The War Within Core Changes to Assassination
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- čas přidán 8. 05. 2024
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I'm just really glad to have less reliance on kingsbane. Overall W changes
The changes sound great, sounds like assa is a bit more deliberate.
i like it, assuming they're going to do some sub changes before deathstalker is released. they have to now that 2nd shadow dance charge is gone from the class tree. bone spike change seems really good
I just hope moving some what away from a more burst heavy playstyle, which assass had a lot of this xpac, doesnt mean it will be bad in raid. Feels like anytime assass was good in raid was when it had huge burst emphasis playstyles and huge upfront damage in CDs and any other time it was just 'meh'. Wish IC wasnt dropped to 6 sec since now youd lose out on 3 empowered garrotes that you could squeeze into that 10 sec. Curious to see how it all shapes up in TWW. Thanks for the vids like always keep it up!!!
I don't think IC is that big of an issue honestly. You can still double gar, rup fok rup and full bleed 6 targets. Most of the time, the back half of carnage is just a pain in the ass cause you don't want to garrote and overwrite one of your stealth garrotes. Good change imo
I think it is bad that we dont have shadowdance. How do I proc carnage now when I cannot restealth, due to tank chain pulling. Vanish has 2 minute CD.
oh.... it looks like bad class design :O rogue dev clueless since bfa
Before: 2m CD Vanish, 1m CD Dance
Now: 2x 2m CD Vanish
Technically worse, but we no longer have any reason to use Vanish inside combat, so if your packs take 1m, you should be able to juggle between the 2 charges.
Pack 1: Open with stealth
Pack 2: *Vanish1* , Vanish2
Pack 3: Vanish1(1m), *Vanish2*
Pack 4: *Vanish1* , Vanish2(1m)
Pack 5: Vanish1(1m), *Vanish2*
etc.
However, I think there's a valid argument to be made about needing to reapply IC in long pulls and thus being limited by your Vanish charges.
You hold vanish charges for it. You want your tank to chain pull since it lowers uptime. You can use the energy and bleeds expiring from the last pack for energy going into the next one. We don't lose a ton of damage from restealths so as long as you hold the vanishes for big packs and use the chain pulls effectively, you're going to be doing way more damage
@@PozitronCZE It's literally 2, MAYBE 3 talents that require stealth if you run ma, the design is fine
Idk. It just sounds like they are killing the one thing we have and not replacing it with anything. Just looking at this stuff makes me think we are gonna have an even tougher time in trying to find key groups. Also it sounds like they are killing our st burst in raid also. I just don't know if any of this is good. However, I do understand the trying to simplify things, it just feels like we are losing our one strength.
getting into pug groups is literally just "is the spec doing insano dps", which is down to numbers. This isn't removing a strength it's just pulling back on the "everything kingsbane" mentality we've gotten pigeonholed into. Once actual tuning happens and things get their damage adjusted we'll be just as strong as anything else, but with more flexibility in the tree. Sounds like a win to me
@@whispyr5793 I hope you're right. What's up with that leech talent tho? Seems pointless.
@@kaddiloc1 yeh I mean it's at the top of the class tree it's not going to be crazy strong
i read all of this as: less buttons less thinking
big good
I only play m+ with my friends because pug tranks chain pull. And why wouldn't they, Assassination is the only spec having an issue with that, it's ridiculous design. I wouldn't mind losing Shadow Dance if they would just take the stealth requirement out of Carnage.
M+ pulls without Carnage active ruin every bit of fun for me with this spec I love. :(
outlaw cares about restealths more than assassination. Both specs want the tank to chain pull in order to maintain uptime
Survival hunter still has Lunge in their TWW talent calculator on WoWHead, is this not current with TWW alpha? It increases range of melee attacks and abilities.
us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/feedback-druid-updates/1833171/2#astral-influence-and-increased-melee-range-2
They mentioned here that they're revisiting range increases across the game
quack 🦆
🦆
I'm just a little worried that the spec just wont have enough damage when we cant ramp kingsbane into infinity. Heavy burst specs sucks to play but they are also one of the most desired damage profiles out there when it comes to prog.
easy solution, all damage done +%
It's all numbers, if number bigger then it's a meta spec, doesn't matter where it's coming from
@@whispyr5793
Can't argue with that. If you say it feels good then i take your word for it. You may also take my wife out for a date. Thank you for your service!
Seeing the tier set now and the sad state of sin current hero model are of the mindset I am where outlaw looks like it'll take the crown again? 😅
there has been 0 tuning of any kind on alpha/beta, you're about 4 months early to any debate about best spec
I really hope to be playing this in m+ next season. Currently, the affixes like this week's spiteful make the spec feel less able to handle the content than outlaw. I don't like outlaw. An average keystone hero gamer would like to play a dot spec and keep up with these insane burst specs nowadays.
outlaw loses out on more damage from spiteful weeks than assassination does. Their stealth impact is just higher. But yeah this is looking good for slimming the spec down and making it more accessible
@@whispyr5793 no it doesnt. With assa u loose way more dmg and the chance to silence the pack that is the only reason assa is worth playing on high keys instead of outlaw. With outlaw u can literally tank spiteful in every pack with the evasion and the impact of a single restealth is not even close. i did tons of 28/27 keys in s3 with that afflix as outlaw and it's rly not a problem.
@@MANNCEUNNOMELIBERO respectfully all the math ever done on this topic from the last 2 expansions combined says outlaw gets more damage from stealth than assassination. Numerically it is just simply not up for debate.
Does it feel worse for assassination? Yeah probably because you're missing out on energy regen and it sounds bad, but the impact of missing stealth on outlaw just hurts the cdr engine, it is what it is.
Even regardless of anything outlaw, chain pulling is still straight up more dps for an assassination rogue.
@@whispyr5793 u mean patches? What did outlaw gain before crackshot talent? Also Who did this math and where i can find It?
I was hoping for a rework to give an alternative build where we didnt play kingsbane, sacrificing the 1min burst profile for a higher but flatter profile. But in general these changes read very good to me, especially for m+.
I think it's actually kinda possible depending on the tuning
Less burst Sadge and no more dance to silence packs when u get restealth Sadge big Sadge
Im liking what i see so far. Im loving the double vanish talent. I really dont like assass in its current state on live. It feels garbage to me in pvp and ive been maining assass since wod. I want us to get away from needing to multi dot everything for energy regen.
Im actually fine with it from a pve perspective.
probably moving more towards multi-dotting everything, rather than away. All the changes are going directly into the fantasy of a DoT spec
why was this recommended to me, I have braincells
So...fewer buttons?
same amount I guess but there's less actives that could possibly be talented into in theory, bone spike being passive etc is "fewer buttons" but we don't use said buttons currently. Depends how you compare it
im so glad our burst is getting nerfed/changed s3 DF is the least fun i had on assa in YEARS
i just hope we can get some alternative talents (capstones?) for flatter damage profile and maybe faster gameplay
also not a fan of chaining envenoms but at least its only 10% dmg
Pally still has melee range increase
It's part of their spec identity they won't be losing increased range
i really love assa but as long as we are so dependant on stealth & outlaw still just need 1 button to do more damage than we do we will always be bottom :(
but we're not dependent on stealth? The removal of nightstalker, dance, and loosening of imp gar and subterfuge makes stealth "requirements" way less punishing while also removing some of the damage from stealth
@whispyr5793 removing dance does make us more reliant on restealths tho right?
Absolutely. Dance's 1 minute Cd compared to Vanish's 2 minute. We'll have fewer empowered garrote/ID windows in long M+ fights as well as raid. but sounds like they're shifting away from that playstyle. manually refreshing the dots in M+ is going to feel worse, imo.
Oh my lord they making us chain envenoms in tww... nooooooooooooo please lawd no
I don't really get the hate for envenom chaining honestly. If there was no talent for chaining, we would just be back to maximizing envenom uptime, which ends up being the same gameplay
maximizing envenom uptime has been an assa staple since way back in cataclysm, now we just have a talent explicitly incentivizing it
@whispyr5793 you're right. And i honestly can't tell why it makes a difference to me. Its a complete irrational dislike tbh. I guess there is a slight difference in trying to spread out envenoms as much as possible vs pooling and then spamming?
@@whispyr5793 the problem for me is pooling, especially combined with slower gameplay that we have now
i dont mind maximizing envenom uptime but waiting ages for energy to regen back is boring and frustrating, at least for me
@@wapniak666 maximizing envenom uptime would lead to pooling as well for what it's worth, you can't get around that
Seems like the rogue devs are not prioritizing the class at all? Hero talents late release and for being late it’s not even good … Look how much love mage and warlock got in comparison… this is a joke!
good riddance sepsis. i like the bone spike change as a M+ player. rip burst tho.
No stepsis Sadge
Pretty sure 90% of ret abilities are 10+ yards
That's part of their spec identity during the rework they specifically limited the amount of movement CDs they were going to give to ret and compensated with increased range