How to Install Room-By-Room Zoning in an HVAC System | Ask This Old House
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- čas přidán 2. 06. 2024
- Ask This Old House plumbing expert Richard Trethewey learns about an HVAC system that allows each room to be zoned out using smartphone technology.
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Richard learns about room-by-room zoning in an HVAC system using vents connected to a smartphone program. Where to find it? Richard installed Ecovent [www.ecoventsystems.com/], a smartphone based solution for setting room by room temperatures on forced air heating and cooling systems.
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How to Install Room-By-Room Zoning in an HVAC System | Ask This Old House
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One of the main issues all zoning systems have to overcome is trying to vary the airflow volume, when most residential HVAC equipment is constant volume. A true variable volume system has equipment designed to run on a wide range of airflow. There is high end residential equipment that is variable volume, with modulating heating and cooling. These high end systems, with variable capacity work well with zoning systems.
Wooooooooooow.
Love finding people who make progress on things and you find it's been relatively around for awhile because I was still stuck on duct dampers and mini splits as the only way to Zone a home
Great video. Thank you. We just bought a two story prefabricated house. They gave us a choice to have one heat pump for the entire house or two separate units. We have one for the first floor and another one for the second floor. I ask you is this really more efficient having two units then just one?
A great video. Rich Trethewey is smart and articulate, always helping us homeowners to understand.
He’s he’s the best.
THIS GUY IS A GENIUS!!!!!!🤗🤗🤗
Guy would make a killing if he would sell this off to NEST to integrate with their learning thermostats and temp sensors.
Their controller has to be in charge so all your really need from your thermometer is the off/on and heat/cool and fan on/off functions. The controller is tracking the duct pressure, room temp/humidity to adjust time on/off. Most smart thermometers don't really do much for room to room conditions but they make better guesses based on outside data and preferences.
That's a good opinion, but I gave up on Nest. I bought a Nest thermostat when it first came out because they promised they would make it compatible with Apple HomeKit, but they have broken that promise. I'm still waiting. Any company that breaks their promises loses my business.
@@TheNameOfJesus That's because NEST got bought out by Google a few months ago after I posted this comment. lol
@@robsp32 And this guy ran his company into the ground and now these no longer exist. Obviously a poor businessman...and no, it has nothing to do with missile defense....
@@ryanroberts1104 you think that Flair smart vents copied his idea?maybe he patented the idea and is a millionaire now?
It seems like it worked work great with ecm high efficiency system where it’s program to operate with the amount of zones calling for.
I will buy when they get the pricing corrected. Self installation.
I like these. Do they work with ECM motors that ramp up and down? Also, do they work with 2 -wire Daikin SkyAir and VRV Series HVAC equipment which is a specialty brand I provide for my customers?
Loved it, Awesome Video.
Any way to integrate it with smartthings? If not, I think your market will greatly expand if you make the individual registers compatible.
In the Netherlands we almost all have modulating, low temperature, central gas water heating, with water temperature from 30 to 60c (86-140F) when it is not freezing outside.
All rooms have thermostats on the radiators and a central controller in the living room. All radiators are sized per room.
The gas furnace is almost always extremely oversized for heating because is also supplies hot tap water.
Wow! I'm sold.
Yes Patel! Have him show you the moneyyyyy!
Sucker born every minute.
I really like what I see but I would rather have a thermostat in each room. Apps are great but if you have a guest in the room or a renter you may not want them to be able to control your whole house. Any chance you will convert that little plug in box to also control the temp like the app from the room? Is there a way to give someone control of just one room with the app? This would be especially handy if someone is having a guest. Does your system account for AC systems that have dual fan speeds? My last question is are you going to have any round ceiling vents? I know this is typically a commercial vent but I have them in my home. THANK YOU!
Now that's a neat idea
i can hear the whistling in the room I'm sitting in now when the other rooms choke off LOL
Fascinating!
Really neat idea. The registers are a little ugly. Would like to see something that could take the existing registers, and mount under/OR replace the damper. Otherwise really neat.
Dipul, you would get a lot more respect if you actually had a tiny bit of HVAC experience.
Your equipment is not for every house or project.
Some homes just need an experienced HVAC tech to summarize their issues and come up with a solution. You are trying to be the next "Nest".
I do admire your " Get rich or die tryin" mentality but have a little more respect for HVAC professionals.
Some homes, they have the wrong size ducts, clogged air filters, small return duct, etc. and now you want people to believe your product is going to be the magic bullet.
You want to get rich off something you don't really know anything about in the real HVAC world.
@@gretzkysyotes How do you install ductwork backward? You should get your facts straight before you throw all A/C contractors under the bus. By the way,jdere31760 is correct and these controls, They don't work too well. he made some statements that are just not correct. So ruin your system. You should fix it yourself too to keep those crappy contractors out of your house.
i didn't see the interface with the furnace. does that controller then somehow link to the existing thermostat? or replace it?
Dipul, I really need a solution that allows me to pull colder outside air through my home when the outside temperature is less than or equal to the internal desired temp. Perhaps a whole house fan integration with damper controlled fresh air intakes. Opening a closing windows for a whole house fan is both inconvenient and not secure.
This is a phenomenal system ... I’ve watched about 20 vids on hvac and all of them were such garbage but this system looks amazing
Just curious. Are you an HVAC tech?
Or a consumer?
Nice idea
Dipul, the system as shown in the video seems appropriate for a quick and easy retrofit but what about new construction? I wouldn't want these unnatural-appearing sensors plugged into my receptacles. And similar comment to an earlier one... why batteries when it could be hardwired?
Love the Klipsch speakers.
Hi Im in the UK where ventilation and AC is beginning to happen, this is 6 years ago!! did this company ever make it ? is there something similar ? any links or info would be much appreciated. Regards
Like the dude said in the beginning, if your stuff isn't sized right, no amount of zoning is going to fix the problem entirely. I remember growing up in my boyhood home, the second floor was always sweltering because the house HVAC just wasn't built correctly. If I plopped this system into that house, wouldn't the a/c just run all the time trying to cool the second floor while making the first floor freezing? Without an ECM motor, I can't imagine that this system could keep all the first floor registers closed completely. They would have to stay somewhat open to maintain air flow.
I think this system is probably better for homes that are either new and built with zoning in mind, or in houses that are being remodeled. People that expect their drafty, poorly ducted and sized houses to be saved by this system will probably crap themselves when they see how expensive the true fix would actually be.
You should make the outlet sensors so they screw on the the wall plate at the center screw. It will stop it from coming off when devices are unplugged.
THAT was the first thing I noticed too. If they are still in business they probably got that figured out by now :-)
that's very cool ,make the job is very easy.
Are there any hvac zone systems that are easy to control with a smart phone?
Richard, it’s been a couple years now so I was wondering how you felt about a system like this vs the old type motor driven?
Could you point me to any videos you have done on installing the old style for an upstairs downstairs (so I don’t have to keep going down and manually turning them twice a year)!
Have you been able to find a motorized system that does not require internet or wifi? Ethernet is good but not connected to outside internet....Internet of things!
are you using esp8266 (or similar) chips?
Very cool
can this product work on a system that is already zoned?
Where is this manufactured ? What is the warranty ?
That's so cool! I wish we had this here in Brazil!
We have been zoning hot water and steam heat since it's inception. And we have been zoning commercial air systems for years. It is about time to see residential scorched air get zoned.
Of course, but within the parameters of static and dynamic resistance permitted by the blower motors in the air handlers.
question for how much they sale ...
and where I can get
that's is amazing
I'm interested in purchasing and installing this system for my home to see how it works...I have been in the HVAC industry for over 20yrs and have only seen amd installed the "old style" zoning systems amd this video has me very intrigued
This is an interesting concept, but the up/down zoning works well for most applications. We had a bungalow with a finished basement on a two zone system. A Lennox signature series gas furnace with a variable speed DC motor (fan ran 24/7), kept both floors at the same temperature year round. This system here would achieve very good results, but a variable speed blower is required to prevent over pressure on low heat/cooling demands. It needs to be considered as a total system when putting this in.
What about the static pressure in the duct or friction when the dampers close? What about the return bypass? Only good for a module home or studio apartment
Excellent points. What motorized register system would you recommend that does not have wifi or internet? I would like to control everything centrally without the internet and would like everything to be hardwired including power and ethernet.
They won't let you close them all or close more than you can. They are a smart system that also keep track of the system to make sure you don't restrict air flow to much.
How does it connect to the Furnace?
What about installing Variable Refrigerant Flow (VRF) heating/cooling system?
very expensive system
That requires a system to be replaced entirely which is expensive. This also doesn't solve the zoneing problem.
What’s the brand of the smart vent system? Where can you buy it? There’s no mention at all.
OMG.... Where can I buy this. I just bought a new home, with 3 huge rooms and a massive master bedroom, large loft, huge living room.... lets just say lots of space. But I can't understand for the life of me how the builder put in a central heat/cooling system that is not zoned. So the rooms are either too hot or too cold with no way of adjusting room by room. I got a $16K quote form an HVAC company to redo the system with zones. And, this issue is causing me to burn through a 500gal propane tank in as little as 2-3 months. Your website is not working, how can I get this system?
What about the air pressure when one air register calling only ? I think BYPASS DAMPER required for these registers .
This system works with any forced air furnace?
The link doesn't work. Also does this require smart control for the hvac, and how does this tell the hvac to shut off?
Great info. From where I can buy this system? The link in the description is not working.
Thanks.
they probably went out of business because this is mildly jank
Where can I get these new registers?
I use keen smart home, much newer technology and works like a charm!
Same company now
@@jbuttleman17 nice, didn't know that 👍
Y. D. If you go to Keen’s website you can see the info for Keen and Ecovent. That website also has the pricing for both systems.
@@jbuttleman17 looks like keen bought them out or keeping keen as main brand after a merger. Thanks for the update 👍
Cool.
I’m thinking of just a couple of issues with that type of zone system. They didn’t talk about a by pass damper or a freeze stat for the supply plenum to keep the coil from freezing up. One other thing. I would think that stopping the air flow at the register would cause a noise problem at each room especially with multiple registers closed at the same time. Build up of static pressure. What is the cost verses a typical zone system.
Cindy Brake
They explained how the hub is programmed to maintain enough vents open to prevent an increase in static pressure.
Very likely the reason why they claimed a professional has to install this system instead of the homeowner.
@@davidcerino1145 bullshit, if the system has to open enough vents to prevent statis pressure build up then it can't regulate the room temps. only way this would work is with a variable speed blower that could be ramped up or down.
@@rollandelliott oh, quite likely, for sure!
These are not ideal systems. It's a nice attempt to retrofit an existing system into a zoning system with the least invasive approach, but it isn't without its flaws. That might still be cheaper than trying to upgrade to a communicating zoning system with an ECM blower motor and a modulating outdoor unit, which would provide the best performance.
I think they want their special guy to install these systems because of the very tedious adjusting the system probably needs just to work well.
How would this control the temperature if a good number of the diffusers have to remain open at any one time in order to keep the airflow at an acceptable amount? It would work a lot better if the system had a bypass damper, and a discharge air controller that could be programmed to shut off the equipment before it trips it’s internal limits, or freezes up the AC coil. I have put in what are called therma fusers, which are 24”x24” diffusers for suspended T bar ceilings in office buildings. They open and close themselves and are fully self contained. We always installed a bypass system and discharge air temperature controls to prevent damage to the heating and cooling equipment.
@@rollandelliott then you would also have to use a furnace with a modulating gas valve, and a inverter drive condensing unit
Can someone please share the name of this product????
I am curious about this product, I have an older home that is a split level and there is a big temperature difference between the upstairs and the down stairs. I am concerned that the lines running to the upstairs rooms are actually to small as they are only 4 inch round ducts and of course not insulated. could this help in a case like this where the downstairs gets cold or hot and the upstairs gets hot or cold. I recently had blown in insulation in the attic and I have reinsulated the outside wall and spray foamed the corners.
Yes Daniel,
Buy ecovent first, then we will help you fix all your other problems.
Trust us..........please.
Now that it has been a while. How has it done? Is this still available?
Do you need a bypass damper in this case?
I was thunkning the same thing
I really like the sensors.. dang this is actually cool.. but, still expensive I bet.
This is good idea, , have a question when these dampers close it increases static pressure in system the return is large bringing in air and now say 3 register are 50% ,1 is 70% how is VS blower going to adjust to airflow, without relief damper to make static adjustment??
yep, the fan works just as hard to try and force air through ducts that are closed.
only way system wont work as hard is if it is closed off before airflow enters the ducts
Where can you buy such frames?
is there an active resource link as Id love to learn more about the product featured..
Where can I actually buy this system?
any update on needed bypass???? How to contact vender?
What is the product name and where can I get it
Jesus oh lord i had this idea a year ago thank god you did this bless you! Where can i buy this unit?
3800 for the 2500 square ft bundle on the ecovent site woof
This is great. Where can you buy this?
What is the name of the company who installs or sells this zoning units?
Wow! They showed an entire video without saying the name of the company??
look at app its ecovent that is now keen
That's what was thinking too!
Exactly not even a link below to view the product
No name, no link, no price
keenhome.io/collections
Here it is and currently on sale. Pretty sweet!
it sounds like the engineer forgot one thing, most people are saying they need a bypass and that is correct for a non variable Hvac. In order to do it without the bypass you need a designed hvac for variable speeds to not over-pressure the flow. You need a max capacity btu but a variable fan speed. There will still be disadvantages, cost is one of them. size of the evaporator is another. A bypass could also be a good thing if they integrate a water heater into the loop instead of being a separate unit. I don't think current systems will not manage unless major deterioration happens. Plus modifying a hvac system vs designing one from the ground up will be better.
100% agreed but what makes me weird out is that as an IT/Technology professional myself, I would never recommend wireless connectivity as it is not as reliable as connected and if these registers are constantly opening and closing, they will eat through their batteries quickly.
So where do you obtain this equipment???
I can imagine all kinds of room to room pressurization issues in the home with supply/returning balancing
1 prob...no integration with furnace or t- stat. If register says need heat. Who tells t stat to fire furnace? Did I miss something?
I'm wondering the same thing... What if one room is set to 65 and another to 75? How does the thermostat know to turn on heat or cool?
What is the name of the Co. Highlighted are they still in business?
How are you diverting the airflow?
They're not. This thing just closes one or more vents, and at the end instead of the beginning as it should if it is to work at all. But as another poster pointed out, it is gone, out of biz.
It's one of the better ideas I've seen in a while! How much they cost of a house. Too bad that they is no retail site, seems very easy to install but no info where to buy it from!
Being in construction for 45 yrs and a licensed contractor I would buy and install if system was available. I won't pay what would be a significant price hike for an HVAC contractor to install some vents. I can't even get an idea of the price because that info will impact what the contractors can charge if we the consumer new the prices, not a good way to do business. I understand there are homeowners that need an installer and that's fine. They should be available to purchase online and I think you will loose a lot of sales because of that.
Ian Mather I totally agree...
Ian- they dont need every tom, dick and harry installing this and then having to support the product because people 'think' they know what they're doing. I can see a whole lot of problems with this, having a network of contractors that understand the product and can hook it up problem free is the way to go.
Super cool tech!
Would like them to retrofit a variable fan control to the furnace as part of their system.
This videos should be titled, "how to piss off your hvac service tech & kill your compressor"
use a Variable Air Volume system. it will detect the temp in the room and adjust the motor and pump so that u only get the required airflow and coolant circulation
that costs over 5 grand
@@strategygalactic well how many vents do you have? Someone was saying the system would cost them over $4000. Plus batteries and the outlet sensors look kinda bad.
that could be zoned?
What about the Suction vents?
Where do i fine this product from?
I just doubt this will make much difference:(
The hub is not synced with the thermostat, so there are two control points.
If the thermostat does not provide enough air flow, then the room temperature won't be controlled by the sensor effectively....
Where do i buy this?
wow!!!
Where do I get this?
Why not make whole system more compatable with the actual furnace or AC unit??
How do i get it i need help to find this plz?
I'm sold where do I sign up.this is exactly what I need in my house
Dipul Patel
Dipul Patel You are not selling these on your website. No prices. Please tell me you are not having these available through 3rd party installation ONLY!!! GIVE US PRICES!
Dont waste your money
@@proverbs2life They have helped my 1950 house out! Much more comfortable. In the summer the vents downstairs are closed and the AC is running keeping the upstairs cool. During the winter I don't have cold rooms and hot rooms all over the house. BTW, not associated with these guys except by purchase. I just wish I could contact them. Keene bought them and buying their product is far harder. I am looking to upgrade my son's new 1948 house!
If I were to add a central AC in a 2 storey house, is it a good idea to have a variable stage Air Handler with 1 thermostat on the ground floor?
I was told that once the speed of the blower comes down, there wouldn`t be enough pressure for the forced air to reach the 2nd floor.
Thanks a lot!
Do you have hot air heat in the house now? Assuming that you don't, do you use the house in such a way that cooling the second floor is usually unnecessary during the day. (only go up at night to sleep)? Do you have both attic and basement?
So how do I get this system? Does it save energy or just regulate your home? Closing registers never made sense to me because the heat and or air still goes to the register, so How does that save money?
Travis They never say it saves money except that it prolongs the life of the HVAC unit because it promotes consistant airflow. But the system is mostly to regulate temperature and make the house comfortable, not to save money.
Travis
This product seems more about comfort than frugality but it can also save some money.
A forced air furnace creates a given amount of heat (hot air) in a given amount of time. If a register is closed and that area is closed (by a door), less hot air is needed to heat the remainder of the house. So the furnace can run for less time.
As was mentioned, electronic dampers directly off the trunk are more effective because none of the heat is 'wasted' in the dead end branch.
In my opinion, this system would have more promise if it were connected to the furnace (or a thermostat) similarly to how electric dampers are.
With this system, from work you could set your living room to be 72 but if you have a traditional (non Internet connected) thermostat and it is not set to the correct temperature, this system does not work.
@@Maxid1 It does the opposite of prolonging the life of a HVAC system.
so where can we buy them????
Link to the product? Or name at least?
look at app its ecovent that is now keen
I don't see a variable speed hvac system that speeds up and slows down according to need Trane builds a really nice true variable speed system that even slows down the compressor to keep the same speed as blower so when one zone isn't calling it compensates with speed of compressor and blower so you don't burn the compressor or blower motor up
How do you buy this product
Old type of workinq! Now its Better.
How to you purchase these?
How I purchased this product
Take my money!!!
What is the name of the system? I'll like to look into it some more. Looks like something that will work great for me.
www.ecoventsystems.com/
Where can I purchase this item? What is the name of the company?
Now combine this with nest