The Smoky Progg's Ability To Freeze TIME. | Pikmin 4 Theory
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- čas přidán 6. 10. 2023
- Today we delve Deep into the Mysterious Smoky Progg. One Of Pikmin's Biggest Outstanding Mysteries for decades. A pattern has been spotted with this creature and the areas that it inhabits. Pikmin 4 gives us some important info which only proves this further. Happy October.
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#pikmin #pikmin4 #piktober #halloween #pikmin2 #pikmin3 - Hry
This is a really cool theory and would make for an interesting area concept in Pikmin. The area could start off primitive and linear with a path to a Smoky Progg boss fight, but then when you defeat the Progg it advances in time to a more modern, man made place.
That would be an awesome level gimmick
This actually relates weirdly well to a more general theory I had, that being that PNF-404 is generally affected by some kind of strange time-distortion effect. I never thought to tie it in to the Smoky Progg though!
The art from the stream is so good, you can’t tell it’s even pixel art
Ikr
Oh snap I didn't even realize :O
???
Krabby do you know what software he uses to do his pixel art?
@@winteryyyyyyy ni
It's like trying to explain King Crimson.
Since a lot of this argument hinges on the existence of Bogswallows, I'd like to point you toward the coelecanth, a deep-sea fish that has not evolved for millennia.
Other areas without Smoky Proggs have strangely non-deteriorated things as well, like all of the active cell phones in Pikmin 3 and the food and electronic treasures in Pikmin 2. I think part of this is just an art-style/artistic liberty thing.
Time is slow down underground and we kill a smoky progg underground.... It's related too? It's not my favorite theory to explain PNF-404's temporal problems but it's a really cool theory! And your art is sooo cute!
Cool theory but nintendo said that the reason why everything seems so "clean" is because they wanted it to really feel like Pikmin could exist in our world! And you got the thing with the glowsap in the piklopedia entry is wrong. the way it's written implies that "the smokey progg is constantly dying at an alarming rate so it's hard to collect samples but perhaps if a mamuta were to lay an egg after drinking high amounts of concentrated glowsap the maybe..." Implying that the glowsap could make the Progg stable!
Actually, I think it implies the opposite, because Glow sap causes severe degradation, able to kill Pikmin leaves very easily. I think that it’s implied that Proggs are horrific mutants that are constantly dying and reforming, and that they exude the same degradative enzyme that mutated them, which is why it kills any Pikmin that touches it, but harms other life forms in increments. Pikmin get dissolved instantly by it.
While this theory does have some good points, as a biology nerd, I DON'T like the fact that this proposes Bogswallows would die out without the Smoky Progg's influence as "old" and """"outdated"""" creatures. Basal clades CAN and SHOULD exist in the ecosystem of the Pikmin world, as evolution isn't a linear process and isn't going towards a singular "best" body plan. It's just throwing shit at the wall and seeing what works, really, and some basal clades REALLY DO WORK.
The Bogswallow's Japanese name includes the words "jawless eel" a common name for lampreys, and combining that with its ingame notes, we can conclude it's in the superclass Cyclostomi and therefore in the infraphylum Agnatha, the sister group to all jawed vertebrates. And like, I'm from the Midwest, right? And sea lampreys HAPPEN to be really invasive within the Great Lakes right now. Do you know just how RIDICULOUS it would be to insinuate that Smoky Proggs are freezing time across the entirety of the REAL LIFE GREAT LAKES? It's simply simpler and more in the spirit of Pikmin I would say to conclude that Bogswallows, much like real life lampreys and hagfishes, have stood the test of time for millions of years, being able to adapt to wildly different conditions despite externally looking so ""primitive"".
What puts this connection's nail really into its coffin is the existence of an even more basal chordate introduced within Pikmin 4, the Sunsquish. With a combination of its Japanese name, its appearance, and its in-game notes, we can comfortably conclude that it is a tunicate. And the Sunsquish exists in PLENTY of areas where the Smoky Progg is absent! Therefore, we can conclude that the Pikmin devs really just wanted to put some clades I find underrated in my own opinion in the game, and I thank them for that.
(where's the flatworm enemy though, a hammerhead worm enemy is RIGHT THERE! i love flatworms!!!!)
i like this theory so I'mma talk about it, mainly the eco-system of these areas and talking about how this would effect them,
Part 1 The Jump from Distant Spring to Preplexing Pool:
Look at the Distant Spring's roster, its the Smoky Prog, Puffy Blowhogs, Spotty Bulbears and their young, Water Dumples, Shearwigs, Yellow Wollyhops and their young, the Swooping Snitchbugs and the Armoured Cannon Beetle. Now we remove the Prog.
In Perplexing Pool (above ground) we can see the Spotty Bulbear and its young slowly appearing while you play, Water Dumples, Yellow Wollyhops and their young, Shearwigs and Swooping Snitchbugs. This suggests that the families of these creatures would of survived the time that the Prog prevented, and all these creatures made it to the new stage of Perplexing Pool. The Puffy Blowhog is replaced by the Withering Blowhog, most likely where the species originated evolving after the Prog was defeated in Pikmin 1, and did so to counter the new Yellow Pikmin that also live here now. There is also a Fiery Blowhog who most likely migrated here from another area. The area also contains the new species of Fiery Bulblax and Skitterleafs, which most likely just moved here, and the Hermit Crawmad and Toady Bloyster, which most likely were born and evolved here. Beady is also found here which is the only time he's found above ground main game, which he probably arrived from the new Citadel of Spiders cave. The Armoured Cannon Beetle is noticeably absent, which makes sense, most of the old enemies didn't seem like the type to be hunted by the Beetle. Water Dumples are too far out in the water, Y.Wollyhops can jump boulders, Shearwigs bury themselves, Snitchbugs fly, so do Puffy Blowhogs. The only species its good against is the hard to fight Spotty Bulbear, which probably is why it's absent from the Pool.
Part 2 What would happen to Heroes Hideaway:
Enemies include copy pasted from the wiki: Bearded Amprat, Dwarf Frosty Bulborb, Frosty Bulborb, Gildemandwee, Horned Cannon Beetle, Iceblown Dweevil, Miniature Snootwhacker, Moss, Porquillion, Shearflea, Skutterchuck, Tusked Blowhog, Gildemander , Hydro Dweevil , Icy Blowhog , Man-at-Legs , Snowy Blowhog , Toady Bloyster, Albino Dwarf Bulborb , Flighty Joustmite, Shearwig , Smoky Progg, Male Sheargrub ,Jumbo Bulborb
The house's cast of enemies seems to be relatively more evolved and hence the Progs were born at a later time.
Don't get use to these guys, my prediction is as folllows, if the all Progs are defeated, the House will come crashing down after it was left alone because of the years of wear and tear catching up to it. But what creatures would survive? My predictions are the Glidemandwee and hence forth eventually the Glidermander, due to their hiding abilties inside objects, both Hydro and Iceblown Dweevil, as it is safe to assume they would have an object above them, acting as a hard hat to the debris. The Skutterchuck for its immense throwing capability to throw debris off of itself and its crystal hardhats, the Shearwigs, Male Sheargrubs and Shearfleas for their small size and the first two, burrowing nature, and the Flightly Joustmite for its hard shell and burrowing tendecies, which would be the most dangerous predator in this aftermath. The rest are crushed in this event.
The nearby caves would introduce the following species: The Armoured Cannon Larvas from Doppelganger's Den, due to their buring abilities to suit this new rocky terrian. Perhaps when the grow up, Armoured Cannon Beetle's will inhabit this place using boulders to push debris. The Toxstool might be a contender, but with its two hosts being the Dwarf Bulborb and Slooch being unsuited to this terrian I see it unlikely. From Frozen Inferno, the Iridescent Flint Beetle would rise to live under debris. The Icy Blowhog has a posibilty to return to this environment from the cave, and if it would, it would have a large amount of food supply. The Arctic Cannon Larva could also become a staple, setting up near the collapsed fridge for its cold nature. From the Plunder Palace, both species of true Breadbug would rise to collect food from the great collaspe, but only the small Breadbug would make its new life in the broken home. The Puffy Blowhog would also certainly be an apex predator in this new environment and would also rise from the cave. The two birds found here also may adapt to this new environment, The Downy Snarget being small and its adult form being the Burrowing, and the Waddlequaff for its impressive ability to eat anything, which could include debris, allowing to clear out areas to live. All the other creatures would remain in caves.
Part 3 What would happen to Primordial Thicket:
Enemies include copy pasted from the wiki: Smoky Prog, Baldy Long Legs, Bogswallow, Doodlebug, Flighty Joustmite, Grubchucker, Honeywisp, Moldy Dwarf Bulborb, Moldy Slooch, Muckerskate, Puffstool, Startle Spore, Bulborb Larva, Spotty Bulbear and its young, Emperor Bulblax.
The enemies here certainly are more anicent, note the lack of Sovereigns above ground, and lack of Shaggy Longs Legs and older creatures like the Bogswallow and Puffstool. Perhaps this Puffstool is so far back in time that it hasn't evolved Puffmin. Now let's remove the Prog.
Unlike the house it is uncertain how this would turn out. But let's say that the mud would stay, but the life would overgrow. We can guess that the Bulborb Larvas would be chased out, and the Bogswallow would have to evolve rapidly but would stay viable in their new form, most likely preying on Muckerskates. Unfortunately the Muckerskates would have to move to pools without Bogswallows or go extinct in their entirety. They will by one of the first creatures to go underground. The Puffstool will follow, being outclassed on the surface, with its allies, the Toxstool and its hosts most likely being forced away as well, down into the caves, or farther out to spread. Baldy Long Legs would most likely stay but will live in harmony with the Shaggy Long Legs. The Grubchucker will most likely still live here unchanged, along with the Startle Spore. The Flightly Joustmite will most likely go underground to escape the Bulbears and Bulblaxes on the surface, which would thrive like usual. Honeywisp is unaffected from all of this. Doodlebug would live under all of this and pop up to the surface to gather food, but spends most of it's time underground. It's poison, unlike the Toxstool which would have moved out, is a new threat to the life there and hence it protects it on the surface.
From the caves, starting with Cavern of a King because of course we are, its has its own paragraph, the Toxstool as stated stays underground. The Bulborbs on Level 2 would go to the surface even though the Bulborb Larva went underground. Burrowing Snarget is up for debate, but seeing the large amount of them, they will most likely either flourish underground or move to the surface and do it there. The Arctic Cannon Beetle would most likely die without the Prog's time schtick but the Dwarf Orange Bulborbs found there would grow into Orange Bulborbs and head to the surface, or populate every cave in the area. Skipping five and six due to repeats. The Titan and Blizzarding Blowhogs are most likely, dead by this time. The Crusted Rumpup may become quite a land predator, but I assume the puddles of muds would keep them underground, The Man-At-Legs would be outclassed by the life, and would likely flee to somewhere with more human activity, or die. Ten is another dead Prog. The Bloomcap Bloyster would be another creature to evolve to live in mud and form a new species. The Spectralids all would come to the surface, the Iridescent Glint Beetle would most likely not. Gildemander wouldn't come up. The Horned Cannon Beetle and Armoured Cannon Beetle may find there way, but its all up for debate. Skip, and Waterwraith would disappear due to excess of life. The Empress would stay underground with its young, like always. Sovereigns will start to grow on surface but due to their lifestyle of soldairty would most likely move out (most likely to Giants Hearth) and the Ancient Sirehound has left in the time we played the game to who knows where.
The other two caves, the Snootwhacker may arrive at the surface and become a staple, the Mamuta may bring another Prog to freeze time again, but they would stay in the area, most likely appearing on the surface due to the life. Mama Sheargrubs, and most likely Female Sheargrubs would move to the surface to eat all the decaying plant life, and therefore will include the Male Sheargrubs, hiding under the titans. This includes Shearfleas who is already there but isn't in the wiki. The Hermit Crawmad would have to do more evolving to live within mud. The Arancode would climb up to higher plants then other creatures and pray on flying bugs, like the Scornet if they move here. They would live out of reach of most competition and have a niche in the environment. The Snitchbug might be one of its target, as it would have a decent spot in this ecosystem, hovering above mud to avoid becoming food. Shearwigs would also arrive on the surface, burying as they always have.
And thats it. This is what would happen if all the Progs died, which we did in Pikmin 4. Great theory btw, it explains the house. (I should do some wiki editing)
I try to not look too hard into lore for pikmin and just enjoy being tiny, but listening to the theory is cool.
This theory sounds pretty interesting, although I do want to mention the awakening wood, which Olimar does mention being there before and mentions how much the area has drastically changed from the forest of hope and renamed it. It makes me wonder if the Smokey Progg only has the time influence in one area or a bigger area than just the distant spring.
A bigger question. How do mututa lay an egg bigger then themselves
About the bogswallow: there are many species alive today which are FUCKING ANCIENT. There is a creature which is alive today that existed before the cambrian period aka the time where animals really developed. It's called a sea pen.
I think you're over thinking it. Humans are clearly still around we just never see them
Agreed, seeing the Luggage by the Door, they were on their way out on Holiday or something.
A rather large chunk of this theory requires assuming that a species cannot resemble itself over time, but that isn't true. Coelacanths for instance have not changed much at all since ancient times, horseshoe crabs are another example... a species "evolves" due to the pressure of natural selection, members of a species with traits that bennefit their survival are more likely to breed and pass on those traits. A species "suited enough" to its environment can experience very little change over millions of years
I think you’re on to something, there is definitely time travel shenanigans happening in pikmin, like with the caves, the perfectly preserved fruits in pikmin 3 and 4, the contents moving forward millions of years in pikmin 3, the seasons randomly changing from pikmin 1 and 2 and treasures randomly appearing in pikmin 2 when there were non in pikmin one. The Smokey Progg being responsible for the weird time travel could be an explanation.
So, I don't know about this Theory, a lot of it seems far fetched but I have another thing for the Bogswallows, they probably aren't so primeval because of something keeping the time in the primordial Thicket from moving, but rather I think it's because they are the Pikmin Universes version of Lamprey. So both have a long body, the Bogswallow has many eyes, while the Lampreys gills look like extra sets of eyes (from which they also got their name in my native language) and they both have very similar mouth, just one with teeth for ripping out flesh, and one without teeth for sucking up Pikmin. And Lampreys are living fossils and very primitive, so why wouldn't Bogswallows also be like that? But another thing, the Heros Hideaway really looks very clean, but on the worldmap, it already looks like a ruin and this bothered me since I saw it for the first time. Ok, now that I think of it, the Sandbelching Meerslug also resembles a Lamprey.
Remainder that in the distant spring there are some skulls of some unknown animals that place was stuck in time for a while
What about all the other areas that change between 1 and 2? I always assumed that the rapid change in the environment was some consequence of faster than light travel.
Or maybe, the designer's went with: '' We want to make it seem like that Pikmin are around us in real life. ''.
They kinda did that with Pikmin 2, 3 and Hey!, since the treasure/fruit all seem fresh.
Also, the treasures like the Maternal Sculpture still has saliva on it said Olimar.
Whilst I'm not sure I'm completely sold by this idea, I do still think it's a super fun concept. There's definitely something strange occurring with PNF-404, and this is an extremely refreshing and unique idea as to what might be going on. Very enjoyable video!
Im super happy you enjoyed. Thankyou for watching!!
I finally finished playing Pikmin 4 and I can FINALLY watch all of these Theory Videos! Awesome work and really interesting theory!!
I had thought of a theory that came from the obscure pikmin game, pikmin bloom. It explains that humans can’t see pikmin (and probably all other species) normally. It could be vice-versa for all creatures (including all captains, castaways, and the rescue corps).
Great way to bring bloom into the equasion lol
Also you said that the egg need something related to glow pikmin to become a smoky progg, that makes the mamuta have more things related to pikmin family.
1:the patron in their arm similar to the onions
2:if the eggs haves the glow pikmin thingy becomes another creature...
True!!
It’s pretty accurate. Olimar leaves, and comes back in 3 minutes, and the entire place changed
I think that the mamuta are some type of moths or buterflys that evolved into a more "mammal" look and thats why it has a larval state
Because open a cocoon you see will surge an abomination
@@marialuciasilva2362ooh I like this idea! Especially considering that butterflies literally liquify themselves inside their cocoons which would result in a smoky progg looking creature
This theory is held together by string. Barely any of the evidence is actually viable, and time ALWAYS acts weird on the Pikmin planet. ALL the areas in Pikmin 2 changed from Pikmin 1, not just the distant spring (and most players won't even fight the progg in Pikmin 1 anyway), the Bogswallow isn't all that unnatural since there's animals irl that have barely evolved at all for centuries, like the Nautilus that has stayed basically unchanged since ancient times.
you actively avoided every single piece of my evidence to make this comment
@@WigwamMan What are you _talking_ about? Everything I said was points that disprove your evidence. That was the point.
@@lasercraft32 its called aTHEORY for a reason bro, it might not be true but its still fun to speculate and come up with ideas
This is a neat theroy a bit out there but hey pickmin literally evolved a way to go in to low orbit to avoid Predators at night
Can't wait for you to do another Pikmin stream drawing stream, Wigwam man.
I have a slight question about this theory. I dont disagree with it, infact i completely support it. My issue with it is in the first area of pikmin 4, and even on the title screen. What is it, you might ask? In the firey blowhog scene from the title cutscenes, in the distance, we see a ladder in the background. From what we can see, it looks like its made out of some sort of metal. My guess being iron. Now because PNF-404 has all the similar qualities to earth today, with the plants being overgrown and massive, including having oxygen, and water, then by my guess, it has a weather cycle. Which means it rains. Now, the issue i have is that the ladder should not look so clean. When iron reacts with oxygen, it becomes iron oxide, or more commonly known as rust. I dont see any rust on the ladder after theoretically 22+ whole years after human extinction, and no creature is intelligent enough (theoretically) to create a ladder very recently. Yet theres no smoky progg there. And even if it isnt iron, its still most likely a metal that can rust or oxodize. Yet the ladder is in perfect condition. If anybody would like to dive into this and try to figure it out, go ahead. Any explanations I'll l take.
Smokey progg…..always so op
I love this theory it's much better than raggins theory about humanity still being alive in the Pikmin timeline and we all know how crappy matpat is about his theorys
Dude, what the hell is MatPat on and where can I get some?
Since Smoky Progg don’t get the night mode red eyes I think they target the Lumiknoll out of revenge for being deformed by it
(To be fair their eyes are already red so we have no clue if the nights makes them attack the lumiknoll or if they simply want to)
I work for Nintendo, and you got it
Yeah!
If the smokey progg activated during the day and not because of glow pikmins in the distant spring, its because the smokey phrog in here was one of any wraith’s way to eliminate olimar from the planet?
Maybe….
Me and smoky prog are brothers
When you start talking about time, you start talking about gravity. It could be that this time-distortion effect is a contributing reason for so many extraterrestrial crash landings of Olimar et al.
that also explains why many of the fauna is so small🤔🤔
this dude in pikmin 4 was beaten kinda easily by me and now we have a chance it can warp time itself
jesus christ
How would time be frozen if days and seasons are passing?
I guess it’s the state it’s in that freezes. Everything around it still goes on. The Sun and moon aren’t within the smoky profs range so the daylight cycle continues.
seasons dont pass in any area where smokey proggs are housed
@@WigwamMan fair enough but the day does also the other areas in pikmin 1 change. This just feels too far out to be the case and a dumb way to explain human stuff being intact. I do like the theory that Mamuta could be aliens though
I have a slight theory that relates to the progg theory. What if mamutas use a time ability to speed up pikmin to have flowers when smacked into the ground
In Pikmin 3 there is a strawberry that’s still growing you can find in the area you find Brittany. It never grows at all no matter how much you wait, it’s half grown. Could there be a Smoky Progg around?
Before I read the whole “glow sap affecting egg” bit I was theorizing that Smokey Proggs would use the red particles to kill the cells of the Mamuta and instead let the Smokey Progg grow inside the egg until it is grown up.
I just think the pikmin planet in general is frozen in time, or experiencing time distortion.
I think its pretty clear that this isn't real but its a really cool theory. its amazing how much evidence you can build up to make a real theory out of what's probably developer oversights. great job. 7.8/10 theory
My theory is that the smoky prog is the entire reason why enemies attack you at night think about it it has red glowing eyes it’s ghastly and it’s considered a boss and where is one of the locations you find it at night I prove my point
Your theory heavily depends on the smokey phrog being killed, but is that a fact? That it has to be killed, I mean. After a sertain day the egg will just disappear, if you just leave it be. And what happens after that? Exactly, dwarf bulbears will show up after the egg has disappeared, which could be because the area can advance again because the smokey phrog left, as he can't be seen anywhere in the area by then.
Progg was canonically killed between pikmin 1 and 2 so checkmate
Personally I don’t believe the theory but one thing that may support it a bit is the music of hero’s hideaway. Almost every version of the song including the tutorial theme has this very prevalent metronome sounding instrument. And obviously metronomes are related to time.
I was just in piklopedia until i saw the dwarf bulborb and dwarf orange bulborb are a family of the breadbugs.Please make a explaning about this why they are not a part of the grub-dogs.
I have my own theory: the water wraith is connected to the smoky progg and plasm wraith.
Its time!
PIKMIN NEW Fortune
I think the smokey progg is a mamuta suffering from the glow sap degenerative properties vs his sparklium nature thats make gloom...they underground manage to become a living vibrational being and even act like juveniles being water wraiths ...or a mamuta that consume sparklium becomes the plasm wraith
Bro thinks he’s dio Brando 💀☠️
Smoky pog
I love smoky progg :)
And guess who else comes from an alien ecosystem, the Careening Dirigibug !
Question I’m not very well versed in pickmin but that looks like the rock walls in the water wraiths area if so I may have a theory about it I will say it if asked
What is it?
@@Bighaid91 basically the death of somthing so powerful (or the birth of it) will attract the water wraith the water wraith doesn’t seem to eat so mabey he’s trying to find a challenge and plus he is inter dimensional so he could very quickly build a nest or maze or just find a way to bring it there
@@GreenPANDA559 cool!
@@Bighaid91 thank you
Mamutabortion
I don't really think there's enough evidence for the correlation of these places being "primal," with how you only really brought up one creature in one of them and gave no other proof for either of the other two being old in any way, instead explaining why another should fit in using circular logic based on the concept that had really been yet to be proven.
Hotel Mario coming next right????????????
I am watching the stupid minions movie rn
Good luck bruv.
But be grateful you aren't watching Hop (2011)
i am watching hop 2011
Good luck bruv. I don't know any movie worse than Hop (2011)
I blame pikmin 4's timeline screwery for this
The smoky progg being able to freeze time is actually confirmed in game, as it freezes time every time it spawns to play a cutscene
59 minutes
Uuuh😅 What are the odds? That humans are still alive just ther never home
nah the humans are off screen :/
Proof?
second
7d ago
First
They aint
They are incorrectly born
Thats what i say
92th viewer!!!!
Bro is dumb about what is common about the 3 places Mamuta lay eggs they all are damp a warm like chicken the egg need to be warm and damply moist 1:09 - 1:15
Huh?