Episode 889 I measure the phase delay of several opamps. They vary at higher frequencies. I also tryout using the RIGOL HDMI output. Do you like it? Be a Patron: / imsaiguy
I think the scope HDMI output is a winner. It should allow you to lock the camera angle on a circuit and lock the focus (turn off auto focus). I always believe in the work smarter not harder principle.
I really Like the PIP… Allows you to maintain close-up and focus on the work area while allowing us to see a straight on view of the scope screen… Great improvement.. I really like the new scope!!! Thanks
I have thoroughly enjoyed your videos and the content you put out. No complaints. Do what you what you like to do. I enjoy the explanations about all the things.
It's quite interesting how the different types of circuits make the audio sound different. Tubes do seem to make the audio sound warmer and richer (Note Mr. Carlson's voice on his CZcams channel). Transistors seem to produce a more clinical sound. Digital audio is the most clinical of all, in my opinion, but we are now getting into the realm of it being highly subjective. A lot must depend on the speakers as well. I use wired earphones and they sound pretty good. Although $10 earphones from Walmart sound better than $1.25 earbuds from Dollarama. My favourite is Winamp because the graphic equalizer makes the audio sound quite different depending on how you adjust the sliders. It is fun to play around with different frequency settings. My Dad records bird songs. He used to use a casette deck and play them back through the little speaker in the deck. The cat just sat there, paying no attention. Recently he switched to a digital recorder and he plays it back through his Bluetooth speakers. Now the cat is all over the speakers wondering where the bird is, I guess. Lol. Cheers from Canada :-)
Love the scope captures. I love my DS1054, but you are really making me think about upgrading. HDMI output is a killer feature. Don't be afraid to use some "full screen" scope views.
Your Rigol should have a measure function for phase between two channels. It's a bit late now, but can be a very handy measurement since getting the exact angle can be tedious!
The scope HDMI picture is much clearer to see, so well worth keeping. However there is a problem with the current setup, when you adjust the scope you blot out the camera image with your arm. If you could arrange for the camera to be on your left hand side rather than the right this would be much less of a problem. (I guess that the camera is on the right so that you can focus on the scope easily) Another option would be to have the camera in front of you looking "down" on the breadboard or whatever. Andy
To add to your Information. The LM-358 was invented by Ernie Leroy Long when he was working for Motorola in about 1968. He developed it for a fuel pump on a Ford Car. How do I know this? Ernie is long time friend from Banawa in the Philippines. We often talk at night while enjoying a beer in Guadalupe. Ernie is responsible for developing about 50 patents. Ernie rose to much fame in National Semiconductor.
Loved the scope display picture-in-picture thing. Also really liked seeing the different op-amps hot-swapped. Thanks for the video. I am thinking about buying a variety of substitutible op-amps to experiment with - would you care to give a list of reasonable choices? I have the AoE tables but they're kinda overwhelming with detail. Would be better if they made them available as spreadsheets, then I could sort them. Maybe I should tell _them_ that. :-)
I like the picture in a picture. It is nice to see your hardware and the scope data simultaneously. Nice job! What about the 741 op amp? I have hundreds of this chip. Are they very bad?
Hey, me again. The video in video works great. This was an interesting example of various op-amps. The topic of phase response deserves mention - a part of the topic that I always need to review is the distinction of group phase verses the phase response at a specific frequency. There seems to be some particular interest in this in the audio arena, but I think that is also at odds with some science about how humans hear. I may have some of this muddied up in my own understanding. Do you have any comment, and could you demo how a multistage amp might manage the group phase? Is it simply having wide band amplifiers to minimize phase distortion at audio frequencies? Or is there more magic?
@@IMSAIGuy Ah, I F'd up. It is Group Delay. This guy explains it well in first 4-5 min of his presentation. czcams.com/video/NHC__ou7-h0/video.html He also has an argument for humans being very sensitive to this type of distortion. [ah and this also illustrates my own misunderstanding] Still interesting topic
@@IMSAIGuy and a more mathematical explanation. czcams.com/video/k5x9s6bMZ5s/video.html which I recognize from 40 years ago,...this is a discrete 'sampled' system that he is developing.
@@IMSAIGuy So I think that I am correct in observing a very wide band amp which has useful gain well beyond 20-20Khz so that all the phase(w) delay within the 20-20Khz signal of interest are delayed equally, that would be the goal for minimal group delay in the audio range. ????
I don't have a EE education so was not taught all that math. I did like the study where high order harmonics above 20kHz matter. Any musician knows that by instinct.
The picture within a picture is a reasonable touch, thank you.
The scope visualization in this video is pretty sweet!
I think the scope HDMI output is a winner. It should allow you to lock the camera angle on a circuit and lock the focus (turn off auto focus). I always believe in the work smarter not harder principle.
I really Like the PIP… Allows you to maintain close-up and focus on the work area while allowing us to see a straight on view of the scope screen… Great improvement.. I really like the new scope!!! Thanks
I have thoroughly enjoyed your videos and the content you put out. No complaints. Do what you what you like to do. I enjoy the explanations about all the things.
Like the picture-in-picture touch. Clarity is great.
Nice lesson about phase relationships. Like new presentation method. Thanks for the look.
Another upvote for the picture in picture when switching between views. Easy to follow, looks good.
This Rigol scope keeps getting better and better! Nice touch.
Love your videos, and i believe new method of showing oscilloscope is nice
It's quite interesting how the different types of circuits make the audio sound different. Tubes do seem to make the audio sound warmer and richer (Note Mr. Carlson's voice on his CZcams channel). Transistors seem to produce a more clinical sound. Digital audio is the most clinical of all, in my opinion, but we are now getting into the realm of it being highly subjective.
A lot must depend on the speakers as well. I use wired earphones and they sound pretty good. Although $10 earphones from Walmart sound better than $1.25 earbuds from Dollarama.
My favourite is Winamp because the graphic equalizer makes the audio sound quite different depending on how you adjust the sliders. It is fun to play around with different frequency settings.
My Dad records bird songs. He used to use a casette deck and play them back through the little speaker in the deck. The cat just sat there, paying no attention. Recently he switched to a digital recorder and he plays it back through his Bluetooth speakers. Now the cat is all over the speakers wondering where the bird is, I guess. Lol.
Cheers from Canada :-)
I like the new picture in picture format great improvement
Love the scope captures. I love my DS1054, but you are really making me think about upgrading. HDMI output is a killer feature.
Don't be afraid to use some "full screen" scope views.
Liked the format
perfect video , regarding phase linearity loudspeakers even high end are very interesting specially with 2 or three way filters...
Your EE204 lab books are due by the end of the day on Friday, everyone. Be sure to put your name on them.
Fantastic! Loved the screenshot during swaps. It would be neat to show how an op-amp responds when one rail goes crappy on ya.
I like the screen capture! (But Mr. Carlson would use his Polaroid Scope camera on his Tektronix 310)
Your Rigol should have a measure function for phase between two channels. It's a bit late now, but can be a very handy measurement since getting the exact angle can be tedious!
I like the PiP and you not obscure areas of interest in the big picture.
The scope HDMI picture is much clearer to see, so well worth keeping.
However there is a problem with the current setup, when you adjust the scope you blot out the camera image with your arm.
If you could arrange for the camera to be on your left hand side rather than the right this would be much less of a problem. (I guess that the camera is on the right so that you can focus on the scope easily)
Another option would be to have the camera in front of you looking "down" on the breadboard or whatever.
Andy
To add to your Information. The LM-358 was invented by Ernie Leroy Long when he was working for Motorola in about 1968. He developed it for a fuel pump on a Ford Car. How do I know this? Ernie is long time friend from Banawa in the Philippines. We often talk at night while enjoying a beer in Guadalupe. Ernie is responsible for developing about 50 patents. Ernie rose to much fame in National Semiconductor.
Nice video :D
Loved the scope display picture-in-picture thing. Also really liked seeing the different op-amps hot-swapped. Thanks for the video. I am thinking about buying a variety of substitutible op-amps to experiment with - would you care to give a list of reasonable choices? I have the AoE tables but they're kinda overwhelming with detail. Would be better if they made them available as spreadsheets, then I could sort them. Maybe I should tell _them_ that. :-)
I grew up using the venerable 741.
I like the picture in a picture. It is nice to see your hardware and the scope data simultaneously. Nice job! What about the 741 op amp? I have hundreds of this chip. Are they very bad?
Another informative video = Thank you. PIP is good; maybe just 1/3 smaller.
Please continue using the PIP function.
I would be curious what would a 741 do...
Hey, me again. The video in video works great.
This was an interesting example of various op-amps.
The topic of phase response deserves mention - a part of the topic that I always need to review is the distinction of group phase verses the phase response at a specific frequency.
There seems to be some particular interest in this in the audio arena, but I think that is also at odds with some science about how humans hear.
I may have some of this muddied up in my own understanding.
Do you have any comment, and could you demo how a multistage amp might manage the group phase? Is it simply having wide band amplifiers to minimize phase distortion at audio
frequencies? Or is there more magic?
how is group phase defined?
@@IMSAIGuy Ah, I F'd up. It is Group Delay. This guy explains it well in first 4-5 min of his presentation. czcams.com/video/NHC__ou7-h0/video.html
He also has an argument for humans being very sensitive to this type of distortion. [ah and this also illustrates my own misunderstanding]
Still interesting topic
@@IMSAIGuy and a more mathematical explanation.
czcams.com/video/k5x9s6bMZ5s/video.html
which I recognize from 40 years ago,...this is a discrete 'sampled' system that he is developing.
@@IMSAIGuy So I think that I am correct in observing a very wide band amp which has useful gain well beyond 20-20Khz so that all the phase(w) delay within the 20-20Khz signal of interest are delayed equally, that would be the goal for minimal group delay in the audio range.
????
I don't have a EE education so was not taught all that math. I did like the study where high order harmonics above 20kHz matter. Any musician knows that by instinct.
How to phase shift a sine wave
czcams.com/video/1gpL32mf1kA/video.htmlsi=VaRUY-xRhXhlu1MK
PIP made it better at least for this kind of a video. Lots of zooming on the scope otherwise.