Christianity is RETURNING? Tom Holland & Justin Brierley in conversation
Vložit
- čas přidán 28. 06. 2024
- Historian Tom Holland, author of 'Dominion', joins Justin Brierley for a public conversation on The Surprising Rebirth Of Belief In God. They discuss Holland's own intellectual and spiritual journey, including an answered prayer to a health crisis.
But is the renewed interest in the value of faith among secular intellectuals evidence of a turning of the tide of faith? Justin Brierley is optimistic, Holland takes a more sanguine view. The event was hosted by LICC's Paul Woolley and Grace Fielding at Westminster Chapel, London with Q&A from a 600-strong audience.
More info, book & newsletter: justinbrierley.com/surprising...
Support via Patreon for early access to new episodes: / membership
Support via PayPal: www.paypal.com/paypalme/brier...
Support via Tax-deductible (USA): defendersmedia.com/portfolio/...
Buy the book or get a signed copy: justinbrierley.com/the-surpri...
This episode's show notes: justinbrierley.com/surprising...
Watch our conversation about the surprising conversion of New Atheist Ayaan Hirsi Ali: • Ayaan Hirsi Ali: CONVE...
00:00:00 Intro
00:01:11 Is there a rebirth of belief?
00:26:52 Tom Holland on God & spiritual encounters
00:44:12 Faith and doubt in today’s culture
00:52:05 What does the future hold?
01:02:16 About Justin’s podcast documentary
01:04:02 Which public figure has done most for rebirth?
01:06:27 How much is this rebirth middle class?
01:10:36 Marginalised men & reasons for / against God?
01:19:16 What can churches do for outreach?
01:21:54 Impact of social media?
01:26:33 More public figures contributing to rebirth
01:35:08 What do we do next?
01:38:32 Want more?
The Surprising Rebirth of Belief in God is a production of Think Faith in partnership with Genexis, and support from The Jerusalem Trust & the Christian Evidence Society.
Grew up with Christianity, walked away as a young adult, and have returned to the church as a more mature man and I'm so glad I did ✝️ Hallelujah
Same. Walked away at 15, started a slow downward spiral, God planted the seed in me at 26. Finally returned and accepted Him at 32 year old and life is so much better now.
@@Ianassa91 ✝️ Amen
@@Ianassa91 lol
To be deceived as a child, well, shame on those who deceived you. Same here. But to deliberately return, after you’ve seen through it? And what about all of the ethical toxicity of Christian dogma like misogyny and homophobia? What about the cultic guilt tripping and the scape goating? What about the group think, the anti-scientific intellectual dishonesty?
Just because I need to belong doesn’t mean I join a cult or even a religion. Just because I need meaning doesn’t lead me to believe in a God and just because I need a moral compass and ethical framework doesn’t mean that I have to sanction an ethical code that belonged to a society thousands of years old.
That’s all suddenly OK now? Or is it conveniently forgotten?
That’s been my journey, too. Is the ‘The Prodigal Son’ the running theme in our lives, do you think? @lanassa91 too. I only started going back to church on Easter Sunday after so many coincidences or ‘synchronicities’ that have become impossible to ignore.
African American soul singer Mahalia Jackson said, "When I sing the blues, I still have the blues. When I sing gospel, I have hope."
I’d rather have the blues than a false hope
I feel quite happy with the blues. Gospel is fun too.
To recognize that you are the humble recipient of an undeserved gift is the opposite of arrogance.
I'm reminded of my grandmother, born in 1914, who very much had a Sacramental Worldview (aka the "Catholic Imagination"). She had prayers for every occasion and everything was full of grace. This was formed by the traditional liturgy of her childhood, with all of the smells abd bells and special feast days & pious practices. I work in campus ministry at a public university and the students I meet who are experiencing conversions are moving toward liturgical traditions with deep symbolism and rituals. If the Church wants to be "relevant" in the Post-Enlightenment age, it needs to become old again.
Excellent comments!
It is a positive sign that younger generations seek deeper meaning in life, hopefully towards the Creator. Let's face it, we're not all equally deep in our search for Truth and Wisdom, yet I feel for those who are more curious and questioning and want more than fairly superficial stuff at a local Christian gathering. Christian symbolism, feast days / holidays, rituals do seem to have often lost their plot in the West, BUT not completely. To your anecdote, it is good that more and more youth are asking for the deeper. Personally, I'm a both/and, meaning that one of the things that drove people away from Smells & Bells was how boring and somber things were. Empty ritual. Hey, if congregants and especially the speakers/teachers/pastors/priests aren't embodying the Joy, Love, Creativity, Truth of God, then we're going to repeat this cycle again and again. I've been in very Protestant, very un-liturgical settings, and very liturgical ones, any Christian community, ANY, can be guilty of joylessness. Protestant, Catholic, even the Orthodox one I visited. Respect for God is one thing, but to make Him out to be a pseudo-distant, almost apathetic Deity is a crime! I never, never understood how people can be so lifeless at a worship service. Well, then again, I did come to understand why....
Not just old--timeless!
@@machtnichtsseimannThat just doesn't line up with the data. Church attendance dropped more the more they got rid of timeless liturgies and tried to modernise
Don't mistake reverence for lifelessness..
As long as it has the moral and intellectual integrity to also face up to the toxic dimensions of faith traditions
If you mentioned that Mary story to most practicing Catholics, they'd have very little problem believing she helped intervene.
No author has explained so much so well to me about history. No Christian or anyone else can come close to Tom Holland. To me, he is perfect, a child-like heart, more than most Christians I know. I hope he never changes in the slightest. And my name is "Thomas" as well, a proud doubter.
Tom Holland is spellbinding
I just started his book, Dominion, yesterday. He seems very interesting!
He looks bored… and I appreciate that honesty!
No he’s just well spoken and aducated.
Couldn't agree more..
I always love listening to Justin and Tom’s discussions.
You are right Justin. Emptying pews DOES NOT mean our faith, even in this country, UK, is dying.
All it means is that Cof E, Methodist, etc etc IS NO LONGER preaching the full gospel and that is what people want. The faithful are still coming together as the body of Christ, but in different ways. Online, small house groups, other "buildings" where they can experience freely the Spirit of the Lord. There are beacons of light throughout this country.
That's just online conservatives and MRAs, and they are trying to influence culture. Their basic motivation is they are anti-feminists, and want women out of the public sphere. It is a power move.
You shouldn't flee from the institutional influence and power of the Anglican Church. You need to take it over and change it for the better. Running won't ever build anything meaningful.
It might also mean that religion is a toxic power playing exercise in mass self-deception whose ultimate trajectory is either ISIS or Trump,
Tom Holland, you have been touched by Virgin Mary. I believe it is not arrogance to think in this way. I have experienced Her help not once. I pray for you. Greetings from Poland ❤
I had a long conversation today with an atheist friend. He replied to the saying. "I don't have enough faith to be an atheist," by saying, "I don't have enough arrogance to be a Christian." I say, go ahead and have the arrogance. God created the entire universe. Humanity, as far as we know. Is the masterpiece, and Jesus died for each of us.
@@gregkirk1842Yeah, atheists seem to not even understand the concept of "God" to begin with, most of the time.
You don’t needed faith in a god to wonder at the beauty of the universe. You don’t need the punitive legalism of a death cult to behave with moral integrity.
Love, empathy, justice, joy and simple goodness, these are not the sole prerogative of the religiously faithful, they are qualities available to humans of all creeds and none.
I attend noon mass at a downtown church. Prior to the shutdown, there would be 20-25 people in attendance. The downtown never completely revived after the shutdown was over, and the building vacancy rate is now 30%. Even though the streets are a lot emptier now, there are 40-50 people at noon mass. This is one church, but I suspect that this is happening in a lot of other places.
I find it also a weird coincidence that Tom Holland here had a miraculous recovery from his cancer similar to Jordan Peterson's wife both which influenced Tom and Peterson who are extremely popular figures in the pro Christian movement today
That was my first thought as well. Healing is a persuasive miracle it turns out :)
Just because someone gets well doesn’t mean that a miracle has taken place
Thank you all. God Bless you for this. I pray he richly use you all; you let your light shine bright. His grace ever overshadow you and yours. May you know his best.
We are seeing a lot of growth in our local Quaker meeting. Young people are coming in and want to know what we believe. Some had tried evangelical churches and been put off by dogma, doctrines and their position on LGBTIQ issues. Four years of growth is a trend. In 2012 the local meeting had three members, this morning they had closer to 30.
Congratulations!
Because they're too lax on the gays, or because they believe what the Bible says?
Dun and Carol Richardson spent 15 years in the jungle tribe Sawi in Irian Jaya Indonesia. The Sawi were head hunters and cannibals. Don and Carol discovered a principle called redemptive analogy in their culture that pointed to Christ. By the time they left 15 years later, 70% of the tribe were Christians. In Don's second best-seller, _Eternity in Their Hearts hearts_, he found redemptive analogies in cultures around the world.
My father’s parents escaped Armenian Holocaust/genocide.
Definitely a bombshell and truthful last moment from Tom Holland, greeted with "Okay before the fatigue sets in… "
On cultural contingency, my sister and brother-in-law had a friend from India who said that 95% of Hinduism was compatible with Christianity. What Hinduism lacked was someone to forgive their sins
Keep up the good work Justin
I love that Tom holland and Nick Cave talk. That reference to their chat about his experience made my day.
One thing that gives me confidence is the more sophisticated understanding of epistemology that is emerging. I think the Covid madness also primed the mind to recognize scientism. The new atheists are naive materialists. For me I had a pre evangelization stage when I was doing a thesis in law and philosophy that had me deep diving pragmatic philosophy and scientism. When I disabused myself of that epistemic prison there was much less barriers to recognizing that the fruits of Christianity was evidence of its truth and that was enough to get me started.
Excellent to hear!
So encouraging
"Those who profess to be wise will be made to look like fools."
Adam was of the world flesh, Jesus & his followers are of the spirit of Jerusalem, heaven above. Be in the world not of the world.
"Do not eat from the tree of man's genealogy." "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree of man's genealogy." Judaism, Hinduism, Sikhism, Buddhism, Shintoism, Communism
"Even now the axe is put to the Abraham's family tree."
Do not be unequally yoked. A house nation planet divided by the 12 Antichrist religious tribalism religious racism nations of the middle far east will never withstand these the birthing pains of this the millennium of climate change end times due to the mystery of the 7 crossings of our stars ecliptic Jesus held in his hand.
"For what does it benefit mankind to gain the whole world after crossing the Sun's ecliptic resets it only to lose his soul?"
I’ve tasted the rotten fruit of Christianity. It made me sick
In my opinion decline in the boooring organized church is growing as well as distrust in government and medical science. However, true followers of Jesus are definitely growing and going to house churches for meetings, but going public and to the streets in their preaching with signs and wonders along with social justice.
I think people have got sick of churches but they’re returning the Bible.
I’m pretty disgusted by the CoE but I’m half way through the Bible and I’m at the point where I would consider myself a believer.
Welcome and I hope you will always remain a broken beginner. This is my prayer for all of us who take Jesus seriously and wish to follow Him.
The problem is Jesus founds a Church in the Bible. It's the entire point of the religion. Find a better Church. Go to a TLM Catholic Service. Something Ancient, Transcendent, and Timeless.
Just reading the Bible gives us Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, Muslims, Arians, Marcionites, Gnosticism, and various other heresies. You have to have a Church, too.
I concur about the CofE, the churches in the UK aren't up to it...The independent churches are pretty spiritually dead (the ones i've been to)...I've yet to see any offering proper help for people with MHI...Indeed, mention them and their eyes kinda glaze over, like they're pretty clueless...Don't mention the absolutely disgusting inequalities in the UK, because nobody wants to hear it, yet some of them are living very comfortably indeed...This isn't Christianity...
I concur about the CofE and the independent churches are spiritually dead and dying...Very little to no understanding or help for MHI's, or other issues people are facing...Nothing on inequalities in society, yet some are living very comfortable lives...You could be forgiven for thinking the conservative party was in charge of the Church and not Christ...+++
I agree, but the fascist youtube keep deleting my truth...+++
Great
So if you're quote unquote Protestant and you meet the Virgin Mary, and she helps ya, what's a guy to do...?
(Asking for a friend)
repent deeply of trusting either a demonic apparition or a piece of wishful thinking
BEGOME.
Become Orthodox… haha
@@cozzwozzleSome Catholic people are taught and believe her job is to bring people to Our Lord Jesus Christ. Others believe it is the Holy Spirit who motivates people to become believers. In any case, it dies not obligate a person to become Orthodox or Catholic. However, the person would be welcome in either faith tradition. Just advise your friend - don't make an idol of the heavenly intercessor. The goal is seeking Our Lord.
excellent advice
“If you start with all the arguments to reason and put them front and centre, than I think you’re missing a trick. You’ve got to start with the heart…” and leave your brain at the door!!! 🤔🤨🙃🤣
Wrong...Gross Conceptual Error....But I suspect you know that. Now go back to your bridge and sleep. ;-)
Intelligent people, deep thinkers are turning to God, opening up to Christianity. Ignorant and shallow people by default are not interested in meaningful pursuits.
new spiderman movie sounds weird
Isn't it about "life"? True life and light, behind and beyond its cultural expression, is the true light that lights each person who comes into the world. The true light that can only be experienced and known through Jesus Christ, the exact representation and expression of the Father. It's beyond principle, it's reality. it's living, breathing, relational, physical, mental, spiritual encounter.
Well all i can say is, if people are anything like me, then i think i know what is going on in the churches, and attendance being down, its the lack of trust in the church message now, as they seem to be turning away from the teachings of Christ, and are more interested in the Woke message. Yes im religious, i pray every day, but i dont trust the church now, so dont go.. That is, i feel, what is going on...
Census data England only (not UK), number of Christians:
2001: 35,251,244 (71.7% of total population)
2011: 31,479,876 (59.4%)
2021: 26,167,899 (46.3%)
it has been rapidly decreasing, what the hell are you talking about?
Exactly. I think these guys are just obsessed with claiming a win over the New Atheists, and so they ignore the reality on the ground.
Just listen carefully, and then you will understand what they are talking about.
Might those numbers have something to do with immigration, low birth rates and deaths of the native population?
I didn’t even fill in the census. I know lots of other people didn’t either
@@solidflyer286 _"The Census Act 1920 makes it compulsory for everyone in England and Wales to take part in the census in accordance with the Order and Regulations. The Act makes answering the questions mandatory."_
✝️🕯️🙏🏻💖🌷
Very interesting discussion, thanks for sharing. It is from a mainly Protestant perspective though. In the Catholic Church there are also very interesting things starting to stir, just under the radar (a record number of adults and teenagers were baptised in France this Easter, for example). But here the reason is not (just) the supernatural, but rather orthodoxy. Latin Masses are full of young people and children (including lots of young men), even while the Novus Ordo churches continue to empty out. There seems to be a hunger among people to engage with something bigger than themselves, and a rejection of the post-Vatican II spirit of engaging with the secular world by trying to please it.
Ya love to see it! (I'm one of em!)
I've read Tom Holland's 'Dominion, the making of the Western mind'; it helped me revision Christianity afresh, which is hard to do in this day and age. I was also intrigued by his final statement about the attitude of Christianity to the Old Testament, which is coming under increasing strain in light of Zionism and the Israel/Palestine conflict. The God of Christianity is the same as the Jewish God, He was a Jew after all. How do Christians reconcile growing anti-semitism with any kind of 'return' to Christianity?
Because Rabbinical Judaism isn't the same faith as Second-Temple Judaism. Jesus came to save the Jews first, then the Gentiles, and they largely rejected Him and killed Him, and have been grafted out of the tree. They can be grafted back in whenever they're willing to admit the Truth.
Essentially, the Christian tradition is that the Church is the successor to Yahwehism, not Rabbinical Judaism, and the Church is the new Israel, not the secular state in West Asia.
The only Christians that worship Jews are the Dispensationalists, which are a small group of Evangelicals that get lots of attention. The rest of us see them as following a false religion and heavily deceived. Much of that is called "anti-semitism," but it's not.
How do you reconcile the Jews who followed Christ and those who crucified Him? Which crowd was "anti-Semitic"?
@@olgakarpushina492 He was crusified by the Romans
@@judithjohnson5055 nice try. That is not what Christians believe, albeit factually true. If I am sentenced to death, is it the accuser whoo falsely accused me or the executioner who is toblamefor my murder?
My commentary on the Middle East conflict is a reply to the title song from the movie Exodus:
ExodAllO’Us
"This land is ours;
It is not mine to hoard,
Entrusted to me by the LORD.
My name is Abraham;
God promised me the land
That in me all nations of the earth be blessed.
God gave me Isaac as the promised one,
But Ishmael also was my son.
When in the Virgin Birth,
God sent his love to earth,
Through Y’shua, YHWH gave us all his best.
"The land was lost for seventy long years;
Through pagan kings it was restored.
No more idolatry or immorality--
Walls and temple grew to glorify the LORD.
Four hundred years, and finally God spoke;
His Word reached Jew and Greek and more--
Word of New Covenant, peace to the penitent,
With an exodus from sin and death and war...."
Pardon? There seem to be window frames but with closed shutters where the gentleman are straining to see through the slits, the gaps around the edges of the shutters. Are they trying to see in, or is heaven going to shatter the frames that currently shape their inquiries?
I think they would se clearer if they read the Bible and asked the lord Himself about the future. We are living in a time when we can se how the scripture are about to be fulfilled. Jesus will come back in a time when most Christians have turned away from their faith. A time when people have turned their back to God so that madness increases. And because of that people will no longer follow the law given to us from God. And that will cause people to lose their love to others. He will come in a time when there are wars all over the world and Christians can lose their life for their faith in Jesus. We can se part of it already happening and the rest of it is on its way. And when Christians starts to ask not Christians about the future then that is also a sign that something is wrong in the body of Christ. If we wants to know we are to ask our Father in heaven.
Young adults can’t even identify or recognize a Christmas Carol anymore 🥴
You don’t have to share an opinion when you don’t have one.
Glory to our most pure and Holy Mother the Theotokos and ever virgin Mary! ☦️☦️☦️
Everybody is relying on 'statistics' to determine how to think. Statistics don't keep up with what's happening on the ground. You know who sees the 'deeper and broader trends'? Older people who've been observing for a long time. We see the change. Plus, you all are missing what is happening outside of the 'male CZcamsrs' influence. Women are shifting. Nancy Pearcey is bringing the data, if that's what floats yer boat.
🌚☄️❤️💫
Holland: It is possible and highly probable that Jesus healed you. After all you were humble enough to ask for help in the way you knew how.How about having a Jesus miracle from God? Considering Jesus dead wounded and died for sins and sickness. This is what Jesus desired to happen when he embraced the cross. Clearly we acknowledge the mother of Christ, but she did not die for our sins and sickness.
Pure superstition
I just wish he wasn't so stuck in the Epicurean world view that NT Wright speaks and writes about so much. It is not one or the other. It's both and much, much more and beyond.
Woke is NOT Christian. Like all evil it is a twisting (i.e. perversion) of a good. It is the opposite of Christianity because it offers no forgiveness and is centered on judgment and condemnation rather than love with forgiveness.
So true.
The churches and communities that thrived within the boundaries of Christianity , have been deliberately deconstructed by professional atheists and academics alike , in order to create a space for themselves within the many sacred buildings and institutions that were created for the propagation of a society based upon long held traditions and customs . Once enticed away from their mother church , new spaces were then created for the now relatively prosperous communities to spend their time , such as retail parks , supermarkets and sports events ( all of which remain open upon the day normally kept aside for worship ) and unfortunately for them now , not knowing the subterfuge that had taken place , they flounder through the mundanity of their vacuous existence whilst the authors of such diatribe as exhibited here , wallow in the stench of their own cultural excrement . However be sure , god is watching and can truly see into the hearts of all humanity…
🇬🇧❤️🇮🇱
No
Well the earthly mother of Jesus is like the rest of us Christians ans she has no power to heal. It is trough Jesus we can be healed. To pray to Mary that she should talk to Jesus has no bearing at all in the scripture. We are told to NOT speak to the dead. And she is dead in her flesh as much as Samuel was. This is forbidden in the scripture. So Tom you hallucinated that part. But Jesus clearly touched you and it is Him you are to thank.
Ave Maria
Im disgusted by you saying Mary is just like you or me. She is the second eve, she is the new arc of the covenant which is Chest. She is the Mother of God(to deny this is to commit the heracy of Nestorianism, to deny the fact that Mary is the mother of God is to deny the hypostatic union)
@@Rocky-ur9mn That is not in the Bible. Mary was mother to the flesh Jesus/God was born in to. She was not the mother to God who lived in that flesh. To say she was the mother of God is to make her the Creater/God. It was not the flesh of Jesus that was God. If that was so the body of Jesus would not have been able to die.You must differ between God and the flesh Jesus wore. The flesh was to be our sacrifice for our sins, and to that flesh Mary was mother. To say Mary was mother to God is to say she is the creator of God and that is a very very serious sin. Mary was given the highest purpose any human has been given from our Lord. But she was merely a human, blessed by our Father in heaven. To say Mary is the mother of God is also to deny the trinity, because she then must have been lived before God.
@@Rocky-ur9mn Dude, Low-Church Protestants don't understand Christianity or any of the deeper meaning or symbolism to the religion and faith. They're very simple people. He's never going to get it. You're wasting your time. He has no idea what "New Eve" means, he doesn't know about the Queen of Heaven symbolism in Revelation, he doesn't know about the parallelisms between her and the Ark of the Covenant, etc.
All he knows is out-of-context Bible verses and "personal relationship." That's it. Anything beyond that is lost on him. I'm just letting them be. Let Low-Church Evangelicalism slowly die out. 🤷🏼♂️
@@TheGudsdotterYou are committing the heresy of Nestorianism.
I think it is very dangerous to glorify conservative Christian faith without realizing the harm and psycological damage it has done - and still does - to countless children. Every child and teenager should be encouraged to trust their own thoughts, be proud of who they are (including their sexuality) and be critical whenever they see or hear religious behaviour, ideas and claims that they don’t believe in. Our precious children are born with open minds free from fear. The Bible is filled with old mythological ideas and stories that we should treat and read as a heritage from a past when true knowledge about the human mind and body was primitive and many deseases were interpreted as punishment from god. By only picking the positive sides of religion, a false and dangerous perspective is created. The first couple of times I listened to Tom Holland, I thought he was both honest and intelligent. Unfortunately, I no longer think he is.
IMO it's arrogant to sssume it's just material coincidence, rather than the intervention of the Blessed Mother. God is not limited by his creation.
Just sharing an Orthodox perspective here, but we are taught that if you experience 'something' in prayer, assume that you are not worthy of receiving a vision or divine intervention etc. Because if it is of the devil, such humility is like a wrecking ball to him. And if it's of cheese ("chemicals, neurons and blind forces of nature" to use Tom's expression), nothing is lost. But if it's truly from God, in this case through His Mother, He will honour such humility and will see to it that the 'message' (for want of a better word), will indeed get through.
"Who is my mother my brothers? You are my mother my brothers my sisters" because he is was & will always be the son of God our father.
Adam was of the world flesh, Jesus & his followers are of the spirit of Jerusalem, heaven above. Be in the world not of the world.
"Do not eat from the tree of man's genealogy." "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree of man's genealogy." Judaism, Hinduism, Sikhism, Buddhism, Shintoism, Communism
"Even now the axe is put to the Abraham's family tree."
Do not be unequally yoked. A house nation planet divided by the 12 Antichrist religious tribalism religious racism nations of the middle far east will never withstand these the birthing pains of this the millennium of climate change end times due to the mystery of the 7 crossings of our stars ecliptic Jesus held in his hand.
"For what does it benefit mankind to gain the whole world after crossing the Sun's ecliptic resets it only to lose his soul?"
@@GregoryJByrnePlease quit copy-pasting your out-of-context verses promoting Gnosticism.
@@carlahmed5737That's brilliant. Like the quote from St. Moses the Black:
"You fast, but Satan does not eat. You labor fervently, but Satan never sleeps. The only dimension with which you can outperform Satan is by acquiring humility, for Satan has no humility."
Adam was of the world flesh, Jesus & his followers are of the spirit of Jerusalem, heaven above. Be in the world not of the world.
"Do not eat from the tree of man's genealogy." "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree of man's genealogy." Judaism, Hinduism, Sikhism, Buddhism, Shintoism, Communism
"Even now the axe is put to the Abraham's family tree."
Do not be unequally yoked. A house nation planet divided by the 12 Antichrist religious tribalism religious racism nations of the middle far east will never withstand these the birthing pains of this the millennium of climate change end times due to the mystery of the 7 crossings of our stars ecliptic Jesus held in his hand.
"For what does it benefit mankind to gain the whole world after crossing the Sun's ecliptic resets it only to lose his soul?"
“The very idea that a text should tell you what you should do is actually immoral. Because now you’re saying that whatever somebody writes has become moral for you. Morality should not be based on authority. It should be based on your empathy for the suffering of other human beings.”
Dr Avalos
You do realise the irony in posting a written quotation by a supposed authority figure imploring us morally not to base our morality on what has been written down by authority figures?
CHRISTIANITY RETURNING? Not according to 2 Thessalonians 1-3. An “apostate” church is not a “return”… sounds like “dogs eating their own vomit” (Prov. 26:11). Might want to look around and see what time we’re in.
It's returning. Premills coping on the daily.
😂😂😂😂😂
Justin is making a mountain out of a molehill. A few more people taking more interest in Christianity is literally a drop in the ocean of people leaving Christianity
Nope. It's happening. TLM Catholic Services are packed nowadays. You can keep coping or join in.
@@MeanBeanComedy ooo you tried to debate the wrong guy bud. sure the TLM might be packed, but so are the orthodox and conservative Presbyterians. Just because the smaller more conservative sects are receiving the conservative runoff from more liberal denominations doesn’t mean 1) that they’re the correct belief or 2) that their dissipation won’t eventually come also. For every 1 person becoming catholic there were about 6 leaving the church last I read. So you can quit coping or join us 😘
Time will tell.
There are sociological and political processes and motivations that might point to resurgence of or coming closer to Christianity.
I Europe, it's obviously driven by existential dread of rising numbers of immigrants (especially Muslims), which are fundamentally antithetical and different to many aspects of Western societies.
In America, it relates to backlash towards what people term "woke" progressivism, and just general nihilism. Though it should be remembered that Christianity in America is still declining, but also still far more prevalent and salient than Europe's.
In Latin America, there's almost wildfire spread of pentecostal & evangelical Christianity. But the Catholic church is definitely getting weaker, and liberalism/secularism sets the tone much as it does in Europe/America.
Africa on the other hand is the wild card regarding the future of Christianity there. It seems to spread and entrench more than ever before.
But what will be the substance of this in a century from now, is hard to tell. (I'd say the same thing about the spread of Christianity in China/Asia).
As Tom is talking about all the exciting things charismatic Christianity has to offer he’s astonishingly silent on the worrying toxicity of modern charismatic belief that has lost none of its racism, homophobia and sexism, not to mention toxic theologies like original sin and attitudes towards outsiders that damage social integrity.
To espouse a return to religious beliefs or practices without addressing these dangers is irresponsible.
Are we going to compromise years of moral development because it’s becoming trendy for middle class young people to embrace religion?
Original sin, the toxicity of sin is scriptural. Hate toward a person or people is not. However compromise with sin isn’t either.
Interesting that the rigidity of Islam toward homosexuality and women isn’t criticized.
Original Sin is beautiful
@@paulgiggs99 😱
@@darmat6288 the doctrine of original sin itself is a toxic doctrine that’s pedalled to gain control over the vulnerable. It leads to addictive shame/confession cycles without helping a person come to terms with the dark side of their nature. There’s no transformative growth because the believer is taught they’re hopeless without Christ’s blood.
The worst thing about this doctrine is when Christian parents and teachers tell small children that they’re intrinsically evil and subject to God’s wrath and have to be protected from an angry God by the blood of his tortured Son. That’s an evil doctrine and it traumatised my relationship with God as a kind Father. Teaching it to children is a form of religious child abuse and being brought up with this teaching can stunt psychological development.
MLK wasn't even a Christian...
He didn't even believe in Christ! He said He wasn't God and didn't resurrect! Lame!
something cannot return which was never here.
what most call Christianity never was. it was church religion
If what Jesus Christ himself said "Strait is the gate narrow the way and FEW there are who find it" we will see this is the case
but not even highly educated men like Holland can see this
so i will ask a totally stupid question ( irony alert) is what Jesus said about what made made a christian relevant??
Jesus founded the Church. He said the gates of Hell would not prevail against it, and he described it as a physical, unified body.
Protestants are a trip. 🙄🙄🙄
Im allergic to Christianity.
Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.
You better thank that con man for all of western culture, and the betterment of the world.
This is a midwit take, please find God before it's too late.
@@ZoomerHistorianYoo never thought I'd find you here sup man
@@TryingToFollowChrist37 Yup. Talentless mouthy soda pop slurping TV watchers have, can and will babble any nonsense of attention they don't deserve.
Cool story bro
John Lennox?