Very good explanation of the golf ball/ golf course dilemma. Has anyone researched how much Jay Monahan has received under the table in his “negotiations”? Someone should write an expose.
Appreciate the point of view fellas, you both have seen it all...The tour pro's old & current should have a bigger say in the rules of the game. The older courses don't want to be embarrassed - when DJ shot -20 beyond at Augusta = bruised ego's. Conservatism will forever limit the game and false narratives will follow.
Some of it is not liking the scores. But I think the bigger issue is that courses becomes driver-sand wedge for the par 4s and driver-8 iron for par 5s. That really eliminates a lot of the nuance in the game. That 1-iron that Hogan hit at Merion? That's a lob wedge for a big hitter now. Augusta may have enough money to expand the course to keep the whole bag in play, but you end up losing any real challenge for most classic courses with Tour players and new courses become resource hogs for land and water.
@@jimiverson3085 The big peoblem is making the courses hard and fast and having the ball roll out another 20-60 yards AFTER they fly it 300. If the PGA would set up a very wet and slow course you would see different scores and the ball would hit and only go a yard or 2. Narrow the fairways too. put bunkers on inside doglegs they cant fly over . Make the courses they have harder and more strategic, The first cut of rough is what jack and arnold played as fairways back in the day , instead of these very short manicured grass where the balls just roll. Many other ways to make the courses play longer , bu they wont do that !
The problem with bifurcation was that the manufacturers wailed like banshees when it was proposed - by the "crusty" USGA and R&A. That level of complaint has been followed by lawsuits in the past, which has cost the sanctioning bodies a LOT of money. The specs in the rollback do seem like they are trying to handicap the higher speed swingers a good bit more. But if you could hit on a workable bifurcation rule, that would be the better solution.
Great discussion gentlemen. Bifurcationnis also a problem because it would force Amateur players to be subject to one ball at one tournament and another at another tournament based on which group decided to adhere to rule a. And which decided to adhere to rule b. As far as distance goes, several designers and pros have addressed that the "distance problem" can be addressed by strategic placement of hazards, narrowing of fairways, lengthening of rough and basic design. Funny how the details of the money and motivations get hidden amongst the doublespeak and strawman argument points. It is also ironic that the hidden battle of the almighty $ seems to ignore the consequences of the various entities vying for their on place over working together, e.g. your point that the manufacturers will have a hard time selling a shorter playing ball, therefore have less motivation for big $ endorsements; I am sure theybwill just continue with "ours is longer than theirs", but it will all be relative to the new standards. ABSOLUTELY a GREAT point on the new test criteria not matching existing conditions. When I heard the 11 degree launch angle I wondered where they got that figure. I'd never seen any number at 11, more like 13 degrees for high swing speed. Anyway, great discussion.
All they have to do is trick up the golf courses by increasing rough height beyond say 300 yards and narrow the fairway at those landing distances also and the big hitters are gonna start hitting 3 woods… this is the simplest and cheapest way of controlling distance at the elite level
Also, if they are worried about pros attacking par just change par for tour players. A par 72 becomes a par 70-68. No par fives just holes 550 yards or shorter.
The average golfer doesn’t play with the same equipment as a pro. We don’t have money for custom fitted equipment and new wedges every month and lessons from elite teaching pros and not to mention perfect fairways, greens, and bunkers.
There is a solution that would meet everyone's needs that is to develop a golf ball that only goes 10% further for a golfer with a 120 mph club head speed than that of a golfer with only a 90 mph club head speed. Reduce the advantage that the stronger golfer has in terms of distance.
The USGA tried that at Winged Foot. Didn't work. What is more likely to trip up the bombers is a course that plays hard and fast - then they aren't sure where the ball will end up if there is any curve on it. But they play the game outdoors and it rains..... They really need to restrict distance for the top pros. But the manufacturers scream bloody murder about any proposal that involves elite competitions using equipment explicitly different from what is available in the consumer market. Which leaves aside the question of whether Tour equipment is more custom than the golf companies admit.
I was saying 30 years ago when the Driver heads got to 330cc the USGA and R&A needed to STOP the Driver head size there as I was seeing the writing on the wall way back then, BUT NO, it was so cool watching all these PROS just blast the shit to of the ball. Well we are there now , and we want to roll the ball back instead of rolling the head size back !!!! But what do I know ???? Only been playing the game for 48 years , I am just as long now at 63 as I was 30 years ago, only because TECHNOLOGY has gone way over board with EQUIPMENT ! The PGA & Jay has turned golf into the biggest Cluster F**K ever instead of trying to GROW the game they are destroying the game !!! I like LIV myself as I all about quit watching the PGA as it became STALE only seeing the 4-5 guys in the lead for 4 hours on TV ! And they are slow as hell too!
Agree 100%….been playing 50+ years, the Driver clubhead size should be rolled back for the Pros & paid college players. Restrict to 3d00-350cc, control MOI, and then let them play.
Nicklaus was saying it in the 70s - not with driver but the ball - it has always been the ball. If you played golf in the 70s - (i can't speak of the 60s I was too young) but the ball today compared to then is not even the same game it makes that much of a difference. good players hit drivers 225 -230 - really long hitters hit it 250. All iron lofts were higher than they are now - as in - a 7 iron today has the loft of a 5 iron maybe closer to a 4 iron now.
@@pjpredhomme7699 Jack was hitting the ball back then 300 yards with the shit balls and wood clubs. You truly don't think its been the equipment that these guys are hitting the ball 350? Go watch these guys hit a persimmon wood with today's balls, they lose 40-50 yards. I have been playing golf for 49 years now and the equipment is the biggest gains I see, I bet a Titleist Balata ball wouldn't be very far behind the new one today, as these guys are fit as hell and have fast swing speeds. saying lofts is pure bullshit no matter the stupid number on the bottom of club, that's just manufactures HYPE crap!!! I have played the same golf courses for the past 40 years and am hitting the ball to the exact same places I was 40 years ago, I may not have the same swing speed it's down about 5-10 mph but I am still hitting the same lofted irons into the greens as I don't go for the HYPE of an 8 I am hitting further than my 6 of years ago, it's still a 6 iron no matter what to me.
Hey Guys,,,great as always,,,,what I wasn't privy to was the PIP money dished out to the top players...and these are the same players that dissed LIV....GFY.... and why has Tiger and Rory attempt to start a new golf team arrangement...following LIV....pathetic
To make golf more difficult without turning the ball back remove all sand bunkers and replace them with wild unkept grasses. No up and downs when missing the greens or long iron shots into greens. Scores on tour will collapse.
The golf ball is like everything else. If there is a market they will be produced illegal or not. Most amateurs will just start buying illegal balls which will be plentiful.
The tour events don't grow the rough high enough, when ever there is high rough the top players disappear. If there's no premium for hitting fairways they are going to blow it all over the place and have wedges into everything
Bifurcation makes things extremely difficult for people trying to work their ways towards becoming a pro or even a college player. Do the college teams use the slower ball or the faster vall? If they earn their way into playing in a pro tournament by winning the U.S. Amateur or the NCAA Championship what happens when they suddenly have to play a different ball in th pro tournament? It puts them at a tremendous disadvantage. By the way, I wonder how much money some of the older courses are paying the USGA to shorten hitting distances. It stinks.
I gather you do not recognize that he has nothing to do with rules of golf - zero - none nadda - its fine if you want him to be fired but it has no relevance to this topic
Bifurcation has already happened - the USGA bifurcated itself from the average player ages ago. The long putter could have been eliminated by simply restricting the length of the putter shaft, but no, they decided to tell golfers how they could hold their club. Really? Oh, and that you have to stand to one side, no croquet stances - that one goes all the way back to Sam Snead! The problem they had with the distance of drives was that they couldn't figure out how to hamstring the golfer to limit swing speed so they had to choose between the ball and the club. Guess which spends more on advertising - ball makers or equipment makers.
Golf is a game against par, if the best shoot way under:par who cares, no bifurcation no ball roll back, it's just par and the best will still win. It's a ridiculous argument. 100 yard sprinters are always getting faster
This is about the powers-that-be in golf wanting to protect their hoity-toity "name" courses, that are threatened with being made obsolete for major championships, only because these same people keep insisting that winning of scores of majors should be closer to par than 15 under.
1 amateurs will hardly notice a difference. They really needed to roll back more and most ams still would not notice. Bifurcation is a terrible idea for golf. For a million reasons. I do play with some big boys what are not that good that reduce courses or certain holes to nothing. Thousands of courses want to build back tees but can’t and in fact are having to sell land to developers. So many pga tour events and other other events the announcers mention the course was renovated and numerous tees added. Maybe not thousands but only because they cannot afford it or have the space. There’s a lot to talk about with the roll back but at the end of the day regular people have hardly gained any distance since circa 2K but the longest pros are clearly going way way farther. The ball is flying too far for elite speed players regardless of scores and anything else. It’s just clearly flying too far. Balls fly 50 yards past fairway bunkers. So it’s really a simple solution considering a roll back will limit the longest hitters while not really affecting shorter hitters. Everyone will hit it a bit further in 2030 just not as far as they would have. Regular people will hit it about the same, which has been the same old story for decades regardless of the golf marketing promises. Imo the rules makers making small adjustments should not even be news. It’s just them doing their job. I get there’s reasons not to trust leadership in golf these days but I really think these boys found a good balance for now, but they will have to address distance with driver more in the future. No matter how much they roll back I’m really not worried for short hitters losing distance. They simply don’t compress enough to get the spring and aerodynamic advantages of newer clubs. We really need to stop scaring the world of golf about this.
This roll back is needed. I play Gutta Perch balls with my same long Nose driver at 90mph Gutta ball goes 150 in air and a ProV goes 190 - 40 yards. Balls from Gary's pro days the Balata 100 goes about 15 yards shorter than todays balls - so the roll back is only going to impact the Pros as with Gary's 93 mph it might impact 5 yards for the 84 mph a couple yards - who cares hit the ball better. But we need to do something as it has to be reeled in and only people that work for ball companies really care - which you both do. Why do the courses have to change - keep it on a level field like baseball did. BTW the reason they took away metal bats is to keep it the same and it would have ultimately killed players due to the ball speed coming off some of those bats. .83 CORE also needs to be enforced more. Agree with your confidence in the PGA Tour. BTW the balls are even more out of wack at higher speeds and the ball companies know how to manage this which really only helps the high speed golfers - but your not reporting this and it is a no no in this industry. These are facts - I know this because I'm in the industry and I know this.
I suspect that changing the spin rate used for distance testing was an acknowledgement that the issue is more complex that just speed. Once you hit a high enough swing/ball speed, a lower spin launch means more distance and higher spin means distance lost because some of the "out" becomes "up." Whereas, for those of us in the unwashed masses, a bit more spin translates into more carry because we don't hit the ball hard enough for a low-flight launch to go very far.
DOD Driver off the Deck. Eliminate the golf tee on tour. LIV should refuse ball roll back and encourage more distance on modern courses that would love the exposure.
Rolling back the ball. They don't change the ball in major league baseball, football or basketball. Only in golf. Because the retail game is based on selling distance. Hot balls are killing courses like Merion and Augusta National. And TV viewers like me will stop watching tournaments featuring driver)wedge par fours.
Manufacturers, PGA, and every organization in golf should sue the USGA and the R&A into giving this stupidity up, stop your membership to USGA and send in complaints. They have done so much craziness in the last few years and they will come for the drivers and other clubs as well stop them now!
On the ball issue - I think you guys failed to discuss the fact that it's driver and pitch all day long. We the paying public and don't want to watch this tour mundane golf (5 wedges!!) We like Augusta because watching 2nd shots at 10 and 11 - real golf, so give us the game back. On an aside from 100 yards in I'd bet the top 5 ladies v guys.
U 2 need 2 take charge of the golfing world! Y all have made more sense in 30 minutes than everyone else has the past month or so!
WHY are these legends not on TV anymore?
CBS production decided they had gotten too old - and decided to give us Trevor Immelman instead - the human equivalent of watching paint dry.
This was great to watch and I didn’t want it to end. Great job ❤🎉❤🎉
Great segment! Great points delivered with expertise and respectfulness! Put Gary and Peter back on televised tour events!
thank you for you comments!
@@kostismccord You’re very welcome, sirs!
Very good explanation of the golf ball/ golf course dilemma. Has anyone researched how much Jay Monahan has received under the table in his “negotiations”? Someone should write an expose.
Great Show Guys. You seem to hit the nail on the head every time.
Appreciate the point of view fellas, you both have seen it all...The tour pro's old & current should have a bigger say in the rules of the game. The older courses don't want to be embarrassed - when DJ shot -20 beyond at Augusta = bruised ego's. Conservatism will forever limit the game and false narratives will follow.
Some of it is not liking the scores. But I think the bigger issue is that courses becomes driver-sand wedge for the par 4s and driver-8 iron for par 5s. That really eliminates a lot of the nuance in the game. That 1-iron that Hogan hit at Merion? That's a lob wedge for a big hitter now. Augusta may have enough money to expand the course to keep the whole bag in play, but you end up losing any real challenge for most classic courses with Tour players and new courses become resource hogs for land and water.
@@jimiverson3085 The big peoblem is making the courses hard and fast and having the ball roll out another 20-60 yards AFTER they fly it 300. If the PGA would set up a very wet and slow course you would see different scores and the ball would hit and only go a yard or 2. Narrow the fairways too. put bunkers on inside doglegs they cant fly over . Make the courses they have harder and more strategic, The first cut of rough is what jack and arnold played as fairways back in the day , instead of these very short manicured grass where the balls just roll. Many other ways to make the courses play longer , bu they wont do that !
Good episode gents
The problem with bifurcation was that the manufacturers wailed like banshees when it was proposed - by the "crusty" USGA and R&A. That level of complaint has been followed by lawsuits in the past, which has cost the sanctioning bodies a LOT of money. The specs in the rollback do seem like they are trying to handicap the higher speed swingers a good bit more. But if you could hit on a workable bifurcation rule, that would be the better solution.
The problem going forward is tour pros hitting drive - 8 iron on par 5 and driver-wedge every par 4...
Pin positions has entered the chat concerning pros.
Great discussion gentlemen. Bifurcationnis also a problem because it would force Amateur players to be subject to one ball at one tournament and another at another tournament based on which group decided to adhere to rule a. And which decided to adhere to rule b.
As far as distance goes, several designers and pros have addressed that the "distance problem" can be addressed by strategic placement of hazards, narrowing of fairways, lengthening of rough and basic design.
Funny how the details of the money and motivations get hidden amongst the doublespeak and strawman argument points. It is also ironic that the hidden battle of the almighty $ seems to ignore the consequences of the various entities vying for their on place over working together, e.g. your point that the manufacturers will have a hard time selling a shorter playing ball, therefore have less motivation for big $ endorsements; I am sure theybwill just continue with "ours is longer than theirs", but it will all be relative to the new standards. ABSOLUTELY a GREAT point on the new test criteria not matching existing conditions. When I heard the 11 degree launch angle I wondered where they got that figure. I'd never seen any number at 11, more like 13 degrees for high swing speed. Anyway, great discussion.
All they have to do is trick up the golf courses by increasing rough height beyond say 300 yards and narrow the fairway at those landing distances also and the big hitters are gonna start hitting 3 woods… this is the simplest and cheapest way of controlling distance at the elite level
When watching Augusta, I prefer seeing the 2nd shot at hole 2 on Sunday...eagle waiting to happen after 2 or 3 great shots.
Watch accordingly.
180cc v 450cc so now can swing 100% at the ball.....in the old days an off center hit with a wooden driver was a disaster
Also, if they are worried about pros attacking par just change par for tour players. A par 72 becomes a par 70-68. No par fives just holes 550 yards or shorter.
I have a friend who bought the LAB putter and it shaved many shots off his score, unfortunately for me, if you are struggling get a LAB putter
Your videos are amazing. I really like it. I am a new subscriber to your channel. Can I talk with you Kostis?
The average golfer doesn’t play with the same equipment as a pro. We don’t have money for custom fitted equipment and new wedges every month and lessons from elite teaching pros and not to mention perfect fairways, greens, and bunkers.
There is a solution that would meet everyone's needs that is to develop a golf ball that only goes 10% further for a golfer with a 120 mph club head speed than that of a golfer with only a 90 mph club head speed. Reduce the advantage that the stronger golfer has in terms of distance.
Wish you would go on for hours and hours Peter
Courses just have to add well placed traps and ake rough a bit harder at 300+ yards...easy as pie
The USGA tried that at Winged Foot. Didn't work. What is more likely to trip up the bombers is a course that plays hard and fast - then they aren't sure where the ball will end up if there is any curve on it. But they play the game outdoors and it rains.....
They really need to restrict distance for the top pros. But the manufacturers scream bloody murder about any proposal that involves elite competitions using equipment explicitly different from what is available in the consumer market. Which leaves aside the question of whether Tour equipment is more custom than the golf companies admit.
You can't roll back technology, and I'm sure manufacturers won't stand for that...they will have to make other plans@@jimiverson3085
I was saying 30 years ago when the Driver heads got to 330cc the USGA and R&A needed to STOP the Driver head size there as I was seeing the writing on the wall way back then, BUT NO, it was so cool watching all these PROS just blast the shit to of the ball.
Well we are there now , and we want to roll the ball back instead of rolling the head size back !!!! But what do I know ????
Only been playing the game for 48 years , I am just as long now at 63 as I was 30 years ago, only because TECHNOLOGY has gone way over board with EQUIPMENT !
The PGA & Jay has turned golf into the biggest Cluster F**K ever instead of trying to GROW the game they are destroying the game !!!
I like LIV myself as I all about quit watching the PGA as it became STALE only seeing the 4-5 guys in the lead for 4 hours on TV !
And they are slow as hell too!
Agree 100%….been playing 50+ years, the Driver clubhead size should be rolled back for the Pros & paid college players. Restrict to 3d00-350cc, control MOI, and then let them play.
Nicklaus was saying it in the 70s - not with driver but the ball - it has always been the ball. If you played golf in the 70s - (i can't speak of the 60s I was too young) but the ball today compared to then is not even the same game it makes that much of a difference. good players hit drivers 225 -230 - really long hitters hit it 250. All iron lofts were higher than they are now - as in - a 7 iron today has the loft of a 5 iron maybe closer to a 4 iron now.
@@paulbedder889 MOI has little effect on distance
@@pjpredhomme7699 Jack was hitting the ball back then 300 yards with the shit balls and wood clubs. You truly don't think its been the equipment that these guys are hitting the ball 350? Go watch these guys hit a persimmon wood with today's balls, they lose 40-50 yards. I have been playing golf for 49 years now and the equipment is the biggest gains I see, I bet a Titleist Balata ball wouldn't be very far behind the new one today, as these guys are fit as hell and have fast swing speeds. saying lofts is pure bullshit no matter the stupid number on the bottom of club, that's just manufactures HYPE crap!!! I have played the same golf courses for the past 40 years and am hitting the ball to the exact same places I was 40 years ago, I may not have the same swing speed it's down about 5-10 mph but I am still hitting the same lofted irons into the greens as I don't go for the HYPE of an 8 I am hitting further than my 6 of years ago, it's still a 6 iron no matter what to me.
Hey Guys,,,great as always,,,,what I wasn't privy to was the PIP money dished out to the top players...and these are the same players that dissed LIV....GFY.... and why has Tiger and Rory attempt to start a new golf team arrangement...following LIV....pathetic
I like the drill but it causes me to hit push fades.
Can’t the manufacturers just say we aren’t gonna make the ball?
Pay $700 for a driver that’s moves the ball at a shorter distance? I don’t think so!
ST Andrews is already done....the last Open C;ship there had to use ridiculous pin positions so the winning score wasn't 30 under.
To make golf more difficult without turning the ball back remove all sand bunkers and replace them with wild unkept grasses. No up and downs when missing the greens or long iron shots into greens. Scores on tour will collapse.
The golf ball is like everything else. If there is a market they will be produced illegal or not. Most amateurs will just start buying illegal balls which will be plentiful.
The tour events don't grow the rough high enough, when ever there is high rough the top players disappear. If there's no premium for hitting fairways they are going to blow it all over the place and have wedges into everything
These guys are too good to have that first two minutes in this video. Come on. . .
Driver face must be reduced to say 300cc
Bifurcation makes things extremely difficult for people trying to work their ways towards becoming a pro or even a college player. Do the college teams use the slower ball or the faster vall? If they earn their way into playing in a pro tournament by winning the U.S. Amateur or the NCAA Championship what happens when they suddenly have to play a different ball in th pro tournament? It puts them at a tremendous disadvantage. By the way, I wonder how much money some of the older courses are paying the USGA to shorten hitting distances. It stinks.
#1 Fire Jay Monahan now!
I gather you do not recognize that he has nothing to do with rules of golf - zero - none nadda - its fine if you want him to be fired but it has no relevance to this topic
They never should have hired Jay. He cares nothing about players not in the top twenty and him making 18 million a year should be a crime 🤔 I think 😜
Tim finchem didn’t give a crap about the players either ! Been that way since dean beaman retired.
@@kevinvonderscher3971yea. And didn’t beaman kinda get pushed out ?
Bifurcation is the obvious solution
Bifurcation has already happened - the USGA bifurcated itself from the average player ages ago. The long putter could have been eliminated by simply restricting the length of the putter shaft, but no, they decided to tell golfers how they could hold their club. Really? Oh, and that you have to stand to one side, no croquet stances - that one goes all the way back to Sam Snead! The problem they had with the distance of drives was that they couldn't figure out how to hamstring the golfer to limit swing speed so they had to choose between the ball and the club. Guess which spends more on advertising - ball makers or equipment makers.
I have enough golf balls to last well past 2030! Wonder if golfers will start buying up all the balls before then? Lol!
Whenever a baseball player goes pro, they go back to wood bats
Golf is a game against par, if the best shoot way under:par who cares, no bifurcation no ball roll back, it's just par and the best will still win. It's a ridiculous argument. 100 yard sprinters are always getting faster
This is about the powers-that-be in golf wanting to protect their hoity-toity "name" courses, that are threatened with being made obsolete for major championships, only because these same people keep insisting that winning of scores of majors should be closer to par than 15 under.
1 amateurs will hardly notice a difference.
They really needed to roll back more and most ams still would not notice.
Bifurcation is a terrible idea for golf. For a million reasons.
I do play with some big boys what are not that good that reduce courses or certain holes to nothing.
Thousands of courses want to build back tees but can’t and in fact are having to sell land to developers.
So many pga tour events and other other events the announcers mention the course was renovated and numerous tees added. Maybe not thousands but only because they cannot afford it or have the space.
There’s a lot to talk about with the roll back but at the end of the day regular people have hardly gained any distance since circa 2K but the longest pros are clearly going way way farther. The ball is flying too far for elite speed players regardless of scores and anything else. It’s just clearly flying too far. Balls fly 50 yards past fairway bunkers. So it’s really a simple solution considering a roll back will limit the longest hitters while not really affecting shorter hitters.
Everyone will hit it a bit further in 2030 just not as far as they would have. Regular people will hit it about the same, which has been the same old story for decades regardless of the golf marketing promises.
Imo the rules makers making small adjustments should not even be news. It’s just them doing their job. I get there’s reasons not to trust leadership in golf these days but I really think these boys found a good balance for now, but they will have to address distance with driver more in the future.
No matter how much they roll back I’m really not worried for short hitters losing distance. They simply don’t compress enough to get the spring and aerodynamic advantages of newer clubs.
We really need to stop scaring the world of golf about this.
Tell the “Pros” during tournament play they can’t use driver. Problem solved?
Jack was/is right.....
GOOD LOOK HITTING YOUR 7 IRON 120, GOOD OLD JACK SHOUTING HIS MOUTH OFF EH.
What about the scores? All this tech talk…scoring should be down in low 60’s…rite?
This roll back is needed. I play Gutta Perch balls with my same long Nose driver at 90mph Gutta ball goes 150 in air and a ProV goes 190 - 40 yards. Balls from Gary's pro days the Balata 100 goes about 15 yards shorter than todays balls - so the roll back is only going to impact the Pros as with Gary's 93 mph it might impact 5 yards for the 84 mph a couple yards - who cares hit the ball better. But we need to do something as it has to be reeled in and only people that work for ball companies really care - which you both do. Why do the courses have to change - keep it on a level field like baseball did. BTW the reason they took away metal bats is to keep it the same and it would have ultimately killed players due to the ball speed coming off some of those bats. .83 CORE also needs to be enforced more. Agree with your confidence in the PGA Tour. BTW the balls are even more out of wack at higher speeds and the ball companies know how to manage this which really only helps the high speed golfers - but your not reporting this and it is a no no in this industry. These are facts - I know this because I'm in the industry and I know this.
The extra distance this century is 95% due to ball technology gains
I suspect that changing the spin rate used for distance testing was an acknowledgement that the issue is more complex that just speed. Once you hit a high enough swing/ball speed, a lower spin launch means more distance and higher spin means distance lost because some of the "out" becomes "up." Whereas, for those of us in the unwashed masses, a bit more spin translates into more carry because we don't hit the ball hard enough for a low-flight launch to go very far.
so you want to hit it shorter? its bull crap, the ball rollback for amateurs is an absolute joke.
not for amateurs
DOD Driver off the Deck. Eliminate the golf tee on tour. LIV should refuse ball roll back and encourage more distance on modern courses that would love the exposure.
Rolling back the ball. They don't change the ball in major league baseball, football or basketball. Only in golf. Because the retail game is based on selling distance. Hot balls are killing courses like Merion and Augusta National. And TV viewers like me will stop watching tournaments featuring driver)wedge par fours.
Too many Americans rule the game....
Manufacturers, PGA, and every organization in golf should sue the USGA and the R&A into giving this stupidity up, stop your membership to USGA and send in complaints. They have done so much craziness in the last few years and they will come for the drivers and other clubs as well stop them now!
On the ball issue - I think you guys failed to discuss the fact that it's driver and pitch all day long. We the paying public and don't want to watch this tour mundane golf (5 wedges!!) We like Augusta because watching 2nd shots at 10 and 11 - real golf, so give us the game back. On an aside from 100 yards in I'd bet the top 5 ladies v guys.
Jay in any other industry would have been sacked a year ago, effing useless.