Milwaukee 8 Problems Part 3 | MAJOR FACTORY DEFECT FOUND | Kevin Baxter - Pro Twin Performance
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- čas přidán 25. 11. 2020
- Milwaukee 8 problems found. Harley M8 Factory Defect Found. In this video we uncover why this engine was making loud banging noises for over 20,000 miles. We tear down this Harley Milwaukee 8 step by step. This is part 3 of a 3 part series. Harley M8 vs Twin Cam. Which is better? Is the Twin Cam Harley better than Milwaukee 8? Or is the Harley Milwaukee 8 better than the Twin Cam?
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723 W Winder Industrial Pkwy
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As an owner of a '17 Road King, I hope you send this complete video to H-D because there is zero excuses for that sloppy work given what they charge us for the bikes. Great Job!!!
Made In America , Ain't What It Used To Be!!! Peace ;-)) 2013 RKC owner mine seems great 32000 miles. Fingers Crossed!! Shame on Harley!;-(((
Yeah yes you're probably right you'll find piston Oilers are plugged I'd almost bet on it
@@goldysmith6953 I just bought a 21 m8 roadglide, I hope quality control solved most all of the issues
@@AmericanPatriot-cw9xe I'm looking at the low rider ST and doing this research to know what I should do ahead of time to make it last as a long as possible.
RIP HD 1903-1999
As a Harley tech, I've had to replace a couple bottom ends due to stuff being left/dropped into crankcases. And whatever dealership this bike went to should fire their techs for incompetence.
you would have to fire them all. The best way to fix a Harley is to only use after market part and never let Harley mechanics touch it. Take it to a mom and pop place that cares about thier reputation.
@@hankjones2975 really makes me wonder wtf might be going on that I’m not aware of. I already feel like Harley Screwed me because i have a 2018 Softail Deluxe, Harley should have stepped up and corrected the Sumping and blow by issues (i don’t mean as they did for the 2020 owners but for those of us stuck with having to pay ourselves for the fix. I did replace my M8 107 insufficient stock oil pump with a screaming Eagle high performance Oil Pump, hopefully that corrects the Sumping issue. This here Ho we’re is unreal. Great Channel by the way.
Crank bearing housing in the case
H.D. owes this man a new bike.
They don't owe him a new bike. They owe him a rebuilt to factory specs Milwaukee 8 engine. Then it will be as good as new. Actually better because a single mechanic did the repair. The owner will walk away ahead of the game. Harley will add another blemish to their quality control tactics. Which looks to be missing in action.
agreed,,,new motor,,,,,,extended warrantee or not,
I would agree on that
😊 Omer
Sad the owner had to live with this issue for years. Happy that we had the opportunity to watch the teardown and troubleshooting process.
for sure sir. he figured months down in total.
@@KevinBaxter He should have been given a brand new bike.
should not mater about extended warranty as fault was reported in original warranty period and not delt with correctly
Yes, but you have to keep the record of coming in with the problem . So many just lose the receipt , which they shops count on, Dodge tried this on my sons transmission problem, told him to come back after he put more miles on it to see if it "Corrected" itself. I've been through these issues before, he learned, he did it, they tried their game, but he had his documentation which = under warranty repair.
@@Wooley689 yeah we all lose our receipts so the wife doesn’t see it! 😂
@@jackedhorse There is a Harley Dealership here that has a sign at the parts counter......... "For a $10 tip I'll print out another receipt listing what you told your wife the parts would cost."
@TJF Denver I AM CONSIDERING BUYING A FIRST HARLEY. I AM VERY SKEPTICAL/LEARY OF THE MANUFACTURER QUALITY. AFTER WATCHING A VIDEO ABOUT THE 103" PROBLEMS AND NOW THESE ISSUES, I THINK I'LL STEER CLEAR OF THIS (H/D) BRAND. I WILL BE 64 IN FEB. AND JUST BOUGHT A 2012 CAMRY IN MINT CONDITION. BECAUSE OF IT'S NEW LIKE CONDITION AND BEING A "JAPANESE ENGINEERED" VEHICLE, IT SHOULD BE THE LAST CAR I "NEED" TO BUY. THE GOLDWING IS A "WISE" CHOICE. I HOPE YOUR '06 W/G HOLDS UP. CHEERS.
@@seymourscagnetti1413 Smart guy.
It would be interesting to see a follow up video of this engine firing up and running when you get it put back together.
Put a new Engine. Don't junk back
That was like being in school.
Kevin is so darn talented, I wish I knew half of what he has forgotten. Thank you for these.
I also wish I knew half of what he knows
As an owner of an M8 I was fascinated with the developing horror show. I don’t see how that much debris could have stayed behind after machining; it would have fallen out spontaneously during subsequent handling. I would really like to hear H-D’s response. If there was one employee who did that to one engine, he might have done it to more. A general recall of engines built around the same time might actually be in order and the owner should be given a brand new motor and vip tour of the factory (before lawyers get involved).
When parts get machined the machines spray a coolant of a kind on the tools to cool them off once it dries it’s actually really sticky if not washed off. It not falling out is fairly normal. See it all the time
Ask OLD dealer mechs on Facebook groups and forums about the stuff they found in Shovels during labor troubles! We love our bikes but the people building them are bored to tears on a good day at a factory not famous for great labor relations....
Have to say that am teally impressed with the investigated tear down and homest approach to finding the problem. Well done !!-
HD should give him a new engine. Like that will happen. But thats what he should get
He has extended warranty, that means he'll get a new motor
@@jamesmcroberts2257 The sad part is that Harley sticks their customer with the responsibility, and push them, to buy an extended warranty program knowing all along that their product’s QC isn’t what it should be to assure the customer a trouble free experience. The new product is overpriced to begin with. That’s why this MoCo is going to fail..... Things like this should have never got out the door with the regularity that it does.
@Mike JW What good is a mew engine when the design is flawed? I'm not saying HD shouldn't step up but this goes back to poorly engineered designs. Harley uses its customers as guinea pigs to figure out their own design and manufacturing flaws.
A new motor has no better chance of not having the same problem as the original new motor! When dealing with factory original problems it is often better to rebuild what you have instead of getting a new motor with the same problem.
It's just the roll of the dice..customer just happened to get the motor built by "that guy" at the manufacturer. Same problem at my job brand new car off the truck not even 10 miles on it and had 0 oil psi...the assembly line person left the packaging paper on the pick up tube! Lesson of the day...don't be the hack at work!
Just watched Parts 1, 2 & 3...Awesome series! Thank you for taking the time to film it and allow us to peek over your shoulder! 👍
another reason why you never buy 1st year build of anything
Me pats my 2015 103 twin cam :)
It don't matter with Harley Davidson. It's been 4 years still not fixing issues.
Unless it's a Japanese bike 😉
@@dennisdethloff7467 JAPANESE FACTORY WORKER'S BREAK: CALISTHENICS.......AMERICAN FACTORY WORKERS BREAK: DOWN A "40 oz." AND SMOKE A JOINT. .....PLEASE DON'T ASK ME WHAT I KNOW ABOUT THE VAN NUYS, CA. FIREBIRD-CAMARO PLANT IN THE 70's (WHICH, TO NO ONE'S SUPRISE WAS DEMOLISHED DUE TO POOR SALES).
Has nothing to do with first year of manufacture this is pure negligence of the machinist, QC, every worker who put a piece inside that engine, and any dealership who he took his complaints to that ignored him. I used to be an automotive technician and I’ve never seen anything like this on a car. I’m currently a machinist. If they do anything like we do for quality control it’s actually rather simple. A part gets run through castings first. After the cases are milled and ready to be built they go to QC but not before they are washed off. Then they go to another plant to be assembled. Then they get put through another QC
I actually called this issue in the first part because the only time I’ve ever seen this problem before was within the plant I work at. If the other QC catches something that’s the fault of our plant they send it back as a unit so we can see exactly what we fucked up and how to fix it. I’ve seen this one time doing what I do and the whole machining plant got an ass chewing from hell over it
It’s no wonder Harley is losing market share
Yes. Very sloppy. Not like it’s an engineering problem. I’d be more accepting of that !
Wow. So the M8 engine design, build and reliability are certainly impressive, especially it's ability to continue to function, given the size and amount of shavings present from day one! Dare I say near bulletproof? Sad the same cannot be said for HD's QC and the low level factory technician(s) responsible for this engine build. Inexcusable...
It's a (mostly) good design; but whoever decided on the right side spark plugs should be slapped. They're a real PITA to get in and out, especially the front cylinder, right side plug and wire. Nothing should be that g'damn difficult; and the amount of dirt and debris that collects around the plug is insane. You absolutely have to blow it out with air before you take that plug out or you're going to get all kinds of shit in your cylinder
I would tell Harley to give me a fresh motor I wouldn't want that motor after all the heat that's been in it !
I’d rather have this guy rebuild it than have Harley Davidson give me another piece of junk. At least you know what you would have. He seems very competent. ,,, New doesn’t mean better when it comes to these engines . Specially in the first years of manufacturing
You have it covered Kev. Hope HD steps up to the plate and give him a new motor. You’ve done well.👍🇦🇺
He'd be better off with Kevin doing the rebuild using seasoned cylinders than a brand new motor from the MOCO.
Stop, you don't believe in magic do you?
Fantastic series!!! You definitely havecshown the proper way to meticulously tear down and investigate!! Thank you for this series!!
Glad you enjoyed it! Thank you sir....and i appreciate your support. Thank you.
When your Wrench says "Oh WOW!!!" Brother, you're about to spend some M.O.N.E.Y.
"If you can't have fun - Don't go to work" Love It!
Great mini series! Thank you for taking the time to share.
Just watched Parts 1, 2 & 3...Great series Kevin. Thanks some much for taking the time to make this series. Cheers
This Customer deserves a new motor. Period
Watched this go on forever with a great number of mass produced items throughout time. Many one time owners of the AMF V-Twins often complained of manufacturing defects and poor build quality or ill fitment issues. Surprisingly, if the mechanical are pulled apart, and the bike reassembled in proper order and fashion, even the bastard children of AMF were amazingly trouble-free afterwards. Many run even better than the newer models now produced, even if they haven't all the bells and buzzers. Betting the client will be thrilled with your unraveling of his woes, and really happy he bought that extended warranty on his bike. Great job diagnosing this 30K headache.
Yes I agree with you,buy a late model twin cam for quarter of the price and build it right and still have money left over.
This was a surprise as I was a 20 year H.D. factory machinist and a engine and transmission repair man and a journey man millwright there and the amount of washing of parts between machining is very good but before you took it apart I saw that those were machining chips how that motor did not blow up is a shock . but I got my first look in the Milwaukee 8 as I retired in 2011 this video was just viewed Nov.1 2021 thanks K.B.
Thanks for commenting. I agree...the washing process is quite good. To a machinist, the first chip found told us what happened. I was surprised myself. I tried to express how rare this is to folks. Producing 250,000 bikes a year, anything is possible. I have seen some crazy stuff over the years. Just one of those things. All the best sir.
Bet there's some HD executives congratulating themselves on the fact the motor survived a few, "they all do that", diagnostic failures untill the factory warranty expired.
Chalk one up for the Bean Counters.
Love the videos. Thanks for posting it. No matter how “boring” you think something like tearing the head down might be, there are lots of us that would never see anything like that otherwise and we really appreciate the content.
Very good and informative vids! I really like how you explain things and show every step of the process.
Kevin, I enjoyed the series, good job and thank you. It's hard to believe the motor lasted so long with so much shavings left inside.
This is so frightening owning a 2019 107 Street Glide what a bunch of guff after paying almost 40k for a machine and seeing this kind of workmanship! BTW awesome job on the videos very informative you have a new fan and subscriber
Cj Morris, the frightening thing is that you paid $40,000.00 for a 107 Street Glide. You shouldn't have paid near $30,000.00. I guess they sold you the gold plated version.
I wouldnt pay 12,000.00
thanks for showing this, makes me appreciate my panhead even more
Hey Kevin, I'm brand new to your channel, but being a proud owner of a 2017 Street Glide, I was totally glued to all 4 parts of your M8 problem series, and loved it! Thanks, and I'm now subscribed, and will be going back to watch your previous vids!! Great job!
I’ll stick with my Twinkie 103
Totally, a great break down by a real professional mechanic! we need more mechanics like this for the money that we spend on production line products!
Can’t imagine what this guy.. or anybody would do if they didn’t have an extended warranty, and had to pay for all this.. while all the time it was a manufacturing defect..!!
Assembly procedure or preparation prior to Assembly
I found these videos enjoyable and interesting to watch. How that engine did so many miles with all that debris is beyond me. I would love to see the project continue. Thanks from UK.
Stumbled on your channel , I’m hooked! Subscribed and loving it
Excellent videos showing the truth! 👍! Getting blown off by dealers is typical, glad to see this problem exposed. Was looking at 2020 114”s...naw I’ll keep my ‘09 Ultra & ‘07 Roadster. Already fixed my compensator woes on the Ultra with a Baker comp.
Glad I came upon this series-Props to Kevin Baxter for posting this. Very informative. Kind of impressed that it went 30K.
I stumbled across this because I was researching things for my my new Harley. I have sat fascinated by all three parts.
This is my first introduction to you guys. What a series to start on!! Great content. Thanks!
Glad you enjoy it! Welcome!
I'm just here to see everyone diagnose after the last video, especially those who are still wrong LOL Great content.
I know what happened! Harley-Davidson gave 5 guys on the engine assembly line there lay off slips and this is what you get PAYBACK
except the only one who got payed back was the customer.. the very guy/gal you want to return. Lax employees give themselves lay off slips.
Good job, Kevin.
I think your title is a little misleading, though.
Gave me a first impression that you discovered a design defect, instead of a loose nut on the factory floor.
Awesome series man. Thanks for sharing this type of stuff. Thankfully the owner is covered.
I just love seeing teardowns and rebuilds👍
Ok, you just called it. And I have to say. That speaks alot for the design and strength of this engine. Other than the heat issues. I can't believe it didn't tear everything up with all that trash in there.
I am personally impressed.
And shame on you H-D!
Thanks my 2018 heritage has 27,000 miles so I was very interested in the issue. Thanks again
Got my attention right from the start!
Great job at finding the ghost in the machine.
Looking forward to future teardowns and buildup’s.
Foriegn objects from disgruntled individuals or accidentally placed from factory, this is a serious issue. Thankyou for taking the time to show me and what to look out for!
You should get a hydraulic lift work bench so you can adjust the work height.
A friend was considering a new Electraglide or a Gold Wing. I suggested the Harley..... I'm glad he disregarded me!
Not all are bad...things happen. its the response to it for 30000 miles that bothers me.
Kevin, great video. Thanks for taking us along on the journey. I'm very disappointed, but not suprised that this just simply came down to poor quality control of the machining and assembly. Definitely glad that this will get repaired under extended warranty coverage
HD definitely at fault.
Wow awesome video and job great to hear that it wasn't a malfunction on the engine itself..👊👊
Great information Kev! I learned a lot through your videos! Keep up the great work and info you put out🍻🤙🏼
Awesome! Thank you!
AWESOME series!! Thank you so much, Kevin!!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Very cool to watch this thanks for making it!
Love the video I just purchased a 2020 street bob so this channel is gonna be my best friend lol
Both informative and entertaining - Thanks.
Be very interested in hearing if Harley commented on the diagnostic/cause.... and what they intend to do to 'make good'.
Really enjoyed this series, thanks for sharing - best from Ireland.
Excellent viewing. Never ever had a Harley , so it was very interesting to see this strip down of this engine. Thank you for showing me the ropes.
thank you sir!
Wish I could find a great mechanic like u here in texas...
Thanks for the video. Good tradesmen are hard to find and dealerships even harder. Never heard of such a thing but can imagine it missed the cleaning process after machining or sabotage
Thanks for the tear down very informative. I thought for sure it might piston skirts. I once bought a new 2007 ultra classic, when they rolled it off showroom floor they heard rattling from rear wheel. When they took tire off rim there was chips in the tires. Big chips. Left in from factory. Amazing
By the looks of the shavings it was from the machining process. Had a bowl on a demon carb with the same thing once on a customer's car. Unfortunate that the customer has to pay for the manufacturer's mistake... I think you are spot on with your conclusion. Keep up the GREAT WORK! I appreciate your knowledge and that you share it with all. Also just watched the end, glad to here it will be covered under warranty.
This engine was probably made on a Friday at 4:55 pm before a 3 day weekend. Lucky for the owner that they got the warranty. Glad I got see see the engine breakdown. I would love to see you rebuild the engine back to proper running order. Thanks.
Great video could watch this stuff all the time. Subscribed.
Great set of videos, very educational....thanks for sharing .
I enjoyed the video very much, its so interesting to watch the tear down only to find out its a factory "fuck up" and he has extended warranty, so now you will give him an engine that will kick ass for miles to come! Happy Holidays Kevin enjoyed it!
I was really interested in the new single cam engine. I personally still run a 99' Evo.
And I love it. Wasn't impressed with the twin cam at first, but after all the cam issues were figured out ...........
Thanks for the video. I do all my own wrenching. And it was a great learning experience to see this engine torn apart.
After watching this m8 tear down as well as other videos I have seen on CZcams showing broken cylinders and now loose head bolts and piston Oilers bolts on these engines , my third bike may be a 1200 sporty or indian
Great video!
,
Great video series. Yes I agree, this is definitely a factory machining "Missed the clean up line" issue. Completely agree with your diagnosis and logical conclusion. You would 100% expect to get material filings though out the entire oil and lubrication system form the pump through every single gallery and through the filter as well as some component wear. With Aluminium, you would expect to see that where in only areas that have direct rotational or linear motion and in direct contact with a harder material. There are only a few locations this occurs. Oil Pump, Bearing to housings, liffters, rockers.
Also Great tip on the oiler screws as well. Thanks for sharing.
Wow! Must of been built on a Monday after a holiday weekend lol. Great video. Thanks!
New years day
A very informative and interesting set of videos. I took it a special interest in this one due to the fact that I have a 2017 Street Glide Special with the M8 107. My engine runs fine without any banging though. Of course, I only have 5,000 miles on it at this time.
Thanks for the video, it invokes a lot questions when I talk to the dealer. I run an 05 Road King Classic and 2012 FLHTK. I have about 40 k miles on each. Never an issue. But I must say that little 88 cu/in is my favorite. No comparison, the TK is a lot smoother, but that 88 puts a big smile on my face, the way it pulls the hills on cool morning is just awesome. Again, thanks for the education.
Wow,, I got it. I thought that as soon as you said drill shavings. Unbelieveable. Oh well, that's the quality of workers today. Not you though. I do all my work myself because any time someone works on something for me they mess it up. Greatest video I saw ever. I, now, can work on an M8 if I ever get one. Thanks a lot.
I bought a 07 road glide new from my local dealer and had trouble with it from day one. I kelp taking it back to be fixed and was treated like I didn’t know what I was taking about. The last time they rolled it out from their shop saying nothing was wrong with it was the day I traded it in. The piss poor work that Riders Harley Davidson service department turns out almost turned me away from Harley. When I see Quality problems like this it really pushes my buttons.
It’s why I’ve never ridden one, I’ve always like water cooled motors so much for American build the best. My 1400cc BUSA and my GSXR 1000, ran like a Swiss clock from day one..there’s zero cross hatching left..
Can’t wait I have found factory defects in my 114
you're already in there... time to go big bore kit...with heads
Yep.Zippers 124”
That’s what I did.
when you spend lots of money on a "premium" motorcycle and it has a faiure of this type starting at relatively low miles, would you really want to throw lots more money at the motor? The factory should replace the motor and the owner can decide if they want to modify a good low miles motor not a motor with higher, hard miles. With the debris and heat this motor has seen, what original parts would you reuse? Oil pump, every bearing and seal, valves, pistons and rods all have seen "out of tolerance" heat. Metal chips have been circulating thru the motor causing accelerated wear along with 30,000 miles of regular wear. I would add load to a used and abused motor without more replacement parts than an entire motor would cost. Just my opinion but higher loads on worn cases and abused parts does not sound like a good plan
Hey man. Great video series. I’m fixing to go into my 114 M8 to look for the source of a slight tick at 30K miles.i believe it’s slack between one of the lifter/push rod/rocker.
It was good to watch your tear down, before I tear into mine. Keep up the good work!!!
Hey Kevin, love watching ur videoa.lots of knowledge. Thank you
In a word, "Fascinating".. Who'd a thunk ? I enjoyed the journey with you !
Very informative and interesting video series. I have been watching your M8 videos as I would like to buy my first Harley but someone got very lazy at the factory. A few of the other dealers he visited should be looked into as well.
Great videos! I wish we would had the cam rolling for an M8 tear down we did last week. Client has minor oil consumption concerns. 2017 out of warranty customer has us install big bore at 27,450miles. We found the 2 ring on the front piston missing.
Great series Kevin! Thank you!
Glad you enjoyed it!
outstanding work kevin
Great video I love a good mystery, thanks for sharing.
Great informational video! I've got a 2017 M8. It doesn't run hot so hopefully I'm good!
Very impressive program.
Thank you, excellent video.
Oh yeah guys… you’re the cleanest
Mech/Tech show on the tube, if you’re called on something,, you tube should fire their censors.
Oh yeah great work & explanation!
I understand the extended warranty being a good thing to have. But with that, since the problem has been noted to the dealership since time of purchase I don’t think that customer should have to pay for the fix if it was found beyond the warranty. Either way though. Good find find sir. And very glad the owner didn’t experience anything that would have left him stranded or worse yet, hurt.
Excellent video and excellent technical analysis.
Great series Kevin! Thanks
Glad you enjoyed it! Thanks Marcel!
Funny shop talk , always makes for a fun work place.
Great job showing and telling, I joyed watching see ya next time have a great day see ya bye.
Wow! Sounds more like the bad ol' days of AMF then HD. Glad the guy purchased an extended warranty, as you said, this is one of the the (few) times it paid off. Thanks for the tour of the insides of the M8, the last time I saw the inside of an HD was a shovel back in the 70s, they were a lot simpler back then.
Wonderful quality control.
Excellent set of videos too, scary for an owner of a 2018(2017 build) softail with the 107!!
I'm really paying attention since I have a 2022 107 M8. I'm engrossed in this Breakdown explanation and build. I'll make another run to the kitchen for Drinks and a snack, Heck it's a Real Thriller of a show.
Great videos! Thanks for sharing.