Dark Tower's Ending - A RANT
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- čas přidán 10. 03. 2021
- My thoughts on the ending of Stephen King's The Dark Tower. Does the Dark Tower end well or is it a mess? Let's talk.
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What do you think of the ending of the Dark Tower?
Haven't read it, but it's a King ending. What did you expect?
Haven't read it but sounds cool
@@milospollonia1121 there are parts of this ending that are a normal Stephen King anticlimactic ending and other parts that are Stephen King at his finest
I love it! For me it worked perfectly
I kinda liked it. It was pretty poetic
How many times are we informed in the series that Ka is a wheel? That's why the ending was perfect
Good point!
EXACTLY
He was shouting it in our face the whole time!
Yes!
"It was a dream the whole time, buy we got hints" is a shit ending. I read because I thought that the actions and pain of my beloved characters would matter in the end. They didn't. The end sucks.
The moment I read it, i just totally felt what King himself said. Something like "I don't know if it's a good or a bad ending, but it's the *right* ending"
Ohh, that's a really good quote! And totally fits that ending and the series
Yes it is
kinda get the feeling its like a videogame, king gave us the bad ending, we gotta start over this series once again by our own imagination this time to get the good ending
Good or bad, it blew my mind
I want one more huge book. It takes place at the end of the journey that began at the ending of the original Tower series. With the Horn.
If you read the section when Roland sacrifices Jake to catch Walter, Roland thinks something like "maybe I could let Walter go, save Jake and raise him as a gunslinger, and then we could conquer the Tower as an unstoppable father and son duo", but he dispenses with the idea and lets him fall. I figured, maybe this time around he'll do it that way. Wouldn't that be something.
the ending reminded me of some old video games where you have to beat the game twice to get the real ending
Seriously haha
I definitely agree with you on that
I always viewed the Tower series through the lens of Insomnia. The ability to move up and down the Tower's levels was portrayed there. So for me the cycling back was not so much a restart as him actually reaching the top of THAT Tower only to open the door on the next level up in reality where he had made one more correct choice in his life before that moment. Each time he's opened that door, he has moved one choice closer to the reality where he has made all the right choices up to that point. In the process he saved that level's beams and started the healing process for that level. With the Tower being infinite he will always travel on, but every time he will live a more perfect life than the last and he will keep the beams from falling every time he passes through. Thus he saves the Tower and himself.
I love this
Do I have to read Insomnia now then?
The Man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed
And the Man in Black turned out to be a complete idiot that is killed by a telepathic human-spider hybrid baby.
@@tamelo but still.... This sentence is king's solid opening
@@tamelo in one sentence:- The Protagonist, The Antagonist, The Protagonist's goal, the antagonists goal, and the setting. All 5 are established in one sentence, and we are thrust into action
@@m.a.d.g.o.d all those are betrayed during the books.
The Man in Black is not the real antagonist. Roland meets the guy only once in 5k pages.
The desert is just a small part of the world.
Roland is like a dog chasing cars. He has no idea why he needs to get the Man in Black nor what he needs to do in the Dark Tower.
But all those problems happen after the third book.
@@tamelo watch Just Writer's Video
I absolutely loved the ending. I think it’s King’s big “f you” to critics who say he can’t write a good ending. He essentially just didn’t give them one.
No. It was a big f you to his readers. He got tired and decided to write the last 3 books all at once so he could be done with it.
One of the reasons I love the ending is because everyone in the book is absolutely convinced that Ka is on their side, Roland included, and I was always like What makes Roland so special? Then in the end, King was like No, Ka don't give a fuck about no one but itself.
Considering that he still considers this the most important series he ever read and based on the info he provides in his semi afterword I definitely think the ending was far more an authorial choice than some reaction of spite towards and outside force.
He essentially gave them endless endings!
My problem wasn't the ending, it was better than alot of his happy endings. The problem was his exert was exactly the 'f you' to not only critics but his own fans. I think it even says that if you want King's ending the book ends right at Roland entering the Tower and fade to black, but since YOU READERS can't handle that here's what happens now!!!!
The series is a metaphor for addiction, and the whole thing of resetting is a metaphor for falling back into addiction. The only way to break Roland’s addiction is for us as the reader to leave that last section unread. Roland needs to save the tower and rise victorious, and then not enter the Tower. IMO
Hmmmm, interesting
Are you an English teacher? Sounds like something one would say while reading too far into things. It is Stephen King though so it might be plausible.
I think the idea that the dark tower is a metaphor for addiction is super likely. As much as he struggled with addiction and writes about it in other books, it makes sense to me.
Whoa....
This is a cool idea - reminiscent of things we've seen in CERTAIN videogames as well, where starting a new game blows up the happy ending you may have given your characters after the first time around. SO META.
I never read dark tower, but I'm still going to watch this and you can't stop me!
*evil laugh*
Living on the edge are you?
Same
Edge of the cliff man. But also, you really SHOULD read it. It is good.
Dr evil laugh
Smarter than me....caught a spoiler in comments. Note to self: maybe read books more than scrolling down CZcams comment sections like the dumbass I am...
Oooph man that ending. one day I hate it, one day I love it, but one thing is for sure I will never forget it.
Long days and pleasant nights sai Greene.
One of the recurring themes of the series is addiction, how it makes one turn selfish and cold to those around them, and how one overcomes it. We see it with Eddie, we see it with King himself, and Eddie even compares Roland's quest for the Tower to an addiction at one point in "The Drawing of the Three." One could see Roland's entire cyclical story as a metaphor for the cycle of addiction, and his return to the beginning of the story but this time with the horn could be seen as a milestone on his journey to ultimately breaking that cycle.
People like conclusive, satisfying endings, so of course many people are going to be pissed, but personally I think the ending serves to solidify the themes of the entire series.
Come on! 7 books. Decades of storytelling. And we end with:
The man in black fled across the desert and the gunslinger followed.
I cried.
Good tears.
That is what you get for continuing to read a guy that literally ended a 1000 page , that should have been cut to less than 500 pages, with a medieval style ending, a crappy fake god in a machine. AND when he reeddited it WAS 500 more more pages obsessive writing and the same crap ending.
OK I am guessing about the extra 500 pages but since that was removed from a book that needed MORE cutting its a reasonable assumption.
There are some books that should've been short, Dark Tower is one of those books. It's funny because it's a contrast to Wheel of Time, which has 14 books, but everything ends real well despite being 14 books. It was originally meant to be 12, but it was split into 3 books by the end.
@@timidalchemist8475 well the ending of wot is allright but there are three really slow and boring books
Ka is a wheel
@@timidalchemist8475 if you started WOT when the first book was written ( i did) it was supposed to be a trilogy!!!
Is it weird that Daniel Greene rants make me feel all warm and fuzzy inside?
Yes but in a good way.
We are all weird down here..
Daniel was concerned about this video not doing so well because of spoilers, so I'm just putting it on mute because I want to read the books, but also want to show some love. 😘
Not read the Dark Tower yet.. but muted audio and a thumbs up to do my part for the CZcams algorithm!
No offence but that’s just sad man
I saw the thumbnail and, not knowing The Dark Tower, I thought the story was Dresden Files because of the silly hat on the cover (yeah I know he doesn't wear a hat but he's drawn with it so cool your jets)
I believe it is time for me to pick this up. You thus have convinced me, Goblin man!
He convinced me to the level of trust. So many titles I have bought because of his reviews on them. He's a Goblin.
I’ve picked this series up and finished it because of Daniel. It’s very good, you’re not gonna regret it
You won't regret it!!
One thing that a lot of people see as disappointing, but I think actually fits so much more upon reread, is the confrontation with Flagg. If you pay attention to the stuff we find out about Flagg in this series and the few times we see him, we realize pretty quickly that the guy isn't actually all that special. He's basically taking advantage of the unknown and many times is acting purely on luck. He even says the first time he meets Roland on the mountain he was actually afraid of him just shooting him because he wouldn't have been able to do anything. Flagg is basically shown as an opportunist and not all that scary throughout the whole series and I think instead of that making people go back and look at his other appearances, it's made them think lesser of Dark Tower because it's not what they thought of him from his other appearances.
VERY interesting take. Wow!
"Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!"
@@RBelmont007 I agree with enduring you're saying. Also, if I'm putting the time line together right, he's coming fresh off of his defeat in The Stand. There we see him losing his sense of control, and then further unraveling in book 7 of the tower.
It fits because of the whole wizard of oz (though tenuous it still is) connection.
Think about it. Who is the wizard, but a fraud in the end? And really, who’s the antagonist here? To me, it seems like the wizard, for putting them on this journey that only ends in Dorothy..... waking up.
Can I ask which other King books would you recomend to read for more information about Flagg? I seen a list of all the works related to dark tower and they are way too many 😅
As someone who hasn't read the Dark Tower series, this ending intrigues me. I mean, I like how tragic that the MC just goes back to the start, losing his memories, his relationships with other people. He must have lost a lot more relationships in his past "lifetimes" because he must have met different people, had different relationships, all for his story to never have an end.
The worst part is that at the last moment, the moment he's sacrificed all his friends and his entire life to reach; what he gets is a moment where he remembers how many times he's actually been doing it, and there is nothing but horror and then the reset.
it's rare that you see a cyclical story where you don't get to see how the loop closes
"...there never has and never will be an ending to (name of series here). But it was *an* ending."
My interpretation is that we do... the original Robert Browing poem "Childe Roland to the Dark Tower Came" is a record of the final cycle, when Roland arrives at the Tower with the Horn of Eld. The loop closes on the next cycle because of what Roland learned and did in the cycle we see in the novels.
@@ashamael "The wind blew across the desert, and the gunslinger followed."
@@templeofthesmilingjackalop9860 took me a second to get what you were saying there, but yeah! The only thing more persistent than the wind in WoT is Roland's will to follow the Tower in DT!
My son is named Roland, because of this series. He's only five so he won't be introduced to Stephen King for quite a while. 😬
My mom used to read me excerpts from IT as a kid at my insistence. It was how I got over looking people in the eyes. If they were silver I knew IT was after me.
I tried for Susannah, but ended up With Samantha. I live in Salem MA. Soo we went Bewitched!
My son's name is Roland, also named after my favorite character > Roland Deschain.
Ka is a wheel. It had to be that way, and I think a different ending with an actual resolution would have fallen short for me.
amen!
I tell everyone I start on the Dark Tower journey... you won't like the ending, but that's okay, read it again and I guarantee you'll like it more the more you read it and the more you get into the story... it's about the journey not the destination... it's very zen.
Journey not the destination heh
King himself has admitted that he rushed the Dark Tower books after the accident as he realized he could've died without finishing the series. I wish he would've taken more time.
I don't really remember, what happened in the last book, which is weird because I usually remember EVERYTHING I read or watched. I'll have to reread the entire series again...
Exactly. I understand why he felt that way. But yes, the final few books suffered a lot for it; it's a real shame.
Yeah. I get it. He thought he was gonna die and didn't. Felt obligated to get through it and finish. Just don't agree with some of the decisions made in book 6-7.
However, he did write Wind through the Keyhole after the fact
If only GRRM had that same impetus...
Out of all the characters in the Dark Tower, I think Susannah got the best ending
She managed to find a world where she could be with Eddie and Jake
It was wonderfully uplifting and gave me the feeling that the journey and heartbreak had all been worth it
Yes!! I cried at that scene. Eddie and Jake, now brothers ❤️🥹
The Dark Tower Concordance has some great essay's in it from Robin Furth (King's then research assistant) about the nature of the Tower and the Quest Roland is on. Has a fair bit of background detail as well. Worth a read if your a fan of the series.
where can I find that?
@@davidglasspool4921 From all good, and probably a few bad, bookshops
I just finished this series yesterday this is PERFECT timing are you spying on me?!?
For the record, it is one of the best endings to any series I’ve ever read. Maybe THE best.
Another aspect of this ending, is that maybe King, having little faith in himself of delivering an ending as grand as the journey(due to his accident and thoughts about not having enough time etc) deliberately left it vague. So as the gunslinger has one final chance of completing his journey, maybe King himself can have another go at truly ending the series. After all in the King Multiverse who can say that another seemingly different book of his down the line doesn't connect to the Dark Tower and give us a much more complete and meaningful ending?
I personally loved the ending also. I thought it was absolutely appropriate for the story as told. I read it as a teenager, and was blown away by the twist at the end. I had never read anything like that before, and it solidified Stephen King as one of my all-time favorite authors.
Another controversial point: I think that the ending of The Dark Tower series is why the Dark Tower movie was plausible. Yes, it was executed poorly, but the whole concept of other worlds and an endless loop certainly implies that what happened in the movie could have been one of the iterations.
The ending chapter was the part that "broke me" more than anything else. There were plenty of tears before that. But when he finally sees _just how long_ he's been doing the same things, and it breaks _him_ enough that he begs for it to be over; that's the horror that has stuck with me for years.
Though there are two things that i wanted to say when hearing you talk about it:
1. I'm pretty sure this is his 19th time going through the tower cycle. What with all the "Chassit" going around. And i'm pretty sure he has to go through the entirety of reality back to the tower to reach a new level.
2. There is an ending where we see him blow the horn and enter the tower triumphant. It's the Robert Browning poem that inspired the series. I'm of the opinion that the dark tower series is a kind of prequel to that original.
I personally love the ending! It's also a great callback to The Stand ("the circle closes", meaning the current cycle has ended but things will just repeat themselves again). We can't escape the circle of history...
One of the things I loved most of the series was Jake's growth. Thought he was a whinger and annoyed me to start, then he just kept growing on me and his end BROKE me. Amazing series & I so love an ending that stays with you and makes you think
I've said ever since it happened, it's literally the best ending King has written. There are things a bit disappointing about the last couple books, I agree, but the ending itself is amazing and I can't see it done any other way.
It fits! It just fits.
Yup, that was exactly how I felt. Most of the last book seemed rushed to me until the very end, but once I got there and realized where he was going with it...well, I remember my roommate running into my room wondering what the commotion was all about. I was more than satisfied with the ending, and I look forward to a re-read
King had no idea how to end it and he rushed and botched the whole thing. No one can convince me otherwise. And don’t get me started on all the villains endings.
This is just ridiculous apologism. You so want it to be a good ending that you've just told yourself it is until you believe it. It's a fundamentally dull, anticlimactic, uninspired, false ending. It's a non-ending. You can think oh that's clever, subversive etc. No. It just means that the arcs, plots, emotional trajectories of the series are not properly resolved. It's a non-ending. King essentially gave up out of desperation to get the series finished. Although I understand why, he should have just waited until his muse came back, even if it meant we were still waiting for the last DT book today.
@@dreamer2260 If we were still waiting for the last DT book today, with no ending given, how would that be any better than the ending we already have? This ending is intentional and written, and is more resolution than not having a last book at all.
Hey goblin man. I just wanted to let you know that I got introduced to a lot of great book series because of you. I'm currently reading both the witcher and the stormlight archive and love them both. So I just wanted to say thank you 😘
I absolutely loved that ending! I mean, yes, the book itself isn't great, but I just love the idea that Roland is stuck in this infinite loop, like a defense mechanism for the Dark Tower, while there is still hope that he might break free. It really surprised me with its originality, and really I can't imagine the gunslinger without his quest.
I love your thoughts on the full ending of the series. To me, Roland’s journey was all about reducing and eventually removing his obsession over the tower, so that he could complete the real reason he set out for it. To blow the horn in order to complete the promise he made to Cuthbert, rather than just seeing what’s inside the tower. Roland adapts to purpose in his youth, and retains that again through the love and growth within his Ka-Tet. With the horn, which was earned via his better actions in this cycle, he will indeed break the loop and continue on with life. In my opinion too, he has the chance to save his Tet this time considering so many things happened in the series because of the inhuman actions done for the tower. Mordred may not even be born if you think about it! As for the final battle with the crimson king, I can understand your feelings in particular as to why you think it’s anticlimactic, but I personally don’t see it that way. The circumstances regarding his mental state and willingness to cripple himself in order to gain undead immunity make sense. He is obsession incarnate. He’s the reason Roland was poisoned with so much of his issue because his adversary was nothing BUT that. Maybe at some point he had a level of empathy for his own demon kin and the desire to preserve them in the prim, but that endeavor ultimately revolved around the tower. His entire life, persona, and decisions revolved around the tower. I don’t know if you’ve read the book Insomnia by king, but it is demonstrated that he DID have great power. However, what he was fighting was Ka itself. It wouldn’t matter how much strength he could muster or what reality he could teleport to, Ka would have Roland come and eventually kill him. The mere possibility of death is something he is keen on preventing, hence why he did what he did and ended up trapped on the tower. Also, Patrick Danville is a kid who’s been persecuted his entire life by the king. The king in it of itself was perpetuating his downfall for acting on killing Roland and Patrick at young ages behind the scenes, while also driving himself mad over his obsession in the face of failure. It’s not like Patrick alone just erases him, Roland adds his blood, which was the only way to end the king at that point. Roland and the crimson king are both descendants of Arthur Eld, the king being a bastard offspring of him and the crimson queen. By erasing the blood on the picture, it cancels out his immunity.
Much longer than necessary thoughts, but I thought I’d give some insight into the whole ending really. Super psyched you have your book published. Long days and pleasant nights Sai Greene.
How did you gain this knowledge?
@@tor4472 reading the whole series, the comics, and looking into the subtext and themes of the entire thing.
I love the ending. But I didn't pick up on any hints his next time through would be the last. In fact I thought the story we read was attempt 19 out of 99.
The question I'm left with is since the tower itself exists out of time and space, are the beams in danger of being broken again after Roland's reset? We will never.
ahhh yeah, hey congrats on the book release my goblin dood.
I liked the ending enough because I agree I felt the tragedy of his memories and growth being ripped away. BUT this was not THE ending, there are no endings
* *spoilers* *I just re-read that ending and I guess the only remorse I had is that Roland’s hand was never healed. The new cycle was different because of the Horn but that last section never mentions his missing fingers. Is he restored or he’ll just keep losing parts of himself every round until there’s nothing left? (Because Roland will not stop even if he has no legs or arms to move).
I think it's pretty safe to assume that at the end/restart he has all his fingers.
Didn’t Gan tell him he was going to be restored when he reached the top after he cut his finger on the rose?
I saw that Doodlebob reference when talking about King Cri- The Crimson King, and it was perfect
Just came here to say hello, havent even read the dark tower
My take: Roland has evolved across his journeys, and this journey in particular actually alters the timeline of what happened even before the first book. Because Roland of cycle #19 (I'm assuming) learned to value his allies along with his quest, in the next cycle, he actually paused to take the Horn of Eld before leaving Cuthbert's body behind, or somehow otherwise recovered the Horn, before following the man in black into the desert. Each cycle has been helping Roland become more worthy--which for him means growing and valuing things outside his quest--before he can really reach the top of the Tower. Each cycle has probably been a bit different as Roland has learned and grown.
What we see in the books is probably the penultimate cycle, where he finally proves he's worthy. What's left is the final cycle, when he will arrive at the Dark Tower with the Horn of Eld in hand, and presumably so gain access to it in full and end the decay of all worlds. Thing is, we know from the series that somewhat distorted records of Roland's journeys are found in stories told in our world. That's also true of the ending. We didn't need to see the final cycle in King's books... because it's already been written about elsewhere. The poem "Childe Roland to the Dark Tower Came" is our record of the ending of the final cycle. There's a reason it's presented in the final novel after King's ending. Thanks to the poem, we know Roland does indeed finally complete his quest, blowing the Horn of Eld before the Tower. Thanks to the novels, we know what he went through across numerous cycles to do so, why it was important and what he had to become to finally be found worthy.
Ah... A Daniel rant... Quality Content I See ;';
I loved it, I thought it actually made sense for Roland and the rest of the story. It allowed me to continue the story even though I couldn’t follow it anymore.
If you're watching the whole video, there are obvious spoilers for the Dark Tower here, but if you are checking the comments and find this one before that reveal. Spoiler alert anyway.
The Dark Tower's Ending is one of my favorite endings to any series full stop for reasons you have articulated. My favorite thing about the ending is that it is so...hopeful, without being saccharine, and that it's foreshadowed in the 2003 Gunslinger on the first page.
But also, what I really love is that it creates this uncertainty that the loops are entirely identical. It is likely that Roland Meets his merry Ka-Tet in each iteration, but how they meet, how they interact, and what ultimately happens to them is not fixed, given that each loop potentially changes. That means, on some level, that you could argue to a degree that there is a loop in which you imagine the characters as Headcanon being potentially a canon loop that's just not written down. It's a way in which fanfiction and fiction intersect that is rare in most stories.
And finally, although the Dark Tower film was a pile of boring dicks, I was so excited to see it approached as a sequel to the original story capitalizing on this meta-fictional component to the story even though King himself despises metafiction. That Roland is played by Idris Elba had so much creative potential in exploring how the Dark Tower exists on two layers of reality as both fiction and reality, that it would have been amazing to have actually capitalized on the potential of that idea.
That's just my thoughts on it, though.
Wait a second. I never watched the movie. But if what you're saying is correct, did Roland have the horn in the movie then?
@@RossZ428 Yep, the Horn of Eld is conspicuously strapped to his back the entire film.
@@Nemo37K oh wow, that's actually pretty cool. It makes me feel better about the movie that it isn't ignoring the books, just telling their own version of the story
@@RossZ428 It's a shame that the movie failed so hard because the actual premise could have been incredible. I was actually OK with the changes they made because it was a sequel. It was just super boring.
King: despises metafiction
Also King: makes himself a main protagonist in several books of a series
I saw this theory on the Dark Tower subreddit that really caught my interest and essentially it was saying that the ending of the series is reliant on the reader themself. Sure that may sound weird but hey, the man put himself in his own series, of course it’s gonna be weird. Anyway, Roland going back to the desert isn’t truly *the* ending, but rather one of two endings. The “final chapter” comes after the final chapter and epilogue, King wraps up everything in a nice bow. The reason why the coda says essentially “you won’t enjoy what I have to write” is because it’s done, over, the only thing keeping Roland from finishing his journey is us, if you want to see the journey done, you must leave him to witness what is at the top of the Tower on his own. King even says, “After that came the sound of a horn. It simultaneously chilled Patrick’s blood and exalted him. The echoes faded into silence. Then, perhaps a minute later, came a great, echoing boom: the sound of a door being shut forever.” And in the epilogue he says, “And will I tell you that these three lived happily ever after? I will not, for no one ever does. But there was happiness. And they did live. Beneath the flowing and sometimes glimpsed glammer of the Beam that connects Shardik the Bear and Maturin the Turtle by way of the Dark Tower, they did live. That’s all. That’s enough. Say thankya.” He even says to close the book and have your last memory be of Eddie, Jake, and Susannah in New York, living happily. The end of Roland’s journey is only the ending that we decide for him. Long days and pleasant nights
I remember finishing the Dark tower a few years ago when I was halfway through my undergraduate degree and it blew my mind. To me the ending felt very complete. His return to begining felt perfect. As Daniel said he still needed to grow to be able to set things right. I found it oddly hopeful, all the suffering Roland caused during the series he could put right. Hell thanks to timeline shennagins and the presence of horn he likely made better/more human decisions that set him on a better path. Roland suffered and inflicted suffering but now because he has grown as a person. Instead of bringing nothing but hatred and pain to the tower. He would bring hope, love and all the best parts of humanity to help it rebuild what was destroyed by human/old one arrogance. At that's how I interpreted the end. Great series ♥️
When I finished it a year or two ago I wasn’t a fan of the ending, but your interpretation is making me reconsider it. I think you’re right that there is something so quintessentially Stephen king about it all and that makes me respect it more even if it wasn’t what I might have expected.
That sounds fascinating!
...
That moment when the rant makes you want to red the book
I was sobbing while I was reading those last few pages. What a poetic ending! The whole story to me, at the end, was about choosing what's right over what's easy, accepting the second chance when it's given to you, when you've reached the bottom, walking through the door, accepting to save your soul and then the world (because everything is connected) and just not fucking it up.
Whatever that means to anyone. For Eddie Dean, it's putting down the heroin. For Calvin Tower, it's as simple of an act as protecting a single beautiful rose from being vanished. For Stephen King himself it's about overcoming his addictions and finishing what he started. For the reader, is about sticking till the very end. The most corruptive thing one can do to oneself in this story is be lazy and not follow the path. That's ultimately what makes the tower fall.
For Roland, it was about walking all those miles, traveling all this distance, waiting for so many years, being quiet and strong, to save the world from falling apart and learning how to love in the process, only to do it again. And again. And again. For eternity. Cause that's what he has to do.
This is a story that stays with you forever.
I have this notion: At some point previously in the cycle, Roland led a literally blood-soaked path to the Tower, guns blazing all the while, and dragged himself, missing even more of his body, on through the Tower and looped. Even absent direct memories, the idea that simply cutting a swath to it stood as a bad idea, but it was easy to fall back into, which he did for many cycles, while trying to resist that simplistic urge. We come to the story we actually read, and now these rampages are reserved for no-choice situations like Tull and the Callah and maybe Algol Siento. But while it is still too much abuse of people and spilling of blood, the hard realizations have set in, and now in the new story we will never see (because there is no movie - NO MOVIE! Love ya, Idris, sorry you never got to play that role) it is more than just him having the horn. He has become the man, even in the past, who would keep such a seeming trinket - a man who values his lost friends, and will value those he gains a bit more. Perhaps this man will note the clouds' travel as a sign of the Tower. Given Walter's trap, I'm not sure he can avoid Tull, though maybe he can get out of Dodge before it gets dodgy. A man who would retain a keepsake is not the man who can let Jake go, and having Jake means no timeline split and no deadly beach nap. If Jake is alive, Susannah does not have to 'take on' the demon that produces Mordred, and that miserable life is prevented. I can't say everything goes their way, and he still needs to be deadly to do his job. The Crimson King stays disembodied, but is now even more dangerous and a mind-whisperer like to the lunatic in 'Insomnia' - yet he makes the mistake of whispering to his still embodied self in the new timeline, driving him so far over into insanity Todash eats him and ends his part in the loop. Maybe Roland even pulls a Boimler and keeps going through till a final scene of all his allies and innocents on horseback riding to the Tower and hearing a voice saying 'So the sins of the Great Old Ones are undone. Heil, Gunslinger.
One last thought: Why the hell didn't King use the songs 'Spanish Harlem' and 'Do It Again' by Steely Dan in there? By lyrics, they are nearly perfect for this.
Haven't watched video yet. In my opinion, it's the greatest ending to any work of fiction I've ever read or watched. It answers questions, resolves much, yet leaves you yearning for more. It is the literal embodiment of 'it's about the journey, not the destination.' It's beautiful. It's perfect. I totally get why people don't like it, but it's my holy grail of an ending. Ka is a cycle, ya ken? Roland had a ton to learn, and Ka is making him go through it over & over. Who's to say that the next one is even the last one? Maybe he'll have to keep going over and over again, always learning more... and maybe in 2 trips or 2,000 trips he'll get it all right and can finally rest. Maybe the final trip he doesn't sacrifice his friends. They all make it to the tower, take care of the CK, and then ride off into the sunset, being satisfied with reaching the goal and spending the rest of his days with the ones he loves. Maybe they all get there, say the names of those they met/lost on the way, and enter together, and as they enter it's a gateway to a new dimension / the afterlife / whatever. The ending we got makes all of those potential endings possible. It is the greatest ending because it provides infinite endings.
And while that is technically THE ending, I really consider Roland shouting the names of his friends & the gate opening for him kind of the end. That moment, even sitting here now typing, makes me tear up. It was so fucking beautiful. What came after was epic as all get out, and as I said above, to me, the perfect ending because it's such an ending with endless possibilities, but yeah.
Now to watch the video and see what you say.
I thought the Crimson King part was fine. I loved using Patrick to take him out, but not being able to completely take him out because of the eyes. Roland's true battle was with the call of the roses. He had to resist temptation, resist the drug (ie his version of heroin aka THE PRISONER) long enough for Patrick to do what he must, all the while shooting the snitches out of the air to keep them safe.
I thought the fact that we didn't have a showdown between Roland and Flagg was the only real letdown. Mordred was cool af, but I really needed a showdown between Roland and Flagg. Maybe next cycle!
I pretty much agree with everything else you said, except for my initial reaction at the end was the opposite of yours. I loved it from the moment I realized what was happening. I set the book down and said aloud, "Wow. That was the greatest thing I've ever read. That was the perfect ending that (my writing professor) said strive for: resolve yet leave the audience wanting more... asking more questions..."
The ending of DT made the series, to me, the 1b to my 1a, another series I know you're intimately familiar with, WoT, whose ending I also loved, yet many people hate. I think many people just don't like endings, for one reason or another.
Fine I’ll read it, happy now!
Same
Good. I’m happy now
Yes! I am happy!
The thing about King endings to me is that what most people have trouble with are his climaxes. I think the final words of most of his books are wonderful, and The Dark Tower is the pinnacle of that. For anyone who wants a new perspective on the series, I HIGHLY recommend the Kingslingers podcast. These dudes spend a couple hours every week deep diving into each section as they read it and it’s provided me with even greater appreciation for the series than I already had.
I LOVED the Dark Tower right up to the end of Wolves of the Calla. I even kinda predicted the ending (Ka is a wheel). But man if Song of Susanna and The Dark Tower didn't feel like King was hate writing the series just to finish it up. That said, while I do not like the last two books, I love the ending, and it rekindled my love of the series overall. But man, what did the villains ever do to King to deserve the send out that they got?
Couldnt get passed book 3. Ill try again someday. This review kind of makes me want to try again soon though 💚🤘🏽
You really should book 4 wizardand glass is fantastic.
@@iancanterbury2380 cool:) thank you for replying 💚🤘🏽
Book 5 is the best. Persevere until at least then.
I’d love to see another run through. The last one. It’s be great
I like to think he’s been drafting it since 2004. But that’s bc I hope he’s not starting to draft it, say, now. That’s gonna be... rough.
That would be the greatest thing
It's one one my favourite endings. It has tragic, mythological feeling, as if you are watching the wild west equivalent of Sisyphus. It's kind of poetic in that way and that makes it memorable.
I think technically the implication is that he is supposed to blow the horn at the entrance of the tower not the top.
In the poem the series is based on "Childe Roland to the Dark Tower Came" by , the final lines are:
There they stood, ranged along the hillsides, met
To view the last of me, a living frame
For one more picture! in a sheet of flame
I saw them and I knew them all. And yet
Dauntless the slug-horn to my lips I set,
And blew. "Childe Roland to the Dark Tower Came"
I really struggled with gunslinger I'm a king fan but could get on with it sadly i did finish it. But cant like everything
But I loving the farseers books almost done on number two. That's thanks to you btw. Got way of kings next. So I'm doing just fine on the reading front. Your own novel I'll buy tomorrow cant wait.
I really like the whole series but the first book is horrible. So if it's the only one you've read, I would suggest to try the second too. First book is really bad in my opinion, which is a shame as makes a lot of people not follow to the next ones
@@laiaal.3324 thanks I will. Found 1st one mega confusing tbh alot didnt make sense
@@paulbryden4006 the whole thing is kinda confusing at times, so if you are not liking the second book neither I would say leave it for good, but please give that one a chance^^
**grabs popcorn**
The first time I read this series was in juvi, and I had turned my best friend onto it before I began.
He finished the series when I was on Wizard and Glass. He swore he wouldn't spoil it for me, but let me ask one question.
I guessed the end of the series successfully, with Roland back in the desert following the man in black.
What I didn't know is that the fates of all the other characters that made up the Ka-Tet would bring me to tears.
You're right, Stephen King's ending to the Dark Tower series punches your expectations right in the face.
And it strikes a sound blow.
Still easily my favorite book series.
After the absolute cluster that is the 7 books, I thought the ending was perfect. It was only years after reading TDT before I learned that the books were never edited, and I developed a bit more appreciation for them. It's a wild ride and the payoff of not having a payoff was perfect
I absolutely LOVE the ending of DT. One of my favorite endings to a fantasy series.
The ending is actually what would make this story such an epic to put into a series format! The story could pick up after this point in the story, but start Roland again with the horn, so the series could actually conclude the story. It would also open the writers of the series to make some of their own artistic liberties (hopefully not bad ones) and build on to the story. And at the end when charges down the hill with his horn, his friends deciding that as much as they want the tower, it was never there’s, Roland will stop halfway down and realizes it was never his to begin with either. His work was done after his ka-tet freed the beams.
I love how King had to add a note after the ending addressing the fact that he knew lots of people would hate it... Hahaha. I thought it was masterful.
Just noticed you said "before" in my version of the book it was right after. So I was mad, turned the paged, and found King telling me "I know you are mad, I don't care, don't write me about it". And I laughed.
There is no catharsis and that isnt how people expect stories to work so its upsetting. But i think its perfectly fitting for the tone of the books since real life is also so rarely neat and cut and dry. Sometimes in life we just have to keep going after all is said and done.
So if he's stuck in a repeating loop, does he finally get to kiss Samanta Carter?
Where my SG1 fans at! 🤣
Hurrr
Whoh I didn't expect hear a SG1 reference haha
In the middle of my back swing!!
Wacko!
Your art is the prettiest art of all the art
I always felt like the reason we see the penultimate and not the final journey is in the final loop he would choose his ka-tet over the tower and call off his journey. Remember at the tail end of book 7 there's a character who basically tells him, "You've saved the Dark Tower. You don't need to go on. The only reason you will is because you're stubborn and you have to know"
I think in the final version at that point he'll walk away from the loop and live with his Ka-tet
I could not agree more. When I finished the last page of the dark tower, I don't think I spoke for about 2 hours. It brought very real, raw emotion to the surface. I was VERY angry with King because it felt cheap. But, the longer I thought about it and remembered how Ka is a Wheel, I began to accept it and see the beauty in it. I've reread the entire series again and love the books even more.
So far anytime an artist sets out to subvert my expectations it turns out bad to me. Dark towers ending sucked for me. Its as unsatisfactory as if odysseus never made it home. The book about Roland's past was the best thing I've read from Stephen king so the series has its merit.
It is funny that you bring up the Odyssey as a comparison, since so much of the tension of the ending is that he cannot stay home. The prophecy of Tiresias states that he must take up his oar and leave again for new shores and new adventures, dying far from home and from the sea in a foriegn land. All of the pathos of his interactions with Penelipe come from this fact: there is no home for
Odysseus; this is just a pit-stop. In a sense, it is the same sort of cyclical ending.
Stephen King's connected universe is, indeed, the Cosmere on coke.
That ending was a total kick in the nuts. Stephen King has admitted that he doesn't believe in happy endings. It's one thing to have read all the books in a row, but I can't imagine what it would be like for someone that started from the beginning of publication, & the huge gaps between earlier books, especially 3 & 4. To build up to this long anticipated ending & that to happen...wow. You bring up some valid points, but it was a bad ending and it was certainly unforgettable in its shock value.
SK always hypes up enemies and they usually end up in an unexpected, mediocre fight at the end. When you write something "beyond the imagination", something like "It" is very hard to explain when it's fully revealed.
I read the series a long time ago so I may get some of it wrong, but I recall King’s warning us not to read the last chapter, to keep in our mind the image of jake susannah and Eddie, but we still go on, because we want to know what’s in the tower, and it proves to us that we are as obsessed with the tower as Roland, he is asked not to go, he is told that the Crimson King is trapped, and yet he keeps going for the tower, just like the reader.
dang it second like
The Dark Tower is the only King I’ve ever read. When I read the end of the story, I decided I would never read another King novel...
Why not?
@@matthewbishop8395 well I didn’t overly enjoy the last few books, but I was determined to press on because I had to know what was going to be in that darn tower. So I dedicated a few months of reading time only to finally get there and realize that the entire thing was basically meaningless. I found it really unfulfilling, and I didn’t get the sense of catharsis I was hoping for. I fully understand why a lot of people like it, but it really just wasn’t for me. I figured if that was the type of ending I could expect from King, I should just avoid his other reads.
I'm sorry that you started with the series with Kings worst ending.
There are other bad ones but tdt puts them all to shame.
I never ended up reading book 7. Back when it first came out, I was on a 6 month waiting list to get it from the library. When I went to pick it up I was at the counter with it in my hands and this Karen behind me starts going off, vomiting the entire ending all over me. I looked at her, asked her what the hell was wrong with her and that I hadn't had a chance to read it. I just put it down on the counter in front of the librarian and walked out.
I always kind of got the impression that part of the original idea for the Dark Tower was supposed to mirror Dante's Inferno a little bit; there are some similar elements in the structure of the books, how the Ka-Tet travels deeper and deeper into the dying world filled with suffering people that are kind of trapped as the world continues to move on. I love stories that can make you wonder about a world's past like that as the characters progress deeper and uncover the remnants of old civilizations that have decayed beyond recognition.
Also if you've ever read 'The Talisman' by King and Peter Straub the story's structure is exTREMELY similar, and I think on purpose. I can't remember if it ties in directly with the greater Dark Tower universe (I think it does) but I like to think it's simply a different multiversal incarnation of Roland's story playing itself out
The Dark Tower was my intro to fantasy/sci-fi. Started when I was 12. I thought the ending was pretty great. Journey before destination lol.
Wonderfully put!
So I suffered through almost all of the series for THAT to be the end? Yikes.
I feel like I was an odd man out for this book. After I read this series I absolutely loved how it ended. I believe I was crying afterwards. And because I started as an introduction into Stephen King's writing by this series, I have not really found any other of his work to be in my opinion as good as this one. One of my favorite series of all time!
Exceptionally well analysis. Expect nothing less from you daniel. It seems thats the very thing I wanted to write in my blog about it but couldn't complete it. You are very good to express your emotion about a book you read. Your videoes and analysis help me a lot to write something about the books I read.
I wish more series would dare go so weird as the Dark Tower does. I loved the series, the worldbuilding and the ending of it - it felt to me satisfying enough in terms that we know what happens, but also mystical and open ended enough to keep me wondering about that story years after I've read it.
I hadn't read any Stephen King before reading the Dark Tower series based on a rec and I felt what you felt. Incredible sadness that Roland went through all that only to have to do it again. I saw his arc in a similar way to how you did: the entire story is the humanization of Roland. I see if as kinda like a "Edge of Tomorrow" time loop where he has to keep repeating it until he gets it right. What is right? I think maybe just not sacrificing people for his quest. I don't think he necessarily will do it next time, and that's why I'm sad. But seriously, great story.
If you love The Dark Tower, you should listen to the Kingslingers podcast. It's two guys who are doing a read through of the entire series, and discussing it as they go (a few chapters at a time).
The interesting twist - one of them is a diehard Stephen King fan that has read The Dark Tower multiple times, and the other is basically a King newbie that has never read any of the books.
Highly recommended, and they just finished getting through the entire series (they're now going "back" to read The Wind Through the Keyhole).
The ending is one of King's best as far as I'm concerned and I absolutely love it. I get why some folks don't dig it, but it feels so appropriate given the set up and how it re-contextualizes everything makes subsequent rereads better. I don't honestly see how else you'd end it but I couldn't have guessed the ending while reading.
"The man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed." DAMN BOI
The series is one of my favorite pieces of media, and there's some very messy stuff in there I can't fully get behind but man, what a ride.
The anime Wolf's Rain did something similar where the world restarts and the next time may be when the characters succeed in saving it
When Stephen King was discussing From a Buick 8, he talked about and explored the idea that sometimes there are just no answers in a story. If you read that story, you see that while a lot of weird stuff happens, we never find out what it all means or even why. He mentioned that sometimes there are just not satisfying endings to our stories. Now Dark Tower is at least a series that has AN ending. It ends with a beginning, but presents the idea of hope and breaking the cycle. While not hugely satisfying, it is not King's worst story ending.
I’m in the middle of my second re-read of the entire series and I’ve come to appreciate how amazing the ending is. That moment when Roland steps through the door and goes back to the desert but has the Horn of Eld in his hand you’re just like “fuck...he went through ALL OF THAT ...just to have to go through it again. “ I got blasted with all the emotions. I like that it subverted my (everyone’s) expectation that in the end you win. No, sometimes you don’t and that’s life; that’s Ka.
I found it super interesting that Gan/the Tower sent Rowland back to the desert and not any other point in his life for this iteration.
King did it well - he gave us an ending, flipped what we expected, and gave us all this nugget that will live in our brains and fam-fictions forever: what happens next?
EVEN BETTER! Finishing the book and experiencing the ending MAKES YOU want to reread it all again. Blew my mind
If I remember correctly (and it's been a while, so I certainly may be misremembering), Roland's concrete description of what he needs to do is reach the Dark Tower, sing the names of the friends he's lost, and enter. His quest is not do some MacGuffiny MacGuffin and actually solve anything, even though when asked *why* they need to get to the Dark Tower that's what he says. When he actually describes what *he* needs to do, the previous chapter's ending covers his quest. That's an end right there. The rest is just Moebian icing through the recursive cake.
It's been suggested that the film adaptation is the next cycle's beginning. It has also been suggested that the film is not worth watching, so I haven't seen it and can't comment beyond that.
The way it should've ended was Roland flinging open that final door to find his own reflection in a mirror.
The one and only thing that has been bugging me is, once Roland starts the journey again with a wiped memory and the horn of Eld, is his right hand restored? Or, does he have to be haunted by some sense of deja vu, but never know how he lost 2 fingers?
Granted, I read this a while ago, and my tastes have changed. However, I really liked. I loved the cyclical and groundhog type ending. There's a clear hint that things have changed. Whether this is the last time or not, it's indicative of the story being much much greater. We shouldn't need the final piece to understand the journey well enough to see the ending that's coming without it blatantly being told to us.
The Dark Tower is one of my fav series ever, and I agree pretty heavily. It's far from a perfect story, there are some things that were a little disappointing, but overall it's utterly brilliant. The ending hit me like a ton of bricks, and I basically set the book down and just laid down for a bit. I was upset, angry, I felt a little betrayed and it was like I needed to grieve almost. Basically my brain just made the windows shut down noise for a moment because it was just so much to process. But with some time I love-hate the ending, for all the reasons you talked about.
I put off finishing the series for years because of the bad press it received. When I finally buckled down and read through the last three books though, I absolutely loved them, ending and all. I'm not usually a fan of the cyclical ending in fantasy or sci-fi, as they tend to be used as a sort of placeholder for a story's ending when the author doesn't know how to wrap it up but they know they want something big. Here however, as you said, it ties in perfectly to the nature of the story and especially the character.
I think it also works here because of a creative technique that I learned about from Rian Johnson, and that is to always be asking yourself "What is it that our character doesn't want to hear, happen, or do?". That question helps build compelling characters and plots. In this case, the thing the character didn't want to find was that the end was the beginning.
I like it because it makes Roland transcends into a sort of archetypical figure. Roland becomes part of the Tower itself, fixing threats to reality while chasing the Tower. Thats how I see it.
Any plans on reading Jerusalem by Alan Moore?
what a fantastic take!! I like that a lot!
I think the ending fits what I see as the primary theme for the whole story: fictional characters and events effecting the real world. We in the real world (keystone earth) read stories thereby interacting with characters end events in the stories (other levels of the tower). The way we think and feel about the stories affect us in the real world by inspiring us with stories of courage or convincing us to change our views based on the experiences of other people or characters. When we finish the story where do we go from there? We start over like Rolland except we are different because of the way we are changed by the story.
I still think deep down its a metaphor for drug/alcohol addiction, the constant connections of doing what you need to get to "the dark tower" the fact of even eddie being a actual addict, back to the factor of always needing to be connected to a group and of speaking up and communicating your troubles, even the ending it self where he never is fully cured kinda like your always an addict even when your not drinking, maybe the ending being him falling off the wagon and having to start again