Brodie - thank you for the great job you did on producing these microphone and signal chain videos. very interesting to see and understand what goes into a great home studio like yours!
Although it has been a few decades since I ran a recording studio my three go to microphones for vocals were the U87, the RE20 and the AKG414. Some sessions I would set up all three and have the vocalist run down parts of the song on each one. That way I picked the best microphone for their voice before touching the EQ.
@@DoartYT there has been a black re320 for a while which has a different sound and lower price point. The black version of the re20 is quite recent and has the exact same sound as the grey re20…
I could not agree with you more. I have used so many broadcast mics, from all the big players in my career and every time I felt something was missing in my audio, and kept trying other mics.. Then I met the RE20 and shortly afterwards, the TLM103, from that moment, I knew I had found my two "endgame" mics. (sadly the U87 is off limits to me, as i have a mortgage!) - There are a couple of others i use for specialist purposes, (ENG and Lav mics etc) but on air, in the home studio, these are my go-to's, no if's no buts! Thanks for making an honest, impartial review. :-) Martin
I got so excited about this video!!! I’ve been using the ev re20 for 7 years now and keep wondering if I need to add (add, not replace!) a large diaphragm condenser mic (the one I have now is the rode nt2a which is NOT my endgame, just the first mic I ever bought 15 years ago)
Nice review. I also have both microphones and they are both quite fine. I should note that if you have a good preamp, you do not need a fethead. For example, an Audient audio interface !d44 or an Audient 4816SE console or a Neumann V402, or an Avalon Design 737 or V55.
Very cool video, Brodie. I'm an A's fan and frequent viewer of your channel, and have always been impressed with your voice and audio quality. I recently got into podcasting and developed an unhealthy interest in microphones. My space isn't ideal, so I am going for the RE320.
Amazing! I was looking for a "U87 vs RE20" video review and found yours. Thank you for doing this very well presented and detailed review! Although you can get the U87Ai on Ebay for around $870, I'm just going to stick with my RE20 for my Voice Over work and make my adjustments using my DBX 286s, 215s and 166xs. Mike Russell actually shows you how to adjust all those DBX units with the SM7B and I was able to do it with my RE20 no problem. I will say that the U87 does sound a tinge better, but don't desire to face the sensitivity issue when it comes to any background noise. I don't have any issues with my RE20 when it comes to that now that my room is treated with some custom acoustic sound panels that I made and using the DBX processors. Maybe later I might get the U87, but not right now. Again, thank you very much for doing this video!
Be careful with used u87's on Ebay. Those mics sell for about $2k used even in kind of rough shape, $870 falls into the 'too good to be true' range of fake mics. Reverb seems like a safer place to get used mics due to pricing data than ebay.
Processed, both mics sound great -- certainly a distinction in tone between the two, but both are fantastic. The difference in unprocessed sound, though, is jarring. The unprocessed U87, to me, was lackluster. The RE20 still sounded good enough unprocessed to just go with it if need be.
i got 1:20 into this video and remembering the difference between the U87 and the "PL20" (back in the day)... i'm pretty sure it was the PL-20's i was working with?(memory is bad, i'm old) along side the neumann u87... and yeah... BOTH were great! the u87 as a condensor with pad.bass roll-offs/polar patterns vs the EV PL20... both are great! haven't tried the "RE"20... but if it's an upgrade from the PL20 from back in the day?... yeah... i'm sure it is probably the best dynamic mic out there... EV makes good stuff! I still, to this day, refuse to sell my EV PA system although I have outfitted the cabinets with JBL drivers... their bass bins/tops? BEST DESIGN EVER! EV makes good stuff!
The RE20 has a huge advantage when it comes to rejecting room noise. This is a huge reason why it's my default. $550 ish for the RE20 vs $3500 for the U87? I'm including the price of a preamp for the RE20 That being said, I absolutely would love to have a U87 Ai
Also, I am in no way affiliated with ANY company but I can say, for the budget-minded, a GREAT alternative would be the APEX460. It is a condenser, i've used it, and with a bit of "know-how" (EQ wizardy) this relatively cheap mic can do EVERYTHING you need it to. (on a budget)... just keep in mind... you may need to do a bit of tweaking of your EQ but if you KNOW how to properly use a 31-band graph... you probably already have made better recordings with a $30 mic than people who have THOUSANDS to spend. A bit of EQ, gate, compression in the right way and post-production digital editing in a DAW will save you thousands. Just sayin'. Unless you are worried about "SPL(overload i.e. kick drum spl distortion)... yeah... $3000+ for a mic is overkill. Move the mic away from the kick-drum beater or buy a true TDM or EV Kick mic for the spl's and learn how to EQ. There. I said it.
I don't know what's is wrong, could be the You Tube video compression, but the RE20 has something wrong on the high frequencies, its a great mic but in this video sounds like crap, like something technical is wrong.
Electrical Engineer here I use the Electro-Voice RE 27 N/D microphones and Koss PRO4AAT headphones. Electro-Voice RE-20 is a great microphone, but I choose the Electro-Voice RE-27 N/D microphone does not have the proximity effect. The Electro-Voice RE-27 N/D -51DB microphone uses a Neodymium Iron Boron magnet it has a higher output and wider frequency response than Electro-Voice RE-20. No Cloud lifter needed. Custom made XLR Microphone Differential Preamplifier The purpose and intent of a microphone preamplifier is to get as much gain with the least amount of noise. Going from microphone level to line level audio allows longer microphone cables without picking up noise and interference. Recommended XLR microphone cables are star quad double braided copper shielded microphone cables such as Belden 8424 Cable. Use Belden 8424-star quad cable between the microphones and the microphone preamplifiers not greater than 7 feet or 2 meters for the least amount of noise. XLR Cables on the output of the microphone preamplifiers do not have to be very high quality because audio signals are at line level greater than +4 decibels as opposed to microphone level at -51 decibels for the Electro-Voice RE-27 N/D microphone. Long microphone cable lengths at microphone signal levels will pick up lot of noise and in some cases AM radio stations. Long microphone cable lines behave more like antennas than microphone lines. After the microphone preamplifiers your audio signal are at line level and very much greater than the noise that you will pick up on long microphone lines. Digital Audio Today’s digital audio recording equipment we are going from 24-bit digital to 32-bit digital audio this is beyond crazy. It will also mean that condenser microphones are on its way out and dynamic and ribbon microphones are on the way in. Condenser microphones such as Neumann U87 are too noisy for 32-bit digital audio. The useful signal to noise ratio of a high-quality condenser microphones is 85 decibels whereas dynamic and ribbon microphones with Neodymium Iron Boron magnets are passive devices with much higher output levels and no internal noise compared to condenser microphones that need preamplifiers, DC blocking capacitors, audio transformers, and phantom powering this creates more noise than can be tolerated in 32-bit digital audio systems. My custom made XLR Microphone DC Coupled Differential Microphone Preamplifier The key to getting the lowest possible noise with the greatest amount of gain is only using the lowest noise components such as Texas Instruments ultra-low noise operational amplifier LM4562, metal film resistors, ceramic capacitors, tantalum capacitors for power supply filtering 4 10 pack Nickle Metal Hydride rechargeable AA batteries 7918, and 7818 linear voltage regulators, DC coupling no DC blocking capacitors no audio transformers. Of course, it only works with dynamic and ribbon microphones. My custom-made microphone preamplifier has a 60-decibel gain with a 100Khz low pass filter. Ribbon microphones must use audio transformers but there are ways of improving the performance of audio transformers. Wire directly from the ribbon microphone capsule is very low impedance, lower voltage, and higher current. The audio transformer turns ratio converts from low impedance to higher impedance lower current to higher voltage. The output impedance on a ribbon microphone is 6 Kilo Ohms compared to dynamic microphones 600 Ohms. Most audio transformers have poor low frequency response at 30 to 40 hertz at the low end. Quadrupling the windings on a typical audio transformer will allow lower frequency response below 10 hertz. Using ferrite core toroidal transformers greatly reduces external hum and noise pickup, and far less audio distortion with wider audio bandwidth. Dr. Thomas G. Stockham, Jr. who founded Soundstream digital audio got it right the first time. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soundstream Dr. Thomas G. Stockham, Jr. his first 16-bit analog to digital and digital to analog converters at 50Khz sampling rate digital audio interface was the first audiophile digital audio system. He used a DC coupled differential preamplifier for his 4-channel digital audio interface using a Honeywell data recorder with a Reed Solomon error correction system. Every digital audio system should use XLR DC coupled differential preamplifier before the analog to digital converter. It guarantees the lowest possible noise and the greatest frequency response. Sound Stream Digital Audio The first commercial audiophile digital audio system was Sound Stream digital audio processor 16-bit 50Khz sampling rate the first audiophile digital audio recording was Diahann Carroll with the Duke Ellington Orchestra Under the Direction of Mercer Ellington - A Tribute to Ethel Waters (popular music on the Orinda label) in January 1978. I have this CD and its sounds great. In 1978 dollars it cost Dr. Thomas G. Stockham, Jr $150,000.00 each to make his digital audio recording system and only 18 were made. I’m getting the SoundBlaster K3+ USB Powered 2 Channel Digital Mixer for $129.99 for webcasting. The SoundBlaster K3+ 24-bit digital audio at 48Khz sampling rate digital audio interface and a SoundBlaster X-Fi HD external soundcard that has 24bit digital audio at 96khz sampling rate. With a gaming laptop is dirt cheap and much better sound quality than the Sound-Stream digital audio interface and a Honeywell data recorder. That’s technology!
u87 sounds better...at least my taste. re-20 has some kind of "dirty" top-end just like other dynamic mics. Can't explain that. I just prefere the u87 sound.and the u87 just looks way better - especially the black version with that purple logo
Fethead is ruining the audio from the beginning... better options are either a Cloudlifter or the Royer dBooster - IF realy needed. But the UAD interface should have enough gain on it's own? I tested Fethead into RME UFXII vs UFXII mic input directly with a R121 and SM7b, and the Fethead clearly ruined things rather then helped, while the UFX mic input had more then enough gain on its own, and sounded much more detailed.
Brodie - thank you for the great job you did on producing these microphone and signal chain videos. very interesting to see and understand what goes into a great home studio like yours!
I went with the RE20.. Took me a while to get the processing/EQ dialed in, but i'm very happy with it now.
RE20 is phenomenal
Although it has been a few decades since I ran a recording studio my three go to microphones for vocals were the U87, the RE20 and the AKG414.
Some sessions I would set up all three and have the vocalist run down parts of the song on each one. That way I picked the best microphone for their voice before touching the EQ.
I love the RE20. I like it so much I bought the new matte black version so now I have two colors.
which color do you prefer ?
Do they sound different?
@@7gpi so thats really a thing then?
Thought they were the same, just different color 🤔
Im going for the brighter then
@@7gpi Thanks 🙏
@@DoartYT there has been a black re320 for a while which has a different sound and lower price point. The black version of the re20 is quite recent and has the exact same sound as the grey re20…
Thanks great informative video 👌 ✨
I could not agree with you more.
I have used so many broadcast mics, from all the big players in my career and every time I felt something was missing in my audio, and kept trying other mics.. Then I met the RE20 and shortly afterwards, the TLM103, from that moment, I knew I had found my two "endgame" mics. (sadly the U87 is off limits to me, as i have a mortgage!) - There are a couple of others i use for specialist purposes, (ENG and Lav mics etc) but on air, in the home studio, these are my go-to's, no if's no buts!
Thanks for making an honest, impartial review. :-)
Martin
Great video!
I got so excited about this video!!! I’ve been using the ev re20 for 7 years now and keep wondering if I need to add (add, not replace!) a large diaphragm condenser mic (the one I have now is the rode nt2a which is NOT my endgame, just the first mic I ever bought 15 years ago)
Love my RE20
Nice review. I also have both microphones and they are both quite fine. I should note that if you have a good preamp, you do not need a fethead. For example, an Audient audio interface !d44 or an Audient 4816SE console or a Neumann V402, or an Avalon Design 737 or V55.
My RE20 arrives this weekend!
re20 for the price point its the best IMO love mine
Very cool video, Brodie. I'm an A's fan and frequent viewer of your channel, and have always been impressed with your voice and audio quality. I recently got into podcasting and developed an unhealthy interest in microphones. My space isn't ideal, so I am going for the RE320.
cool! I think you'll like it. also: check out my new channel for ALL production content: brodie.bz/Production
@@brodiebrazil Cool. Will definitely check it out and subscribe. Let's go, Oakland!
I agree !
Amazing! I was looking for a "U87 vs RE20" video review and found yours. Thank you for doing this very well presented and detailed review! Although you can get the U87Ai on Ebay for around $870, I'm just going to stick with my RE20 for my Voice Over work and make my adjustments using my DBX 286s, 215s and 166xs. Mike Russell actually shows you how to adjust all those DBX units with the SM7B and I was able to do it with my RE20 no problem. I will say that the U87 does sound a tinge better, but don't desire to face the sensitivity issue when it comes to any background noise. I don't have any issues with my RE20 when it comes to that now that my room is treated with some custom acoustic sound panels that I made and using the DBX processors. Maybe later I might get the U87, but not right now. Again, thank you very much for doing this video!
Be careful with used u87's on Ebay. Those mics sell for about $2k used even in kind of rough shape, $870 falls into the 'too good to be true' range of fake mics. Reverb seems like a safer place to get used mics due to pricing data than ebay.
Yea, WATCH OUT!!! A U87 for 870????? Hold on to your wallet 😢!!!!!😮
Processed, both mics sound great -- certainly a distinction in tone between the two, but both are fantastic. The difference in unprocessed sound, though, is jarring. The unprocessed U87, to me, was lackluster. The RE20 still sounded good enough unprocessed to just go with it if need be.
Glad you put it that way because I completely agree!
i got 1:20 into this video and remembering the difference between the U87 and the "PL20" (back in the day)... i'm pretty sure it was the PL-20's i was working with?(memory is bad, i'm old) along side the neumann u87... and yeah... BOTH were great! the u87 as a condensor with pad.bass roll-offs/polar patterns vs the EV PL20... both are great! haven't tried the "RE"20... but if it's an upgrade from the PL20 from back in the day?... yeah... i'm sure it is probably the best dynamic mic out there... EV makes good stuff! I still, to this day, refuse to sell my EV PA system although I have outfitted the cabinets with JBL drivers... their bass bins/tops? BEST DESIGN EVER! EV makes good stuff!
Are you able to hear a difference in quality boosting via the uad vs using the fethead? I find with the re20 the gain on the uad is enough
i dont think the fethead colors most mics sound in any way. the gain i hear... tonal differences, i dont.
@@brodiebrazil 🙏 thanks , I don’t need the fethead then!
The RE20 has a huge advantage when it comes to rejecting room noise. This is a huge reason why it's my default. $550 ish for the RE20 vs $3500 for the U87? I'm including the price of a preamp for the RE20
That being said, I absolutely would love to have a U87 Ai
Those used to be my endgame mics the RE20 still is because of radiohead but lewitt is getting up there for me
You can buy 7 RE20s for the price of one U87.
Also, I am in no way affiliated with ANY company but I can say, for the budget-minded, a GREAT alternative would be the APEX460. It is a condenser, i've used it, and with a bit of "know-how" (EQ wizardy) this relatively cheap mic can do EVERYTHING you need it to. (on a budget)... just keep in mind... you may need to do a bit of tweaking of your EQ but if you KNOW how to properly use a 31-band graph... you probably already have made better recordings with a $30 mic than people who have THOUSANDS to spend. A bit of EQ, gate, compression in the right way and post-production digital editing in a DAW will save you thousands. Just sayin'. Unless you are worried about "SPL(overload i.e. kick drum spl distortion)... yeah... $3000+ for a mic is overkill. Move the mic away from the kick-drum beater or buy a true TDM or EV Kick mic for the spl's and learn how to EQ. There. I said it.
I don't know what's is wrong, could be the You Tube video compression, but the RE20 has something wrong on the high frequencies, its a great mic but in this video sounds like crap, like something technical is wrong.
Re-20 sounds clearer
U87Ai sounds richer looks beautiful I think the RE20 looks ugly... I use a baby Neumann TLM102 love it
Electrical Engineer here
I use the Electro-Voice RE 27 N/D microphones and Koss PRO4AAT headphones. Electro-Voice RE-20 is a great microphone, but I choose the Electro-Voice RE-27 N/D microphone does not have the proximity effect. The Electro-Voice RE-27 N/D -51DB microphone uses a Neodymium Iron Boron magnet it has a higher output and wider frequency response than Electro-Voice RE-20. No Cloud lifter needed.
Custom made XLR Microphone Differential Preamplifier
The purpose and intent of a microphone preamplifier is to get as much gain with the least amount of noise. Going from microphone level to line level audio allows longer microphone cables without picking up noise and interference. Recommended XLR microphone cables are star quad double braided copper shielded microphone cables such as Belden 8424 Cable. Use Belden 8424-star quad cable between the microphones and the microphone preamplifiers not greater than 7 feet or 2 meters for the least amount of noise. XLR Cables on the output of the microphone preamplifiers do not have to be very high quality because audio signals are at line level greater than +4 decibels as opposed to microphone level at -51 decibels for the Electro-Voice RE-27 N/D microphone. Long microphone cable lengths at microphone signal levels will pick up lot of noise and in some cases AM radio stations. Long microphone cable lines behave more like antennas than microphone lines. After the microphone preamplifiers your audio signal are at line level and very much greater than the noise that you will pick up on long microphone lines.
Digital Audio
Today’s digital audio recording equipment we are going from 24-bit digital to 32-bit digital audio this is beyond crazy. It will also mean that condenser microphones are on its way out and dynamic and ribbon microphones are on the way in. Condenser microphones such as Neumann U87 are too noisy for 32-bit digital audio. The useful signal to noise ratio of a high-quality condenser microphones is 85 decibels whereas dynamic and ribbon microphones with Neodymium Iron Boron magnets are passive devices with much higher output levels and no internal noise compared to condenser microphones that need preamplifiers, DC blocking capacitors, audio transformers, and phantom powering this creates more noise than can be tolerated in 32-bit digital audio systems.
My custom made XLR Microphone DC Coupled Differential Microphone Preamplifier
The key to getting the lowest possible noise with the greatest amount of gain is only using the lowest noise components such as Texas Instruments ultra-low noise operational amplifier LM4562, metal film resistors, ceramic capacitors, tantalum capacitors for power supply filtering 4 10 pack Nickle Metal Hydride rechargeable AA batteries 7918, and 7818 linear voltage regulators, DC coupling no DC blocking capacitors no audio transformers. Of course, it only works with dynamic and ribbon microphones. My custom-made microphone preamplifier has a 60-decibel gain with a 100Khz low pass filter.
Ribbon microphones must use audio transformers but there are ways of improving the performance of audio transformers. Wire directly from the ribbon microphone capsule is very low impedance, lower voltage, and higher current. The audio transformer turns ratio converts from low impedance to higher impedance lower current to higher voltage. The output impedance on a ribbon microphone is 6 Kilo Ohms compared to dynamic microphones 600 Ohms. Most audio transformers have poor low frequency response at 30 to 40 hertz at the low end. Quadrupling the windings on a typical audio transformer will allow lower frequency response below 10 hertz. Using ferrite core toroidal transformers greatly reduces external hum and noise pickup, and far less audio distortion with wider audio bandwidth.
Dr. Thomas G. Stockham, Jr. who founded Soundstream digital audio got it right the first time. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soundstream Dr. Thomas G. Stockham, Jr. his first 16-bit analog to digital and digital to analog converters at 50Khz sampling rate digital audio interface was the first audiophile digital audio system. He used a DC coupled differential preamplifier for his 4-channel digital audio interface using a Honeywell data recorder with a Reed Solomon error correction system. Every digital audio system should use XLR DC coupled differential preamplifier before the analog to digital converter. It guarantees the lowest possible noise and the greatest frequency response.
Sound Stream Digital Audio
The first commercial audiophile digital audio system was Sound Stream digital audio processor 16-bit 50Khz sampling rate the first audiophile digital audio recording was Diahann Carroll with the Duke Ellington Orchestra Under the Direction of Mercer Ellington - A Tribute to Ethel Waters (popular music on the Orinda label) in January 1978. I have this CD and its sounds great. In 1978 dollars it cost Dr. Thomas G. Stockham, Jr $150,000.00 each to make his digital audio recording system and only 18 were made. I’m getting the SoundBlaster K3+ USB Powered 2 Channel Digital Mixer for $129.99 for webcasting. The SoundBlaster K3+ 24-bit digital audio at 48Khz sampling rate digital audio interface and a SoundBlaster X-Fi HD external soundcard that has 24bit digital audio at 96khz sampling rate. With a gaming laptop is dirt cheap and much better sound quality than the Sound-Stream digital audio interface and a Honeywell data recorder. That’s technology!
u87 sounds better...at least my taste. re-20 has some kind of "dirty" top-end just like other dynamic mics. Can't explain that. I just prefere the u87 sound.and the u87 just looks way better - especially the black version with that purple logo
Fethead is ruining the audio from the beginning... better options are either a Cloudlifter or the Royer dBooster - IF realy needed. But the UAD interface should have enough gain on it's own? I tested Fethead into RME UFXII vs UFXII mic input directly with a R121 and SM7b, and the Fethead clearly ruined things rather then helped, while the UFX mic input had more then enough gain on its own, and sounded much more detailed.