Training Intensity Zones: general rules and importance of individual testing.
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
- This is a brief video explaining the endurance training zones schemes that I use in research (3 zones) and in practice working with Norwegian coaches and athletes (5 zones), as part of the Norwegian Olympic Federation model. I also show some examples of why individual assessment is really important when describing intensity zones and prescribing training.
hey dr. seiler, just wanted to send you a note where you may actually see it and say thanks for your work / research. i use the 80/20 method now for triathlon training. i very much appreciate the gains seen but more so the focus on lower intensity that doesnt beat my body up. im less fatigued than i used to be as a whole.
Thank you for breaking down how HR and Blood lactate data ranges are athlete specific and need to be measured to figure out whats going on.
Hey Dr Seiler, what are your thoughts on the current trend we are seeing in the US in distance running to "blend" workout paces? The idea is that the benefits of additional load for a given intensity will improve but with significant diminishing returns relative to the risk / recovery cost (i.e. to work on threshold you could just do 20 minutes and get 80% of the training benefit as if you did a full 60 minutes of intervals at the same intensity) and so with that additional energy you could also work on improving high end anaerobic output and get 80% of the benefit of a speed session by doing a few shorter reps at a controlled versus all out pace after the 20 minutes of threshold work. So you are training two energy systems in one workout. Over time, the idea is that by holding back in workouts and doing less for each system, you can improve more physiologically because you can now train your high end aerobic and anaerobic capacities more frequently.
My immediate thought is that this puts training in a box that ignores the mental aspect of hard interval training. Even if the above hypothesis is true physiologically and you are able to accomplish more over a longer training period, I wonder if the benefit of doing a full hour of threshold training versus 20 minutes has much more of a benefit of improving our central governor and you will still race better by doing less frequent but more mentally demanding training.
Dr. Seiler, thanks for sharing your findings on these. It’s helped me make informed decisions on training myself and I’m sure many others can feel the same.
One question I have relates to LT1 and assumptions people might make about the nature/definition of LT1. I’m sure a lot of athletes can spend 2-6 hours riding at their LT1, but is there a norm to what you should be able to spend there?
I’ve recently been training my 3 hour power. I’d assume it’s close to my LT1, but that LT1 is truly a bit lower than that 3 hour peak power figure. Is it erroneous to think long rides at LT1 are repeatable on a day in, day out basis? My gut says yes. However, I’m unsure how often athletes can really get away with training there.
Hey Stephen, is there any way I can get in contact with you for an interview on my channel? I tried emailing you a while back. Cam
Great video! It's so true! And unfortunately, so many recreational (as I am / was) runners tend to run everyday PR's and medals. Having no idea what they are doing. Sometimes even in groups!
When I started running again, I was lucky having chosen a good coach. I realized afterwards: he obliged me to buy a heart rate wrist watch or whatever I could spend. Just to build a good basis for my ultrarunning ambitions: measure my HR, my lactate treshold and to analyze those personal zones. And then in the first months, he wants me to run almost only in Z1/Z2. With just one training in Z3-5. All trainingsessions should be focused on one thing: if it is endurence of strength or interval. Then do just that. Man... that helps me a lot. Even crushed the 10%-rule...
In short: there are a lot of numbers like 10%-rule, BMI, Zones, HRmax, VO2max and whatsoever: but it's all personal and there is no good or wrong per se. It's a combination of things. And it's always your own route, chasing your own goals.
2:30 Z6+ is colored blue because you will be amidst the blue skies on your way to eternal rest.
Anyone else craving for pumpkin pie ?
A friend and I were discussing the value of high intensity workouts for 70 year old hikers. We are using heart rate zones to keep from overexerting on long hikes (5 to 7 hrs) at fairly low speeds and in training. I argued that there would be little value in the high intensity workouts as we are not trying to get a lot faster, just a little faster and able to go longer if necessary. What do you think?
That pie looks so good.
@StephenSeiler Finally someone who knows to tell the difference between HRpeak and HRmax as I saw in one of your interviews. I think it was for a triathlon channel. I use since many years different heart rate profiles to define my 3 zones for biking and running. I also think that without a spiroergometry its more or less guess work. In my case the difference between running and biking is even bigger than 5 to 7 beats. Its around 10 beats higher for running at the sam VTs. And another almost 10 beats lower for swimming compared to biking. One question that I have since many years and could never find an answer to. Professor Seiler, do you have an idea which compensation would make sense for resistance excercise when done in a metabolically challenging fashion? Like Crossfit? Would the heart rate at the VTs shift more like in swimming to a lower heart rate, becasue basically all the muscles are working, more venous blood flow return, lower heart rate? Or more like running, where the heart rate is higher and the same physiological ventilatory thresholds? I tend to think that you feel faster anerobic before the heart rate skyrockets and tend to believe that its probably lower than even biking. More like for swimming. As far as I understand the physiological concept, the heart rates for our VT are genetically pre determined. The only parameters that change are power or speed output at the individual heart rates. Another reason why all these formulas like 220- or even 180- are rubbish. If I take 180 and subtract my 53 years, I end up at 127 as aerobic heart rate for running... But in reality, measured with a Spiro, my VT1 while running is at 149. I made 2 sprioergometires on a bike with 6 years of pause inbetween. At the first one I was a lot fitter. At the second one just returning back to endurance training. Guess what. Both VTs were exactly at the same heart rate, despite not training any endurance in all the years in-between. So much to the concept of HRmax is declining with aging. Even if it does, the VTs dont seem to move. On a bike for me VT1 @ 140 and VT2 at 160. I ignore HRmax and HRpeak and go just with the HR @ VT. It would be extremely helpful, if you could provide an idea out of your rich knowledge regarding a potential HRshift for strength (endurance) exercise. Thank you very much!
What is the difference between heart rate peak and heart rate max?
Hi, loving your advice and take on the polarised approach to training. I’m a keen masters cyclist at a good National level. Wanting to start looking into my training for next year and I am considering in purchasing a lactate Pro portable testing machine to help precision in setting my training zones in the 3 model approach.
Is this a worthwhile investment?
For my long endurance rides of 4-5 hours what kind of mmol would I be riding these at, so I can match it to power and HR to define training zones.
Would I ride a 2 hr endurance ride at the same mmol/power / HR.
Thanks in advance for any info on this subject. Keep up the great work 👍👍
Hello Dr. Stephen, quick question: is it accurate to say that, metabolically speaking, the 2nd turn point (VT2) would be also when the Cori Cycle fails to be enough to "recycle" the amount of lactate acid we are producing?
Awesome question. I would also like to hear the answer. For what it's worth, I've always thought of VT2 as the point where the mitochondria can no longer perform aerobic glycolysis and cytosolic glycolysis dominates. The degree to which lactate escapes the local musculature and has to be processed in the Cori cycle seems like it might depend strongly on the density of mitochondria in the type 1 fibers and the relative proportion of type 1 vs 2 musculature that exists.
How long should my shorter easy weekday rides be? Is 90minutes enough? 60? 120?
Start low mate. It's all about volume and recovery. If youre knackered by the end of the week and don't recover for the next week you are doing too much.
I am a 62y/o Cardiologist. Started training again after a 40 year hiatus. Now five years in; Initially was following an on-line HIT program but ran into nonfunctional over-reaching repeatedly between years 2 & 3: wanted to quit. Then by chance I found POLARIZED training after hearing you on a podcast. Doing well since. I am doing ZONE 1 training M-F and get my high intensity during group rides "racing" Sat & Sun. Q1: Is it ok to bunch-up my HIT on the wk-ends? I don't take recovery weeks, feeling pretty good on 10-15hrs/wk training like this but now struggling to improve further. Q2: Do I just need to find more time? Thanks!
You really should do cpet and you know it 😉!
Subscribed in 2 minutes :-D
Any physiological adaptation advantage/disadvantage when doing high volume, low intensity base training, to train in the low end of z1 vs the low end of z2?
Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge!
With which method are you determinating LT1 here?
Why I ask is...: Mine was determined as the speed/HR/Lactate before the first 0.5mmol/l rise (Swiss Olympic Standard) and the Testcenter put then LT1 between Z1/Z2?!? (also in a 5-Z Model!), but other methodes tend to use the values before the first 1 mmol/l rise and put LT1 between Z2/Z3 (like you do here).
With the second mentioned method i would arrive at pretty much the percentages you mentioned (80% HRmax, there i would have a small cardiac drift in a 1.5h run, for me plausible by feel). With the first one mentioned (which was applied to me) i get values, which are significantly lower (74% and by feel it seems almost to easy, no decoupling at all, I run 1.75 max in traning-longruns).
Thank you for your time!
Would FatMax (determinded via Spiroergometrie) be in the "same area" as LT1, and would FatMax be a parameter, which is more reliable to measure?
I know that LT1 is by nature really difficult to determine reliably.
Nice video Dr Seiler, Im coach the triathon an ex triathlete, Im a question The norway table instensity the zona 1-2 or LIT in polarized model is 50-80% HRmax but the %HRR (Heart Rate Reserve) is 10 to 15 beats before the %HR. In my case 50%HR is below the sensations to run ERP (1-2) , im walking to 50%Hrmax but 50% HRR is more real to run. Is more eficiente %HHR but %HRmax.? Thank you Dr
Does you is your lt1 and lt2 based on power or HR? Eg my z2 is 190-230w and 128-147bpm.
If I’m riding at 220w but my hr goes to 150 should I ease off? Or stick with the power and ignore hr? Will I be going into creating more lactate?
How is maxHR defined here? If it is the absolute max HR an athlete can spin their heard to, what's the meaning of the Zone 6+ and the "heard rate going out of the window" in that zone? Is maxHR defined here as the HR at VO2max exercise intensity?
Had a question. As we go through a training block, we fatigue and HR appears to be more difficult to get higher when exerting effort. Have you looked into how HR may drift from say Z3 to Z2 for the same type of effort due to fatigue? Would such a drift indicate that rest and/or more recovery is needed?
Man, that video was too short :-). I clearly do not fit in the general population. My VT1 is at 87% instead of my VT2. It is difficult to keep my heartrate low while exercising, so although my RHR can be below 40... it will jump to 140/150 with ease with very low intensity. I do wonder if that part can be trained specifically. I mean, can zone 0 be trained, so my zone 1 becomes a longer range?
You're then most likely lacking proper aerobic base, so do a a lot of low intensity rides/runs (zone 1 in 3 zone model) to bump up your base.
if I were you, I'd simply try to be more active in my day-to-day life, doing lots of walks, climbing stairs and the like. No need to track that. Z1-Z2 training when you're intentionally going out to train.
Dr Seiler, What are your thoughts on the 4 zone system used by the Swedish XC-programs (A1, A2, A3, A3+)? To my understanding that system roughly merge zone 2 and 3 instead of zone 1 and 2 (using the 5 zone model from this lecture as a reference). Does this make any physiological sense? Thank you for posting these videos!
How would you recommend that I find my max heart rate as a runner? Without going to he lab...I have access to road and hills where I'm at...thanks in advance!
This is a good topic for a short video!
I used this way: czcams.com/video/aCZXOVJCOpI/video.html
@@sportscientist also, what's the (usual) difference between maxHR vs VO2max expressed as a HR? If I've understood right HR for VO2max is lower than max HR?
Hi, I don't understand how HR max equal VO2 max on your graph ?
Good video
What is in your view the best cycling or running test to find your true max heart rate? Would a step test on the bike be the best way to do it? I fall into the category of folks that could not get within 20 beats of my 220-age predicted heart rate.
Oh no. Don't do step test to test max heart rate. No way you you will reach your max that way. Better do 4-5 minutes long Z5/VO2max interval, then do 30-60 seconds maximal effort immediately after.
@@michwoz I second that, did exactly that yesterday the VO2max was longer and the max effort a bit shorter but it gets you quite close. Ended up 220-40 instead of 220-56.
@@st939 and are you 40? Is that why you're saying you ended up at 220-40 (age)? Thats not a terribly reliable formula. I'll try the 4 to 5 minute efforts followed by smashing myself and see what i get to. As a 39 year old I know there isn't a snowballs chance in hell of me getting close to 220-age. I looked up a Lactate Threshold test from last year on treadmill rather than bike and i only got to 162 at 19kph +1% incline.
So @@michwoz what kind of rest between the 4 to 5 minute efforts, 2 minutes max? And thr 60 second smashfest is just after the last effort, yeah?
@@gilleek2 I'm 56 max HR is around 180.
hey Dr! wanted to ask, if i were to do a self lactate threshold test, how can i define my VT1 and VT2?
because 2.0mmol/l and 4.0mmol/l is just a rough gauge right?
my max hr is just under 200. im 45. should i be worried, is that too high?
No ;)
if you are on meds it is higher. if you are a lifelong sportsman it is higher.
@@jackcarpenters3759 its funny. Froomes max hr is like 170
@@cypriano8763 He might have started relatively low. If you sport, the max heart rate doesn't go down with age as much as with untrained people.
@@jackcarpenters3759 Isn't max HR completely genetical?
hello, traduction French ou ebook French ?