Sharpening Convex on KME System (Fallkniven F1, Convex Rod)
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- čas přidán 29. 07. 2019
- cedric-ada-store.creator-spri...
Good gravy its bricky on things
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Sweet, perfect timing! Looks like you know your way around a slightly bent rod pretty well...😂
Heha
Love your attitude Peter, I've always been one to take your videos, advice, data, and help for exactly what it is. I hate that you always have to tell people that you aren't trying to be an expert, and that you're just doing what you do.
Thanx for being you, and all that you have done for the community
Yes!
The centering and chord line of the curve!!
Excellent use of geometry, and only the SECOND video on clamp systems that I have seen that have incorporated the geometry into the setup, convex, saber, micro bevel all edges benefit immensely from that simple set!
Well done and subscribed.
My lansky also has (Had) difficulties gripping certain knifes, I used to tighten it down to an uncomfortable level to get it to not move.
But this was all fixed when I used a hot glue gun and a clamp to create two thin hot glue sheets that grip like a MF with even the lightest pressure.
these sheets can be reused untill they are covered in dust from stone and steel from knife.
It extended the life of my lansky clamp
The diversity in technique and philosophy in sharpening is remarkable... thanks for sharing!
That explains why I messed up my bark river. I didn’t put it in the clamp like you. I just put it in like a regular knife. Thanks for sharing pete
Thank you for your effort and time. One of my favourite channels😃
Awesome vid. Still awake here in the US and saw you uploaded another vid!
Breaking new ground again Pete. You're effort is appreciated.
Personally, I don’t care how anyone sharpens their knives, what shoes they wear, or what brand TP they wipe their ass with; however, learning to freehand a convex knife is very easy, enjoyable, and may just be your gateway into becoming a master sharpener.
I encourage everyone to give it a go! You have nothing to lose and will very likely get it after only a few times.
Edit: reason- in this age of machines and gadgets for just about everything it’s nice to get back to basics, learn a real skill and become more self reliant. Don’t fear what you don’t know, instead just dive in head first and learn as you go.
;)
Wolf H make a video would love to see
@Richard Davis
Typo
;)
Any tips then?
@@mungo75
Cliff Stamp’s forum. Search it. There’s tons of info there. Join it and get in conversation with them and ask questions. Very friendly and great guys. It’s not like other blade forums at all. It’s small, slow-ish and has a wealth of info.
@@Wolf_K Thanks, I'll have a look. I've got a guided system, but always looking to get better at freehand.
Thanks man. I truly believe that The convex rod is a great addition to any KME system.
Love that final throw into "The Stump" a la AKB!
I have a Lansky and get very good results with it, I am thinking of whether to just buy a stand for it or go straight to the KME.
Some friends suggest going straight to the Wicked Edge though but I don't have that kind of dough.
Forget the sugar! Strawberries and metal flake is my favorite! Nice job Pete!
2:15 That spot he missed with the Sharpie is literally going to haunt me.
Nice dude, you have been an uploading beast lately. I ordered one of these awhile back and delivery left it on my porch and some asshat stole it before I got home, lol. I just hope when he opened it he thought "WTF is this thing?!" Meh, life goes on.
I free-hand sharpen
.... because i couldn't afford a KME system.
In all seriousness, I had an old lansky system back when I though the Gerber Bear Grylls AO knife was a "really nice knife". That said, I couldn't sharpen diddly with it because i was inexperienced. When I started looking for ceramic, diamond, and cbn abrasives, I couldn't afford a guided system, so I bargain-shopped and ended up with a couple of the small spyderco ceramics and some small DMT plates. I had to practice and practice, but now I can get a pretty decent shaving edge on s110v and maxamet.
Guided or not, the key is to know your tools and understand the fundamentals. I've learned a lot watching this channel, along with some others like Micheal Christy, BBB, etc., and watching you guys sharpen knives to ridiculous levels and taking the time to show the process and explain what you are doing has been invaluable to my growth in sharpening skills. Thank you!
I had to watch a Ford trucks ad before I could watch your video. You've made it man! They bought the uncle Randy bit!
I gave convexing a go on the lanskyjig about 15 years ago.. Apexed about 20 degrees, upped to 21 and then a few at 22.. Then a soft compounded leather pad at 21 to blend the phases.. Looked good with little metal lost
I really enjoyed the cutting montage at the end, especially the sponge cutting
Yeah. I'd never seen it before but makes so much sense since its so soft and flexible...not at all dense.
LOVED the Sax music @ the end 👍
I really appreciated this video. I am just learning the KME, but will be sharpening my F1 in the future, so this information is really helpful. Thanks -
I just watched a video on convex blade sharpening done by KME and there are 2 differences they present. First is that you sharpen the blade by only going away from the edge. The second thing is that the stop is supposed to be used to prevent the stone from running up onto the blade and scratching it, so it goes on the same side of the guide as the stone carrier. Here is the video: czcams.com/video/NnKAatK42uI/video.html
Great video. I need to order the convex rod for my kme to sharpen my crk large sebenza 21 and umnumzaan since they are convexed edges. Only suggestion I'd make is to do the initial sharpie removal test with the 1500 grit stone. If the angle isn't correct, you won't be removing much material as if you use your lower grit stone to test. I've been using the 6 and 3 micron lapping films to get a mirror edge but recently got the 1.5 and .5 kangaroo strops and emulsion to refine the polish even further (sharpening OCD!), lol. I couldn't quite see, but I got the screw on ball for the stone holder which makes the whole process a little easier on my hand, less fatigue. I have the spyderco sharpmaker which is good for touch ups but nowhere near as precise as the kme. I had bought the Lansky but returned it because I found it to be a real pita. KME has definitely been worth the money for me. I don't have the steadiest hands so free hand is out for me. I really laughed when you talked about the free hander eliteism. Do what works for you! Love your content, it's informative and your personality makes it fun as well.
Gotta say, I’m jealous of your base! Mine is very monotone and you can tell it’s three different chunks composited together but yours looks nice, you know, for a square piece of wood😂
I absolutely love the F1.. got the CoS version and i cannot imagine a better companion in the wild. I sharpen on waterstones (1000/6000/12000) then i strop on a soft strop with 1 micron paste. Its important to loosen your wrist while sharpening convex on waterstones to form a natural curve
It may be as with cars, some could change gears by them self, other are dependant on automatic gear change and these how have an hired driver. All depends on training and dedication. Some want to master sharpening, others just want sharp knives, without too much fuss. But this is knifesharpening nerdvana. Lovely to watch.
Hey Pete! You gotta upgrade your knob on that stone carrier. Makes a world of a difference. Take the stone carrier to a hardware store and go to their little plastic threaded knobs and see what you can find. Trust me, so much better. I use a round one. I also have a small one for the angle selector that I found. Easier on your fingers and much more control with the stone carrier round or tapered knob. I tried both and like a 1 1/4" or 1 1/8th" round knob. I think the threaded hole and screw part is 1/4" and a coarse thread
Awesome video so far. Can you do longer kitchen knives and such on this?
Ps, with the cbn application to the strops, start rubbing from the fine one and go to the next coarsest one. Then you only dirty one finger.
Great video, I like the F1 and never thought about bending the rod to get a convex edge. However I missed your verbal final conclusion. You seem to be happy with the result, but I have no clue how this results compares with your regular way of sharpening. Could you add that please.
i just strop after every use. i have so many knives in my rotation i only sharpen if i get a chip in the blade. great video.
Luckyyyyyyyyyy
I have a KME... still on the fence about liking the convexing rod. Because of needing to work the stone completely top to bottom evenly along the entire edge I find that the time it takes to get a really even looking grind just takes an excruciatingly long time.
Flip side, if I just want to give a random knife a few swipes on a strop, the convex rod can remove the necessity of needing to dial in the exact angle of the edge... not something I do often, but a useful time saver on occasion.
Based on kme the stop collar is actually meant to stop you from coming to high into the edge, not to stop you falling off. And it's that last little bit of the stone before you fall off that's actually hitting the apex
I use two on mine one to stop in stroke and one to stop out stroke.
Good video though. I've only used the kme convex to turn normal flat grind into a more convex edge and on axes using the axe attachment. Was curious to see how it does on a full convex edge
Interesting video :-/
Two comments:
1) RE: 6:10 in video
If you reposition stone high/mid/low, position relative to blade, while using angle finder you will be able to see overall range of convexity of stone relative to blade (to give you an idea of resultant grind).
2) RE: 3:15 in video
The positioning you are using in clamp is the reason your visible secondary appears to be wider nearing tip. By angling the blade in the clamp at an angle (a line bisecting ricasso to tip illustrated in your video with your steel rod) , as opposed to parallel (clamp jaws parallel to blade) you are creating a condition where the resultant edge bevel angle is the same at the ricaso and the tip (and somewhat lower in the belly section transition) because the blade-stock progressively gets thicker near the tip, an equal bevel angle will be wider (appears wider). Example: cut a 2" thick piece of wood at 45° and compare a 2.5" thick piece of wood cut at same 45° angle. The thicker piece of woods bevel will be wider, same as thicker portion of blade-stock of your knife as you progress towards spine (thickening portion belly to tip climbing up stock towards spine).
If you were to position blade in clamp with blade parallel to clamp, so as to allow tip to be positioned closer to parallel lines of clamp jaws and stone arm pivot a couple different things would occur. The stone would provide a constant grinding angle in the flat portion blades edge, and the angle would gradually increase from belly transition up to the tip. This would create a progressively steeper (stronger) angle in the area of the blade where the blade-stock is getting thicker, somewhat counteracting the effects of thickening blade stock and constant grind angle as referenced in varying stock thickness above.
I believe this relatively new (last 3 years or so) procedure of positioning the blade at an angle to clamp (line bisecting ricasso/tip & line of front edge of clamp has been born if folks not fully understanding how varying blade stock thickness along edge relates to visual bevel width and how this relates to actual resultant grind angle.
I can remember how everyone was arguing about how grind angle changes on a guided system from simply moving the stone Left/Right ... NOT, and the bogus SimpleLife video that demonstrated/parroted this as fact (totally misguided). Link to a video response I did to SimpleLife (read my video comments). I belive he deleted his video shortly after my video response and/or posted a disclaimer that his video was WRONG).
Knife Sharpener Jig Debate - Left(Right Angle Change
czcams.com/video/4u1xhuRIWlo/video.html
Hopefully something useful here ;-)
Thank you for the video. I am also a KME user. What causes those scratches on the surface of the blade? I've learned to mask my blades with shipping tape.
It’d be interesting to see a comparison between standard KME edges and convexed ones. Any plans to incorporate this into future steel test?
Sand paper on a mouse pad is much cheaper. Highly effective too
Have you tried the convex extension to your kadet?
A weird counterintuitive thing that is hard to visualise is that when positioning the knife in the clamp you don't need to include the straight part of the edge. The angle will remain constant across the straight section. The channel "Simple Little Life" did a couple videos on this. So, the way I do it is to find each end of the belly (one end is usally the tip if there isn't a short straight section before the tip) and draw a dot on the edge at these two points. Next, draw a line between those two dots. Now, find the center point of that line and draw another line at right angles from that point toward the spine of the knife. Place knife in jig keeping the last line centered in the jig and at right angles. I'm pretty sure this technique is the best way to minimise variation in angle/bevel depth along the edge. It is a bit less stright forward on knives where the belly doesn't maintain a constant curve, and you may have to make a bit of an estimation to bias your centering toward the steeper part of the belly. The straighter the belly the less it matters.
@@sheltermonkey6065 That's what you would think, watch the Simple Little Life video where he sets up the string lines, like I said, it is counterintuitive.
@@sheltermonkey6065 czcams.com/video/UjoTLYsKG9k/video.html
@@sheltermonkey6065 Have a look at the video in the link, it took him a while to get his head around it, so there are older videos with incorrect assumptions. In the video I linked to he demonstrates the actual geometry using string lines.
The link doesn't go anywhere bro
Doesn't go anywhere with a kme video, is what i meant
From the way Bark River explained it to me is your supposed to use the full length of the Stone. After trying this method I was able to get a shine almost halfway up my blade. I was starting to get serious chipping with an narrow sharpening range. Long controlled Strokes no sweeping. They knew what they were talking about because now I have no chipping. I baton the hell out of my convex edges and now they are holding up. I wish I could explain why.
Do you have a link to the angle app you're using? I've downloaded a couple that aren't very consistent. Thanks Pete!
Good video .👍
Hey Pete, just in case i haven't already told you, i can free-sharpen my knives. I thought you ought to know for some reason!
Me too!
Just thought you should know
Great video Pete! I'm a newbie to sharpening and have used my basic set up of the KME on a few blades. Just recently purchased the 50 and 100 grit beast diamond stones, Arkansas translucent stone, and the kangaroo strop with 4 micron CBN emulsion. One question I have about the stone progression is if I start with the 50 "Beast" stone should I then go to the 100 grit or just skip the 100 and go straight to 140 grit? I have a feeling I'm wasting steel and putting unnecessary wear on my stones. Likewise, if I happen to start with the 100 grit stone should I then go to the 300 grit stone instead of the 140? Any help would be appreciated greatly, thank you!
If it helps I mostly have S35VN, 20CV, and M4 steels on my knives. I don't have Maxamet, Rex 45, or ZDP 189 (I wish) just yet. Lol.
Sandpaper on a mousemat will work fine as well)
Would you be able to do that type of convex grind on a Ken Onion Edition Work Sharp? I’m thinking if you loosened the belt a bit you could widen the convex edge a bit….. I’m looking at a Bark River Chopper with a Convex grind and I don’t have a KME….
I had a lansky system but it was too shaky for me so I just use the stones from it as tiny hand stones (instead of bench stones). It seems to work fine for me for pocket knives and small fixed blades. I don’t have the space to justify having a bigger/more expensive sharpening set up. #DadLife #OfficeJob #IHaveA2YearOldSonAndTheHouseBelongsToHim
Thanks Pete. Again great content. How would the KME work for chef’s knifes. I have a very expensive Miyabi I need to sharpen and don’t want to scuff or stuff my knife.
What have you been doing up to now? Or is this the first its gone to dull or you want to prepare before it comes up?
ssunfish I just bought it. It only gets used on special occasions and a bit of a show off piece. ☺️. It needs to get sharper and still have the factory edge on it.
@@paulvictor9368 ah. Now I see. Yeah. Whoever sold you that expensive knife should have assured you could maintain it or get it maintained.
I have a lansky and although it works great I do see where the fixed sistems are limited in a way, sharpening long kitchen knives is a bit of a problem and clamping twice is a no for me, allso the angle cant be true it depends how close to the edge you clamp the system, I have the spyderco triangle sharpener and it also does a good job but a very blunt knife no chance, so now I use waterstones where you have complete freedom so to speak and it didnt take me long to get the hang of it, and the joy and satisfaction you get is uncomparable to fixed systems. I still use them though but mostly to touch up a pocket knife.
Great video! You mentioned that you can go to lower angles below 17 degrees on the KME , but everywhere I see them sold 17 is the lowest mentioned. Is this possible and how do you do it? This is the one thing keeping me from getting this system. My gatco can go as low as 11 degrees. Thanks.
You have to remove and re-position the guide upside down, which allows you to achieve lower angles. The biggest limiting factor angle wise at that point is the distance from the back of the knife to the edge, and the jaws themselves (you'll eventually hit the jaws as you get too low). But you can definitely get angles lower than 17 degrees
@@DanielReyes-hz1qk Thanks. I will consider this.
Do you have a cut test between convex and v that would be cool
What was the total time you spent from setting up to finishing the sharpening process? On one that dull, I can usually pass the blade through my old Kwik Sharp sticks a few times and then use my home-made 16 inch strop for about a half hour. Total about 35 minutes and I end up with a razor edge.
id say if i wasnt stuffing around with filming and shots and stuff it woulda been a half hour job
Where you got this curved rod from? Home made or bought?
I wonder if I can bend a lansky rod to get the same effect 🤔
My kme is coming next week can't wait, I haven't bothered with the water stones do you think it'll be a problem, have all diamond, all the cermaic and arkansas a strop and 4 films, think that'll be able to get a mirror?
all diamond is all ive ever needed!
@@CedricAda thanks for the reply Pete! Did you actually. Managed to get a mirror going straight from the 1500 to the lapping films? Thanks again bud
yeah, thats how I do it. spend a bit longer on the 1500, then do three out of the six films, usually either 9micron, 3 micron then .1micron, or 6micron, 1 micron and then .5micron. Helps then last and you really dont need to use all 6
@@CedricAda sweet perfect thanks mate, got my manix 2 maxamet coming and didn't wanna eat away my work sharp belts, fingers crossed it can handle it
i've been freehand sharpening for a couple of years and still ever so often i can't get them as sharp as i would like to
so if i do ge them hair popping sharp, trust me, my neighbours will know about it
Do you angle the blade in the clamp making a straight line from the tip on every knife regardless?
@Detective Popcorn that's been my problem for so long
@Detective Popcorn that's huge for me that was the biggest turn off that I couldn't figure it out and all it was, the clamp position
Did you buy the rod or you just took one from your original system and bent it?
But what about the rounded stone for recurves?
I had an daily carry Ontario knife years ago that was a convex edge and recurve. Pain in the dick to sharpen before I had a proper setup. Ended up wrapping sandpaper around a wooden dowel and did it by hand... Got tired of that and sold it.
What's Fallkniven's bevel from factory?
I've tried half a dozen times to convex with the kme rod, different steel types, lengths and angles.. the results are very sharp but NOT A FULL CONVEX.. it's a modified "V" cut at best..
In general what do you prefer to sharpen this type or tormek?
this one, the tormek has a lot of maintenance involved, changing the stone grading each time from 200 to 1000 gets a little annoying and its very expensive too, even moreso than this!
Why didn't you end with a finished closeup? Hopefully, it looked as good as it cut.
also, thoughts on films vs cbn emulsions?
I think I like the strops and emulsions. all a little more robust and for my own knives I dont care too much for absolute mirror
I know Nick gifted you that KME but would you buy a replacement with your own money if you lost that one or could you live with the Lansky?
nah im hooked on KME now, for sure!
or some other fancy pants angle system, I’d probably try another one for the whole experience kinda thing
I don’t have the patience for doing this haha. I just use the ken onion worksharp to sharpen my knives. I just stick to basic V grinds
But I do love your videos and I love all the education you bring to the CZcams world! And I appreciate how this system contributes to your steel testing videos
Technically being a belt sharpener like the ken onion uses is convexing your edges. It's the one thing everyone seems to mention about ken onion it will convex your edges
The problem is you're only working the last 1/4" or less of the blade -- i.e. a tiny portion. A true convex sharpening of a knife would be working virtually the entire blade, from the apex all the way up to the spine, in order to thin and shape the blade in a proportionate fashion each time you sharpen. This keeps the blade geometrically sound. Using any type of jig like the KME, however, you will eventually end up with an ever-increasing obtuse blade geometry as you grind away into thicker steel.
I used to have a KME years ago when I first began sharpening knives, but once I learned to sharpen by hand I put the KME away and haven't used it since. My advice is to just learn to sharpen by hand and put the gadgets away.
Did you order that bent rod separate?
yeah its an extra
Good shit Pete, I got mine a week ago and haven’t used it as yet. I might watch this first, as I also got the “beast 50 grit”, with my convex rod and could really damage my knives?
The song 22:11 sounds to me like someone just saying "frittata
Frittata
Frittata
Fritatttttt
Frittata
frittata
Frittata
Frittata
Frittata
Frittata
Frittata
Frittata
Frittata
Frittata,"
Etcetera
Whats up with the blasphemous edge killing nylon/plastic cutting board??
Noob: “I’m having trouble with freehand sharpening”
Freehandboi:”you telling lots of people you freehand? Cuz that’s the most important part of freehand sharpening”
LAUGHING!
Does Lansky make a curved bar for convexing?
I will try to bend one to have a try :)
@@K.M925 Thank you. I have considered learning free hand sharpening to convex my knives, but if my lansky can be modified, I would prefer not to have to change my whole system. Thank you.
Sandpaper + mouse pad = free hand convex grind less cost, effective and efficient save more time.
That sponge being cut is so satisfying
ooh i know right, I could do that all so. S O C R I S P
One of the best free hand sharpeners I ever found on CZcams is Virtuovice, and he sharpens perfect convex blades by hand, but his knives all look like absolute shit because of that, so I rather have the KME😅
I know my comment is a bit late.. but when you're spreading your compound on the strops, if you spread them in order of finest to coarsest you could use the same finger and not worry about cross contamination! Dropping a grain of sand into a bowl of stones makes no difference..
Reef.
Judging from the minimal bend in the rod, the degree of convexing seems to be so minimal, I don't see the point.
DEFINETLY something to self-evaluate. YMMV. I think we get in a hurry and look for shortcuts and rock solid quick answers. Learning by experience or by hands on is not everyone's preferred learming style. I think for me experiments and finding MY way that I can do is best. Just as long as I'm not re-inventing the wheel every go-round.
@@ssunfish haha... great troll!
@@sheltermonkey6065 subtle enough to almost slide by: the smoothest!
Don't like it. The mouse pad/sandpaper and leather strop with compounds works well enough. The F1 is awesome! Convex is very easy to sharpen by hand than standard V edge (for me at least).
Lol avoid cross contamination, tosses the sleeves to get mixed up and way too strong handed just rolling the edge.
I just go freehand way easier
Burr-tennis..... Lol...:)
After bailing out of my jet plane and landing safe and alone in deep jungle, I need a knife I can resharpen on the nearest flat rock.
These videos are for people who never have enough stuff and those who will not even attempt to become dexterous.
See, I think this method stinks because you have a micro bevel on a convex and you shouldn't have that. Yes the knife is sharp but you took the true convex away. You obviously do not know how to properly sharpen a convex.its only obtained on a belt
What rubbish..poor knife
I cringe when I see stuff like this.2 hours and a mess(not even chipped) OR Work Sharp..60 sec and done
BOOSTEDLASER on that knife it is a CONVEX ground knife if you put it through a worksharp it would ruin it
@@dizzy897 w
w
Wrong work Sharp is convex
whole things about half an hour, worksharp is also good
Have you tried the convex extension to your kadet?