A Sensible PTR 91
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- čas přidán 15. 09. 2021
- Is there a sensible middle ground for modernizing a G3 clone? One that won't double your total investment into the platform? One that can actually find a competitive niche in today's market?
Yeah kinda.
SubscribeStar:
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Aww, the rifle weighs as much as Hop does. Bless.
Sick roast
He's mad
@@graveland2333 hop is always mad
@@autisticusmaximus9562 Perturbed, not mad
@@ElTejon47901Sustained disdain...
For how much hop says he hates the PTR it kinda seems like he doesn’t really hate the PTR
Could be trying to find a decent setup so he doesn't feel like he owns a piece of shit rifle, by today's standards.
I've seen it happen with people who bought something due to hype, NOT due to research or actually quality. They can't afford to replace it and it's one of their first guns.....if not the very first. So there is some sort of emotional attachment.
I hate PTR too and I should know, Ive owned 2 of them for years. LOL
@@newdefsys are they really that bad? I'm seriously considering one, like hard lol
@@fieldy-8008 I bought mine 11 years ago. Back then they were a very good deal and the market for surplus parts and accessories was plentiful and affordable. But today (2021) I think a SIG 716i or an M&P-10 would be a better choice.
@@newdefsys isn't the sig like $2500 though
Hop is a tsundere for PTR
The only other person I’ve ever seen use that word was laying down on a bed because of, let’s just say, his weight - on one of Christine’s TikTok citations on YMH.
*please note that is second-hand TikTok viewing.
"It's not like I like you or anything, baka
@@Kn3350ck5 Is it weird I read that in Hop's voice?
PTR-chan is too heavy to forget.
@@johnqpublic2718 Why does this sound like you're talking about Tom after his hilarious basketball injury
Hop is the battered housewife that keeps coming back to PTR.
It's okay Hop, we're here to help. Just blink twice if the PTR 91 is holding you against your will.
👀
@@Hoplopfheil I looked for a "long time" to decide about which "checkpoint rifle" I wanted. Ended up with a M1a Socom II. Red Dot sight & light/laser combo. "Thoughts, in general?
@@lesliestar6344
I own a PTR91, M1A and AR10. If you have to go with 308 pick an AR10. PTR91s are good battle rifles that in my experience don't fail without extensive firing without cleaning (650 rounds before I had jamming issues over months). The reloads are very slow though, and getting the PTR91 or M1A to be half as modular as an AR10 requires a decent amount of cash shelling, at which point you would have been able to get a good optic on an AR10 platform. Proper eye relief on something like a magnifier or LPVO can also be a concern. They are definitely fun guns though, and I shoot mine way more than my AR10. Really comes down to how much you are willing to sacrifice function for fun and reliability.
@@upkz762 As mentioned, already purchased an M1a. It, perform(s),(ed) quite well for what I needed at the time! "Mission/need's" have changed, so it is stored "in the bunker now". The RDS was sufficient. I have AR pattern rifles with LPVO's (several). Thanks for the input.
@@lesliestar6344 no problem
How are you mounting the red dot BTW? Scout rail/charger slot adapter,receiver mount?
I like how you can’t give up on this beast . Your facial expressions throughout the series have kinda said it all.
Nothing compares to shooting a G3. Except a Barrett.
He makes the same face in every video, I don't see how this comment makes sense.
@@joshuapate Thinking the exact same thing..
Ahh Nutnfancy... so many gun guys grew up with his 45min reviews in the early days of Guntube
I must still be in the early days...
@@rifleshooterchannel208 Ya I don't believe in all his beliefs. I just think its kinda strange how so many people have seen him and use his acronyms and POU idea but no one mentions him. Like he was our guilty pleasure we dare not speak of.
I couldn’t stand him from the very beginning.. watched a lot of TMHonfire, cokeman, bamdizzle, the armory channel, Hickok, etc. all the OGs. Nutnfancy always just seemed so corny.
@@death-to-dogma6142 I actually think most people weren't even around to watch nutnfancy. He's sort of halfway down the guntuber "iceberg" if I'm being honest.
@@ChucksSEADnDEAD That might be true. I remember when all there really was was him, Demo Ranch, and FPS Russia back in like 2010
Hop, the PTR 91 died two months ago. You have to move on, it's what she would have wanted
For your effort, in the words of the great king Osric: " What daring! What outrageousness! What insolence! What arrogance!... I salute you. "
This thing is like Hoplopfheil's abusive spouse who he keeps coming back to. Its ok to just /like/ a gun man, it dosn't need to be optimal! Jokes aside awesome video, I hope you get this thing to a point where you feel like its working for you. With as many videos you have on it, I'd say you are just enjoying the platform/shooting it!
When you buy a 308 battle youve accepted that your going to have a heavy rifle. Going with a barrel under 18 isnt a smart idea, and your not going to shed much weight on the furniture. The FAL the hk91 the ar10 and the m1a are all heavy guns, and thats that.
After running AKs and AR15s often, switching to the "big boys" aka full battle rifles...shits heavy.
It is all relative. As crazy as it sounds when I got my hands on the updated G3 the Swedish military uses it turned out to be around 5,5kg...which is not that much more than the standard service rifle which is just over 5kg.
Idk, I think a 16in is fine for a DMR 308. With a battle rifle or dmr you may still have to do things in close, clearing rooms or vehicle stuff and you're probably not engaging farther than 800 yds.
@@deadbolt9019 - Yeah, ain't that the truth? There's no free lunch, in terms of physics. If you want to use a rifle firing a powerful center-fire cartridge, that rifle has to be stoutly made. The barrel, receiver, bolt-BCG, etc. are heavier than those found on the typical AR15. Today, synthetic materials are beginning to become practical light-weight alternatives to steel and aluminum, but many rifles still rely on machined billet steel, which means weight.
Patriot Ordnance Factory or POF, as they are called, claim to have made a breakthrough - I say "claim" only because I have not verified that the published data are correct - in the design of an AR308, namely their 308-caliber large-frame AR weighs no more than the equivalent AR15 when unloaded. The design of the bolt-BCG is different than the typical large-frame AR, as are other details. But again, no free lunch: Weight is your friend when soaking up the recoil impulse, and in a lighter rifle/carbine, that .308 is going to kick pretty hard.
They're rare and expensive, but the old Armalite AR10 design from the late 1950s - which was license-built by the Dutch firm of Artillerie Inrichtingen during the 1960s for export sale - may have come the closest to the "holy grail" of a sub-eight pound battle rifle in .308. weighing in at 7.25 - 8.9 lbs without magazine. The variance one assumes is due to the precise configuration. The famous Jerry Michulek borrows Reed Knight's example out of his museum's collection, and wrings it out on You Tube as only he can. Check it out. Even old Jerry is pretty impressed. The modern 1990s and onward Armalite isn't the same firm, but a modern company which makes AR-type firearms under that name. Their AR10s are somewhat heftier and are in no way light like their forbearers, despite being nice rifles otherwise.
@@henrik2518 swedish soldiers also complain about the weight of their standard rifle
The difference between a Hop video and a Nutnfancy video? Hop has seven full videos full of content and solid info, in the time it takes Rich to tell us what a magnificent individual he is in a single video.
Seems like the ideal G3/CETME setup in the modern day is to get your hands on a short barreled HK21, preferably an HK51B, so you can have a convertable-feed LMG that will fit in your glovebox and/or can be taken into tight enclosed spaces as an impromptu flashbang.
Lol. I’ve never seen a 51b run more than 10 rds at a time.
@@psp1921tsmg
I've seen them run more but really, if you think about it, 10 rounds is perfect for blinding everyone in a room or down a dark corridor.
@@The_Crimson_Fucker so just run a a g3 k. Way more reliable a lot less recoil. And you can use beta mags for extra ammo
@@psp1921tsmg
-reliable
-beta mags in 7.62
Chose one and only one. I don't know if it was some Chinese bootleg shit or what but I've seen the feed lips on a plastic Beta warp from heat and induce malfunctions.
Maybe it's the fact that they look like a set of cock-and-balls but I've never liked them. Besides, HK21s come with mag adapters _that actually work reliably_ so you can have both in one.
You can't really convert a G3 to work like that without substantial machining. I've seen HK21s roundabout G3K length too, and from what I've _heard_ HK21s are slightly nicer in full auto than standard G3s - which I've never heard anyone say anything even vaguely nice about.
P.S.: You can't do cool, retrofuturistic operator shit with Beta-C mags. You need the rubber-dongle + belt-over-forearm action. Style > Practicality
@@The_Crimson_Fucker I have zero trouble with my Beta mags in my G3’s other than they are a bitch to load if you don’t wanna use a beta Mag and then use an x products for 50 rounds 50
I own the FR (102) version. I know that this rifle is outdated, there is no good reason to love it, the ergonomics suck, kicks like a draft horse, its finicky, etc. But, BUT, I cannot help it - I love it. I just do. Its like that old, super high-maintenance, only slightly attractive ex-girlfriend that you can't stop banging because she way more confidence than she should.
I love this corner of guntube honesty about watching Nutnfancy, he had a stigma of being the leper of the gun community despite his influence on it. I for one, love the dude.
Nickelback of guntube?
I guess im late to the party
What do people have against the dude?
@@TOAOM123 He's not really pro-2a, and his videos are about 30X the length they should be.
@@Garrumx the dude is explicitly pro-2A
@@bullphrogva1804 He's pro-2a the same way a fudd is pro-2a.
As a MG Gunner in the German Military in the early 90s i can tell you.. the G3 was a mayor pain in the butt to carry around... in basic trainig i, as an MG gunner had to carry the MG3 loaded with an 50 Shot belt box AND the fuggin G3 on a Strap on the back ... i hated i so much i nearly dumped it in to a river when we were on a 3 day biwak... the only thing that thing is good for is that you can wack someone to death with it once you´re out of ammo
do you think it was the 9lbs gun or the 90lbs of gear that was heavy
I just love G3 clones, keep it up dude. Giving me hope lol
I went full PTR-tard and did a heavy build. PRS stock, slim fore-end, 50mm optic that fit to still charge the firearm and get over the rear sight.
It’s hard to not smile when you hold it, or when your charge the rifle and hear the noises it makes. Such a good, rugged rifle.
So... buy an AR10 and have less regrets. Got it.
and more money in your pocket.. Yeah
@@randomidiot8142 SR25 pattern Master Race
@@calholli SR25 master race because knight made it or because it's better designed?
@@randomidiot8142 it's truer to the original AR-10 platform
@@misfit4816 but is that really a good thing? Making a clone with any flaws faithfully replicated isn't usually a good selling point. Isn't that why most ARs are m4a something pattern and not first gen pattern?
" I'd like to promise you that I won't make any more PTR-91 videos, but I'm totally gonna make more PTR-91 videos. I don't think I can help with it. "
The complicated way to say you are a masochist (kind of).
I'm starting to think the G3/PTR91 is like that one girl you hate everything about but the sex is great so you keep coming back.
Or you want to like her butterface and depressed after a 'starry' night.
hop, you have a problem... this is a intervention. Your father (nutnfancy) and I are really worried. Please pick up the phone. Come back to the land of SAWC.
Had an aluminum G3 mag pop a floorplate out the other day. Mag seems near new. Haven't had that since the insanely worn mags of basic training. Had a Cetme Sporter pile as a kid, and am glad I could reconnect with a basically G3 clone again, but I don't think I'll be furthering my PTR. Wouldn't normally be a problem to have some fun, but with 'civil war' coming, and possibly to lose my job at the end of October thanks to coerced gene therapy..... not in the cards. God help us all.
I always enjoy when Brass Facts uploads
My group uses them in overwatch positions in defending in rural areas. Better car stopping power than 556. Accurate enough for our needs. Cheap enough to use and beat up.
Are… are you the Taliban?
You act like it's a cheap rifle. lol... For that kind of money, you could build a nice AR10 style setup.
@@calholli not really. You could build a cheap ar10. Maybe you should try shooting one first.
@@godwinjoy9730 if I say yes, is the government also going to give me 85 billion dollars in weapons?
the g3/ptr was my stan rifle back when i was in the bundeswehr, i was totally ok with it until i got to carry a g36. it is a massive difference but still i dunno why i just love the g3 and if i could i would buy one. preferences aren't that logical sometimes, so have fun finding your optimal setup and thx a lot for uploading your videos, it's always a pleasure watching someone who knows what he's talking about!
I mean... If you've got the money you could buy one
I have the old match grade PTR 91 with an ACOG on it. It works really well for me. It fills that mid level marksman rifle slot really well. I can wander around and when needed reach out and hit my target.
thanks for making the PTR videos, i really enjoy them .
I appreciate your ptr videos, I have a c308 myself and thought about trying to make it more tactical but decided on going the other way and making it more cetme style like it’s meant to be
Same here, brother. I'm gonna put a scope and a sling on it and call it good. I don't want to be stuck paying an immense amount of money for a little added capability.
I love these ptr videos, keep em coming!
God bless your ptr endeavors and thanks for sharing!
This series of videos got me into this rifle. I have the 18in stepped 101 model. I use a Choate tool side folding stock with a short buffer works great and is straight line so no stupid humpback. Even when using the short buffer I cant tell the difference in recoil. Havent got an optic for the rail yet but looking into 1-4x glass.
You say you hate it, but we both know you love it deep down. I dont know what it is about it, but the G3 is just cool. I love my PTR91.
Please make more videos about the PTR. I'm well aware of the G3's failings in the modern gunfighting world, but it's a fucking tank and I absolutely love them. Really cool to see it updated. I have a lot of respect for the Swedish or Portuguese troops that need to train to negotiate and dominate the modern battlefield using modern tactics, with one of these. It's hard enough as it with an AR-15. Cheers.
Portugal adopted the SCAR the G3 will remain for the Marines and rear area personal
@ Bojan M. - The CETME/G3 platform is a legend, and with good reason. Used by more than fifty nations during its height in the Cold War, the rifle proved itself all over the world in some of the harshest climates around and under conditions that would break or destroy many lesser designs. The G3 was fielded, as the 7.62x51 mm M80 round was fielded, in the expectation that it would be used against invading Soviet-Warsaw Pact forces flooding through the Fulda Gap and across the northern German plains into greater Europe.
That didn't happen, but the G3/CETME was used in numerous smaller conflicts around the world. It is perhaps most famous for its use by Iran during the Iran-Iraq War of the 1980s and in the African "bush wars" from the 1960s onwards, but many armies still use them today in some role or other. It was/still is famous for being able to function and remain reliable under appalling conditions of neglect, abuse and dirt/debris. Indeed, some of the mercs and irregulars using them never cleaned their rifles, yet they continued to run.
The platform may be the last word in reliability and toughness in a long arm for military use. The Israeli Galil and Com-Bloc AKM-AK47 are legendary for their reliability and toughness, but the CETME/G3 even outstrips them, according to some sources. But the penalty is weight; they're built like tanks but are in no way light.
Back in the 1980's my Dad used to own an ex-Namibian one converted to semi-auto only, back when that was legal here (Canada). He recalls it being extremely beat up (he paid something like $350 for it) but the bore was good and it never once give him any problems. No telling how many rounds it had through it before it came to him, but he added to that by at least a few thousand before selling it.
When I used one on a foreign weapons course in the army, it was in equally poor state. Again, it didn't stop working and we really ran it hard. Everyone who was 5'10 and over liked it. Everyone shorter had more mixed opinions. I fell in love with the thing.
Thanks for the post!
@@bojanmilankovic - Thanks for writing, and interesting to hear of your experiences. The consensus seems to be that the CETME/G3 can take a licking and keep on ticking, to paraphrase that old watch advertisement. With as much as they weigh, they better be durable, right? I find it ironic that the CETME/G3 has outlasted its chief Cold War competitor, as a service rifle, the FN FAL, in service with military and other forces. I guess that speaks to its basic virtues. The FAL was adopted by some ninety countries ultimately, but few still use it today, whereas some fifty or so nations used the CETME/G3, but many still retain them today in some capacity. If my info is correct, the G3 is cheaper and less-complex to make, which may factor into it. The FAL is by no means an inadequate design, it is a great one in fact - but sometimes the cheaper and less-complex option wins out. I somewhat prefer the FAL to the G3, so it is something of a mystery to me it wasn't retained more often, but regardless, if I was a young conscript, I would not feel inadequately armed with either one.
@@danp5073 Their marines and some of their UN troops choose to keep the G3 over the death rattle FN gun
I have a good AR setup. Still I like seeing these retro battle rifles being configured for modern defensive roles. Please keep them coming!
Claw mounted rails work nice, if you weld them on.
Much better ptr91 video than the last one.
I have read the enhanced buffer is more helpful once you get the bolt velocity down by changing the locking piece out. It's like a 'last couple percent' modification, following the locking piece and muzzle brake.
So it depends...if he got the enhanced buffer from Hkparts it isn't going to do jack shit really. It's two shitty copper backed springs taken out of the standard buffer. What he really wants is the Bill Springfield buffer or Parabellum Combat one. Both of those are fantastic because they actually use different springs.
I have 4 PTR clones, 2-91s, 9CT & 9KT. Hop nails my love/hate relationship with the G3 and mp5 with absolute precision.
I thought about scrapping them myself for a more modern platform. The reason I haven’t done so is that they genuinely are great engineering. It’s hard to throw good engineering away.
I love mine. I even found the wooden stock and foregrip for it.
I run a PTR 91 Squad carbine with 16" match grade fluted barrel, match grade trigger, Magpul PRS2 and Swampfox Tomahawk 1-8x24. Excellent and comfortable setup.
CLARKSOOOON
I certainly get the inclination to make this rifle a contender with more suitable and modern platforms. I dreamed for decades about getting an Hk91. Thank God for ptr and even the century ptr built CETMEs. The latter allowed me to satiate the need for one of these rifles and realize what a heavy cumbersome beast it really is. There are definitely better options out there. Having said that, I get HOPs torrid relationship with the platform. It's still cool.
I have a Vector Arms V51 SBR built on a PTR receiver. Mounted a Trijicon Tripower. Found a good MP5 tri rail to replace the front forearm with a TLR 1 combo and stubby VFG mounted. I have a Choate Tool folding stock for it but don't use it. Kept the OEM stock mounted.
Epic fireballs.
Also have 2 NIB PTR 91 Classics with 18" barrels. Despise the OEM slim forearms. Swapped new unissued HK fat forearms with the HK bipods on both. Also swapped US made HD buffers in all 3.
Set the 91s up with TA01B ACOGs.
As a new ptr 91 owner this is great info tyvm
"Let's just ignore the fact that AR10s eat themselves alive."
Sincerely,
People who don't shoot a lot.
RIP Hop's woman when she asks how he liked the dinner
If you want to do more roller locks, I'd love to see one on the Cetme L.
Love these videos because I'm still debating an ar10 or a ptr91
@ 0:15 Or for notalgia reasons. The G3 was my service rifle in the german military. That was 22 years ago ...
I still love it. it looks really cool.
G3 clones are a lot of fun to play with. Keep the videos coming!
The ptr vids are my favorite. Probably of the way Hop stokes opinion. In my own experience I have found the G3 platform to be a very fieldable rifle. One thing I did notice in this particular vid is the use of that vertical grip. I've seen this most common with less statuesque guys operating it. I'm not one to comment on others stature. I myself am 6'2" and a husky 280. My younger brother, however, is 5'10" and about 130 and he has a hell of a time reaching the bcm handstop that I have mounted directly under the charging handle for palm placement. At full arm extension I can reach all 4 fingers past the muzzle end. The G3 is a long rifle and what is comfortable for one may not be for another. Just a thought.
Sounds similar to my M1A Scout Squad 18” battle rifle. I got it because I love the coolness factor but it’s not the most practical semiauto.308. I ended up putting a PA 1-6 LPVO on it with a SADLAK Airborne mount and a fiberglass stock with cheek riser. It’s a decent daytime setup. In a pinch, I could put a light on the scout rail using an offset mount. Updating these old platforms is all about compromise. If you want pure function, with an AR10 or SCAR.
I'm going through a very similar situation with a 5.56 AK (SLR 106) that I picked up a few years ago. I want it to be a viable "serious use" rifle in my collection, but it's hard to functionally beat the AR platform... Lighter, more ergonomic, supremely customizable. Basically the AK ends up being a contender only because of it's "cool factor", which is unfortunate.
Yeah, I've been trying to come up with a serious reason to get 5.56 ak instead of an ar but I really can't except for "it looks cool."
I never really understood this. Why does it need to be a "serious use" rifle? In practical terms, you're likely never even to use in your gun, but even then, you don't really need anything other than one rifle, one shotgun, and one pistol with few exceptions. Everything else is no matter how you try and justify it, ultimately exists in your collection "Because it's cool." And that's okay, because guns are really fucking cool.
@@airmanautismo.6481 I think it's just how I try to justify the huge amount of money I've blown on it. Dedicated suppressor, $1k worth of lights/lasers for NV, 3/4 of the ZenitCo catalogue...
@Anakin Skywalker Then if you're really gonna be that practical, just buy what you need, what is a rifle, pistol shotgun. Even with a family you can spare some "unnecessary" expense.
Hop, you make great content. Very grounded.
I have a K3P that I SBRed and I can say its my favorite gun. Its way to heavy and its still huge, but its just alot of fun and the shorter barrel makes of for some of the issues in handling of its bigger brothers. is a great compromise. Couldn't imagine putting a muzzle break on it though. Just the Factory Flash suppressor felt like i was getting punched in the face every time it fired and had a tendency to clear out the shooting tables next to me at the range. I ended up putting a KAK flash can on it which drastically helped with the sound profile. (Temporary solution till i can get an OSS can for it)
Loving the Ptr chronicles
I really recommend trying a build like you described at the end, anchored around a G3K style barrel and a Spuhr stock. I've found it to be a great and unique profile of firepower and mobility.
Well, I couldn't find an FN FAL (SLR) that was within my price range, so I went with the PTR100, which, for all intents and purposes, seems very similar to the PTR91 described in your videos. I have replaced the stock handguard with a steel one and the birdcage brake for a heavy-duty compensator, which, although a little louder, does help a lot. I love it!
I picked up a PTR 91 in the FR variety earlier this year. Probably going with a mild DMR setup on it, if even that. I am collecting common military pattern rifles and just wanted one because I think they are cool. I have no interest in making it a tactical, serious battle rifle so I harbor no regrets about my purchase. I have a VG6 Gamma muzzle brake and the extended charging handle upgrade on it (though charging the rifle is still a bitch... hopefully it gets easier after some serious usage), and only really think I'm going to do a trigger upgrade, a stock upgrade, and maybe some kind of optic. The FAL is next on my list as I've already got an AK, an AR, and a VZ-58.
I love this series Hap, go crazy....
I've got a C308, and after some poor performance I decided to replace the extractor.
I also added a 1 inch riser onto the rail for scope mounting reasons.
I have to say, that after those fixes and such, I've fallen in love with the rifle. There are better .308 alternatives, yes, but this rifle is simple, it's reliable now that I've fixed it, its a permanent addition to my arsenal.
I'm still gonna mod it however, and set it up to my standards.
feel like a prism optic on one of these is the move, if you can get within the eyebox
Nutnfancy's 2016 Fail-a-thon was epic as was his Top 10 reasons not to bug out. Yeah, he can be full of himself and wrong at times but he has provided sane POU that separates the serious from the tacticool eliteists. This is important in a world of dying boomers and their acolytes. A collaboration of Nuntnfacy and Hop about the PTR91 in the desert would be epic. Doodle on the side dropping shade while dad bitches about the cost of making the video is a must. Can't wait.
Watching Nutnfancy is like listening to the Bay City Rollers. No one admits to it, but you wouldn't have groups like Nirvana without them.
Young people that don’t hunt at all and only think in terms of self defense are just as annoying and incompetent as boomers who only hunt (rarely)and don’t believe in high capacity/full of stupid myths
@@ViktoriousDead Reminder that this is not a hunting channel, per se, and, as far as self-defense, ya minght wanna do some YT searching on "dollar collapse"
@@ViktoriousDead That's probably because the 2A was about fighting, and that most gun channels are not hunting channels.
@@ViktoriousDead Fully automatic boar spears with shoulder things that go up should be legal to own without a permit.
PTR91 addiction activate.
Interesting build for sure. My friend made a PTR build for a DMR role and basically copied the cold war G3 + a modern stock & optic. With everything on it, it came to 13ish lbs.
He had a Burris RT6 on a surplus G3 claw mount, new manufacture POF wide handguard, with a new manufacture HK steel bipod (each also bought under $100 each idk how he did it), bill springfield trigger group in a steel trigger assembly, extended charging handle which sits kinda funny on it with the wide handguard, standard flash hider, and lastly a Magpul Prs stock. IDK how he does it but he shoulders the thing and puts clover leafs in a target 50yds away with steel case and iron sights, I haven't seen him shoot it long range yet. I only imagine he would do it faster with a proper muzzle brake.
Really liking the PTR vids
If you like having to go to the next county to find your spent brass, then a PTR-91 is for you!
I've just been through this with a (real) G3 trying to turn it into a DMR. So far, it looks the part, but accuracy with my favorite LR load isn't great. Still, you wouldn't want to take your chances against it under 600-700m.
If you can hit a man sized target at 600-700 meters that seems good enough for a DMR.
Dmr?
@@Return_to_Roots designated marksman rifle
Did you go with the spurh stock? Everything I've seen for a HK upgrade points to that but I hate the look of it
@@alllopez63 I cannot share a photo here, but yes, I did. The Spuhr stock is set up to help deal with the "hump" in the back of the receiver on the G3. If you run an optic, you need to raise your head considerably above the line of the iron sights. I don't think your average AR stock can do that - without going for something that gives an elevated cheek weld. However, the Magpul PRS-2 does something similar.
Ironically I run an acog, with spuhr set up. It allows your to reach out and get close if need be. The eye relief isn’t bad as everyone says. If you plan on hiking it around. You’ll need a good sling it’ll make a difference on your back over time, the slingster is king. The ptr is a solid gun, heavy yes but it’ll hold up for what you need it. I take mine hiking and am fully confident in it.
The Slingster was OK for my PTR. Didn't like how thin the webbing was it would frequently tangle. I run a M60 sling instead now.
For years I tried to talk myself out of the reality of my HK91’s Not Being That Heavy! The point that this really hit home, for some reason, was the day I first shot a buddy’s PTR91 and it not only shot exactly like my HK’s, but the first thing I said out loud was “This is just as heavy as my HK”.
Two weeks later I sold both of my HK91’s when Obama was re-elected and made out huge. So in the end I love the PTR91 for just opening my eyes! LoL
Almost the same thing just happened recently with my MP5 & MP5K…Both sold really fast and for twice what I originally paid years ago. I was fed up also with the insane costs of any accessories or modifications.
I believe that if the G3 got the same innovation in the same way as the AkM does. It would solve alot of the problems you mention in your orginal clip.
What I would like to see is:
-a gas or hydraulic buffer instead of a (a old, worn out, oil soaked) friction buffer
-common tungsten filled boltcarriers
-a replacement picatinny rail for the front sight, in the same hight as reciever rail.
-a better solution for the safety
Recommend to switch the cocking handle with a HK 21E or a 23 style handle. It will be easier and faster to operate the charging handle for sure.
God i am early for once,much love from balkans my man,i absolutely love serious/joking manner with straight to the point facts.Just pure fucking info people need
Thanks for the videos I am still interested in the PTR due to all the cheap mags I already bought :D
It's definitely heavy but personally I think it's a great coyote gun especially going past 500y. I have a simple 1-8 on it and took the wood furniture off and lined it up just a little bit. I'm okay with it. It's definitely not the lights been on my own but I do have my own personal uses for it. Plus I think it's fun slinging 308 out of a roller delayed rifle.
So I have one too...it's a heavy gal...but she does put my rounds where I want them. I agree with your statement of making it for longer range as the weight makes it fairly unwieldily. Or get stronger! ;) This definitely isn't going to be a weapon for your little brother but it definitely will make your grandpa proud.
I still need to get a spur stock for mine and then it should be pretty much done.
Speaking of TNP lingo, these videos need a huge "second kind of cool" banner for the uninitiated to save you time with the "there are better options" crowd that don't get it. Love the journey you are taking your G3 clone on and appreciate the honest feedback. These almost make me want to toy with my PTR but you staying grounded and honest with your conclusions and the fact that I would need a claw mount keeps me from taking the jump into this money pit/boat of a rifle. I wish you could do this for the FAL, I think there is way more potential there and IMHO the FAL would be a better battle rifle to possibly make the jump from 2nd kind of cool to an actual practical POU. Similar inherent challenges but I like the ergos (aside from grip) way better, especially reloading.
Scope mounting on the fal has basically one good option I thought. It's still a cold war bigger is better battle chungus.
@@randomidiot8142 That is the rub with the FAL, aftermarket accessories are nowhere near even the G3.
If you look at what the Bundeswehr has done to make G3s into DMRs, it gives you an idea of what is needed to bring this rifle into the 21st century. I'm going from memory but if I recall correctly, those precision rifles have a new trigger pack or a trigger job, a replacement stock which is adjustable to the shooter's cheek weld and length of pull, a refined two-stage buffer and recoil spring, and of course a suitable optic and mount, plus a provision for mounting modern imaging devices and accessories and a sling. LeRoy Thompson's book for Osprey Military, "The G3 Battle Rifle" (Weapon 48, Osprey Publishing, 2019) has a nice section on what the modern German marksman used in Afghanistan, as well as some well-done photos and illustrations.
But yeah, tough go making this boat-anchor into a lighter, more-portable machine. Hit the gym and build those muscles....
As a military historian, I have been somewhat surprised to find that so few nations have tried the FN FAL/SLR/L1A1 as a precision or sniper weapon. Bob Cashner's book, "The FN FAL Battle Rifle," also for Osprey (Weapon 27, 2013), seems to conclude that it is primarily because of the rifle's clam-shell style hinged receiver that the weapon did not enjoy better success as a precision platform. Eventually, solutions were found to this problem, both during the Cold War (the British SUIT, various German optics, etc.) and later on (DS Arms retrofit M1913/P-rail receiver cover). The Argentines used a few scoped FALs during the Falklands War, but that's about the only record I can find. But then, I am not a specialist in this rifle or its history as others are.
IMHO, the FAL is far-superior ergonomically. It balances better in the hand, and "points well," as a shotgun enthusiast would say. The controls are convenient and well thought-out. The adjustable gas system is a wonderful performance enhancement, though I understand that in some armies and units, adjustment was done by unit NCOs and/or armorers and the line troops were not permitted to adjust the valves unless specifically ordered to do so. Properly set for M80 Ball, the FAL is a much pleasanter rifle to use than the G3/CETME design; its recoil is not nearly as harsh as the roller-delayed blowback of the G3. The FAL barrels are generally accurate, but the trigger and iron sights could be better, although they are of course more than adequate to the typical soldier's use. And they are hard-hitting, rugged, and reliable weapons, firing an effective cartridge.
the fal is worse in every realistic way.
He “hates” the PTR like squidward hating krabby Pattie’s
After using the "enhanced" buffers in both fixed plastic G3 stocks, the Magpul PRS stock, and the Spuhr stock, I agree 100% with your assessment....if there is a noticeable reduction in recoil with the enhanced buffer over the regular buffer, I sure as sh*t can't feel it either.
the $100 enhanced dmr buffer no, the wider HK21 buffer does but its $200+
@@adam3651 Do you know if the 21 buffer will fit in the Spuhr stock? I know the Swedes use a long buffer that is similar to the 21 buffer, but I can't remember how the two of them compare in terms of width and length.
@@dexm2010 also interested to know the answer to that question. Recently got a Spuhr, would 100% pony up for the 21E buffer if it fits.
@@metzwax5021 I'll bet someone over at HKPro likely knows the answer, I just struggle to bring myself over there for...various reasons.
@@dexm2010 No, it won't. The width of the HK21E buffer is slightly larger than that of the DMR buffer. It's also significantly longer. HKParts does sell a copy of the G3 Heavy Buffer, but they're out of stock right now. These mimic the -21E style, but with a shorter housing that will fit in the A2, Magpul PRS, or Spuhr with a bit of modification (need to dremel some space in the back plate).
0:16 Damn Hop didn't expect you to call out my country like that 😂
Something worth mentioning, the Century Sporter 308's are Spanish CETME kits imported by Century and finished by PTR for 922r compliance. With that, you get all PTR compliance parts, including the barrel and receiver, making it an excellent cheaper starting point. I got mine last year for about $600 with 5 mags and bought another dozen G3 surplus mags for about $3 each.
Glad your experience was different, but beware that not all Century Arms CETME surplus rebuilds accept surplus G3 magazines. Some take 'em, but some only accept CETME-pattern magazines, which are harder to find. Maybe there is a way to do some light fitting of the G3 magazines so they work or work better, but if so, I have not seen anything on that. It's a real shame, too, because those wood-stocked CETME clones are very appealing to an old Cold War-era dude such as myself (Yeah, go ahead and cue the 'Boomer jokes.... ; )
After watching these videos detailing why I shouldn't get or try to accessorize a PTR91, I'm definitely gonna get one and try to modernize it
"I can't make it off a couple of high altitude range trips once or twice a year. Damn it, PTR. I wish I knew how to quit you."
I put a heavy, two stage recoil buffer in mine and it made a big difference.
I ran an RT6 on my PTR. Was not a fan personally of the scope. But it is a great value scope.
I have this rifle, and I would recommend using it for long range and firing from a prone position. This bitch is heavy but pretty damn accurate. I have the claw scope mount and replaced the muzzle brake with a cooler one and replaced the stock. Awesome rifle but not the most diverse..... which is why I purchased the Springfield M1A. Both great rifles! The charging handle on the PTR is super fun and unique to use.
Thank you for this video to prove I wasn't crazy
I just dumped my m1a to go all in on the ptr ,you need any 20 rd m1a checkmate mags ? I have 18 left , saw the range twice .
@@charlesdesurne4696 I'm good man, thank you though!
I love this.
Lol at :20 they're straight up shouldering that shit with the stock fully collapsed! You do you bro!
I would consider running one of these. I wonder if they have lighter thinner aftermarket barrels though.
Yeah I’ve been looking for the 16” barrel for a year, good luck
The brass coming towards the camera at 5:39 spooked me. I thought it was gonna chop my head off and kill me.
My first year hunting whitetail I brought out my Cetme. 5 round mag, Nikon scope, psg vibes. Fuck it was heavy. But what a vibe.
A sensible PTR91? This I’ve got to see.
I like the old girl going to set mine up for long range with the Magpul PRS stock and lower FCU still debating on going with the classic wide handguard with built in bipod or one of the Mlok units
a sling adapter over the trunnion area is how you sling a PTR to avoid interfering with the charging handle.
I bought my ptr's because I am a cold war era guy and regardless of it all...that G3 was just cool. Your vids though keep it very real. Make your call. Just enjoy it in pure form like a raw AK and roll, or slightly mod (for me a red dot or basic lpvo) to make it more usable. Do not try to make it what it is not! I AM glad PTR is making these variants for our enjoyment.
I have a HK 91 and I love it...its heavy though.. but the MR 762 is definitely a better choice all things considered
Yeah it’s called bulking upAnd hitting the gym