH THE OBEDIENT SUBJECTS OF HEAVEN IN THEIR EFFORTS TO LIVE THE NEW LIFE IN CHRIST…He that believeth in the Son, hath the Father also. He who has continual faith in the Father and the Son HAS THE SPIRIT ALSO. The Holy Spirit is his Comforter, and he never departs from the truth.”- Also found in In Heavenly Places, pg. 336, par. 2, and also found in Manuscript 21, 1906, par. 11.
Yes. Notice the following carefully:
Fathers and mothers, teach your children of the wonder-working power of God. His power is manifest in every plant, in every tree that bears fruit. Take the children into the garden and explain to them how He causes the seed to grow. The farmer plows his land and sows the seed, but he cannot make the seed grow. He must depend upon God to do that which no human power can do. 👉 The Lord puts His own Spirit into the seed, causing it to spring into life. - 8T 326.4
Not by its own inherent energy does the earth produce its bounties, and year by year continue its motion around the sun. 👉 An unseen hand guides the planets in their circuit of the heavens. 👉 A mysterious life pervades all nature-a life that sustains the unnumbered worlds throughout immensity, that lives in the insect atom which floats in the summer breeze, that wings the flight of the swallow and feeds the young ravens which cry, that brings the bud to blossom and the flower to fruit… For all the objects of His creation the condition is the same-a life sustained by receiving the life of God, a life exercised in harmony with the Creator’s will. -ED 99
@@theguardpost6250 it says His power and His sustaining hand, NOT THE HOLY SPIRIT. Those are totally different things.
"We have been brought together as a school, and we need to realize that the Holy Spirit, WHO IS AS MUCH A PERSON AS GOD IS A PERSON, is walking through these grounds, unseen by human eyes, that the Lord God is our Keeper and Helper. He hears every word we utter and knows every thought of the mind. 14LtMs, Ms 66, 1899, par. 11
"The Holy Spirit always leads to the written Word. THE HOLY SPIRIT IS A PERSON; for He beareth witness with our spirits that we are the children of God. When this witness is borne, it carries with it its own evidence. At such times we believe and are sure that we are the children of God. What strong evidence of the power of truth we can give to believers and unbelievers when we can voice the words of John, "We have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him." 1 John 4:16. The Holy Spirit HAS A PERSONALITY, else He could not bear witness to our spirits and with our spirits that we are the children of God. HE MUST ALSO HE A DIVINE PERSON, else He could not search out the secrets which lie hidden in the mind of God. "For what man knoweth the things of a man save the spirit of man, which is in him; even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God." 1 Corinthians 2:11. 21LtMs, Ms 20, 1906, par. 31-32
"Here is where the work of the Holy Ghost comes in, after your baptism. You are baptized IN THE NAME OF THE FATHER, OF THE SON, AND OF THE HOLY GHOST. You are raised up out of the water to live henceforth in newness of life-to live a new life. You are born unto God, and you stand under the sanction and the power of THE THREE HOLIEST BEINGS IN HEAVEN Who are able to keep you from falling. You are to reveal that you are dead to sin; your life is hid with Christ in God. Hidden 'with Christ in God' (Colossians 3:3)-wonderful transformation. This is a most precious promise. When I feel oppressed, and hardly know how to relate myself toward the work that God has given me to do, I JUST CALL UPON THE THREE GREAT WORTHIES AND SAY, 'You know i cannot do this work in my own strength. You must work in me, and by me, sanctifying my tongue, sanctifying my spirit, sanctifying my words, and bringing me into a position where my spirit shall be susceptible to the movings of the Holy Spirit of God upon my mind and character.' And this is the PRAYER that every one of us may offer."- Manuscript 95, October 20, 1906, par. 29.
@@7th-Day you’ve got to remember that there is only one God, not three. You say that there are 3 Gods, God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit, is that Gods name, Holy Spirit? Jesus said that a spirit has not flesh nor bones. You really need to study the whole Word and the Spirit of Prophecy. They don’t contradict themselves
concerned Bible citizen Put her writings aside as she recommended. Go back to the Bible and study what it teaches about who the Father, Son and their Spirit are.
@@revelation1790 may I suggest you tell that to this person who did the video.
Prove all things, hold fast that which is good.
Tried to do this in an attempt to prove the trinity from the bible and found this teaching to be false as god the son and god the holy spirit cannot be found there.
Peaple! thing about, if Jesus where God, he could not die. If would be a tremendes theater!!! And Luzifer would be the first to complain verry loudly!!!
Yes, the human side of Christ could have died and taken the sinful human race with him and yet remained God. This is how I see it.
Christ had put off His devinity and took human form.
Phil.2:-8. Let this mind be in you which was is Christ Jesus
Who thought it not robbery to be equal with God , but made Himself of no reputition,and took upon Himself the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men
And being found in the fashion of man, humbled Himself and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross
Ellen White says that we will worship the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit in heaven.
I can now understand better why Kellogg had trouble, because basically he was repeating what EGW said, but with the wrong understanding.
Understanding what I'm saying gives more evidence how EGW refused the trinity.
For one, are first Kellogg stated God was in everything. However, when he tried to fix it, because he blew believed God to be a trinity, although the holy spirit is everywhere as EGW stated, by making the Holy Spirit into a god, like the trinity states, then it goes back to God being in everything where in reality it is only the spirit of God that she mentioned was in everything, not God Himself.
This shows she was against the trinity at that time.
So what happened to the bible ehhh
The Comforter that Christ promised to send after He ascended to heaven, is the Spirit in all the fulness of the Godhead, making manifest the power of divine grace to all who receive and believe in Christ as a personal Saviour. There are three living persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.... {SpTB07 63.2}
John 14:7 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you
John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:
John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Ellen White was trinitarian.
“There are three living Persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers-The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-Those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.”-Special Testimonies, Series B, No. 7, 63. (Evangelism, 615.
Thank you for sharing. At first glance this seems to be the case, however, when one takes into account all she wrote on the personality of God and His Son, one is able to see that she did not believe God to be three persons.
The Holy Spirit is a Person who speaks
Act 8-29 Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot.
Act 10-19 While Peter thought on the vision, the Spirit said unto him, Behold, three men seek thee.
Act 13-2 As they ministered to the Lord, and fasted, the Holy Ghost said, Separate me Barnabas and Saul for the work whereunto I have called them.
In these verses, it is evident that the Holy Spirit is speaking Himself. There is no evidence in these verses that anyone is speaking through Him.
The Holy Spirit is very much a Person
Ellen White never considered Jesus as co-eternal with the Father but co-equal
Hello
I am the resurrection and the life." In Christ is life, original, unborrowed, underived. "He that hath the Son hath life." 1 John 5:12. Said Jesus, "He that believeth in Me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: and whosoever liveth and believeth in Me shall never die. HLv 354.6
John 5:26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he GIVEN to the Son to have life in himself;
How did the Father give Christ this life that is original, unborrowed, underived?
By inheritance:
Hebrews 1:4 having become so much better than the angels, as He has BY INHERITANCE obtained a more excellent name than they.
God is the Father of Christ; Christ is the Son of God. To Christ has been GIVEN an exalted position. He has BEEN MADE EQUAL with the Father. All the counsels of GOD are opened to His Son. 8T 268.3
Conclusion: Christ is the LITERAL, NATURAL Son of the Father and by inheritance He is EQUALLY divine. The BRI declares that Jesus is NOT the literal, natural Son of God but only a metaphorical son. Somebody is wrong… either the Pioneers and EGW or the corporate SDA church.
@19818456 FALSE
I STRONGLY urge you to dig a bit deeper into this as you have certainly missed many statements from the spirit of Prophecy. Please see the below to start:
Christ is the pre-existent, self-existent Son of God.... In speaking of his pre-existence, Christ carries the mind back through dateless ages. He assures us that there never was a time when He was not in close fellowship with the eternal God. He to whose voice the Jews were then listening had been with God as one brought up with Him.-Signs of the Times, Aug. 29, 1900.
He was equal with God, infinite and omnipotent. . . . He is the eternal, self-existent Son.-Manuscript 101, 1897.
While God’s Word speaks of the humanity of Christ when upon this earth, it also speaks decidedly regarding His pre-existence. The Word existed as a divine being, even as the eternal Son of God, in union and oneness with His Father. From everlasting He was the Mediator of the covenant, the
one in whom all nations of the earth, both Jews and Gentiles, if they accepted Him, were to be blessed. “The Word was with God, and the Word was God.” Before men or angels were created, the Word was with God, and was God.-Review and Herald, April 5, 1906.
@@greentayengwa4120Did you know that you can also have that live? Are you an eternal being? Read the quote below.
In Him was life, original, unborrowed, underived. This life is not inherent in man. He can possess it only through Christ. He cannot earn it; it is given him as a free gift if he will believe in Christ as His personal Saviour. "This is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent" (John 17:3). This is the open fountain of life for the world. {1SM 296.2}
Joohn on the banks of Jordan the spirit descended as a dove the spirit and the father spoke three prer
Lets walk a bit in 2. Corinthians 3. 3:3 - who is the Spirit? 3:6 - who is the Spirit?; 3:8 - whos is the Spirit?; 3:14 - here we have Christ; 3:16 - Who is the Lord? Answer in 1. Corinthians 8:6; Back to 2. Corinthians 3:17 - The Lord is the Spirit; 3:18 - The Lord is the Spirit. Conclusion - Jesus Christ, the One Lord, Is the Spirit.
And a comment from Ellen G. White, in Letter 66 1894: We want the Holy Spirit, which is Jesus Christ.
And if You have issues with the Comforter then the Bible is explicit on this topic too. We read in John 14:16 that Jesus will “pray the Father, and He shall give you another Comforter, that He may be with You for ever”. Then Jesus continues in verse 17 saying “ye know Him, for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in You”. In verse 18 he specifies “I will come to You”, and in verse 20 Jesus says “I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in You”. Then in verse 26 Jesus repeats “But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have told you”. Continuing in John 15:26 Jesus tells the disciples that “When the Advocatec comes, whom I will send to you from the Father-the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father-He will testify about Me”. Finally, in John 16:7 Jesus explains that He must goe away in order to send the Comforter. In all these texts Jesus talks about the Comforter, and the Holy Spirit, but one may ask: who is this Comforter, who is also the Holy Spirit? In 1. John 2:1, John gives an answer: “My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you will not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate before the Father-Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.” How is this an answer to the question? Well, the word “Advocate” in this verse is the same word as the word for “Comforter” in the previous verses: Greek word no. 3875 - Parakletos, Parakleton. This word means Comforter or Advocate. So when Jesus says that the Comforter (Parakletos) is the Holy Spirit in John 14:26, and John writes that the Advocate (Parakleton), in 1. John 2:1 is Jesus, then it must also logically follow that the Advocate and the Comforter both refer to the same person.
Finally remember 2. Timothy 3:16 and Isaiah 8:20 KJV or BSB.
Ellen White never quoted 1. John 5:7, and the text is an interpolation, and does not exist in the oldest Greek manuscripts. It was put in greek in about the 14 century translated from Latin.
The Holy Spirit reveals the Lamb of God that taketh away the sin of the world. “He shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you,” Christ said. “He shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you” (John 16:14; 14:26).
An essence cannot teach. Only a being can teach. I wish i could have time to teach about the Holy Spirit according to the little light we have from the bible. 😊
1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
That is what the bible said. 3 in one.
Going on the premise that 1 John 5:7 is a genuine verse (modern Bibles have taken it out) would it make sense. Compare the next verse.
1 John 5:8 KJV
And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
What connection does spirit, water and blood have with each other?
Isn't it obvious that these coordinate for a single purpose. Not that they are one and the same entity. Give it a thought.
See the series by Codey Morey on this that is definitive EGW said don't write about the HS questions etc then the Lord gave the light put in DA in 1890's...Is strange I never hear mention of Heb 9:14 The HS is Eternal thus divine and God and being a He a person and the words we will make man in our image are endless proof of it all.. GLORY TO GOD IN THE HIGHEST Amen... I grew up Methodist was washed out ecumenical easy church the Lord showed me about a social business club reality to look good etc and about organized global religions is to be local congregations all of the same faith. Never hard of Luther or the Sabbath in my early yrs and til I was 20+ never hard or saw sda church we lived in university towns maybe they kept the Remnant church out of them on purpose!!!!! It's been a church state evangel eccumen church structure for a long time
So Ellen g white turned the bible now, something is totally wrong bro...
He is the Third person of the Godhead.
The fact that SDAs are Starting to embrace Catholic doctrine is funny. 😂😂😂😂😂 I thought this day would never come
A proud Catholic here, Happy to see that our SDA brothers are starting to understand.
The God, the Son is eternally begotten to the Father
The Holy Spirit proceeds from the father and the Son.
Modelism and tritheism are Heresy.
We don't use Models to describe God.
Lets not compare anything on Earth to describe God.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the subject. I do not believe that the Holy Spirit is an essence based on the bible. I respect your quote from the SOP.
Below is what Ellen white herself said in her book -The Acts of the Apostles, 51, 52.
"The nature of the Holy Spirit is a mystery. Men cannot explain it, because the Lord has not revealed it to them. Men having fanciful views may bring together passages of Scripture and put a human construction on them, but the acceptance of these views will not strengthen the church. Regarding such mysteries, which are too deep for human understanding, silence is golden."
If men can't explain it, what you just said need to be reviewed because you attempted to explain and define what is the Holy Spirit.
Amen amen
Mark 13:11, Luke 21:15...the bible says jesus IS the holy Spirit
If Jesus was the Holy Spirit, one and the same person, then why we here yet? Shouldn't we have been in heaven by now? Jesus is in the heavenly temple, the Holy Spirit is with us and can be everywhere.
One God, 3 offices.
You are 3 . Body soyl and sspirit. Just like wlliam miller said
*@alertaadventista9516* - *Understanding the Biblical Concept of the phrase "spirit” - *Many people are confused over the ‘Holy Spirit’. How does God clarify the matter for us?*
God’s spirit and man’s spirit are comparable to each other in certain respects, *although not all aspects of their respective spirits are equally similar for we are dealing with a divine being vs. a mere created man.* Nevertheless, since man was made in the image and the likeness of God, we can learn something about the Spirit of God by looking at the spirit of man.
‘But God hath revealed them unto us by *[his Spirit: FOR THE SPIRIT SEARCHETH ALL THINGS. YEA, THE DEEP THINGS OF GOD].* For what man knoweth the things of a man, save *the [SPIRIT OF MAN WHICH IS IN HIM]? [EVEN SO THE THINGS OF GOD KNOWETH NO MAN, BUT THE SPIRIT OF GOD].* 1 Cor 2:10, 11
Some [trinitarians] regard this passage as another example to prove and to demonstrate that the Holy Spirit has his own mind and therefore conclude that he is an independent individual not unlike God the Father and His Son.
*Question #1:* What does Paul mean when he stated, ‘for the spirit searchesth all things, yea, the deep things of God’? *Is Paul saying that the Holy Spirit is a separate being who is searching God’s mind, who is another being altogether?*
*Question #2:* What does Paul mean when he stated, *‘For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him’?*
*Questions are then raised* … *Can a man’s own spirit search his own mind? And how does the spirit of a man know the things of a man?*
*Let’s take a look at how David’s own spirit* -- *‘MADE DILIGENT SEARCH’ OF HIS OWN MIND, as he pondered the ‘works of the Lord’:*
‘I call to remembrance my song in the night: *I commune with mine own heart*: and *MY SPIRIT MADE DILIGENT SEARCH.* Will the Lord cast off for ever? and will he be favourable no more? 8 Is his mercy clean gone for ever? doth his promise fail for evermore? 9 Hath God forgotten to be gracious? hath he in anger shut up his tender mercies? Selah. 10 And I said, This is my infirmity: but I will remember the years of the right hand of the most High. 11 *[I WILL REMEMBER THE WORKS OF THE LORD: SURELY I WILL REMEMBER THY WONDERS OF OLD].’* -Psalm 77:6-11
Here we find that David communed with his own heart in that David’s own spirit “made diligent search” of his own heart/mind. *The heart is regarded as the center of a person’s thoughts and emotions, especially love or compassion. The heart is synonymous with spirit.*
Is David's spirit a separate individual from himself, searching deep things of his own mind? *Obviously NOT.* We can agree then that the spirit of a man belongs to the man and is an integral part of his personhood and yet can search his own mind, SEEMINGLY independent of the person himself.
*Therefore, what Paul is saying* in 1 Cor 2:11 *[‘For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him’]* *is that, a person’s spirit knows its owner and it searches and remembers his own thoughts and knows what is in his own mind; a person’s ‘spirit’ therefore knows of himself better than anyone else.*
*Now let’s examine how Paul draws a comparison between God’s Spirit and man’s spirit* when he stated, ‘For what man knoweth the things of a man, *[SAVE THE SPIRIT OF MAN WHICH IS IN HIM]? [EVEN SO the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit].’* 1Corinthians 2:11
Paul says, *‘EVEN SO,’* which is to say, *IN THE SAME WAY* that the *man’s spirit knows the things of a man, [God’s OWN Spirit] also searches His own thoughts and knows what is in His mind*. No one else knows, except God Himself [unless it is shared]… *the Spirit, therefore is not another person but rather it is God’s own Spirit.*
*‘But there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.’* -Job 32:8
*While there are similarities, we are reminded that there are differences.* After all we are comparing God’s Spirit with man’s spirit. The main difference is that the spirit of man is said to be ‘in him’, whereas God's Spirit is NOT limited locally. God can indeed extend His Spirit outside of Himself as His own DIVINE presence/influence/power and can actuate change beyond His locality.* - Remember God and Jesus are divine Beings and humans do not possess a divine nature.
*Let us look a little further as to what the Bible says about man's spirit, to see what our spirit is.*
*Our spirit is spoken of in the Bible as:* Our mind [Ephesians 4:23; Philippians 1:27] our heart [Psalms 34:18; 51:10, 17; 77:6; 78:8; Ezekiel 36:26] and our life/breath [Isaiah 38:16; see also Job 27:3; Revelation 11:11]. *Indeed, from what the Bible says, the spirit of man is the personality, character, and life essence of man.*
*God's Spirit is also spoken of as:* His mind [compare Isaiah 40:13 with where Paul quotes it in Romans 11:34 and 1 Corinthians 2:16] and as life [Genesis 2:7; Job 27:3; 33:4; John 6:63; Romans 8:10; Revelation 11:11]. We clearly see that so far; the premise is holding up. People often say that the Holy Spirit HAS personality, however, man's spirit and God's ARE personality. Just as man's spirit is a part of him, and not a separate entity, God's Spirit must be the same. However, there is a main difference in the Bible between man's and God's spirits - God's Spirit is not confined by space as with man's spirit... God's Spirit can be present apart from His corporeal body. Thus, God's Spirit is also synonymous with His presence. [define hypothesis or premise].
Psalm 139:7 *‘Where shall I go from your Spirit? Or where shall I flee from your presence?’*
*The Bible says that both God's Spirit and God's glory fill the earth* [2 Chronicles 2:6 and Jeremiah 23:24 compared with Isaiah 6:3].
*From Bible evidence, God's Spirit is His mind, life, divine presence, and glory.* The evidence points to the fact that God's Spirit is a part of God - the personality and character of God, able to manifest itself in various ways apart from God's bodily form. Because it ‘proceeds from the Father’ [John 15:26], it is most commonly called the ‘Spirit OF God’ or ‘Spirit OF Christ’, and as opposed to our spirit, it is ‘Holy’. *The word ‘Holy’ is an adjective* be it in English or Greek. *‘Holy Spirit’ is not a name but a description of God's Spirit/character.* The Bible mentions several types of spirits. We find ‘evil spirit,’ ‘dumb spirit,’ ‘unclean spirit,’ ‘foul spirit,’ ‘humble spirit,’ ‘excellent spirit,’ ‘good spirit,’ ‘broken spirit,’ ‘wounded spirit,’ ‘faithful spirit,’ and ‘haughty spirit’ etc. *All these spirits are distinguishable by the adjective that describes them such as good, foul, humble, etc. We know that God the Father has a spirit* [Matthew 10:20] and His Spirit of course could be nothing other than Holy.
*While we cannot know all the ways or workings of the Spirit, the Bible makes it clear that it is a part of God, the mysterious part of God that can be present everywhere, working in unseen ways, working like the wind, in mostly unseen ways.*
The Bible very clearly describes the spirit as the mind, will, and emotions, your character if you will. It is who you are. *So, a spirit cannot be a literal person in itself. If it were, it would cease to be a spirit.*
We must always remember that hermeneutics is the proper use of the principles of interpretation to discover the author’s intended meaning of a biblical text, with the goal of applying that meaning to a contemporary audience.
"Out of the fullness of His grace, He has blessed us all, giving us one blessing after another. God gave the Law through Moses, but grace and truth came through Jesus Christ." [John 1:16-17].
May 'Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord," [2 Peter 1:2].
Emphasis Mine
I have to disagree. God is not numerically one. He is numerically ONE in his Divine Nature. You have Almighty God the Father. Out of him came forth (Begotten) is One and only Son who has his Father' ETERNAL DIVINE NATURE. The Divine consisting of Divine Substance and Divine Essence. The Holy Spirit also came forth (Proceeded) from the Father' Divine Essence. This is why he is called Holy Spirit (Holy Essence). Both begotten and proceeded resulted in separation but still the one Divine Nature.
All creation came out from God. He used his holy spirit to accomplish it.
Coming out doesn't mean some part broke free.
Christians must believe this. Else, they cannot be Christians.
(1 Corinthians 8:6) there is actually to us one God, the Father,
I will believe your argument about the trinity...WHEN YOU SHOW ME IN THE WORD OF YAHUWAH.
Trinitarian people CANNOT produce scripture that provides Proof of Trinity.
The problem will be always reducing the divinity of Jesus, separating Him from the Father and finding teologic explanations to get rid of Moses and the Prophets.
Jesus was with (את) Elohim in Genesis 1:1, Jesus was on the Mount Sinai in Exodus 20-24, Jesus was on the cross and will kosher the sin away from this planet, so He can finally restore the Earth and stablish His kingdom with His saints - The Sabbath milenium.
The Torah is the writen Jesus and Jesus is the living Torah.
"Trinity" is a name invented by the Catholics to put Jesus below Mary. Almost a registered trademark. The SDAs definition of trinity is almost word by word, what is in catholic cathecism.
The Bible is the progressive revelation of who God is, begining as the Father, then as the Son and lately as the Holy Spirit. If we don't understand this, that's because we (EGW included) didn't receive it yet, as promissed in Jeremiah, Joel and other prophets. The Holy Spirit, as promissed, is a fact yet to happen, when God seal His saints, during the final persecution (Rev.7)
The goal is to make each of us able to be His living temple, so that He will dwell wherever we are. This is the eternal life.
FYI, the Muslims and Jehovah Witnesses also do not believe in the Trinity. You don’t understand your own nature that’s composed of many parts like atleast the mind, body and sprit, so how can you second guess the nature of God? If God reveals Himself to be three different beings, who are you to question? Maybe you can’t comprehend it. The example of the egg: it has three parts alright: the shell is a shell 100%, the yolk is a yolk 100%, the white is a white 100%, with all of them together, It’s an egg 100%, not 300%. Can you understand how this can be? No. So stop your vain speculation on who God is with your mere mortal understanding. The world is composed of a great variety of parts which operate as one though they are many just like your smartphone that’s composed of the physical body, software and electricity to operate the whole thing. Can you explain this phenomenon? No. So stop your attacks on the SDA Church for God’s sake.
No trinity exists. God is not ONE, is not TWO, is not THREE.
God the Father didn't need to live a REAL TIME relationship with us, that would have been inappropriate: if you are free to make decisions this means that the future is indetermined, unknown, dependent on those decisions.
God was able to do that in our past, in a distant "God's temporal dimension". From that past temporal dimension He was able to see us into his future and to interact with that future, with us. But this conversely means that we are NOW observed by Him from that past, in other words a "temporal bridge" exists connecting God to us. Since God actually is not here - He is only "virtually" here - you can say that God is like a spirit here ("God is a spirit" Jn. 4:24), He is the "Spirit of God". The "Spirit of God" (aka Holy Spirit) is thus NOT a third person. In fact you can see in the gospels that everything is made by the Spirit of God, not directly by God. This is what happens, but only from our point of view! From God's point of view things are different! He was able to live all his relationships, to do ALL his almighty God's work even before the world started. When all his work was done, the future of mankind (and God) was ONE, determined. His power was definitely set to make that one future true. God was thus free to get rid of his then useless power and become like a normal man: the SON of God, with no power at all “ I from myself AM NOT ABLE to do a thing” (John 5:30). "Son" means He DERIVES from God "He who sees me sees Him who sent me.". Jesus is not an actual son. All above means that of course - as stated by Jesus - nobody could actually see God: "nobody has seen God at any time" "The world has not known you". This means that the Son of God is ALONE in heaven (TWO Gods cannot exist) Jesus "inherited" it "all things are now in my hands". Jesus is thus the ONLY KING and sits next to the POWER of God because He needs it: He has no OWN power. The Father is in heaven (and here) only in the form of a spirit.
Thus, Jesus is NOT the almighty God, yet He is not distinct from Him "I am in the Father and the Father in me" because Jesus WAS that almighty God. In other words They are not the SAME ONE God, yet They are not "TWO distinct Gods". This means that God is more than one and less than two.
Rather than trying to nail down God, which I believe is foolish . does the pot made from clay even know of the potter the clay the spinning wheel the fire the paint?NO!!! All we need to know is God Loves sinners hates sin....there can be no remission of sin without the shedding of blood ( Jesus).and Jesus said. In John 16 verse 7 through 11... end of story....God is a mystery as to why He is and why there is creation as opposed to no God and no existence......We will worship God .dare no created thing to its creator you must explain all things to include yourself how you became in every minute detail.what do you wanna be God ....nahhhhhh .well God bless all.
three parts of an egg are still 100% egg even if it is not the same part of the rest of the egg, its still all an egg. That egg yolk, shell and white will never not be 100% of that egg matter. The man in this video didnt actually teach what an egg was, he just dismissed the egg after it was broken saying its no longer what it was....well then what was it??? What a terrible lecture
Sadly sda does not understand the trinity and the deity of Jesus Christ. One of many false doctrines the sda believe. Example the present truth. Perfect example of a cult and similar to the LDS cult. Lds believes that the current church profit has the authority to change the rules. And the sda cult does the same thing with "present truth" authority to change the fact for evil control. Just like catholic church as well. Run people and fall at the feet of Jesus and repent.
🌷 P R O M O S M
I agree...need more Biblical presentation & less of the "lesser light".
You hit the nail
Sorry, Jesus isn’t God, nor equal to God. He called our God and Father his God and Father at John 20:17.
See also:
1 Corinthians 8:4-6
4 Now concerning the eating of food offered to idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world and that there is no God but one. 5 For even though there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth, just as there are many “gods” and many “lords,” 6 there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.
And……
John 17:3 “This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.”
The only true God…..
FALSE
The same Paul that wrote to the Corinthians says this to the Philippians:Philippians 2:5-6 (KJV) Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
The same John in the same chapter 20 continues in vs. 28 declaring that the disciples themselves finally understood that Jesus was GOD!
John 20:28 (KJV) And Thomas answered and said unto him,(Jesus) My Lord and my God.
You are reading not for understanding, but to prove your point. This unfortunately causes you not consider other passages that shed light on the topic. You have assumed that three persons must equal three beings for God. But why can't God be three persons and one being? One being does not necessarily have to equal one person. That's just the way it works for us humans! Why would you assume it works that way for the Almighty creator?
Also additional Spirit of Prophecy quotes:
The Comforter that Christ promised to send after He ascended to heaven, is the Spirit in all the fullness of the Godhead, making manifest the power of divine grace to all who receive and believe in Christ as a
personal Saviour. There are three living persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers -the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit-those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.”- Special Testimonies, Series B, No. 7, pp. 62, 63. (1905)
He was equal with God, infinite and omnipotent. . . . He is the eternal, self-existent Son.-Manuscript 101, 1897.
While God’s Word speaks of the humanity of Christ when upon this earth, it also speaks decidedly regarding His pre-existence. The Word existed as a divine being, even as the eternal Son of God, in union and oneness with His Father. From everlasting He was the Mediator of the covenant, the
one in whom all nations of the earth, both Jews and Gentiles, if they accepted Him, were to be blessed. “The Word was with God, and the Word was God.” Before men or angels were created, the Word was with God, and was God.-Review and Herald, April 5, 1906.
@@themanlymansite
Something to think about:
What if…….
Jesus was created? What if, he is the firstborn of all creation (Colossians 1:15), repeated at
Rev 3:14 “To the angel of the congregation in La·o·di·ceʹa write: These are the things that the Amen says, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation by God:”
Is Jesus not the Amen?
Proverbs 8:22 “Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way, The earliest of his achievements of long ago.”
Hmmm…..Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way…….
Who is the way?
John 14:6 “Jesus said to him: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.””
If Proverbs 8:22 isn’t talking about Jesus, then who is it talking about?
Please continue with Proverbs 8:30 “Then I was beside him as a master worker. I was the one he was especially fond of day by day; I rejoiced before him all the time;”
Who could this be?
It sounds like God the Father, Jehovah, who has no beginning, first created the son (see above), then, the son, being God’s master worker (Contractor, sub-contractor, as it were😀), created everything else.
John 1:3 “All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence.”
I’m going to repeat Jesus’ words to Satan when he tried to tempt him at
Matthew 4:10 “Then Jesus said to him: “Go away, Satan! For it is written: ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.’””
I reiterate, just as Jesus did,
“HIM ALONE YOU MUST RENDER SACRED SERVICE.”
@@stevenwebb6253 Thanks for providing the additional verses. Happy to go through them with you. Were you going to respond to the verses I provided you earlier? You claimed that Jesus was not equal with the father by quoting Paul in Corinthians, but the same Paul says they are equal in Philippians 2:5,6. You said Jesus was NOT God by quoting John, but the same John in the same chapter identifies the disciples as worshiping Jesus AS GOD in John 20:28. When debating the strategy is to take only those items that will allow you to win. But we are here for truth. I accept the verses you brought forth, but not to the exclusion of the others. All must be weighted together and considered wisely so as to arrive at the correct conclusion. Let's take some of the misunderstandings you put forth.
You said: "What if...Jesus was created" Then went on to quote Col 1:15 and Rev 3:14. You've misunderstood the verses and E.J Waggoner helps correct this in His book Christ and His Righteousness (apart of the 1888 message). I quote a few paragraphs for you and anyone else interested. Please give it a good read when you get the chance.
" Before passing to some of the practical lessons that are to be learned from these truths, we must dwell for a few moments upon an opinion that is honestly held by many who would not for any consideration willingly dishonor Christ, but who, through that opinion, do actually deny His Divinity. It is the idea that Christ is a created being, who, through the good pleasure of God, was elevated to His present lofty position. No one who holds this view can possibly have any just conception of the exalted position which Christ really occupies.
The view in question is built upon a misconception of a single text, Revelation 3:14: “And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write, These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God.” This is wrongly interpreted to mean that Christ is the first being that God created-that God’s work of creation began with Him. But this view antagonizes the scripture which declares that Christ Himself created all things. To say that God began His work of creation by creating Christ is to leave Christ entirely out of the work of creation.
The word rendered “beginning” is arche, meaning, as well, “head” or “chief.” It occurs in the name of the Greek ruler, Archon, in archbishop and the word archangel. Take this last word. Christ is the archangel. See Jude 9; 1 Thessalonians 4:16; John 5:28, 29; Daniel 10:21. This does not mean that He is the first of the angels, for He is not an angel but is above them. Hebrews 1:4. It means that He is the chief or prince of the angels, just as an archbishop is the head of the bishops. Christ is the commander of the angels. See Revelation 19:11-14. He created the angels. Colossians 1:16. And so the statement that He is the beginning or head of the creation of God means that in Him creation had its beginning; that, as He Himself says, He is Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last. Revelation 21:6; 22:13. He is the source whence all things have their origin.
Neither should we imagine that Christ is a creature, because Paul calls Him (Colossians 1:15) “The First-born of every creature” for the very next verses show Him to be Creator and not a creature. “For by Him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things were created by Him, and for Him and He is before all things, and by Him all things consist.” Now if He created everything that was ever created and existed before all created things, it is evident that He Himself is not among created things. He is above all creation and not a part of it." pg.21, 22
Next - Proverbs 8:22-8:30. Firstly, the reading you give seems to be from an Alexandrian Bible. One produced from the texts compiled by Wescott and Hort. Please check into their Occult backgrounds so you can make a wiser decision about which texts to quote from. In the KJV it is rendered
22:The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. 23:I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
Much different reading right? The Spirit of Prophecy leaves no room for error when on quoting from these verses she says:
"Christ is the pre-existent, self-existent Son of God.... In speaking of his pre-existence, Christ carries the mind back through dateless ages. He assures us that there never was a time when He was not in close fellowship with the eternal God. He to whose voice the Jews were then listening had been with God as one brought up with Him."-Signs of the Times, Aug. 29, 1900.
Also "While God’s Word speaks of the humanity of Christ when upon this earth, it also speaks decidedly regarding His pre-existence. The Word existed as a divine being, even as the eternal Son of God, in union and oneness with His Father. From everlasting He was the Mediator of the covenant, the
one in whom all nations of the earth, both Jews and Gentiles, if they accepted Him, were to be blessed. “The Word was with God, and the Word was God.” Before men or angels were created, the Word was with God, and was God."-Review and Herald, April 5, 1906.
Concerning John 1:3 please consider that this must include himself. Therefore He could NOT be a created being. This comment is getting quite long so I'll follow up with my last point concerning Matthew 4:10.
Please consider these things diligently. You seem sincere.
@@stevenwebb6253 Ok, separate comment for Matthew 4:10. To understand those words more fully you have to understand the nature of the temptation that Satan gave Jesus. They were calculated to get him to doubt "WHO" he was. Please read the corresponding chapter in Desire of Ages for more insight here. With that said, when Jesus said it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve." He was quoting the word of God. Who is the word of God? Jesus!! according to John 1:1 which is what makes the response so brilliant. He asserts His divinity through quoting the word which is Himself. He penetrates directly to the center of the temptation while simultaneously giving us the roadmap.
You have to remember that Satan began his rebellion in heaven because of His jealousy of Jesus. He wished to be in Jesus' spot and he's doing everything he can to diminish his sovereignty and rightful rulership and the titles that go along with it. My friend, please reconsider your position carefully. Don't let the blind lead you into the ditch.
I wish they would quit putting makeup on Ellen White, as she vehemently condemned those who used it.
One GODHEAD of Three Persons (like one family of three people): There are three living persons of the Heavenly Trio; In the name of these three great powers--the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit - those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these Powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of Heaven in their efforts to live the New Life in Christ. {Evangelism 615} {7ABC 441.9}
The description of the Godhead as the Pagan "Trinity" of three heads on one body, is NOT mentioned in the Testimony of Jesus - but was ADDED as a paragraph heading:
The Eternal Dignitaries of the trinity - The Eternal Heavenly Dignitaries - God (the Father), and (Jesus the) Christ, and the Holy Spirit - arming them [the disciples] with more than mortal energy... would advance with them to the work and convince the world of sin. {Manuscript 145, 1901} {Evangelism 616.4}
Let’s see what inspiration has to say:
“That Christ should MANIFEST HIMSELF to them, and YET be INVISIBLE to the world, was a mystery to the disciples. They could not understand the words of Christ in their SPIRITUAL sense. They were thinking of the outward, visible manifestation. They could NOT take in the fact that they could have the PRESENCE OF CHRIST with them, and yet HE BE UNSEEN by the world. They did NOT UNDERSTAND the meaning of a SPIRITUAL MANIFESTATION.” - {TDG 142.4}
The third person of the Godhead is the spiritual manifestation of Christ.
“CHRIST is WITHDRAWN ONLY FROM THE EYE OF SENSE, but HE IS AS TRULY PRESENT BY HIS SPIRIT AS WHEN HE WAS VISIBLY PRESENT ON EARTH.” {ST April 7, 1890, par. 6}
The Third Person of the Godhead, is the UNSEEN PERSONALITY OF CHRIST. It is Himself, Spiritually Manifested in third person.
Our pioneers where NOT Trinitarians.
We don't follow pioneers, we follow bible
Victor did NOT say that we should follow the pioneers.
He was simply stating that the pioneers had it right.@@willitea6770
For Seventh-Day Adventist Christians the pioneers of their movement were the ones to receive accurate knowledge of the scriptures, hence the pioneers are highly respected by those who believe in Mrs. White’s writings; who states this to be so.
for the children of God, bible is above everything
Very very good...
I’m glad you’ve come in to the Trinitarians lie but you need to read from the Bible and stop quoting EGW. In the same way you were wrong about the triune gods you will also soon see how you are wrong about most of her teachings too. Just stick to the Bible people or you’ll be up at that podium apologizing every other week.. What is so hard about this?
You hit the nail
Exodus 20:3-4 that's Ellen G white, stop it in Jesus name she's dead lord Jesus is alive for evermore Amen...
Dotrine of devils may God through his spirit reach u
He has carefully avoided EGW statements which support the HS as a personal being and divine. Bible does support three beings but not three gods. One God, Father; and Christ as the son of God is God too, but not the Almighty as the Father. Ellen White cannot be relied upon to establish the doctrine of God with her confusing and contradictory statements
Lies...she distinctly said that Christ as Always existed as One with the Father, unborrowed and un-derrived.
@@undrielgrenger53
That 'unborrowed, underived' statement was plagiarised from John Cumming!
@@19818456 Even if it was, which it wasn't as it was totally normal for writers of that day to "borrow" ideas and styles from other authors, it does not take away from the fact that its inspiration.
Every light of truth comes from God. As John 1:9 says, Christ is that True light that "lighteth every man that comes into the world." ALL truth comes from Him, and it doesn't matter if a grain of that truth falls here or falls there...God is the originator of it all. So it doesn't matter if said writer John Cumming actually made that phrase of statement first, because that only means that he himself could never have discovered or imagined that ideal if God hadn't permitted some grain of the truth to pass through his knowledge.
So at the end of the day, God is the Author of ALL truth....and as Ellen White herself said, "Inspiration stoops to give no man credit"...why? Because Truth cannot and WILL not originate from degenerate man...all "truth" discovered or realized by man, still originated at some point from that same original Source....Christ, that "Great light which lighteth every man that comes into the world."
That is why, if you take a careful, and truthful look at the bible itself, you will find that it is FULL of "plagizarized" statements from the writings of the prophets and apostles, all "borrowing" from the writers before their time.
@@19818456 1 proof please. Don't insinuate mal intent especially when plagiarism and rules surrounding it were VERY different back then. Many times she would explain at the front of the book that she would quote directly from an author if they did a good job explaining a point so she could save time in her writing. This in no way takes away from it's truthfullness.
You exhibit simply ignorance about the scripture and Spirit of Prophecy on this subject, and you have mistaken the biblical concept of God in the Bible. Throughout Scriptures reveal that there are three eternal Persons refers as God. The one true God is made up of three eternal Persons, the heavenly Trio. God is not a one person.
In the Old Testament, the Hebrew word for GOD is 'ELOHIM,' which is a plural term that means more than one person(Strongs, Concordance # 0430 'elohiym {el-o-heem'). For example, in Genesis 1:26: 'And God said, "Let US make man in OUR image, according to OUR likeness." So at creation 'God' was more than one person. It seems sinificant that this truth should be introduced in the very first chapter of the Bible. The God is a plurality of Persons, and each Person of the Godhead is not 'a' God; it is the three persons that are God, or make up the Godhead of the eternal kingdom. It is like having a government which is a singular word but made up of a number of members. No single member is the government, but all go to make up that government as individual members.
The phrase 'one God', the 'one' (echad) refers to the unity of these three eternal persons. Heavenly Trio consists of three eternal beings, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
You misunderstand what's "tritheism"! it may be either you refuse to understand or could not understand the doctrine of the Trinity. Tritheism is the counterfeit teaching that the Godhead is really THREE SEPARATE GODS. This erring view is often misplaced by the cults for the doctrine of the Trinity which states that the God exists in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The doc. of Trinity affirms that the one true God exists in three divine persons.
Again, this a typical straw man argument. The doctrine of the Trinity is not three Gods. The doctrine of three Gods is tritheism, not Trinitarianism. Three Gods is how Mormons view the Godhead.
Put comment in wrong area so just noting again that the trinity is a false doctrine & EGW should in no way be considered a prophetess (see previous comment as to why)
Beware, this is just SDA WITH NEW MAKE UP!!! Still is NOT CHRISTIAN.
Why is that, is it because they don't believe that God is a respecter of persons like Calvinists do?
Stop lying with EGW for your all accursed with her read the Holy King James Bible KJV your accursed reading for the copies of the HOLY KING JAMES BIBLE NKJV NIV NLT NASB AMP AND ALL OTHER COPIES OF THE HOLY KING JAMES BIBLE WAKE UP AND STOP LYING
EGW is a HAFT TRUTH CONFUSED ABOUT IT YOU SHOULD BE HAFT TRUTH WILL NOT GET YOU INTO HEAVEN FOLLOWING THE LORD JESUS CHRIST WITH THE LORDS HOLY KING JAMES BIBLE GODS BLESSINGS TO YOU ALL BECAUSE YOU NEED IT ALL THE HELP HE WILL GIVE YOU REMEMBER NOT BY WORKS BUT THROUGH FAITH AND GRACE OF LORD JESUS CHRIST
The FATHER SON AND THE HOLY SPIRIT THE FATHER SPOKE THE WORDS AND THE WORD WHEN OUT AND THE HOLY SPIRIT WAS OVER THE WATERS THEY ARE OF ONE GOD EGW IS A FALSE GOSPELS AND LORD JESUS WILL TELL YOU SO READ YOUR HOLY KING JAMES BIBLE YOU ARE ACCURSED READ YOUR BIBLE GOD IS NEVER WRONG BUT SDA ARE ACCURSED GET OUT OF HER YOU ARE DOOMED FOR THE FALSE TRUTH ABOUT THE TRUE GOD I HOPE YOU WILL WAKE UP
You but EGW above THE LORD JESUS CHRIST YOU ARE ACCURSED CONFUSE BY EGW IN FALSE TRUTH YOU ARE ALL CONFUSED