I'd be really interested in how sound comes into this process! When is the dialogue synchronized and mixed? When is the music composed and mixed into the audio?
In the analogue era, the sound mix first started when the film was cut. Now it's much more fluid, as Christy Kail says, because of Total Recall and other digital options. If original music has been composed for the score, the music is recorded, mixed and mastered in a sound studio. in the past and still on certain large productions, the music is recorded in real time while the conductor and musicians watch the film on a large screen. Finally the finished filtered and processed: Dialog, Cleansound, Livesound, digital effects sounds, Foley effects, underlying mood sounds, and the finished music tracks are all mixed in a sound mix cinema with a calibrated Dolby Atmos system, or less depending on the budget. I was once at a seminar where David Lynch told how the sound of a B52 bomber had been added in the last mix underneath rest of the sound on his film "Blue velvet"
Yes. It Really depends on the direction. In Dunkirk, Nolan asked to Zimmer to star composing before the shot days, so the music would be the fundamental guide for the drama. XML export and other types of the same family, can give you the option of working "the same" project in different platforms. Even sound post production have his own ecosystem now a days: you can work sound design of sound FXs in multiple layers in Ableton live, group them, classify them. At the same time somebody can work in the ambience design of multiple layers in protools, group them, classify them. At the same time somebody can work in the voices of multiple layers in Audition, group them, classify them. At the same time somebody works in the music sound mix (another ecosystem ). And finally you put together the sound ecosystem with music ecosystem in one project that needs the most important final mix of all those layers together. That final mix have fades of music, fades of ambiences to enhance voices and FX, and other way around. Equalization, post sent auxiliary FXs, like reverbs and delays to any sound fx or voice that need to blend with the sound space in the shot. For example in Mad Max Fury Road, many voices have a tape delay post send auxiliary FX, to blend the subject with the canyons, deserts and caves. Even more complex mixes and FXs like doppler FX into multiple channels (like in IMAX or Atmos) just in that particular final sound/music project. Even so I dedicated a lot of years working in sound, is the most underground place in the world. Just ask yourself, and watch the making of the lords of the rings: the fellowship of the ring. And all the customs, art, production, etc, have more scenes of explanation. But directors like Nolan, Villeneuve, Lucas, Michael bay, Scott family, Terrence Malik, James Cameron, Spielberg, Michael Mann, do hardcore emphasis on sound design/music final mix. And is proven that those kind of guys are the ones responsible for the creation of new cinema production ecosystems that delivers more jobs, careers and new budget ways for the future of quality cinema working ecosystem. Sorry for the "ecosystem" word, but I think that part needs to be clear.
Yes, as you says, Agustin Saavedra. Film sound work can be quite complex. Another example of a director's high priority of the music is Sergio Leone's old masterpiece "Once Upon a Time in the West" where Ennio Morricone's famous score, which was written in advance, was played at high volume in speakers while the film was being shot, so that the actors could get in the right mood. The film was filmed without sound, which was made afterwards.
@@agustinsaavedra2752 blablabla ecosystem blabla ecosystem yadada yada yada ecosystem... ecosystem yadayada ecosystem. LOL, I'm just having a giggle at what to me seems like an infatuation with the word ecosystem, for which there are many alternatives by the way. But I do agree that sound is very important, it can make or break a movie, more than most people realize I think. I'm not really a "sound guy", but I know enough to pay attention to getting the recordings done properly if that's up to me, and I can whip up a basic sound mix.
To be clear. When I say that Nolan and PTA finish their movies on film. Meaning their master format is an analog print made by printing the original camera negative onto either intermediate stocks or print stock directly, I am not saying they don’t edit their movies on a computer. They do. Their movies get edited on the computer using scanned dailies. The actual film negative then gets cut to according to that edit. The digital versions of their movies is made by scanning photochemically color timed inter positive prints and grading that to match the analog master print. Also digital cameras don’t have an inherent look. Just like Film can be graded digital to look like anything, so can digital. They’re may be a manufacturer provided look but all professional digital cinema cameras can be made to look like anything, including each other. At least for all regular cinema audiences. And digital can also come quite close to the look film. Through mathematic film emulation using VFX. See Steve Yedlin’s Display Prep demo for that. He shot The Last Jedi 50/50 on film and digital and Knives Out and Glass Onion entirely on digital. All have the look of film scanned and graded to look like to print film. Watching an actual anlog print still looks more beautiful though.
@@vlcheish it depends on whose colour science you like to shoot to. But you can grade anything to anything so they match assuming you have the resolution & bit depth
negative cutting wasnt always done. the scanned footage would often be color corrected in the digital intermediate and was high enough in resolution to be outputted to film.
@@AG-BG Yes most movies from the mid 2000s shot on film were finished in the DI even when they still released on print. Nolan and PTA are just the last still finishing on film.
You chose a great reference film in Banshees of Inisherin. Truly a cinematic masterpiece for more reasons than one - beginning with breathtaking cinematography. Well done
Great Video! Something to add: This movie in specific is actually projected on actual film stock after being finished in a digital space to add more real film stock characteristics. You can read about it an a British cinematographer issue! Thank you for the video!
You should do a video explaining how stop motion movies are shot. The ability to shoot a movie one frame at a time allows you to do some pretty interesting stuff.
Can you explain D-squeeze? What is the standard aspect ratio (and horizontal and vertical resolution) for a digital cinema camera sensor? And how is it cropped and stretched into the final 4K/2K/1080p versions needed for consumers (cinemas and homes)? I'm curious about any potential loss of fidelity due to stretching or squeezing the image by a non-integer multiple of pixels and in different ratios in different axes.
Different cinema camera sensors are different sizes and resolutions, for example the Alexa LF is 4448x3096 photosites. Most are around the 3:2 aspect ratio, which is a good compromise for spherical and anamorphic shooting. To fit a delivery resolution, the correct aspect ratio is "extracted" and then scaled to the delivery container size. Generally the capture resolution is high enough resolution that scaling by non-integer values isn't really an issue. The same with desqueeze.
This is a great video!! I went to a Q&A with Ben Davis and he mentioned how he wanted to shoot Banshees of Inisherin on film but went with digital (arri) and projected the footage onto film and scanned, a technique he discussed with Greg Fraser who did this on Dune and Batman. Have you ever looked into or done any videos on this technique?
Slight correction for Banshees of Inisherin which all the reference clips are from: Backup, dailies colour, transcode, and sync were all handled by a near-set digital lab, rather than by the DIT or DM.
@@bngr_bngr I think they mean it wasn't being handled on set by the DIT using for example a pre-agreed LUT. In this case the DIT would be handling replication of data onto SSD storage etc & then sending a copy to the 'digital lab' where it would receive a colour grade but it could also include an assembly cut of the day's shooting, which might point to areas they might need to shoot coverage. (warning. This a theoretical interest to me, I Am Not A Cinematographer!
"B-cam open up half a stop. The assistant then will change aperture from T4 to T2.8 and a half" - The ARRI lens you show has markings for ⅓-stops, but not for half-stops.
This is how most cine lenses are marked. To set a lens to 1/2 stop, you rotate the lens barrel to the negative space in between the 1/3 stop and 2/3 stop marking.
Arri or Premiere what about Resolve itself? Also why would you need to apply a LUT to a proxy unless your kit is really slooow? Also I would expect give a final grade at the end. Also when editing you would also need to at least applied any pre-viz effects or effects proxies such as set extensions etc whilst cutting. Lock picture usually comes quite late in the process after post.
Why would you choose a REC709 Colour space unless your shooting on a very old camera. Surely you would choose REC2020 or something with a better dynamic range i.e applying a LUT to whatever you were viewing it on for later grading in post
I was a little bit disappointed in this video. You didn’t discuss the process of transferring the digital media onto film and then back to digital media so that it would possess a somewhat natural film look which is what they did with this movie. it would be great if you could talk about that process. 😊
Yes you can expose it onto a stock and then rescan but what's the point. That's the same logic as saying vinyl records sound better. Vinyl records only sound better because you can't play the arsey tricks with compression you can on digital If you want to add a film look you can add any film stock or grain you like in post. Go look at the Phillip Bloom channel he can give you a good intro into what can be achieved?
Usually Rec709, as you won't be viewing on P3 monitors on set. The new Alexa 35 colour science however, removes the display transform from the LUT altogether, so you can choose in camera what display format you're outputting, without the need for multiple LUTs.
Most DITs either use INOVATIV carts or have custom ones built. All the actual equipment and monitors on the cart are usually assembled by the DIT themselves - you can't buy DIT rigs off-the-shelf.
Given that RED shoots to standard consumer grade SSDs and these days you can build a SAN for silly money even if using Enterprises grade SSD, why would you dump to spinning rust? I get using RAID6 HDs for long term storage & then replicated out to tape. But 'on set' all the CZcamsrs I know back off their uSD cards to a series of SSDs & then if necessary wipe them...
As a DIT, this is a great video explaining the process!
"In Depth" Cine, for real. This was a truly fascinating video, and love the presentation style of your videos.
Dude, these are so helpful & informative. I'm gradually grasping the technicalities of cinematography. 🙌🏽🎥
I'd be really interested in how sound comes into this process! When is the dialogue synchronized and mixed? When is the music composed and mixed into the audio?
Sound is synced before editing starts, and temp mixes will happen during the edit. Final mixing will happen at around the same time as colour grading.
In the analogue era, the sound mix first started when the film was cut. Now it's much more fluid, as Christy Kail says, because of Total Recall and other digital options. If original music has been composed for the score, the music is recorded, mixed and mastered in a sound studio. in the past and still on certain large productions, the music is recorded in real time while the conductor and musicians watch the film on a large screen. Finally the finished filtered and processed: Dialog, Cleansound, Livesound, digital effects sounds, Foley effects, underlying mood sounds, and the finished music tracks are all mixed in a sound mix cinema with a calibrated Dolby Atmos system, or less depending on the budget. I was once at a seminar where David Lynch told how the sound of a B52 bomber had been added in the last mix underneath rest of the sound on his film "Blue velvet"
Yes. It Really depends on the direction. In Dunkirk, Nolan asked to Zimmer to star composing before the shot days, so the music would be the fundamental guide for the drama. XML export and other types of the same family, can give you the option of working "the same" project in different platforms. Even sound post production have his own ecosystem now a days: you can work sound design of sound FXs in multiple layers in Ableton live, group them, classify them. At the same time somebody can work in the ambience design of multiple layers in protools, group them, classify them. At the same time somebody can work in the voices of multiple layers in Audition, group them, classify them. At the same time somebody works in the music sound mix (another ecosystem ). And finally you put together the sound ecosystem with music ecosystem in one project that needs the most important final mix of all those layers together. That final mix have fades of music, fades of ambiences to enhance voices and FX, and other way around. Equalization, post sent auxiliary FXs, like reverbs and delays to any sound fx or voice that need to blend with the sound space in the shot. For example in Mad Max Fury Road, many voices have a tape delay post send auxiliary FX, to blend the subject with the canyons, deserts and caves. Even more complex mixes and FXs like doppler FX into multiple channels (like in IMAX or Atmos) just in that particular final sound/music project.
Even so I dedicated a lot of years working in sound, is the most underground place in the world.
Just ask yourself, and watch the making of the lords of the rings: the fellowship of the ring. And all the customs, art, production, etc, have more scenes of explanation.
But directors like Nolan, Villeneuve, Lucas, Michael bay, Scott family, Terrence Malik, James Cameron, Spielberg, Michael Mann, do hardcore emphasis on sound design/music final mix. And is proven that those kind of guys are the ones responsible for the creation of new cinema production ecosystems that delivers more jobs, careers and new budget ways for the future of quality cinema working ecosystem.
Sorry for the "ecosystem" word, but I think that part needs to be clear.
Yes, as you says, Agustin Saavedra. Film sound work can be quite complex. Another example of a director's high priority of the music is Sergio Leone's old masterpiece "Once Upon a Time in the West" where Ennio Morricone's famous score, which was written in advance, was played at high volume in speakers while the film was being shot, so that the actors could get in the right mood. The film was filmed without sound, which was made afterwards.
@@agustinsaavedra2752 blablabla ecosystem blabla ecosystem yadada yada yada ecosystem... ecosystem yadayada ecosystem. LOL, I'm just having a giggle at what to me seems like an infatuation with the word ecosystem, for which there are many alternatives by the way. But I do agree that sound is very important, it can make or break a movie, more than most people realize I think. I'm not really a "sound guy", but I know enough to pay attention to getting the recordings done properly if that's up to me, and I can whip up a basic sound mix.
To be clear. When I say that Nolan and PTA finish their movies on film. Meaning their master format is an analog print made by printing the original camera negative onto either intermediate stocks or print stock directly, I am not saying they don’t edit their movies on a computer. They do. Their movies get edited on the computer using scanned dailies. The actual film negative then gets cut to according to that edit. The digital versions of their movies is made by scanning photochemically color timed inter positive prints and grading that to match the analog master print.
Also digital cameras don’t have an inherent look. Just like Film can be graded digital to look like anything, so can digital. They’re may be a manufacturer provided look but all professional digital cinema cameras can be made to look like anything, including each other. At least for all regular cinema audiences. And digital can also come quite close to the look film. Through mathematic film emulation using VFX. See Steve Yedlin’s Display Prep demo for that. He shot The Last Jedi 50/50 on film and digital and Knives Out and Glass Onion entirely on digital. All have the look of film scanned and graded to look like to print film. Watching an actual anlog print still looks more beautiful though.
"digital cameras don’t have an inherent look"
Dang....so all those internet guys who keep saying "cAnOn cOloRs!" fooled me all along!
@@vlcheish 😂
@@vlcheish it depends on whose colour science you like to shoot to. But you can grade anything to anything so they match assuming you have the resolution & bit depth
negative cutting wasnt always done. the scanned footage would often be color corrected in the digital intermediate and was high enough in resolution to be outputted to film.
@@AG-BG Yes most movies from the mid 2000s shot on film were finished in the DI even when they still released on print. Nolan and PTA are just the last still finishing on film.
You chose a great reference film in Banshees of Inisherin. Truly a cinematic masterpiece for more reasons than one - beginning with breathtaking cinematography. Well done
Nope
@@gravestron9695 lmao
Could you maybe make a video about HDR? How is it used, when does it add to the experience, when does it feel to gimmicky etc
Its just such a shame that RED is gatekeeping the ability to shoot compressed raw. Such a shame to the entire industry!
when red applying for patent, the officials just have some cheap weed
yeah, but from what i understand it will run out in 2035.
Well, sony has X-OCN and Arri HFE, which as I understand is essentialy the same, rightm
Given Red seems to play fast & loose with the truth, has anyone looked for prior art to its patent??
They'll go bankrupt once that patent runs out and we'll all celebrate!
Great Video! Something to add: This movie in specific is actually projected on actual film stock after being finished in a digital space to add more real film stock characteristics. You can read about it an a British cinematographer issue!
Thank you for the video!
Please make one video about cinema mastering or DCP file
Love the video, 1 quick crazy nit picky thing, T4 to T 2.8 would be a full stop right
Thank you. That was fascinating.
You should do a video explaining how stop motion movies are shot. The ability to shoot a movie one frame at a time allows you to do some pretty interesting stuff.
From what I see in the remarks this is a great series of vids.
Excellent, excellent video. Your channel is incredibly helpful.
Bless you InDepthCine. This is great!
Wow! Big cinema productions are using proxies too!
Great Video!
Can you explain D-squeeze? What is the standard aspect ratio (and horizontal and vertical resolution) for a digital cinema camera sensor? And how is it cropped and stretched into the final 4K/2K/1080p versions needed for consumers (cinemas and homes)? I'm curious about any potential loss of fidelity due to stretching or squeezing the image by a non-integer multiple of pixels and in different ratios in different axes.
Different cinema camera sensors are different sizes and resolutions, for example the Alexa LF is 4448x3096 photosites. Most are around the 3:2 aspect ratio, which is a good compromise for spherical and anamorphic shooting. To fit a delivery resolution, the correct aspect ratio is "extracted" and then scaled to the delivery container size. Generally the capture resolution is high enough resolution that scaling by non-integer values isn't really an issue. The same with desqueeze.
That "Arri 65+DNA" comment connects like a good film can be relatable directly rather than metaphorically. Epic...
This is a great video!! I went to a Q&A with Ben Davis and he mentioned how he wanted to shoot Banshees of Inisherin on film but went with digital (arri) and projected the footage onto film and scanned, a technique he discussed with Greg Fraser who did this on Dune and Batman. Have you ever looked into or done any videos on this technique?
can we get a video on ari aster
Excellent video
Excellent! 🎬
This is such an informational and great channel keep it up. You’re the most knowledgeable and in depth explainer I have ever heard!!!
great work as always
Slight correction for Banshees of Inisherin which all the reference clips are from: Backup, dailies colour, transcode, and sync were all handled by a near-set digital lab, rather than by the DIT or DM.
What does that mean?
@@bngr_bngr I think they mean it wasn't being handled on set by the DIT using for example a pre-agreed LUT. In this case the DIT would be handling replication of data onto SSD storage etc & then sending a copy to the 'digital lab' where it would receive a colour grade but it could also include an assembly cut of the day's shooting, which might point to areas they might need to shoot coverage.
(warning. This a theoretical interest to me, I Am Not A Cinematographer!
First time I've been this early. Another awesome video. Much love 🇿🇦
"B-cam open up half a stop. The assistant then will change aperture from T4 to T2.8 and a half" - The ARRI lens you show has markings for ⅓-stops, but not for half-stops.
This is how most cine lenses are marked. To set a lens to 1/2 stop, you rotate the lens barrel to the negative space in between the 1/3 stop and 2/3 stop marking.
Always so helpful bro
This was so much informative thanks
Love you and your channel so much. Super special stuff.
Vere level `. Thaggedhele
Can you do video on 3D movies?
Do mean shot for 3D cinema in stereo, shot single lense & converted in post or Shot for display in VX (VR/AR) Head attached displays??
Arri or Premiere what about Resolve itself? Also why would you need to apply a LUT to a proxy unless your kit is really slooow? Also I would expect give a final grade at the end. Also when editing you would also need to at least applied any pre-viz effects or effects proxies such as set extensions etc whilst cutting. Lock picture usually comes quite late in the process after post.
Kiff to hear a Saffa accent. Nice one, bru!
Another great video. Love your work. Keep it up!
thank you so much :D
Great video! Easy to follow and understand :-)
Why would you choose a REC709 Colour space unless your shooting on a very old camera. Surely you would choose REC2020 or something with a better dynamic range i.e applying a LUT to whatever you were viewing it on for later grading in post
I think LOG would be more appropriate, no?
Very informative
so valuable
I thought caucasian skin tones are best placed at 18% Middle Grey + 1 stop (which is pink in Falce Color), am I wrong?
Wow could you elaborate on this further, references etc I know zip about this, any help appreciated!
Super 🙏 congrats 🙏
So an hour of ArriRaw @4K is 2TB? You can 2TB SSD for about & £150?
I get you edit using something compressed but
I was a little bit disappointed in this video. You didn’t discuss the process of transferring the digital media onto film and then back to digital media so that it would possess a somewhat natural film look which is what they did with this movie. it would be great if you could talk about that process. 😊
Yes you can expose it onto a stock and then rescan but what's the point. That's the same logic as saying vinyl records sound better. Vinyl records only sound better because you can't play the arsey tricks with compression you can on digital
If you want to add a film look you can add any film stock or grain you like in post. Go look at the Phillip Bloom channel he can give you a good intro into what can be achieved?
On set showluts design in p3 dci or rec 709 luts sir
Usually Rec709, as you won't be viewing on P3 monitors on set. The new Alexa 35 colour science however, removes the display transform from the LUT altogether, so you can choose in camera what display format you're outputting, without the need for multiple LUTs.
@@christykail3314 why 709 vs 2020 or for that matter a log form?
I thought 709 was a older colour space due to older sensor capabilities?
thanks but i'll stick to my bolex h16 reflex
Just as I was looking for something to watch while doing some wallet designing.. Perfect!
Some what
@@billem16 Apparently he designs wallets
I want try
Why r u creative ?!!!!!
at 2:32 what are these trolleys called does anybody have any good brands or models i can buy?
Most DITs either use INOVATIV carts or have custom ones built. All the actual equipment and monitors on the cart are usually assembled by the DIT themselves - you can't buy DIT rigs off-the-shelf.
Given that RED shoots to standard consumer grade SSDs and these days you can build a SAN for silly money even if using Enterprises grade SSD, why would you dump to spinning rust? I get using RAID6 HDs for long term storage & then replicated out to tape. But 'on set' all the CZcamsrs I know back off their uSD cards to a series of SSDs & then if necessary wipe them...
👌
seemingly over complicated for how much easier digital cinema is compared to film.
Having watched both videos, it seems that shooting on film is a far more simpler process than shooting digitally.
considerably more expensive though
Why you use unreadable white text on yellow background. 😂
Datur anglers? Oh, you mean data wranglers! LOL!