Plumbing A House With Pex-A (DIY Expansion Pex Installation)
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- We used Pex-A or expandion pex for all of the supply lines in our house. the fityings snd pioe themselves are slightly more expensive then using normal pex, but I think yhe end product will be alot better.
Leave any questions you have in the comments and I'll answer them the best I can.
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Here is a link to the code reference book we have been using:
www.amazon.com...
Nice video. The black 'manifolds' you are using are technically still manifolds, but not proper manifolds. The black ones are just a series, you can tell because only one end is open. If you draw water from the first lines, the latter lines will lose some flow for uneven flow. Example: wife flushed while you were in the shower and it became super hot scalding you. No bueno. The idea of a proper manifold is a loop with the supply lines extending off of the loop. It does not need to be a big loop, either. For the 4-port manifold you are using, a simple 6" - 12" loop will feed those 4 supply lines. This loop creates a back-pressure ensuring that ALL supply lines are receiving and sending a more even flow between all of the lines, not just the first one. This helps to eliminate those scalding moments in the shower.
Gotta rotate the tip you risk causing gaps that will leak down the line
Watch it again, please. You can clearly see the tip rotating automatically 1/8 of a turn on each pump of tool.
@@DaveDayCAE No it doesn't. The manual tool he has doesn't have an indexing head. You need to manually rotate it.
@@adisharr Exactly!
@@adisharr well I watched it over and over again, and it did rotate.
@@cynthiaayers7696 now go watch how it's supposed to be rotated with a tool that does it automatically and you'll see it's not the same thing. The tool he's using does not have an indexing system built into the head.
@6:25: Always rotate the tool or fitting between expansions to ensure an even, round expansion. The further apart the teeth pry, the less circular their force. Uneven expansion can lead to leaks. That's why the automatic expansion tools rotate the head after every expansion.
... and now I see others posted similar comments. Leaving this one up in case the added explanation helps someone.
Good point but might be impossible in tight areas
@@psoon04286 Not with the battery powered tools, they rotate the jaw between each cycle. No muss, no fuss. At least a lost less fuss then a leak. Oh, the Apollo tool has a rotating chuck, just try it. So, you can just rotate the jaw if the space is an issue.
@@harrisfogel6992 thanks for the heads up. I’ll see if they’re available at the rental outlets
@@psoon04286 I did the same, Home Depot didn't rent them, so a pal loaned me the Apollo tool. But.. when I tried a electric model, it was like a sigh of relief!
i found my Milwaukee propex expander tool used, for about $200.00. I only used it to re-pipe my house from galvanized steel to pex. I thought it was worth every penny since i had to work in a cramped crawlspace in my 1950's era house.
I wish I had one, I didn't even think about looking for a used one. I'm sure it would have been very helpful for us too, because even though you can almost stand up in our crawlspace it is still not comfortable!
Thanks for watching!
Did you happen to sell it after use?
Make sure there’s no water leaks before you install the Sheetrock. It’s better to use the propex expander because the manual tool don’t expand the pex evenly unless you rotate it manually and where it didn’t expand sometimes you get leaks
DANG ! You found a steal ! I paid over 4 hundred then I had to purchase a the Battery almost 6 hundred : /
MrSuperBrite no I kept it since I plan to use more PEX-A for a water softener and other water treatment equipment
After watching your video even one year later you did a great job for a DIY. Seems like you saved alot of money vs hiring a plumber, electrician, etc. All the negative comments don't mean anything if inspections passed code. You and your wife make a great team together which I'm sure has inspired alot youtube watchers. Probably by now you both are living happily ever after in your dream home. Liked your video.
Thanks! We are happy living in the house but we still have projects to complete and videos to come! We also did save a lot of money doing everything ourselves. Thanks for watching!
I'll be installing pex A next week but opted for the electrical expander. Well worth the piece of mind.
That will deffinately be easier, and will deffinately rotate lol! make sure you follow the recommended testing procedure as if you test like a standard system by just bringing to test preassure and leaving it the air expands the pipe and the preasure will drop and it will look like a leak! Our manufacturer had us double the test preassure for 15 minutes then drop to the test preassure for the remainder of the test. Good luck with your project!!
And peace of mind.
Sorry to see you fighting the manual expender tool. Battery Expander is worth every penny. You can always sell it after your house is completed.
Manual expander deffinately wasn't the easiest but wasn't impossible, using it in small spaces isn't fun though.
Glad I watched this video. I have just a few Pex lines to plumb and no way do I want to futz around with that manual expander.
It's deffinately not the easiest to use especially in tight places! Good luck with your project!!
Next time, buy or rent a cordless electric expander and always give it a couple extra shots after it bottoms out on the tool.
This is exactly what I was looking for. I wanted to know the effort using the manual expansion tools. No need to do an upper body workout after working with the Pex A.
Yeah it's not the easiest. I have a project coming up with 1"pex and I'm not excited!
Thanks for watching!
Haha, a free bonus for adopting PEX A - bulging chest😄
yes you must rotate the after each stretch
Smartest trick in this video: Bend supports.
They do make bend supports that are a little less bulky than the stub out supports we used, but we had a whole box of the stub outs so we just used those even though they are bigger! Thanks for watching!
There's expansion fitting PEX B btw. See Zurn's system.
Pex a and b denote how the pex is manufactured, pex b does not return to its original shape after being deformed, pex a does this is what let's pex a be expanded. The company you refer to most likely manufactures in the pex a style, amd the allows you to crimp ot as well, so calling it pex b that can be expanded would be wrong.
@Poots Pastures I won't claim to be an expert. Zurn claims they use the Silane method for manufacturing their pex pipe, which would make it pex b. Zurn also claims their pipe can be used with expansion or crimp fittings. Feel free to litigate them over false advertisement, but they're claims I have no reason to doubt.
@@PootsPasturesZurn specifically states their Pex-B is F1960 certified, meaning you can use expansion fittins with their Pex-B product.Yes, I know Pex A and Pex B are created using different methods. The Zurn Pex-B being expandable is the interesting thing about that product.
A little incorrect information in this video. You CAN use crimp rings on PEX A along with expansion fittings, but can NOT use expansion fittings with PEX B, only crimp rings.
Thank you for posting your video. Your efforts is greatly appreciated sir.
Hey great video, just as an FYI it is good practice when using the hand expander to rotate the pipe as you expand it cheers
Great tip and Adding to this, it could possibly lead to leaks at your joints. Hope all is working well for you two.
Yes you should, we didn't rotate as much as we should have, but have had no issues going on 4 months, thanks for watching!
@@PootsPastures What brand of pex-a pipe did you use. I used the same tool but I had trouble expanding the Apollo pex-a pipe I am using.
It was Apollo
Good Video, these new different PEX applications are a bit confusing as to which one is better than the other. I have a hard time with PEX A expansion method how it can seal and not eventually might blow off do to variations in water pressures, especially with Hot Water connections, where water temperatures can get rather high, and why those temperatures might affect the plastic. I'm definitely not a Plumber, but just trying to use a common sense approach. Good Job on your plumbing video, I think I learned a lot. Even though the cost of an electric or battery Expander Tool is expensive, it still might be a good investment do to the physical strain of using the hand pump method in tight quarters. If you buy one of the expensive ones, you could still sell it later and recoup most of the cost. But what do I know. Right?
Pex isn’t uv resistant, you run pex to copper stubouts to protect the pipe from rupturing due to being exposed to sun. . Anywhere that sun might touch the pipe has to be a copper stub out. But you will probably learn that in a few years lol
Dang your right, the 1/2 inch of pex sticking out of the wall in a room with a few windows, that's inside a closed cabinet, behind random items in the cabinet has already broken due to the uv exposure :(
PEX is very vulnerable to UV light, which strips the tubing of its chlorine-resisting properties. Most PEX is rated for 30-60 days in direct sunlight. Make sure you store it out of the sunlight on the job site and cover it as soon as possible after installation. If any of it's going to be exposed to even indirect sunlight through a window or just fluorescent lights after finishing, you should cover it with a latex-based paint or tape. That's another reason to use copper piping for regions that may be exposed, such as the feeder-tube for a toilet.
They do make chrome trim covers that slide over pex, and have the room to expand it so that the stub out is covered and protected, and it also looks a little nicer
@@PootsPastures I'm hoping for that graphite look so I can have a Fast and Furious look to my PEX.
Well, after watching your video, I'm buying the $400 electric Pro Pex Expansion tool for sure. That manual one is way too much work.
A lot of people go with the battery powered option, I'm just stubborn!
Thanks for watching!
Awesome video. Love to see other DIYers like myself learning to do PEX-A. Since you spent good money purchasing the 20V DeWalt angle drill, why didn't you spend $300 and get the Dewalt 20V PEX A expansion tool (tool only) since you already have the Dewalt batteries as opposed to using the manual PEX expander? The battery powered version is such a huge time and labor saving tool. I noticed it was taking two of you to expand the tubing using the manual expander whereas the battery one makes it so easy and efficient for one person to do the job. Just a thought. Really loved the video. Also, really loved the message on the lady's T-shirt.
If I was doing more than one house I definitely would have bought the Dewalt pex expander, but as you said it is about $300 so it just came down to not wanting to spend the money, and the manual expander isn't the easiest to use, but it is doable with one person, two definitely helps. Also not to start issues but I don't think having a completely evenly expanded line is necessary, as the pex is made to expand then shrink back to original form, so as long as you can get the fitting in and don't over expand (if that's even possible with the expander heads, I think you are good to go. Thanks for watching!!
@@PootsPastures does your manual tool automatically rotate the expander so the tube is equally expanded?
@@PootsPastures When you have finished with the tool, sell it, it makes it easier and affordable as well.
@@Allen-bm6tz nope his doesn't you what u pay for
Couldn't find the DeWalt in stock. I also have the 20v batteries. Just dropped $400 on the Milwaukee 12v that comes with 2 batteries. I might just sell it after my house is done and get the DeWalt bare tool later.
Wow really like your video. You both did a nice job. Learnt a lot, thanks, Maurice :)
Thanks! Glad we could help!
Also check out PE-RT piping, by brands like HyperPure. It's expandable and flexible like PEX-A, but it's recyclable.
You just saved us! We have Pex-a and a crimper....👀 looks like we won't be doing any joints today
Oh no! Well I'm glad you caught that, make sure you have the correct expansion fittings too, I found that the one actual plumbing supply store in our town had all the expansion fittings we needed, even when our local hardware store did not.
Thanks for watching, and good luck with your project!!
@@PootsPastures The into you provided that PEX-A cannot be used with crimp rings is NOT true. All PEX lines, A, B & C can be used with ASTM F1807 copper crimp rings & ASTM F2098 stainless steel cinch rings. It is marked on the tube as such.
Actually PEX-a is fine with crimp systems, which fall under ASTM F1807 standards - check your Pipe and if you see F1807 marked on it, it is approved to be used with crimp systems. Apollo specifically states their tubing meets or exceeds ASTM F1807 standards (which are crimp fittings)
@@mikeboehk2307 I looked up the specifications for Apollo's pex-a and that standard is listed, I left them a message to clarify if you could use their expansion pex with crimp rings, however that begs the question, why? Why would you buy more expensive tubing when you could use somthing that's more readily available and cheaper (at least where we are). I will update when I hear back from the manufacturer.
@@PootsPastures thanks! Keep us posted!
Great video! I think you are mistaken about not being able to put crimp rings on Pex A. The Manufacturers will recommend using expansion or crimped fittings on this product.
I have checked and you can use crimp on pex-a.
just buy pex b if you want to crimp it. Expansion is far superior.
Admire you both greatly! You took on this huge task and are doing great! I am going to us PEX A on my next project. I have been using copper for years, this stuff looks like fun.
Pex-a is definitely a work out! Thanks for watching!
The manual fuuuuuuuuuuuckin sux.....I have the milwaukee tool...but I do this everyday so it makes it worth it.
How is your expansion pex holding up now, after a few years?
I'm looking at going down this rabbit hole on the weekend!
thank you for the great video!
As a plumber I personally see pex a as the best option. We have it in our house and I truly trust it. After the pipe is expanded and put over the fitting it is constantly trying to shrink to its original size and shape, meaning the joints strength only increases over time. I’ve also been to remodel jobs and hooked onto old expansion pex from 10-20 years ago that holds up just fine. Truly a great system
Its great no problems at any connections! I am very glad we went with pex a!
Thanks for watching!
@@GingerBreadGroyper. Yes, that's true. The company I work for installed pex a about 15 years ago and it's still working pretty good. I have watched another videos with bad reviews about this type of pipe but, honestly I don't know if something is going on with their water or whit the installation itself.
@@PootsPastures did you use Uponor or Zurn?
I gave you 👍 but the Cordless PEX eXpansion Tool definitely is worth it both for ease of install & leak proofing your system.
Also, expand the pipes/ tubes 4-8 times after contact w/ the tool rim depending on the size of tubing(⅜"-1") & rotate w/ each expansion
A works with all types, expansion, sharkbite, crimp, etc.
Good video. Do you have to (is it code) always use color coded pipe for hot and cold? Can you just use white for it all?
After expanding the pipe with the expanding tool you have to be quick enough in attaching it or else it will not fit and you will have to do it again.
Yep it's a little stressful especially in tight spaces lol!
Your drain to the washer is not plumbed right, but it will work.
Trying to learn about PEX piping as we’re about to have our house re-piped at the main line where it meets the house supplying cold water to our first manifold inside the home. Have you had any issues with the PEX splitting longways or the joints splitting? Any leaking from the PEX fittings themselves ?
Rotate the expander tool head. It may damage your pet if you don’t.
No pets were harmed in this video
You made a mistake with using expander. Unless your expander has a rotating expansion fitting then you need to do it yourself. What I'm saying is that there is a flaw in the tool you have compared to the automatic Dewalt or Milwaukee. Look it up you will see what I'm talking about.
I know what you mean, but with the manual one it never goes in exactly the same way so you would get the same effect as the electric ones that automatically rotate. Also I'm not sure if there would be a real issue if it didn't rotate? I deffinately see that the force is being spread around more equally, but I don't necessarily see how only exerting the force in one spot would really matter as the pex itself can take the expansion without issue. And as an aside the test we ran on it was 120 psi for 30 minutes then 60 psi for an hour (what is required up here) and we didn't have any issues, but deffinately an interesting question.
Yeah I have seen other plumbers mentioned this and showed footage of what's happening in a close up. They say the chances increase on not rotating the manual tool since certain spots don't expand as much as others.
@@PootsPastures read the manual!!!
@@PootsPastures The main reason you rotate is because of the groves on the head.. it give's the inside rings inside that also help it bite down on the fitting.. you get less a leak when it is rotated...
Also.. on your last expansion you can hold longer if you need.. you can hold it as long as you want if you need to get it in a tight spot.. also you can put low heat to it
to help it close up on the fitting if you need to.. you can also heat it to fix a kink in it..
I watched this video to see how the manual expander performed. One other thing I noticed that it is difficult to use the manual expander when you are by yourself.
It definitely isn't easy, especially in tight spots.
Hi, thank you for the video. Does the expansion tool turn its head (spin) every time you clamp it (expand) or not? Your videos are inspirational !!
Some of the automatic tools I have seen do, but the manual tool does not. If you check out the video we are releasing this Saturday I go over that issue along with a couple other frequent comments we get. Glad they are inspiring you and thanks for watching!!
@@PootsPastures Will do! Thank you very much ✌️
@@RadioRich100 oh man! Well, I have not tried it. It is a good video for inspiration purposes. Thank you. How would be done correctly?
@@RadioRich100 I see what you are saying. It is clear that they are not professionals but DIYers and anyone watching their good and kind videos should keep that in mind. Maybe you can teach us all how to do it correctly. What is your channel?
@@RadioRich100 Thank you. As I said before, they are DIYers, and people should take things with a grain of salt. They are CZcamsrs and are only sharing their experience.
However, I do see your point and you are already making things better for all CZcamsrs and everyone watching.
So 3 years in how is everything? Because I've been seeing a lot of videos the past 6 months of there being hairline cracks under or just behind the expansion ring.
Can you show how you attached Pex to the shower manifold, toilets, sinks and washer ? I am about to take on a project on a 70 + year old home I have the 3 manifold knob in bathtub. Hot is Lt side knob, shower middle knob and Rt side knob is cold. I was thinking I could run 3/4 pex to a reducer (3/4-1/2) before going through wall to the plumbing fixture ? BTW Love your wife's shirt !
My wife says thanks lol! and We will cover the terminations in a video a little later, however I've been trying to figure out how to answer this so you don't have to wait so this is going to be a little long winded.
So the short of it is we used a standard universal shower manifold that was not made specifically for pex, but it was made to have threaded connections, not soldered connections, so we used an adapter that went from the correct thread size to 1/2" pex and it worked very well. As far as for the sinks, toilets and such they make the 1/4 turn valves that you usually find under sinks and for toilets, that will attach directly to the pex, so we will be using those, the only thing to think about with those are that if the stub outs are not concealed under a counter you will see the pex coming through the wall unless you get a little kit that has the silver trim. The washer was also pretty easy, you can get washer outlet boxes that are specifically made for pex so you don't have to use any weird adapters.
As for running 3/4 pex to the shower, what we did is just run 3/4 pex to the bathroom and then split off with a manifold (basically it has one 3/4" input and several 1/2" outputs for each fixture) and then ran 1/2" to each fixture. You shouldn't need more than 1/2" running to the tub shower or any other singular fixture for that matter (there are exceptions to this for sure).
basically it sounds like you have the right idea, you'll probably end up getting new shower hardware, I would just make sure it has threaded connectors so you don't have to solder. Also whenever we are doing a project like this we always end up laying it all out on the floor of the hardware store, and usually end up taking up most of the aisle, but it really helps.
I hope this helps, sorry it took so long for me to get back to you. Good luck with your project!!
Maybe call a plumber?
Great video, but one dangerous flaw. Opunor, the creator of Type A is absolutely adamant that you rotate the jaws 15-25% with every compression. Not doing this is the leading cause of drips and failures. If you ignore that requirement, the jaw causes grooves to form, thus providing chanel's for leaks and future failures. I had to redo my fittings as a result. I even called the company and spoke to the engineers.
That's one reason the expensive Milwaukee Tool is better, as they added a auto rotate function to the jaw. Hopefully you won't have any leaks. But you might consider adding to the video to stress this point. Great video otherwise.
Going on 2 years and no failures. That sucks that you had to re-do your plumbing.
Thanks for watching!
@@PootsPastures Fortunately, I only had a small number to redo. But this is included for the Apollo Tool you used, it's right in the instructions. So, I think it's reasonable that you include this information to assist your viewers. I'm sure you won't have any issues, but the engineers and product managers I spoke with, stressed that these failures don't happen right away, they happen slowly, as the grooves created but the jaws get deeper and the product ages.
So, I'm sure you will be ok, but it's important as an educational video to inform your public. According to Uponor the failures aren't generally catastrophic, the product is designed to limit those events, they reveal themselves as slow drips. I was happy to redo mine, as the walls were still open. I only screwed up on a dozen or so fittings. But, if there are fittings you can access, maybe a nice afternoon would be spent redoing them properly. At least that's what I would do, as would Uponor.
It was their exact recommendation. Repair any accessible ones, while accessible, and some that I had that led to the cold water lines, but were outside the walls, I did later. Heck, it took 15-minutes. Really wish one of my friends had the electric tool! So much easier and better cross hatching from the jaws.
You might also want to mention that the Apollo compression tool, has a list of recommended cycles for each size of pipe. 1/2-inch for example, is listed at 3-4 stretches, with the number increasing with the size of the pipe. I know most folks don't like to read the instructions, so I ended up taking a photo of the table with my phone, since I kept forgetting!
As I understand it, you CAN use crimp fittings on Pex A. But if you do, then why use Pex A whose great advantage is the expansion fittings (and flexibility).
The hardest part of videos like this is knowing it’s too late and your mistakes can’t be undone.
Glad you enjoyed it, make sure you Subscribe!
thanks for the share :D God Bless you guys
Thank you!
You didnt rotate the Expansion tool , it will leak , I would go back and redo those connections !!!
The system was tested in accordance with manufacturer, and passed. I've also addressed this before and the head of the tool doesn't stay in the exact same spot every time with the manual tool so the jaws don't open in the exact same spot every time.
Does your tool rotate? If it only expands the same location then there might be some gaps? It can pose some problems?? I’m just an observer. I never did any type of plumbing.
We've had no issues at this point I'm thinking that the rotating head is just to sell you a $300 tool...
I like your Join , or Die tattoo and T-shirt!
Thanks!
Awesome
Thanks!
So why do you need the ring if PEX A is always squeezing down on the fitting in the first place. Is it because the piping doesn't have a strong enough squeeze and you need an extra piece to make it stronger. Then why not just use another piece of expanded type of the same that you're using for the incoming water as a ring. You know just caught off of 1-inch piece expand it, then slip it over then expand the both. No need for the extra cost of expansion rings.
Well except for those stoppers on the rings. So I think I understand correctly. Cool. Answered my own question. By the way nice video. Age 65. 👍✌
Yep the stopper and I'm not sure if 1" would fit over the 3/4" properly. But the rings are the same material as the pipe so like you guessed my guess is the extra force helps. Thanks for watching!
Anyone know if all those dead legs will fail inspection? I thought dead legs couldn't be more than 3x the diameter of the pipe due to water sitting stagnant and breeding legionellae
way too many lines in exterior walls. i don't know where you are located but i hope it is south of the Mason Dixon line !
We are in northern AZ our lowest temp this winter was around -10, and we had about a week where we didn't get above freezing. That being said we haven't had any pipes freeze. We took the time to insulate behind the pipes, with high quality insulation.
We had a neighbor who hired a contractor to build their house and they had their pipes freeze which caused a whole bunch of call backs.
If your careful and take the time to insulate its not a problem.
it's amazing to me that those expansion joints actually hold without external crimping;
good for hot water too?
Great Video, what is the brand of the Pex-A tubing you used and did you buy those in the big stores like home depot or lowes?
We used Apollo pex and fittings, and yes we got it from home depot but only a few stores carry pex-a and expansion fittings.
Thanks for watching!
@@PootsPastures That was then, in late summer 2021 Lowe's finally started selling pex A, the Dewalt tool and most of the pex A accessories.
The home depot we got it from was one of the only ones in the state that kept it in stock. However they did have it all online to order when we started plumbing
Uponor is the gold standard for PEX-A. It's sold by plumbing supply stores, not Depot.
You deff need to brush up on the code for drilling those joists too. In our state you can't even drill the those. Not sure where you are but there was a hand full of reason this would fail inspection where i am at, but upc and Ipc change state to state.
The manufacturer of the joist specify where, and how big of a hole can be made in the joist. All the holes are well within the specifications provided by the manufacturer. I'm sorry your state doesn't understand that the engineers who engineet engineered lumber are actual engineers who are able to calculate and specify what holes are allowed in the joists. The bci joists actually have some perforated knock outs in the joist to make running wires and such easier.
@@PootsPastures its has nothing to do with manufacturer specs when it comes to plumbing. Its just part of the plumbing code and you most certainly can't hack it out like i saw at one point in the video. The max you can drill a I joist is 2 inches I believe. Which means all you can fit is 1.5 inch pvc. But again, different states allow different things. Like for instance where the washer discharge should be a tee not a wye, when you use a wye on a vertical drain the vent isn't working correctly, and it must be really close to being an s-trap. From the trap 90 to what is supposed to be a tee needs to be twice the diameter of the pipe.
You actually can install compression ring PEX-B fittings on PEX-A pipe.
This has been covered in other comments, it depends on the manufacturer
@@PootsPastures You can compress any PEX-A. However, expanding PEX-B is mfg dependent as only Zurn is recognized at this time.
Uponor will not warranty pex-a that is used with compression firings.
@@PootsPastures correct. But it will work.
Hi... Would you say using a curved 90 is better for end pressure, as opposed to a fitting 90?... Thanks...
Yes it's supposed to be better
yes 50% reduction in flow if a 90 deg fitting is used and if you double the size of a pipe, you increase the flow by 4x.
Your running and come to the wall that you have to touch/bump off of, compared to cutting the corner , in order to change your path.
So I'm going the manual way. My question is since you didn't rotate your tool or the tubes while expanding have you had any leaks or issues because of it? I can't go power tool so I just need to know if it makes much of a difference or is it just knit picking. Thanks
I've had absolutely no issues. Everyone makes such a big deal of it, and while I think ideally it is good practice to try and change the positions of of the jaws I really don't think it matters that much. I will say that we just re-did our water filters and changed to 1"pex. I rotated the tool the best I could. It isn't that much harder to rotate it every time. However the 1" pex was way harder to expand than the 3/4" if you have two people it's way easier. Hope this helps!
When working in the crawl space I noticed light coming in between sill and foundation. Hope you live in area that never freezes.
We hadn't sealed that yet when the video was recorded, but if you are curious about our freezing issues check out our most recent video.
Very inspiring guys. Question, is there a way to non-destructively undo a joint to correct a misalignment or worse, a leak?
Yes and no. The whole system is preassure tested at 120psi for 15 minutes, and then 60psi for 30 minutes so any leaks should be caught then and corrected. If somthing were to happen later (after drywall) you would not be able to access without testing or drywall.
There are a couple of exceptions to this. If your plumbing rings through an attic or crawlspace you would be able to access it all that way. Additionally if you had a few joints in one area you could put a small access door there (they sell these at home depot).
If you are really worried about having no joints in the walls you could use a manifold system. You could place the manifold on the wall in a utility room, etc, and then there would be no joints between the manifold and the fixture.
Hope that helps and thanks for watching!
What will you do if you have a leak in a tight spot in a finished area where you can put no expansion tool in?
Already experienced it?
at 11:55 saw daylight at top of foundation???? thanks for the vid!
Yeah we aren't completely done sealing the foundation in yet, when we foamed the space origionally we ran out of foam halfway through! Thanks for watching!
I can’t wait till electrical
Oh yeah! We've been working on that for a couple weeks and it feels so nice!
@Poots Pastures
What ever I have gathered from looking at videos and some websites, I thought Pex A was mostly the translucent white color pipe and Pex B was mostly blue and red? With the manual tool does the head rotate or do you need to rotate the tool? I am interested in investing on a tool for smaller jobs that dont require repiping, for repaires on customer work I want to leave job completed the best possible way since now everybody says to rotate the head when expanding pipe to have the best possible seal. What company brand did you use for your home?
Pex-A and B both come in white, red, and blue. We used Apollo pex because that's what we were able to get. All of the pex-a tubing and fittings are made to the same standards so I dont think the brand really matters that much, but Apollo and uponor are the two I know. And yes you have to rotate tool as the head does not rotate on it's own.
I hope that helps!!
@@PootsPastures
Thanks for the info.
Idk why you wouldnt spring for a battery powered expander.
Mainly because I like torturing myself and reading all of the comments about how the system will fail...
+should of used wider gliders
all that work to go with plastic fittings.. hope you never have issues with freezing as these plastic fittings pop easier then the brass fittings only time I consider the plastic fittings is temporary say if I needed to plug off a line to turn the water on
So our crawlspace is a conditioned crawlspace meaning that it should stay about the same temperature of the inside of our house so freezing will not be an issue. It's also standard use up here, even our plumbing supply store doesn't carry very many fittings in brass.
@@PootsPastures I guess up in Wisconsin it's not worth the gamble over the 50cents-1$ difference between the 2 to know that its once and done
In Wisconsin I wouldn't mess around with plastic at all, and if we didn't have the conditioned crawlspace we deffinately would have gone with brass everything
@Hank O nope I've replaced a good number of the plastic fittings as they freeze it's the weakest link
Watched several vids, good job and thanks for posting. What type is your expansion tool?
Thanks! And it was an Apollo expansion tool. It comes with 1/2, 3/4", and 1" expander heads.
Good install. But where can I buy the expanding tool for the pex? It seems I can find anything for PEX-B, but PEX A tools almost impossible to find😭
I found it at our local home depot, but you could get it on amazon, or any specialty plumbing store or website should have it.
The worst that you can do is to used PEX tubing for your interior water lines.
Nice. I’m actually doing some of this right now but I bought the Milwaukee expander tool. Did you use Uponor brand pex and what is the name or part you used to secure the pex to the wood for the bathroom sink lines?
I have heard really good things about the battery powered expanders. I did some 1" pex the other day with the manual expander and it was terrible. and they are 90 deg bend supports if that is what you mean.
Im a little confused i would think the white line which represents the main line would go only to the hot water heater and then switch to 1/2 hot and cold lines that would run throughout the house to all of ur faucets.
I think he might have a main hot and a main cold
Yes I've been meaning to answer this. The white pipe is 3/4" and the red and blue are 1/2", we didn't get red and blue 3/4" because we would have gotten two 50' rolls and we only needed one roll.
To answer the question one of the ways to set up the system is with a manifold system. Where you would have a main cold which would split off to your water heater. Then after the heater you have the 3/4" split to a bunch of 1/2" and each 1/2" line would go to it's own fixture. And the same thing with the cold it would also split and have 1/2 to each fixture.
What we did was use what is called a branch system, where you still branch off and go to the heater from the main cold line, the difference is after the heater you continue the 3/4 and branch off 1/2" lines whenever there is a fixture. Same with the cold it branches off before you enter the heater and 3/4 goes around and 1/2 runs branch off and go to each fixture. The reason we use 3/4 out of the heater and as the main trunk of the system is because if we have many different fixtures on at the same time the 3/4 can handle the extra flow in water where 1/2 could not handle the extra flow.
I know it got a little confusing because the 3/4 wasn't blue and red, but hopefully that makes sense.
4:27 looks like an S-trap there which are not used anymore.
This has been covered in our orbs plumbing video, thanks for watching!
NEVER USE crimping but use unponer or shaekbite or use elbox support
All our our fittings are expansion fittings and sharkbite and uponor are brands, not sure what you're getting at?
I don’t think those pex pipes are for those fittings ? Thought those only ment for snarky bites and crimp connection
So Pex-B uses crimp or clamp fittings and you could use shark bites as well. Pex-A is manufactured using a different process and you use expansion fittings with it. You could use shark bites as well, and some Pex-A allows you to use crimp. However on my opinion the expansion fittings are the way to go as you don't reduce the pipe size at every fitting like you do with crimp fittings. Matt Risinger with the build show has a great video about the different types of Pex. Hope this helped clear some stuff up, if you have any questions let me know!! Thanks for watching!
not understanding why you put manifolds there. I thought it was against code. they have to be accessible.
There's no difference between the type of manifold we used and a normal T fitting so I dont see why they would need to be accessible. If you have a large manifold where each fixture has their own home run as well as their own on off valve it would need to be exposed but ours don't have any valves. If you harken to know the specific section of code I would be interested in reading it, as I could be wrong in my thinking. But I will add that instead of doing a normal trunk branch type system we used the manifold at each bathroom to make running the lines easier, so essentially their are 2 main trunk lines that run opposite ways in the house and when they reach a bathroom they branch off into the manifold we have. Hippie that helps explain what we were thinking!
Amazing how everyone has to throw there 2 cents in on rotating expander. I'm sure they knew what they were doing
I apreciate it! The rotating expander head really does get people all bothered, but like I've said before the system was tested up to 120psi with no issues! Thanks for watching
The holes are too tight. leave enough room incase the pipe expands.
Do you have issues with rodents chewing through the Pex lines?
We don't have rodent issues, so I wouldn't know if they would chew through pex or not... but I've never heard of it.
pex rule #1; OVERSIZE, PERIOD. figure out what size of traditional pipe you'd use normally, go at least one size larger on the pex. for 1/2 normal pipe, use 3/4, etc. the fittings/junctions are flow restrictions. even with pex a, though pex a is not nearly as bad. if you need to reduce, do it as close to the end point as possible. avoid reducing if you can get away with it.
With pex B and C I agree, but one of the reasons that pex A is so nice is because the inside diameter of the pipe and the inside diameter of the fitting are the same size in the case of half inch .475". The fitting could cause a little more turbulence I guess but there is no need to increase pipe size.
Thanks for watching!
@@PootsPastures nono, even pro plumbers who pay attention will upsize with a. the way a is designed helps, but it does not eliminate the issue.
The size differences are within .07 of an inch. I've never heard of anyone upsizing pex A. May be common where you are but not where we are, or anywhere I've ever read or seen. It would get more water to the fixture though.
@@PootsPastures I was wondering that since the Pex A pipe has thicker walls than the M Copper pipe, wouldn't the same size Pex A pipe cause less water pressure? I have heard of people going up in size. I'm not sure what to do here in U.S.
@@kenabi this not true at all lol. 10 year master here. Not sure where you are getting this but its entirely inaccurate.
Funny how you dont think plumbers do not know about PEX they are the one buying the $400 expanding tools
Pex is easy and simple and cheaper However be aware the chemicles in the pex may leech out and hopefully, no one is drink tap water anyways but unless you have a superior water filter its something i would think about
Is pex safe to run threw an atic
Yep! You shouldn't have any issues
Depends where you live. Cold areas. No water lines on outside walls or an attic.
Your ring is what does the action of the shrinking your pex does not it’s a memory ring to constantly shrink onto the fitting
The ring (or sleeve) is made of the same material as the tubing, both the tubing and ring are trying to shrink back to the origional size, it's not only the ring trying to return to normal.
Thanks for watching
you are wrong, the pipe and ring work together to achieve their original dimension. (retired plumber/49 yrs)
Yes definitely, Your fittings are going to leak because you didn't rotate the expansion tool.
Covered in other comments, but nothing is leaking and everything passed test, also expansion tool does move around when using the manual expander tool as it never goes back in the exact same spot. Thanks for your concern.
OK I thought you were using the older tool that did not rotate.
I was too distracted by all the framing problems.
BTW, I thought I knew all about PEX A vs PEX B until I watched Integrity Repipe Company's video. He claims that Zurn PEX B is superior to PEX A. He says that Zurn PEX B has double the bursting strength and superior hot water resistance. He also claims that Zurn PEX B can use expansion fittings similar to PEX A. He says that cheap box store PEX B gives it a bad name.
Interesting, so as far as I know the a,b, and c denotes the manufacturing process, which in turn gives them the different characteristics. I looked it up and saw that they sold expansion and crimp/clamp fittings for it, my understanding was if you used pex a with clamp or crimp the pex would always be pushing against it and wanting to return to its original form which could give you a higher failure rate. And in turn if you used expansion fittings with b it would not want to return to its original format but would stay in it's expanded state... I definitely need to do some more research into it, but if it could do both with manufacturers warranty that would be cool.
Thanks for watching and letting me (and everyone else) know about this it looks pretty cool!!
@@PootsPastures I did further research and it now seems that the advantage that Uponor enjoys over Zurn PEX B is that if Uponor A kinks you can mend with heat gun and that PEX A is more flexible. czcams.com/video/tJI-E6y2DuU/video.html I suspect that Zurn PEX B uses expansion ring adaptors made of PEX A. This would be a good test review for a "Project Farm Review".
@@IggyDalrymple that repipe guy also claims that copper stub outs will fail within 8 years, which sounds like BS to me.
I called Uponor about the difference of using a plastic vs. a bronze 90 fitting , because I'd read different comments on it. They told me that there was no difference. The only advantage that metal has, it that it can hold it's form in extremely high temperatures, but that it was irrelevant since that condition would far exceed the design parameters for the pipe, so the pipe would fail before either fitting would. And he said, it's cheaper, but meet the exact same specs. That's assuming you purchase Uponor branded pipe, fittings, and compression sleeves. Uponor was more expensive than the Apollo at Home Depot, around 20 percent mow when I checked last month.
I work with architects and high level plumbers, and they told me two things. A) Don't buy anything from Home Depot if you can avoid it, the products look the same, but they hammer the manufacturers on price so severely, that everything from toilets to water heaters have cheaper components, castings, and more. So, go to a plumbing supply house. B) They all said use Uponor, so I used Uponor. Not a snob, but when the guys I work with who have million dollar jobs, I assume they want to limit their liability by buying the best. Plus my local supply only stocked Uponor, so... not much of a choice! Oh, the other reasons plumbers like Type-A, is that it can bend to tighter corners then Type-B. Type-C, which isn't still that popular, was an attempt to make a more flexible (like Type A) hose than Type-B. So, it's kinda of an improvement or hybrid. I've not used it, but it does seem to bend easier.
One serious reason for Type A vs Type B, is the water flow to the exterior compression vs interior. The fittings on Type A provide significantly less restrictions, and turbidity vs Type B. Think of copper as the standard, a fitting on copper is exterior, thus has no impact on water flow rates, unless you a sloppy nitwit who doesn't deburr the inside of the pipe before soldering. The minute you stick a fitting to the interior of a pipe, it impacts flow rate. The cool thing about the Type A design is that they fittings are the same size of the interior of the pipe, you are stretching the exterior of the pipe around the outside of the fittings, so the interior diameter never changes. This might not impact you on short runs, or runs with no fittings, but if you need several fittings it can impact your flow and pressure.
I found charts that help to determine this, so that you can calculate flow and increase pipe size if pressure levels are critical. I used to design labs that had equipment with stated water pressure needs, and we had a situation where a contractor tried to skim some money, by using a thinner copper pipe for long and hidden runs. When our processors had problems due to insufficient water supply, we had to cut holes in the drywall to find the pipes, and then billed the contractor for the cost of repair and replace. For the average home this isn't an issue, but it's absolutely an issue with commercial projects. However, for showers, water pressure matters, so minimizing fittings on PEX B is an important consideration. Just saying...
Better ain't cheaper and cheaper ain't better. Not a big fan of any of this plastic piping. this is just another product invented for the developer for nothig other than to lower the cost of materials, cut out the professional tradesman and increase profits...........not do it better. Only a fool chooses pex over copper. Sincerely, a Licensed Plumbing Contractor.
Says the person who watches a video on how to install it...
@@PootsPastures And that video would be all of 30 seconds............nice try.
As someone who just spent two years dealing with failed copper slab leaks, and talking to copper engineers, the failure rate of copper is actually higher then PEX-A, especially around joints. The issue with PEX failure, is either not following the directions, such as the need to rotate the jaws 15-20 % with each expansion, or with fittings. Here in So. California there is an epidemic of slab leaks, all from copper. Evidently the chemicals used to purify water, cause corrosion at joints, as as corrosion increases, so does turbidity, and the cycle just repeats itself till failure. While PEX might be faster and cheaper, I don't think that it's the reason to use it. It has lots of other reasons, one primary is the ability expand with freezing temps that cause copper to fail. I've been sweat soldering since I was 7, and love it. But I'm really loving PEX-A. And no risk of fire!
@@harrisfogel6992 Copper's been around since the 70's, so it's had quite a longer trail period to fail than Pex piping. Copper also suffers from the "not following directions" deal. Why developers decided to bury copper lines under slabs is a mystery to those with common sense, especially when it was red (soft) copper. This (like your PEX tubing) was done to maximize profits, not because it was the better way to do it. These fools out here in Southern California also buried galvy, and the cheap materials from China that weren't sufficiently coated with Zinc. Santa Clarita, Valencia, Newhall - is loaded with these slab leak issues however this has more to do with how it was done rather than the copper itself. The only time copper fails is when the water pressure is not regulated. It will create pin holes in the piping, even the fittings. But this is very rare. The price of copper and the finances to hire tradesmen to install it (and the insurance / workers comp) is the only reason you'd choose PEX over copper. It's kinda like how they went to ABS plastic piping for drains - those Union pipe cutters wreaked havoc on a builders budget. Even when Building and Safety said you had to use cast iron for drains in commercial - BAM, the No-Hub all but ended the pipe cutters run. Like I said, "Better ain't Cheaper and Cheaper ain't Better". It's your house, your license.............
Billy Sims, I agree with you. Personally I found it difficult to transition from lead solder to non-lead, I wasn't heating it properly, generally too much heat, etc. I recently found some 50 year old copper I stashed, and I swear it's different then current copper. I soldered tests, and it just seemed better. I've a pal who's a metallurgist, who told me that current materials benefit from better Q&A, due to more sophisticated sensors, etc. However he also admitted that the Chinese metals, often don't use that tech, and that test results might be fake. He avoids Chinese steel for that very reason. But the guys who taught me, haven't been replaced by as many similar masters, at least not in my experience. There are lots of really talented folks, but because the breakdown of the apprentice system, and union system with it's mentorships, I think you have to search for those masters now.
Are you a plumber ?
I am not a plumber
He needs a disclaimer stating that he is not a plumber. A bunch of the info he provides in not accurate.
I have never claimed to be a contractor, or plumber, and the video even had DIY in the title so that should be a hint. If you have information that is better you may want to share it so you could help somone else out instead of just saying I'm wrong. Thanks for watching.
Also found where you said I was wrong about the pex in a different comment, I have a call in to the manufacture to clarify as all of the information I have ever seen has been to what I said in the video, it will be interesting to see what the manufacturer says...
Thank you. You and the wife are do an amazing job.
I appreciate it!! Thank you for watching!,