How tracks changed forever after the first Tokyo Olympics
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- čas přidán 24. 07. 2021
- The Tokyo Olympics in 2021 will be historic. The 1964 Tokyo Olympics already was, thanks to a big change in the track itself.
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This video is all about the transition from cinder tracks to synthetic tracks in the Olympics, and why that matters. Here's a grab bag of links:
Thumb by the incomparable Linus Boman. Have you seen his channel? / @linusboman
Track maker extraordinaire: beynonsports.com/en/why-beyno...
Tracks being laid down: • Carpell Surfaces | Sto...
Let's Run forum post about cinder tracks: www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_re...
Big OpEd about how synthetic tracks are a must have for training: www.infobae.com/aroundthering...
A bit about the certification process: www.worldathletics.org/downlo...
Gaze upon Hayward: hayward.uoregon.edu/hayward-f...
I was a hurdler in high school & college. I didn't run on an synthetic track until running on my college track. Prior to that all I knew was cinder tracks. I can tell you from first hand experience that falling on a cinder track was much more "memorable" than falling on a synthetic track. Cinder tattoos are real.
Cinder tracks completely scared me off hurdles. I saw a hurdler destroy his chest from a fall, he was a bloody mess and was rushed to the hospital. Like falling on coarse sandpaper.
I graduated in 2015 and in my four years running hurdles I only ran once on a cinder track. I thought it was fun but I still prefer synthetic.
My middle school had a cinder track that they let degrade to the point of essentially being tough dirt with pebbles the consistency of DG. Memorable is definitely the right word for it, while I didn't get the tattoo, I can't think of a worse surface to fall on, especially at speed. Coarse sandpaper is an understatement.
I run on dirt tracks
I don’t really understand the logic of cinder tracks. You might as well have a dirt track at that point, like a baseball field no?
I see several people talk about how their schools were the last to adopt synthetics and how they ran on dirt and cinder rather recently. But at my school we ran on a gravel concrete mixture that could literally shear whole panels of skin off upon a tumble. This was until 2018 when we got blacktop asphalt like a road would have which was way smoother but hotter. Oh and I forgot, to top it all off our track wasn’t even the right length. Unlike every other track on the planet that’s 400m ours was 414m because the building company both used yards instead of meters AND measured wrong. Last ran there in 2019, good times.
Reminds me of a 410m track that had 3 turns and 3 straights because they built it around a baseball field
@@jadenlilly6113 i read that as basketball field and i has trying to figure out how to make a "square" with 3 turns and three straights.
@@ferretforrent1144 baseball court
Our school had a synthetic track, but was also the wrong length and we couldn’t host meets. There were also some divots in different places
😂😂😂 lol
Cinder tracks are fun, but I have a shale track nearish me. Really strange to run on, and my god, in heavy wind you're basically blinded by the shale dust, even if you're not particularly close to the track.
Wow, I am super curious now.
@@PhilEdwardsInc Yeah, I'm unsure when shale stopped being used in place of cinder, all I know is they used shale in Chariots of Fire, which was about the 1924 olympics
Its not only the track that has contributed to the athletes performance. Athletes now a days take the benefits of a good diet along with strength training. Along with these, there is lot of advancement in the sportsware aswell. Infact, world athletics had to ban a Nike shoe cuz it gave an extra edge for the athletes over the other competitors
Ban the dragonfly spikes
@@waterproof4403 why?
@@rileyoakley7196 rich folks had them poor folks did not
Yep the shoes are about a third the weight
@@tesmith47 imo dragonflys are fair. 5 of the 6 people that outran me at my state meet were wearing them but one guy went out in saucony spikes and still threw down a fast 1600. Just because you have on dragonflys dont mean you are automatically faster
Insightful as ever Phil. When will Casio finally recognise your brand ambassadorship?
This all ends when I become CEO of Casio.
@@PhilEdwardsInc when you become CEO I need a one-off reissue of the Eminem gshock. 800+ for black and 23k for grey is too pricey unless it's a 1960s Fender Stratocaster
@@PhilEdwardsInc I swear I thought that was the midway cut when it cut to your closing. There was so much more you could have expanded upon and delved into. For instance, touching on the topic of whether or not that randomness really speaks to who is the best athlete or not. Is an athlete that consistently performs well on a cinder track, despite the variability and random chance, better than an athlete that always beats him/her on a synthetic track? Is the more adaptable athlete better(that could actually perhaps run a track on a field) than one that that dominates under perfect conditions? Nobody's saying you had to pick a side, just saying there was loads of material for you to work with and expand upon on both sides.
Awesome
@@MaverickBlue42 who?
In the 70s I ran on tracks made from dirt, cinder, crushed brick, and rubberized asphalt before I finally set foot on a tartan surface at state in 1979. The improvement in my performance was phenomenal.
Yes, the average track in the Bay State League, Massachusetts was cinder and I believe rubberized asphalt. I am not sure if we saw a great track that year. Most of the towns in the Bay State League had good running traditions and were not poor towns. Thankfully, we did not know any better.
@@furfamilysue My senior year at Framingham South (1972), we ran all our meets at Framingham, Natick, & Wellesley who all had rubberized asphalt tracks.. We ran on a cinder track at Needham in 1971 & that's the last one I remember. And Needham was a track powerhouse back then! Go figure!
How much difference that synthetic track gave compared to that old track?
@@medhanjaisaxena4960 Once I was in college (Northeastern) all we ran on were synthetic tracks. I think the biggest difference is the synthetics allow you to train harder without beating up your legs & joints.
@@paulgill3672 yeah man ik that but i wanted to know about the time difference, i recently ran a 22.64 FAT on grass, so fast can i run on a synthetic track with exact same conditions????
My favourite story of the horrors of olympic running tracks is the track used in the disastrous 1904 Summer Olympics Marathon. This was when the dustbowl was rly at its height and they ran on very hilly and dust covered or even just dirt roads, often with other traffic nearby, for hours on end in weather of around 100F/38C. Oh, and there was prty much no water provided to runners at any point along the route as it was believed it wud slow runners down to be properly hydrated. Theres a whole lot of other absurdness from that race too.
"There were only two places where athletes could secure fresh water, from a water tower at six miles and a roadside well at 12 miles (overall race was 24.8 miles). James Sullivan, the chief organizer of the games, wanted to minimize fluid intake to test the limits and effects of purposeful dehydration, a common area of research at the time. "
I recall that. Two runners were chased by dogs and hid in orchard or regular trees for shelter. That same Olympics killed several swimmers and water sport participants because the water was infected with livestock runoff from the world's fair held next to it. Also don't forget what regular hydration the runners got that was an egg whites, honey and rat poison concoction.
@@dragonsword7370 The guy who won was given that crazy rat poison mixture multiple times and had to shuffle across the line aided by his trainers. They also thought a guy who gave up during the race, got a car ride most of the way back, and then jogged across the finish line won before that happened. Not to mention the 2 people who ran without shoes, and the multiple amateurs who just decided to run the race as well. Someone else stopped at an orchard along the way to eat some apples which turned out to be rotten and upset his stomach. He ended up passing out for a few hours but still finished 4th. What a wild time.
The Dustbowl was in the 1930s, and not in St. Louis. It was just really hot and the streets were unpaved.
@@SamAronow dry dusty dirt roads in MIssouri or Illinois summer heat get miserably dusty. It's why rural places still spray some kind of agent over the roads to glom down the dust and dirt in the dry times.
Here's a good video about it from Jon Bois czcams.com/video/M4AhABManTw/video.html. Or if you're afraid or links, just search CZcams for 1904 Olympic marathon and it's the first video.
I ran on cinder tracks in 1991 in the Midwest US. I have 3 cinder tattoos from a 800m in 1990. I did not win. School also had a bullet hole in the door to the back door of the building. A guy on our team broke a pole vault there as the pit was too deep.
Best comment I've ever heard about that 1964 track at Tokyo came from John Davies (who finished third in the 1500). He described how the acceleration Peter Snell cut loose from the 300m mark left the field "running through his potholes". Snell will probably be the last man ever to achieve the 800/1500 double, and the disturbing thing is, you look at the footage, he didn't just win. There will not ever be a more dominant performance in an Olympic final than that. He didn't win by daylight, daylight had passed. Metaphorically track officials would have lit night time torches between him finishing and the rest of the field (who were after the leader had torn through the cinders effectively running cross country). Great video.
Also the last person to set a world mile record on a grass track - about 3:54 from memory.
@@tonylittle3508 -At Wanganui’s Cooks Gardens, New Zealand.
Super interesting video on a topic I never knew I needed to know. Great work as always Phil.
The quality is so good that when i looked at your sub count I was really shocked to see you didn’t even have 50k! You really deserve a MILLION subs
The tall runner with low arms in the '64 5,000m is (Aussie) Ron Clarke. One of the best distance runners to never win gold. He won another medal in '68 (Mexico City). Beautiful runner with several WRs in the '60s. Vale Ron.
Great video! I've enjoyed all your videos on Vox, and happened to get lucky that this video intersected with my interest in Track and Field. I'm so glad you have your own channel so I can watch more of your content now. You have a really unique artistic voice that's really enjoyable and can make any topic interesting
Loving your channel. Can't believe its not popular yet. All the best!
Your videos are perfect!!! They are the right length, they have the right amount of detail and the mix of scenery is entertaining.
I ran track as a kid and I can say gravel took a toll on one’s body and I love the synthetic track. Less pressure on legs and hips. The track shoes you had to have long spikes and that added to the rough run. I agree the technology that has gone into track and field. Like football and tennis the change in equipment has made players performance better. And players play longer like tennis.
You should do a video on Olympic swimming pools. The 5km winning time will get you a nice scholarship today but the 1500m freestyle winning time will barely get you a look from most D1 schools. A LOT has changed
The state qualifying (and probably winning) times when I swam in HS in the early 2000's probably wouldn't even get you a look from D1 schools nowadays in even the shorter distances. It is insane how much swimming has changed in just the past 2 decades, let alone prior to that. Heck even with him talking about Track and synthetic tracks, with how much equipment and training has advanced in the past two decades it's the same story. There are kids running times in the 800m in HS that would have done pretty well in the Olympics 20 years ago.
@@Jaqen-HGhar state wins get you looks, state qualifying doesn’t matter cause it’s not hard
Distance doesn’t matter, depends on what ur winning
@@zachsuarez1830 In the early 2000's making it to State would get you visits (if not offers). At least in 4A and 5A in TX. I mean there aren't enough kids winning at state to fill an entire team at each D1 school.
@@Jaqen-HGhar there 100% are, remember there’s 6a, 5a, blah blah all the way down to 1, that’s 6 people per event, with second place being just as good as first in some things. Winning doesn’t matter, times are all the really matters in swim
I use to pave running tracks for a company. We used a mixture of recycled rubber materials and a combination of urethane.
Thanks phil!! I love these videos! They are so cool and informative!
Awesome video, I've always wondered about how much more energy return a synthetic track would give over dirt or cinder. Also just randomly found your video and the track you are running on is at the high school I graduated from, so crazy
Thanks for another interesting video Phil!
I'd say this is an evolution of the sport, and it's happened in most others too. Just take a look at a modern football (soccer for those over the pond) they're not the heavy leather balls of old. They're made of synthetic materials, are much lighter and are designed to induce certain flight characteristics.
I'll just say Bob Hayes was an amazing person, Gold medal track and field runner as well as a Superbowl champ. I met him before he passed away. Every time I see a track and field I think of him.
This is honestly one of the most interesting videos I've seen in a while! Glad to have found it
The crunch at the end really ties this all together
Very informative video. Much appreciated!
this was a lovely video to watch! subbed!
This is the kind of information I would have never known existed. Thank you and bring more.
My brother lives 5 mins away from Hayward Field and he just showed it to me last July when I was visiting from out of town! Very impressive complex, he sounded really proud to have it in his city, too.
Amazing watch my friend. Great taste
These videos are incredibly high quality!
The greatest change I've noticed is in the game of Hockey. After the inception of synthetic turfs in Olympics, countries from subcontinent have struggled to perform well. Developed countries started dominating the game and countries like India, Pakistan who couldn't afford these surfaces fell behind.
Field hockey, I assume?
@@godoftenors Yes. Field hockey.
@@cmmartti That's debatable! Totally depends on where you are from I guess. Ice hockey is not popular in most of the sub continent and it's the other way around in North America. Anyway I agree I should have been more specific :)
@@cmmartti hockey means field hockey everywhere else in the world apart from North America. Don't assume your way is the only correct way.
@@Shacko14 maybe but even so field hockey is based off of ice hockey, which can just be called hockey. It’s like how football can either mean association football, rugby football, American football, Australian football etc. Depending on where you all, despite all sharing a common origin
Nice video, love the details : )
When I was in college (1967-71) our team traveled to College of the Desert near Palm Springs, CA. We ran on a natural grass track because other materials would not survive the dust storms. The grass was cut short and was very soft and very "slow".
My high school in the early 80's had a cinder track. We trained on that for cross country and track. When we did go to schools (some high schools had them and the local University as well) that had 'rubber tracks' as we called them then, and our times definitely got better. I'm convinced that training on cinder made us better runners on rubber. When kids from other schools showed up at our meets they would be amazed, saying things like "How do you run on this?" we'd respond with "As fast as you can." In four years of high school, we lost 2 track meets. We had a great coach as well.
Good training
Wow, that sounds a lot like my school. We ran on ashes clear through 1984. We hated it, especially when it rained. The new rubber track in '85 was terrific.
One day I looked through some old yearbooks and saw in the late 1970s our track team was insane, like 94 - 6 in ten years with five undefeated seasons.
I asked our gym teacher why he stopped coaching and he just mumbled, "It was a coupla reasons", then walked away.
I enjoy your content very informative hope you keep getting them subs you deserve it good luck
As of 5 years ago my high school was one of the only in the region with a dirt track - running on that for events was hell on earth compared to the rubber tracks at every other school. I sucked either way so it's not like it made much of a difference performance-wise though hehe
Really great videos. Enjoy your content.
We had a mix of synthetic and cinder tracks we practiced and competed on in the late 70s and early 80s. We had to change out our spikes longer or shorter depending on the track surface. The only advantage of cinder was it didn't get as hot as synthetic on +90 degree F summer days.
Your videos are great. Keep up the great work
Love the video!
Second time I've watched this video and it's still just as interesting. keep it up breh
Lovely video! ☺️
What an awesome video!
Maybe I missed it but almost all of the U.S cinder tracks are 440 yards vs 400 meters meaning there's some races and records with the decline of cinder that may never be broken again
interesting
@@PhilEdwardsInc pretty much meaning the 880 yard record at the middle school I attended will never be taken down
I bet you could cover this subject again with much longer video.
You have a great voice and manner that makes for us wanting more of your work.
Good job Phil 😊
Amazing to think that Bob Hayes ran 10.06 for the 100 metres on that Tokyo 1964 cinder track. He also ran a wind aided 9.91 that didn't count as a record. In the final he drew lane 1 - the inside lane - knowing that so many of the distance runners over the previous couple of days, the 10,000 metres - 25 laps - for instance had created a foot-slogged valley in the cinder surface that he then had to contend with. Thankfully, runners at international and later all events since then haven't had to contend with that.
I was in the stands when Hayes ran the final leg of the 4x100. He started 3 yards back and finished ahead by 3 yds
I just found this channel. It’s really cool! Great video, especially for such a small CZcamsr.
You have the same watch as me, nice.
Keep rocking that gold Casio!
We are elites.
this was really cool to check out, would like to see more info on the differences in times
Happy I came across your channel, you've got some interesting videos! I think the first I saw was the Pentagon one, and I've been enjoying each one I've watched since.
Really interesting video!
Cinder track is harder to remove from under skin when someone falls which is likely during a race. I went over the handlebars on my bicycle as a kid and learned that the hard way on a cinder driveway
Many years ago, 1962 to be exact, our high school track league championships were held at a field with a new cinder track, very loose surface. Winning time in the 100 yard dash was 11.5 seconds, as I recall. Normal meet winning times were in the range of 10.0 to 10.2 seconds.
What would Bob Hayes have run in 1964 on a synthetic track?
I was a mediocre shot-putter, 42'6" was a decent put for me.
When Were you born? I'm guessing 1947/1948.
@@biggiecheese1280 1944
@Tom Kieffer . . . In high school back then, well into the 1970s, a mark over 40 feet in the shot could get a competitor placing in the top three at a dual meet.
Gee! I ran the 100 yards in HS with a best mark of 10.8. A time of 11.5 you wrote of makes it sound like the race was held at a beach.
@@bloqk16 The race was on a new and uncompacted cinder track, so it may as well have been on a beach. My 42', more or less, was #3 on the team.
U prob wont see this but if u ever think these vids are pointless (probably don’t) trust me, I and a ton of other people love this kind of stuff and u have a gift of explanation really do appreciate yours vids keep it up!
Saw it and appreciated!
high school cinder track 100 meters - 10.5: state meet on a synthetic track - 10.14, 2nd place...🔥💥😳 very interesting
this was great. I trained on a outdoor cinder track at my HS during cross country AND a mondo track for indoor/outdoor track!👟
This was really cool to watch and your quality is super good. Subscribed.
Also hello from Eugene OR!
Jealous! I lived in Eugene for about six months a million years ago. Did I consume any track and field while I was there? No. I was focused on what was more mind boggling to me at the time - some place that had dollar movies.
As someone who really appreciates my school's track and was curious about it, this was great!
subbed for this, maybe my second or third of yours. i like your thoughtfulness and curiosity.
great video!
I found it amusing that, as a trail runner, I absolutely love the sound at 1:51 ...I've never really enjoyed the experience of fancy tracks. But then again, I'm not a sprinter. Funny how just the sound of different types of ground can trigger a feeling!
That video is one I made. I ran over 20000 miles on that track.
You are exactly right I ran on cinder in 1964 and that sound crunch, crunch, crunch coming behind you still triggers me😅
For many years, Ratcliff Stadium in Fresno Ca was considered one the fastest tracks in the world even though it was a cinder track. But as you mentioned, it takes a lot of maintenance. Fortunately, the city and the maintenance workers took pride in their work caring for the track.
I had the opportunity to run on this track in HS and college in the West Coast Relays track invatational. Every year, there would be a listing comparing the times on this track with the other artificial track events such as the Penn Relays and other big track events. In each case, the times at West Coast would be about the same or often, faster.
Great video
This is so cool. My high school got that synthetic track for the pan am games in the 90s. Still in great condition
Before that, we had crushed limestone "quarter down" which gave a pretty great road rash when we fell
I'm new to the channel, and I enjoyed this video. Hard to believe you have so few comments and so many views. Keep up the good work.
I've seen maybe 2 videos from you?
And I'm completely uninterested in track sports...
And yet, I've just subscribed.
Excellent channel man, keep it up, and I hope CZcams rewards you. 🍻
Yep this was my high school track experience. We practiced on the gravel tracks but we competed on synthetic tracks
At my small-town Nebraska track, it was a mix of crushed white rock, gravel, dirt and maaaaaybe some cinders. Which is probably whyall the track meets were held at the neighboring town, which had a fancy synthetic track.
Cool video, thanks!
I gotta admit I didn't catch the posting date, as we're now coming up to the winter advertising games. The issue you mentioned is not something I've ever thought about as the only running I ever do (or did since it's been since March 2020) was to go to after a NYC Transit bus or subway. That being said, it's a nice of news to know about. Thanks.
very interesting article :)
Another great one... sometimes I feel like you are inside my head for what type of videos I enjoy.
We ran on cinder in the 90s. The meet that was infamous for it was the one that also had the fieldman’s race and the steeple pits. I borrowed shoes and broke two 1/4 spikes on the steeples cause I’m a big dude.
The meta-sport of equipment advantages is really cool, especially in marathon competition. The problem that has arose is that Nike's competitive race shoe significantly out does all its competitors to the point were athletes signed with other companies will wear the shoes while covering the Nike logo, or else they would be at a disadvantage from the gun. Its really interesting viewing how much equipment effects and plays into the sport.
Good video.. It would be interesting to interview runners who ran on all surface s. It's amazing how tracks have changed over the years...
You should do a video on the science of indoor tracks with their high banks. If you run say the 200 meters and are in the outside lane. You are over five feet above the ground in the turns.
In my highschool we only had a cinder track to run on. It is hard to run in if you don’t use spikes because it was very easy to slip and fall. Really glad I threw so I only warmed up on it. I don’t remember anyone getting “tattoos” but I would doubt it. The cinder was quite painful to fall on.
Alot of the footage and the still image at 1:35 is Billy Mills, who won the 10k at the 1964 Tokyo Olympics. He was a huge underdog and not considered a challenger for a medal much less the gold. There is a famous video about his race and his final lap where he pulled away and took the victory. Billy Mills is an Oglala Lakota from Pine Ridge South Dakota, a true warrior.
Good job
Good stuff
Ah riding the Olympic seo wave I see! Great video as always.
hahah i feel seen. at least making an attempt!
Cinder Tattoo would be an AMAZING band name
Finally, jocks and emo kids will be united.
I have no idea why this was recommended to me but I don’t regret watching it
I ran on a cinder track in the early 90s before it was resurfaced after my last year running. I'm missing pigment in left leg by my knee where I fell on the cinders and got torn up.
A new insight. 🎉
Thank you ☺️
Interesting - when Kilauea erupted into the Leilani Estates in 2018, folks who lived there recorded all kinds of video - and heating the sound of cinder trucks again, I was reminded of heating footsteps on all that lava!
Any opinion among you guys on which type is better for runners? I had chronic shin splints all theiughout high school and part of college, so I always preferred rubber tracks which felt like they absorbed more impact. Apart from preventing cinder tatoos, I suspect they are better for joints, shins, etc. Does anyone know definitively?
Holy shit, I thought i was watching a NYT short documentary. Good stuff!!
I've been to Hayward field in Eugene and that place is freakin' amazing.
I did long distance track and cross country races in junior high and high school. I achieved my personal best in the mile and 2 mile races on a cold, rainy day in racing flats my coach had me use for the first time. Every little thing makes a difference.
You know I was a very bad cross country runner for just a year, but I totally remember every condition when I got my PR. Sticks with you!
great advantage of cinder tracks: you can analyse your running by looking at the footprints.
Had a synthetic at my high school, it felt great to run on
You bring up a good point and one that most fans of track and field are unaware of. There needs to be some experimentation in the difference in restitution between all weather tracks and cinder tracks, if you can still find one. I was a sprinter in the 80's and have raced on both cinder and all weather tracks and needless to say there is a big difference. I would love to see the times of Bob Hayes corrected for poor surface quality, I'm sure on a contemporary track his times would be competitive today.
Go to Camp Verde Arizona the high school track is just like that track hasn't changed I ran on that track from sixth grade all the way to high school. I love that sound when you run on a dirt track.
And a cinder track was an improvement on what preceded it
I have ran on hayward field in 2016. What is the difference in the upgrade equate to in performance ?
Commenting here to really help the channel 😎
thanks todd 🦸♂️