MiG-21 vs F-104 Starfighter - The Final Clash, Indo-Pakistani War 1971
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- čas přidán 15. 06. 2024
- The War of 1971. between India and Pakistan brought the expected clash between two iconic Cold War era fighters - F-104 Starfighter and MIG-21. The latter heavily outnumbered the former and Pakistanis remained mostly on the defensive. Furthermore, majority of F-104 examples they operated during the conflict were on load from Jordan and they could only fly in Pakistani airspace. Two such borrowed Starfighters were flying a CAP sortie when ground control informed them of an Indian group approaching them. Two of their latest MiG-21s were escorting four Maruts. Starfitghters turned to intercept the intruders.
DCS World again proves as a suitable platform for Cold War era aviation historical reenactments.
Sources:
- Peter E Davies - Osprey Combat Aircraft 101 - F-104 Starfighter Units in Combat
amzn.to/3CB4kj0
- kaiser-aeronaut.blogspot.com - Air Defence in Southern Sector - 1971 War
- Martin Bowman - Lockheed F-104 Starfighter: A History
amzn.to/3CnhAYG
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"Long Note Three" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License
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0:00 Cinematic Intro
2:33 Narrative Intro
6:51 The Clash
10:45 Post-battle Analysis and Landing
#DCSWorldHistoricalReenactment #MilitaryAviationHistory #IndoPakWars - Hry
Chuck Yeager was the US adviser to the Pakistani Air Force during this period and he was very upset when the Indian Air Force destroyed his personal Beechcraft on the ground during an air raid. You should recreate this encounter.
I think I read something about it. I'm not sure which Indian airplanes took part in this but they were probably Hunters or Su-7s which we lack in DCS. Hunter is supposedly being developed. Su-7 was available as a mod but it doesn't work in the latest version anymore.
@@showtime112 it was the Hawker Hunter F56a from the 20th Squadron of the IAF
Kevin: As a kid growing up, the Father of the family next door was a retired F104 pilot! Other aircraft as well, of course!
@@satyajitlall0606 OK, waiting on the Hunter development for DCS then.
@@showtime112 the kill was credited to Lt Arun Prakash (VrC) a Indian Naval Aviator who was serving in the No.20 Lightnings Squadron in the Indian Air Force at that time.
Curious. I saw an old globe today, which had West Pakistan and East Pakistan on it - and now I come home to this. This day has come to a good ending.
Funny how you noticed that detail :)
It was not just a conflict but a full scale war which changed the world map
Yes
JUST A 13 DAY WAR... 3RD DECEMBER 1971 TO 16TH DECEMBER 1971....🇮🇳🤜🇵🇰🤛🇧🇩....
Contrast the woefully poor performance of Russian fighter aircraft in the various Middle Eastern wars. The IndoPak wars, especially the 1971 conflict, show that with proper training and discipline, Russian aircraft can be just as capable as their western counterparts.
Absolutely not if both pilots are equal and my God I hope your not talking about present time the western aircraft dominate in reality especially the U.S. aircraft cmon
@CarryTheTruth that's true it benefits the scrap metal people when they go out and pick up more downed migs
@@thomasvelazquez9789 C'mon man we are talking about 1971 here. The IAF had Soviet equipment but they had post WW II RAF training with pilots and commanders who had served in the RAF before Indian independence.
@@colinw7205 oh that's right the training and self capabilities along with Russian training from the Soviet s wasn't enough?? The Israelis do a tremendous absolutely tremendous job of training and designing equipment 100% better period cmon!!!! My friends have a few Israelis guns not guns from the countries surrounding Isreal. The IAF is one of the best ever
It's also because they fought in similar eras. Most Soviet fighters when they fought western hardware were already outdated.
Lesson learned: Do not bring a gun to a missle fight.
I think they were sending those F-104s on CAP missions more as deterrence. As long as Indians see them on their radars, they'll keep away. Guess they were wrong.
@@showtime112 I think you are correct. The 104's were not flown very smartly. Target fixation is a real problem that has been there since WW1. I am not sure the 104's were every really in the fight. Do you know if they were under PK GCI control at the time? The 104's should have used their better acceleration and climb to zoom away from the 21's and then use that Pk energy to escape or return to the fight. However, I would have escaped as the gun was very unreliable at the time and going against missile armed aircraft when you only have a gun is a mugs game. Just set up a simple DCS scenario with the same aircraft on different sides, one side with missiles and the other with just guns... all things being equal, the missile equipped aircraft would prevail. As always, a well done and interesting video. Always looking forward to your coverage of these lesser known events. Thanks.
@@haedubabaganush I think that Pakistani ground control was aware of the situation because they detected the MiGs and sent the F-104s to intercept them. Now, I'm not sure if they knew they were armed with guns only. A serious handicap, as it was shown. Thanks for the comment, glad you liked the video!
@@haedubabaganush
Well...in Vietnam when the F4 was used without a gun on the assumption that guns were no longer needed the MIG21 s flown by North Vietnam inflicted so much casualties that tbe later model of fhe F4 had a gun....its not Just the aircraft its the Pilots , their training , Radar assets , AWACS...etc.
Whats funny is when Israelis destroy MiGS people blame the MIGS and not tbe poor training and doctrine of the 3rd world countries that use them ...not to mention the MIGS are export varients ....hahahaha....
@@johnweerasinghe4139 please let's not go to far with your mig 21 victory lap I'm pretty sure the Isrealis knocked down migs that were flown by Russian pilots who had taken over for some of the either Syrian or Egyptian pilots. Th Russians had blamed the middle eastern pilots for poor performance but then got their ass kicked by the Israelis
Hey mate 🇭🇷 that was a great narrative and a well produced video. Was it this war that India fought for Bangladeshi independence? And wow - those MiGs were deadly - keep’em great videos coming. Greetings from Oz 🇦🇺 Jai Hind 🇮🇳
Thanls for the feedback! Yes, this is the war in which Bangladesh became independent. More videos coming up.
It's the 1971 Indo - Pakistan war
The MiG 21s are our pride, they have brought fame and victory to us in many battles. 💛
An exceptional design, no doubt about it!
@@showtime112 exactly..... MiGs are always MiGs, the most original of its kind, no matter how much you may be able to copy and make them.....
@@barshankarmakar4342 how about china
@@arrogleinadtra that's what I meant to say....☝
Mig-21s have more air to air losses than air to air kills, what are u talkin about
there was another clash between PAF starfighters and Indian Fishbeds over the gulf of cutch between a flight led by Wing Commander Mervyn Leslie Middlecoat to quote wiki in the matter Promoted to Wing Commander, at the outbreak of war on 3 December 1971 Middlecoat was on a training assignment with the Royal Jordanian Air Force. The day after he returned to Karachi, he volunteered for a mission to attack the heavily defended Indian airbase at Jamnagar on 12 December.[4]
After strafing aircraft parked on the runway, Middlecoat and his wingman were forced to abort their mission when they were bounced by two IAF MIG-21 aircraft from No. 47 Squadron IAF.[4][6] Middlecoat, as leader of the sortie, was entitled to egress first but instead told his younger wingman to depart ahead of him. Maintaining a high speed, he reduced altitude and managed to deflect the first missile fired at his Starfighter. However, with the lead MiG21 closing range, he was shot down over the Rann (Gulf) of Kutch. The Indian pilot who shot him down, Flight Lieutenant Bharat Bhushan Soni, saw Middlecoat eject and his parachute deploy. As he fell into the Arabian Sea, Soni contacted a nearby IAF base to send a rescue team; however, by the time potential rescuers arrived, Middlecoat was nowhere to be found.[4] He had landed in shark infested waters and it was considered unlikely that he survived.[citation needed] Declared missing in action, he was posthumously awarded a Bar to the Sitara-i-Jurat. His remains were never found. please make a video on this
the Fighters in the dog fight
Indian side MiG-21FL PAF side F-104 STAR FIGHTER
Already covered on this channel 😁
Yeah his daughter also apparently met the Indian pilot who shot him down, they have a pretty good relationship, apparently it was very emotional for him to meet her. He's like an uncle to her though from what she wrote iirc.
@@issamislam9596 oh wow, I did not know this
I talked to a 104 pilot, and he said the 104s were designed primarily to launch and intercept bombers as rapidly as possible. You can tell by the stubby wings they weren’t super maneuverable. Great graphics and presentation.
All that is true. Thanks for commenting!
That is a myth. It was designed as a fighter. He may have flown it in the interception role but he doesn't know the true history of the aircraft. There is also a former F-14 pilot on the internet who says the F-14 was an interceptor that was not intended to dogfight. That is not true either. Not all pilots know the history of the aircraft they fly.
@@gort8203 Interceptors are fighters.
The F-104 was designed to take off and rapidly climb to altitude. For West Germany - it was right on the border with the Warsaw Pact - so - if it was attacked - they wanted an aircraft that could do what the F-104 could do.
They then went and used it for all kinds of things it wasn't really suited for.
.
@@BobSmith-dk8nw Of course interceptors are fighters, but the F-104 was designed as a fighter, not an "interceptor". Read the history of the airplane. Kelly Johnson interviewed Korean War fighter pilots and in response to their desires designed a simple lightweight air superiority fighter with superior speed, climb, and ceiling so it could dominate enemy fighters in combat. USAF had not even asked for such a plane, but when he showed them the design they decided they wanted him to build it.
The aircraft was not unsuited to any of the roles it was asked to perform, with the possible exception of being a stopgap interceptor for Air Defense Command while the F-106 was delayed. As a pure day fighter with no radar missiles or SAGE equipment it was not a fully suitable all-weather bomber interceptor, but they needed something to fill the gap until the F-106 was ready.
The G model was inherently suitable for the low-level nuclear strike role in which it replaced jets like the F-84F.
People you are confused regarding what fighter and interceptor means really bad. Fighter means an aircraft that is nimble and it can dogfight. Good example of such aircraft is Mig-17 or Mig-19. Or F-16 certainly, from a different era of course. Interceptor is an aircraft NOT designed to dogfight in the first place, but instead designed to be very fast, great acceleration, and long range missiles. Good examples of this type is the F-104 and Mig-23 again Mig-23 came much later though. Shit agility both but great speed and acceleration. Get in the fight very fast, get the missile in the ass of the enemy and get the hell out of the zone very fast. That is an interceptor. What made the Mig-21 superior to the F-104, if you look at service period its pretty obvious is that while the Mig-21 was a great interceptor, it was as well a fairly good dogfighter in the same time.
The Starfighter mod is pretty useful for setting a scene. All of those mods external models are really really good. Also, the Indo-Pakistani conflicts are definitely something not a lot of westerners know about. I've currently been reading a lot about them, and it really opened my eyes. Quick side-note on the Starfighter, but that wing is so freaking sharp. An instructor told me many technicians would give themselves nasty cuts on the leading edges. There's one at the museum here so I wanted to feel just how sharp, and man it's literally a knife blade. Great video
The mod is useful. And the Indo-Pakistani wars were fought in that interesting period when technology wasn't yet overwhelming. They still had to come close, pull some maneuvers and use guns or short range missiles. It's too bad that in DCS we have few types used in the 1965. conflict, a lot of interesting stuff happened there. Thanks for the comment!
Remarks about Longewala?
The leading edge was usually covered with a rubber lined edge protector when on the ground. One of the first things to mount to a plane having just taxied in.
Did the Pakistani f104's not have missiles? Like Sidewinder L??
@@montys420- They could carry sidewinders but in this case, mission planners opted for more fuel instead of them. Now it seems like an obvious mistake.
I recall that the USAF own estimations found that the Mig-21 was superior to F-104 in every regard.
And in the same war got divided into 2 parts 😂😂😂
Lol mig 21 defeated f15 of usa in exercise 😂
Matching them against Mig 21's without having sidewinders equipped was beyond dum.
@@priyanshusingh2043 still got moped in the middle east
@@michaelpascual3581 Because the Middle East flew the bis. IAF got the Bison, which impressed the USAF so much that they equipped their F-16s with the same Israeli jamming pod.
Always good to see some Starfighters!
Many seem to agree :)
The flying coffin 😁
There were a few moments where the graphics were so good that the only real give away was the perfectly groomed grass, unaturally flat and clean runway, and not one airport ground light cracked or broken. That and tire deformation as it rolled.
Thanks for the comment! I've been experimenting with various filters and effects. It can give you a much more realistic look over the vanilla game. At least of the airplanes. Ground objects are not there yet :)
As usual, excellent graphics! Just that, had the MiG 21FL been portrayed, it would have been even better. Please see if you can reverse the tail insignia on the PAF F104. The star should point to the rear of the aircraft. Keep up the excellent work and thank you.
Thanks for the comment. As for the MiG-21, bis is probably the only version we will ever have unless somebody mods it. But nothing's been announced.
I'll check the insignia issue, thanks for pointing out.
India win this war , pakistan regret to war with India , mig and su is hero that time
it's India who started war in 1971 only 34k were fighting 1 million intruding force but PAF whipped IAF asses in the sky you can google or Wikipedia. PAF has kill ratio of 2:1 against IAF in this war PAF got 100 plus kills with just lost of 34.
You should do a vid on that Pakistani pilot who claimed something ridiculous like 5 victories in 60 seconds with 4 bullets, or some bullshit like that.
5 shot in 30 secs
No video, no logic, no pointers
Alam made that story even paf didnt back it up but as media picked it up paf unofficially promoted it.
Later even pakistani pilot and several foreign pilots did calculations and destroyed alam which lead to him being pissed off at all times
naPakis are always prone to TSLL TALES to make up for their lack of actual Fighting Talent😂😂😂
An excellent video. I know so little about the actual combat experiences of the F-104s, which was such an iconic aircraft of my childhood during the '60s.😉
Thank you very much! There might be a few more F-104 in combat episodes to cover, I hope to do them soon.
82ND
The Widow maker!! One of my favorites!!
Yours and everybody else's :)
Don't you mean the "lawn dart"?
In pakistan's school books they won this fight too.
Not sure about Pakistani school books. But Pakistani pilot Kaiser Tufail described this event quite clearly in his blog.
@@showtime112 pakistani military and academia has habit of twisting losses and make them look victorious
They also have a habit of making things up like M.M.Alam
@@CaptPrice_ maybe if u dont kill million of bangalis
@@CaptPrice_ haha take the ratio 93000:0
😂😂😂
@@CaptPrice_ excuses are for losers. How cum u never avenged Bangladesh for more than 50 years. Aisi bhi kya kamzori
Almost surprised me with tuesday :)
It was totally deliberate 😁
Sup friend? How you been?
Great effort as always, mate. Be well.
Hey, long time no hear from you! I've been fine, working on the content most of the time. Thanks for the comment!
Uttarlai Air Base is 10Kms from my home.
MIG-21s still thunder the sky every morning since I can remember.
Their roar is most heard thing for me 😍
Waiting For Tea Was Fantastic Sort of Comments
😂😂
Excellent presentation. The best way to destroy an F-104 fleet is just to get your adversary to fly them a lot. They have a terribly high attrition rate. Pakistani planners on this mission - I know, let's use one of the world's least maneuverable fighters for gunfighting. Yeah, what could go wrong!
Thank you! I think they put them on those CAP missions hoping that their presence would discourage Indian intrusions. But that was what they had and it had to do somehow.
PAF got most of the F-104s through donation/ begging.
Pakistan only lost two of it's F-104 in it's entire operational history?
And the opponent should consider themselves lucky the 104 didn't have sidewinders
I mean the Mig-21 isn’t known for it‘s great attrition rate either. They’re both quite accident prone planes although the Starfighter is worse.
"On je jedan, jedinstven;
Njime ponosi se Flota.
U ciloj galaksiji nema
takvoga pilota!..."
TBF, Data 😁🤭
Sorry, couldn't resist it!
Great video, I really love watching these "modern" beasts in action!
Cheers! 🍻
It's a little known fact that Lt Cdr Data from Star Trek served with the Indian Air Force early in his military career 🤣🤣🤣 Thanks for yet another comment!
@@showtime112 🤣🤣🤣🤣👍🏻 Yup, sometimes history #facts amaze me! 😉
Excellent video.
I'm glad you liked it!
The brave pilots behind the mig 21 were great warriors.
@Prestallar haha... Your cowardly terrorists are great warriors right?
@Prestallar what oh really?... Can't make smart statements... That's ok... Can't expect something interesting from a failed terrorist state
The MIG 21 is one of the best fighter plane in the World during that era,and the long successful service given by it to many countries Air Force.
The Israeli Air force could down mig 21s with a mirage
Pakistan air force shot down brand new mig of indian army in 1971 war with okd f86 sbre
@@iamsalngo81 india shot down a Pakistani sabare jet with a trainer aircraft follan gnat
Thanks this was interesting as usual. Will DCS show us an F-86 vs the Vampire? I think they may have fought in the 1965 war.
Thanks for the comment! I would like to do stories from the 1965 war as well but the problem is that none of the aircraft flown by India are available i DCS, Vampire included. There was some talk that Hunter was being developed but I don't have any current info on that. Hunter would open some opportunities because it was used a lot by India in '65 and '71.
@@showtime112 Hunters are pretty cool. 4 , 30MM cannon. I worked with the Chilean AF for a while on their F-16 program. They had an old Hunter on static display. Seems like a large aircraft. Pretty cool however.
@4one14
I heard somewhere that all Jordanian hunters were destroyed on the ground before they could take off. Part of Israel’s preemptive strike.
@@showtime112 contact IAF 🇮🇳 musium.They are having old a/c
@4one14 yes.IAF musium got them. 🇮🇳
MIG 21 😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😍
The Bison Upgrade is just 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Many love it, that's for sure!
I would like to see PAF F86 vs IAF Gnats, which actually was the baseline for all Indo Pak conflicts till 1971.
But DCS don't have Sabre Slayers (Folland Gnats) i guess.
Sadly, no. But who knows, maybe a developing team from India will start working on one? I'd buy it.
The Gnat had a good record but the PAF still scored more kills than the IAF in 1965, getting the ageing Vampires and the Hunters
@@allinacan
Pakistan had access to state of the art equipment during that period, and a much higher per capita income than India so they had the money to buy those. India relied on quantify to counter their quality. So even if though there were more kills, India took the cup.
Funny that the date in this video is where everything changed for pakistan.
Excellent work.
Thank you for your comment!
Must be a ton of work to make these videos Great Job. is this better, I don't think I've ever missed one video.
Well, let's just say that I can produce one video per week with a 'standard' effort. When I forget about doing anything else, I can produce two 😁
Super interesting topic. Unfortunately the sound / comment mixture is such that comments hardly understood.
No matter whatever planes pakistan puts in battle India's MiG-21 is the answer for everyone 👍👍
Too bad they will be retired soon.....
Yeah with Abhinandan 😂🤣✋👊😎🇵🇰
@@greaterpakistan5586 yes ....abhinandan sirf naam nahi wo revolution hai jo agey bhi aaise hi datke muqabla karegi
@@desikalakar...3854 datt ke muqabla tea is fantastic ke saath. Dreams are allowed 😂🤣🤡
@@greaterpakistan5586 They will retire with Generation 4+ world class Tejas MK II taking their place, which takes the cake from every International Bid for the value for money Arms deals.
Stop the fruitless War over senseless century old Religious reasons, and stop cross border Terrorism. Neither Islamic Fundamentalism nor Hindutva is going to put bread on our plate. Without putting the leash over Pak Army funded Terrorism in India and Afganistan with inncent Taxpayers' money, Pakistan can never be "Great".
Ditch the Religion and be a rather sober Democratic state. #MakeLoveNotWar #GivePeaceAChance
Excellent Graphics!
Thanks for commenting!
One day before this battle, 93k Pakistani soldiers surrendered in front of indian army on the eastern front.(Bangladesh)
Animation is well-made, what software is used
DCS World. It's not really animation software but a flight simulation.
Boss I like the animation and story compilation
I like your comment :)
Great presentation.
Thanks, glad you liked it!
Its the arms embargo on Pakistan that saves India everytime.
Actually the Indo-Pakistani wars are well known in the UK thanks to our links with both countries.
UK might be an exception.
@@showtime112 So what exactly is "The Western World" ?
Starfighter's turn rate against the MiGs would not help them at all, even if they were armed with AA. They would find it difficult to get in the cone.
Possibly. Even though it seems the F-104 wingman was able to get behind a MiG-21 after a head-on pass. Many would probably claim this impossible 😁
I was a Kid 11 years old when PAF fought IAF in 1971 in former East Pakistan . Sabres, the Korean era jet shot down the Mig 21. It’s the pilot skill to. I witnessed the dog fight over Dhaka Airport.
@@shahzadyousuf9946 Thanks for sharing that!
@@showtime112 No worries.
@Prestallar in vietnam all the us fighters were equipped with missiles. But too many phantoms were shot down. That made them open the elite fighter school to train the pilots to dog fihht. Am I correct so far?
excellent
Thanks, I'm glad you liked it!
After the Mig 15, the Mig 21 is the greatest fighter aircraft over 60 yrs. Won us many battles and instrumental in the growth of airforce.
WHAT😅🤣😂THE GREATEST AIRCRAFT, please tell me your not that dumb
The F-15 would beg to differ.
The mig 21 was your great aircraft not the world's greatest cmon get out of your shell
@@thomasvelazquez9789 the Mig 21 lasted with our aircraft for decades and was produced locally. We became the 5th largest airforce in the world thanks to Russian help.
@@thomasvelazquez9789 as good as my english is... The above comment is talking about us.. Not the world.. Stop being triggered about everything
lovely animation
I'm watching this on the 16th of December 2021 which celebrates 50 years of the Bangladeshi liberation war of 1971. My wishes to the Bangladeshi brothers who will see this comment. And a big thank you to showtime for covering this event. Regards.
Thank you very much for this comment! And I congratulate you on the 50th anniversary of independence!
@@showtime112 hey there! Thank you buddy. I'm Indian actually, but we do celebrate this as a day of victory here in India as well, so thank you for the wishes
Star fighter was not manevourable, any way indian pilot got credit for shooting down star fighter
It still managed to get on the lead MiG's tail 😉
Quality of Indian fighter pilots are very good. I know at least one who chose NDA over IIT, Kanpur.
“IS” not “ARE”.
Sorry.
Two of the sleekest, most beautiful planes ever made.
NO WINGS ON THE MOST DANGEROUS FIGHTER (STARFIGHTER) OF ALL TIME. ABOUT 150 GERMAN PILOTS LOST THEIR LIVES IN THIS FIGHTER.
Don’t know why this cropped up on my feed, and saw the two adversaries, I didn’t bother.
The comment section must be a flame war so I moved on.
Everywhere on the internet. Everywhere.
It’s incredible.
No doubt in that Mig 21 s provided great service to our nation.... But it's time to retire them before more pilots losses their lives
Yeah, that seems to be the rational way of thinking.
The F-104s mistake was letting the mig get close
Do Sabre stories from 1965 Indo-Pak War as well.
Some of those will be covered in the near future. But a few have already been covered, check them out.
Did the Pakistani f104 not have Sidewinder missiles during this conflict?? And you answered this in ya vid great work! 👍 can't believe they chose to have the fuel over the missiles in the Jordanian f104s in home base cap
I guess they probably thought that the presence of F-104s would deter Indian airplanes and they wouldn't even have to fight. Thanks for commenting!
Pakistani starfighters were equiped with sidewinders..even 25 percent of our sabres were equiped with sidewinders
@@696pk was answered brother , Pakistani pilots were brave men choosing extra fuel over missiles, let's 🙏🏽 that 1 day we can all be 1 with 1 ❤️ and we can all live happily
Interesting
Thanks for the comment
Super graphics
Thanks for the comment!
Muito bons esses vídeos. 👍🏽🇧🇷
Thank you very much!
Can you please also simulate the encounter between a PAF F-6 and an IAF MiG-21
Covered in a recent video.
Phantom Killer vs Widowmaker
This war and the Vietnam War had a huge impact on the design of the US 4th gen fighter later on, where the maneuverability of the aircraft became important again.
Aye yo showtime I would love if you recreate the 3rd and 4th f104 shot downed from mig21 (Sources Iaf combat kills of 1971 confirmed National interest Migfly and Bharat rakshat) so 4 f104 star fighter were confirmed to be shot by mig21 in the 1971 war even tho Pakistan admitted lose of 2 to migs but actually it was 4 to migs
I'll try to find more info on that and possibly put it on the list.
What happens when a loan aircraft is lost, does the host country need to replace or compensate?
I suppose that depends on the individual agreement. The nation that loans any weapons must know that there's a chance they will be lost. There was probably some kind of a compensation agreed.
The game has even simulated the scratches in the glass😅 Awesome
DCS is the most advanced military aviation sim so far.
Nice video
Thanks for the comment!
It is a rare to see MiG's get a good positive k/d ratio, albeit in this war only downing 3 or 4 jets for 1 loss 😁.
True. The war was limited in duration and Pakistan only had a handful of F-104.
I wonder what are the kill statistics of the R-3S and how it compares with other similar timeframe early IR missiles. Looks like India didn't have much trouble with them?
I haven't exactly done much research. If you look at two MiG-21 vs F-104 encounters, the MiGs launched three missiles and one of them hit. That's amazing statistics for the period but the sample is small.
That missile was a copy of an American sidewinder A COPY!!!
@@showtime112 very very small
@@thomasvelazquez9789 The original R-3 was the straight copy of the 9B, the R-3S had rocket motor and seeker improvements afaik.
You are really talented, great video😎
You know what they say, it takes a talent to recognize a talent 😉
4:11, In fact there were two more possible choices for Mach 2 fighters at thet time. EE Lightning from the UK and Saab J35 Draken from Sweden.
The audio in the video was difficult
does anyone can help me I need
some information about this game
wich device can play this game or dcs
and how it's work 🤔
Hello! You can only play DCS World on a PC. If you have one, you can download the game installation here:
www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/downloads/world/
Basic package is free, you get two airplanes and two maps. Others are paid but you can test them free for two weeks. It is complicated to learn but there are plenty of tutorials to help you.
@@showtime112 can I play it offline or
it's full online
@@ibrahemseediqyar652 You can play online or offline, anyway you want to.
This is a hard one for me, because if I had to choose to support either India or Pakistan in a war, I would support India, but the F-104 Starfighter is my favorite of the Century Series, and so I want India to win the war, but don't kill my beautiful Lockheed Starfighters!
Tough choice, indeed 😁
The HAL Marut, the other aircraft mentioned, was designed to be an interceptor but due to underpowered engines was never to be one and was used for ground attack only, a good airframe wasted. Pakistani airforce was more dominant in the Barmer (Uttarlai) sector throughout the war despite that they lost 2200 sq km in the Sector.
There used be an Indian administrative office deep into the vast Tharparkar district of Sindh(Paxtan) which borders my home district Barmer(Rajasthan).
Pak air domination over our sand dunes was worthless 😅
Our people helped army in every manner, faught bravely alongside our soldiers. Hundreds of PIECEFOOLS(☪️🕋) were butcherd in My district by a local ex feudal lord for their loyalty to their holy religion and Allah created holy moly paxtan.
There was no tank regiment in Indian army devision here, so Indian army opened up the silencers of their Jonga Jeeps at night and scared off Pak tank regiment.
Almost all of tanks were captured and crew run off for another day 😅
You would also like to know during the counterattack by PAF after the Indian Airforce bombed terrorist camps in pakistan territory a F16 was shot down by a MIG 21 as late as in 2019
🤣🤣🤣 In dreams only
History of our military time.
I really enjoy it when people who has never ever touch even in static displays a fighter aircraft give an opinion on flying or capabilities of such a precious warfare piece....planes are what they're supossed to be a man operated machine....so if the operator is very well trained and current that will make a diference for the outcome of the encounter...
Combat outcome is decided by a lot of factors. Capabilities of a weapons system are just one of them.
@@showtime112 i'm a retired fighter pilot with combat experience and apreciate your work a lot....keep it up...well done showtime
@@luissierra2350 Thank you very much, I'm very happy to hear it!
Do the 1971 war PAF F86 shoot down of the IAF MiG21 as well. Both are available in DCS. Maqsood Amir vs. Tejwant Singh.
That one was already covered, you should be able to find it in the 'Indo-Pak Wars' playlist on the channel.
@@showtime112 really? Can I get past the flame war??? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
I will check it out. Thank you….
From F104 to F16, no one can escape this boomer era fighter...god bless Mig 21
You may say what you want about it, but it was certainly one of the most successful and iconic jet fighters of all times.
F-16??? Another of your wet dream!! Nandu, didn't manage to fire a single missile from the Bison and all 04 missiles are on display along with Nandu Aircrfat wreckage. Pakistan has invited Independent observers to come and visit and put an end to Indian wet dream. Till day nothing concrete from Indian side to boost up their claim
@AVIATJET F-16 was shot down with what?? Abhinandan Jet! The missiles are on display, Nandu faced heavy Electronic jamming, do you really think he was going to shoot down an F-16 in a BVR combat? There is healthy data on ourside as well that an Su-30 was brought down over Indian occupied Kashmir. Even the locals were recorded saying that An Indian jet in Flmes was seeing rushing for an emergency landing and I furyer add to my claim what was an Mi-17 chopper doing in middle of an heavy Ariel activity? From the number of personals killed it clearly sounds like a rescue mission for Su-30 piolts. PAF has outclassed IAF in that day when Indian Air defense shotdown their own aircrfat mistaking it to be PAF jet.
@@ZamanKhan-gw8bq that is yours wet dream of downing su30. Hear yourself how hypocrite you sounds right now one side you denying F-16 shot down because no wreckage shown by India other side also claiming for shoot down Su30 with no proof but coz your Mãdarshachãps media and DGISPR have told you. Where is that 2nd pilot vanished who was admitted in Pakistan Army Hospital ? Your DGISPR clearly admitted for having two different Indian Pilot but one suddenly vanished 🤣 for year you guys where Celebrating for having Israeli pilot who was flying Indian jet as per you Mãdarshachãps. It is highly possible that R-73 launched by Abhinandan might hit your JF-17 or Mirage-5 as they where returning after dropping H-6 bombs. Your Airforce knows what they lost... You guys even denied bodies of your Soldiers in Kargil and you think your Airforce will admit for loosing jet against India. Meanwhile you guys are still Bhikari can't even buy 350cc bike go drive your 80cc outdated junk bike because that's your Aukaad
@AVIATJET Nandu Bison had all 04 missiles intact when it was shot down Nandu didn't fire a single Missile. Even he himself has not spoken of it. The reason he went deep Inside Pakistan Airspace was because of jamming he had no idea where he was totally blind. Secondly SAMs were not operated by Pak side, PAF is not stupid to use SAMs when we had multiple assets air Born and can eaisly lock on to a Mig 21.
Why weren't Pakistani fitting Sidewinders on the wing tips of the F-104 and external tanks on the underwing pylons?
There are lots of air combat stories of 1971 indo-pakistan war. These legendary USSR era mig 21bison aircraft are still working in Iaf with limited amount. In 2019 february indo-pakistan air skirmish at kashmir, mig 21( squadron leader abhinandan) got it's new kill F16 of paf.
Yeah. There's a video about this on the channel. Not everybody agrees on how things happened though.
@@showtime112 the pak government told the we shot down 3 aircraft, 3 pilot s captured. Then they tell that only 2 aircraft (MiG-21 SU 30mki) has been shot down, 1 pilot ( dusra banda)is Isreali😂. Why the hell there will be 1 person which is Isreali in a russian twin seat jet(SU 30mki)? some witnesses told that there were 3 people. One was WC Abhinandan and the others 2 might be from f16.
The claimed F-16 kill is BS. The only fighter plane shot down that day was the Indian Mig 21.
@@JR-ut2ne really you don't know the truth🤣. Pakistani are very smart to hide the truth.. There is lots of mobile videos..
@@vimalkumar3815 Nah man there is zero video evidence and no wreckage that can be attributed to an F-16 and the shot down IAF Mig 21 had all it‘s missiles still attached when it crashed. The claimed F-16 is as absurd as the Pakistani claim of downing an Indian Sukhoi.
the mikoyan mig-21-fishbed vs. lookhred f-104 starfigter f104--starfigtets. the f104 was superior fighter.
Was Chuck Yeager in the 104?
He did fly it. There was that altitude record I believe.
What type of trees are these in the background ? They look like date palms, and we have them, but so many ? In the Punjab, we would have more of Azadarichta Indica, Dalbergia Sissoo. Ficus Bengalensia & Mangifera Indica.
This is not really the map of Punjab as it is not available. It's Southern Turkey / Northern Syria as the closest stand-in.
@Showtime112 OK. But am surprised that maps of India are not available. Now if this had been for the IAF stations in Rajasthan they would have fitted to a T
Truck vs car = car. One of the few times car wins against truck.
A F-104 getting on the 6 'o clock of a MiG-21 was quite a feat!
It does seem odd 😁 But I guess it could be flown effectively and even turn well enough.
Though India used Russian equipments their tactics and training were modeled on British and US
Yeah, Indian pilots were supposedly very disappointed with the level of training the Soviets offered.
@@showtime112 they never took any training other than type conversation from the soviets.
The way that encounter happened it cannot be concluded that one type was superior to the other. The Indian MiG-15s had infrared air-to-air missiles while the Pakistani F-104s were not so equiped for that mission.
That is true for the whole war. Pakistanis only had a few Starfighters and used them rather carefuly while Indians had over a hundred MiGs.
One 104 was also shot down during the raid at Jamnagar by Flt Lt Soni. The pilot couldn’t eject.
True. There is a video about it on the channel.
The Starfighter had the nickname "widowmaker" among Nato pilots.
A game that could be really useful for these kinds of videos would be war thunder, BUT it wont be worth it, because the accuracy isnt as high as DCS, and mainly because there is a huge grind for all the vehicles. But you are doing some great work with what you have, keep it up.
I thought about WT briefly but as you say, it's a lot of grinding :) IL-2 gives a lot of options for WWII scenarios and I'll probably go that way along with DCS. Thanks for the positive comment!
Go India!
Jordanian air force squadron was sent to Pakistan by late King Hussein.
The comments are hilarious.
The Mig gets a lucky kill based on a pilot having severe target fixation, and a complete lack of situational awareness, to the point of ignoring his flight leader, and people think the Mig is somehow superior.
The loss of the F-104 is due to a complete and utter failure on the part of the unfortunate deceased pilot. Period.
A well trained and situationally aware pilot in the F-104 would have never entered a flat turn fight, and never continued a flat turn. Nor would he completely ignore his 6 o'clock AND his flight leader's warning.
Comments usually are hilarious in any video that deals with Indo-Pakistani Wars :) You could argue that the number of clashed between F-104 and MiG-21 in this conflict was too small to draw any definitive conclusions.
Do dcs have hf marut mod
Unfortunately, no.
@@showtime112 hopefully it will be made by some one.
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Thanks for commenting!
Vietnam war sky hanoi This battle is even more fierce
Mig 21 is not only for fighting, it can also be milked ..... especially those in IAF
The Star Fighters are almost no wings/maneuver but all engine and altitude. With enough built in canon and machinegun fire, it would have been great at that time.
Pretty much true.
Something about the starfighter just screams Speed and it just gives off that aura of cool and sexy. Now if we could just get a modern reimagining.
Landing gear, lex, wings, stabilators from the hornet tail from the f16 and cockpit and engine from the f35 could be something special
It is certainly charismatic :)
F104 was known as The Widow Maker in West Germany, because so many of them kept on crashing and killing many pilots
Took about stating the obvious yawn
@@alanwayte432 talk about commenting lame stuff,