Revan was Power
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- čas přidán 8. 09. 2024
- Kreia confides in the exile her knowledge of Revan and how exceptional he was.
Had to reupload this. Background music was too loud.
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#StarWars #KOTOR2 #Expandeduniverse
Damn. The concept of Revan choosing to turn to the dark side to prepare the Galaxy for the return of the sith empire is so much more meaningful for his character arc than "being brainwashed by Vitiate". Seems The Old Republic just used him as a money grab. Smh.
That makes no sense whatsoever. That makes it sound like Revan was just chasing after the next thing without any thought. No Kreia said that Revan's choices were always his own
To hell with TOR
I fucking hate the Revan novel and SWTOR. It did to Star Wars Legends what The Force Awakens and The Last Jedi did to the Star Wars Canon.
Did they specifically identify the evil Revan found as the Sith Empire before SWTOR? I always thought it was left vague.
@@Visitormassacre The Eternal Empire could have been a really cool non-Sith threat to the galaxy, had it not turned out to just be the Emperor playing a long con. Could have made a neat basis for KOTOR III
This game makes revan so much better.
...and BioWare ruined that with SWToR...
@@makara4615 Jealousy is an ugly thing.
@@JJoh4040 I don't remember.
@@JJoh4040 I believe I remembered. Basically, what really made Revan cool was the questions and implications about them brought up in KOTOR 2. Then the Revan novel and SWTOR really just gave all of it the shaft.
Agreed I love How it expands upon his story and lore from the first game through the exiles eyes
Both Knights of the Old Republic games were absolute masterpieces, and Kreia is, at least in my opinion, one of the best written characters in all of Star Wars, if not in all of fiction.
She is (in my opinion) one of the best characters in game/Cinema history! We wil never see a character so good as Kreia anymore in Movies or Games today. Not when Disney owns Star Wars or company’s like EA (Games), Ubisoft & Warner Bros making our games nowadays!
Kreia is the best damn character of all time
Absolutely 100%. They just don't make games the way they used to :(
Revan was one of the greats- not simply for his power, but his perspectives.
For the Star Wars universe, Revan is one of the best examples of knowledge equaling power. Through gathering knowledge from both the Jedi and the Sith, he understood that both were extremes. After the Last Jedi, the common man will believe Luke Skywalker to be the architect of balanced force users, when it actually predates even Revan.
Revan was just a power hungry man who found the light at the end.
Papito Qinn the way The Last Jedi criticizes the the jedi was unprincipled due to its SJW messages. It lacked thevwriting the KOTOR Had. If there were a star wars movie with this kind of writing, there would never be this much division from the fans.
@@StoicSurvivor99 The level of writing in TSL would never have been achieved by Rian Johnson. Johnson is a high-school level hack writer who wants his scenes and sacrifices his plot to have those scenes; Chris Avellone wrote for games that could not effectively demonstrate scenes visually, and so had to write a compelling narrative that drew the player in.
It's possible to have positive social commentary present in a movie that works effectively while being subtle; the last word being one that Rian Johnson does not understand. It's not just the SJW commentary that bogs down the movie, though- it's the fact that the plot was written accommodate the scenes instead of the other way around.
@@DarkKing009 someone wasn't paying attention
Disney will never be able to comprehend the grand philosophical depth of Kreia
Why? Because is evil? Disney don't creates movies, Lucasfilm do that. Disney release them ands creates merchandising. You can say Kathleen Kennedy cannot or JJ
@@Ale-dd3ek "Disney doesn't create movies"... Uhm they do. Been doing it since the 1930s...
@@martinp3166 Star Wars movies are made by Lucasfilm. If something is wrong wrong it's not Disney fault, but writer fault
@@Ale-dd3ek Who's owned by Disney.
Also, learn some basic movie history before you tell dumb false claims about Disney
@@martinp3166 Disney own Lucasfilm but the creation of movies and shows is Lucasfilm job. Filoni and Favreau created Mandalorian, JJ and Rian made sequels, Ron Howard made Solo. Disney don't arrive and say: "This is the plot use it, lol"
1:45 - 1:49 Revan was power, it was like staring at the heart of the Force.
0:49 - 0:54 He became the dark lord out of necessity, to prevent a greater evil
1:02 - 1:05 Someone who was willing to wage war to save others
1:49 - 1:53 Even Then you could see the Jedi he would slay, etched on his soul
This is the nuance of Revan that people really need to wrap their heads around. To simply say he was jedi, dark lord, then jedi again deeply deeply undercuts his story and does him a MASSIVE disservice! Revan is a VERY complex character and deserves to be precieved and enjoyed as such. This is why I say that many writers for Revan don't understand him
Kreia talking about Revan's power reminds me a lot of how Obi-Wan talks about Anakin's power in the force.
I like to think of Revan as the chosen one of his era, it fits so well
i like to think that anakin is a distant descendent, there is a lot of paralelism and similarities that make you think one to another and vice versa.
Revan picked up his mask from a fallen mandalorian women. The need to end blood shed was what drove him, the fact he saw pass the mindless aggression and was capable of interpreting the existence of a sith empire beyond the out rim was what made him ruthlessly kill and convert.
It was an arms race, a preparation for war!
like what malak said, he was a hero, villain, jedi, sith, he was everything yet was nothing too, revan was complex and yet simple too, but what is and always be true is his heart on how he was always true to himself whether he was in the light or dark, his conviction made him free of the light side and dark side of the force
Too bad Drew Karpyshyn ignored this dialogue concerning Revan.
My head canon has Revan allowing the Sith Emperor to turn him to the DS and initially controlling him, however, as Revan returned to Republic space, he managed to resist the Emperor's control over him (by his strong willpower and being a great distance away from the Sith Emperor). Revan then realized he needed to understand both aspects of the Force thus remained as a Dark Lord of the Sith. This way, what Kreia and HK-47 (concerning Revan's plan to have the Jedi fall to the DS at Malachor V) say about Revan is mostly still relevant while still preserving the canon from SWTOR.
But in the Revan novel it is made clear that Revan and Malak freed themselves from Vitiate influence. They had already fallen to the Dark Side by the time they met him so after freeing their minds from his corruption Revan began to prepare the galaxy to fight the Sith emperor by conquering the Republic while preserving some key worlds because a destroyed galaxy could not stand a chance against Vitiate. So the Old Republic game do not contradict Kotor 2.
I could listen Kreia talk for hours! She is like an audiobook!
This is one of the greatest additions on the star wars galaxy. It takes good and evil from star wars and questions all of it.
i've always found cute that even though Kreia does not agree with all of Revan's actions, she is so proud of him and his power, her nurturing teacher side
0:54 boot "I do not believe the Jedi council changed Revan as they claim"
0:58 initiate "they merely stripped away the surface to allow the true self to emerge again"
1:02 initiate 2 "Someone who was willing to wage war to save others."
Light side
This just make the Dark side Revan seems kinda stupid since Dark Side Revan is basically Dark Side stupidity
Silent Shadow - Reborn Darth Revan? (KOTOR dark side ending) or original Darth Revan? And why?
To anyone wondering, these quotes are used for the creation of my lightsaber :p
@@darthrevan7710 Kotor 1 Dark Side Revan since lets be honest dark side Revan was basically more of a thug that would rob and kill innocent people.
Also the greatest strategic military mind in Star Wars
Cough thrawn lmao
@@BiasN Thrawn won a some battles against a new republic that was struggling to stand on its own two feet using resources leftover from an incredibly powerful galaxy spanning army.
Revan defeated the Mandalorians at the height of their power while the republic was still recovering from the war with Exar Kun. Afterwards he built up the republic, then took over a third of its fleet and built the sith empire and nearly defeated the republic. Afterwards he then helped the now weakened republic defeat the incredibly powerful army he built.
I’d say Revan has him beat pretty well in strategy and tactics
@@4477superman thrawn >> revan
He has better feats
@@BiasN Name checks out. Is given logic and reasoning, flat out denies it cause 'hurr durr thrawn better'. Biased as can be.
Kreia is by far the deepest most in depth character in all of Star Wars. Easily the most brilliant character in all of fiction. The only character in Star Wars that compares to her is Thrawn he is just so well written also but no one compares to the brilliance of Kreia!
Heh! I agree!
Look, I love Kreia but saying she is the most brilliant character in all of fiction is just plain stupid. She does not hold a candle to the likes of Rodion Romanovich Raskolnikov, Ivan Karamazov, The Underground Man, and Humbert Humbert. Kreia is an excellent character and KOTOR 2 is easily one of my favorite games, but to say that she is "Easily the most brilliant character in all of fiction" is just wrong.
Remember when dialogue used to be like this in video games and movies
I think you have to go to the independent stuff for that now in both.
But... Did Kreia respect Revan?
She hates the force... And compares Revan to the "heart of the force"
... Does that mean she hated Revan?... Or did she respect Revan?
Personally I think that answer is highly dependant on when in Kreia's life you ask that question, especially if you subscribe to the theory that she is Arren Kae. The short of it, I believe at the very least, is that she admires, perhaps even secretly idolizes Revan's powerful will and personally; a will and strength of internal character to not be shackled by the teachings and biases of the Jedi, nor the corrupting influences and impulses of Sith lore and the Dark Side in general.
I feel the need to emphasize that I think Revan made the calculated choice to become a Sith Lord, accepting the fact he needs to dive deep into and fully embrace the Dark Side in order to strengthen both his Sith Empire and the Republic for Vitiate (refer to Essential Guide to the Force book). Revan may have been working towards a greater good, but if his machinations and conquests went on without derailment, he would have been a benevolent dictator ruling all, with the quote 'Dark Side winning' unquote. (Maybe like the Emperor of Mankind?). An example of this self-will is Revan decided to go face the "True Sith" / Vitiate on his own, instead of going on mad, endless power quest to retake control / recreate his SIth Empire; he kept on task unlike for example Yuthura Ban, who tried fruitlessly to take control of the Sith Academy in a misguided attempt to become "powerful enough" to Free All the Slaves.
Kreia in the end, I believe was essentially tortured by the reality of there always being destructive Good vs. Evil battles instigated seemingly always by the Jedi and Sith in a never ending cycle. As this relates to Revan, In her point of view s/he was the only one to have both powers of both Light and Dark (high Charisma RPG stat) as well as the ability to subtly manipulate and outright take the reigns of the Sith / Jedi cyclic war for his own will and goals. Self-Determination unimpeded (seemingly) by the Will and Destiny of the Force, what Kreia values most.
I like rambling like this. Hopefully this made some sense in the end.
Revan was Kreia's greatest student from her point of view(aside from the Exile). She valued his power, his mind and his charisma. She liked how he could manipulate everyone and how he learned all her lessons well. She even proudly states that she was the one from whom he came for advice about how to leave the Jedi Order. That shows that she has affection for him.
However, she disliked how Revan liked droids, for those are dead to the Force and thus, they are only to serve. A machine for her has no value, because it isn't truly alive. Then again, she says that Revan probably liked droids due to his desire to always have beings that obeyed him without question.
Revan was grounded in physical plane, he wanted to protect the ones he loved. He was aware of the dilemma they were in but was willing to accept the role given him by the Force.
Kreia on the other hand wanted complete freedom and independence from the transcendental realm that was at the causal plane of existence.
I believe Kreia respected Revan, because as she mentioned "Raven choices was always his own". He was as free as the limits of their knowledge about the reality allowed them.
Kreia hated the structure of the reality we live in. They had no connection and no influence with their causal plane.
At the end, because of that, none of them was truly free.. Tragic isn't it?
They were really close, thou.
They've challenge the paradigm and influence a lot of souls, making the first step towards a better world.
That seems to be a complicated question, she certainly seems to show some degree of respect for him in this conversation while she certainly does not like the force. I find the conversations here to be more better then anything I can think of saying at this time; usually I am the one rambling for paragraphs at a time regarding issues. This is a change. I will state what I think, it seems to me that her hatred of the force stems from the fact that she sees it as a malevolent god controlling and manipulating the lives of others. She seeks to kill it and free the galaxy from the endless repetition of light and dark, of Jedi and Sith endlessly clashing. She clearly is proud of how she taught him and how he came back to her for advice regarding how to leave the order. She also seems to believe that his choices were always his own and that the order did not change Revan, all the events of the wars and the decisions of the council did were to remove the surface and show who he truly was. In other words, he demonstrated who he was as an individual, as a person through the events at that time. That is also why she doesn't believe he "fell" he merely showed who he really was to the galaxy. The Jedi would say that he fell, but that is their point of view. That is just my take on it right now. Sorry if I started rambling myself, I often do that on discussions I like.
@Sarincrow I don't think you can say Revan understood Kreia's teachings, while the Exile did. Though she was not master to the Exile for long, her devotion to the Exile seemed deeper, as though the Exile walked a path she more approved of.
all of kreias apprentices was so powerful
All of these Interactions are excellent teaching for our reality.
Conquering the galaxy to unify it against the true sith empire...a motivation that perfectly works
Really makes me wonder if Bastila and her strike team ever stood a chance against Revan when they had him cornered on the bridge of his ship, if Malak had not opened fire on him.
Highly doubt it.
since we are getting remake of kotor 1, I am hoping we get kotor 2 aswell because it is probably one of my most favorite games of all time, the acting and writting was masterful
The dislikes are from the remaining Jedi Masters
Swtor made him look weak
@RoboPotato They still killed him then brought him back just to die again, it’s stupid
@RoboPotato he had to? No he was tricked by the emperor and he resurrected him just so swtor let you kill him again
@RoboPotato Yes I know but see now it made him even look weaker making more mistakes, they took what was great about KOTOR and ruined it! 😭
@RoboPotato No they should have stuck with him fighting the emperor in his mind and release him from that prison and you have a choice to set him free and he becomes a member of your party or die as a force ghost by mercy killing him, both would work for any class you pick light or dark
@RoboPotato revan was strong but there are many sith and jedi who are far stronger
Choosing evil to destroy the Greater evil what a man
Evil? I mean if you want to see it that way, sure.
I really represent revan because he was "willing to go to war to save others ".
I don't just represent Revan, I am Revan.
Do you think if the Jedi or force sensetives were like Revan and they became like him then the galaxy would be a safer place their would not be never ending wars between light and dark that a order of gray force users could be the end of it all? Because i do if Luke decides to follow a path like Revans maybe the galaxy will finally not have to experience the Jedi and the Siths terribly wars ever again Revan is what all force users should be.
Revan was week
You're an idiot DarkKing
Dakota Vanleer well war is a part of nature. Revan knew this as well. War gives us challenges. We crave challenges because they make us stronger. As strength and conflict gives us meaning. But there are calmness between storms. Peace wil prevail for a time and then the storm will return with some psychopath leading them and war has begun. Like the balance of the force, there has to be balance between peace and war.
No. There is no solution with Grey Jedi. They are even worse than Jedi. Please watch the Failure of the Grey Jedi vid.
Wars are inevitable, but peace in-between is too. Both are two sides of the same coin, just as chaos and harmony. War is the best way to spur innovation, that is how we learn.
Lord Revan shall always be my master. I , his loyal follower and one of many, shall await the day until his return and when the day comes he does, we shall ascend to the star's and do his will.
cringe
1. Is this a vanilla conversation?
2. Damn, we really need a Kotor 3 to retcon the mmo
Indeed
They set so much up for a third even Chris Avellone was like "so this is what its gonna be about"
I always have this dream of an announcement video where its just a dark background with a voiceover then the words "KNIGHTS OF THE OLD REPUBLIC III" pop up
Ughhh one can dream
Courtney Killed Curt - one can. Ive actually written a 100 page novella to lead into KOTOR 3, along with my own KOTOR 3. Essentially a Revan novel rewrite.
I def agree i want an obisidian made kotor 3 so bad
I'd like a fan made game of Kotor III using the game's graphics. Like a hack or something, with real voice actors and shit.
Maybe the third one would be about championing the threat behind the trilogy. As if the first game was to setup the standard Star Wars fair, the second to darken and cloud it, and the third to finalize and bring both worlds in a climactic masterpiece.
0:34 and that's why I find the Revan novel and SWTOR so fucking insulting. They are the equivalent of The Force Awakens/The Last Jedi: making previous accomplishments and character development pointless to tell a shitty story that leaves much to be desired.
It is a very difficult thing to call oneself a Star Wars fan at this point. Maybe I'm not one anymore.
Well, you can call yourself a fair weather fan perhaps. There's nothing wrong with criticism. By definition it's the act of pointing out flaws in an effort to bring improvement. It's insults that aren't productive.
0 dislikes, you love to see it
You might have jinxed it.
Nope. Still good boiiiii!
@@PapitoQinn Congrats you have the 1st dislike
1:45 boot
1:50 initiate
Dark side 1
The few dislikes were the Jedi Council
Kreia alone was the one who even made Revan and the mandalorian wars interesting to me
I remember Keria talking slower and with pauses. Was this sped up?
No. It wasn't. All I did was remove the dialogue options in the edit.
Revan maybe number 1 but Kreia is number 2
i hate how the videos pop up at the end
so annoying
Yeah I'm sorry about that. They annoy me too, which is why in my newer videos I editing in some time after the video for the end screens. Unfortunately I made this video before I had the idea.
It is important to note that Kreia is not exactly a reliable narrator of Revan's character. She reads herself into his motives.
It's very likely that Revan, being proud, fell into evil ways, and justified them afterwards. Nevertheless, take Kreia, a thoroughly macchiavellian creature, with a grain of salt.
This version of Revan isn't quite so unique, I mean, he's kind of just another "for the greater good" villain. I don't like him in swtor, but I'll acknowledge that he was never really great as a character. Especially when compared to the other phenomenal characters in this game.
I am getting SOOOO sick of TOR's (bullshit non-kotor spinoff) EA-ridden "canonization" mockery of the original KOTOR legacy, both Revan and the Exile's (NOT accepting that bullshit name, ever) gender is supposed to be ambiguous and up to the one who creates them and what TOR (Not to be confused with the original "KOTOR" series) fucked over, which is precisely why i'm with the group that shuns that mockery of the original KOTOR series. To me both Revan and the Exile were both female (No, not because i'm a pervert, it just feels right to me, seriously) and perhaps, one day, i'll upload a variant of this scene, not as polished but still to the variation I prefer of course, i'm sure you understand how I feel. :) (And no, that doesn't mean I ship Carth with FemRev, quite the contrary in fact and I REALLY wish that KOTOR 1 and 2 had the same romance quality that its Jade Empire cousin counterpart had since it let a female Spirit Monk MC romance girls in its story and vice versa, if KOTOR 1 and 2 had that quality then it would make it even more better imho ^^ [I won't deny that I am a MAJOR Yuri-fanatic, but I also see the inner-beauty of it] I would REALLY love to see Bastilla lamenting the postponed return of her FemRev lover, such a damn shame that it always reverts to thinking that FemRev romanced Carth in KOTOR 2's story, even though my FemRev would NEVER do that, ever. Also, There REALLY should've been the choice to choose between the Handmaiden and the Disciple, and as I REALLY don't care at ALL for that stupid Mical i'd choose Brianna over that Republic turd, always. At any rate, apologies for the wall of text, just venting my honest feelings is all.)
How can anyone truly appreciate something they claim to love when any slight change to their customized version sends them into a tirade?
It would be like saying there's nothing permitting the existence of a female Shepard in Mass Effect, pretty much shitting on those that prefer the female variation of the MC.
@@rookie5708 - Your personal head canon was contradicted, and now you're throwing a fit. Gender ambiguity has its place in games such as these, and while we play them we are free to make our own choices, but in such an expansive and interconnected universe, a definitive answer must be available.
Just because you prefer Revan to be a female, does not mean they have somehow insulted you as a consumer by making him male. When I first learned about KOTOR 2, I originally imagined the Exile as a male. Now that I know she was canonically female, I adjusted and learned to appreciate her as such. You should do the same.
Lmfao what a pervert
Disney/Lucasfilm would ruin these characters
Blah blah blah
Revan was week
Oh hi SWTiOwaRe, you enjoying your bad writing? That's cool, just let us enjoy our good writing too. Live and let live and all that.
who??
Jolee Bindo #1
Revan was just a power hungry man who found the light at the end.
i argee he did get his ass kicked by vitiate