Why do Hongkongers care so much about Cantonese?
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- čas přidán 28. 09. 2023
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Artists using written Cantonese to reinterpret traditional Chinese heritage and Hongkongers overseas sharing their linguistic heritage with an overseas diaspora are but two examples of Hong Kong’s attachment with the dialect most commonly spoken in the city. In the first of a two-part series about Cantonese, the Post caught up with a primary school debate team that uses the dialect to sharpen their argument skills.
Note: at 00:48 in this video, the captions incorrectly say Cantonese may have originated a century and a half earlier than the late Qing dynasty. It should have read that the dialect emerged a “millennia and a half earlier”.
Related story:
Education Bureau rapped over Cantonese 'not an official language' gaffe sc.mp/2lzB8Ay
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I speak Cantonese and a bit of Mandarin. While learning Korean, I was surprised to find many vocabulary sounded more like Cantonese than Mandarin. It made more sense since I found out that Cantonese has a longer history than Mandarin which I thought opposite was true initially.
Sometime even for certain Japanese kanji pronunciation too
You should be fluent in Mandarin first ... before learning to speak Korean.
Fookinese also sounded like Korean.
Diu nei Lou mou. Korean is a useless language and sounds disgusting
如果不会讲普通话，你就是以越代汉的越南人，假装自己是中国人
it has a longer history so it should sound like Cantonese along with Japanese. higher power just want to wipe out history and create their own official language without acknowledging and forgetting the past.
because, swearing and insulting people's mother in the Cantonese language is a poetic artform. The form and flow is unmatched by any other language.
Speak English fool
pin this comment. dllmgh
😂
😂 In swearing, Hakka dialect sounds more powerful.
Yeah just like the Americans
I am a native Hongkonger and have been teaching foreigners Cantonese for almost 10 years. I am always so proud of my students who diligently learn Cantonese as they found Cantonese is a very beautiful, interesting and precious language which is over 1000 years of history.
cantonese is from canton and hk does not have their own language.
@@EJH989 Cantonese and Mandarin are both dialects in China, NOT language (Chinese in general term is a language on international stage). HK being in Canton Province (now it is Guangdong Province) and was heavily influenced by the main dialects of the area-- Cantonese, Hakka, Teochew (Chao-Shan). And there are many other regional dialects as well. Mandarin only came much later in HK as the border opened up and also it is the official national dialect.
@EJH989 @ivegas1000 Actually you are both incorrect. Linguistics dictates the defining distinction between two languages being dialects vs standalone languages hinges on being mutually intelligible - since Cantonese and Mandarin are NOT mutually intelligible, they are standalone languages. Dialect classification only stands true if two speakers can manage to communicate, despite vocabulary differences for the same words.ý
@@ivegas1000: Mandarin is a UN made definition. And it is a subset of actually something like Fuijian.. and this is why people are now kicking up a fuss. Cos they want everybody to be Fuijianese ?! NO !!!!! STOP IT !!!!! STOP !!!!
@@MeiinUK
Funny fake news.
Putonghua of the PRC ... and Kuoyu of the ROC .
Japan only use standardized Japanese in their schools and governance.
Singapore, Malaysia and Indonesia using standardized Bahasa Malay .
Philippines use Tagalog and English for governance.
Somehow, watching Chinese gangsters movies in Mandarin doesn’t sound as fierce as when Cantonese is spoken.
You're right. Languages can be broadly categorised into feminine-sounding or musculine-sounding. For example, English is considered more or less neutral whereas Arabic is considered extremely masculine. Likewise, Cantonese is a relatively more masculine-sounding dialect than the more feminine-sounding Mandarin dialect. Consequently, the Cantonese dialect is rather akin to an acquired taste. Like Arabic, it's hard for foreign ears to accept at first, whereas Mandarin is more feminine and melodic on the ears and hence more easily acceptable to foreign ears.
Mandarin just sounds weird.
@@momofighter3211 because Mandarin is heavily influenced by the nomadic tribes of the north, Liao and Jin, and later Qing. Funny how the mainland is so pro-Han yet they themselves are using a language that is less Han than the dialects they are marginalizing and suppressing
@@momofighter3211 你怎么跟着傻叉是的。
@@quantumchang4410 What a nonsense ... I think Cantonese sounds more melodic, regardless of "femine", "masculine" or any other gender...
Cantonese is not just the language of Hong Kong it's the broader tongue of the Guangdong (Canton) area.
That's true! Unfortunately, as Cantonese is no longer taught in Mainland China, many of the newer generations in the Guangdong can't really speak Cantonese. That's why many Hong Kongers care about the preservation of Cantonese!
Agree with you. I suppose Hongkong can claim to be a special dialect because they have infused some English words within it? It is just like overseas Chinese everywhere, the language changes slightly? This is the same with English - that is why there are so many different accents and different words for the same things, like dust bin used in England and trash can used in the Americas, like horse riding and horse-back riding, and many unique expressions in Australia and so on? The beauty of China is that all ethnic groups keep their own languages in addition to Putonghua. Putonghua is the official language and is promoted as it helps administratively, communicatively, unity, understanding, etc. It is being pragmatic. For China, the advantage is that the written language is understood by all Chinese, no matter whether they are from Canton, Shanghai, Fujian, Shandong or any other province? As HK is a part of China, Mandarin being the official language makes sense? That does not mean that Cantonese will be eliminated? If Cantonese is the main language of your family, then you will not lose it as you will be speaking with each other every day in Cantonese? I am sure Cantonese folks in Canton Province still speak Cantonese.
The thing is that written Chinese can be read in Cantonese though, so learning Cantonese is more like learning one and a half languages (speaking colloquial Cantonese and writing written Chinese), so Chinese can definitely still be taught in Cantonese. And to my understanding, since many of the younger generation in Guangzhou only has to learn Mandarin and their family also understands Mandarin, they can understand Cantonese but not speak it (similar to second generation immigrants overseas I guess)
But there are definitely differences between Cantonese spoken in Guangzhou and Hong Kong as you said, such as words infused from English (eg taxi as 的士 in HK and 计程车 in Mainland)
Yes, but what we don't recall is that HKers aren't actually have ancestry only from Guangdong. In the previous two generations in HK, more than half of the immigrates were from all over China just like Taiwan, but over time, they adapted Cantonese and their children did not speak their mother dialect. Just like people from Guangdong who chose to immigrated to Taiwan in the 40-50s and adapted Mandarin after. The thing is.. you aren't completely loosing the culture, you can still have tv shows/music etc, and the language unity of Chinese around the world far outweighs the downside
The best way to increase the usage of Cantonese around the world is to make it easier to access Cantonese cultural media. Look at Japan and Korea. There wasn't a reason to learn Japanese and Korean until people started seeing Anime, Manga and K-pop. Now, the two languages have exploded in popularity around the world!
I grew up in the UK but I listened to Hong Kong pop music and watched a lot of Hong Kong dramas and films when I was a child. Now it's so hard to get them. If they want to save Cantonese then they need to release Hong Kong films and music on popular streaming services like Netflix and Amazon.
the point is Hong Kong is no longer the center of Chinese pop culture, Those days are long gone,
@@ju98sy But they can still release the old materials. Just because they're old doesn't mean they're bad. I would say a lot of Hong Kong films from the 80s, and 90s can easily stand up to modern day films.
@@Yutappy99 why bother since you can find it all over the internet
@@ju98syBecause not everyone is internet savvy. And also, why not? What harm is there to make it easier to access these content?
@@Yutappy99 what kind of audience you are trying to target then ?
I am a native Hongkonger, and I believe that Cantonese is very important for us. It is wired in our genes, literally.
You still need to be fluent in Mandarin for the next generation do well.
@@gwent5914Just like learning English or any other major language. Mandarin is a must to unify the whole country for communication purpose, at the same time it needs not to destroying the fabric of life in the Cantonese community. Hopefully their government can seek out the balance between the two. To be honest many HK people don't even speak proper traditional Cantonese anymore, they are a mix of English+Cantonese through years of western influence.
Even as a native Kuala Lumpurian, Malaysian like myself, born and raised here from descendants of Guangxi province, Cantonese plays a major role in my daily life. Viva La Cantonese!
glory to hongkong
@@Nirvanaki🤣🤣🤣👉港灿👈🤣🤣🤣
Cantonese is my mother tongue. My ancestors are from Canton, China which is the home of the Cantonese language. They emigrated to Malaysia in the early 19th century. Hence Cantonese is widely spoken in big cities of Malaysia like KL, Ipoh & Kuantan besides other Chinese dialects like Hakka, Teochew & Hokkien. I'm proud to be a Cantonese speaker.
The same goes with me. Typically pure cantonese though. Both my parent r Cantonese. As city KLites Cantonese is the norm fr early yrs.
100% right. My father was born and raised in Ipoh MY. He never forgot his mother tongue even though the local government had done everything they could to discourage locals to learn and speak Cantonese. Our family moved away from HKG (aka my birth land) over four decades ago and my circle of friends primarily speak English, but Cantonese is still # 1 dialect being used within our family. I'm, too, proud of being a fluent speaker.
Hi, I'm from KL, Malaysia too. Sadly the younger generation, especially post millennia hardly speaks any Cantonese nowadays. Even some of the kakak Indon are more fluent in Cantonese than the young ones.. 😂
If your ancestors are actually from those hometowns, then move back to those hometowns. DONE. Do you know that, everybody does that as well ? They move back to their ancestors' hometowns... even in Europe.. it is the same... When Europeans were open door and had to do business etc. They move to their grand parents' towns or cities.. or whatever... And they discuss how to move on together. So why is HK being used, and being scapegoated? Like it is OWED and being used as a minion ? Why ???? So speak in those regions and areas then.
@@lmc2664
Birth Place > Not "birth land" 🤦
Cantonese, Wu, and other southern Chinese languages have existed for longer than Mandarin, which evolved from the Middle Chinese spoken north of the Yangtze River during the Song Dynasty. Most of the "sound readings" (音読/音訓) used for Chinese characters in Japanese and Korean are based on Cantonese or other southern Chinese readings, with only some based on Mandarin.
i'm curious why no one is talking about the other Wu languages and dialects like Shanghainese or Zhejiangnese....
why is there a huge preoccupation with the West about HK-specific Cantonese. I dont see videos or media covering the gradual loss of other mainland Chinese languages...
@@zacharycohen9985
I think the the majority of the Chinese diaspora is Cantonese/Toisanese.
@@maggiechan33 I respectfully disagree. Indonesia and Thailand have the world's largest Chinese community outside China. Source: Statista
@@zacharycohen9985
But what language do they speak ?
The Chinese diaspora also includes at least 20 other countries.
@@maggiechan33 Many languages including the various Chinese dialects like Minnan, Teochew, Hakka， Hokkien and Cantonese
I am 3rd generation Taishanese (新宁)born and raised in Malaysia.
Taishanese might sounds too minority ,my grandparents didn’t taught me how to speak.
instead we speak Cantonese.
It’s really sounds similar and it’s much more easier to communicate with others Chinese communities. We also influenced by Hong Kong TV show and pop culture for a few decades .That’s why Kuala Lumpur ,Ipoh and some townships are so familiar to Cantonese-speaker , no language barrier at all.😂
Hiak pao mei?
Haha! Me too! The 3rd generations of Taishanese, our grand parents didnt taught us, instead we speak Cantonese.
I realised that most of the Cantonese speaking in Malaysia especially in Ipoh are mostly Hakka.
It does not sound "minority", cos it is your assumption that you are in the minority, when you are "not" ? I don't ever see a person in the UK... keep saying that "I am English and I am in the minority"... actually.. We just get on as usual. If you are a Taishanese, then introduce yourself as such. Where has the basic decencies gone to ??? i.e. "Hello... My name is Mr X... I am from XYA...and this is my business card..." or a ".... I am here to introduce myself to you, as a colleague... and I am here to look after XYZ".... Don't accept online media, or entertainment as the FORMAL way to behave ! People still don't know you !!!!!
Hello i am also Taishanese living in KL :D but i also don't know hwo to speak instead speak Cantonese
Question:
Where is Cantonese most spoken in Malaysia?
Would it be in Petaling Street Kuala Lumpur (a.k.a. Malaysian Chinatown)
Also:
Where do people in Malaysia learn Cantonese?
Are there Cantonese language schools there?
Or do you just learn them online? (e.g. Cantonese Pod 101)
You can never replace how glorious swear words sound in Cantonese
Culture!!! 😂
i lost it where you said "how glorius" Lol
And this is why you think we should learn Cantonese? I'll take a pass, thank you!
@@LUIS-ox1bv Literally no one asked you.
@@LUIS-ox1bv No group would accept a pretentious foreigner who can’t take a joke, so we’re not exactly missing out, either.
Somebody protect this teacher at all cost for her efforts to protect and preserve Cantonese. As a Chinese who is not fluent in Mandarin, one can't imagine the amount of subtle disdain and snark I get from Mandarin-speaking Chinese
@@deschan2246. 🤣
如果不会讲普通话，你就是以越代汉的越南人，假装自己是中国人
@@deschan2246.its almost like some people arent always surrounded by their native language
@@deschan2246. "If you're not fluent in Mandarin, you're not Chinese"
In another words, someday if you don't speak Mandarin, you go to concentration camp until you get fluent in Mandarin. indeed it happened under Mao.
@@san209nha9 no it didn't happen. did you just make that up? disgusting. there is a propaganda war going on to make Hongkongers self identify as an independent group of people from the rest of the Chinese using the dialect.
Cantonese should continue and be promoted all over the world! Is a beautiful language! Pray for Hong Kong...
Why need to pray for Hong Kong? Are the people dying there?
@@bossb5513 Many have disappeared and never seen again! Just because they spoke up against the CCP! Now don't waste my time...!!!
@@Alex.8081 lol. Many like how many? Can you even name these people? If you have evidence, I am sure US is going to act. You are just wasting people time and brain memory with your lies.
@@bossb5513Hong Kong is not free anymore! That’s why we should pray for Hong Kong!
@@eduardodasilva907 You mean not free to riot, destroy the city disrupt normal daily life, etc. like before , hmm ¢o¢kroach ??
What I like most about this video is that it categorizes both mandarin and cantonese as dialects.
People from China always try to undermine the importance and value of cantonese by saying that it is a DIALECT, while mandarin is actually also a dialect.
Cantonese is not a dialect!!
Proud to be a Cantonese speaker! Such an ancient language which keeps the heritage and culture well.
You got that right!!
Yes
W
The first time I travelled to China I went through Hong Kong. I was proud to have learned Mandarin. I remember the young guy at the travel company preferred to speak English than Mandarin. I was impressed with his pride in speaking Cantonese. It was a chance for me to understand culture on the ground is more important than culture in books. You need to listen to people.
it wasnt only about pride, while cantonese are their first language, english come next as second. Mandarin is like an optional language where not all people were able to speak.
其實在我年少時，因為政府不鼓勵學習廣東話， 所以也不是太明白的！但是後來遊歷全球，經多方觀察，才明白粵語確是非常獨特的！可以說：世界上沒有一種語言在作曲填詞方面可以與粵語相比的！請勿誤會，當然粵語歌也有不好的。我是說在作曲填詞的最高境界上，現在是找不到比粵語更好的語言。我自幼便深通普國語，至今任何人對我說普國語；我都會聽懂超過99％。可是我不明白為什麼有時我在聽一些普國語歌時，竟然連一個字也聽不懂！原來超過八成普國語的字都是雙聲字而那兩聲通常都是相差很遠的（例如：雙字，shu ang)！九成半以上粵語字都是單聲字（例如：雙，seung)！而且粵語字通常都是九聲齊全！所以在粵語來說，要找一個字的發音與曲調完全相同比普國語是容易很多。反觀所有普國語歌，幾乎每句曲詞都有拗音字（即改變字的發音去遷就曲調）。有些普國語歌幾乎每字拗音！所以我便聽不懂！歐洲的拼音式多聲字便更無法相比！所以好的粵語歌是可以做到詞曲合一，差不多沒有拗音字；唱歌和平常說話幾乎相同。全世界沒有另一種語言有這個粵語的特色，普國語也不例外！可是粵語一定會在中國失傳！因為現在中國政府的統治模式是必然使多數語言消亡的！這不一定是中國政府白紙黑字的政策；但是中國人的統治者為了防止地方有任何實權，便規定各地方領導都不准是當地人！非當地人統治便不鼓勵當地的語言！這是不難理解的！反觀民主國家如印尼，雖然有全民皆懂的國語（Bahasa Indonesia）,但地方語言如(Javanese)並沒有消失！又如菲律賓雖有幾乎全民皆通的(Tagalog)，但地方語言如(Ilocano)沒有消失！甚至美國的西裔人還是經常以西班牙語溝通的！反觀中國，上海話從1949年至現在只七十年便幾乎全面消亡！放棄粵語便是放棄人類文明的重要遺產！長遠來說，廣東人是要到外國去學習粵語！誠可嘆也！
普通話國語與歐洲的多聲字語言一樣；在唱歌時都離不開拗音，所以有時便全曲拗音，成為一種獨特的歌唱形式，叫藝術歌曲！如果沒有字幕，普通人是完全聽不懂的；但歌者還引以為榮！可是廣東話因為可以做到詞曲合一，不需拗音。所以粵語歌是沒有（或幾乎沒有）藝術歌曲的！但是就是因為世上沒有粵語藝術歌曲，很多北方的歌唱家都看不起粵語歌，認為沒有藝術！其實這是大錯特錯！因為全世界除了粵語歌外，沒有其他的歌曲可以做到詞曲合一；不需拗音！光是這個特式便足證粵語歌的藝術成就。同時正正就是因為粵語歌的藝術成就非凡，大部份廣東人都不太喜歡聽非粵語歌曲，因為非粵語歌曲都有很多拗音字！這樣使廣東人看起來好像排他性很強，其實都是誤解！
每個中文字的粵語發聲最多可以有九聲。普通人是不一定可以發出到九聲；但是普通人最少也可以發六聲。例如那個(Si)部的粵語發音由高至低可以表達如下：（1）師（2）史（3）試（4）市（5）是（6）時。(Fun)部：（1）分（2）粉（3）訓（4）奮（5）份（6）焚。(Ma）部: (1)媽（2）嫲（3）嗎（4）馬（5）罵（6）麻。(Se)部：（1）些（2）寫（3）瀉（4）社（5）射（6）蛇。(Sui)部：（1）需（2）水（3）歲（4）緒（5）睡（6）誰。（Yi）部：（1）依（2）椅（3）意（4）以（5）二（6）宜。(Yuen)部：（1)冤（2）丸（3）怨（4）遠（5）願（6）園。(Ngoi)部：（1）哀（2）靄（3）愛（4）有聲無字（5）外（6）呆。(Lo)部 ：（1）撈（2）佬（3）有聲無字（4）老（5）路（6）勞。(Tou)部：（1）滔（2）土（3）吐（4）肚（5）有聲無字（6）途。(Wai)部：（1）威（2）位（3）尉（4）偉（5）惠（6）維。(Wong)部：（1）汪（2）枉（3）有聲無字（4）往（5）旺 (6) 黃。(Wu）部：（1）烏（2）糊（3）惡（4）有聲無字（5）護（6）胡。(Yim) 部: (1) 閹（2）掩 (3) 厭 （4）染 (5) 艷 （6）嚴。(Yung)部：（1）翁（2）擁（3）有聲無字（4）勇（5）用（6）容。又(Si)部九聲是（1）師（2）史（3）試（4）市（5）是（6）時（7）舌（d尾）（8）攝（p尾）（9）蝕（t尾）；後三聲是尾聲。沒有一個普通話國語的字的發聲是如此齊全的；因為所有普通話國語字都只有四聲！所以粵語纔是完整的漢語；普通話國語是真正的方言！各位還記得尤雅那首著名的『往事只能回味』吧？她第一句的第一個字是（時）字，同時她第三句的第四個字也是（時）字。可是這兩個相同的字尤雅是用完全不同的聲調唱出來的！因為她在唱第二個（時）拗了音去遷就曲調。這首歌的曲調不錯；但是每句曲詞都有不同程度的拗音字。全部普通話國語歌都有這個問題！反觀粵語歌，雖然偶然也有拗音字，但拗音情況是極少的,粵語歌的拗音字例子如下:關正傑那首經典(情愛幾多哀)最後三句:(為換到,她的愛,甘心衝進恨海)那個(愛)字,他唱成(哀)字!但是關正傑這首名作全首歌只有這一個拗音字而已!普通話國語幾乎沒有一首歌的作詞可以有這種全曲只有一個拗音的水準!因為所有普通話國語歌幾乎每句曲詞都有拗音字!歐式語言的歌曲就更不足論。且聽Diana Ross那首名曲 If We Hold On Together 幾乎全曲拗音。
因為粵語歌普遍無拗音，唱粤語歌跟平常說粵語沒有很大的分別。所以與全世界的語言不同；最佳學習粵語的方法就是學唱粵語歌！
兹列舉數句尤雅此曲中的拗音字如下: 時(光）一去永不回；往事只能（回）味!憶童年（時）足馬清（梅），兩少（無）（猜）日（夜）相随。（春）（風）又（吹）紅（了）（花）蕊，（你）也經已添了新歲！
廣東人作了數千首完全沒有拗音字的粵語歌!例如葉振棠那首『江湖行』唱起來跟平時講廣東話完全無分別！但是完全沒有拗音字的普通話國語歌絕無僅有，找來找去只有那首廣東人作的「滄海一聲笑」！將來粵語絕跡於中國後，中國便不會再有第二首無拗音字的普語歌了；因為只有廣東人纔會創作無拗音的歌曲！
光是「力拔山兮氣蓋世」一句 用廣東話來說 霸氣十足 氣宇軒昂 足以襯托楚霸王之霸氣 相反用北京官話來説 就像閹割去勢了一樣 毫無霸氣可言
My grandad was from Dongguan. My entire family now(4th generation) speaks Cantonese here in Malaysia but however do noticed the popularity are diminishing here with the younger generations. When Hong Kong dramas were a hit in the TV, usage did expanded here. Hopefully Cantonese can sustained.
Talking about tvb dramas, they are now a joke. 80s had high quality dramas
I don't speak Cantonese ( Vietnamese) ,but I do work for a certain large HK sauce company in the US branch. Funnily, during random office talk I can figure out some Cantonese because it more similar to Vietnamese than Mandarin.
Y'all should do a video on Vietnamese-Cantonese!
me I’m việt learning Cantonese 😂
I mean, most east asian languages spread off the rlly ancient chinese language, thats talking abt probably before the Tang Dynasty.
thank you for this. im american chinese cantonese and i always love having something playing in background in cantonese. mandarin is not the same. theres also a funniness and attitude and playfulness in cantonese that really tickles me. ill always love this language, my first language.
mandarin sounds harsh to me. Cantonese always reminds me of Stephen Chow in his glory days.
Anyone that says Mandarin sounds harsh has got to listen to Teresa Teng's songs especially Yue Liang Dai Biao Wo De Xin. 😃
@@goyam2981or Faye Wong's songs 💕 ✨
I'm of mainland Chinese origin and I also care about Cantonese, and for valid reasons.
1. Although HK's Cantonese also suffers from oppression from the dominant Mandarin language, it at least has its own media and has some international influence as well. While mainland Cantonese varieties, particularly the ones spoken in Western Guangdong and Guangxi, are in real danger of extinction. And they are often considered to be of lower value than the varieties spoken in Guangzhou and in HK, which is definitely not the case but this does put them in a greater danger cause a lot of youngsters are not learning them from their parents anymore.
2. Cantonese preserves some important details on the history of Guangdong and Guangxi. People tend to focus on Cantonese's connection to Middle Chinese, which I don't deny. However, Cantonese also preserves a substratum Kra-Dai or Daic vocabulary which it shares with neighboring Tai-Kradai languages such as Zhuang or Ong-Be. For instance, the word for to itch or itching in Cantonese is Hang, and in Zhuang it's Hom. The word for to step across or to stride in Cantonese is Nam or Lam, and in Tai-Kradai it's Yam or Kham. There're many such examples. Some even say that the commonly used Cantonese word 佬 which means guy or folk may have a Tai-Kradai origin as well. This means that the natives of Guangdong were likely of Kra-Dai origin and they were forced to sinicize by the medieval Sinitic dynasties such as the Tang or the Song.
Those are the reasons why I'm learning both Cantonese and Zhuang at the same time and believe me learning both together definitely helps.
I am not a scholar of the origin of the Kra-Dai language family. There are several speculations as far as I know. It is possible that the Tai-Kadai (Kra-Dai) language family was formed as early as the 12th century BCE in the middle of the Yangtze basin, coinciding roughly with the establishment of the Chu fiefdom and the beginning of the Zhou dynasty. Another speculation is that that Kra-Dai is a branch of Austronesian belonging to subgroup Puluqic developed in Taiwan, whose speakers migrated back to the mainland, both to Guangdong, Hainan and north Vietnam around the second half of the 3rd millennium BCE. Either way, the Kra-Dai family and the Yue family of languages might have an ancient related origin, or as the Kra-Dai speaking people migrated towards Southeast Asia they travel thorugh the Old Yue language(古越語) speaking area and some language exchange could have happened. Yue language family 粵語 is related to Old Yue language(古越語). It is highly unlikely that Yue languages (Cantonese is one of them) or Yue people are derived from Kra-Dai or vice versa.
All these languages are cultural heritages and all are wonderful in its own way and should not be eradicated by any government.
@@CKWong-jk5st Nothing proves that Kra-Dai originated from the Yue kingdom in Zhejiang. AFAIK, the most recent hypothesis proposed by Blench (2018) is that Tai-Kradai originated as a branch of Austronesian which back-migrated to South China from Taiwan and its place of origin was somewhere in Guangdong around the Pearl River Delta. This kind of makes sense to me, as Cantonese is the only Sinitic language to contain a substantial amount of Kra-Dai substratum vocabulary.
Anyways, Cantonese definitely has a relation with Kra-Dai, and I feel quite sad that people tend to only focus on its relation to Middle Chinese and completely ignore its connection to the native languages of South China. And I stand firm against any eradication of the indigenous languages of the region, be it Cantonese, Kra-Dai, Hmong-Mien, or others.
@@weifan9533 Please not be offended. I said that there are several hypotheses for the origin the the Kra-Dal family of languages. I have also mentioned the Blench hypothesis in my comment. I never said that Cantonese does not have some relationships to Kra-Dai. The "Chinese people" that came down from the north to present days southern China definitly had intermarriages with the Baiyue 百越 people. The present day Yue language family is an amalgam of the middle Chinese and some languages of the Baiyue 百越 people, and I guess that is how the Kra-Dai language get into what now we call Yue languages.
Due to the strong Chinese literature tradition and the Chinese written languages, the Middle Chines part becomes the dominant part of the Yue languages, although we could still find Baiyue 百越 and Kra-Dai words in modern day Cantonese.
I love languages. Languages are percious cultural heritage. All languages are wonderful in its own way, and none of them should be suppressed or eradicated by any government.
@@CKWong-jk5st Yeah but you tend to only stress on how Cantonese is related to Middle Chinese and don't really want to mention its relation with the various native languages where the most important one being Kra-Dai. And I'm not offended at all I'm simply stating the truth.
The Sinitic civilization is way overrated and its mathematic, philosophical, and scientific accomplishments were leagues behind the Egyptians, the Greeks, the Romans, the medieval Arabs, and the Renaissance Europeans. Not to mention that the Sinitic people were quite authoritarian and actively suppressed the natives of South China. The PRC isn't an anomaly in fact it's merely a continuation of the authoritarian Sinitic dynasties of the past.
And genetically speaking Cantonese cluster with neighboring Kra-Dai and Kinh people rather than with North Chinese.
Hence if you're Cantonese then there's really no reason for you to worship the Sinitic people who might very well have enslaved and tortured your Kra-Dai ancestors and forced them to sinicize.
I’m a Cantonese speaker and it’s struck me while learning Vietnamese that we shared a lot of the same word in our daily speaking that mandarin does not have. I’m still finding how does this connection happen
I' totally supporting. Still learning. It grows inside me since kid, watching Cantonese dub Japanese anime. Still watching anime, Hong Kong dramas & films.
Anime is for kids
I miss Cantonese drama. I learned so much about life from them. And I find their language are easier to listen to ❤.
0:48 you quote 17th century for Putonghua and 220AD for Cantonese. That is almost 1500 years, not a century and a half (150 years).
Yes, I think they meant a milennium and a half, not a century and a half. It was a mistake.
My parents were from Hong Kong, and they speak Hong Kong Cantonese, and taught it to me, despite me having been born and raised in Canada. It is a highly distinct form of Cantonese different than even the other forms of Cantonese spoken in Canton Province, due to the influence of British English.
Until the 1990's many overseas Chinese communities, were vastly Cantonese speakers from Hong Kong, bringing the language to the international world and made its impact in pop culture of the age, thanks to the emergence of Chinese movie icons like Bruce Lee.
Its also important to know, that the way Cantonese in Hong Kong works, there are actually two forms, written and spoken. For example on news broadcasts, they use a very formalistic way of speaking, while in day to day conversation like shopping or talking to friends, it is a much more casual type of language.
In overseas Chinese communities like Vancouver, there is a very strong connection between Cantonese speakers, even if you do not know the person, but a sense of comradery between them, like they're from a bigger Hong Kong family.
When I go to Hong Kong, many locals are surprised at my Cantonese proficiency in conversation, despite my brain being hardwired to English pretty much since a child, and they take it as a great compliment that I respect their language.
Cantonese and Hong Kongers go together like Dim Sum and Milk Tea.
Cantonese is also a key to opening many doors of Chinese culture and history of poems, music, films etc some poems are just meant to be spoken in Cantonese and sound so much better, and the HK music and entertainment scene back in the 80s and 90s were honestly superior, the films were top notch and the humour was Cantonese specific
I would prefer Chinese Malaysian mindset. Most of them are multi-lingual. They are never stuck into this type of conversation. Many of them could speak or at least understand two or three Chinese dialects such as mandarin, Cantonese, Hakka, Teochew and Hokkien, at the same time.
I love this attitude! The more the merrier, extra feather in your cap which opens more economic opportunities for you and your family. Now who's gonna say no to that
Agreed, why limit your choices? In Malaysia, I have met Chinese who also spoke Bahasa and English, and non-Chinese who spoke flawless Cantonese or Hokkien.
Speaking Mandarin Pekingnese and Mandarin Tanshanese or Sichuan may be dialects. But Cantonese Hakka Hokkien And Mandarin are different LANGUAGES.
This is true, I'm Malaysian, not a polyglot by any means, and even I spoke 5 languages fluently by the time I was a kid.
Thanks for the video it was very helpful and interesting and informative, my late f-i-l was born in area outside of Beijing and spoke Mandarin his wife was from the South,and to listen to them speak was different. ❤😊
Great video! I learned a lot.
I found it interesting that the Spanish words for fried rice and soy sauce are more based on Cantonese. China is always tearing down the old and replacing it with something new, something they perceive to be more modern and better in their effort for national linguistic unity. Hakka and Cantonese will continue to live on abroad, just not in the mainland. Thankfully, there are polyglots and linguists that are making videos about Cantonese to preserve a historical language.
Happy that my country Peru was named in the video, I was watching this video while eating Chaufa(fried rice) which is very popular here, I didn't know that word came from cantonese dialect.
Why do you find this odd ? Cos a lot of Cantonese were sent abroad to work in the past colonial days !!! And as you could see who they were, and why really, can't you ??? And did you even read about the punti-hakka war as well ? A lot of the punti (cantonese) were killed by the hakkas.... around 1 million of them... maybe this explains why THEY were shipped abroad.. to work as coolies.. and as slaves to the international trades? Have you NOT noticed this fact ??? And do you not see why, and how come, the idea and the whole idea.. of more hakka.. and more SE Asians.. and flooding HK ???? It's like... shoo away the birds that nests in those nests, and then let somebody else rob their nests !!! This is what is going on here to be honest. Anybody with a brain would know what is going on !!!!
And the thing is, the Western world... doesn't accept this fact.. and doesn't even want to rebalance back that justice. Cos in the far future.. there isn't even a race called cantonese people, actually.
Spanish word like Pekín (Beijing) also translated from Cantonese
It’s sad because it’s taking everything special and unique about a place and destroying it. It’s the kind of mindset that the US had in the 1950s and 1960s, where historical buildings and neighborhoods were all torn down to make way for “modern” structures, highways and parking lots. The demolition of the old Penn Station in New York was one of the most tragic examples of that and was one of the catalysts for the preservation of Grand Central, which today is a major tourist attraction.
@@adnyc82 : It's funny that you mentioned that period of time, because that was also the post war period... and the USA then experienced actual Big Depression... which is what is indeed also now happening with HK as well. Just that, when the financial or the Asian financial crash happened... Japan took care, and they retreated and defended themselves, even though they were economically depressed for a long time. They stayed and managed life. Whereas South Korea was kind of in decline, but didn't... And now, the same with HK as well... The people didn't stay in HK as well.. Cos they kept wanting to go round and to keep on rotating.. but these individuals, doesn't realise that, taxes, and lockdowns.. is supposed to tie YOU to pay the taxes TO a specific land... Doing this.. ultimately basically destroys everybody.
Which is now why we have things like these lock downs... and banning tech companies.. and banning mobile phones.. and petrol... The inequality gaps are higher and higher.. And at the same time... countries are fighting even knocking out each others' satelites too ? Weird that THIS is not mentioned in the local news.. so therefore.. these comps keep on living in the bubble... the imagery media bubble...
That was very interesting. Thanks.
Y’know just listening to this video changed how I felt about Cantonese! There’s so much in this language and yet not many people talk about it!
I'm learning Cantonese, and sometimes I do get positive encouragement,
...but there's a huge culture of insults and condescending attitudes towards foreigners wishing to learn.
This severely discourages learners and further isolates the foreign communities.
Cantonese is already difficult to learn since it's largely unsystematic and arbitrary. It's almost like a language that's been designed to be secret to prevent outsiders from learning.
So please be mindful of the harm you cause to new learners, help them learn and feel welcomed.
Most Hong Kong people do not care about Cantonese. We just speak it. And some people just wanna use this as a reason to separate us from the rest of China. Cantonese is widely spoken in Guangdong and Guangxi provinces in China. So it does not represent people of Hong Kong.
Best of luck! Lo lick!
@@lchristophor3107it’s naive for you to think guangdong and guangxi still speaks Cantonese.
Asking Hongkongers to check themselves is more futile than talking to kindergarteners about bullying.
Hong Kong is extremely racist and xenophobic. Hong Kong people think they are the Whites of Asia.
all the love to Cantonese, Hakka, Teochew, Chao Shan, and all the other ethnic languages in the greater guangdong area
I don’t speak much cantonese as much I speak mandarin. But I am proud to be the one passing it down. There’s something about it. It sounds gracious. And the way it generates swear words just like a set of piano, whereby full of raw potential to be explored. Leaves behind nothing but harmony and the peasant to our ears.
You are the worst person
‘pleasant to the ears’…. 同意
Actually Mandarin can also be pleasant for example spoken by 康永 and 小S in the Taiwanese talk show, just that the people who speak it from the North speak it harshly and brashly.
Shanghainese should be preserved but more and more people from other parts of China are moving into Shanghai. You hardly hear people speak Shanghainese anymore in public. This is one dialect I plan on teaching my kids to preserve.
Long live Shanghainese.
I learned Cantonese when I was between the age of 2-3. Loved watching Cantonese language movies back in the day on VCD from Jackie Chan, Chow Yun Fat and Jet Li. Funny thing about VCDs if you put one side audio it would be in Cantonese and if you put the other side it would be in Mandarin since the audio was mono. LOL Thankfully DVD came out and everything sounded so much better in stereo.
Cantonese has evolved more quickly than other languages, incorporating English, like PK, MK, D, and swearing is unmatched
Hokkien steps in
Every time I go home to HK, I have to hit up my cousins for the newest slang.
Just how did it evolved? In comparision with japanese, that made foreign words sound japanese, cantonese simply took them without any change, so they stick out like sore thumb, as was clearly noticable in this video.
For those of us who avoid swearing, using this as a reason to learn Cantonese, is groundless and hardly encouraging.
I love Hong Kong ❤. So much friendly people there. 😊
It’s very important to preserve Cantonese and also the Chinese writing in the traditional form. Our Cantonese songs, Cantonese opera, Cantonese jokes and also the Cantonese cuisines that come with the HK’s culture. These are what make HK unique!
Can we not refer to Chinese languages as “dialects” of Chinese? A large majority of these Chinese languages have significantly less mutual intelligibility with each other than say, Spanish and Portuguese, yet no one would dare refer to Spanish and Portuguese as merely “dialects” of each other.
Agree. So irritating when hear at the beginning of this video, she said Mandarin is a dialect spoken in China 🤔, .. Cantonese is a dialect of Chinese so on and on helloooo what if someone said ok let's learn English, ya English a dialect of Germanic language 😌 and French, Spanish, Portuguese.. any dialect of Romance language... please lah don't be ignorant.
Majority of Chinese speakers in recent history spoke dialects of Mandarin. Hokkien, Cantonese and Hakka are not mainstream.
They are considered as dialects because they share the same written script so your Spanish and Portuguese example do not apply.
Whether a language is called a separate language or a dialect is a purely political question. I'm not being sarcastic here, it's simply how it works.
@@paunitka7 , this is exactly how it is. In Yougoslavia there was a common language: Serbocroatian. It was teached in schools. After the decline of Yougoslavia each of the former Yougoslave republics claimed to have an own language, i.e. Serbian, Croatian and Bosnian. They were considered dialects before.
A Serbian buddy has said: I didn't speak any foreign language and now I am fluent in 3 languages at once. 😆
I love listening to Cantonese.
Even though I don't speak it.
Mandarin sounds harsh to my ears.
Watching from Somalia.
With me its the opposite. Cantonese sounds loud. It's Cantonese speakers that have given people who are not Chinese, the impression that the Chinese like noise. Loud talking in the streets and restaurants. Loud Cantonese Opera. Loud firecrackers. People speaking out loud in Buddhist temples. Hong Kong Cinema with loud actors.
That would be a little stereotyping. Cantonese has much depth & naunces & the way you can express it. It is often deceptively subtle, by which I mean Cantonese is infamous for subtle slights & inferral which often can be understood by a true blue Cantonese that you have been insulted in the worse possible way being done with the utmost politeness & smile. Cantonese can be very cultured, soft & polish, it could also be blungeonly loud, crude & brutal. It all depends on who we are with & the context of the environment.
@@LUIS-ox1bv
Most people alive today saw the majestic and attraction of Cantonese through tvbdramas when hk pop industry was at its peak. But few people know the strongest essence of this languange go back a bit earlier to the black and white movie era. Aka your great grand or grandparents era.
Your head will spin and will be impressed by the true beauty of Cantonese languange when you truly know how to speak it and apply it in all sorts of situations.
Btw, Hong Kong population is a mix of Cantonese, Hakka, Teochew, Shanghainese. Before the British colonised Hong Kong, large groups of Hakka and Teochew lived in Hong Kong and New Territory.
They were not all Hakka. That is a lie. Many were weitou. Some were extended relatives of other regions who might be Hakka. But it does not mean that they could still pull wool over other people's eyes. Wolf in sheep's clothing springs to mind. And everybody knows who those are.
This Hong Kong mother language and should maintains it for generations to come. Once it's lost it will be very hard to get it back. Pleae HK value your Cantonese dialect.❤
It's not a "dialect" as framed by SCMP .
It's the same Cantonese spoken also in Macao and Kuangtong (Cantonese speakers)...
如果不会讲普通话，你就是以越代汉的越南人，假装自己是中国人
i'm curious why no one is talking about the other Wu languages and dialects like Shanghainese or Zhejiangnese....
why is there a huge preoccupation with the West about HK-specific Cantonese. I dont see videos or media covering the gradual loss of other mainland Chinese languages...
@@zacharycohen9985
Not really ...in regards to other Han languages. They're still spoken by Shanghai and Zhejiang natives.
West and it's al'lies preoccupation with "Cantonese" is to ferment disunity among Chinese people.
A Destabilization Op which encompass backing separatists traitors.
@@zacharycohen9985could it be the subtle decimation of the language enforced by you know who, so it appears that more effort must be put into preserving Cantonese
The unique and funky of the HK Cantonese owned characteristics is the SLANG!! There are not any modern metropolitan cities dalogue have that many slangs or swear words
Yes and no. A lot of what non-Cantonese or even Cantonese consider slangs are actually old, middle Chinese. Of course, there are many more modern slangs as time, culture, society changes over time. Some "slangs" used when I was a kid have fallen out of use, and there are many slangs, and necessary neologisms (especially of compound words) that I do not know or understand now.
You conclusion is just because you are not as familiar with other language...... BTW, no against to Cantonese slang, I like it.
@@sharp4479 so your conclusion is that you assume I'm not familiar with other languages, k bring some example that you know the language have most slangs then.
K, maybe that is a hard question for you. But for instance can you name any international actor have made famous by using slangs like Stephen Chow? See below a brief bio of Chow which "Mo Lei tau" slang become it own dialog.
**Chow is famous for creating the unique mo lei tau comedy, which means “nonsense humour”. Mo lei tau emphasises witty wordplay that consequently creates comedic effects. In the 1993 film Flirting Scholar, Chow called a cockroach, which he accidentally crushed to death, “Siu Keung” as he pretended it was his pet^^
@@CKWong-jk5st
Name any international actor have made famous by using slangs like Stephen Chow? See below a brief bio of Chow which "Mo Lei tau" slang become it own dialog.
**Chow is famous for creating the unique mo lei tau comedy, which means “nonsense humour”. Mo lei tau emphasises witty wordplay that consequently creates comedic effects. In the 1993 film Flirting Scholar, Chow called a cockroach, which he accidentally crushed to death, “Siu Keung” as he pretended it was his pet^^
Who truly cares. Is this a point of pride with Cantonese speakers? If so, its rather an odd way to root for what's great about Cantonese. Braggng that your language has more ways to curse others is nothing to brag about.
My Spanish professor is from Peru too and she teaches Spanish in CUHK. I was also surprised about the connection between the food culture in Peru and the Cantonese language.
Don't romanticise it so much that you also forget your own roots and what is going on in your community won't you ???
My Spanish tutor is also from Peru, haha, in HKU Space
100 Cantonese went over into south America. Only around 10 000 mixed race or is still Cantonese. And now, you want an entire 8 million people to kowtow towards you ? My grand dad also worked in the ships. And catered for those South American shipments etc. But you don't have settling rights. Even the house that I live in in the UK is owned by a British Lord. May it reach this way forever.
I am a theoretical linguist and a second language acquisitionist fascinated by Cantonese. Thank you so much for this video. I will be using it in my master's courses at the Hong Kong University of Science and Technology.
What SHOULD have happened, is to have the actual "National Song" to be written into the Cantonese language, and be done with. And not to force the kids to pick up the language, and not be able to sing it in their own mother tongue !!! That would have been the way. I don't even understand how come.. this big mess is like this now. And the assumption that "you NEED to do this". That is BS. You don't need to do anything, you are already a chinese !!!!
"a century and a half earlier" is 150 years, the narrator meant 1500 years earlier. 17th century - 220 AD.
Im from Malaysia, my place have Mandarin, Cantonese, Hokkien, Hakka, Malay, English. Mandarin very gentle and have that educationist vibe. Cantonese and the rest have that old vibe. When i recite old poem in Mandarin Vs Cantonese. The Cantonese always made that crazy impact. Cannot deny ~
Thank you
Cantonese is spoken in certain parts of Malaysia too!
cantonese is also so much more ingrained in the English language than Mandarin is... thanks to the immigrant laborers in the 1800's that moved to America
Ketchup: is literally cantonese
long time no see: direct translation from the Cantonese phrase
im a child of an HK immigrant myself, and really hope to be able to pass on the language to my own children someday; the langue will not be lost so easily
I agree but to be fair, Mandarin also has the exact same expression for "long time no see" which is "好久不见.“ In Cantonese, it's "好耐冇見" they're literally the exact same meaning but just with the use of different words, since both languages often use different vocabulary for words of the same meaning (and often don't!).
??, they are the same word the only difference is one is traditional and the other is simplified.@@deskclerk
@@kimeli 久 and 不 are two different words from 耐 and 冇. The only character that has two different forms here between traditional and simplified is 见 which is the simplified form, while 見 is the traditional form.
@@deskclerk不 is not use for ‘no’ in spoken form but unless we pair it with another word like 不過
How could it be possible for there to only be one century between 220AD and the 17th century? I think you meant more than one and a half millennia earlier
When a "standard dialect" is chosen, it gives advantage to those already speaking it, whereas those who speak a very different dialect (language) would have to learn and code switch, and may be mocked for not speaking the standard dialect well enough, hence the disgruntlement because of power asymmetry.
If they had created a new dialect based on all dialects which is equally different from all native speakers, this would detach the "power asymmetry" inherent in the chosen language, and easier to be adopted as a unifying tool of communication.
The video is wrongly made, cos it does not reflect or match that of the chinese language at all.... and there isn't anybody of the actual significance to say such things either. Or the correct angle. This is why, you see Taiwan being so successful and yet, you don't see the same thing here in HK ??? Mandarin was and is meant to be a subset of the actual chinese language. Some of the language and the people from the North isn't Chinese... that is why, they are now using that Eight Nation notion.. to topple the final individuals that are chinese? Why ? Because some people decided to use other countries' money or resources, such that, they cannot kowtow but to give away their own daughter to marry into China, so that one day. It is not chinese any more? A New Dawn arise ????
This is what had been done in Yougoslavia. There they had unified the dialects into "Serbocroatian language". It was teached in schools. But look what happened in the 1990s: Each of the newly separated states on former Yougoslavia soil has been claiming to posses an own language: Serbian, Croatian and Bosnian. Despite the international linguists' community said that this is not true but that there is a South Slavic language continuum instead they insist to "have a right to have on an own language". So what is a "mother tongue" and what is a dialect is mostly not a question of science but of political will.
But I agree with you that not native speakers have a disadvantage against native speakers. We felt it in East Germany where Russian was the common language in all of the Eastern block organizations. The Russians automatically had the leading positions even when they were not in the leading position formally. They always could communicate among each other easily and thus could make decisions before the question was discussed in the official committees.
Today it is similar with the English language. As an English native you can easily work everywhere in the world. It is much more difficult when your knowledge is based on scholastic English.
I can imagine that Cantonese speakers feel the same discomfort and therefor it is some kind of a reaction of defiance to insist on the "mother tongue".
Yeah just like in the philippines, it's disgusting.
The people in those so-called state councils need their heads banging together. Or sacked. When they see other countries are run by their own people and yet China wants other foreigners to run their own land. I find that a big laugh.
See dddd
I want to hear more Cantonese. It is beautiful.
no its not, out of the big 3, cantonese is the worse sounding.
@@kimelinope, it is much much better than mandarin.
@@jamielovesmile they both sound awesome.
The real question should be why do HKers care so much about Cantonese *now*?
Back in the days before '97, Cantonese was for verbal conversations only and hardly anyone would write in the Cantonese form of Chinese at all.
This
Just like how they suddenly cared so much about elections after the British left
Perhaps because they feel it is under threat, so out of stubbornness they focus on it more.
@@pjacobsen1000 That's strange though, because they had no problem stamping out all other Chinese dialects in HK
@@AgakAgakEngineer The main language in HK is Cantonese, so perhaps migrants into the city just adopted the language of the city. 'Stamping out'? Are you saying there was a concerted effort to eliminate other dialects? By who?
@@pjacobsen1000 People in HK came from all over China, so there were actually many dialects spoken in HK, cantonese was just one of them
I speak Cantonese primarily and this is very important to me because its part of my uniqueness and my identity. Without Chinese, I'm nothing. This is my POV. Thank you for posting this video
lesson learned from many families in Guangxi and Guangdong today, many young people don’t speak Canto at all, they already lost their root language.
Not so lost when they need to communicate with their elders.
but most speak their local language, then need to learn Mandarin and English in school.
I love Cantonese
Yes, such a beautiful chinese language
There are problems with the video. At 0:50 it says Cantonese came a century and a half earlier (150 years). I think you meant a millennium and a half earlier (1500 years)
I caught that also. I began scrolling to see if someone else saw that error.
🧡💯✍️ .....i just found out recently Cantonese is about 2000yrs old....and Mandarin was ajusted in Beijing only about 100yrs old🤠🤠
@1:10 technically there are 5 tones when you include the neutral tone, some can even argue there are 7 tones in Mandarin. Interestingly I find myself able to understand a bit more of the Wu dialect than Cantonese, coming from Taiwan. It is beautiful that people are preserving the Cantonese dialect. As languages evolves over time, how people speak in the future might be different from how we speak now.
Outside of HK, probably only KL city, malaysia where cantonese is highly appreciated and used quite widely.
KL may have more cantonese speakers grouped tightly together but cantonese is still widely spoken in almost every major chinese diaspora
and probably Canto-speaking second generation Chinese living in the west.
I dare say Malay is probably spoken way more than Cantonese worldwide, its all in the numbers really
香港人加油!! 🇭🇰🇭🇰
Interesting that now Hong Kong people seems to care so much about Cantonese as if all of their ancestors have been speaking this language for thousands of years. And while about 60 years ago, many of their parents or grandparents came to Hong Kong from totally different regions with different dialects, such as Teochew, Hakka, Shanghai, northern China, etc.
Actually I speak Cantonese and enjoy Hong Kong movie with original cantonese audio track more than the mandarin version. But I just feel really weird that some Hong Kong people just kinda forgot their family background, and only consider "Cantonese" as their culture.
You are speaking to a netizens me. Whose ancestors were elites in HK before you foreigners moved in. Before migrants moved in. When you talk about corruption and that kind of bs. Sorry it does not include you ??? The official government name for HK was actually Sun On. You did not know this, did you ? It should indeed finally be accepted as this actually. The city is running down a trajectory that is getting worst and worst.... this is not about language. This is about political power and legitimacy.
The more I realised this... why NSL seems to be suppressing them. Cos they have never used media properly or formally portray what they want to say or come across. I cannot imagine how annoying it might be for the 1.4 billion citizens over the border to be seen to make such big assumptions... The translation angle or the piece written by scmp here isn't entirely correct. Cos frankly I expected an actual HK paper to guard the angle from HK itself than to generalise as well. The viewer doesn't know the history of the SE Asian readers or the history of those countries. So the starting point is kind of pointless ? You don't see this in the USA or in Europe. They always refer back to their history. But it is clear that HK doesn't. And lots of rootless migrants tend to run into HK for its money which I find surprising.
Check your fact! Majority of HKers grew up in Cantonese speaking families. Cantonese has been the dominant language in HK.
To me , a Dutch man, guangdong hua is the most beautiful language in the world. If I hear it it reminds me of one of the happiest times of my life. Living in Hong Kong. It also,reminds me of,the thousands of kung fu movies I’ve seen
Essentially, this is the way Hong Konger to show they are not “Chinese”. In Britain, there are many dialects but kids all learn standard English at School.
So ? Britain speaks English cos the Scottish King gave given his land and people to the English Queen. And promises were made etc on this. They signed a contract. Nobody has given away HK..... When Carrie Lam.. whose maiden name was Cheng... some people say that she is her family is the earliest settlers in HK. Hence she should rule. But those earliest were not Chinese. They were a Muslim. So this is why UK steps in cos they say that it was anti Muslim within the prc. I never clicked on this but the media now white washed it all.. cos china stepped out to say loudly that they are against radicalisation and terrorism. I.e. Muslims converting Chinese. So you are implying that Malaysian which is a Muslim state ought to actually be bulldoze over HK and absorb it as part of it's empire? Watch the fireworks fly off !!!!!! And now the media plays the other advocate and says that mainlandisation is happening. Sorry but please kick out other SE Asians from HK please. Kick them out. HK chief exec should revoke HK Id cards one by one and comb through their family tree. Check by DNA. Sorry but they should. No wonder I was beaten to a pulp by Fuijianese aka Malaysian in the UK too. Scary thing this has started across the globe....
@@MeiinUK I don’t see how it is relevant. There are many dialects even in England, but school still teach standard English. The Irish choose to speak English despite their history with Britain.
@@user-rt6ip4kb1i: This is about HK's soveignty.
@@MeiinUK The Welsh Language (Wales) Measure 2011 gave the Welsh language official status in Wales in the United Kingdom. Welsh and English are de jure official languages of the Welsh Parliament, the Senedd, with Welsh being the only de jure official language in any part of the United Kingdom, with English being de facto official.
@@RaymondHng : Oh wow... I never knew that at all ! So it is now official and locked into an actual parliament. So how come actually Cantonese and English was supposed to be part of the Basic Law as well.. and this has changed ?? And this kind of "grab a politics" kicked in ? Why is this happening to HK ?????.....
I'm Cantonese living in HK. Don't care so much about Cantonese myself, just a dialect that I happen to speak.
exactly, life is more than language. language is just a means to communicate.
I live in Kuala Lumpur Malaysia and I'm proud to speak Cantonese.
I love Cantonese sound watching Hong Kong movies as a kid. It also sounds similar to my mother tongue Vietnamese. Last but not least, many Chinese immigrants in South east Asia where I lived, worked and travels are Cantonese
The Hong Kong people is proud of Cantonese. They still speak this language regardless of whether they are in Singapore, Malaysia, China and USA and Canada. No right or wrong.
I'm a Singaporean Cantonese, very proud of my heritage.
The same problem in India..Hindi language is spreading across South part of india..
South people don't speak Hindi..
South states are 4 ..4 different languages...
There are 22 official languages in India...
More than 22 languages in India actually...
My mother tongue is Telugu..I can speak English very little..
I can read Hindi, write Hindi but can't understand ..
North part of India mostly speak Hindi, Eventhough each state of North India have their own language...
It's a Chaos....
I don't understand what prime minister of India, parliament disscussions says in parliament every time.. because of i can't understand Hindi...
I knew what he says through English translation..
I speak broken Cantonese and proud of it! My grandma taught me! Miss you grandma! RIP!
It is essential to not only retain but to promote Cantonese. It is a very rich and deep language, full of nuances and cultural history (swearwords apart.) Mandarin is so different, more "modern". Chinese is not easy to learn whatever language you learn. On this point, we ought to keep all our different languages. Imagine, if you speak a tongue and it's being blocked or banned.
Putonhua (Mandarin) is not "modern". It has been spoken widely through the ages. I am sure neither the HK government, nor the Chinese Mainland Governments, are banning or blocking Cantonese from being spoken or taught. If you visit China, you will realize the vast numbers of dialects spoken there.
The point is that some individuals are trying to discriminate and/or attack others on a personal level when they dictate that you could have the right to property and to have a family in HK. And inside the PRC. This.. is stopping people from working to get a job and to survive cos they just changed the Cantonese words . So that means what.. you are cutting off somebody from being themselves ?????? All products and all trades have now changed from Cantonese ? People buy the wrong things ? People eat poisons cos their names and translation went wrong ???!!!.... What you were taught before has affected your contracts ?? And you are no longer understanding your sectors and more ?
@@jademoon1530
Hokkien is the oldest Chinese language. Cantonese is about 2000 years old and is spoken in southeastern China. Mandarin is the youngest Chinese language, the language came after the collapse of the Song dynasty during the Middle Chinese period. Cantonese and Mandarin are actually entirely different languages. Calling Cantonese a dialect is just like calling Sanskrit a dialect of Hindi. Or Latin is a dialect of Greek...
You need to study history. It's conventional to refer to the many Chinese languages as dialects in the "vernacular" of white people, but technically, they are different languages.
Why Cantonese specifically? What makes it so special than other languages in China that, it absolutely needs the special treatment?
Not only and specifically Cantonese. I feel that all languages and dialects ought to be used and spoken without impositions or prejudice.
Dear SCMP,
You might want to do more research into the origins of Mandarin before committing to the proposition that Mandarin emerged during the Qing dynasty. Various forms of “Mandarin” were already spoken in Northern China during the warring state period, most noticeably among the northern kingdoms. It began to coalesce during the Han/Tang dynasties when focus was shifted towards countering the northern nomadic tribes which continued into the late Song dynasty. It solidified as formal court language when the Yuan dynasty established Beijing as its capital and even more so when the Ming dynasty relocated its capital from Nanjing to Beijing and then continued by the Qing dynasty.
Just as Cantonese is an amalgamation of local southern dialects, Mandarin itself is an amalgamation of local northern Chinese dialects AND the linguistic influence brought in by officials from ALL over China after they passed the imperial exams and are posted to the northern imperial court. It was the language of the court mandarins which people outside the Forbidden City would’ve have trouble understanding. The Beijing dialect was actually very different from Mandarin and only through supplying and selling to the court over the centuries that Mandarin percolated into the wider local population then later through modern technological communication.
Also note that Cantonese is NOT the only southern dialect in Guangzhou, when there are tens if not hundreds other Guangzhou dialects with distinct variations from valley to valley, ie Toishanese etc. Cantonese gained prominence primarily because of British colonial and media policies, Hong Kong’s media ecosystem since the 1950’s and the ready consume market among the wider Chinese diaspora.
Um what about Cantonese prominence in Guangzhou where the language is centered - not HK? This had nothing to do with the Brits. What about diaspora Cantonese throughout the world as a result of famine caused by the CCP - again nothing to do with the Brits.
@@Obscurai well, clearly you need to consider cause and effects. Consider the branching of a decision tree and how one decision made can branch into multiple consequences, both intended and unintended. HK was a British colony, clearly any decision made by the HK colonial government has subsequent intended AND unintended consequences, like failure to implement local democracy from the onset rather than only AFTER withdrawal agreement was struck with the PRC. Or never having HK represented by a HK Member of Parliament in the British parliament ;)
@@revilogo Blah blah blah. My Cantonese language skills is not affected by the whatever the Brits did.
Clearly, you are into conflating issues for an agenda since you keep bringing up the Brits. My parents are from Zhongshan (another Cantonese city in China) and nothing to do with HK.
I suggest you keep you inflammatory comments to yourself.
@@Obscurai 🙄
Clearly if the British colonial government had chosen Toishanese as the working language for HK schools etc, HK people today would still be speaking Cantonese as lingua franca in everyday life. ;)
I hope they won't make all three languages mandatory in school. It'll create even more stress in the already stressful school environment.
That's the dilemma. If all three can't all be mandatory, which will? You see, this trend of expecting children to be less multilingual is what's killing many languages. Speaking three languages IN Hong Kong is the norm and children in that environment will not be struggling knowing all three. There are other areas that would even have more languages. Only areas where the most "powerful" languages originate have frustratingly urban-lead monolingual phenomena.
@@xarifa777 agree!
Come to think of it, most malaysian chinese are so versatile in speaking different languages to different people 🤭 maybe not all are masters, but at least passable. Some also can speak foreign language like Japanese, Korean, Thai, Spanish, French etc
They should purge mandarin.
@@xarifa777 : You guys cannot speak any of those fluently ? Sorry, but you don't ? And can't ? And doesn't even know the laws and the languages as well? And this is why the argument rises... cos you "explain" and yet you don't even understand what you just agreed to contractually.. and everything else... ??? There is no honor in your word. At all. And because you just did that, you are scapegoating.. fighting... attack... and the rest...
It don't matter really. Kids will be better off if we make it mandatory. I grew up in a Shanghaiese family. I went to primary school at a Mandarin only school. Then I went to an English only secondary school. So now I speak 4 languages and a little German.
Cantonese is the real Chinese language officially.
The caption is being disrespectful to them.
To them their language is a part of their culture and heritage of course they care about it. And also it is natural for any language speaker to want to know and understand what they are talking about and to correctly pronounce out the words one speak and write.
the video says mandarin originated from the Qing dynasty in the 17th century then went on to say that Cantonese originated a century and a half earlier in 220ad after the fall of the Han dynasty. apparently to SCMP, 220ad to 1700ad is only one and a half century long. Goes to show that the person who wrote this, the person who narrated this and the person who edited this has very little idea about Chinese history.
220 AD to 1220 AD to 1700 is 1500 years !
a century and a half is 150 not 1500.@@yanliew4027
Correct.
As a Malaysian, i really need to thank tvb for teaching me Cantonese hahaha.
Need to preserve these dialects - it is part of history. Plain and simple IMHO.
I am a Malaysian but I speak Cantonese. Usable in Hong Kong too. Truly a beautiful dialect.
Sun Yat Sen was Cantonese!
After some wiki, thanks to you I also learnt that Sun Yat Sen's brother went to Hawaii at 17 and from a struggling vegetable gardener to a captain of industry in Maui. I'm extraordinary impressed, and he liquidated his business empire to support his brother's overthrow of the Qing Dynasty. Now that's some moving history right there.
An HK without Cantonese is an HK without its soul... That would be pointless...
I'm from Guangdong province, but I was raised in the caribbean watching Hong Kong ent so I only understand Cantonese as my friends also spoke that. When i went back to Guangzhou in recent years, I'm surprised to find ppl living in the Cantonn province actually can't speak cantonese, which is weird.
There are a lot of videos about this action. Most kids turned adults are now broken beyond belief.... this is how you turned somebody into an evil ghost.
@MeiinUK what does that even means?
@@minwoo15: Ahhh.. if you understood Cantonese then you would know what I mean when I directly translated the proverb. To be a ghost means being evil. Evil in a situation that doesn't require any personal jabbings. No point in jabbing one another. Stick to the topic and not to the person.
@minwoo15 For the younger generation, most likely because the schools there only teach Mandarin now.
It's ridiculous that they have had to discuss about the choice of their official language/linguistic heritage.
Hong Kong is Cantonese.
i call the big one, 'bitey'
Learn Mandarin Chinese as a lingua franca like we learn English to communicate with rest of the world, and use Cantonese as a preservation while communicating with the local community in Guangdong area. Being trilingual is amazing.
But one day there might not be any Cantonese left in Guangdong or Hong Kong if the kids growing up are not learning it in school and don't use it to communicate often. That is already occuring in Guangzhou, Hong Kong is next to follow.
I have absolutely no desire to learn Mandarin.I tried studying it, but I found it tedious.Regional languages like Cantonese, Wu, Hakka, etc. are a lot more fun and far more organic.
@@Bunnyroo7what about Mandarin is tedious?
@@anjelynn7314 Standard Mandarin is a lot like High German. It's very logical and straightforward once you figure out how it works. At least for me, both are cold languages. Because of that, I had a hard time really getting into Mandarin.
1997 marked the end of Cantonese - Just like the HK music and film industries.
Nope, it's still bustling.
Please google search and read the below topic in Quora by Alan Watson :
What is the truth of Mandarin?
The truth of Mandarin: the clumsy Chinese spoken by Manchus
About author: Jin Qicong (1918-2004), Manchu, former chancellor of Liaoning Institute of Nationality Studies, professor, chief editor of magazine Manchus Research, well-known expert of Jurchen, Manchu’s studies, Qing history and Mongolian history. His original surname, given name and styled name are Aisin-Gioro, Qicong and Lu Chong respectively. He’s the seventh generation of the fifth son Prince Rong of the First Rank of Qing Emperor Qianlong. His great great grandma was the Qing famous female of literary abilities Gu Taiqing. His father Jin Guangping was a notable scholar of Jurchen and Manchu.
We all know Japanese people speak English clumsily. If Japanese ruled Britain, then the clumsy Japanese English would become the universal language spoken across the world. Though this analogy may seem ridiculous, something similar just happened in China. Mandarin, which is now the common language of China, is essentially the Chinese language Mongols, Xianbei people, Jurchens and other nomads learnt and spoke clumsily. Only when they became the ruling party of China, the clumsy Chinese they spoke became Mandarin, the national language.
作为一个从小接受普通话教育的上海乡下人，在学校教学使用普通话，在家里讲本地话，上海话是在大学阶段和同寝室的上海市区人那里学来的，现在基本上工作中碰到上海人讲上海话，外地的讲普通话，并不存在什么障碍，也不存在什么上海话不会讲的情况。自己的小孩现在可以听懂本地话，上海话，因为在家里还是本地话，上海话讲的多，但是她平时多数讲普通话，不太愿意讲上海话，但是我觉得这个不是问题，随着年龄的增长，随着对于自己上海人身份的认同，也会自然愿意去说上海话，因为我的心路历程就是这样。
你識用上海背誦詩經、楚辭、史記、出師表、唐宋古文、唐詩宋詩嗎？見到中文字你會用上海話念嗎？有用上海話創作的電影、電視劇、流行曲嗎？
@@benjamin.0623 上海属于吴语地区，用上海话去背诵诗经，出师表这种本来就就是很别扭的，就像用上海话去读普通话的文章，有些用词根本是不一样的。就像用闽南话，粤语去读这些古代的诗集肯定也是不可能完全和文字一致的。见到中文字用上海话念是很常见的，特别是一些路名。地标之类的。用上海话创作的电视剧一直都有，以前的《孽债》《老娘舅》《开心茶坊》这些你去搜一下就能搜到，流行曲虽然不多但也有，比如上海地区的王厂长；电影虽然没有其完全用上海话的，但是有很多电影里面都会出现上海话的对白，比如今年的《无名》，虽然只有王传君说的比较地道。不要以为地方语言在国内都被压制，上海的电台有专门的提倡沪语的沪语节目。新疆，内蒙，西藏的电视台有自己语言的的综艺节目，每个地方都在维护自己的地方方言。这些地方的语言也没有因为普通话的推广而消失。只要自己热爱自己生活的土地，方言就不会消失。方言最大的教育基地就是自己的家庭。
@@andachen7473 用自己語言讀古書何別扭之有？自古言文分立，閩南語、粵語與古文不完全一致，但不影響今人用閩南語、粵語誦讀古文。難道普通話又與古文一致？我腦中的詩詞全是粵語記誦，不獨我如此，而是代代粵人皆如此。由梁啟超到唐滌生、黃霑到林夕，皆以粵語思考、粵語創作。母語家裏學，結果就是學生只能用母語閒話家常，不能用母語來傳承文化、討論學術或其他高深話題，母語功能全面縮小。我成長於粵語家庭，但家人從未亦不識用粵語教我讀詩經楚辭、討論哲學、歷史、經濟等。凡此種種，皆由學校所教。若學校不以粵語教學，整整一代人之母語水平將全面退化。
@@benjamin.0623 沪语可以读，但是很多诗词你用沪语读出来并不押韵，也无美感，甚至别扭。你不要只想着你粤语可以读，全国方言众多，而且有很多少数民族的语言甚至根本不能对着汉字一对一的读出来。而且从国家的角度来说，你们都用方言来进行学术讨论，高深话题的讨论，那么你怎么和其他国内其他地区的人进行交流。语言学习是需要环境的，毕竟如果把普通话作为和英语一样的方式来教学，甚至只是作为选修课的话。那么你看看国内大家的普遍的英语水平，新疆或者西藏老一辈的普通话水平或者香港人之前的普通话水平。你觉得这种水平能做到互相之间充分有效的沟通么。国内不同省份的人都用自己的方言进行沟通，你怎么去不同的省份工作，去生活。我在广东工作但是我说上海话，你们全都说粤语，是你们学上海话呢还是我学广东话呢。香港人去深圳玩，深圳地区湖南人特别多，你不会普通话连问个路都难。秦始皇最大的功绩之一就是统一了文字，统一的语言是维系一个国家凝聚力最重要的手段。
@@andachen7473 如果你生於元朝的漢人，一定十分贊使用蒙古語作為傳承文化的語言及文字，又方便全蒙古帝國國民溝通。
As Indonesian who grew up watching hongkong movies in the 90's, cantonese and hakka languages were more familiar to me than mandarin.
Cantonese speakers in Hong Kong: Save Cantonese
Also Cantonese speakers in Hong Kong: Lets keep littering random English words in our sentences in place of Cantonese words!
😂😂😂
As a person who speaks both languages from a young age, the worst thing you can do is to mix languages like this. And it just makes them sound pretentious especially since most of them don't speak English well
I been wondering what really happened to Cantonese language last 2012 during my youth and school years ago I been wanting to learn and know what why and how come there are different languages in China during my high school years especially my Hmong (Laotian) teacher didn't teach or tell me the main reason or others to is there something happened to China as they're all from that time ago will not speak multiple languages anymore and sticking with one than making it difficult on each and every people in China as Beijing I knew it that they only speaking Mandarin but not Cantonese unless if they are allowed to speak both in cases some might move to or other people from different nations as Western I saw in Karate kid as Jackie Chan movie that I been wondering why there's Western people comes and goes to neither visiting or wanted to stayed there to residents and support as this video shows some helps with English literature and languages while their own people does 2 languages Cantonese and Mandarin. I would like to learn and even know what and how to speak in from of their homeland someday in the future hoping covid states are and will be cleared eventually I mean
We must preserve the ancient Chinese Cantonese language...Mandarin is the Northern barbarian language which was forced onto the Hans by the Manchus...remember the saying overthrow the Ching and reinstate the Ming...the Manchus have won with their Mandarin language😢
Nonsense.
Each dialect , nomatter where they are, small or large should be respected and protected ! That's the bottomline.
What a ridiculous question. Why do French people care so much about the French language?
Why do Germans care about German?
The real question is..why is Beijing so obsessed with stamping out Cantonese culture?
Beijing wants to put Hong Kong Cantonese in its subordinate place because it symbolizes the colonial, democratic heritage of the British,
the best hong kong person is-tony leuong. i want to see more of him
It's the uniqueness of China for having so many different dialects. They are free to make Mandarin the general language but they should not abolish the dialects. Both can exist together.
Why? Abolish is the way to get rid of unable to understand
@@MultiverseRaidenClan You can easily get rid if that by just teaching mandarin at schools from a young age while letting them use regional varieties in social contexts. Multilingualism is a thing and it's very easy for children to pick up multiple languages.
@@possiblyijt7400why is minnan an ethnic
@@MultiverseRaidenClan Minnan (I'm thinking of Hokkien) isn't an ethnic minority but linguists generally consider it to be a distinct language from Mandarin.
btw cantonese speakers don't always consider it a 'dialect'. some of them is of the opinion that cantonese is a language in its own right.