What Happened to TSM?
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- čas přidán 12. 01. 2023
- TSM are one of the biggest esports orgs of all time.
They’ve won countless tournaments in almost every major scene, signed some of the brightest stars, and given us some of the most incredible moments in esports history.
But in recent years, TSM have been caught up in several messy controversies, made baffling competitive decisions, and left the fans wondering - what’s next?
Can TSM still rise above their troubles - or is it already too late?
Written by: Alina Sotula (@ASotula)
Edited by: Matthew Massey
Production Assistance: Jason Lo (@JasonLobsterr) and Nicolas Buck (@nbuck12)
Thumbnail by: Bennett Grainger (insta: @bennettgrainger)
Hosted by: Josh Bury (@thrown_gauntlet)
Produced by: Alina Sotula (@ASotula), Connor Dunn (@connordunn_), and Danielle Rosen (@Daniel_Rosen)
Footage Credits: pastebin.com/ZZz4VrtF
Music used under license from Associated Production Music LLC (”APM”).
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I really like TSM's siege roster, but I have to separate the team from the org (the same can be said for Faze's csgo roster). I've disliked Reginald since I started playing League back in season 3. My friends showed me the videos of Reginald harassing his teammates (Dyrus and Xpecial) and my opinion was solidified. It was hilarious when TSM did an internal investigation and found nothing wrong with Reginald's behaviour.
That’s what happen when you have power you abuse it
I use to be a pretty big TSM fan. Dyrus was one of my favorite pros. It really broke my heart when that reginald video came out. Like, holy shit was it toxic. The shit part was that Reginald clearly knew it was being recorded, and was open about it being part of how they run the team. If no one every leaked that video publically, nobody would even know how shit of a person reginald really was. I would have kept blindly supporting him.
@@Jasongy827 with great power comes great responsibility is something reginald never heard
For real, there are so many players across games I like that are apart of TSM yet Regi is just such a terrible person. It’s made me realize I don’t cheer for orgs, I cheer for players.
Correction they found he had done nothing LEGALLY wrong. That was it. A completely empty statement.
the difference between regi compared to other team owners like Nadeshot, Jack, hell even Rick Fox, is that his communication skills never evolved past ranked trash talk. he's a CEO and owner of a major org yet he still does not know how to properly convey his feelings, wants, or expectations to anyone he works with. we're the same age and i was there during S1 when he was still just a shittalking kid. now he's an adult with the same mentality he had over 10 years ago. being responsible for millions in dollars of assets doesn't make you a good businessman, he should've sold TSM years ago and just chilled in a 5 star resort where he can harass the service workers in peace.
Nothing but a bit of management and business training. But knowing him he was above even himself and probably thought he knows best and how things are run. And if nobody was ever able to stand up to him and tell him otherwise, there is no growth and nothing that would have changed the situation. This may just be his wake-up call but might already be too late. This kind of stuff manifests deeply.
As someone that followed TSM since Season 1 as you, that's what baffles me the most: the dude is still the same solo queue trash talking kid he was back then. How the heck can someone not grow up one bit in TEN YEARS? That's absolutely crazy to me
Dood should stay out of player development and managment. Stick to just the business financial side of it.
the sole reason i sadly stopped being a TSM fan is regi
he's just a psycho that lucked into the right spot at the right time.
I reckon 90% of the people that chat tsm do it cause it's a meme, not because they are a fan. Just a theory, a game theory.
Cringe
Considering 90% of tsm cheers in league are in games where none of them are present, yeah
Exactly its just a meme they did not need to dramatize the last 20 second of this video lol
You can't have one single EU BO5 without TSM chants. When we know the accross the pound banther, it's pretty easy to know if those are serious...
Yep
Love how faker is just laughing while the chant was in the background
I knew TSM was going to have problems sooner or later thanks to Reginald's attitude and I was right.
Something that people easily missed is TSM Leena, prior to resigned, she was TSM, she was the person who collected every roster and behind their every success and it quickly crumbled when Leena left.
@@Frzned9x People are so weird. Hate TSM all you want but the fact that you go and support people like DL and Leena when they arent exactly free of drama is dumb. Leena had the whole Dardoch thing and also had multiple times where she would get into arguments with people on reddit. She was a PR disaster.
@@detoxive8903 I dont support leena or dl, I couldnt care less about them. Nor did I even state that i hate tsm ever lolw. Im just stating the facts that everything went to shit when they left.
wow good job!!! here’s a cookie 🍪
Sry for that
league was my first introduction to TSM, esports in general really, and the team not just for lol don't feel the same like early 2010s that also goes for each organization. but that's probably just nostalgia of the championship series at those times in our lives
love how you say that the Apex team is falling off when they just placed #1 in NA
Exactly what I was thinking, I wonder when this video was made to be this outdated.
It’s likely this video was made quite some time ago since there is a lot of editing
I was about so say cause they are defo top 5 itw rn but let’s see on lan
the game itself is falling off
It's important to note that the TSM report at 10:55 didn't clear him of wrongdoing, just that that there wasn't any evidence he did anything legally wrong, which given he hired a law firm to do the review would make sense. That doesn't mean that he didn't do anything that the players said, just that there was no evidence of anything against the law.
It's important to note that although someone may not have broken any law, that they may still have acted in a manner that may be considered improper...
@@Dad.by.Daylight sure but thats not how this works. A law firm only confirms legalities, NOT morals.
@@Dad.by.Daylight That is could "morality policing"
@sam sam People have been doing that for centuries... But that is part of the reason why the internal investigation was focused on how nothing "criminal" was done... As we all know, Riot's decision wasn't just focused on whether the line was crossed... Right or wrong, more than one person has noted that Reggie had a tendency to go over what most would consider "socially acceptable" from his position of power... Would he have acted that way if he was a normal employee? Not a chance in hell... He acted that way because he WAS the boss, and did not have someone above him to set him straight...
@@samsam-xk3er youre the type to defend child labor if it wasn't illegal huh
TSM has just started too regain form in apex again with them winning the NA pro league split 1 which is the toughest region
Seeing Regi and Carlos get what they deserve and have had coming for a while is SO damn nice.
For real it’s funny seeing karma hit entitled dudes who think they’re above consequences
what?
all carlos did was post a video with andrew tate
carlos didnt do anything
@@bjoe__6710 didnt do anything, partying with a sex trafficker and abuser and a misogynist, for sure he didnt do anything
Friendly reminder that they didn't "flounder domestically" in Spring 2017. They still won with Turtle.
Right lol? Is hauntzer losing mvp to arrow considered floundering?
We love theScore's revisions to history.
@@jamieeldredge3963 classic TSM fan
2017 lcs = gold korea soloq
And they went 15-3 in the regular season, so it's not like they just pulled it all together for playoffs either.
Idk when the vid was made, but in apex, they're one of the best rosters in the world atm
TSM fan since 2012 here and all i can say is this,
Watching them from their highs in the 'early' days to the troubles that the past 5 years that they have endeavored i have still had the same passion if not more than before for this organization. Yeah, we can all blame regi and the management for how the org has fallen into shambles as of late but we also remember how good and exciting these teams were once before. I cheer for the players of all Calibur no matter where they reside now because they were once part of the TSM tradition in bringing everything they had to the teams they played for. The passion that they have whether its the LoL team or Hal and the boys in Apex, you cannot teach passion and that's why i am a fan of the organization. So that someday, when all this dust clears from the allegations and muck that they will return back to where they were and be a proud organization for the fans once again.
clown
I'd say there's been more good than bad, and also that not many people would be sad to see Regi just...go, just go away, y'know, and let someone else take over.
I started being a fan of them because of league, continued being a fan because of the meme culture, and now I've moved onto Siege and start to newly appreciate TSM over there.
Amazing video. Thanks for the content m8 ~
Not sure the Apex team is falling off. They're still first place for first split this year in NA. I dont know if they'd win the upcoming February LAN but that's not a low performing team. I'm not a TSM fan at all but I do follow their Apex roster (TSM doesn't have notable teams in CS or Dota for me to care about), and I just think it's a weird thing to point at when the metric says they're doing as well as eSports Arena and Xset.
The FTX stuff, and the internal review of Reginald is absolutely something to talk about though and was interesting.
The video already stated they were the progenitor of the 5 CSGO players that eventually became Astralis.
Everyone loves Beaulo
Not everyone most fans of his are bandwagoners
@@VibingWithVariety u can bandwagon and still like someone? i dont think there are many people who dont like him. he doesnt talk shit, hes good, chill, funny, not really much to hate on tbh
i love merc
I always thought that the TSM chants when TSM weren't there was a tongue in cheek thing. Sort of like when USA chants go out in a sports event where the USA team isn't competing or already lost.
Weren't they planning on going back in the CS team around February?🤔
i love this caster Josh Bury please never leave us
Thank you. I don't want to leave you, and I don't plan to!
I received a jacket as a birthday gift with TSM. Shortly after, Bjergsen left and then the drama started to incur. Poop. I then realized I am really a Bjergsen fan.
Same, I remember his debut in NA and his Syndra and LeBlanc looked unstoppable. He was the first modern midlander in NA.
Tsm got really lucky with their starting Dota 2 team. They were really successful as a new team last year which is really difficult in Dota 2. Not sure how it will go on since most players are out.
Carlos and Regi should exchange notes on how to shaft their own org the most effectively.
tsm dota 2 astronomically ignored
Only relevent in NA and Stockholm.
"Maybe you follow Leffen in Melee"
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I started playing league end of season 1. Don't really play anymore but man TSM was pretty hype in the early days.
When Leffen won Evo 2018 was my favorite because he beat Armada at his prime before Armada retired.
Their Siege and Apex roster carrying the whole org atm
Siege is a dead ass game tho lmfao
@@amyciao1707who?
@@seancafferty782 Apex and Siege are dead games. Compare viewership of LoL esports to those games. Not even close.
@@Gurpreet-sv5zg who asked
@@Gurpreet-sv5zg bro, stagnating and declining viewership is still not dead. Like, look up old FPS giants like Wolfteam or Blackshot, or really a lot of old shooters that had multiplayer. They're practically dead now. TF2 doesn't really have a competitive scene but its community is still alive and well. You don't have to have millions upon millions of active players to be "alive" rofl.
You may be right that one day these games will die, but that's literally not true right now, nor for the forseeable future.
Subroza and Wardell duo made me fall in love with TSM for sure and that whole roster. Good ol days 🥹
I always wondered if that TSM chants were from fans or like a meme
That Dom clip about the internal “investigation” still slaps
I wouldn't say the Apex team has started to fall off. They won the first split of NA and are looking very strong. Just needed to adjust to roster changes and meta changes. Although any team is going to look like they have fallen off when they were winning everything in the beginning
TSM chants have cemented themselves in League eSports. That's a level of legacy no other org has achieved yet in the western scene. I wouldn't be surprised if TSM chants were still happening even if the org disbanded for some reason.
TSM is a chanted as a joke in worlds.
yea he failed to mention that the chants were supposed to be a meme lmao
A history and a legacy as a meme, and not a respected name.
WOW WOW WOW...now wait a minute...chanting "tsm" has become a MEME...99% of people chanitng this or writing it in chat DONT really give a damn about TSM...or are even remotely FANS of that org...its just something that established itself as a joke...and carried on even after they where not on par anymore.
Thats not a meassurement of the succes of THE ORG??????????
Of course they will continue, the chant isn't meant as support for TSM but as a meme.
damn no mention of TSM Tweek at the beginning?? man’s on a super hot streak rn and is doing great, along with his podcast that’s also been really popular
At this point, I just chant TSM for the culture and tthe meme
I started League in S2 watching Dyrus and the Oddone. Loved that team. Loved it even more with Bjerg. I'd watch TSM Legends like it was my JOB! It was awesome and there was no one that did it like that. I loved the team for how hard they charged towards Worlds and how dedicated the players were. Sometimes I rewatch their old highlights so I can chant TSM for those glory days. But I've moved on. Regi fucked it up. I was already done watching their stuff when they put PoE in Midlane?? Huni top??? Doomed to fail and now they are an 8th-10th place team. Too busy bullying people than trying to win Worlds. It's a shame.
damn the comments about tsm's apex team falling off did not age well lmao
This camera angle makes me feel like I'm watching the Joker video tape from The Dark Knight
Bringing leffen in this video, I wonder if you are gonna cover all the situation with Zero, since a lot has happenend since you unlisted Zero´s video. With all the bad press I hope TSM can recover and take the stance once more in international LoL.
I used to watch Regi and HotshotGG on own3d back then. I had no idea I was basically watching the beginning of esports and streaming as a whole.
congrats on 2 million subs!
Respect for showing the R6 dub at 0:40 🙏
tsm valorant was the first ever team i rooted for in valorant, i still remember first strike the good old days. I think i really liked their original roster so when they started dropping players i was already pretty upset. When they announced the partnership with ftx i was a bit skeptical about it but ultimately i decided just to wait and see what would happen I still remember in 2021 summer they really almost made a come back in vct, but kind of after when wardell left tsm i decided there was no point in me watching tsm anymore. Well im pretty sure they are trying to qualify for ascension right now so who knows.
If I recall there was a rumor TSM was going to pull out of LCS to go to the LEC but I think nothing came of that
Recent years? This shit has been there from the beginning
The tsm legends back in 2016 summer made me a fan of tsm lol since today. I still think the best roster was with 2016-2017 tsm
What I remember from tsm is regie vs wildturtle
Exactly just as I was wondering.
13:08 ??? #1 in NA pro league split 1.. playoffs are happening soon and are much more prepared for international metas with raven then they were the last 2 LANS. the CEO is gonna definitely take first.
I can't even imagine Regi trying to bully someone like Leffen.
I can’t express how much I love to see Andy crumble🥴
It depends on what game you're a fan of. TSM's strongest team is on Apex Legends. Don't let streaming numbers fool you. That game has been in the top 5 on Steam Charts for the last few years. Their team is probably the highest paid in Apex comp, too.
anyone know what happened to the other host, i remember it was josh and another guy.
I really like the video, nice coverage. This org could have been something special without Regi, such a shame.
bro this was my team 😢
I was a fan of TSM, but regi was always the aftertaste you knew you had to deal with.
6:47 'As someone who knew the ins and outs of the game'
Yea.... Maybe back in season 2...
Those clips where Regi is harassing Dyrus or Xpecial in particular are still just so hard to watch.
People chant because TSM is a big meme. No need to overthink things.
The apex team is not falling off they're doing quite well in comp rn.
„He‘d fist fight the instructor on day one“ that gave me a good laugh 🤣
The apex scene is still doing alright
TSM is such a catchy chant
For 10/11 years i cheered for tsm, however i supported the staff and players, not reginal… so after everyone left and the bad calls they have done for years continue to happen but without the original staff, the ship just went downhill for the league part and its not tsm anymore at least for me.
deadass said tsm apex is falling when they just placed 1st in NA 🥶
Is funny how Regi used to be the most hated org owner in esports (at least lol I don't follow a lot of other esports)
And then carlos came and said: hold my beer 😂
But I guess now that carlos is no longer an owner, regi reclaims the title?
Hate Carlos because he hung out with "bad man tate"? OK lol
Nah Regi still holds that title, nobody really hates Carlos 😂. Just because he hangs out with Tate.
@@jacobgiocondo456 Carlos was already hated with the perkz situation. He also had a debacle with LS and not paying up employees. I guess we know who the fake bandwagon fans who joined when G2 became relevant in 2019 lol.
Honestly, as a non TSM fan doing the same chant, I always thought it was just a meme
Great video as always!
Gotta love the famous airport speedrun.
That'll never get beaten xD
As far as content wise optic takes the crown, they were so far ahead of their time
Wait did they say in 2017 spring they floundered? They won the split
TSM is what happens when you have a group of people who just wanted to make a competitive team. Then when the team becomes an org, the CEO happens to be the person who was the most abusive on the team. Basically, a typical gaming nerd (Most gamers back then tbh) was given the power to run a massive organisation which in the real world is a terrible idea.
Chanting TSM is a meme and the more of a meme the org is, the funnier the chants are.
"It can't get any worse" that's the most jinxed line I've ever heard
I think the reason TSM retains fans is because it has entered the space that traditional sports teams inhabit. When I root for my home city win or lose I stick with them. I talk shit about them but no one else can. For so long esports teams had the band wagon mentality. All the way back in Cod Black Ops 1 with Optic. Been watching League esports since season 2. And I can say no matter how long I go away from TSM just like my home team if I see those black and white colors I still root for them.
Same. I am beyond disappointed on recent years but still, I'd rather stop watching esports completely rather than support any other team.
As you said, once you "choose" a team you are likely to stay there!
TSMs apex team isn’t falling off… otherwise, all facts, great video
i havent followed LoL since 2018, im actually surprised this team survived all these years under the ownership and leadership of Reginald. I was expecting them to disappear much much sooner.
Talent supressing Machine
Y'all left out the fortnite impact they had that left and The Leena Reggie doublelift shindig
Crazy how far this titan of an org has fallen
Same with blizzard not surprise by anything
Real ones know HotshotGG discovered doublelift and his blitzcrank
Question. Did you drop Dota2 content?
I play siege and keep the tsm charm on my most sweaty ops I only pull it out when I wanna go “total sicko mode”
PASSION
what about The Rain Man, and the BAYLIFE?
for me I know TSM from the mobile moba game called vainglory
They have also become a big meme. At least in league of legends; if you hear the punlic scand TSM, chances are they're taking the piss
the only tsm have now only R6 team and i hope tsm didnt mess up with their R6 team
Dota apex smash????
10:30 Season 2 mid laner who was dragging his team down with completely mind boggling shot calls and losing lanes non stop. Its a miracle they had any kind of success when he was on the team.
I've been a fan of competitive League since season 2 and am an avid C9 fan. From day 1 I couldn't stand TSM or it's fan base, and as much as I can't stand them and enjoyed their competitive downfall, it's truly sad how it happened. Regi drove a powerhouse of an organization into the ground because of his own ego.
It’s a mistake of the journalist to assume that the people chanting TSM at matches where they aren’t even playing are TSM fans. Chanting TSM has become a meme. It’s not some random pocket of uber-loyal TSM fans holding on to a bygone era. It’s just a meme.
3:34 what about optic?
Optic literally mane esports what it is today
I was a longtime TSM fan in almost everything until 2020. I soullessly watched in 2021, but the last time I was truly proud to be a TSM fan was 2020.
Dyrus theoddone bjergsen wildturtle xspecial best team ever i still remember watching their old vids in their shitty apartments back in the day rip old tsm their siege roster kinda gives old tsm vibes
Even their Challengers Valorant Roster doesn't inspire much confidence. It's like they are not even trying to get into VCT anymore. They had the whole offseason to recruit a super team but they stuck with a lackluster team.
The Fortnite TSM roster is not in the video, I wonder why
Still waiting on Regi to sell all of his toys like he said he would if TSM didn't do well.
I feel like half the time they do TSM chants it's just for memes tho. RIP Regi's house.
As a diehard tsm fan the only saving grace lect for tsm is for regi to sell the team. As long as he owns the team there will always be a negative aspect towards tsm. Regi really needs to sell the team and have the team be under a new owner but the likelihood of that happening is the same likelihood of an NA league team winning worlds
TSM is one of the few profitable esports teams. Regi not selling.
@@vroomzoom4206 they are profitable now but who is is to say a year of two they are not profitable due to the amount of controversies surround regi as a person
@Joaquin Oreta yeah, but if you look at esports teams being profitable is extremely rare and they still sell for millions, so he may as well keep it until it starts operating at a loss then sell.
where is subroza's comment..?
Got confused. thought this was about FTX.