Just bought an old dump truck to use around the house. Had no idea what that damn red button was for. Finally found the video to explain it simply. Thanks.
Thank you for explaining the Higher gear shifts. 5 Low to 4 Hight and then 5 high, another guy had a C Ford with same Tranny. I had always split shifted my uncle's F600 with a 4 & 2 speed by split shifting every gear. Always hauled heavy. I have driven the 5 & 2 speeds never thought about that in the higher gears, about the forth and 5th. Gears being geared that way. Had no visor or instruction placard. No one showed me the shift pattern. Back then it was just get in truck and drive. The owner of company was the CDL trainer. You just went and took the DMV written Test. Then the company did the Road Test. YES they use to do it that way. No 2 or 3 months of Drivers school training like now. Where you have a professional Driver train you to shift. Double clutch. Road training. Mostly on 10 speeds. Different Transmission. NO rear end transfer of rear end gear ratios. Thank you very much. This is real helpful for younger people to understand the older style of shifting those older Trucks.
Thank you so much , I have a 89 Ford F800 5/2 . I was pully my TL10 up a mountain and really batched it up pretty bad , ended up pulling the steep grade in low first , traffic wasn't very happy with me , even though it was only 4 cars . I wanted to show some courtesy and tried to pull off to the side and sunk in the grass , Now after the cars passed I was able to reverse on the steep grade and get the truck and trailer back on the road , but the right tire was so full of dirt and mud of course I had no traction . I tried to spin the tires clean , then started the wheel hop so I cancelled that and continued to reverse back down the hill to a flat enough area to take off again . This was a learning experience and I need more practice . I really thank you for breaking it down . It's way difference than my 10 speed road ranger .
50 years ago in April of 1973 I turned 18,got my chauffeur's license and went to work driving C-60 Chevy 5 yard dumps with this same shift sequence..on that 1st morning the forman had all us drivers in a group, I was the new guy..when he got to me he asked,Can you drive that truck? he said pointing 1 out, I immediately said Yes Sir! To which he said Follow that guy..That guy was already rolling out the driveway!! I had to run, start the truck,find a gear and go..no test drive, no coaching.. absolutely sink or swim and I taught myself to get by until I had time to read the drivers manual in the glove box where I found the 4 lo,5 lo,4 hi, and 5 hi "trick" because there were no stickers in the cab.. part 2 later, maybe lol!!😊
Thanks for the video. I have to drive a 1997 F-800 bucket truck with this setup. It was stuck in high range when we got it and I noticed a huge difference when going from 3h to 4h. Now I know why.
I used to call it 5th over,, and with a 1968 International -238 Detroit the revs (tach) wanted 21:50 rpm,,and around 17.00 shifting range,,splitter was electric and it could make a clown" out of me leaving a green light in a hurry sometimes,, I would feather clutch and it would split faster or slower, ear it up and feel it in your seat,,! Great video, thanks!
Thank you very much I started my job and this is what they have nobody knew how to shift properly and hell I didn't either this was very helpful thank you
Thanks I just bought one of these and I got fooled because the button was already up so here I am trying to shift it up and thinking it is broken. Wished I had watched this video first.
Drove a lot of grain trucks back in the 70's. Usually split second gear, shifted 3L 4L 5L and 5H. Like a 6 speed. Worked out well most of the time. Didn't really need to split every gear.
I have a GMC 7000 with the same rear end .. save your self some issues later if you run empty or light just use high side.. if you have a heave load use them all
Thank you Bro. Is it normal for these trucks to make a LOT OF NOISE? my 1991 split shift GMC Gas power top kick makes a LOT OF NOISE when im split shifting.
I owned a Inter Acco and I always went 2nd low 3rd low 4th low 5th low then to 5th high going down I went down in high range then when I got to 2nd then changed to Low range to start off again
4H and 5L are the same ratio. I tend to leave the axle in H unless fully loaded, and just drive it like a 5 speed. If loaded heavy, I'll start in 1L, shift to 2L, 3L, 3H, 4L, 4H, 5H.. more shifting whilst splitting, but it's much easier for me to stay moving without rowing constantly. If you get good, you can shift the transmission, axle, or both without the clutch. Except pulling uphill loaded.. put a tach on it, 4H and 5L are the same gear ratio.
@@SLOCLMBRI don't have the ratios in front of me, but I know that numerically, 4H is slightly higher than 5L. It's not enough to make a difference though, even on a tach. You'd have to plug it in and pull the sensor data, or do the raw math with the ratios to notice
Thanks . Very helpful. When loaded , 5 high . And need to climb a hill is when everything goes to shit for me . What do you do ? I thought I would naturally shift the rear to low . But hardy ever works . I end up in 2nd or 3rd barely moving. ??
I have yet to drive a manual transmission like this but this video is very informative in great detail. Thankyou for posting. For anyone who can answer...is this same shift pattern for 4 speed/2 speeds?
I drove a 4 & 2 speed rear for meany years. Always heavy Loads. I just split every gear. I never shifted a 4 speed back to third hit and then forth high. Never seemed to bog down. Seemed normal. I watched another video on a guy with 4 & 2 speed rear. He just split every gear. YES I think on four speed it's split every gear.
4 and two is truly 8 different ratios vs a 5 and two being only 9 different ratios. In the 5 and two, 4H and 5L are the same ratio, you can use either one, but skip the other. If unloaded, you can just stay in high range and shift only the transmission
Great video. Is this a 10 speed or 5 speed? I thought I heard you said 10. My set up is just like yours. I have a 1974 international TK Dump truck with a 5-2 Caterpillar 210hp Transmission
This is considered a 5x2 or a 5-speed transmission with a 2-speed rear-end. Not the same as a 10-speed, which is 10 forward gears all in the transmission (typically a Roadranger with a high-low range switch operated by air). I drove a lot of years in both, and I think the 5x2 is actually a bit more flexible.
You can do it just to make sure they work, but you really won’t need them and they’ll probably be super low and it might be kind of jerky at the start. You’re better off skipping first gear ⚙️
Drove 2 spd axles many yrs. The 2 spd gear not that heavy. Dont use hi range in 1st or 2nd gear on hard pulls.. ive seen several twisted in two. Ask any truck mechanic.
I’ve had my CDL for over twenty years now and have driven these split rear end trucks for many, many miles. I have always cycled through the low range first, then used the preselect switch (red button) to go to the high range. Never had an issue whether I’m loaded or not. Way too much effort to cycle from low to high as is suggested in the video.
Your thinking is very close, a super 10 is still a 5spd that you use twice, if the vehicle is new to you, be gentle and feel out 4th and 5th hi's and lo's...it may be 4 lo,hi and then 5 lo,hi, the early 70's C60 I drove had 4 lo..5 lo then back to 4 hi and finally 5 hi..I scared the company driver who road tested me because he was taught lugging 5th lo to 5th hi was normal, When I went back to 4 hi he jumped and grabbed the dash with both hands, I didn't say a word...
Nate I have a question, I have a topkick with the vortec 8.1 liter unleaded gas engine, when I get up to highway cruising speed (60-65mph), are my RPMs suppose to be at or slightly above 3000rpms. I think it kind of weird thats all. My RPM tack goes up to 5000rpm.
Try a 5 speed with a 4 speed Spicer gear box and once you get a truck rolling you don't need to double clutch any transmission is out dated use a low rpm shift after your rolling you don't need a clutch except starting g and stoping or in and out of reverse to first gear
1. The switch on the shifter is bad (most common in my experience) 2. Electrical wiring issue 3. A problem with the shift motor on the axle 4. Bad shift solenoid Thanks for watching. I hope this helps. Good luck!
Question so when your in 5 high how would you go from 5 high to 5 low? We have one of these as a tanker on our fire dept and I’ve only driven it like a 5 speed because I’m not sure how to downshift with the dual axle.
If you want to go from 5H to 5L, with your foot still on the accelerator, push the button down, take your foot off the pedal, ever so briefly, then come back down on it, and your shift down will be done.
Exactly..when you let up on the throttle you introduce momentary slack along the entire driveline, that slack allows the electric motor/solenoid at the rear differential to change between the 2 ratios available, for downshift you need to increase driveshaft speed gently, the gears will mesh when they match
@@jackspringer9283 idk about this...when you shift up, youre going from high force to low, because as you shift, the rpms are dropping...but when you downshift the rear, the axle is going to slam in pretty hard right?
Definitely get that checked out. If you’re making the shift correctly, it should be pretty quick and smooth. If there’s hesitation, it could be an issue with the solenoid on the axle. I’d suggest having it looked at and tested by an experienced truck repair shop. Good luck!
That depends- could be a couple things. If it’s just the switch, yes all you need is the red switch. It could also be a solenoid or actuator on the rear axle that changes the gears themselves. Pull the switch and have it tested and go from there. Either way, parts for these aren’t too terrible expensive or difficult to work on. Good luck!
@@Spacecowboy42 If it's vacuum operated than you might just need to check the diaphragm on the rear axle. Could not be holding any vacuum, or it's torn. This is a super easy repair/replace.
If your truck has air, change the diff shifter to an air change usually the electric motor fails and gets stuck in either hi or low which means you end up with a box full of neutrals
😔😡 I wanted to hear DAT CAT rattle !! I had a 6500 !!!! W/a cat n same transmission!! Thrill to drive !! Passing whatever we wanted !! Up the Colorado,UTAH,Washach, Appalachians !!😔 ! MPG SANK !! Still hauled Timberframe,timbers, tools n a trailer all over ! The extended cab WUZ HUGE ! W/a Chrime bar behind the front seats ! We strapped luggage on it ! Two Guys would sleep on the floor ! N backseat Guys still had legroom !! Should have kept it for a P/U TRUCK !!
Thank you, I've had my F700 for 3 years and finally a video demystifying the transmission. This is the best video on this subject on CZcams.
Thank you so much for the kind words Jeff, glad I could help!
Oh man thank u I couldn't find a clear instructions of how my f700 shifts I was tearing the gears up lol
Just bought an old dump truck to use around the house. Had no idea what that damn red button was for. Finally found the video to explain it simply. Thanks.
I’m glad I could help! Let me know if you have any further questions!
Thank you for explaining the Higher gear shifts.
5 Low to 4 Hight and then 5 high, another guy had a C Ford with same Tranny. I had always split shifted my uncle's F600 with a 4 & 2 speed by split shifting every gear. Always hauled heavy. I have driven the 5 & 2 speeds never thought about that in the higher gears, about the forth and 5th. Gears being geared that way. Had no visor or instruction placard. No one showed me the shift pattern. Back then it was just get in truck and drive. The owner of company was the CDL trainer. You just went and took the DMV written Test. Then the company did the Road Test. YES they use to do it that way. No 2 or 3 months of Drivers school training like now. Where you have a professional Driver train you to shift. Double clutch. Road training. Mostly on 10 speeds. Different Transmission. NO rear end transfer of rear end gear ratios. Thank you very much. This is real helpful for younger people to understand the older style of shifting those older Trucks.
Thank you so much , I have a 89 Ford F800 5/2 . I was pully my TL10 up a mountain and really batched it up pretty bad , ended up pulling the steep grade in low first , traffic wasn't very happy with me , even though it was only 4 cars . I wanted to show some courtesy and tried to pull off to the side and sunk in the grass , Now after the cars passed I was able to reverse on the steep grade and get the truck and trailer back on the road , but the right tire was so full of dirt and mud of course I had no traction . I tried to spin the tires clean , then started the wheel hop so I cancelled that and continued to reverse back down the hill to a flat enough area to take off again . This was a learning experience and I need more practice . I really thank you for breaking it down . It's way difference than my 10 speed road ranger .
Just bought a truck with a 2 speed rear that i know nothing about & this will help me greatly. Thanks!
Drove a Ford LN800 for many years with this same set-up. Realizing the top 4 combos were 4L - 4H - 5L - 5H was a key discovery.
Great explanation
That's called a working 5th transmission..
Your thumbnail got me. "What is wrong with that guys finger?" Video starts, "oh it's a two speed switch." 😆
Brought me down memory lane driving my old landscaping truck, a 1994 GMC Kodiak. I was the only guy they trusted driving it.
50 years ago in April of 1973 I turned 18,got my chauffeur's license and went to work driving C-60 Chevy 5 yard dumps with this same shift sequence..on that 1st morning the forman had all us drivers in a group, I was the new guy..when he got to me he asked,Can you drive that truck? he said pointing 1 out, I immediately said Yes Sir! To which he said Follow that guy..That guy was already rolling out the driveway!! I had to run, start the truck,find a gear and go..no test drive, no coaching.. absolutely sink or swim and I taught myself to get by until I had time to read the drivers manual in the glove box where I found the 4 lo,5 lo,4 hi, and 5 hi "trick" because there were no stickers in the cab.. part 2 later, maybe lol!!😊
Thanks for the video. I have to drive a 1997 F-800 bucket truck with this setup. It was stuck in high range when we got it and I noticed a huge difference when going from 3h to 4h. Now I know why.
Thank you for very detailed instructions! Verbally & visually!
I used to call it 5th over,, and with a 1968 International -238 Detroit the revs (tach) wanted 21:50 rpm,,and around 17.00 shifting range,,splitter was electric and it could make a clown" out of me leaving a green light in a hurry sometimes,, I would feather clutch and it would split faster or slower, ear it up and feel it in your seat,,! Great video, thanks!
Thank you!!! Just bought a 94 F700 and driving it home I ground a couple gears trying to figure this out now I know.
You have cleared any confusion Thank You sir!
Thank You sir for taking the time to explain an “ On The Job Training “ skill. Keep us the good videos. Have A Great Day! 🛻🚚🚛
Nice video, that shifting sticker was missing in my topkick so this helps!
I got a 91 Chevy bus with a 366 small block and a 4 speed split shifter and this helped a TON
Thank you very much I started my job and this is what they have nobody knew how to shift properly and hell I didn't either this was very helpful thank you
You're welcome, Miguel! I'm glad you found this informative and helpful.
Thank you! I'm eyeballing an old D400 with a 5x2 and was curious how that worked.
Thanks I just bought one of these and I got fooled because the button was already up so here I am trying to shift it up and thinking it is broken. Wished I had watched this video first.
You just don’t see trucks with dogs any more. Always thought they were a brilliant invention.
Great job 👍🏽😎. How many rpm's before we shift. Thanks for the video
Easy to understand bought a c 60 wasn't sure how the axle shifts thanks
Lot of muscle memory training...like druming.
Thanks for caring and sharing
Fellow drummer here as well- I totally agree!
Drove a lot of grain trucks back in the 70's. Usually split second gear, shifted 3L 4L 5L and 5H. Like a 6 speed. Worked out well most of the time. Didn't really need to split every gear.
Thankyou for this video ❤
Great explanation!!!
Thanks for the insight!!!
I drove a 86 chevy c60 with a 396 in it. Holmes 500 wrecker boom. I use to leave my axle in the high side. Just drive it as a straight five speed
I have a GMC 7000 with the same rear end ..
save your self some issues later
if you run empty or light just use high side..
if you have a heave load use them all
Thank you Bro.
Is it normal for these trucks to make a LOT OF NOISE? my 1991 split shift GMC Gas power top kick makes a LOT OF NOISE when im split shifting.
Thank you !
Would this also work for my r model Mack with a single stick 5 speed with the left and right, high and low
I owned a Inter Acco and I always went 2nd low 3rd low 4th low 5th low then to 5th high going down I went down in high range then when I got to 2nd then changed to Low range to start off again
Would that b the same way with a mack single stick 5 speed,high and low 🤔
thank you
That did simplify it a little thanks
4H and 5L are the same ratio. I tend to leave the axle in H unless fully loaded, and just drive it like a 5 speed. If loaded heavy, I'll start in 1L, shift to 2L, 3L, 3H, 4L, 4H, 5H.. more shifting whilst splitting, but it's much easier for me to stay moving without rowing constantly. If you get good, you can shift the transmission, axle, or both without the clutch. Except pulling uphill loaded.. put a tach on it, 4H and 5L are the same gear ratio.
Thank you! Glad I didn't have to mention this! Shifting 4L-5L-4H-5H is a waste. 4L-4H-5H is how it's done.
@lm464326 right on! I've heard that it's a different ratio, but the tach is always insistent that it's the same gear. 5x2 really does equal 9...
@@SLOCLMBRI don't have the ratios in front of me, but I know that numerically, 4H is slightly higher than 5L. It's not enough to make a difference though, even on a tach. You'd have to plug it in and pull the sensor data, or do the raw math with the ratios to notice
@@iamtheinfantry41035 I believe you! I still skip it
@@SLOCLMBR for sure. I don't blame you. I drive 13 and 18 speeds all day, and unless I'm overweight, I skip more than I hit!
Once I’m moving, I don’t use the clutch anymore. I only use the clutch for stop and go.
Thanks . Very helpful. When loaded , 5 high . And need to climb a hill is when everything goes to shit for me . What do you do ? I thought I would naturally shift the rear to low . But hardy ever works . I end up in 2nd or 3rd barely moving. ??
Stay in high range, shift down to 4 High, then button down and go to 5 low then 4 low and that should do the trick
I have yet to drive a manual transmission like this but this video is very informative in great detail. Thankyou for posting.
For anyone who can answer...is this same shift pattern for 4 speed/2 speeds?
I drove a 4 & 2 speed rear for meany years. Always heavy Loads. I just split every gear. I never shifted a 4 speed back to third hit and then forth high. Never seemed to bog down. Seemed normal. I watched another video on a guy with 4 & 2 speed rear. He just split every gear. YES I think on four speed it's split every gear.
4 and two is truly 8 different ratios vs a 5 and two being only 9 different ratios. In the 5 and two, 4H and 5L are the same ratio, you can use either one, but skip the other. If unloaded, you can just stay in high range and shift only the transmission
Very interesting. I drive a eaton 15 speed deep reduction.
What are the ratios of this 2 speed axle?
Thanks!
You’re welcome! I hope this helped!
So it's like shifting the high range of gears in a 13 speed
Great video. Is this a 10 speed or 5 speed? I thought I heard you said 10. My set up is just like yours. I have a 1974 international TK Dump truck with a 5-2 Caterpillar 210hp Transmission
This is considered a 5x2 or a 5-speed transmission with a 2-speed rear-end. Not the same as a 10-speed, which is 10 forward gears all in the transmission (typically a Roadranger with a high-low range switch operated by air). I drove a lot of years in both, and I think the 5x2 is actually a bit more flexible.
@@davepenn9181 I'd say a bit more durable, too.
Im about to purchase one of these… on my test drive can I go through all the hi and lo gears empty without a problem ..?
You can do it just to make sure they work, but you really won’t need them and they’ll probably be super low and it might be kind of jerky at the start. You’re better off skipping first gear ⚙️
Drove 2 spd axles many yrs. The 2 spd gear not that heavy. Dont use hi range in 1st or 2nd gear on hard pulls.. ive seen several twisted in two. Ask any truck mechanic.
If not hauling heavy can you just drive it like a regular 5 speed then go to high range? I think I heard that. I just double checking.
I’ve had my CDL for over twenty years now and have driven these split rear end trucks for many, many miles. I have always cycled through the low range first, then used the preselect switch (red button) to go to the high range. Never had an issue whether I’m loaded or not. Way too much effort to cycle from low to high as is suggested in the video.
Got a 50 F6 and 61 F600 both have 4 and 2s
Found one I want to restore, this is a start
So it's basically like a Super 10 big truck transmission? But a 5 speed or basically a 10 speed since each gear has a high and low?
Your thinking is very close, a super 10 is still a 5spd that you use twice, if the vehicle is new to you, be gentle and feel out 4th and 5th hi's and lo's...it may be 4 lo,hi and then 5 lo,hi, the early 70's C60 I drove had 4 lo..5 lo then back to 4 hi and finally 5 hi..I scared the company driver who road tested me because he was taught lugging 5th lo to 5th hi was normal, When I went back to 4 hi he jumped and grabbed the dash with both hands, I didn't say a word...
Can I just leave it in high gear through all the gears? If im not pulling a load
Absolutely!
Nate I have a question, I have a topkick with the vortec 8.1 liter unleaded gas engine, when I get up to highway cruising speed (60-65mph), are my RPMs suppose to be at or slightly above 3000rpms. I think it kind of weird thats all. My RPM tack goes up to 5000rpm.
Yes 3000 is normal for that setup
Wow
Super 10
Try a 5 speed with a 4 speed Spicer gear box and once you get a truck rolling you don't need to double clutch any transmission is out dated use a low rpm shift after your rolling you don't need a clutch except starting g and stoping or in and out of reverse to first gear
I’m looking at buy one myself. Same truck. The owner states it doesn’t go into high gears. What could this be?
1. The switch on the shifter is bad (most common in my experience)
2. Electrical wiring issue
3. A problem with the shift motor on the axle
4. Bad shift solenoid
Thanks for watching. I hope this helps. Good luck!
Question so when your in 5 high how would you go from 5 high to 5 low? We have one of these as a tanker on our fire dept and I’ve only driven it like a 5 speed because I’m not sure how to downshift with the dual axle.
If you want to go from 5H to 5L, with your foot still on the accelerator, push the button down, take your foot off the pedal, ever so briefly, then come back down on it, and your shift down will be done.
Exactly..when you let up on the throttle you introduce momentary slack along the entire driveline, that slack allows the electric motor/solenoid at the rear differential to change between the 2 ratios available, for downshift you need to increase driveshaft speed gently, the gears will mesh when they match
@@jimwilloughby thanks!
@@jackspringer9283 sounds good I appreciate it!
@@jackspringer9283 idk about this...when you shift up, youre going from high force to low, because as you shift, the rpms are dropping...but when you downshift the rear, the axle is going to slam in pretty hard right?
Mine has hesitation on the button is that normal ?
Definitely get that checked out. If you’re making the shift correctly, it should be pretty quick and smooth. If there’s hesitation, it could be an issue with the solenoid on the axle. I’d suggest having it looked at and tested by an experienced truck repair shop. Good luck!
My switch went out in my bus. It’s stuck in low. I can’t get it in high. Is it an easy fix?
That depends- could be a couple things. If it’s just the switch, yes all you need is the red switch. It could also be a solenoid or actuator on the rear axle that changes the gears themselves. Pull the switch and have it tested and go from there. Either way, parts for these aren’t too terrible expensive or difficult to work on. Good luck!
@@NatesPlaceMI hey thanks for the response. Really appreciate it
@@Spacecowboy42 If it's vacuum operated than you might just need to check the diaphragm on the rear axle. Could not be holding any vacuum, or it's torn. This is a super easy repair/replace.
If your truck has air, change the diff shifter to an air change usually the electric motor fails and gets stuck in either hi or low which means you end up with a box full of neutrals
What truck is it?
1990 Chevy Kodiak
basically super 10 speed
I'll take this over a twin stick 😂
You and me both 😂
😔😡 I wanted to hear DAT CAT rattle !!
I had a 6500 !!!! W/a cat n same transmission!! Thrill to drive !! Passing whatever we wanted !!
Up the Colorado,UTAH,Washach, Appalachians !!😔 ! MPG SANK !!
Still hauled Timberframe,timbers, tools n a trailer all over !
The extended cab WUZ HUGE ! W/a Chrime bar behind the front seats ! We strapped luggage on it ! Two Guys would sleep on the floor ! N backseat Guys still had legroom !!
Should have kept it for a P/U TRUCK !!
I wish my 95 cummins had a 2 speed axle
Now THAT would be cool! Right up there with my pipe dream of Dayton style hubs on an F450 🤙🏻🤷🏼♂️
So sorta like a mini 10 speed
Essentially, yes! You end up with 10 forward and 2 reverse gear ratios
Brakes compressor
KODIAK
I can drive one of these stoned