I Just find the concept that the Tenno routinely dive in haunted labs and don't notice the wisper of ghost because they are to busy blasting music amusing.
Suspiciously Green & Black Nova Prime running through the labs: "Oop, sorry 'Voices of the Dead', can't listen, too busy listening to Devil Trigger! ALL THESE THOUGHTS RUNNIN' THROUGH MY HEAD~"
To me, an important aspect of Albrecht's character is his martyr complex. To say whether he is good or bad, selfless or selfish is a dumbing down of his internal conflict. He is not "cartoonishly evil" in a single minded sense - it was Loid's love that made him decide to live, he talks of Loid lovingly AND he even talks of his daughter favorably. He regrets abandoning Euleria, he regrets abandoning Loid and he even feels sorry about the Cavia experiment (he cannot bring himself to sacrifice Kalymos, another living being he genuinely cares about, but is still distraught about the Cavia as a whole. He couldn't kill Tagfer, Fib and Bird and instead gave them to Loid -> while also talking how much better of a person Loid is; Albrecht elevates the people (and kavat) he loves while also using it as an excuse to "prove" that he is evil and irredeemable). My take is that Albrecht feels responsible for Wally/The Other (in his 2020 original requiem logs he even talks how, despite other people going to explore the Void, nobody talks about seeing the Other); so it is possible to believe Albrecht genuinely does feel like Wally is HIS demon (reference to Loid's line, also the Operator log lore catchup blames Albrecht for the existence of the Indifference) and thus only Albrecht himself can and should fight him. He runs away to 1999 to protect Loid (because he DOES care about Loid) but also because he needs a "battleground" between him and Wally. So, everything Albrecht does is a way for him to seek redemption through death. He will go out with a bang and that will be his absolution. Unless we stop him or convince him that there is another way. IF we want to do that... But I believe that, in line with Warframe's overall narrative, that will be our angle. In Duviri he ALMOST realizes how the Indifference works (it latches onto your emotions, specifically negative ones), but because he is so caught up in lionizing Euleria while putting himself down, he instead decides that he has to fight physically. It only deepens his martyr complex and his resolution that he has to be "an honest demon". To me Albrecht isn't good or evil... he is strangely human for an Orokin. Also he possesses self-awareness, something the Orokin are constantly described as lacking. They are beings of hubris and delusions of grandeur. Albrecht clearly had an ego, but he can also admit that he has done wrong. He just doesn't believe he deserves a conventional apology ("if only I was worthy of you, my Loid."). ---- This has nothing to do with the wider philosophical aspects of your analysis, but it is very interesting as an analysis of Albrecht as a character in how everything he does goes against Orokin tradition and values: 1) even his appearance, he never had the giant blue arm, possibly a conscious choice to go against the grain. 2) practices alchemy, a forbidden art, which was the key to Void science. 3) Saw the value in "archaic" technology: the Entrati had a grand library and actual, physical books; a lot of Entrati items ingame are described as archaic but reliable 4) even the Entrati aesthetic - the Orokin are all about gold and white, whereas the Entrati aesthetic is very gothic in comparison 5) Their attitudes towards death - Orokin were flippant around death and dying, the Entrati had burial grounds and ossuaries. Did they honor their past bodies? Their past lives? 6) and of course... Albrecht and Loid's relationship. Fraternizing with the lower castes was forbidden (but only the lowborn would face punishment) or was seen as a taboo fetish, but Loid and Albrecht were clearly on equal terms and respected each other immensely.
well said , agreed , and imho spot on =] though its completely possible that Albrecht did have the typical orokin features in many of his prior forms [ie the blue skin and long arm] , remember that he choose to not undergo the continuity only after his encounter with Wally , we dont necessarily know how many times previously that Albrecht did take the kuva and transfer into a new yuvan host
Sometimes I wonder if the Man in the Wall is even a villain in the first place. To me, personally, he just seems like a truly "chaotic" force-of-nature kind of entity.
@@TheDsIEGE Reminds me of Lovecraftian lore to an extent. I can imagine "defeat' (if it even exists when it comes to beings like him) in of itself being a concept that he can work around, and eventually with time, bypass. I feel like there's plenty of nods to Lovecraftian lore in general when it comes to The Indifference. The voidtongue, his presence, and mystery all combined bears a striking resemblance to Nyarlathotep. Atleast, in my opinion.
@@senri3125 I agree; The Indifference need not be malign, but simply omnipotential, able to be many things or even anything. Case in point: ancient Greek "atomistics" considered Void to be a fifth basic element, amongst air, fire, water, and earth where void was a dualism - both emptiness and potentiality. The Indifference, emerging from the void (or its essence) has acted both chaotically and cohesively, being transformative as well as controlling.
@@TheDsIEGEfirst, learn of your shadows existence. Second, learn not just to live with it, but to fully INCORPORATE it into your full being, taking the best of both your light and shadow, and bolstering the weaknesses of the other. If one fails, at best one would lead a life unfulfilled, or on average the shadow breaks out when we least want it to. At worst….it takes over the light, and we are overtaken by the worst of our traits.
My own theory is that he simply does not want to alone or find a real permanent body for his own. However the second part lacks proof the first one is pure speculation. But normally he doesn't seem hostile towards his important subjects
The Indifference being sourced from and the worst trait of Albrecht signifies the path ahead. I'm reminded of Psychonauts. Take his pain away, put the void back in its box. To keep the shadow at bay. Or to unify them. Soul benders as tenno are. Comfortable in the depths of the Abyss which stares back. Not defeated, but placated, sated after ravenous engorgement on the orogin system. All the pieces go back in the same box at the games end.
What I realized at the end of the 1999 sequence is Albrecht says Arthur with the voice of the indifference. And it's sometimes heard in Duviri too when we answer a tablet. Arthur must be important to him. The Vessel is made of him after all.
I think that the starting images of the quest are really telling in what the underlying conflict is. The moving dust reminds me of cymatics, the visualization of sound frequency patterns through metal plates and dust particles. the dust shaken by wally's voice symbolize the "world of dust" as it's called being shaken by the presence of the indifference, being affected and changed by the presence. And all the connections between the vocas being different intensities or forms of speech, so a bellow for example, always being in the lower registries. DE opened a very symbolic plane only through sound and I congratulate them for that.
You know it's funny that everyone is glossing over the fact albrecht managed to Crack a form of time travel, and yet hasn't figured out another way to travel faster then light without the void
I definitely see us playing as partial warframe-operator’s, similar to Arthur. Imagine the suit unwrapping itself from around our head, almost like the venom symbiote.
Oh boi this was a juicy one. First of all, my man Siege cannot stop cookin, he's hitting that kitchen harder than me hitting those Acolyte Farms for Protea Prime. I like to say I know a thing or two about Warframe's Lore, but this current narrative is probably the most confusing and convoluted, maybe because we are still missing a few pieces from the chessboard. In regards to our Tax Evader Wally, what I could gather is, maybe Wally is a physical representation of the Shadow, something we all have. If that is the case, it would make sense for Wally to have been created instead of being born. When Albrecht fell into the Void, the Shadow took form in an entity known now as The Indifference. Fitting too if I may say, his name. Anyway, if that is the case, I would argue there are as many Wallys as there are people, because we all have the Shadow. It's just waiting to be manifested, but for that to happen, it needs to make contact with the Void. Or, I'm just way too high on cereal right now.... There's also this other theory I had and I'm not sure I shared yet. It's about the Protoframes and 1999 in general... We know Entrati went back in time, not to an alternate timeline. We know he brought stuff from his current year to the past, already breaking a bunch of rules of time travel. As if this wasn't enough, he created Warframes, Protoframes, which creates a Paradox. What this means is, both Ballas and Entrati are responsible for the creation of the Warframes. Entrati used the Helminth Strain to infect people in 1999 and create the Protoframes. In the future of this timeline, Ballas could take notes and create the Warframes based on the Protoframes. I like to call this the Albrecht Paradox. It effetively means that Albrecht Entrati may be responsible for literally everything in the Orokin Empire thanks to his actions in 1999. Anyway, I went on way too long already,. Great vid Siege as always, keep on cookin my man, we're here and we're hungry.
I dont think the lab is made out of the bones of people he sacrificed to the void BUT that notion made me connect a few things. The entire lab is build like a body, eyes and ears we defend. The Necramites, Necromechs and Culverins acting like cells (Necromechs being a perfect analogy for Killer T Cells.) Capilaries which move resources around the lab. What if the entire lab is grown from a subject, the gray strain specificly described as being able to grow to massive sizes. The Orokin Derelicts are full of the grey strain afterall.
But... what are the walls made of? Wouldn't it actually make sense within that exact line of thinking that the structures would be made of skeletal bone?
@@DavidUtau He was considered worthless by other orokin even after that achievement, I'm _not_ talking about ant castes here, I'm talking about _social standing._
The significance of Wally's missing finger may come from Hindu hand mudras, where the index finger represents Vayu (air), as in flying through the "air" of the void. There maybe other allusions, but for now I can only come up with connecting the many ghostly eyes in the walls (or we capture) to Swaha (form).
Alternatively it could also be something like "The Creation of Adam" (In the Sistine Chapel I think it was) where God reaches out to give life to Adam. Albrecht would be "Adam" in this case With Wally as "God" (at least in the way that he rules the void) Albrecht ran away from Wally and something something "Albrecht put the stars in reach" Idk, just my interpretation
Albert, I wouldn't say is neither brilliant or evil. More so he is both equal parts gifted as he is traumatized; which, when combined even with the best of intentions, is just one of the many stepping stones on our path to the hell that we know as the void.
The Carl Jung shadow theory is amazing, especially considering what is also considered in that theory - The collective unconsciousness. Indeed, The indifference/Wally is very fitting of being a shadow, The part of our characters closest to the collective unconsciousness. An unconsciousness where figures and concepts often are the anchoring entities, think Vitruvian man, deadly sins and emotions in Duviri, greed, envy, sorrow, joy, maybe a bit of a stretch, but the Lotus as the Tenno characters mother figure could also very much be enforced by the shadows anchoring in the collective unconsciousness, mother/nurture as a concept... All are conceptual entities in the collective unconsciousness, and the void may very well be a theoritical theory made manifest, it could be an interpretation of the Collective Unconsciousness of all sentient creatures in the universe, and that may be why it is so scary, because it is often seen as the shadow, the darker side of the self, but even more so, it is often unknown and difficult to interpret, chaotic yet also somehow deterministic, portraying our sentient freedom, yet also basic instincts that often lead us in the same direction: flee, fight, perish, prosper. We are just lucky that the Persona Universe hasn't been made manifest in Warframe yet, then we could be battling the conceptual embodiment of litteral demons, Angels, saints and other fictive and mythological creatures in History xD
@@TheDsIEGE that may be correct. However, I feel tick tock is more fitting because one of the recurring more obvious recurring themes is time and being late, in my eyes this “dialogue” if you can call it that is us being taunted, being told times running out and we should hurry up or else we’ll be late
Another point to consider that Albrecht's labs are located in the void/pocket dimsension - the intro cutscene at the beginning of any node, right after loading. Both Orokin Void and Albrecht's Labs share the same one.
Ok, so I wasn't the only one to think that's how that all happened... I was wondering if the little ball that drops becomes the huge one that's at the very bottom of the labs...
So considering how much of a bio-mechanical horror show the rest of the system is, when it comes to Albrecht's inner sanctums I would rather pin that on being made with the "precursor" to the current tech being used. You can kinda see how a lot of the place is "built" thanks to the Mites that float around. They can rebuild anything destroyed using (I want to say) some method of being able to turn matter into energy and back again. That or it is using the remnant materials and "stitching" them back into one whole. Which would mean it is happening on a sub-atomic scale and we REALLY do not have the time for THAT rabbit hole. Which sorta ties into the idea of alchemy. If you have the method of taking one material and transmuting it, how far can you take that process? Let's say as an example the idea of taking basic igneous rock and turning it into steel. If you can do that, then why not create massive caverns in the depths of a moon. While Deimos is a smaller moon than Lua, it is still a Moon. Meaning you have a LOT of room to work with when you get below the surface. I mean sure, it ain't no Colony Ship For Sale (cheap!), but a lot of the tech of Warframe seems to slightly line up with a lot of the inner workings of Deimos. So it is far safer to say that the inner sanctums are made using prototype Orokin tech. Something that predates even the Unum. Cause lest we forget, you can get some lovely tower meat from the Unum.
Perhaps DE could use the potential infested liches as a way to link the whispers in the wall to rail Jack since the only thing that can destroy the infection for good is a void bomb.
AAAAHHHHHHH WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE SO LATE HERE?????? Now I can't witness this masterpiece as soon as it comes out. Hear me out.... If the Earth was flat, we'd all have the same timezone and this type of shit wouldn't be happening UNIVERSEEEE
@TheDsIEGE I've heard this audio many many times through you videos but once Albrecht Entrati says "operator" this time, 8:34 , its suddenly dawns on me that at no point in any segment of the story are we the players, the tenno, ever actually called by a personal name. No one ever asks our name nor I we ever given the opportunity to even pick a name. I know it probably just to avoid needless complexity and wasted code and stuff like that but still.
@@mirdhi0I’d also point out much like Names. The Cavia sought names, the knowing someone’s true name gives you power over them (often in spell craft). I wouldn’t be surprised if the Operators name is being intentionally held back because of the power associated with it.
@@Niteshiftmonkey not a single enemy or opponent ever a exhibits action that follows such a thought process. For example Ballas never asked or attempted to aquire the name of the tenno. Nothing has ever asked or searched for proper personal information about our character. We always called something else. The tenno, the void devil, operator, Star child, etc but never a actual name. We know plenty of characters names, like Ballas or Albrecht, we even learn and recover/rename the Entrati family members as we rank up but we the players have nothing.
Good stuff man, i knew i liked the game itsself (gameplay wise) but when i digged further into the lore i found myself listening to more of the dialogue and story thats been told. I love the scientific approach the Zariman quest line gave us since im really into stuff like that. Whispers in the Walls doubled down on that. Awesome video!
Back in August when whispers was revealed i mentioned to my gf that the new area was the same material as the man in the wall himself. I even questioned if it WAS the wall. Oh also unrelated but youve noticed the murmur having a lot of different limbs for their enemies, right? Maybe even the fingers on the walls. But i noticed a step even further. Above the fragmented gorge opposite the side that is looking over the void, is a head and a torso. Almost bursting out of the wall.
I feel like the look of the murmur when they die gives it away... And the face you're referring to, if you look close, is actually already in the video!
23:14 I honestly never noticed this when playing, but tile where arthur is laying has a representation of the sun and the moon. I doubt that actually means anything but still an observation.
What I was thinking... Since you brought psychology into the theory, wally is actually pure being, as if it acts like a child and has a desire to get what he wants ( the id part ) I don't know if I make sense but in my mind it does It's neither bad nor good, just still in it's age of id before knowing what you can or cannot have, before developing an ego of it's own...
14:18, I've actually done extensive listening to each set of the whisper audio files found in the sound bank for the game, I believe there's a total of 7 or 8 seperate "whispers" voice lines. (I'm using some of them for a personal audio/soundscape project, but they were all very interesting to listen to solo'd out)
Wally. My favorite eldritch deity. I ask myself of how will the Tenno deal with him? Or... will we ever do something in the first place? Maybe Wally just wants to see everything become ''different'' at last, maybe he is tired of himself being indifferent.... if we could call him "indifferent" at all...
Mine too! And yeah, for being indifferent he sure likes things to go his way, lol... What I do love is, we're waist deep in this entity, I've been dying for this since Chains of Harrow!
@@TheDsIEGE Are the man in the wall, the indifference and the doppelgänger even the same? Our tenno doppelgänger (and albrecht's too) is not indifferent at all. I would rather say he is mad at us for not keeping our part of the deal. And why is it also called the lidless eye in the chains of harrow quest? Has this name for wally been used elsewhere?
the start of the quest is something i wanna dive more into, because the thing we see collapse is referred to as "The Untime Door" the heart pumps the void through the untime door, and it just casually collapses? nah. I think the collapse of the door linked us to the wall of lohk properly which is why the labs appear only afterward, because they exist within it and why wally has so much more power.
Actually... I think it's possible that little sphere that drops begins to grow and becomes enormous at the bottom of the lab aspect, not the crumbling part where the man in the wall is.
Why is it beginning to sound like this is going to end with the Tenno accepting that their doppelgänger is a reflection of themselves and subsequently reclaiming it as their own
you remember how since the second dream, weve been making choices that effect the compass- that little decision marker that changes to be light, dark, even or maybe alittle heavy on one side vs the other. What if that leads to what happens in 1999 or something soon after? what happens to entrati, the future, ect- what if that thing weve been blindly choosing is whats going to determine our ending?
I'm pretty certain it will. Those choices are typically void related and the man in the wall has even been a part of a few of them so... I'd bet on it having significance sooner than later especially because in whispers, we got more questions to add to our "morality" gauge.
Sort of off topic but i wonder if in Tagfer's desire to 'get' Albrecht we will find out that Minn is still alive somehow, trapped in the void. And it be an onkko x saya situation where minn can't let tagfer know she is still alive for whatever reason, as otherwise DE would have to code tagfer to have a different reason to do netracells lol. I only say this because the cavia talk about her a lot during their rank up dialogue so there has to be a larger reason than just conflict right? I don't remember if they say she clearly died, only that she was lost to the void, aka no body or cadavers was returned?
Given that Warframe already has actual Rubedo in the game, they know the concept so... yeah, I'd say that's a significant possibility or if nothing else was directly inspired from it.
Albert that we see in the 1999 part of the story is a "clone" in all likeliness. We see that when a person makes a "deal" with the man in the wall, or being touched by the void, such as the Zarimon crew, the Drifter, and the Murmurs shadows of other Warframes get imprinted into the void. Without the Tenno, the Warframes steadily went insane from their powers before the Tenno used transference on them (much like the adult crew of the Zarimon). Which implies that likely the Warframes are the "clones" or murmur influenced, while their real self was placed into the void akin to the Drifter, leaving their void clone that replaced them, to go insane like the Zarimon crew did. But since the Tenno are the only one that made a "deal" with the man in the wall , we're the only one that keep our true self in the "real" plane and the void plane (by making the Duviri space it seems). The Holdfasts seem to kinda be the key in the theory though, as their remade from the void as they were before, but are steadily being torn to madness once again as void angels. If I had to take a real guess, Albert is likely trying to fuse the parts of himself into one, and the man in the wall with the first instance of the man in the wall/void manifesting (sometime in 1999). Or to put more accurately, he is trying to mess with the eternalisum of the man in the wall by messing with it's timeline. At least that what I think with all the wackness psudo philosophical stuff the last few updates have brought to the story (such as the presantisum vs enteralisums debate from the Zariman AI). Edit: little side thing. I think there are multiple men in the wall, or more then 1 version of it. It seems like the void itself is an entity, and the man in the wall is just one form of consensus from within. I would say maybe the void is hivemind like but also chaotic in nature, meaning it actively battles with itself (akin to a split personality or Duviri mood swings), which is why the man in the wall is "nice" and makes a deal with us, for its own purpose of fighting and controlling the void for itself, or expand its influence in the void. And if I had to guess the man in the wall is likely the first person or persons to interact with the void or the voids interpretation and reconstruction of them (like the Holdfasts), likely from 1999. That or the man is the wall is itself Alberts, or as implied originally, your Tennos void clone/shadow.
I think somehow Arthur Excalibur and Albrecht Entrati are different versions of the same person from different timelines or possibly even his son from that time. I can't remember who but someone mentions him possibly having secrets in the past and who or what he could be hiding there. Maybe this could be possible for the Tenno as well. Albrecht knowing that one of the children on the Zariman will be able to operate the vessels and they are just waiting for this right operator. And that Albrecht, Arthur and the Tenno are so closely connected and intertwined. The Tenno even says Exalibur used to be him. At one point i thought the Stalker could be the Indifference's Warframe how the Tenno are with Exalibur. And how the Stalker and Indifference are always looking for us like their missing half and how the Accolites are all named after dark emotions. Just a theory. Hopefully DE can tie it all together to make it one if the greatest video game stories of our time.
There is a story that loid tells about Kalymos and how it essentially died. Days later, it was fine. Given what we know about the cavia, it's very likely Kalymos is a void copy, unless there's some other nefarious reason this story exists...
I’ve always wondered why albrecht looks more human than the rest of the orokin we see. Like the rest of his family have the blue skin and long arm but he doesn’t in the whispers quest. And then there is the picture of him that looks Orokin so I wonder what is going on
Are you meaning to say that 1999 is Albrecht's nekyia? Then if so, it begs to question whether Albrecht's sanity survives the embrace of his Shadow. If I understand you correctly, by consciously confronting/validating his shadow he obtains nigredo and then to overcome it he'd gain albedo, then he will have to eventually "become good (or atleast neutral)" again or else not gain this immortality through psychological alchemy. If he succumbs to the shadow, and be that evil we see in the cutscene of him grinning and voidspeaking, then he would have failed in his alchemy experiment and never gain albedo.
Yes, I think you've got it and... I wonder if they will go into the difficulty and near certainly of failure this whole thing typically is. In fact, if this is the way they are going, I could see the tenno being the one's who reach this state before him, with them being both able to love and kill and do it in a justified way. Perhaps, our final battle will be with a consumed Entrati, and... if the man in the wall is within both of us, maybe we have to die together to complete the circuit?
@@TheDsIEGEdamn….what an ending. I fear we may actually be close to WFs actual ending… The story has always been mankind’s search for meaning, for itself. Personified by the MITW taking the Vitruvian man in form. And the truest aspect of that search, that of reconciliation between shadow and self, is becoming more open, obvious, and nearing completion. And now, we have WF 1999, tying us back to DEs progenitor game Dark Sector. Where we’re likely to have our last conflict with The Indifference. We finish where Warframe started. WE END AS WE BEGAN Until we ascend, and begin a new timeline…
So tldr from the interpretation of a "witless horde": Albrecht incorporates part of his shadow self ,(the indifference) into his being with cool alchemical elements (pun)
- Alchemy - Demonic Angels - Evil God like being trapped in a prison like space which has a spirit which convinces people into dodgy deals by imitating themselves. - Void language sounds evil AF. - Summoning circles. - Drinking blood. - Ballas refers to the Void as ‘hell’ and the Tenno as ‘devils’. - Ballas mentions miracles on more than one occasion. We’re all being played by the ‘devil’.
@@TheDsIEGE I was checking back and it looks like youtube didn't send my comment: I meant specifically the alternative skull-like version and the "doore with 6 arms" one at around 6:20. Link in the description seems to be only about the Tennocon 2022 ones.
Yes, his actions and personality do lean more towards an Agent Smith vibe. I wonder if he's jealous of us(Tenno) and our capabilities. Maybe he thinks we have great power and don't wield it as we should or as he deems we should if he possessed such power. Now he's making a deal with the devil in hope of becoming it's protege to enact his will and be empowered/corrupted by the void.
I wonder if the lab Albert is said to have created in duviri, that is a replica of one he owned in a previous life, and that subsequently went missing over night might have something to do with the labs seemingly inexplicable size? Some sort of merger of the two, would explain why the wally has such a presence there, the lab in our plane being connected to the void in some way (via duviri) I've been wondering since watching these speculative lore videos about the other, not Albert's but our own. My question is who is the real tenno? This question is presented in game near the end of the new war, no? If we ponder the same as Entrati did after seeing his other when offered the choice of who we are, is the drifter or the operator the real tenno? I may be misusing tenno and operator but I think using them in the way I did better get across the point I'm trying to make. One last note: I wonder if there is some relationship between Albert, his other/shadow, his refusal to no longer take the kuva and the alchemical philosophy of the elixir of life?
You know, I'm not saying it's impossible, but many of the recent business practices, and probably most importantly the whole Justin Truman GDC conference where they openly admitted to consistent underdelivery, that... well it doesn't inspire me. It doesn't inspire me like it used to, to want to dig into the deeper lore and find stuff like I do in Warframe. I'm not saying they are perfect, but DE has really impressed me with their commitment to the game. Because of this, I feel really good about spending my time on Warframe. We'll see what the final shape holds, but... most of it will depend on what Bungie as a company decides to do with the soul of the game in the near future.
I believe that Albert is fundamentally evil and that the man in the wall is a reflection of his half-evil self, and he made an agreement with Kido for his reasons.... The same thing applies to our own Kido, who is half-evil. He sabotages everything with Albert. They thought they were making amends, or vice versa.. I think that the void is like a mirror, but it makes the reflection a real person, either good or evil..... I also think that Stalker is not evil, and even all of the Sentinels are not evil, but rather good, and they wanted a war with orekin for unknown reasons. I think they knew that a man in the wall had taken control of them or something. Like this, sentinels they are the only The only ones that has not been touched by a man in the wall. I think the reason Stalker joined the Sentinels is to take revenge on Teno because they killed their people because they were in control.... And the last thing I think is that when Albert invented a time travel machine, he went back to the past and ruined the things we are living in now. Including the old war and other things, and now wants to fix it at any cost
Well there is definitely a sinister side to the tenno somewhere, and... that scene in the erra cinematic... where the man in the walls eyes are on our own... Can he do that anytime? With this in mind, there very well could be... our own tenno, like a repressed personality that just takes over at times. I mean... How could that not be the case, if it's already happened once and... seemingly happened to Entrati as well?
Heh...this all reminds me of Fullmetal Alchemist. Albrecht seen what's behind the door/wall and now he is cursed with knowledge...what knowledge? We will see...
The Orokin HATE twins, other than that it is superstition, do we know why? What if their disdain for Entrati after his void experiments is in part because he INSISTS he created a twin by accident?
You miss something and I'm not gonna say what. But you did put it in by intentional or accidentally... Or... Anyway Amazing video as always Swazdo-lah Surah Stay safe guardian
I'm glad to see you got to check out the video though... I have to admit that... although I love the symbology of today's theory... I highly doubt it will make it into the game as I've said, lol...
@@TheDsIEGE I'm not going to say anything... I know you already know what it is... You already planned for the next 3 Videos to come... Till then... Let them wonder... And read the corner... Or the 3 joined lines... lol...
Everytime I hear sth about Albrecht I get more and more the feeling he is more evil than Walle. He is a typical case if fuck around and fund out but he tries to run from the find out aspect
Yeah, I don't view him in a positive light, and in fact... his vibe speaks to the persona of someone who's actually fully consumed by their shadow, and that's never a good thing.
Albrecht is a truly evil man. I'm worried DE will try and make him "complicated" or "just misunderstood" when he is wholly irredeemable by any moral standard worth considering. I feel like it is the destiny of the Tenno to destroy Albrecht for good, and maybe bring a sort of peace to Wally, who I'm starting to think was the one tainted by Albrecht, not the other way around. Thank you for your video
I'm sort of hoping for the whole, he'll be the evil and then sacrifice himself or fight the entity within and help us win, redeeming him all original darth vader style... but that's just my dream. Thank you for checking it out!
@@TheDsIEGE I wonder if that would redeem him in the eyes of his countless murder victims and experiment subjects? I would have no sympathy, or gratitude for him. I think Tagfer is right not to forgive Albrecht, I think there is a point where someone does so much evil, they can never do enough good to wash away that stain. I don't know where that line starts, but I feel like Albrecht crossed it, with glee, a long time ago. I don't know that Vader was ever redeemed, so much as Luke corrected some of the evil wrought by his father. Luke is the hero not because he saves Vader from any fate, but because he never succumbed the way his father did. Just my take anyway, what a time to be alive as Warframe lore fans, gonna ne a wild year 😊👍
So much of this has me believing ala Matrix, we're not entirely "alive", and not really "dead" either. We end as we began. From dust you came, to dust you shall return (IE : Genesis 3:19). Are we even really alive? Is any of this real, or are we still dreaming? The Indifference holding the Lotus flower alludes to the past, The Old War, and the fact that there's a whole history to which we don't remember but Alad V alludes that we destroyed a whole civilization and don't remember. What else do we not remember because our past has been wiped from our memory? And who did that? Albrecht is truly shades of grey. Neutral. The balance must be maintained, but at what cost to the Tenno? To the Orokin? To the very system itself? He doesn't seem to care either way. Almost as if he is.................Indifferent. They are one in the same. Two sides of one coin. Albrecht, the Indifferent.
Wait are you telling me I have been collecting somebody's perfectly filtered pee pee this whole time? (rubedo) I have never had my jaw on the floor this long before. And my helminth is eating some right now!? I'm absolutely lost.
I like Albrecht much more as an antagonist than Ballas. Ballas was cartoonishly evil. a parody of what 'evil' is. His was a character that would fit a children's story. Albrecht is so much more nuanced. Some people might not even consider him to be evil, which IMO, is the tell of a truly *great* villain. Plus, Albrecht is a mirror of the Tenno we play; since we too cannot be certain if we are playing as a child saved from the void, or as a manifestation of the void. The majority of NPCs seem to believe the latter, calling us 'Void demons'. If we must be demons; unlike Albrecht, let's not embrace that fact. let's not be 'honest' demons. Let's be what those lost children could have been, given the gifts of the void. We've already shown we're not beholden to the will of the void. (We didn't uphold our deal with the Man in the Wall). So let's keep that up. Let's do good, whether we're demons or not.
A human is the divine creation corrupted by demonic intervention. The imperfect perfection. The difference between a demon and a god is the perception of the audience. An action always has a positive and negative effect. That's why humans are powerful beings. We can communicate with true divinity and the infernal. The original human beings were homunculi named Adam and Lilith. Adam was filled with divinity of Universe by obedience, and Lilith was filled with the infernal by rejection of the Universe. Eve is the daughter clone of Adam, thus making her an inferior version of Lilith. Because of the divinity of Adam, Eve was made divine. This is the reason why women are deemed inferior in most religions.
So the game's alignment's white and dark is possibly "ego" and "shadow" respectively, both contributing to what is "self"? The diagram that illustrated that is fascinating. It has "consciousness" at the top alongside ego, but at the bottom, alongside shadow, it doesn't just say "unconscious", but "collective unconscious". I wonder if that's a part of us that The Indifference taps into, and into us all that we share? What might that mean for the future of the game's alignment? Perhaps too dark and you are too heavily influenced and controllable. Too light and you are too insular to be an effective weapon/not sensitive enough to The Indifference? Seems with many things, balance, whether it be your psyche/the force/your diet is the key to success...
The start made me laugh Al getting cut off by his ringing pager just to turn it off an continuous he's monologue
In my mind I was thinking we were hearing his thoughts and then he was like... "damnit, who could this be?" and then got back to his thoughts, lol
@@TheDsIEGEit fit in well!
I Just find the concept that the Tenno routinely dive in haunted labs and don't notice the wisper of ghost because they are to busy blasting music amusing.
Well, we're built different, ya know?
@@TheDsIEGEI listen to CZcams videos instead of the ingame music half of the time… so in a way I’m learning or observing instead of “listening”.
Suspiciously Green & Black Nova Prime running through the labs: "Oop, sorry 'Voices of the Dead', can't listen, too busy listening to Devil Trigger! ALL THESE THOUGHTS RUNNIN' THROUGH MY HEAD~"
@@Kilesfactorme but a purple, black and pink (or red, gold, black & white) wisp listening to eminem, 3arc zomb music and linkin park 😂
"Sorry can't hear the Whispers, ignored the airpod volume warning and cranked NIN all the way up" 🤣
To me, an important aspect of Albrecht's character is his martyr complex. To say whether he is good or bad, selfless or selfish is a dumbing down of his internal conflict.
He is not "cartoonishly evil" in a single minded sense - it was Loid's love that made him decide to live, he talks of Loid lovingly AND he even talks of his daughter favorably. He regrets abandoning Euleria, he regrets abandoning Loid and he even feels sorry about the Cavia experiment (he cannot bring himself to sacrifice Kalymos, another living being he genuinely cares about, but is still distraught about the Cavia as a whole. He couldn't kill Tagfer, Fib and Bird and instead gave them to Loid -> while also talking how much better of a person Loid is; Albrecht elevates the people (and kavat) he loves while also using it as an excuse to "prove" that he is evil and irredeemable).
My take is that Albrecht feels responsible for Wally/The Other (in his 2020 original requiem logs he even talks how, despite other people going to explore the Void, nobody talks about seeing the Other); so it is possible to believe Albrecht genuinely does feel like Wally is HIS demon (reference to Loid's line, also the Operator log lore catchup blames Albrecht for the existence of the Indifference) and thus only Albrecht himself can and should fight him. He runs away to 1999 to protect Loid (because he DOES care about Loid) but also because he needs a "battleground" between him and Wally.
So, everything Albrecht does is a way for him to seek redemption through death. He will go out with a bang and that will be his absolution.
Unless we stop him or convince him that there is another way. IF we want to do that... But I believe that, in line with Warframe's overall narrative, that will be our angle.
In Duviri he ALMOST realizes how the Indifference works (it latches onto your emotions, specifically negative ones), but because he is so caught up in lionizing Euleria while putting himself down, he instead decides that he has to fight physically. It only deepens his martyr complex and his resolution that he has to be "an honest demon".
To me Albrecht isn't good or evil... he is strangely human for an Orokin. Also he possesses self-awareness, something the Orokin are constantly described as lacking. They are beings of hubris and delusions of grandeur. Albrecht clearly had an ego, but he can also admit that he has done wrong. He just doesn't believe he deserves a conventional apology ("if only I was worthy of you, my Loid.").
----
This has nothing to do with the wider philosophical aspects of your analysis, but it is very interesting as an analysis of Albrecht as a character in how everything he does goes against Orokin tradition and values:
1) even his appearance, he never had the giant blue arm, possibly a conscious choice to go against the grain.
2) practices alchemy, a forbidden art, which was the key to Void science.
3) Saw the value in "archaic" technology: the Entrati had a grand library and actual, physical books; a lot of Entrati items ingame are described as archaic but reliable
4) even the Entrati aesthetic - the Orokin are all about gold and white, whereas the Entrati aesthetic is very gothic in comparison
5) Their attitudes towards death - Orokin were flippant around death and dying, the Entrati had burial grounds and ossuaries. Did they honor their past bodies? Their past lives?
6) and of course... Albrecht and Loid's relationship. Fraternizing with the lower castes was forbidden (but only the lowborn would face punishment) or was seen as a taboo fetish, but Loid and Albrecht were clearly on equal terms and respected each other immensely.
well said , agreed , and imho spot on =]
though its completely possible that Albrecht did have the typical orokin features in many of his prior forms [ie the blue skin and long arm] , remember that he choose to not undergo the continuity only after his encounter with Wally , we dont necessarily know how many times previously that Albrecht did take the kuva and transfer into a new yuvan host
Honestly Albreitch's drip always been ahead of his time
This is undoubtedly true.
man stopped in an alt 2014 and stole aiden pierce's drip, then continued to 99'
Headcannon: Ballas was the only weirdo wearing a damn toga.
It needs to be made into an operator/drifter suit
I can't unsee Jotaro whenever I see him
Sometimes I wonder if the Man in the Wall is even a villain in the first place. To me, personally, he just seems like a truly "chaotic" force-of-nature kind of entity.
According to Yung, he's not at all. But... the lifelong challenge is learning to live with him.
@@TheDsIEGE Reminds me of Lovecraftian lore to an extent. I can imagine "defeat' (if it even exists when it comes to beings like him) in of itself being a concept that he can work around, and eventually with time, bypass.
I feel like there's plenty of nods to Lovecraftian lore in general when it comes to The Indifference. The voidtongue, his presence, and mystery all combined bears a striking resemblance to Nyarlathotep. Atleast, in my opinion.
@@senri3125 I agree; The Indifference need not be malign, but simply omnipotential, able to be many things or even anything. Case in point: ancient Greek "atomistics" considered Void to be a fifth basic element, amongst air, fire, water, and earth where void was a dualism - both emptiness and potentiality.
The Indifference, emerging from the void (or its essence) has acted both chaotically and cohesively, being transformative as well as controlling.
@@TheDsIEGEfirst, learn of your shadows existence. Second, learn not just to live with it, but to fully INCORPORATE it into your full being, taking the best of both your light and shadow, and bolstering the weaknesses of the other.
If one fails, at best one would lead a life unfulfilled, or on average the shadow breaks out when we least want it to.
At worst….it takes over the light, and we are overtaken by the worst of our traits.
My own theory is that he simply does not want to alone or find a real permanent body for his own. However the second part lacks proof the first one is pure speculation. But normally he doesn't seem hostile towards his important subjects
The Indifference being sourced from and the worst trait of Albrecht signifies the path ahead. I'm reminded of Psychonauts. Take his pain away, put the void back in its box. To keep the shadow at bay. Or to unify them. Soul benders as tenno are. Comfortable in the depths of the Abyss which stares back. Not defeated, but placated, sated after ravenous engorgement on the orogin system. All the pieces go back in the same box at the games end.
We may be the perfect weapon for the job. Almost too perfect. I wonder if anyone knew that would happen...
What I realized at the end of the 1999 sequence is Albrecht says Arthur with the voice of the indifference. And it's sometimes heard in Duviri too when we answer a tablet. Arthur must be important to him. The Vessel is made of him after all.
I think that the starting images of the quest are really telling in what the underlying conflict is. The moving dust reminds me of cymatics, the visualization of sound frequency patterns through metal plates and dust particles. the dust shaken by wally's voice symbolize the "world of dust" as it's called being shaken by the presence of the indifference, being affected and changed by the presence. And all the connections between the vocas being different intensities or forms of speech, so a bellow for example, always being in the lower registries. DE opened a very symbolic plane only through sound and I congratulate them for that.
You know it's funny that everyone is glossing over the fact albrecht managed to Crack a form of time travel, and yet hasn't figured out another way to travel faster then light without the void
I definitely see us playing as partial warframe-operator’s, similar to Arthur. Imagine the suit unwrapping itself from around our head, almost like the venom symbiote.
Gaming note : when you see them sitting in a chair (much like Virgil from DMC) you know it’s about to get serious
Oh boi this was a juicy one.
First of all, my man Siege cannot stop cookin, he's hitting that kitchen harder than me hitting those Acolyte Farms for Protea Prime.
I like to say I know a thing or two about Warframe's Lore, but this current narrative is probably the most confusing and convoluted, maybe because we are still missing a few pieces from the chessboard.
In regards to our Tax Evader Wally, what I could gather is, maybe Wally is a physical representation of the Shadow, something we all have. If that is the case, it would make sense for Wally to have been created instead of being born.
When Albrecht fell into the Void, the Shadow took form in an entity known now as The Indifference. Fitting too if I may say, his name. Anyway, if that is the case, I would argue there are as many Wallys as there are people, because we all have the Shadow. It's just waiting to be manifested, but for that to happen, it needs to make contact with the Void.
Or, I'm just way too high on cereal right now....
There's also this other theory I had and I'm not sure I shared yet. It's about the Protoframes and 1999 in general...
We know Entrati went back in time, not to an alternate timeline. We know he brought stuff from his current year to the past, already breaking a bunch of rules of time travel. As if this wasn't enough, he created Warframes, Protoframes, which creates a Paradox.
What this means is, both Ballas and Entrati are responsible for the creation of the Warframes. Entrati used the Helminth Strain to infect people in 1999 and create the Protoframes. In the future of this timeline, Ballas could take notes and create the Warframes based on the Protoframes.
I like to call this the Albrecht Paradox. It effetively means that Albrecht Entrati may be responsible for literally everything in the Orokin Empire thanks to his actions in 1999.
Anyway, I went on way too long already,. Great vid Siege as always, keep on cookin my man, we're here and we're hungry.
Hey thank you and I think you might be on to something here... 1999 will hopefully give us more info!!!
I dont think the lab is made out of the bones of people he sacrificed to the void BUT that notion made me connect a few things. The entire lab is build like a body, eyes and ears we defend. The Necramites, Necromechs and Culverins acting like cells (Necromechs being a perfect analogy for Killer T Cells.) Capilaries which move resources around the lab. What if the entire lab is grown from a subject, the gray strain specificly described as being able to grow to massive sizes. The Orokin Derelicts are full of the grey strain afterall.
But... what are the walls made of? Wouldn't it actually make sense within that exact line of thinking that the structures would be made of skeletal bone?
@@TheDsIEGE yes, bone. Like the void towers. But not human or animal bone. Just infestation mimiking bonr if I understood correctly.
@danshrk maybe it would be petrified flesh? That could mimic bone and stone
Well, Demios is a guest head floating in space after all.
Considering that Albert is orokin, his idea of "human" is undoubtedly skewed. He probably threw a bunch of onstron into the void.
Like... insanely skewed, and given what i do know, the idea that he had a moral quandary surrounded humans here is a laugh riot.
@@TheDsIEGE He's viewed as a lesser Orokin within their society, right?
@@nullpoint3346 He is orokin. Period. And not a "low one". He literally invented void travel.
Probably piles of Grineer got thrown through the void.
@@DavidUtau He was considered worthless by other orokin even after that achievement, I'm _not_ talking about ant castes here, I'm talking about _social standing._
The significance of Wally's missing finger may come from Hindu hand mudras, where the index finger represents Vayu (air), as in flying through the "air" of the void.
There maybe other allusions, but for now I can only come up with connecting the many ghostly eyes in the walls (or we capture) to Swaha (form).
Ooooo! Now that's something interesting indeed!!!
Alternatively it could also be something like "The Creation of Adam" (In the Sistine Chapel I think it was) where God reaches out to give life to Adam.
Albrecht would be "Adam" in this case
With Wally as "God" (at least in the way that he rules the void)
Albrecht ran away from Wally and something something "Albrecht put the stars in reach"
Idk, just my interpretation
Albert, I wouldn't say is neither brilliant or evil. More so he is both equal parts gifted as he is traumatized; which, when combined even with the best of intentions, is just one of the many stepping stones on our path to the hell that we know as the void.
I can definitely agree with this
Rubedo is a crystalline resource in warframe, a common one. I didnt give much thought to it till now.
Yay, distiled pee used for alchemy !!
Drumstick time🍗
It most certainly is...
The Carl Jung shadow theory is amazing, especially considering what is also considered in that theory - The collective unconsciousness. Indeed, The indifference/Wally is very fitting of being a shadow, The part of our characters closest to the collective unconsciousness. An unconsciousness where figures and concepts often are the anchoring entities, think Vitruvian man, deadly sins and emotions in Duviri, greed, envy, sorrow, joy, maybe a bit of a stretch, but the Lotus as the Tenno characters mother figure could also very much be enforced by the shadows anchoring in the collective unconsciousness, mother/nurture as a concept... All are conceptual entities in the collective unconsciousness, and the void may very well be a theoritical theory made manifest, it could be an interpretation of the Collective Unconsciousness of all sentient creatures in the universe, and that may be why it is so scary, because it is often seen as the shadow, the darker side of the self, but even more so, it is often unknown and difficult to interpret, chaotic yet also somehow deterministic, portraying our sentient freedom, yet also basic instincts that often lead us in the same direction: flee, fight, perish, prosper.
We are just lucky that the Persona Universe hasn't been made manifest in Warframe yet, then we could be battling the conceptual embodiment of litteral demons, Angels, saints and other fictive and mythological creatures in History xD
I always interpreted 4:33 as “tick, tock, Tenno”
I do believe it's Rap Tap Tap
@@TheDsIEGE that may be correct. However, I feel tick tock is more fitting because one of the recurring more obvious recurring themes is time and being late, in my eyes this “dialogue” if you can call it that is us being taunted, being told times running out and we should hurry up or else we’ll be late
Another point to consider that Albrecht's labs are located in the void/pocket dimsension - the intro cutscene at the beginning of any node, right after loading. Both Orokin Void and Albrecht's Labs share the same one.
Ok, so I wasn't the only one to think that's how that all happened... I was wondering if the little ball that drops becomes the huge one that's at the very bottom of the labs...
me listening to a 5 min vid abt math: ⚰
me listening to 5hrs of in-depth lore dives and theoretical analysis: 🗿
So considering how much of a bio-mechanical horror show the rest of the system is, when it comes to Albrecht's inner sanctums I would rather pin that on being made with the "precursor" to the current tech being used. You can kinda see how a lot of the place is "built" thanks to the Mites that float around. They can rebuild anything destroyed using (I want to say) some method of being able to turn matter into energy and back again. That or it is using the remnant materials and "stitching" them back into one whole. Which would mean it is happening on a sub-atomic scale and we REALLY do not have the time for THAT rabbit hole. Which sorta ties into the idea of alchemy. If you have the method of taking one material and transmuting it, how far can you take that process? Let's say as an example the idea of taking basic igneous rock and turning it into steel. If you can do that, then why not create massive caverns in the depths of a moon. While Deimos is a smaller moon than Lua, it is still a Moon. Meaning you have a LOT of room to work with when you get below the surface. I mean sure, it ain't no Colony Ship For Sale (cheap!), but a lot of the tech of Warframe seems to slightly line up with a lot of the inner workings of Deimos. So it is far safer to say that the inner sanctums are made using prototype Orokin tech. Something that predates even the Unum. Cause lest we forget, you can get some lovely tower meat from the Unum.
I am curious how DE will connect Albrechts labs to the railjack considering the fingers in our ships are undoubtedly the one from the man in the wall.
So... they are actually copies, the one in our ship, much like all the vessel parts. Cavalero actually makes mention of this in passing on the Zariman
Granted. Surely The Man in the wall doesn't like his finger being taken and duplicated.
Perhaps DE could use the potential infested liches as a way to link the whispers in the wall to rail Jack since the only thing that can destroy the infection for good is a void bomb.
Liked because you included the pager, that has been puzzling me for a while,lol.
We all are so concerned on if we could, we never stopped and thought if we should.
Couldn't agree with you more!
@@TheDsIEGEmay not matter in the end if the player is never given a choice to make but merely has to follow a script
AAAAHHHHHHH WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE SO LATE HERE?????? Now I can't witness this masterpiece as soon as it comes out.
Hear me out.... If the Earth was flat, we'd all have the same timezone and this type of shit wouldn't be happening UNIVERSEEEE
I wouldn't mind a flat earth. Would remind me more of middle earth and I want to live in a hobbit home!
I Am Late!... thank you for the meal Lord Siege, I'm certain it shall be delightful as always.
I hope you enjoy!!!
@TheDsIEGE I've heard this audio many many times through you videos but once Albrecht Entrati says "operator" this time, 8:34 , its suddenly dawns on me that at no point in any segment of the story are we the players, the tenno, ever actually called by a personal name. No one ever asks our name nor I we ever given the opportunity to even pick a name. I know it probably just to avoid needless complexity and wasted code and stuff like that but still.
@@mirdhi0I’d also point out much like Names. The Cavia sought names, the knowing someone’s true name gives you power over them (often in spell craft). I wouldn’t be surprised if the Operators name is being intentionally held back because of the power associated with it.
@@Niteshiftmonkey not a single enemy or opponent ever a exhibits action that follows such a thought process. For example Ballas never asked or attempted to aquire the name of the tenno. Nothing has ever asked or searched for proper personal information about our character. We always called something else. The tenno, the void devil, operator, Star child, etc but never a actual name. We know plenty of characters names, like Ballas or Albrecht, we even learn and recover/rename the Entrati family members as we rank up but we the players have nothing.
Great video as always! That conclusion was perfectly built, keep it up! Your presentation is great and I can’t wait to watch you grow in the future.
Thank you!!! I really appreciate that and I'm glad you liked it!
Good stuff man, i knew i liked the game itsself (gameplay wise) but when i digged further into the lore i found myself listening to more of the dialogue and story thats been told. I love the scientific approach the Zariman quest line gave us since im really into stuff like that. Whispers in the Walls doubled down on that. Awesome video!
Back in August when whispers was revealed i mentioned to my gf that the new area was the same material as the man in the wall himself. I even questioned if it WAS the wall.
Oh also unrelated but youve noticed the murmur having a lot of different limbs for their enemies, right? Maybe even the fingers on the walls. But i noticed a step even further. Above the fragmented gorge opposite the side that is looking over the void, is a head and a torso. Almost bursting out of the wall.
I feel like the look of the murmur when they die gives it away... And the face you're referring to, if you look close, is actually already in the video!
23:14 I honestly never noticed this when playing, but tile where arthur is laying has a representation of the sun and the moon. I doubt that actually means anything but still an observation.
What I was thinking... Since you brought psychology into the theory, wally is actually pure being, as if it acts like a child and has a desire to get what he wants ( the id part )
I don't know if I make sense but in my mind it does
It's neither bad nor good, just still in it's age of id before knowing what you can or cannot have, before developing an ego of it's own...
This channel is underrated, should be sponsored by DE
You’re truly among the best of this game’s community. Keep it up dude!
Thank you!!!! I do my best!
You raise a good point. I could believe an orokin seeing a human or a few other things a lesser being.
EXCELLENT QUOTE by Carl Jung at the beginning dood , mega-kudos =]
One of my favs
14:18, I've actually done extensive listening to each set of the whisper audio files found in the sound bank for the game, I believe there's a total of 7 or 8 seperate "whispers" voice lines. (I'm using some of them for a personal audio/soundscape project, but they were all very interesting to listen to solo'd out)
That's amazing!!! I didn't realize all of that. Now I'm gonna have to listen...
Holy shit, the editing on this is so good. I love how yoi've overlayed the codex to the cutscene
Thank you!!! It's taken a good many years but... I'm finally starting to actually learn how to use my editing software versus just winging it, lol!
Wing it forever. That's what i do 👍🏾
@@SocraTetris Well it's worked for me so far at least, if nothing else, lol...
Love this!
I Love this!!
Wally. My favorite eldritch deity. I ask myself of how will the Tenno deal with him? Or... will we ever do something in the first place? Maybe Wally just wants to see everything become ''different'' at last, maybe he is tired of himself being indifferent.... if we could call him "indifferent" at all...
Mine too! And yeah, for being indifferent he sure likes things to go his way, lol... What I do love is, we're waist deep in this entity, I've been dying for this since Chains of Harrow!
@@TheDsIEGE Are the man in the wall, the indifference and the doppelgänger even the same? Our tenno doppelgänger (and albrecht's too) is not indifferent at all. I would rather say he is mad at us for not keeping our part of the deal. And why is it also called the lidless eye in the chains of harrow quest? Has this name for wally been used elsewhere?
Love it!
Thank you so much!!
the start of the quest is something i wanna dive more into, because the thing we see collapse is referred to as "The Untime Door"
the heart pumps the void through the untime door, and it just casually collapses? nah. I think the collapse of the door linked us to the wall of lohk properly which is why the labs appear only afterward, because they exist within it and why wally has so much more power.
Actually... I think it's possible that little sphere that drops begins to grow and becomes enormous at the bottom of the lab aspect, not the crumbling part where the man in the wall is.
Another upload 🎉
Hope you enjoyed it! It was a fun one to make!
Best lore videos on yt hands down
Thank you!!!
Why is it beginning to sound like this is going to end with the Tenno accepting that their doppelgänger is a reflection of themselves and subsequently reclaiming it as their own
NEW VIDEO LESSGOOO
you remember how since the second dream, weve been making choices that effect the compass- that little decision marker that changes to be light, dark, even or maybe alittle heavy on one side vs the other.
What if that leads to what happens in 1999 or something soon after? what happens to entrati, the future, ect- what if that thing weve been blindly choosing is whats going to determine our ending?
I'm pretty certain it will. Those choices are typically void related and the man in the wall has even been a part of a few of them so... I'd bet on it having significance sooner than later especially because in whispers, we got more questions to add to our "morality" gauge.
Minn's body was the only body not recovered from the void. Like sevagoth was she's still out there.
The man in the wall is smart af
This kinda explains the characters from 1999 since they look partially Warframe
Sort of off topic but i wonder if in Tagfer's desire to 'get' Albrecht we will find out that Minn is still alive somehow, trapped in the void. And it be an onkko x saya situation where minn can't let tagfer know she is still alive for whatever reason, as otherwise DE would have to code tagfer to have a different reason to do netracells lol.
I only say this because the cavia talk about her a lot during their rank up dialogue so there has to be a larger reason than just conflict right? I don't remember if they say she clearly died, only that she was lost to the void, aka no body or cadavers was returned?
What if Kuva is the Philosopher's Stone. It does grant Infinite life and is the basis of the Orokin
Given that Warframe already has actual Rubedo in the game, they know the concept so... yeah, I'd say that's a significant possibility or if nothing else was directly inspired from it.
Epicness
Thank you!!!
Albert that we see in the 1999 part of the story is a "clone" in all likeliness. We see that when a person makes a "deal" with the man in the wall, or being touched by the void, such as the Zarimon crew, the Drifter, and the Murmurs shadows of other Warframes get imprinted into the void. Without the Tenno, the Warframes steadily went insane from their powers before the Tenno used transference on them (much like the adult crew of the Zarimon). Which implies that likely the Warframes are the "clones" or murmur influenced, while their real self was placed into the void akin to the Drifter, leaving their void clone that replaced them, to go insane like the Zarimon crew did. But since the Tenno are the only one that made a "deal" with the man in the wall , we're the only one that keep our true self in the "real" plane and the void plane (by making the Duviri space it seems).
The Holdfasts seem to kinda be the key in the theory though, as their remade from the void as they were before, but are steadily being torn to madness once again as void angels.
If I had to take a real guess, Albert is likely trying to fuse the parts of himself into one, and the man in the wall with the first instance of the man in the wall/void manifesting (sometime in 1999). Or to put more accurately, he is trying to mess with the eternalisum of the man in the wall by messing with it's timeline. At least that what I think with all the wackness psudo philosophical stuff the last few updates have brought to the story (such as the presantisum vs enteralisums debate from the Zariman AI).
Edit: little side thing. I think there are multiple men in the wall, or more then 1 version of it. It seems like the void itself is an entity, and the man in the wall is just one form of consensus from within. I would say maybe the void is hivemind like but also chaotic in nature, meaning it actively battles with itself (akin to a split personality or Duviri mood swings), which is why the man in the wall is "nice" and makes a deal with us, for its own purpose of fighting and controlling the void for itself, or expand its influence in the void. And if I had to guess the man in the wall is likely the first person or persons to interact with the void or the voids interpretation and reconstruction of them (like the Holdfasts), likely from 1999. That or the man is the wall is itself Alberts, or as implied originally, your Tennos void clone/shadow.
I think somehow Arthur Excalibur and Albrecht Entrati are different versions of the same person from different timelines or possibly even his son from that time. I can't remember who but someone mentions him possibly having secrets in the past and who or what he could be hiding there. Maybe this could be possible for the Tenno as well. Albrecht knowing that one of the children on the Zariman will be able to operate the vessels and they are just waiting for this right operator. And that Albrecht, Arthur and the Tenno are so closely connected and intertwined. The Tenno even says Exalibur used to be him. At one point i thought the Stalker could be the Indifference's Warframe how the Tenno are with Exalibur. And how the Stalker and Indifference are always looking for us like their missing half and how the Accolites are all named after dark emotions. Just a theory. Hopefully DE can tie it all together to make it one if the greatest video game stories of our time.
My personal headcanon is that Kalymos, Albrechts cat is the Man in the Wall himself.
There is a story that loid tells about Kalymos and how it essentially died. Days later, it was fine. Given what we know about the cavia, it's very likely Kalymos is a void copy, unless there's some other nefarious reason this story exists...
This gives me Beyond good and evil vibes
I’ve always wondered why albrecht looks more human than the rest of the orokin we see. Like the rest of his family have the blue skin and long arm but he doesn’t in the whispers quest. And then there is the picture of him that looks Orokin so I wonder what is going on
Are you meaning to say that 1999 is Albrecht's nekyia? Then if so, it begs to question whether Albrecht's sanity survives the embrace of his Shadow. If I understand you correctly, by consciously confronting/validating his shadow he obtains nigredo and then to overcome it he'd gain albedo, then he will have to eventually "become good (or atleast neutral)" again or else not gain this immortality through psychological alchemy. If he succumbs to the shadow, and be that evil we see in the cutscene of him grinning and voidspeaking, then he would have failed in his alchemy experiment and never gain albedo.
Yes, I think you've got it and... I wonder if they will go into the difficulty and near certainly of failure this whole thing typically is. In fact, if this is the way they are going, I could see the tenno being the one's who reach this state before him, with them being both able to love and kill and do it in a justified way. Perhaps, our final battle will be with a consumed Entrati, and... if the man in the wall is within both of us, maybe we have to die together to complete the circuit?
@@TheDsIEGEdamn….what an ending. I fear we may actually be close to WFs actual ending…
The story has always been mankind’s search for meaning, for itself. Personified by the MITW taking the Vitruvian man in form. And the truest aspect of that search, that of reconciliation between shadow and self, is becoming more open, obvious, and nearing completion.
And now, we have WF 1999, tying us back to DEs progenitor game Dark Sector. Where we’re likely to have our last conflict with The Indifference. We finish where Warframe started.
WE END AS WE BEGAN
Until we ascend, and begin a new timeline…
We've seen this play out in another game, written in 1999.
The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask.
That's a Link of magnanimous proportions, wouldn't you agree?
@@TheDsIEGEand a terrible fate to meet
I was mad we didn't off the lotus and let nora in her place, but if entrati lives through this I will throw my PC
So tldr from the interpretation of a "witless horde": Albrecht incorporates part of his shadow self ,(the indifference) into his being with cool alchemical elements (pun)
- Alchemy
- Demonic Angels
- Evil God like being trapped in a prison like space which has a spirit which convinces people into dodgy deals by imitating themselves.
- Void language sounds evil AF.
- Summoning circles.
- Drinking blood.
- Ballas refers to the Void as ‘hell’ and the Tenno as ‘devils’.
- Ballas mentions miracles on more than one occasion.
We’re all being played by the ‘devil’.
Ok, you said rubedo in terms of alchemy, now that begs the question... does the in-game gem by the same name have a similar origin?
Where can I find the two concept art of "alternative" Man in The Wall at 6:20 ? o.o
There's a link in the description
@@TheDsIEGE I was checking back and it looks like youtube didn't send my comment: I meant specifically the alternative skull-like version and the "doore with 6 arms" one at around 6:20. Link in the description seems to be only about the Tennocon 2022 ones.
Cavia would to him mean labrat. Humans can be labrats, its not a big stretch
Ego =tenno ,self- drifter , shadow- man in the wall mmm if enter in the void you split into 3 personalitis ego/self/shadow or void trys copy 1 of 3 .
Based off the chair Albrecht Entrati is either John Constantine or Neo when he met Morpheus.
He's definitely got some of the "one" vibes. But then... so do we. Maybe... Smith?
Yes, his actions and personality do lean more towards an Agent Smith vibe.
I wonder if he's jealous of us(Tenno) and our capabilities. Maybe he thinks we have great power and don't wield it as we should or as he deems we should if he possessed such power.
Now he's making a deal with the devil in hope of becoming it's protege to enact his will and be empowered/corrupted by the void.
I wonder if the lab Albert is said to have created in duviri, that is a replica of one he owned in a previous life, and that subsequently went missing over night might have something to do with the labs seemingly inexplicable size? Some sort of merger of the two, would explain why the wally has such a presence there, the lab in our plane being connected to the void in some way (via duviri)
I've been wondering since watching these speculative lore videos about the other, not Albert's but our own. My question is who is the real tenno? This question is presented in game near the end of the new war, no? If we ponder the same as Entrati did after seeing his other when offered the choice of who we are, is the drifter or the operator the real tenno?
I may be misusing tenno and operator but I think using them in the way I did better get across the point I'm trying to make.
One last note: I wonder if there is some relationship between Albert, his other/shadow, his refusal to no longer take the kuva and the alchemical philosophy of the elixir of life?
I'm hoping that we can get some more lore with Jade when she drops. Is it gonna be before '99 tho?
Yes, I believe it will although I don't know if it will provide more information on 1999 or just be stalker info
I wish we could see Destiny story and Lore from your channel....
I would love to have Destiny2 story with your Voice🥲
You know, I'm not saying it's impossible, but many of the recent business practices, and probably most importantly the whole Justin Truman GDC conference where they openly admitted to consistent underdelivery, that... well it doesn't inspire me. It doesn't inspire me like it used to, to want to dig into the deeper lore and find stuff like I do in Warframe. I'm not saying they are perfect, but DE has really impressed me with their commitment to the game. Because of this, I feel really good about spending my time on Warframe. We'll see what the final shape holds, but... most of it will depend on what Bungie as a company decides to do with the soul of the game in the near future.
Did Thrax build the labs for Al like how the man in the wall might've
wait the starting cutscene has dialog? bro was silent for me the whole time 😭
I think TheDsIEGE added one of Albrecht's dialogue on the codex that you can uncover onto the cutscene. Honestly, it worked so well!
I did!!! This is actually dialogue from his lost notes, cheekily added in to present the premise of the video!!!
I believe that Albert is fundamentally evil and that the man in the wall is a reflection of his half-evil self, and he made an agreement with Kido for his reasons.... The same thing applies to our own Kido, who is half-evil. He sabotages everything with Albert. They thought they were making amends, or vice versa.. I think that the void is like a mirror, but it makes the reflection a real person, either good or evil..... I also think that Stalker is not evil, and even all of the Sentinels are not evil, but rather good, and they wanted a war with orekin for unknown reasons. I think they knew that a man in the wall had taken control of them or something. Like this, sentinels they are the only The only ones that has not been touched by a man in the wall. I think the reason Stalker joined the Sentinels is to take revenge on Teno because they killed their people because they were in control.... And the last thing I think is that when Albert invented a time travel machine, he went back to the past and ruined the things we are living in now. Including the old war and other things, and now wants to fix it at any cost
Well there is definitely a sinister side to the tenno somewhere, and... that scene in the erra cinematic... where the man in the walls eyes are on our own... Can he do that anytime? With this in mind, there very well could be... our own tenno, like a repressed personality that just takes over at times. I mean... How could that not be the case, if it's already happened once and... seemingly happened to Entrati as well?
Yes, it is likely that this happened to him...
Where does the Albrecht intro monologue come from? Is it AI?
No, I put the dialogue from his lost notes into the beginning.
@@TheDsIEGE Where can I find the dialogues? I searched in the wiki and I can't actually find the actual voice lines, only written quotes
@@cardinull5761 you need to destroy whispers in Entrati labs. By doing this, you will unlock more and more of his lost notes
I would take the new Albrecht song way more seriously if it didn't sound like they were singing "jelly" every 3 seconds lol
I actually have it saved as Jelly Ra Song, lol
@@TheDsIEGE I knew it wasn't just me! Haha
Or Octopath traveler Auguste
Heh...this all reminds me of Fullmetal Alchemist. Albrecht seen what's behind the door/wall and now he is cursed with knowledge...what knowledge? We will see...
The Orokin HATE twins, other than that it is superstition, do we know why? What if their disdain for Entrati after his void experiments is in part because he INSISTS he created a twin by accident?
Crazy coincidence there, yes?
I'm sorry I'm late, I was busy watching Drake get verbally dragged outside and murdered 😅
Hey Fullmetal Alchemist taught us ya need humans to make the philosophers stone
You miss something and I'm not gonna say what.
But you did put it in by intentional or accidentally...
Or...
Anyway
Amazing video as always
Swazdo-lah Surah
Stay safe guardian
You're talking about his head, yes? I've seen a better one...
One with a very unique aspect... A third eye...
I'm glad to see you got to check out the video though... I have to admit that... although I love the symbology of today's theory... I highly doubt it will make it into the game as I've said, lol...
@@TheDsIEGE
I'm not going to say anything...
I know you already know what it is...
You already planned for the next 3 Videos to come...
Till then...
Let them wonder...
And read the corner...
Or the 3 joined lines...
lol...
hmmm4_4 Goood show kinda nice
Everytime I hear sth about Albrecht I get more and more the feeling he is more evil than Walle. He is a typical case if fuck around and fund out but he tries to run from the find out aspect
Yeah, I don't view him in a positive light, and in fact... his vibe speaks to the persona of someone who's actually fully consumed by their shadow, and that's never a good thing.
Albrecht is a truly evil man. I'm worried DE will try and make him "complicated" or "just misunderstood" when he is wholly irredeemable by any moral standard worth considering. I feel like it is the destiny of the Tenno to destroy Albrecht for good, and maybe bring a sort of peace to Wally, who I'm starting to think was the one tainted by Albrecht, not the other way around. Thank you for your video
I'm sort of hoping for the whole, he'll be the evil and then sacrifice himself or fight the entity within and help us win, redeeming him all original darth vader style... but that's just my dream. Thank you for checking it out!
@@TheDsIEGE I wonder if that would redeem him in the eyes of his countless murder victims and experiment subjects? I would have no sympathy, or gratitude for him. I think Tagfer is right not to forgive Albrecht, I think there is a point where someone does so much evil, they can never do enough good to wash away that stain. I don't know where that line starts, but I feel like Albrecht crossed it, with glee, a long time ago. I don't know that Vader was ever redeemed, so much as Luke corrected some of the evil wrought by his father. Luke is the hero not because he saves Vader from any fate, but because he never succumbed the way his father did. Just my take anyway, what a time to be alive as Warframe lore fans, gonna ne a wild year 😊👍
So much of this has me believing ala Matrix, we're not entirely "alive", and not really "dead" either. We end as we began. From dust you came, to dust you shall return (IE : Genesis 3:19). Are we even really alive? Is any of this real, or are we still dreaming? The Indifference holding the Lotus flower alludes to the past, The Old War, and the fact that there's a whole history to which we don't remember but Alad V alludes that we destroyed a whole civilization and don't remember. What else do we not remember because our past has been wiped from our memory? And who did that? Albrecht is truly shades of grey. Neutral. The balance must be maintained, but at what cost to the Tenno? To the Orokin? To the very system itself? He doesn't seem to care either way. Almost as if he is.................Indifferent. They are one in the same. Two sides of one coin. Albrecht, the Indifferent.
How does eternalism even work, how can Duviri exist before the incident that made it and
I'm working on a vid of that as we speak.
where reddit link
In the description, good stuff right there
Hey space dad
HEY KIDDO.
So if rubedo comes from urine does that mean Rhino's rubedo skin is basically a piss skin?
Yes, that's correct.
Wait are you telling me I have been collecting somebody's perfectly filtered pee pee this whole time? (rubedo) I have never had my jaw on the floor this long before. And my helminth is eating some right now!? I'm absolutely lost.
I like Albrecht much more as an antagonist than Ballas.
Ballas was cartoonishly evil. a parody of what 'evil' is. His was a character that would fit a children's story.
Albrecht is so much more nuanced. Some people might not even consider him to be evil, which IMO, is the tell of a truly *great* villain.
Plus, Albrecht is a mirror of the Tenno we play; since we too cannot be certain if we are playing as a child saved from the void, or as a manifestation of the void. The majority of NPCs seem to believe the latter, calling us 'Void demons'.
If we must be demons; unlike Albrecht, let's not embrace that fact. let's not be 'honest' demons. Let's be what those lost children could have been, given the gifts of the void. We've already shown we're not beholden to the will of the void. (We didn't uphold our deal with the Man in the Wall). So let's keep that up. Let's do good, whether we're demons or not.
A human is the divine creation corrupted by demonic intervention. The imperfect perfection. The difference between a demon and a god is the perception of the audience. An action always has a positive and negative effect. That's why humans are powerful beings. We can communicate with true divinity and the infernal. The original human beings were homunculi named Adam and Lilith. Adam was filled with divinity of Universe by obedience, and Lilith was filled with the infernal by rejection of the Universe. Eve is the daughter clone of Adam, thus making her an inferior version of Lilith. Because of the divinity of Adam, Eve was made divine. This is the reason why women are deemed inferior in most religions.
No way this is how I found out JK Rowling’s first book was fan fic
Yep... See that?
In the process I have learned that I am gay
That happens sometimes.
Is it just me or Albrecht's voice doesn't suit him. His voice sounds so old. He's model looks so young for his voice
Maybe but... I love his voice and I love his delivery too. It's very calculated
disliked the video cause hero-wars ad
I can respect that.
So the game's alignment's white and dark is possibly "ego" and "shadow" respectively, both contributing to what is "self"? The diagram that illustrated that is fascinating. It has "consciousness" at the top alongside ego, but at the bottom, alongside shadow, it doesn't just say "unconscious", but "collective unconscious". I wonder if that's a part of us that The Indifference taps into, and into us all that we share? What might that mean for the future of the game's alignment? Perhaps too dark and you are too heavily influenced and controllable. Too light and you are too insular to be an effective weapon/not sensitive enough to The Indifference? Seems with many things, balance, whether it be your psyche/the force/your diet is the key to success...
I think you've got it now!